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von Richthofen talk

May I ask why you are copying all this over to your talk page? —KNcyu38 (talk • contribs) 07:37, 19 March 2007 (UTC)

Scholarly discourse includes thinking through all possible aspects of a problem, in other words, open-mindedness. You can only "beat" people who you perceive as less open-minded by focussing on your ability to epathize with their mindset. Trying to beat the crowd at stubbornness rarely works out your way. Google counts nothing here. You are not the only one who cares, but try and convince other people of it. That single quote doesn't tell much, that's why I suggest checking the book as if you were desperately looking for proof that von Richthofen had Jewish ancestry. I really mean it, it's a good exercise to focus on the problem at hand and on different ways to approach it like circling in on the subject-matter. I'm suggesting to you to handle this as professionally as possible. This includes being prepared to "lose" a debate. But if you lose, you should lose in a good way, being glad that you stand corrected. Not in a bad way where everybody starts shouting and blocking. —KNcyu38 (talk • contribs) 07:40, 19 March 2007 (UTC)

I'm saying this because I can't and won't even try to help with Misplaced Pages matters when I have the impression of a closed-minded trench war. —KNcyu38 (talk • contribs) 07:44, 19 March 2007 (UTC)

I am the one trying to be a proffesional here! I am open minded, but give me something to work with! It's Chris Lawson, calling others anti-semites and me a quack, etc that's who you should direct that comment too. All I want is the truth. You say you are all about the sources, but in this case the weakest of sources, the weakest of quotes, does nothing to bother you??? I pasted the discussion here b/c I have the feeling it may get deleted by someone. I have read other moderators mention doing Google searches, I am the one who got it added that Bruce Lee was 1/4 German. Google isn't a good source, but it is indicative often times especailly with someone as famous as the Red Baron when nothing comes up. That's all that I was saying, no evidence for Jewish ancestry.

Things (almost) never get deleted on Misplaced Pages. You say that Clawson is calling others anti-Semites and you a quack. That's quite a strong allegation, do you have any diffs for that? Otherwise it may be construed as a personal attack by you. —KNcyu38 (talk • contribs) 08:34, 19 March 2007 (UTC)

I believe I got your point, but people used to believe all sorts of stuff that was later rebutted. I was asking about diffs for your allegations against Clawson. Those are two different things that should be carefully kept separated. —KNcyu38 (talk • contribs) 08:43, 19 March 2007 (UTC)

Yes, the other guy contesting this Jewish ancestry error in an earlier thread on the same Baron discussion article made his points to Chris Lawson in a civlized way and Lawson accused him of being anti-semitic, then he said, in reference to me in my discussion thread there, that "any quack can make a post/edit on wikipedia", clearly implying that I'm a quack. JohnHistory 08:51, 19 March 2007 (UTC)JohnHistory

I saw the latter, of course. It wasn't directly aimed at you, but I didn't like it, either. Um.. you know what a diff is, do you? Just in case: You can get one by looking at the history of any page, selecting two versions, and then pressing the "Compare selected versions" button. You can include it by putting the complete link (with http:// etc) into single brackets like this: , the result will then appear like this, or like this. Look at the markup, you'll figure out the rest. These diffs or differences are often used as proof of precisely which edit by another user you are talking about. That's one beautiful thing about a wiki: It doesn't forget anything, which means that people have to think before they press "Save page". Alright, enough explained. Again, can you provide any diffs?

Regarding truth, you may want to take a look at WP:A (especially this section, by the way). You see, Misplaced Pages has a set of guidelines and policies. Attribution, not truth, is the aim. I certainly appreciate that you care about Misplaced Pages like most of us do, but it's all about working together, not against each other. I'm sure that if you come up with serious doubts as to the accuracy/appropriateness of the way the book is quoted, others will listen. —KNcyu38 (talk • contribs) 09:24, 19 March 2007 (UTC)

Utterly unfounded accusations

Accusations that I have called you anti-Semitic will not be tolerated, and it is quite clear that this edit was suggesting the other editor was being anti-Semitic in tone (which he was).

Furthermore, you should be well aware that Misplaced Pages has, at its foundation, a policy against original research and a policy requiring all sources to be cited and reliable. You have yet to meet these standards in your claims, and your edits will continue to be contested until you do.--chris.lawson 21:26, 19 March 2007 (UTC)

I said you accused him of being anti-semitic not me, and no he wasn't being that way. Please show how he was being anti-semitic??? You are the one with the bad source/quote! Can't you see that? It isn't even on the Baron, nor does it give a jewish relatives name, and the quote doesn't even even say he was jewish. JohnHistory 03:23, 20 March 2007 (UTC)JohnHistory.

