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Revision as of 21:05, 16 December 2023 editMzajac (talk | contribs)Autopatrolled, Extended confirmed users66,545 edits →Titles of articles on Ukrainian povits/uezds: ReplyTag: Reply← Previous edit Latest revision as of 17:05, 18 December 2024 edit undoLowercase sigmabot III (talk | contribs)Bots, Template editors2,293,709 editsm Archiving 2 discussion(s) to Misplaced Pages talk:WikiProject Ukraine/Archive 8) (bot 
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== Konstantyn H. Kulyk == == Draft:Yury Yuriyovich Shikula ==
I've created an article for the former Ukainian prosecutor ]. There seem to be a lot of different spellings for his name, in Ukrainian, Russian and English. Could someone familiar with these languages take a look and check that I've got the right versions of these names? — ] (]) 21:21, 16 November 2023 (UTC)

== Nashi political party's page has missing sources. ==

The sources for these two claims are incorrect. The sources attached have nothing to do about supporting the Russian invasion of Ukraine in 2022.

"The party has a ] stance. It supported the ]."

All 3 attached sources are from before 2020. ] (]) 04:18, 17 November 2023 (UTC)
:{{Done}}. Removed the 2nd sentence, see ]. ] (]) 07:40, 17 November 2023 (UTC)

== Proposed merge of Dovzhansk Raion into Sverdlovsk Raion ==

] There is a merge proposal ongoing at ] that may interest editors of this WikiProject. ] (]) 17:33, 20 November 2023 (UTC)

== Has the classification "Rural Settlements" been abolished along with "Urban-type Settlements"? ==

I just learned that Ukraine has recently overhauled their settlement classification scheme, but I can't seem to figure out whether they abolished the classification of "Rural-type Settlement". I've translated a few settlement articles and would like to update them if the classification no longer exists. Also, if they have abolished it, do rural settlements immediately become villages (selos) in January when the law takes effect? <span style="font-family:Copperplate Gothic, Ebrima;background-color:OrangeRed;border-radius:7px;text-shadow:2px 2px 4px#000000;padding:3px 3px;">]</span><sup>]</sup> 05:48, 30 November 2023 (UTC)

:I didn't know where to post this question, so I apologize if this is the wrong place. <span style="font-family:Copperplate Gothic, Ebrima;background-color:OrangeRed;border-radius:7px;text-shadow:2px 2px 4px#000000;padding:3px 3px;">]</span><sup>]</sup> 05:58, 30 November 2023 (UTC)
:You would naturally assume that, but it seems that the new law simply ignored the existence of rural-type settlements, since there are very few of them. Legally, they were never called "rural-type", they were called simply "settlements" and generally were smaller than "villages". Only "urban-type settlements" always used an adjective in the name. So it seems that the new law did not affect the rural-type settlements and they would stay as "settlements" even though we basically have a corrupted hierarchy now: city > settlement > village > settlement. Maybe, it will get fixed eventually, or maybe not. ] (]) 06:18, 30 November 2023 (UTC)
:The most sure way to check the status of any settlement would be to check with which is a huge excel file listing all administrative units and their types. However, it has not been yet updated since the new law took an effect, so we would need to wait for the update and then see how the ministry deals with this inconsistency. ] (]) 06:26, 30 November 2023 (UTC)
::Thanks for clarifying! I'll have to check in on the spreadsheet in January. <span style="font-family:Copperplate Gothic, Ebrima;background-color:OrangeRed;border-radius:7px;text-shadow:2px 2px 4px#000000;padding:3px 3px;">]</span><sup>]</sup> 06:32, 30 November 2023 (UTC)

== Igor Bondar (of the 2020s) ==

],<br>
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Hi! As of December 2023, works (or at least "] work") are coming out of ] from Bondar.--In Ukraine, is he considered a poet, first and foremost, or rather a writer?--He seems to be sort of a correspondent (from Kharkiv) in a mid-size newspaper in my country, because his newspaper column gets printed a few times every month.--Trying to find in-depth sources is problematic, in part because there was an Ukrainian journalist (uk.wikipedia.org/Ігор_Бондар) ], that was murdered in ] in 1999.--Thoughts on how to find sources about the writer/poet and his works?--His work printed in my country (and largely in one newspaper), might barely contribute to possible wiki-notability; however, it is all other stuff that might decide possible wiki-notability. ] (]) 01:59, 7 December 2023 (UTC)

