Misplaced Pages

Talk:Typhoon Haiyan: Difference between revisions

Article snapshot taken from Wikipedia with creative commons attribution-sharealike license. Give it a read and then ask your questions in the chat. We can research this topic together.
Browse history interactively← Previous editContent deleted Content addedVisualWikitext
Revision as of 04:17, 22 December 2021 editDylan620 (talk | contribs)Extended confirmed users, Pending changes reviewers, Rollbackers22,626 edits top-importance across the board; extreme meteorological significance, arguably one of the most catastrophic tropical cyclones of all time← Previous edit Latest revision as of 03:17, 4 December 2024 edit undoTvpuppy (talk | contribs)Extended confirmed users1,597 edits Rated low importance for TaiwanTags: Mobile edit Mobile web edit 
(15 intermediate revisions by 14 users not shown)
Line 1: Line 1:
{{Ds/talk notice|cc|long}} {{Contentious topics/talk notice|cc|long}}
{{Skip to talk}}{{talkheader}} {{Skip to talk}}{{talkheader}}
{{Article history
⚫ {{WikiProject banner shell|1=
|action1=GAN
⚫ {{WikiProject Disaster management |class=C |importance=top}}
|action1date=02:07, 18 August 2014 (UTC)
⚫ {{WikiProject Weather |class=C |importance=top |wpac-task-force=yes |tropical-cyclones-project=yes |floods-task-force=yes}}
|action1link=/GA1
⚫ {{WikiProject Tambayan Philippines |class=C |importance=Top}}
|action1result=failed

|currentstatus=FGAN
⚫ |itn1date=8 November 2013
⚫ |otd1date=2015-11-08|otd1oldid=689326250
|topic=Earth sciences
}} }}
⚫ {{WikiProject banner shell|class=C|1=
⚫ {{ITN talk|8 November|2013}}
⚫ {{WikiProject Disaster management |importance=top}}
{{FailedGA|02:07, 18 August 2014 (UTC)|topic=Earth sciences|page=1}}
⚫ {{WikiProject Weather |importance=top |wpac-task-force=yes |tropical-cyclones-project=yes |floods-task-force=yes}}
⚫ {{WikiProject Tambayan Philippines |importance=High}}
{{WikiProject China}}
{{WikiProject Vietnam}}
{{WikiProject Micronesia}}
{{WikiProject Taiwan|importance=Low}}
}}
{{Philippine English}}

{{annual readership}} {{annual readership}}
⚫ {{OnThisDay|date1=2015-11-08|oldid1=689326250}}
{{User:MiszaBot/config {{User:MiszaBot/config
| algo=old(360d) | algo=old(360d)
Line 20: Line 34:
}} }}
{{Archives}} {{Archives}}
{{Broken anchors|links=

* <nowiki>]</nowiki> The anchor (#Public Storm Warning Signals) ]. <!-- {"title":"Public Storm Warning Signals","appear":{"revid":415721507,"parentid":414594603,"timestamp":"2011-02-24T17:54:15Z","removed_section_titles":,"added_section_titles":},"disappear":{"revid":727445685,"parentid":724032077,"timestamp":"2016-06-29T01:46:25Z","removed_section_titles":,"added_section_titles":,"replaced_anchors":{"Public Storm Warning Signals":"Tropical Cyclone Warning Signals"}},"very_different":false,"rename_to":"Tropical cyclone warning signals"} -->
== Strongest ever ==
}}
On cnn it said this hit 195 mph. Typhoon tip the previous record holder was 190. wtf.--] (]) 08:49, 8 November 2013 (UTC)
:Wind speeds yes but not pressure. Although, an unofficial Dvorak estimation made by NOAA put Haiyan's min pressure at 862 hPa but that number is suspect as the official RSMC for the Western Pacific is the JMA. ]] 14:10, 8 November 2013 (UTC)

In 1934 storm winds of 231 mph (372 kph) were recorded. The record should be qualified against non tropical storms, perhaps. <span style="font-size: smaller;" class="autosigned">— Preceding ] comment added by ] (]) 14:39, 8 November 2013 (UTC)</span><!-- Template:Unsigned IP --> <!--Autosigned by SineBot-->
:While this storm may have had winds greater than Tip (the JTWC kept the maximum winds at 190 mph), the deciding factor for comparing storm intensity is central pressure. Officially, the JMA (the official warning center for the region) had Haiyan's lowest air pressure as being 895 hPa which is higher than Tip. &mdash; <font style="font-family:Helvetica; font-size:15px;">]]</font> 17:37, 9 November 2013 (UTC)