Canvassing against Clawson's RfA

Kindly stop doing this, canvassing is against policy. – Riana 09:06, 20 March 2007 (UTC)

I was just trying to let the people see what I saw. Why is that bad? I don't tell them what to think, not that I could anway! Being aware and informed is a good thing, right? What do you mean by "canvassing"? JohnHistory 09:11, 20 March 2007 (UTC)JohnHistory

You are basically encouraging people to oppose this guy . RfA voters usually scrutinise a candidate's contributions very carefully. I know you think you are doing the right thing, and keeping people informed is not bad, but excessive crossposting makes it look like you have a vendetta against him. It's generally not the done thing. – Riana 09:12, 20 March 2007 (UTC)

I refer you in particular to WP:CANVAS#Campaigning, especially the last sentence: Misplaced Pages editors are therefore not to engage in aggressive cross-posting in order to influence votes, discussions, requests for adminship, requests for comment, etc. – Riana 09:14, 20 March 2007 (UTC)

Yes, but this whole thing happened just yesterday after their support was given. So how could they have known about it? I don't have a vendetta, but I would by lying if it didn't scare me that someone of this caliber and agenda would be given administrative powers! The "cross-posting" was b/c I have the same thing to say to all of them. That is to say, please look at what I'm talking about and make your own mind up. I didn't know this was against policy, hell, I'm just trying to do the right thing here. JohnHistory 09:17, 20 March 2007 (UTC)JohnHistory.

I understand if you didn't know it was wrong. The best thing to do is to start a section on the talkpage of the RfA itself, as people who have voted will hopefully have an eye on it. – Riana 09:19, 20 March 2007 (UTC)

-Thanks! JohnHistory 09:20, 20 March 2007 (UTC)JohnHistory

I will not take part. – Riana 09:22, 20 March 2007 (UTC)

Please do not canvas on my talk page in opposition for someone's RFA. It's against WP:CANVAS. ⇒ SWATJester 09:35, 20 March 2007 (UTC)

What they said. Mackensen (talk) 10:43, 20 March 2007 (UTC)

In case you haven't noticed, yes I know now. JohnHistory 01:29, 21 March 2007 (UTC)JohnHistory

Your message regarding Crhis Lawson

Are you sure you want to support this guy? Look at his source/quote for making the Red Baron jewish. read the discussion page on it. See the opposers views on his request page. It scares me. JohnHistory 08:36, 20 March 2007 (UTC)JohnHistory

http://en.wikipedia.org/Talk:Manfred_von_Richthofen

http://en.wikipedia.org/Wikipedia:Requests_for_adminship/Clawson

Thanks for your concern. I'll speak with Chris Lawson about this, but may I suggest you familiarise yourself with Misplaced Pages:Canvassing which frowns on your cross-posting & partisan votestacking. The Rambling Man 09:29, 20 March 2007 (UTC)

Again, thanks for your concern, I'll address this personally. The Rambling Man 10:14, 20 March 2007 (UTC)

Disruption at the RfA

Hi John. You're running a serious risk of being deemed a disruptive editor and being blocked for your trouble. Can I please suggest the following. You've made your point about the candidate. Further editing on the topic makes you look very bad, per WP:NAM. In all good faith, I sincerely suggest you drop it, right away. --Dweller 11:23, 20 March 2007 (UTC)

John, Dweller's right. Editing even your own comments is generally frowned upon, as it alters the meaning of other comments that may be a reaction to it. If you really feel you have to add anything, do it beneath your vote comment, and indent it with " #: ". But I suggest you don't, in this case. —KNcyu38 (talk • contribs) 11:32, 20 March 2007 (UTC)

Ok, it was mainly just typos, and clarification, when I was editing to get it correct. I even said I "added to the above" when I did. I'm tired guys, people try to scapegoat me, but what's in it for me? all this trouble, all this work. I just want to do what's right. I am student of history afterall, If you don't stand for something you'll fall for anything. Good night, and good luck people. JohnHistory 11:37, 20 March 2007 (UTC)JohnHistory

P.S. whoever edited the Red Baron page, it's better, but again the quote given from the source doesn't even say he was jewish, maybe the article should be changed to say..."doc so and so says he was not aryan", afterall that's what the sources quote is saying. Maybe slavic, i don't know. I can admit that though. JohnHistory 11:37, 20 March 2007 (UTC)JohnHistory

I believe you mean well, but 1) the Richthofen issue is, now that it has been brought up, totally seperated from Clawson's RfA and 2) as you're a very new user, you don't know this, but putting messages on the talk pages of many different users regarding an ongoing or upcoming RfA (either in favour of or against it) is forbidden by a policy called WP:CANVASS, as mentioned above. Please don't do it, it may get you blocked. —KNcyu38 (talk • contribs) 12:18, 20 March 2007 (UTC)

Blocked

I have blocked you for 24 hours for continued disruption to wikipedia, most recently with edit after all your warnings for Clawson. After you block has expired, please take a long hard look at the whole situation and consider being more constructive on the encyclopedia. Regards Ryanpostlethwaite contribs/talk 12:21, 20 March 2007 (UTC)