:You mentioned "my country". Is it Ukraine or other country? Google search in Ukrainian finds poet Igor/Ihor Bondar-Tereshchenko from Kharkiv (]). Is that the one? ] (]) 05:27, 7 December 2023 (UTC)
::Outstanding! I will link the article when I expect to have it done in a few weeks.--(As columnist, his "Brev fra krigen" column, is signed by ] Bondar, although the articles are translated by a local translator.)--I will use the title ], unless a talk page advises that ] is how ''his'' name should be in English. (Wikidata does not give any clue yet, it seems.)--Thanks a lot! ] (]) 02:29, 8 December 2023 (UTC)

== Merge discussion at ] ==
] There is a requested merge discussion at ] that may be of interest to members of this WikiProject. ] ] ] 22:22, 10 December 2023 (UTC)

== Titles of articles on Ukrainian povits/uezds ==

I intend to clean up the titles of articles and categories on historical ]s (a.k.a. ]s or ]) in Ukraine. This system of subdividing the gubernia (a.k.a. ''huberniia'') was established in the Russian empire (]), and then inherited by the Ukrainian People’s Republic and Soviet Ukraine (]).

The spellings and names are not consistent. There’s no advice in ] and I can’t find any corresponding guideline for Russian-empire or Soviet place names. A number of these have been moved without discussion to a different pattern (e.g., Bakhmutsky Uyezd was moved to ]).

I intend to rename all of these to use consistent spelling with the main article ], for example ]&nbsp;→ ]. This is not controversial and I will proceed without waiting for comments (but feel free).

I am also considering the following questions:

# Do we keep the prevailing capitalization ''Konotopsky Uezd'', or switch to lowercased ''Konotopsky uezd''?
# Do we keep the prevailing native adjectival proper name, like ''Konotopsky Uezd'', or switch to an anglicized version like ''Konotop Uezd'' (after the city of ])?
# Were any of these established in Ukraine after 1917 and should therefore be renamed, e.g., ]&nbsp;→ ]/]?

Any other concerns? Please comment.&nbsp;—'']&nbsp;].'' 16:55, 15 December 2023 (UTC)

:It makes sense to use "uezd" for consistency with the main article name. Regarding the questions:
:1. This probably should be governed by some general English rule. I see that American counties always use the capitalized versions: "]", "]" (also "]"). Is it the same in other English-speaking countries?
:2. I would prefer Konotopsky Uezd because it's closer to the original name. Otherwise, you actually need to do some original research to identify the center and to transform the name accordingly. And what to do when it's not named after the center, like ]? (Also, ] is named after part of the name "Novaya Ushitsa".) Similar examples for other units, like ] and ] frankly sound a bit unnatural to me as a Ukrainian/Russian speaker, and require some extra-thinking to understand what the topic is about.
:3. During Russian Empire times the divisions were very stable, but a lot of changes (incl. creations of new units and deletions of old ones) were happening after 1917. I guess most of uezds listed below were created in Russian Empire times, so probably the Russian name "uezd" can be used for the following reasons:
:: 1) for consistency with all other imperial units existing back then;
:: 2) because in all official documents of that time it would be written in Russian (since Ukrainian language was either prohibited or suppressed during that time);
:: 3) since it would be hard to distinguish Ukrainian from non-Ukrainian units, since Ukraine did not have well-defined boundaries back then.
: However, if some unit was created in ] or one of Ukrainian states (after 1917), then probably the term "povit" might be a better fit, since that's how it would appear in many documents (including most of modern historical research focused on post-1917 Ukraine) and it would be clear that the unit indeed belonged to Ukraine. For older Russian Empire units which continued existence in ], the redirection from povit to uezd can be also used. ] should not however be renamed into Povit, since it was created long before 1917, so most of its existence was in Russian Empire.
: --] (]) 04:36, 16 December 2023 (UTC)
::3. Muscovy and Russian empire reorganized gubernias a number of times.
::1) It’s not all consistent, as there are articles about former imperial counties with Estonian, Latvian, and a Lithuanian names, and I think Polish too. Would have to check Georgia, Armenia, Central Asia, &c. Consistency is the lowest-priority naming ].
::2) See ]. There is no reason to automatically privilege colonial names and deprecate native local names.
::3) Ukrainian ethnolinguistic territory had well defined boundaries, and history books tell us which gubernias or which of their parts were in it. Russia recognized specific Ukrainian boundaries in the 1918 Treaty of Brest-Litovsk. There were specific borders of Soviet Ukraine established soon after, and of course we know what the boundaries of modern Ukraine are.
::There is also the assumption that “most of its existence” is true and significant, but “its most recent name” is not, with no rationale for this. In fact, most examples like ], ], ], ], and ] indicate the opposite. ] privileges most recent names, and local names, unless “a substantial majority of reliable modern sources” do otherwise.
::(Ushitsa county was called ''Ushitskyi/Novoushitskyi povit'' or ''Ushitskii/Novoushitskii uezd''.) &nbsp;—'']&nbsp;].'' 16:16, 16 December 2023 (UTC)
:::My main concern is that some of the articles, like ], cite only a Russian-language source. In such case, it would be probably an OR to translate the name into English ''through Ukrainian'', especially since Ukrainian spelling 100 years ago and now might slightly differ. Such articles should have at least one Ukrainian-language source to justify the Ukrainian name, for example, you could probably use establishing new okruhas and raions to get the correct Ukrainian spellings for the abolished povits. ] (]) 20:57, 16 December 2023 (UTC)
:::If consistency is not an issue, then you can probably decide on a case by case basis depending on the cited sources. ] (]) 20:58, 16 December 2023 (UTC)
::::Of course, but I’d like to do a mass cleanup first. This conversation is just to see what is acceptable. &nbsp;—'']&nbsp;].'' 21:05, 16 December 2023 (UTC)
:::By the way, uezd was sometimes translated into Ukrainian as "уїзд" (uizd). In any case, all uezds/povits can be considered as colonial units, since they were established either by the Russian imperial, or by the Soviet, or by the Polish administration. The only truly native units pre-1991 were "zemlias" that the ] tried to establish in 1918, or polks and sotnias in the ] times. ] (]) 21:04, 16 December 2023 (UTC)
::For modern place names in Ukraine, per ] we use the anglicized form for oblasts (]), raions (]), and hromadas (]), but we transliterate names of urban districts (]). This example shows that the lesser-known uezds don’t necessarily have to be named the same way as the larger gubernias. We do seem to capitalize all of the subdivision types when they appear in names, although many academic sources do not.
::(By the way, the ''official'' Ukrainian Latin-alphabet place names are always transliterated according to the toponymic guidelines: Donetska oblast, Zolochivskyi raion, Avhustynivska rural council, Zavodskyi raion.) &nbsp;—'']&nbsp;].'' 18:48, 16 December 2023 (UTC)
::2. I agree that transliterating the native name is best. Although Dneprovskii/Dniprovskyi can also be reverse-engineered as Dnieper uezd or Dnipro povit, this would be ] (unless it were based on determining the COMMONNAME for each of these hundreds of little-mentioned places). &nbsp;—'']&nbsp;].'' 19:06, 16 December 2023 (UTC)
:I second @]'s point about borders not being clearly defined. Linguistically it's largely a continuum. There are places within the borders of modern Russia whose language is closer to Ukrainian (such as some parts of Voronezh oblast) and vice-versa there are places within the borders of modern Ukraine where Ukrainian has never been the dominant language (e.g, ]). ]<sub>]</sub> 20:16, 16 December 2023 (UTC)

{{Collapse top|List of uezds in Ukraine}}

This is a preliminary list of articles on povits/uezds/counties in Ukrainian gubernias. Some of these ended up in the territory of the RSFSR and not Ukraine after 1917.