**Added on November 12th**

All the claims about this typhoon's being "strongest" are totally wrong. JTWC made a conversion mistake and the figure 315 km/h that was the source of all the big claims was erased from their server and you won't find a trace of it. In reality, that figure should have been 275 km/h, as seen in official Philippines' meteorological sources. The right measure of the strength is via the minimum pressure, anyway, and this typhoon is just 21st-35th in that part of the Pacific Ocean since the 1950s, see . So a similarly strong or stronger typhoon appears there once in 2-3 years or so. So I ask someone to correct this whole amazing mess and erase all the wrong comments about this typhoon's being extraordinary. --] (]) 07:35, 12 November 2013 (UTC)

:<small>When WILL America metricate? ] (]) 07:42, 12 November 2013 (UTC)</small>

<small>(in response to ])</small> Would like to clarify for a few things. Yes, intensity amongst tropical cyclones as a whole is usually determined via barometric pressure. That being said, the Joint Typhoon Warning Center utilizes 1-minute sustained winds, while the PAGASA and JMA utilizes 10-minute sustained winds. More precisely, the JTWC estimates wind speeds that are sustained for one minute - that is, if one were to measure winds for one minute, and then average measurements within that minute out. For the other agencies, they estimate wind speeds that are sustained for ten minutes. See ] for more details. As such, there was no conversion mistake, the JTWC determined winds to equate to 170 knots operationally, which equates to 315&nbsp;km/h (195&nbsp;mph), which is the highest since the 60s, though at that time instrumentation was rather unreliable. In reply to your comment of the JTWC wiping their servers to erase this 'mistake', this occurs with ''every'' operational advisory that the JTWC releases. Though it won't be confirmed until their annual tropical cyclone report is released this measurement was rather remarkable. The JTWC did not make a conversion mistake, and in the next advisory released from them they slightly weakened the storm to 295 km/h as the storm had passed over land and had actually weakened, again, still over 275 km/h. I hope that helps. ''']<sup>(]·])</sup>''' 03:40, 13 November 2013 (UTC)

:Dear Austin Man, thanks, I understand that all the alerts are being rewritten and there are various n-minute averages used by various sources. That's exactly why one can never compare the figures obtained by differing methods and differing timings to claim that one storm or another was a record-breaker of any sort. There isn't any single metric to measure the intensity in which the storm was a record-breaker, not even among those that landed. --] (]) 06:04, 13 November 2013 (UTC)
::I have already discussed this with you Lumidek. Please discontinue this discussion unless you can provide evidence aside from your own personal assumptions. ] (]) 20:22, 14 November 2013 (UTC)
:::It should be noted that JTWC's measurements are satellite based. There are no direct measurements confirming the sustained wind speeds (at any interval) that you are quoting here. In fact, all of the direct measurements are at variance with JTWC's satellite estimates. Comparing the satellite measurements to direct measurements strikes me as bad science and smacks of advocacy. <span style="font-size: smaller;" class="autosigned">— Preceding ] comment added by ] (]) 20:45, 14 November 2013 (UTC)</span><!-- Template:Unsigned IP --> <!--Autosigned by SineBot-->

If the record is measured by barometric pressure... This storm had an estimated pressure of 858 mb based on the Dvorak technique. Should Haiyan not be the most intense ever? I mean, even NOAA stated it at 858 mb. ] (]) 06:33, 16 November 2013 (UTC)
:That's the lowest of their estimates; however, a more accurate estimate from NOAA (using a more recent wind-pressure conversion) was 884mb, but still an estimate. The official pressure for Haiyan is 895 mb according to the JMA, which ranks it among the top 30 storms in the basin. ] (]) 06:41, 16 November 2013 (UTC)
::So I suppose you could say Haiyan is the most intense ever as measured by Dvorak technique (which is by no means official). I mean it did score a T8.0 and according to one source a T8.1. That's pretty darn high if you ask me. Though by direct/satellite measurements it is NOT most intense. ] (]) 08:56, 19 November 2013 (UTC)

My reanalysis says that it has 1-min sustained wind speeds of 205 mph and a pressure of 868 hPa.
I’m not going to edit the page to update its wind speeds and hPa though. ] (]) 03:48, 16 June 2020 (UTC)
:{{ping|Bsslover371}} source? ] (]) 16:24, 6 December 2020 (UTC)