Note, if you feel this block is unjust, please place {{Unblock|reason for the unblock}} ~~~~ on your talk page and an admin will review it Ryanpostlethwaite contribs/talk 12:22, 20 March 2007 (UTC)

{Unblock|reason for the unblock}

I was just trying to get the typos fixed, and in the process sometimes I would clarify my points. Didn't realize I was doing anything wrong. Just rolled out of bed, going back. I have even edited this twice already. JohnHistory 12:25, 20 March 2007 (UTC)JohnHistory

Take some well-intentioned advice. Sleep well and come back less angry. --Dweller 12:28, 20 March 2007 (UTC)

What you need to do is, put this template; {{Unblock|reason for unblock}} ~~~~ directly underneath and replace reason for unblock with your reason why you feel the block is wrong. Theres no need for a heading Ryanpostlethwaite contribs/talk 12:29, 20 March 2007 (UTC)

• Request to unblock denied. >Radiant< 12:31, 20 March 2007 (UTC)

Funny, I didn't request anything! Just explaing to the people who come here what happened. I could use a break anyway. This has been consuming for me. JohnHistory 01:28, 21 March 2007 (UTC)JohnHistory

automatic talk page archiving

John, if you want to, you can set up Werdnabot to automatically archive your talk page. Each section will then be moved to a subpage of your user talk after a set period of time, and is easily accessible for future reference. If you want, you can use a slightly enhanced version, like I have on my user talk. Don't hesitate to ask, if you have any questions! Regards, —KNcyu38 (talk • contribs) 14:53, 21 March 2007 (UTC)

Manfred von Richthofen (again)

Replied. —KNcyu38 (talk • contribs) 03:59, 23 March 2007 (UTC)

You may have a new friend: , . —KNcyu38 (talk • contribs) 07:55, 23 March 2007 (UTC)

"All's well that ends well." That's because I decided not to be a dick about it. —KNcyu38 (talk • contribs) 23:55, 23 March 2007 (UTC)

Ownership and personal attacks

Regarding the very uncivil behaviour you displayed here and there.

Please do not assume ownership of articles such as Manfred von Richthofen. If you aren't willing to allow your contributions to be edited extensively or be redistributed by others, please do not submit them. Thank you.

Please do not attack other editors, which you did here: Talk:Manfred von Richthofen. If you continue, you will be blocked from editing Misplaced Pages.

—KNcyu38 (talk • contribs) 09:22, 24 March 2007 (UTC)

You aren't making any sense. You know how long I waited to edit that. Your a hyporcrit for not critizing the guy calling me scum. Shows your bias. JohnHistory 09:26, 24 March 2007 (UTC)JohnHIstory

FYI: I reported that IP who attacked you and it was temp blocked. All because I like you so much. —KNcyu38 (talk • contribs) 09:30, 24 March 2007 (UTC)

I'm serious, if you keep this up I'm going to bust you for herassment!!!! You know responding to the real uncivil act, the real personal attack by someone else against me, that wasn't your first impulse. No, your first impulse is to herass me for responding in a controlled way. JohnHistory 09:33, 24 March 2007 (UTC)JohnHistory.

The fact that you critize me and talk about me being blocked for saying truthfully that this guy is lying about me deleting anything here, which you can check. and the fact that you say nothing to him after he calls me "aryan scum" , etc. Show your bias, and that you are out to get me. I'm sure now, you will go back and comment on that, to cover yourself, but that was not your first impulse your impulse was to critize me for responding in a controlled way to such a personal attack. You will be blocked if you continue to herass me like this. JohnHistory 09:42, 24 March 2007 (UTC)JohnHistory

Waiting patiently, logically debating, and reaching consensus is in no way "owning the article" by me. In fact I'm doing the opposite. You know how long I waited to edit. Do not make false accusastion and slander against me, please refresh yourself with the civil policy on wiki. We both know that you and I have a history, and that we don't particularly like each other. I know how uncivil your capable of being, I have experienced it first hand. So please keep that out of Wiki, and stop herassing me! JohnHistory 10:00, 24 March 2007 (UTC)JohnHistory

IP claims

Regarding this, did you make that edit, as the IP claims, or is it a fraud? Please spare me the tedious work to look in your contribs. —KNcyu38 (talk • contribs) 13:18, 24 March 2007 (UTC)

On second thought, forget it. —KNcyu38 (talk • contribs) 13:20, 24 March 2007 (UTC)

Vandalism on MvR

Edits like this could be considered vandalism in their own right. Please state what you mean by "vandalized" on the article talk page, and please do it in a reasonable manner, without "shouting!!!!!" or pointing fingers and personally attacking other editors. —KNcyu38 (talk • contribs) 18:32, 25 March 2007 (UTC)