The list is incomplete, and still lacks links to articles on povits/uezds/counties in ], ]/], ], and ]. Feel free to add missing article links.&nbsp;—'']&nbsp;].'' 16:55, 15 December 2023 (UTC)

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], I came across this draft a few days ago in a rather incomplete state and have made some edits. However, as a non-Ukrainian speaker, it is challenging for me to fully assess the accuracy, especially regarding the title: is it Yury Yuriyovich Shikula or Yuriy Yuriyovych Shykula. Also, I removed some content from the awards section, as it appeared to pertain to a different individual with the same name. Could someone please review this draft for accuracy? I am particularly curious about this draft as it seems potentially notable. ] (]) 14:44, 26 November 2024 (UTC)
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:I am not an Ukrainian speaker, but I think he is Yuriy Yuriovych Shykula. We just use ]. ] (]) 17:00, 26 November 2024 (UTC)
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] (not active for over a year and a half when it comes to his global account) has created at least some maps with his personal ex libris in the lower right corner, and they are strewn across various pages, including important ones; some examples: , , , , , . I think that below is a list of all of his uploads, but I haven't been seriously involved in Misplaced Pages for a long time, so I might be missing something: . Maybe someone here could find some extra time to try and go through it and correct the images affected.
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Posting it here for lack of a better place, and WikiProject:Ukraine seems to be more active in the English version than in the Ukrainian version. ] (]) 02:52, 3 December 2024 (UTC)
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:I don't thing adding ex libris violates any rules. These images are hosted on WikiCommons so you may want to request assistance ] as well. Or you can just do it yourself :) ]<sub>]</sub> 13:15, 7 December 2024 (UTC)
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Is anyone able to rescue this? ] (]) 00:01, 7 December 2024 (UTC)
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== Requested move at ] ==
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] There is a requested move discussion at ] that may be of interest to members of this WikiProject. ] (]) 17:34, 9 December 2024 (UTC)


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They completed training and have been sent back to Ukraine, and I'm seeing various Russian, Ukrainian, and French reports on the brigade, but can't make sense of what's going on. The article should use the highest quality sources, such as AP and Reuters, and they have given profiles on the brigade in the past, but haven't given an update since. . . So should we wait until the highest quality sources comment on this? ] (]) 04:45, 18 December 2024 (UTC)
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Latest revision as of 17:05, 18 December 2024

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Draft:Yury Yuriyovich Shikula

Ymblanter, I came across this draft a few days ago in a rather incomplete state and have made some edits. However, as a non-Ukrainian speaker, it is challenging for me to fully assess the accuracy, especially regarding the title: is it Yury Yuriyovich Shikula or Yuriy Yuriyovych Shykula. Also, I removed some content from the awards section, as it appeared to pertain to a different individual with the same name. Could someone please review this draft for accuracy? I am particularly curious about this draft as it seems potentially notable. TheBirdsShedTears (talk) 14:44, 26 November 2024 (UTC)

I am not an Ukrainian speaker, but I think he is Yuriy Yuriovych Shykula. We just use MOS:UKR. Ymblanter (talk) 17:00, 26 November 2024 (UTC)

Ukraine-related maps by User:Роман Днепр

User:Роман Днепр (not active for over a year and a half when it comes to his global account) has created at least some maps with his personal ex libris in the lower right corner, and they are strewn across various pages, including important ones; some examples: , , , , , . I think that below is a list of all of his uploads, but I haven't been seriously involved in Misplaced Pages for a long time, so I might be missing something: . Maybe someone here could find some extra time to try and go through it and correct the images affected.

Do you think any disciplinary measures could be taken against the user?

Posting it here for lack of a better place, and WikiProject:Ukraine seems to be more active in the English version than in the Ukrainian version. KarolloraK555 (talk) 02:52, 3 December 2024 (UTC)

I don't thing adding ex libris violates any rules. These images are hosted on WikiCommons so you may want to request assistance there as well. Or you can just do it yourself :) Alaexis¿question? 13:15, 7 December 2024 (UTC)

Kateryna Bilokon

Is anyone able to rescue this? Bearian (talk) 00:01, 7 December 2024 (UTC)

Requested move at Talk:Leonid Kadeniuk#Page move due to misspelled name

There is a requested move discussion at Talk:Leonid Kadeniuk#Page move due to misspelled name that may be of interest to members of this WikiProject. Feeglgeef (talk) 17:34, 9 December 2024 (UTC)

155th Mechanized Brigade (Ukraine)

They completed training and have been sent back to Ukraine, and I'm seeing various Russian, Ukrainian, and French reports on the brigade, but can't make sense of what's going on. The article should use the highest quality sources, such as AP and Reuters, and they have given profiles on the brigade in the past, but haven't given an update since. French source. Ukraine source. So should we wait until the highest quality sources comment on this? Harizotoh9 (talk) 04:45, 18 December 2024 (UTC)

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