== Remiscence to Yolanda Saldivar's namesake? == == Remiscence to Yolanda Saldivar's namesake? ==
Line 71: Line 61:
*'''Strong Oppose''' – We are not anywhere near the readability limit in terms of prose (article size ''does not matter here''). And unless someone plans to significantly expand the content in the Philippines impacts sections, an article split is absolutely pointless. This proposal has already been put forth and shot down multiple times now. Unless something fundamentally changes (such as a large-scale content expansion, as I had mentioned earlier), this one should also go out the door. ''''']''''' 🌀 (]) 14:31, 13 December 2020 (UTC) *'''Strong Oppose''' – We are not anywhere near the readability limit in terms of prose (article size ''does not matter here''). And unless someone plans to significantly expand the content in the Philippines impacts sections, an article split is absolutely pointless. This proposal has already been put forth and shot down multiple times now. Unless something fundamentally changes (such as a large-scale content expansion, as I had mentioned earlier), this one should also go out the door. ''''']''''' 🌀 (]) 14:31, 13 December 2020 (UTC)
{{abot}} {{abot}}

== Maximum rainfall inches ==

Do we need a template data for maximum rainfall inches? I researched on the internet and some of them say "11 inches", some "19 inches". We need actual maximum rainfall inches data that is confirmed by either PAGASA, or other verified weather bureau. ] (]) 01:39, 3 November 2022 (UTC)

Latest revision as of 03:17, 4 December 2024

The contentious topics procedure applies to this page. This page is related to climate change, which has been designated as a contentious topic.

Editors who repeatedly or seriously fail to adhere to the purpose of Misplaced Pages, any expected standards of behaviour, or any normal editorial process may be blocked or restricted by an administrator. Editors are advised to familiarise themselves with the contentious topics procedures before editing this page.

Skip to table of contents
This is the talk page for discussing improvements to the Typhoon Haiyan article.
This is not a forum for general discussion of the article's subject.
Article policies
Find sources: Google (books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL
Archives: 1, 2Auto-archiving period: 12 months 
Former good article nomineeTyphoon Haiyan was a Natural sciences good articles nominee, but did not meet the good article criteria at the time. There may be suggestions below for improving the article. Once these issues have been addressed, the article can be renominated. Editors may also seek a reassessment of the decision if they believe there was a mistake.
Article milestones
DateProcessResult
August 18, 2014Good article nomineeNot listed
In the newsA news item involving this article was featured on Misplaced Pages's Main Page in the "In the news" column on November 8, 2013.
On this day...A fact from this article was featured on Misplaced Pages's Main Page in the "On this day..." column on November 8, 2015.
This article is rated C-class on Misplaced Pages's content assessment scale.
It is of interest to the following WikiProjects:
WikiProject iconDisaster management Top‑importance
WikiProject iconThis article is within the scope of WikiProject Disaster management, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of Disaster management on Misplaced Pages. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.Disaster managementWikipedia:WikiProject Disaster managementTemplate:WikiProject Disaster managementDisaster management
TopThis article has been rated as Top-importance on the project's importance scale.
WikiProject iconWeather: Tropical / Western Pacific / Floods Top‑importance
WikiProject iconThis article is within the scope of WikiProject Weather, which collaborates on weather and related subjects on Misplaced Pages. To participate, help improve this article or visit the project page for details. WeatherWikipedia:WikiProject WeatherTemplate:WikiProject WeatherWeather
TopThis article has been rated as Top-importance on the project's importance scale.
Taskforce icon
This article is supported by WikiProject Tropical cyclones (assessed as Top-importance).
Taskforce icon
This article is supported by the Pacific typhoon work group (assessed as Top-importance).
Taskforce icon
This article is supported by the Floods task force (assessed as Top-importance).
WikiProject iconTambayan Philippines High‑importance
WikiProject iconThis article is within the scope of WikiProject Tambayan Philippines, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of topics related to the Philippines on Misplaced Pages. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.Tambayan PhilippinesWikipedia:WikiProject Tambayan PhilippinesTemplate:WikiProject Tambayan PhilippinesPhilippine-related
HighThis article has been rated as High-importance on the importance scale.
WikiProject iconChina
WikiProject iconThis article is within the scope of WikiProject China, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of China related articles on Misplaced Pages. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.ChinaWikipedia:WikiProject ChinaTemplate:WikiProject ChinaChina-related
???This article has not yet received a rating on the project's importance scale.
WikiProject iconVietnam
WikiProject iconThis article is part of WikiProject Vietnam, an attempt to create a comprehensive, neutral, and accurate representation of Vietnam on Misplaced Pages. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page.VietnamWikipedia:WikiProject VietnamTemplate:WikiProject VietnamVietnam
???This article has not yet received a rating on the project's importance scale.
WikiProject iconMicronesia
WikiProject iconThis article is within the scope of WikiProject Micronesia, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of Micronesia on Misplaced Pages. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.MicronesiaWikipedia:WikiProject MicronesiaTemplate:WikiProject MicronesiaMicronesia
???This article has not yet received a rating on the project's importance scale.
WikiProject iconTaiwan Low‑importance
WikiProject iconThis article is within the scope of WikiProject Taiwan, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of Taiwan on Misplaced Pages. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.TaiwanWikipedia:WikiProject TaiwanTemplate:WikiProject TaiwanTaiwan
LowThis article has been rated as Low-importance on the project's importance scale.
This article is written in Philippine English, which has its own spelling conventions (color, realize, center, travelled) and some terms that are used in it (including jeepney and cyberlibel) may be different or absent from other varieties of English. According to the relevant style guide, this should not be changed without broad consensus.



Archives
Archive 1Archive 2

This page has archives. Sections older than 360 days may be automatically archived by Lowercase sigmabot III when more than 3 sections are present.
Tip: Anchors are case-sensitive in most browsers.

This article links to one or more target anchors that no longer exist.

Please help fix the broken anchors. You can remove this template after fixing the problems. | Reporting errors

Remiscence to Yolanda Saldivar's namesake?

I know Yolanda Saldivar killed Selena, but 18 years later, in 2013, Typhoon Yolanda (namesake of Yolanda Saldivar) killed 6000+ people in Tacloban.

15 December 2014, 10:56 PM (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by 112.209.29.61 (talk) — Preceding undated comment added 22:56, December 15, 2014 (UTC)

Effects in the Phillippines article

WP:SNOW close. No consensus to split.~ Destroyer🌀🌀 00:44, 14 December 2020 (UTC)

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

@Destroyeraa, Jasper Deng, Hurricanehink, SMB99thx, Cyclone Toby, Cyclone Yoris, and KN2731: thoughts on a subarticle? Article is over 200 kB and information is better covered if subsection is provided. --HurricaneTracker495 (talk) 02:42, 22 November 2020 (UTC)

Oppose. That would be majority of the article if there was a Philippines article. Maybe move more of the aftermath to Humanitarian response to Typhoon Haiyan? ♫ Hurricanehink (talk) 03:16, 22 November 2020 (UTC)
​ Meh. HurricaneTracker495 (talk) 14:17, 22 November 2020 (UTC)
I gave my thoughts and I felt they were perfectly cromulent. ♫ Hurricanehink (talk) 19:12, 22 November 2020 (UTC)

Split?

This is crazy. 207 kB is waaaaay past the point we split. We either need to condense or split. This is unsustainable. --67.85.37.186 (talk) 23:13, 25 November 2020 (UTC)

I suggest you read the above discussion, where I proposed a way of trimming down the article. ♫ Hurricanehink (talk) 00:19, 26 November 2020 (UTC)
Have you read WP:SIZERULE? ~ KN2731 {talk · contribs} 14:16, 27 November 2020 (UTC)
Not sure if this is to me or the IP, but I want to point out that the size rule has to do with readable prose. Much of the 207 kb is table formatting and references. ♫ Hurricanehink (talk) 15:08, 27 November 2020 (UTC)
@Hurricanehink: it's to the IP. Was pointing out that 207 kB of wiki markup isn't "waaaaay past the point we split" (readable prose is only 47 kB last time I checked). ~ KN2731 {talk · contribs} 09:31, 28 November 2020 (UTC)
I've made a spelling change to the proposed new title. Certes (talk) 17:14, 27 November 2020 (UTC)
  • Strong Oppose – We are not anywhere near the readability limit in terms of prose (article size does not matter here). And unless someone plans to significantly expand the content in the Philippines impacts sections, an article split is absolutely pointless. This proposal has already been put forth and shot down multiple times now. Unless something fundamentally changes (such as a large-scale content expansion, as I had mentioned earlier), this one should also go out the door. LightandDark2000 🌀 (talk) 14:31, 13 December 2020 (UTC)
The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

Maximum rainfall inches

Do we need a template data for maximum rainfall inches? I researched on the internet and some of them say "11 inches", some "19 inches". We need actual maximum rainfall inches data that is confirmed by either PAGASA, or other verified weather bureau. Sarge Da2 (talk) 01:39, 3 November 2022 (UTC)

Categories: