Misplaced Pages

Revision as of 03:47, 7 May 2007

Old talk at /Archive1, /Archive2, /Archive3, /Archive4, /Archive5, /Archive6, /Archive7, /Archive8, /Archive9, /Archive10, /Archive11, /Archive12, /Archive 13, /Archive 14, /Archive15, /Archive16, /Archive17, /Archive18

Image:Mouldy_bread.jpg

July 10 last year you deleted this image with the summary it had the same name on the commons. The link is now broken with no trace of any such image on the commons. Where did it go? - Mgm| 12:11, 1 April 2007 (UTC)

It was deleted by me simply as a matter of housekeeping, as it was a duplicate. However, looking at the Commons logs, it looks like the image was deleted recently as a copyright violation: . Dmcdevit·t 04:14, 4 April 2007 (UTC)

Why did you block me?

I want to know why my IP address was blocked. I do have an account, I just don't feel like logging in everytime I want to correct a minor misspelling (I occasionally use my account, I just prefer anonymous editing, is that wrong?). How did I abuse my IP address? I never vandalized any articles and I think it's unfair that I get blocked without any explanation. Let's see if we can work something out. I can understand you'd want to keep trouble makers out of Misplaced Pages (trust me, I hate them too), but I assure you I am not one of them. Hurricane Andrew 14:56, 5 April 2007 (UTC)

Hello, I am asking you why my IP address has been blocked, I haven't done anything wrong. I am posting it here: 66.217.38.111 Please respond, I don't want my questions ignored. Thank you. Hurricane Andrew 21:18, 6 April 2007 (UTC)

I haven't been ignoring you. In the future please put your messages at the bottom of talk pages, so people you are trying to talk to notice it. :)

As for the block, you are on a dynamic IP range, which means that you share it with many other users, whose IPs change periodically, along with yours. That means that blocking a specific vandal is harder, and we sometimes have to make range blocks. This is why we have anonymous-only blocks, so that legitimate users like you affected by the block can simply log in and edit. I did not block you personally, it is simply a case of collateral damage. If I had intended that, your account, not your IP, would have been blocked. Dmcdevit·t 22:46, 6 April 2007 (UTC)

RFAR

I'll keep this short. Could you reconsider your recent RFAR request, giving the new process a chance? I would that perhaps we can assist these two, and they could add good content. In the interest of the project. Thanks, Navou / _contribs 15:50, 2 April 2007 (UTC)

As I noted, it doesn't make sense to me to come up with some communit-imposed sanction when the two were already on revert parole and have a history of gaming and violations. In particular, the revert parole was recently used to unblock them by an overly rules-oriented administrator, so it seems counterproductive. To be frank, I think a ban is the best solution. Dmcdevit·t 17:46, 2 April 2007 (UTC)

Ararat arev

Whatever you did, it seems to have stopped him cold. Thanks very much for handling that. Seraphimblade 01:12, 4 April 2007 (UTC)

Well, looks like I spoke too soon, he's back at it. Still, your help is greatly appreciated. Seraphimblade 04:00, 4 April 2007 (UTC)

Heh, I noticed. ;) I just blocked that newest IP (same range), but it's not as much of a problem: he's running on old sleepers he already created, but once he runs out, account creation is already blocked so he'll be out of luck. Dmcdevit·t 04:02, 4 April 2007 (UTC)

Well, here's hoping he runs out soon! Seraphimblade 04:08, 4 April 2007 (UTC)

By the way, is there any way to add to the account creation page a warning not to use an obvious password (like the same as the username)? He's apparently been compromising accounts like that. Seraphimblade 04:17, 4 April 2007 (UTC)

How is it possible to know that? I suppose if the account was created recently enough that the IP for the log entry is still stored, I might notice the sudden change in IP, but I haven't seen that on any of the accounts I've checked. Is there some other way to know he didn't pesonally create an account he used? In any case, it's not a bad suggestion; how does this look? You can edit that page however you think best. Dmcdevit·t 04:36, 4 April 2007 (UTC)

Khoikhoi stated he did it, I haven't tested it myself, but it does appear that at least some of the accounts in question have made a very sudden shift in interest and contribution areas. Regardless, the edit you made certainly makes sense, people like to use really stupid passwords sometimes. Seraphimblade 04:44, 4 April 2007 (UTC)

Dmcdevit, please check out Special:Contributions/7777. You'll notice that the account clearly wasn't created by him, but he was able to use it because the password is the same as the username. I was even able to log into it myself: . Khoikhoi 05:35, 4 April 2007 (UTC)

Also, take a look at Special:Contributions/Kuk. It was last used a month ago before Ararat arev first used it. Khoikhoi 05:37, 4 April 2007 (UTC)

Barnstar

		The Working Man's Barnstar
		For your seemingly tireless efforts in improving Misplaced Pages, I, Khoikhoi, award you this barnstar. 02:55, 4 April 2007 (UTC)

Oh, and Ararat arev is back on Armenia under the following IPs:

• 206.148.196.115 (talk · contribs)
• 206.148.196.201 (talk · contribs)
• 206.148.196.25 (talk · contribs)
• 206.148.197.13 (talk · contribs)
• 66.81.158.196 (talk · contribs)
• 66.81.158.113 (talk · contribs)
• 206.148.196.197 (talk · contribs)

Ciao, Khoikhoi 02:55, 4 April 2007 (UTC)

Looks like those were mostly old range blocks of mine that expired. I've extended them. Thanks for the barnstar. :-) Dmcdevit·t 04:11, 4 April 2007 (UTC)

Armenia and Ararat Arev

I am one of the editors who first had to deal with this user over five months ago. Quite simply, no power on earth will ever stop him from adding his material rabidly if the semiprotection is removed. He's already returned once again just after you unprotected it. You might want to put it back. Thanatosimii 05:16, 4 April 2007 (UTC)

The semi-protection wasn't doing anything anyway, these are all old accounts that can edit over it. However, they are old accounts because his main IP is blocked from account creations. I think he will run out of steam soon. Dmcdevit·t 05:26, 4 April 2007 (UTC)

I hope he will stop, but I am not sure that will be the case. He might just go to, say a library, and create his accounts again, he might have done this already. Do the editors need to make some number of edits to be established editors, or will they be an established one after some preset time? I guess we will have to use editprotected in the mean time. deniz_C 21:55, 23 April 2007 (UTC)

Anonymous

Hi. Could you please check the activity of 72.18.138.210 (talk · contribs). He has been edit warring on some pages, deleting content added by other users and ignoring talk, and has previous warnings from admins about his actions being vandalism. Regards, Grandmaster 05:28, 4 April 2007 (UTC)

Misplaced Pages:Requests for arbitration/E104421-Tajik

Hello,

An Arbitration case involving you has been opened: Misplaced Pages:Requests for arbitration/E104421-Tajik. Please add any evidence you may wish the arbitrators to consider to the evidence sub-page, Misplaced Pages:Requests for arbitration/E104421-Tajik/Evidence. You may also contribute to the case on the workshop sub-page, Misplaced Pages:Requests for arbitration/E104421-Tajik/Workshop.

On behalf of the Arbitration Committee, - Penwhale | 12:35, 4 April 2007 (UTC)

Undelete

An editor has asked for a deletion review of List of abbreviations for names. Since you closed the deletion discussion for this article or speedy-deleted it, you might want to participate in the deletion review. — Swpb 12:46, 4 April 2007 (UTC)

Review of Block User:The_Behnam

I think that the decision to block this user was a bit premature. The cited reverts in the 3RR were for undoing POV vandalism POV pushing (this last resulted in the page being fully protected). The 300 article's edit page - in an effort to maintain stability, requested that users bring their proposed changes to the Discussion Page first. This request was also meant to build consensus for changes in the article, and cut down on edit warring. Benhams's edits were not of the tendentious sort, and were actually constructive.
Benham has been harassed by User:Agha Nader, whom he apparently knows in RL. After looking at the edit histories of both, I do see a tendency of Nader to follow Benham around, contesting his edits. I never believed in cabals, and for the most part still don't, but I have noticed - at least in the 300 article a definite, overtly cooperative effort to maintain a pro-nationalist sentiment within the article. Both ArmenianJoe and Agha Nader (and a few others, such as Khoikoi, Azerbaijani and Mardavich) seem to work in very close coordination of effort, via external email (fully aware that any conversation within talk will be recorded). While of course there are no cabals, the best of these "non-cabals" maintain a NPOV to work towards a better article; that is not occurring with the aforementioned users. They work to undo edits that that challenges their nationalist view, and to discredit and remove those editors who disagree consistently with this view. Often this view fiolates one or more of the Five Pillars. After viewing the ArbCom you are part of, I am pretty sure you know what I am talking about here.
Benham has clearly angered this group, and you can see that the edits he reverted were non-consensus edits that served solely to push a POV that was in the specific minority in the article. If you cannot see your way to removing the block after evaluating the environment in which Benham was editing in, perhaps you could lessen the length of the block. Typically, a first block lasts for 8 hours. Benham has not received that same consideration that any other user would have for 3RR on non edit-warring edits. Arcayne 16:15, 4 April 2007 (UTC)

Please do not refer to other ediors you disaree with as vandals, as this is uncivil, see WP:VAND#What_vandalism_is_not. The proper response to harassment is not response in kind. While teh content of the edits may have been constructive (I make no judgment), the edit warring was not. Please read through WP:DR#Further_dispute_resolution for proper responses to hostile editors. Dmcdevit·t 17:18, 4 April 2007 (UTC)

Excuse me, but I would ask that you not accuse me of mistaking vandalism with disagreement - I am well aware of the difference. While I completely agree that fighting 'fire with fire' is a close approximation to WP:POINT, your blocking of those editors ensuring a NPOV only serves to encourage POV "vandals" (your term, not mine) to continue those tactics which remove detractors.

As well, I agree that an An/I might be the only method by which to resolve the underlying issue, but your narrow interpretation of the violation here actually hurts that AN/I. The first block that the user received was a 24-hr block, when in most cases, 8-hr is called for (and I've seen the original block reasoning by Khoikoi - the edits were neither egregious nor valid). If you truly felt that the block was necessary, you might have AGF and allowed for the block to be of a more reasonabl length.

That you seem to be blocking the indivdual according to a warning that you gave him on another page, and using it as a further justification for the block here implies that you are exerting a sero-revert policy, which isn't WP policy. It seems to allow additions without correction, so any sort of completely POV nonsense can be added, as anyone who reverts it will be blocked, according to your warning This hasn't appeared to foster much in the way of discussion on the Discussion Page. It instead appears to have encouraged sockpuppetry, which seems to have increased significantly since your warning.

Clearly, you have issues with the edits taking place in the Koryun and Azerbaijan (Iran) articles. After taking a look at some of the nonsense going on there, so would I. However, penalizing someone and citing special rules you have devised on other pages as the reasoning seems invalid. This implies that you might have a conflict of interest in this matter, and should not have weighed in on the complaint. Since the block has already taken place, you could either remove it completely or reduce it, in order to correct this CoI. Arcayne 21:09, 4 April 2007 (UTC)

Please do not make ill-considered accusations. If you look at my edit history, you will not find a single POV, or nationalist edit. To accuse me of conspiring with other editors through email to "harass" The Behnam is unacceptable. Do you have proof for any of your accusations? I wish that you would AGF, and not snipe my on various talk pages with accusations.--Agha Nader 04:37, 5 April 2007 (UTC)Agha Nader

Er, what "various pages" are you referring to, Nader? And why are you following my edits? I believe reasonable people would consider that stalking. Arcayne 04:47, 5 April 2007 (UTC)

Your talk page, Khorshid's talk page, and Behnam's talk page. You once accused my of stalking your page then you were admonished by The Behnam. Please review the Misplaced Pages policies on stalking. Looking at a discussion about a review of a block of a user that I reported, is definitely not stalking. Do you think you can make these sort of ill-considered accusations on various talk pages without me noticing.--Agha Nader 04:55, 5 April 2007 (UTC)Agha Nader

I guess I am a little confused. How is it that Benham's, Khorshid's, Dmcdevit's and my Talk page are all on your watchlist?? As well, I keep the AN/3RR board on my watchlist, which I am pretty sure isn't against the rules, either, any more than requesting a blocking admin review the evidence. All of the people I named seem to be extraordinarily well-connected to one another. However, if it's this single accusation that bothers you, I will withdraw it unless or until you prove me correct.

While I cannot expect you to remove my talk page from your watchlist, I want you to know that I consider it pretty odd. It isn't like we edit a lot of the same pages. Whatever. This convo is taking up another user's Talk page, when you could be addressing me on mine or on yours. Let's leave the guy alone, shall we? Arcayne 05:07, 5 April 2007 (UTC)

Who said they are on my watch list? I only responded to the personal attacks you made. Do you think you can make personal attacks on your talk page without people seeing them? I referring when you called your fellow editors "Petulant, vengeful children" on your talk page. Please refrain from making personal attacks on all Misplaced Pages space. Agha Nader 11:32, 5 April 2007 (UTC)Agha Nader

As I said before, you can address these issues on my talk page, so long as you remain polite. That you are posting it here simply suggests that you are cheaply trying to complain to this user. As for the comment, I have already clearly answered you there; the comment was not directed at you, and I am quite certain that your time would be far better spendt not stalking my user history or talk pages. After this post, you can write all you want - I am not going to take up another inch of this user's talk page. Arcayne 11:43, 5 April 2007 (UTC)

Please AGF. The reason I am commenting here is that you attacked me here. At this point I hope Dmcdevit would comment on what appears to me to be personal attacks you made here. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Agha Nader (talk • contribs) 19:08, 5 April 2007 (UTC).

Re. Azerbaijan (Iran) and 72.18.138.210

I made a bad call there. Another admin who is involved with the article contacted me and I reduced the block to three hours last night. However, you're right and I should not have blocked them in haste as I did. I will immediately apologise to that editor. I'm only a 2-week newb admin but I should have known better and slipped up on this one. AIV was kinda busy last night! - Alison 16:52, 4 April 2007 (UTC)

Zero revert rule?

After my recent block I realize that your edict at Azerbaijan (Iran) is essentially a zero revert rule. I don't know if such a rule has legitimacy on WP as an alternative to protection but I ask that you implement protection instead. If people want to add something they can just use the formal request template on the talk page. On the other hand, 0RR allows things to be added but never removed, and may encourage sockpuppetry. Full protection seems to be a better, WP-endorsed mechanism for freezing edit wars, so I ask you do please use full protection there instead of 0RR. Thank you. The Behnam 10:16, 5 April 2007 (UTC)

Adolfo Holley

On 6 April, 2007, Did you know? was updated with a fact from the article Adolfo Holley, which you created or substantially expanded. If you know of another interesting fact from a recently created article, then please suggest it on the "Did you know?" talk page.

--howcheng {chat} 06:08, 6 April 2007 (UTC)

Mackensen RfB

Hi,

Response now available there. If you'd prefer to talk the discussion to any particular talk page, that's fine with me. Best wishes, Xoloz 00:04, 7 April 2007 (UTC)

Oguz1

This kind of looks like he is evading his ban, and the revert by the IP are the same, Artaxiad 09:01, 7 April 2007 (UTC)

Mauco

According to the block log, he is blocked for two months for using suckpuppets. See link. --Thus Spake Anittas 19:43, 8 April 2007 (UTC)

Yes...? I was the one that blocked him. Dmcdevit·t 19:45, 8 April 2007 (UTC)

Okay, then you should know; so why remove the notice? --Thus Spake Anittas 20:00, 8 April 2007 (UTC)

We don't blank people's user pages because they have been temporarily blocked. Dmcdevit·t 21:59, 8 April 2007 (UTC)

I'm not sure we're talking about the same thing. The page was not blanked. You just removed the notice where it said that he was blocked because of using suckpuppets. Have a look at the history. --Thus Spake Anittas 22:02, 8 April 2007 (UTC)

Ah! My mistake. I somehow misread the diff and thought that the userpage had been replaced with the template. All I meant to do was retore the userpage (due to my misundersanding), not remove any template. Ignore me. :-) Dmcdevit·t 22:09, 8 April 2007 (UTC)

Hehe, well, I don't mind either way. I just found it strange, that's all. :p --Thus Spake Anittas 22:22, 8 April 2007 (UTC)

http://en.wikipedia.org/search/?title=Misplaced Pages:Requests_for_checkuser&oldid=87046132#William_Mauco

Person Needing a Time-Out

This anon user seems to be having some difficulty working with others (1, 2 and is often uncivil (1). The user has a short but unhappy history within the WP community. Usually, one can find at least one or two positive edits that a user has made. Unfortunately (and surprisingly), this user has none. What might we be able to offer the editing community in the way of protection from this user? - Arcayne () 14:21, 9 April 2007 (UTC)

Sockpuppet case

Can you checkthis case out? This is a really big sock case. Kingjeff 04:20, 10 April 2007 (UTC)

Are you sure that you made an accurate assesment of the case? Can you please recheck them? Kingjeff 20:47, 10 April 2007 (UTC)

If you look here and here, then you'll see evidence of an evasion of a ban. Here is a giveaway for IP Address 81.211.198.6. Kingjeff 21:57, 10 April 2007 (UTC)

The technical evidence doesn't support a connection. Of course, CheckUser isn't a magic wiki pixie dust, and adept users can evade detection, but you'll need an admin to make a judgment call on the matter if that is the case. Dmcdevit·t 00:25, 13 April 2007 (UTC)

Misplaced Pages:Requests for checkuser/Case/Arthur Ellis

Just to be clear, I assume that TropicNord (talk · contribs) is not a confirmed Arthur Ellis Sock? I just want to verify before I fulfill the requested removal of tags from his/her userspace. Thanks!--Isotope23 16:02, 10 April 2007 (UTC)

That's how I read it. Thatcher131 16:06, 10 April 2007 (UTC)

Yes, that's what I meant. Dmcdevit·t 19:50, 10 April 2007 (UTC)

Help with sockpupettry

Hi Dmcdevit, I need your help. REDVERS, one of the Administrators that is working with the Fellowship of Friends page, left me the following message:

Hi, Mario. On the talk page of Fellowship of Friends, I offered Misplaced Pages's best way for how to resolve these disputes (basically WP:RS); sadly, this was basically ignored and very obvious sockpuppetry was resorted to instead, by people who held the high ground in the dispute.

I wrote to REDVERS but he didn't reply to me. Do you know how can I find out who the sock pupeteers are based on this and this? Thanks a lot! Mario Fantoni 18:12, 10 April 2007 (UTC)

Please read WP:SOCK and tell how any of these accounts are in violation of the specific prohibited uses of sockpuppets, and I'll check them out. And if they are, please provide a possible culprit, if you can, so I can compare the two. Dmcdevit·t 20:11, 10 April 2007 (UTC)

Hi. Did you check 62.31.146.25 (talk · tag · contribs · filter log · WHOIS · RBLs · proxy check · block user · block log · cross-wiki contribs · CheckUser (log)) against Xmas1973 (talk · tag · contribs · deleted contribs · logs · filter log · block user · block log · CA · CheckUser(log) · investigate · cuwiki) and John Smith's (talk · tag · contribs · deleted contribs · logs · filter log · block user · block log · CA · CheckUser(log) · investigate · cuwiki)? The IP shows as in the UK, which I know John Smith is from. If they are connected this would be a 3RR vio. Thanks.Giovanni33 04:48, 12 April 2007 (UTC)

Oh yeah - two users from the same country. What a coincidence.

Giovanni, I suggest you see a psychiatrist to deal with your paranoia. John Smith's 10:39, 12 April 2007 (UTC)

Watch it. We won't tolerate attacks or incivility. Giovanni isn't paranoid, if the IP is reverting to your version and is the same country then it's reasonable to think it might be a sockpuppet and get it checked out. The fact that you're getting incivil kind of supports the allegation. How about rather than requesting it all from Dmcdevit, go to WP:RFCU and file the appropriate reports. --Deskana (fry that thing!) 13:01, 12 April 2007 (UTC)

I do have a question. Dmcdevit, did you check where there is any relation between the anon IP 209.160.65.68 and User:VietFire? John Smith's 15:18, 12 April 2007 (UTC)

Many thanks

Many thanks for being the voice of reason with your comments on Zeq's talk page. I reiterate that I am not, as he claims, involved in any content dispute with him, and in fact, am trying to spare newer admins what I and others have gone through; to ensure that all the work that went into the arbitration case was not for naught. Also, I am sorry about the slight unpleasentness we've had in the past over this. Regards, El_C 07:18, 12 April 2007 (UTC)

Oh, I didn't recall that was over something related to Zeq. See WP:AN/I for lengthier comments by me. Also, I have no grudge either, no need to worry about the past. :-) Dmcdevit·t 07:26, 12 April 2007 (UTC)

Will do. Goodstuff, I didn't think so. Thanks again. :) El_C 08:16, 12 April 2007 (UTC)

Jaakko Sivonen

User is complaining so I took the liberty of starting a thread here to endorse your block (which was past due, IMHO). --bainer (talk) 14:24, 12 April 2007 (UTC)

Documentation of Checkuser reply templates

Hi, I came across Misplaced Pages:Requests for checkuser/Case/Matthead where a user wonders what does  Possible mean. I must admit I am a bit lost myself on the different templates you CU use to answer the cases. I started a discussion some time ago on the clerk noticeboard on the meaning of all these. What do you think of expanding the Indicator page to emphasize a bit more the answers? -- lucasbfr 15:50, 12 April 2007 (UTC)

Azerbaijani

Hi. Please check recent contribs of User:Azerbaijani. He is waging a slow revert war. Just today he reverted 3 pages. See: Here he reverted the page: To this version: And this edit is a partial revert, as he deleted the following line under a guise of adding info: However, official reports from international organizations, such as the leading human rights organization in the European Community, the Council of Europe, paint a favorable picture.

Entitlement to 1 revert per week does not mean that he should go around and revert the pages once a week, he makes no attempt to reach a compromise with other editors or try a dispute resolution. Grandmaster 20:00, 12 April 2007 (UTC)

First of all, I am entitled to one revert per week per article, Grandmaster cannot dictate to me in which ways I choose to use my reverts, because I certainly do not go around talking about Grandmaster to admins for every little thing he does or every revert he makes. He is trying to continue to the character assassination that Atabek and AdilBaguirov started. Note that Adil Baguirov has already come back several times with IP's and even created a new account, which was banned, just so he could continue edit warring and attacked several articles. Furthermore, the COE quote on the Talysh Mughan Autonomous Republic was selective, Grandmaster and Adil picked the only part of the report which praised Azerbaijan, and left out all of the criticism which are talked about in the same source! Since it was selective, I removed it, yet because of Grandmaster's insistence, I expanded it to include the rest of the report. Furthermore, the source is from the Council of Europe, so I merely changed However, official reports from international organizations, such as the leading human rights organization in the European Community (of which the underlined portion is POV and not sourced) to According to the Council of Europe.

Secondly, since Grandmaster is talking of compromises, why did he revert my first edit instead of talking about it on the talk page? I had left a comment on the talk page, but nope, Grandmaster wouldnt discuss it, he simply reverted me and left another comment, so this in itself contradicts Grandmaster, as he is saying that I am the one not wanting to compromise! He assumes that he doesnt have to compromise, but that I do.

Furthermore, my edits speak for themselves. I have compromised on many many articles, and I myself have asked third party users to comment on several articles.

The character assassinations have just started again, and soon I'm sure Atabek will also be here to make a few comments against me.Azerbaijani 21:07, 12 April 2007 (UTC)

Sometimes I feel like I should post a note at the top of this page to the effect of "This is my personal talk page, not a noticeboard". I'm not the only administrator in the world, and this conflict has drained enough of my time already. Could you please take this to the community at a wider noticeboard? Dmcdevit·t 00:23, 13 April 2007 (UTC)

Misplaced Pages:Requests for checkuser/Case/Armenia-Azerbaijan

Hi, I was wondering if you would like to look into this case. Artaxiad seems to be still editing: . He says he wont stop. -- Cat 11:45, 13 April 2007 (UTC)

Misplaced Pages:Requests for checkuser/Case/Arthur Ellis

Thank you for the very prompt and efficient reply to the request. TropicNord

Zero

Arbcom rulings are prescriptive, though, which is what we're talking about, and which isn't a small point. Just so you know, the problem Zero is getting at is the problem you have any time one person writes and interprets the same text. Let's say you wrote the ruling poorly; is that something you're going to be as ready to admit as a third party? Beyond that, are you going to be as perceptive to ambiguities in your text? I don't know that it's anything to inform arbcom about, but I do think it's something for you to consider.

My point here, in any case, is simply that a misreading of an ambiguously worded arbcom ruling isn't the time to resort to harsh sanctions against a guy who has been contributing extremely productively here for some three years. Just a thought. Mackan79 06:55, 15 April 2007 (UTC)

WP:AN#Disclosing real IP – something a checkuser should not do

Just to inform you, not long ago on the Admins noticeboard, a pretty serious allegation was made against you regarding possible abuse of your Checkuser privileges. Whether you reply or not is up to you, but I'm sure you would want to provide your point of view. Just passing on the message. Harryboyles 13:02, 15 April 2007 (UTC)

Transnistria

Can you protect the page? 3RR against user Alaexis (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · nuke contribs · logs · filter log · block user · block log) He was blocked before 2 days ago for 3RR.--M-renewal 13:58, 15 April 2007 (UTC)

Hi, Dmcdevit. I saw you were already anounced about the report I made against you. If you don't want to comment publicly this report I would be interested to know in private your opinion, through e-mail. Regarding the edit-war actually going in Transnistria article, I think is staged to show that even without User:William Mauco there are edit wars on this article. In 7 April, at "Romanian Wikipedians notice board" where I asked advice about Mauco's case, somebody point at a vandalism made at Vladimir Socor article by the newbie User:M-renewal, suggesting that M-renewal could be a sock of Mauco . I didn't took this seriously as Mauco was not a simple vandal, as M-renewal appears, but considering latest developments I believe this would worth a check - for you is easy to do.--MariusM 16:05, 15 April 2007 (UTC)

Block review

An uninvolved user has posted to WP:AN requesting a review of your 48-hour block of User:The Benham. I see some mitigating circumstances, while two other admins (one on AN and one on the user's talkpage) have agreed with the block. Your input at AN is requested. Regards, Newyorkbrad 23:04, 15 April 2007 (UTC)

Your block of User:The Behnam

This block is being discussed on WP:AN#Request Admin Second Opinion on Unblock Request for User:The Behnam. At least two editors have supported an unblock. Your comments would be welcome. DES 23:05, 15 April 2007 (UTC)

ArbCom

A case you commented has been filed an ArbCom request by me, on Misplaced Pages:Requests for Arbitration#Transnistria, please go take a look, thank you! Wooyi 02:19, 16 April 2007 (UTC)

Edit warring

It looks like you have been engaging in edit warring at Iranian women. Please be aware that User:The Behnam has just been blocked for this, and the same will happen to you if it continues. You need to read WP:DR and follow the non-confrontational processes outlined there for resolvin the conflict. Thanks. Dmcdevit·t 07:26, 14 April 2007 (UTC)

Sure. Thanks for the guidance. In the meanwhile, I would be grateful if you kindly point me to the right direction. There is an editor (FullStop), who due to his religious intolerance and dogma is constantly RV my edits in number of pages. HE has taken this to a personal level, to the point of accusations; What can I do about him? Many thanks in advance for your co-operation? ← ← Parthian Shot (Talk) 09:53, 16 April 2007 (UTC)

You might want to try mediation (WP:MEDCOM or WP:MEDCAB) and ask for outside opinions (WP:3O and WP:RFC) to get more eyes on the conflict. There is more advice in the essay at WP:DR. Dmcdevit·t 09:58, 16 April 2007 (UTC)

Many thanks. ← ← Parthian Shot (Talk) 10:02, 16 April 2007 (UTC)

Hey look! ParthianShot tried DR right with his next edit ! The Behnam 14:26, 16 April 2007 (UTC)

Dmcdevit, would you have approached this differently had you known that ParthianShot was formerly Surena (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · logs · filter log · block user · block log), twice blocked for edit warring and a checkuser-proven sockpuppeteer? BTW, his behavior continues to be a problem, I will look into it tonight. Thatcher131 22:53, 16 April 2007 (UTC)

Thatcher, please note that there's an ANI thread on this (in which Dmcdevit noted the same observation). Newyorkbrad 23:00, 16 April 2007 (UTC)

Correct. I might have blocked both instead at teh time, but by the time Behnam emailed me and I realized ParthianShot was experienced, it had already been one or two days since the edit war, and he didn't continue, so I noted it on ANI and took no action. Of course, if he's reverting elsewhere now, it might be a different situation. Dmcdevit·t 23:20, 16 April 2007 (UTC)

Edit warring and edit warriors

That was a refreshing read. Btw, Slrubenstein introduced me to a recent essay of his today which you may be interested to review. Regards, El_C 10:20, 16 April 2007 (UTC)

Question on the JB196 RfCU

I see a lot of the accounts listed were not blocked (the later ones), were they unrelated, or was just burntsauce unrelated? SirFozzie 19:53, 16 April 2007 (UTC)

Unblock request

User:209.217.67.146 is requesting unblock. I have contacted you, as in guideance with our procedures. Part Deux 21:02, 16 April 2007 (UTC)

This range block is needed to deal with a persistent banned user. However, it is only an anon. only block, which means the person just ahs to log in to edit. If they don't have an account, either the person behind it can find another internet connection (library, school, etc.) to create an account, or can email an admin with the request, and they can fulfill it following the instructions at Misplaced Pages:Request an account/Administrators. Dmcdevit·t 21:27, 16 April 2007 (UTC)

Thank you, will notify. Part Deux 21:32, 16 April 2007 (UTC)

RE: Ombudsman Commission

Hi, Thankyou for offering to assist in the investigation. I shall be in touch shortly to discuss any issues. Feel free to provide an email address to cartmanau-at-gmail.com if you wish it to remain private - Cartman02au 07:42, 17 April 2007 (UTC)

You can email me through the "Email this user" link, or, in any case, you already have my email from my comments at checkuser-l. Thanks. Dmcdevit·t 08:42, 17 April 2007 (UTC)

Check this out...Buffadren is MaGioZal...

Buffadren (talk · tag · contribs · deleted contribs · logs · filter log · block user · block log · CA · CheckUser(log) · investigate · cuwiki)

MaGioZal (talk · tag · contribs · deleted contribs · logs · filter log · block user · block log · CA · CheckUser(log) · investigate · cuwiki)

MarkStreet (talk · tag · contribs · deleted contribs · logs · filter log · block user · block log · CA · CheckUser(log) · investigate · cuwiki)

William Mauco (talk · tag · contribs · deleted contribs · logs · filter log · block user · block log · CA · CheckUser(log) · investigate · cuwiki)

Misplaced Pages:Requests for arbitration/Zeq-Zero0000

Hello,

An Arbitration case involving you has been opened: Misplaced Pages:Requests for arbitration/Zeq-Zero0000. Please add any evidence you may wish the arbitrators to consider to the evidence sub-page, Misplaced Pages:Requests for arbitration/Zeq-Zero0000/Evidence. You may also contribute to the case on the workshop sub-page, Misplaced Pages:Requests for arbitration/Zeq-Zero0000/Workshop.

On behalf of the Arbitration Committee, David Mestel 19:36, 17 April 2007 (UTC)

Would you believe me ?

If I tell you that I want to see a better encyclopedia ?

I know you think I am hopeless, and quite honestly I can see why.

However, most articles from which I was banned (even for a year) have all had continued edit-war without me.

I did not receive 8 blocks for editwars. Some of my blocks were on nonsense like I left a message on few people talk page asking them to participate in an admin vote. That was enough for a young admin to block me (twice - once more fro asking to be unblocked) . That admin has later given up his adminship on the ground that he realize he is not mature enough (he is only a kid)

Anyhow, Misplaced Pages is missing amechanism to ensure NPOV and lack of edit wars on issues such as the ME articles. People like my self, Zero and Ian could never agree without a 3rd party activly mediating. Just banning me from articles I had conflict with Zero Palestinian Exodus and the 1948 war has done nothing Zero continued the POV pushing and edit war with others. This is endless and this is not just a personal issue but also a process issue.

as you can see I don't have problem to admit my guilt (in places where I am guilty) but I do want to move beyond guilt to find a process that can work. Just blocking the Pro_israel side of the POV and doing nothing to the anti-israel side of the POV is not a way to get to NPOV.

Best regards, Zeq 19:49, 17 April 2007 (UTC)

Of course I believe you. I have infinite confidence in the good faith of editors, despite shortcomings; Misplaced Pages would never have turned out to be such a success if cynicism were right. However, sometimes good faith is not the same as good behavior; one of the best ways to work to improve the encyclopedia rather than to promote your POV is to avoid contentious topics that excite you enough to cause such hostile editing tactics. I'm afraid though (see my comment about not being cynical; Misplaced Pages has good articles on most contentious subjects because of ideologically dissimilar editors working together cordially) that I can't accept the claim that Middle Eastern articles, or any set of articles, invariably lead to conflict between opposing editors, by the nature of the topic. To say that is to ignore the body of good articles on contentious subjects at Misplaced Pages. Inability to communicate or to work together or to follow content policies—conduct issues—are the problem here, and need to be dealt with if you cannot moderate your behavior in the face of a concerted effort by the community to get you to do so. Dmcdevit·t 03:30, 19 April 2007 (UTC)

I accept what you say at least in large part. I wrote it after I read this: WP:User:Dmcdevit/Thoughts - in which you focus on the personality of the editor. My point was that it is not always just the personality of the editor but the subject matter as well.

I tend to agree with you regardless of what is the origin of the problem the solution is in what you wrote here:

"one of the best ways to work to improve the encyclopedia rather than to promote your POV is to avoid contentious topics that excite you enough to cause such hostile editing tactics."

Best, Zeq 10:15, 21 April 2007 (UTC)

ParthianShot part trey

MedianLady (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · logs · filter log · block user · block log). Possible sock puppet and/or sock puppet of another user looking to stir up trouble . May be a backslashing open proxy. Thatcher131 20:27, 17 April 2007 (UTC)

Open proxy is right. Actually it's the same person as whoever this IP at Denial of the Armenian Genocide was. (This is why I don't block open proxies anon.-only; anyone who knows how to use an ope proxy knows how to use another internet connection or another open proxy to create an account to get around the block.) Dmcdevit·t 21:03, 17 April 2007 (UTC)

So why was ParthianShot blocked? was it her? I requested a CheckUser on her regarding another I.P and it was unrelated so is this someone trying to frame her? Ashkani 18:58, 18 April 2007 (UTC)

The problem is that the IP and MedianLady were obviously carrying ParthianShot's disputes for him, so it seems that he was evading his block through sock or meatpuppetry. As for that IP he could have just gone over to a library. Considering the subsequent creation of MedianLady I think there is more reason to believe that this is ParthianShot himself and not some conspirators. The Behnam 19:34, 18 April 2007 (UTC)

Okay than how do we know he is telling the truth? CheckUser has confirmed I.P is unrelated I'm sure they know if its a library. Ashkani 19:37, 18 April 2007 (UTC)

I'm not sure how the specifics work for that. I just pointed out the IPs work to Aksi_great since it was obviously suspicious and appeared to be a block dodge. It was up to his judgment as I didn't expect PS to be foolish enough to operate under a related IP. The Behnam 19:39, 18 April 2007 (UTC)

Okay? Ashkani 19:44, 18 April 2007 (UTC)

ParthianShot was blocked for edit warring. The block was extended for sockpuppetry, then dropped back to its original length after the checkuser came back unrelated. Exactly why jpgordon said the two were unrelated is privileged; another checkuser can check his work but the details will not be released publically. I originally blocked MedianLady as a suspected sock puppet; since she edits from open proxies that can't be confirmed or refuted. But she was pushing allegations that ParthianShot's block was a racially motivated conspiracy, which we do not need here, so she is still indefinitely blocked. ParthianShot's comments against user:Fullstop on his talk page sound very similar to MedianLady's accusation that Fullstop secretly got Ashki to block her for edit warring, so my suspicions are still raised. I'd also like to know how brand new user Ashkani got involved in this; I certainly wasn't even aware of blocking policy and sockpuppets on my second day. However, even if Ashkani is someone's sockpuppet, that's tolerable as long as he isn't a sockpuppet of a blocked or banned user. Thatcher131 19:55, 18 April 2007 (UTC)

It should be noted that Ashkani also gives credence to the nationality conspiracy "there also is skirmish between nationalities not being fair because of the admins nationality" The Behnam 23:18, 18 April 2007 (UTC)

I was trying to be neutral giving the other users claims. Ashkani 23:20, 18 April 2007 (UTC)

From the way you put it it sounded as if you believed that there was really a nationality issue. I apologize if I erred in that judgment. However, of new concern is that PS is now treating Fullstop and I as one (Fullstop/The Behnam), is insulting admins ("have gone mad"), and calling Fullstop and I puppets of the Islamic regime ("ploy by Islamic regime’s puppets"). Which, by the way, is very similar to the ideas of that IP on the talk page for The Lion and Sun. Hmm... The Behnam 23:27, 18 April 2007 (UTC)

Erm. So anyway. This is my talk page, not a noticeboard (I know they look alike sometimes). If this discussion needs to take place, please do it in a more appropriate place. (Shoo!) Dmcdevit·t 03:37, 19 April 2007 (UTC)

You really should put a notice, archive your page than do it since so many people do things like this. Put a link to the notice board. Ashkani 23:26, 19 April 2007 (UTC)

Would you mind reviewing this users (Ashkani) contribution as per your WP:RFCU/C/Artaxiad findings? He seems to be obsest on Turkish related topics just like Artaxiad. -- Cat 00:02, 23 April 2007 (UTC)

RE: Misplaced Pages:Requests for checkuser/Case/Pens withdrawn

Hello, I found that you have declined the cases on Misplaced Pages:Requests for checkuser/Case/Pens withdrawn. My request is to run a checkuser for the my userid and check whether these users are sockpuppet of mine. It is clear from my evidences that these users are not in my IP domain and there is no reason to put them under my user id. Ptu them int appropriate places. Not under my user id. As the request says the checkuser was for the "Pens withdrawn" and all the users are put under my id!! --- Sundaram7 07:32, 18 April 2007 (UTC)

It is not our policy to have self-requested CheckUsers. Please see the directions at WP:RFCU. Dmcdevit·t 03:33, 19 April 2007 (UTC)

Checkuser Close

It wasnt so much as a sockpuppet abuse, this user used his IP address AND his account to post on it. If I nominated him in the wrong place, please direct me to the correct location. I remember reading somewhere that this could be done, so I gave it a shot. Thanks DietLimeCola 07:52, 18 April 2007 (UTC)

Sockpuppetry is not prohibited. Abusive sockpuppetry is. Please read WP:SOCK and only file another request if there is a specific abuse according to the criteria there. Dmcdevit·t 03:34, 19 April 2007 (UTC)

Elsanaturk

This user is practically asking for a ban. See here: Click on the links there to see his personal attacks. He is making it very clear that he knows that he is personally attacking me and that he doesnt care whether he has to face the consequences. This is coming from a user that just got out of an Arbcom. I'm sick of his personal attacks, and I think he should be banned for a period of one year for these attacks (thats my opinion, I'll leave the actual decision to you guys).Azerbaijani 03:50, 19 April 2007 (UTC)

Help!

I don't know why this revert was made without any discussion. He also reverted all the changes I made yesterday, back to back within a minute so either he's a speed reader or he did not read any comments or content.

1. 04:42, 20 April 2007 (hist) (diff) m Armenians in Turkey (Reverted edits by Oguz1 (talk) to last version by SmackBot)
2. 04:42, 20 April 2007 (hist) (diff) Dissolution of the Ottoman Empire (rv per source cited) (top)
3. 04:41, 20 April 2007 (hist) (diff) Van Province (rv) (top)

I made a direct appeal on his talk page , on the article talk page, and on my edit summary on why the change was made ] , alas.

He claims Primary Sources are completely out per WP:NOR. But I provided three sources which is acceptable per WP:NOR, and WP says they're even encouraged.

What did I do wrong that warranted a revert from an admin. And he won't discuss anything with me, nor does he comment the edit summary.

I am asking you for help because, if I ask anyone else for anything, I get blocked.

So, please, I really need to know what I am doing wrong here. Thanks. --Oguz1 14:47, 20 April 2007 (UTC)

Misplaced Pages:Requests for arbitration/Transnistria

Hello,

An Arbitration case in which you commented has been opened: Misplaced Pages:Requests for arbitration/Transnistria. Please add any evidence you may wish the arbitrators to consider to the evidence sub-page, Misplaced Pages:Requests for arbitration/Transnistria/Evidence. You may also contribute to the case on the workshop sub-page, Misplaced Pages:Requests for arbitration/Transnistria/Workshop.

On behalf of the Arbitration Committee, David Mestel 22:09, 20 April 2007 (UTC)

Dazed

• Dmcdevit there accusing me of sock puppets again () on the administrators noticeboard I am not using socks. There superficially saying I am a troll and saying offensive material, Please check 86.137.146.147 so it can be cleared I have no idea who 86.137.146.147 is neither have I edited the pages that 86.137.146.147 has.

• Minutes later 86.137.146.147 appears trying to frame me I am not from the United Kingdom I had to leave for a family emergency and now there saying nonsense, there going to use that against me now everywhere that I am a sock. I guess this gives Cool Cat the right to harass me of a sock and stalk my contributions I am helpless right now. Ashkani 23:12, 20 April 2007 (UTC)

Note: A editing war has started been started by Makalp, he hasn't discussed any of his reverts I have left the user a note on his talk the user who added the material for third party sources and NPOV. how long may I take this users harassment? Ashkani 23:12, 20 April 2007 (UTC)

I still don't appreciate users harassments theres other interwikis. Ashkani 03:44, 22 April 2007 (UTC)

Denial of AG

Thanks for the comment on the talk page. I think we can reach a relative stability there with my last edit. I think it also reflects the bbc reference well. deniz_C 00:32, 21 April 2007 (UTC)

I disagree with you this time, anyway I am quite busy, I should possibly take a break. deniz_C 21:51, 22 April 2007 (UTC)

Unblock request

Your input might be helpful on an unblock request at User_talk:Megaversal. Regards, Newyorkbrad 20:58, 21 April 2007 (UTC)

OttomanReference

User:Dmcdevit says: You have multiple reverts at this article since its unprotection with no edits to the talk page at all. You were just blocked for edit warring there. Please stop continuing the current edit war, and intead work the problem out by discussing it. If the edit war continues it may be dealt with by blocks. Dmcdevit·t 20:55, 21 April 2007 (UTC)

These are six edits and summaries of all the editions (more than three months) by me from 12 "January" 2007. My summaries:

• 6- 20 April 2007 (rv -2 (introduction has already been discussed) please obey the general rules of editing see: the discussion Talk:Denial_of_the_Armenian_Genocide#Revised_opening_line)
• 5- 20 April 2007 (rv -please use the discussion page for changes.)

--I 'm blocked here by an ADMIN for the 3RR of because of the reversion of ArmenianJoe's added "added text"; which I did not responded to ArmenianJoe with the third revert of his deletion of the section.

• 4- 16 April 2007 (rv - vandalism deletion of block of text with no apperant reason.)
• 3- 15 April 2007 (All the items are cited; please be more specific; perform your editions in small increments and give their reasons. Thanks)

User Armenian joe reverted the added text

• 2- 15 April 2007 (Let me divide the introduction into two pars. One that ""agrees"" other that ""disagrees"". This will minimize the edit wars....)
• 1- 15 April 2007 (citations from "The Middle East: A History) added a text

Regarding "no edits to the talk page," I'm the one who asked the use of talk page and inspide of the other users gave an extensive reasoning, which the respond never solidified. I would appreciate if, you follow this link and see the response and how the introduiction section should be shaped.

• 1-

Could you please be more specific; especially why do you feel the need to threaten me?? It is hard to understand the reasons of me being targatted.?? Thanks. --OttomanReference 00:00, 22 April 2007 (UTC)

Also regarding the blockage: Besides the fact that I have never been in the 3RR, there has never been a warning by Admin user:Cbrown1023. This can be easily recognized if you follow my talk page. The Admin User:Thatcher131 tried to war me about the 3thr revert but I was blocked by then.

• 3 Admin User:Thatcher131 reverts his message, which s/he recognizes that eventhough there is no warning the action already performed by user:Cbrown1023
• 2 message that I'm warned
• 1 message that I'm blocked (there is no link that that I can produce for the warning)

While asking me to discuss the content of the introduction section; and giving me a warning not to edit the page; The introduction section has been removed not just a single sentence but two paragraphs without any discussion at the talk page . I just do not get your position. Thanks. --OttomanReference 02:37, 22 April 2007 (UTC)

After my unprotection of the article on April 20, you made 2 further reverts, and gave no rationales for either of them on the talk page, you last edit there being April 18. The point is this: you were just blocked for edit warring on that article; please stop with the repeated reverts and develop talk page consensus for contentious changes. Dmcdevit·t 05:08, 22 April 2007 (UTC)

Thanks for your response. That does not really clear the feeling that I'm victimized. What about your position that changes at introduction should be discussed at the talk page and the latest deletion/removal of the whole introduction section. I thought this behavior was the reason behind my blockage, but obviously there are different perceptions of it. As you did not act on deletion of the whole introduction, this form of edit should be normal. Currently this article has virtually no introduction and I guess this is a form of solution. No introduction, no problem. Have a nice Sunday. I have a workshop to attend. --OttomanReference 05:40, 22 April 2007 (UTC)

Well, first of all, your accusations of bias are patently absurd considering I blocked Aivazovsky before you pointed out that diff to me. But, he was blocked for edit warring, not for the content change he made. The point is, I don't have any stake in teh content dispute at all and it is not the reason I'm making the decisions I am. The problem is the behavior of teh edit warriors on either side. When you have a dispute, work it out according to dispute resolution procedure, not sterile edit warring. Dmcdevit·t 06:03, 22 April 2007 (UTC)

Pam55

Hi. I suspect that Pam55 (talk · contribs) is a sock account. Please check his contributions, he only turns up occasionally to revert Iran related articles. Grandmaster 10:39, 22 April 2007 (UTC)

Please use the WP:RFCU process. Dmcdevit·t 09:52, 23 April 2007 (UTC)

DYK

On April 23, 2007, Did you know? was updated with a fact from the article José de Garro, which you created or substantially expanded. If you know of another interesting fact from a recently created article, then please suggest it on the "Did you know?" talk page.

Do I know you my dear sir? Blnguyen (bananabucket) 05:14, 23 April 2007 (UTC)

Congrats on the DYK! :) - Aksi_great (talk) 09:41, 23 April 2007 (UTC)

Thank you both! :-) Dmcdevit·t 09:53, 23 April 2007 (UTC)

Ararat arev

He's been back, on the Turkey and Armenia pages. Would it be possible for you to nail some more IPs and/or socks? (If you'd prefer I make the request on the main checkuser page, just troutslap me and I'll be happy to, just figured you were already familiar with the situation.) Seraphimblade 10:19, 23 April 2007 (UTC)

Requests for checkuser/Case/Silveriver

Hi, I have added another one that i forget to put before. Can you please check it for me. Thanks DXRAW 12:15, 23 April 2007 (UTC)

Thanks mate. DXRAW 09:13, 24 April 2007 (UTC)

Checkuser

Hello Dmcdevit, can you take a look here please? User_talk:Blnguyen#Any_ideas_about_what_to_do_with_this_article.2Feditor.3F. Thanks, Blnguyen (bananabucket) 23:44, 23 April 2007 (UTC)

Misplaced Pages:Misplaced Pages Signpost/2007-04-23/Pat Binns

Your article Misplaced Pages:Misplaced Pages Signpost/2007-04-23/Pat Binns contained the sentence: "As of publishing, the television segment was still illegally available through Pate’s YouTube channel." with a link to the material. Please read Misplaced Pages:Copyrights#Linking_to_copyrighted_works and note that linking to copyright infringements is prohibited on Misplaced Pages and may constitute a copyright infringement in itself. Thanks. Dmcdevit·t 08:24, 24 April 2007 (UTC)

If I simply said, but didn't link? I was using this to demonstrate a lack of integrity in Pate. -- Zanimum 16:47, 24 April 2007 (UTC)

That's probably fine (though I'm not an expert; your guess is as good as mine). Dmcdevit·t 20:21, 24 April 2007 (UTC)

Ahwaz and Nasser Pourpirar

I understand tha User:Ahwaz was unblocked under his promise not to edit war on Nasser Pourpirar. Indeed Ahwaz account has not touched the article ever since. On the other hand the history of the article shows a number of throw away accounts reverting it. Do you think they are Ahwaz's puppets? If, yes, he probably should be reblocked. Alex Bakharev 07:06, 25 April 2007 (UTC)

Having looked at the accounts, it's hard to say because of all the open proxies: Bizbilirdik = Alif Lam Meem, but both are on an open proxy, so it's a dead end. AbedHo is on an open proxy. Someone 1984 is on an open proxy. Atashparast is already confirmed as Khorshid. The one interesting result is that Discipleoftruth = Nazcas, and it's geopraphically in the same area as Ahwaz, but a different ISP. This could happen if someone just goes to their work or school and uses the computer there. The open proxies in general are fishy, but there's not much I can say from a techical standpoint about whether that is evidence enough. Dmcdevit·t 03:25, 26 April 2007 (UTC)

Thanks!Alex Bakharev 00:27, 27 April 2007 (UTC)

Misplaced Pages:Community sanction noticeboard#Diyarbakir

• Misplaced Pages:Requests_for_arbitration/Moby_Dick/Proposed_decision

Since you were an arbitrator on the case involving Moby Dick, I was wondering if you could provide some insight at User:Ben's comments at the Community sanction noticeboard using Moby Dick's edits as evidence (or something like evidence) -- Cat 17:34, 25 April 2007 (UTC)

Also see the relevant checkuser case Misplaced Pages:Requests for checkuser/Case/Diyarbakir -- Cat 16:38, 26 April 2007 (UTC)

Ararat arev redux

The user is back with several socks, all of which can be found here, here and here. Just a heads up. Anything that can be done? Cheers, – Riana 18:58, 25 April 2007 (UTC)

I have to be away from the computer now, but see my block log. I've been watching this since before your note. The problem is that normally he'd run out of sleeper accounts by now and semi-protection would work, but instead it looks like he has a bot to hijack old accounts with insecure passwords. The Earthlink range is completely blocked (it should be returned to anon-only if he goes away for a bit) and the big Level 3 and Pac-West ranges are blocked from account creation. His only recent accounts came when that block expired and he created more accounts, but it looks like he ran through them pretty quickly. Outside of that, we just have to keep blocking the old accounts until he goes away. Tell me if there are any more recently-created accounts. Dmcdevit·t 19:24, 25 April 2007 (UTC)

Figure they'll ever reconsider using a captcha for login, rather than just creation? At the very least, that would force this type of idiocy to get done by hand. Seraphimblade 19:32, 25 April 2007 (UTC)

Added a couple dozen here, but I have to duck out. Perhaps someone else can take up the slack? – Riana 19:37, 25 April 2007 (UTC)

Will do, I should be around a bit. CMummert's watching as well. Don't worry about going back too far though, the server doesn't keep logs very long. Seraphimblade 19:47, 25 April 2007 (UTC)

Haven't gone further than March 2007 yet. There's a lot I skipped over in April. – Riana 19:51, 25 April 2007 (UTC)

That should be very much far enough, I don't think they're ever kept more than a month. (Though Dmcdevit can troutslap me if I'm wrong on this one, and for holding a conversation on his page. :P ) Seraphimblade 19:59, 25 April 2007 (UTC)

What are the chances of me getting access to User:Kitty again? :( El_C 20:48, 1 May 2007 (UTC)

Have you tried talking to the blocking admin? Dmcdevit·t 22:21, 1 May 2007 (UTC)

Sadly, that idiot is not returning my calls! El_C 08:06, 2 May 2007 (UTC)

So the subject of the sentence "must have guessed my password" is omitted. I am still trying to figure out whether Ararat arev guessed Kitty's password (which was Kitty) and so you blocked; whether Kitty is the real Ararat arev and was blocked for guessing others' passwords; whether Kitty guessed your password (Kitty) and did something naughty so you blocked Kitty as punishment; whether Kitty guessed your password, and is still operating the El C account (you) now and blocked Kitty because of, um, difficulty typing with paws... Or what. I could try and see if I can get through to the blocking admin, though; maybe he'll reply to me. Actually, I think he's watching this page. Dmcdevit·t 08:41, 2 May 2007 (UTC)

Why spoil a good mystery? All, or most, of the above! Kitty 17:56, 2 May 2007 (UTC)

Checkuser autoblock

B.Wind is suffering from an autblock which appears to be connected to a Checkuser block you placed. I do not intend to undo the block, but as the blocking checkuser-admin, I would appreciate you taking a look. The user also states he/she has sent an email to the blocking admin (I'm assuming you). - auburnpilot talk 07:01, 26 April 2007 (UTC)

Yes, I just replied to his last email, but I'm off to bed now. This is related to the Ararat arev vandalism at Turkey-related articles, and I think it' too severe to unblock right now, as he's still active. Dmcdevit·t 07:17, 26 April 2007 (UTC)

User:Tajik block

You have blocked user:Tajik few weeks back and he is now using a new user name, which is user:Tajik-Professor. He is purposly using bad typing during his edits, at the same time, using a name tajik-"professor". both, tajik and tajik-professors, are involved in anti-pashtun (see talk:Pashtun people) and anti-Afghanistan.

• other possible sockpuppets or meatpuppets:
  • user:Beh-nam (involved in vandalising many articles)
  • user:Aryana310

Somebody needs to stop this user who is hooked on spreading false, misleading, and incomplete information online. Herdtrid 23:34, 26 April 2007 (UTC)

user:Beh-nam placed false welcoming tag on User talk:Tajik-Professor . In the green section, your contributions links to someone elses contributions by the user name "NisarKand" who is already banned from editing. Herdtrid 14:49, 27 April 2007 (UTC)

300

I've only made two reverts and an edit, on something which is a clear NPOV violation. Miskin 00:25, 27 April 2007 (UTC)

For example have a look at this edit which I didn't even bother with: . What about WP:NPOV? Does the opinion of a group of partisan editors count more than NPOV? Miskin 00:29, 27 April 2007 (UTC)

Two reverts is my limit. This article has been pov-pushed too much by partisan editors, who have btw established a status quo version by means of numerical superiority. It is ridiculous to seek DR for such a fundamental question. They claim that their pseudo-consensus is more credible than npov. Miskin 00:39, 27 April 2007 (UTC)

As well, I thank you for pointing out my, Miskin's and AlienTraveler's eidts. However, I couldn't help but notice how these were the only three folks you took it upon yourself to "warn." One might ask why you didn't bother notifying the other editors in the dispute. Of course, you might have not gotten around to doing it as of yet. As you know there is a major concern expressed by a number of other editors about the presence of a pro-nationalist group of editors. Your failure to properly notify the other editors in the dispute might very well be construed as bias. I won't take that step with you, although I have found at least one other admin working with this group. Arcayne () 00:59, 27 April 2007 (UTC)

Do not make ill-considered accusations. Accusing your opponents of being "a pro-nationalist group of editors" is in violation of WP:CIV.--Agha Nader 02:00, 27 April 2007 (UTC)

My accusations are never ill-considered, but thanks for making part of my point for me, Nader. However, I don't believe I know why you are here. I didn't refer to you by name, and I can assure you that I don't consider you an opponent. In point of fact, I hardly consider you at all. I believe you have been warned numerous times about stalking and plotting against other editors. You are excused, sir. Arcayne () 04:35, 27 April 2007 (UTC)

Richard Hell abusive blocks

Something evil has happened and I wonder if you could explain and follow up; it appears user "66" signed his last discussion post for Richard Hell entry as "Roosterer" and then proceeded to get you to block every single anon on that page as "blocked as abusive" EXCEPT for "66" (ie, he got "Roosterer" banned too) AND he got the version he wanted put up (CLEARLY showing beyond all doubt he won't engage in gd faith discussion) protected; there is no edit history for the reversion; Please follow up; I also think this behavior should have "66" banned; if that is not possible a SEVERE reprimand if such exists. It was highly abusive, dishonest and disturbing. AND he got his goal of his page version up so no edits would be done (See Talk page for STEEL for discussion of why his version is NOT to be the one up, and the purpose for the original protect). THis behavior is severe; every single anon on that page (multiple people over multiple years) were blocked by him, at his request using a false account set up ("Roosterer" - who refers to prior posts when there are none registered for Roosterer on that page). This appears obvious; please confirm why you did those blocks and reversion of protected page (and why no history is there to trace it). 4.236.15.182 18:14, 27 April 2007 (UTC)

I have no idea what you are talking about. I've never heard of Richard Hell before now, and never blocked any editors there, to my knowledge. Dmcdevit·t 21:24, 27 April 2007 (UTC)

The block went away and then came back the next day, and now is gone again; "this account or IP address has been blocked...by Dmcdevit...for persistent abuse; your IP address is 4.231.241.60" comes up; a search of your block log reveals many # blocks on 26 April, and when I clicked on many of the #'s the message refers to the same IP address even though the blocked # is listed on the log as a different # (eg, 22:21 26 April 4.231.0.0/16 (clicking on contributions, says "none"; clicking # gives above message; also 67.150.120.0/24 block, yet some other blocks you made 26 April show correct/matching IP address on block message). A search of that referenced # says "IP address not blocked" yet attempting to edit I got that same page, referencing you and saying my IP address is 4.2... All of the other IP's from RHell talk page other than 66. came up as blocked when I clicked them, but I guess there is some broad range blocking going on unrelated to the Hell site from what you say. I assume complaints by others lead to the fast unblocking or could it be a virus? Some glitch anyway. 4.236.12.42 19:03, 28 April 2007 (UTC)

I placed several range blocks then because of a persistent vandal. It looks like you share the same ISP as that vandal, Level 3, which is a dynamic IP range. The range (4.231.0.0/16) doesn't have contributions because it is not any single IP address. Any blocks caused by collateral damage were inadvertent, and not related to perceptions of abuse by editors at Richard Hell. This can be avoided in the future if you register for an account and log in when anonymous-only blocks are placed. Dmcdevit·t 21:32, 28 April 2007 (UTC)

Check on User: Kd lvr User:Kdkatpir2 User:WTAEchick

Does this ] mean we are okay? - was posted by User: Kd lvr

I would like to know how these three are not related. Seriously. It is pure sockpuppetry. - SVRTVDude 02:29, 30 April 2007 (UTC)

Please read what sockpuppetry is and how CheckUser works. Dmcdevit·t 07:43, 30 April 2007 (UTC)

I don't know if it means you are okay; it means you are likely to not be sockpuppets, though. Dmcdevit·t 07:43, 30 April 2007 (UTC)

Bahá'í Faith FAR

Bahá'í Faith has been nominated for a featured article review. Articles are typically reviewed for two weeks. Please leave your comments and help us to return the article to featured quality. If concerns are not addressed during the review period, articles are moved onto the Featured Article Removal Candidates list for a further period, where editors may declare "Keep" or "Remove" the article from featured status. The instructions for the review process are here. Reviewers' concerns are here. SandyGeorgia (Talk) 16:57, 30 April 2007 (UTC)

checkuser

Hi Dmc - can you please check up Paraqueet (talk · tag · contribs · deleted contribs · logs · filter log · block user · block log · CA · CheckUser(log) · investigate · cuwiki) and Herr=dab= (talk · tag · contribs · deleted contribs · logs · filter log · block user · block log · CA · CheckUser(log) · investigate · cuwiki) - these two ids were caught trolling on Misplaced Pages talk:Requests for arbitration/Hkelkar/Evidence by me and user:Newyorkbrad in a relatively short space of time. I am suspecting Kuntan (talk · tag · contribs · deleted contribs · logs · filter log · block user · block log · CA · CheckUser(log) · investigate · cuwiki) or Misplaced Pages:Requests for checkuser/Case/Hkelkar but it could be another involved party as well. Rama's arrow (just a sexy boy) 20:29, 1 May 2007 (UTC)

Yes, this is Kuntan. The following are all confirmed:

• Beejavapa (talk · contribs)
• Human aside (talk · contribs)
• Paraqueet (talk · contribs)
• Herr=dab= (talk · contribs)
• Rajamankkan (talk · contribs)

Dmcdevit·t 20:42, 1 May 2007 (UTC)

Note to the peanut gallery, all blocked. Thanks, Dmcdevit (now you don't have to hide from me on IRC tonight). Thatcher131 20:54, 1 May 2007 (UTC)

Misplaced Pages:Requests for checkuser/Case/Freedom skies

Since the checkuser results indicate likely sockpuppetry, what do I do next? JFD 04:16, 2 May 2007 (UTC)

Either an admin will take care of it soon, or take it to WP:AN for help if not. Dmcdevit·t 04:29, 2 May 2007 (UTC)

Thanks. JFD 05:51, 2 May 2007 (UTC)

FYI - let's just make sure the issue is crystal clear

Zeq

Use square brakcets for urls/diffs. (I did it for you) El_C 07:52, 2 May 2007 (UTC)

• This is a key evidence and I want to make sure you see it:

This has been discussed before. Zero was told not to ban Zeq 07:49, 2 May 2007 (UTC)

Is this really necessary? And why are you commenting in the Arbitrators field? El_C 07:52, 2 May 2007 (UTC)

*Ugh* Zeg, I'm irritated enough about Zero' assumption of your bad faith; I didn't realize you were doing the same of him. Please don't. Questioning judgment is fine and proper, but not good faith, after years of good service. I'm not sure why you say the issue is the ban and not the block; it's both, which are functinally the same act of poor judgment. Dmcdevit·t 07:58, 2 May 2007 (UTC)

devit,

You need to realize one very important issue about wkipedia which is especially true for people who come from non-english speaking places (like I do): 1. I do not graps fully what is the difference between "good faith" and "good jusdgment". 2. Any exchange in written english lacks the basic human comunication mechanisms of tone of voice, facial expression etc.. - as such the opportunity to misunderstand is high. So I am not sure what is exactly you are now further complainaing about me. Zero should have known not to ban me (he was told by Fred not to use ban as the first step if he has a conflict) you want to call it "bad judgment" this is fine by me. Zero have demonstrated all along that he does not take descision truly as a neutral party. He takes decision based on his clash of POV with me. call it as you like. Zeq 10:47, 2 May 2007 (UTC)

While I do not have a good grasp of what american english speakers mean in the word "judgment" I do think I can identify when someone doubt that someone else is acting in bad faith. Is this (the bottom part not the highlighted on top) one of those instances ? I am asking. this is a question. Zeq 11:00, 2 May 2007 (UTC)

Or maybe do you consider this Misplaced Pages:Requests_for_arbitration/Zeq-Zero0000/Workshop#NPOV_requires_both_views_to_be_represented to be a violation of AGF ? But what if the evidence support that this is modus operandy that Zero is using again and again ? He makes article POV by removing the other POV. I have showed this in the evidence. Zeq 11:20, 2 May 2007 (UTC)

here it is again: supreme intelegence able to turn everything to his prefered direction. That is how he has been also editing for years. Always he is right and the other side is wrong. Zeq 12:43, 2 May 2007 (UTC)

To question one's good faith is to question their intentions, to assume they are trying to harm the project, not help it, and not simply that any harm they may do was an attempt to help. To question one's good hudgment is to question solely their decision-making capabilities. Dmcdevit·t 19:22, 2 May 2007 (UTC)

That is good definition. I understand better. At least I know now that I am acting in good faith. It is beyond my ability to judge other people motives. I really can not tell what they are. I can only look at their results without knowing if it their motives or their judgment that got to those results. Zeq 12:10, 3 May 2007 (UTC)

IRC access

Hello DMC! Hope everything is going well for you. I am seeking access to the admin channels at IRC. You apparently have the keys. (Are they attached to a brick on a chain like at the Sunoco station?) Let me know how to proceed, if you would be so kind. Thanks in advance for your consideration. Best regards, as always, Hamster Sandwich 19:55, 2 May 2007 (UTC)

Edit Warning

Hi, I am reporting an editor who is engaged in edit-warring. HappyInGeneralhas done about 34 reverts on () page alone in the last two weeks. He and I were warned on May 1st. I have refrained from editing that page, but HappyInGeneral has continued edit warning.

In ignoring the warning and 3RR rule, HappyInGeneral has declared himself an edit warrior. If he is not punished for this behavior now, no one will care about Wiki rules any more.

The edit warning on that page is mostly about a provocative and contested image added by HappyInGeneral. Many editors have rejected placing this picture in the intro. In trying to reach a compromise with him I created a section call “Abuses against Falun Gong practitioners” and placed this picture there. But HappyInGeneral deleted this section and moved the picture back to the intro thus starting a round of revert war. --Samuel Luo 06:24, 3 May 2007 (UTC)

Samuel Luo, I am not connected to the dispute in question but happen to have this page on my watchlist, so you comment prompted me to respond. Picking an admin known as more eager to block then most others amounts to Forum shopping. Report technical violations of WP:3RR to WP:AN/3RR. Otherwise, if blocks are under 3RR but still qualify for a general disruption (which is admittedly also a possibility) post them at WP:ANI. Attendance of these boards is more representative to the general community stance on disruption than a single admin you pick selectively. --Irpen 07:21, 3 May 2007 (UTC)

Irpen, I appreciate your concern, but please don't impugn my judgment by implying that other admins are more appropriate than me to look at edit conflicts. I am not a forum, but an admin like any other, with the same standing as any other. You also seem to ahve assumed a bit much about Samuel Luo, considering he posted to 4 admins talk pages which (regardless of any problems that might pose) does not seem to me like "picking an admin known as more eager to block then most others". Having said that, it's past midnight here so I wasn't planning on having the time to give the matter Samuel was asking about the consideration it deserves tonight. Dmcdevit·t 07:30, 3 May 2007 (UTC)

Dmcdevit, I had to look up impugn but after doing so I assure you that my intent was not to impugn anything or anyone. I keep my opinion about the propriety of your activities out of that message as well as of this one. I post a simple statement of fact that the post to the board specifically designed for such kind of messages and attended by a wider spectrum of admins would result in an action (or lack of it) more likely to be in line with the general community stance on such a non-clearcut issues like whether a particular series of reverts amounts to disruption or not. I am pleased by your appreciation of my concern. --Irpen 07:46, 3 May 2007 (UTC)

In that case, you have an overly-bureaucratic view on matters, which is also not shared by most of the community. No noticeboard is necessary and most admin actions are not the result of noticeboard posts. What would be more appropriate would be for an admin to ask for more opinions there if he looked at the situation and decided the complexity demanded it, but not to recommend everyone go there as a matter of course. Dmcdevit·t 07:54, 3 May 2007 (UTC)

I agree that there is a revert war going on, which I don't like, so please help me clarify a few things by commenting on my contributions.

The Suppression_of_Falun_Gong page:

I think that this contribution is essential: because it's well sourced and very relevant to the page. Please review and let me know what you think.

Also the tags are necessary because the current version of Suppression_of_Falun_Gong is hijacked by the POV of Special:Contributions/Samuel_Luo a Falun Gong critic who is proposed for being banned , also you may observe that the contributions of Special:Contributions/Pirate101 and Special:Contributions/Yueyuen are only imitating Samuel Luo's behavior.

A few questions:

1. Is the information well sourced?
2. Is the information relevant?
3. Do we have consensus on that page?

My opinion regarding these questions, and please let me know if I'm wrong.

1. +
2. Basically if the material is well sourced and relevant it should be in that article.
3. If the article is not on consensus than there should be tags presenting that.

As far as I see it, I'm acting according to the wikipedia rules and spirit, where Samuel is not, he is even removing tags that show that the article is disputed.

Also please note that there was a legitimate section for this on this page however this was deleted: . Abusively and repeatedly . Also please review this section of the evidence page:

PS: Note that this is question is here for more then a month now:

I would really like more input on this issue, from you or from anyone else, this would be very much appreciated. Thank You. --HappyInGeneral 21:13, 3 May 2007 (UTC)

Thank You for your response, this is the type of answer that I wanted more then a month ago. Also another question, how can you hold back POV warriors in this case? --HappyInGeneral 21:22, 3 May 2007 (UTC)

OK, let me first read WP:DR, and after that, if this I don't see that this special case is covered I'll get back to you for some more info. Thank You so much. --HappyInGeneral 21:25, 3 May 2007 (UTC)

I admit that I have engaged in edit warring. However, the point here is that while I stopped, Happyingeneral continued his aggressive edits. His defiance and violation of 3RR is blatant and yet he is not punished. With examples like this can you expect other editors (that includes me) to follow the rules? If Happyingeneral is not blocked more people will follow his examle in forcing their pov with edit wars. This link takes you to the edit history of the suppression of the falun gong page. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Samuel Luo (talk • contribs) 21:57, 3 May 2007 (UTC).

Can anyone check if my edits were legit? Samuel wikipedia has vandals, and somebody has to hold them back, don't you think? How about discussing twoard a consensus and contributing more to the talk page, where you express your view. Just deleting well sourced materials repededly is Vandalism. Check out WP:VANDAL. --HappyInGeneral 22:20, 3 May 2007 (UTC)

Content disputes are not vandalism (see WP:VANDAL#Types_of_vandalism). The essential feature of vandalism is bad faith, and there is not evidence of that for either of you. Dmcdevit·t 22:31, 3 May 2007 (UTC)

Both Happyingeneral and me got our warnings at this time--16:39, 1 May 2007. As the record shows happyingeneral made another revert at this time 20:43, 1 May 2007 just four hours after the warning. He went on to make three more reverts on May 2nd. I resumed my reverts on May 3rd seeing that happyingeneral was not punished. Happyingeneral is a Falun Gong practitioner and there is a group of them working on Falun gong related pages. They are here to prevent anyone from reporting the true teachings and practices of the Falun gong. They often provoke edit wars when removing well sourced material. The conflict on suppression of the Flaun gong page was provoked happyingeneral who insisted on placing that picture in the intro. He is so bold, if he meets no punishments he will only be bolder. I am leaving Wiki soon, blocking me means nothing to me now. Bye --Samuel Luo 05:54, 5 May 2007 (UTC)

Selket is Selket

I am also Selket on FreeNode IRC. --Selket 06:36, 3 May 2007 (UTC)

My concern about the Licorne ban

The concern I have about the Licorne issue is that it was unilaterally extended to indefinite by one admin, with no discussion whatsoever. To be fair, I believe that anti-Semitic hate speech shouldn't be tolerated--hell, I gave the admin who indef'd him a Barnstar yesterday for booting him. But how's it gonna look in court if Licorne shows up expecting to edit under the restrictions imposed by ArbCom, only to find himself indef'd? It wouldn't be worth the inevitable disruption he'd cause. That was my rationale ... I was concerned that a one-year ArbCom ban that was extended to indefinite without discussion (no matter how merited it was) wouldn't stick in court, and the guy would drive people off Misplaced Pages before finally being booted for good. I'd have mentioned this on ANI, but didn't want to get jumped on in case anyone considered it trolling.Blueboy96 19:59, 3 May 2007 (UTC)

First, Licorne is still banned by ArbCom, so I don't understand your premise. More importantly, I have absolutely no clue what Misplaced Pages bans have to do with court at all. The Wikimedia Foundation is on solid ground in prohibiting anyone it wants from accessing its site, and there are no appeals of Misplaced Pages bans to government authorities. I have a hard time understanding how anyone even thought that was an issue. Dmcdevit·t 20:31, 3 May 2007 (UTC)

He was only banned for a year--a ban which technically ran out on March 23, 2007. It was unilaterally extended by Fastfission for anti-Semitic personal attacks ... see Licorne's entry on WP:LOBU, Licorne's talk page and the block log to see what happened. Like I said, I agree with the logic behind the indef--anti-Semitic personal attacks can't be tolerated here. I was just concerned he might have a window to try to take the Foundation to court. In any case, he evaded his ban four times, so it wouldn't have been too much trouble formalizing Fastfission's action.Blueboy96 21:32, 3 May 2007 (UTC)

It would be nice if you actually read WP:BAN before we go any further, especially WP:BAN#Community_ban and WP:BAN#Restart_and_extension_of_ban_duration_when_evasion_is_attempted. Dmcdevit·t 21:37, 3 May 2007 (UTC)

True, I don't dispute that. I could have missed something here ... but it seems that Fastfission's action occurred before the first of the four instances that he evaded the block. Though in any case, since evaded four times, for all intents and purposes you might as well say it's an indefblock (since under the original ArbCom ruling, he wouldn't be allowed back until 2010).

I support him being booted--I just want to make sure we get it right and don't give him a window where he could possibly return.Blueboy96 21:42, 3 May 2007 (UTC)

This is what I don't get: where did you get the idea that a real world court has anything to do with this? How could anyone take the Foundation to court over a ban, and if they did your assertion that Fastfission's block was not a ban is wrong. It is completely in accordance with WP:BAN#Community_ban, and, for good reason, a noncontroversial ban doesn't need a formal "ratifying" process, it is simply common sense. Dmcdevit·t 21:50, 3 May 2007 (UTC)

So your logic is if someone is indef'd and permabanned for egregious racially motivated personal attacks, it's OK not to discuss it since it's common knowledge that this behavior isn't acceptable here. I can accept that explanation. I was just thinking that since I want to be an admin someday, I didn't want to be the one to have to unblock a really onerous character because we were forced to do so. Blueboy96 21:55, 3 May 2007 (UTC)

Some advice if you'd like to be a reasonable admin: Misplaced Pages does not run n rules, it runs on understanding the reason such rules were written down, and taking action in accordance with good principle. Licorne will never be unblocked so long as there is a good reason for him to be blocked and no one contests it; there is no reason for discussions about that. Dmcdevit·t 22:29, 3 May 2007 (UTC)

Here you go (Re:ArbCom/CSN)

Here's the diff of FIVE members of ArbCom endorsing CSN and it's ability to topic ban problem users. SirFozzie 23:17, 3 May 2007 (UTC)

Yes, I know about that and would have voted the same were I still on ArbCom. No where does ArbCom endorse WP:CSN (which, by the way, was still called "Misplaced Pages:Community noticeboard" at that point). As I just noted on Durova' talk page I keep repeating that "the CSN did not invent such things, that they can happen as a result of any discussion, and that the ArbCom supporting the community's ability is not the same as the ArbCom endorsing the Community Sanction Noticeboard." No one has explained the claim that this is some innovation connected to the CSN. Dmcdevit·t 23:30, 3 May 2007 (UTC)

From the peanut gallery, I also view that case as the ArbCom endorsing community action—they say nothing about the particular forum. In the past, I have applied 1RR parole to articles to cool edit warring entirely on my own discretion, and for the most part they have been honored. The idea that only the CSN can authorize the imposition of remedies less than a ban is the creation of CSN itself. Thatcher131 23:36, 3 May 2007 (UTC)

• Decline. The system appears to be working. --jpgordon∇∆∇∆ 07:12, 26 February 2007 (UTC)
• Decline and endorse both the specific community sanctions, and the right of the community to do so. Essjay (Talk) 00:49, 27 February 2007 (UTC)
• Decline; Essjay speaks my mind. The Uninvited Co., Inc. 18:29, 27 February 2007 (UTC).

Maybe I'm reading something into the words you're not, however. "The SYSTEM' appears to be working". SirFozzie 23:44, 3 May 2007 (UTC)

One arbitrator said "The system appears to be working" and you seem to be taking that to mean that he (and all of arbcom?) thinks WP:CSN is ideal. Why don't you ask him? From my interaction with Jpgordon in the past, I sincerely doubt that's how he would like it to be take, and suspect he would go support deletion if you brought the nomination up at his talk page.

Thatcher's point is what I'm trying to get at. Maybe an example will help? Back in the deep primordial ooze before WP:CSN existed, I thought about a community ban for ParadoxTom and broached the subject at Misplaced Pages:Administrators'_noticeboard/IncidentArchive141#Community_ban_for_ParadoxTom, where it was decided to restrict him to 1RR. A month later, after a few violations of this community-imposed, completely uncontroversial 1RR, the case was brought up at ArbCom , where I instead recused and imposed a community ban on ParadoxTom, since I felt confident there would be no objection. There was no objection, Misplaced Pages:Administrators'_noticeboard/IncidentArchive150#Community_ban_for_ParadoxTom, and ParadoxTom was quietly banned by acclamation without resorting to ArbCom. This is in no way an innovation of WP:CSN, to claim so is a red herring, and what I am in opposition is the bureaucratic hoops that CSN is trying to impose that will constrain such reasonable actions. Dmcdevit·t 00:03, 4 May 2007 (UTC)

Well, just between June 2006 and Feb 2007, there are at least 5 cases listed at Misplaced Pages:Requests for arbitration/Rejected requests where ArbCom endorsed a community ban rather than open a case to make a formal ban. Not quite the same as endorsing a topical ban, true. However, even if "the system is working" was to be taken as an endorsement of CSN, that does not mean it was an exclusive endorsement. Thatcher131 23:54, 3 May 2007 (UTC)

A bonnie old friend ...

Latest batch of socks, with account creation times:

• Fotografia (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · nuke contribs · logs · filter log · block user · block log) 18:10, 30 April 2007
• Cel care e destept (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · nuke contribs · logs · filter log · block user · block log) 18:14, 30 April 2007
• Gaina de aur (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · nuke contribs · logs · filter log · block user · block log) 18:16, 30 April 2007
• Fat frumos (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · nuke contribs · logs · filter log · block user · block log) 18:20, 30 April 2007

Could you check if there's more where those came from? Fut.Perf. ☼ 20:22, 4 May 2007 (UTC)

• Looserheart (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · nuke contribs · logs · filter log · block user · block log) - Probably another one... --Illythr 20:37, 4 May 2007 (UTC)
  • Several Bonaparte socks and open proxies blocked, and that last one is Kuntan, which also turned up more socks and proxies. Thanks. Dmcdevit·t 23:13, 4 May 2007 (UTC)

Concern

If you trust my good faith I will tell you one more thing. 90% of my edits in wkipedia have been in an attempt to NPOV blunt POV by people like Zero, Homey etc...Misplaced Pages has a serious anti-Israel problem and this is btw, why almost all Israeli editors (very active in Hebrew wikipedia have left the english wiki - only El_C has remained but he has viwes that are of a tiny minority). In a world in which Zionist is a 4 letter word Misplaced Pages is loosing a valid (yet unpopular) POV.

In my arbcom case there is evidence. Yet, it looks that once again Fred, who has admitted before to being anti-Zionist, is ignoring the evidence page and rushing in the workshop page to offer yet another defense (3rd arbcom case he does that) for th anti-Zionist Zero and accuse only the behaviour of the Zionist Zeq.

Does this seems fair ? maybe it is time to put the issue on the table: It is not the behaviour that is the problem here but the POV on a specific subject. Some people who have strong POV should not be editing those subject . This would prevent all the edit wars. The solution that ArbCom took so far (banning just the pro israel side) has not solved the peroblem: Zero is running into massive amounts of edit wars with people other than me. Please look at the evidence. My concern is that it is being ignored. Zeq 06:54, 5 May 2007 (UTC)

Have you had a opprtunity to think about my concern ? the evidence is not getting much attention and already decisions are being discussed . Zeq 08:37, 6 May 2007 (UTC)

I can't really say about Fred's personal persuasions, have you had a content dispute with him before? As for your edits being "attempt to NPOV blunt POV," this is good, but the problem is not your intentions, it is your aggressive way of doing things, by repeatedly reverting instead of seeking mediation. I do think the problem is people with strong personal feelings editing controversial articles with no mind for compromise. And I do think Zero has edit warred and have added evidence to that effect. There is still plenty of time left in the arbitration for such concerns to be raised. Dmcdevit·t 10:28, 6 May 2007 (UTC)

• I did seek medaition (for example in the Amin Husesini article) but it was refused.
• There is pleanty of evidence that I interduced and it seemed to be ingored.

I did not had any recent direct edit dispute with Fred. I respect his viwes as he admitted to be "anti-Zionist" and he charterze me as "Zionist". So clearly this is the samr old problem I have wrote to you before: 2 opposing POV.

It is the same as with Zero. I respect his POV. All that I ask is that his POV will be presented fairly, side by side to the other POV. Howver, Zero has a technique to nullify the opposing views - I describe it in the evidence page. In many articles it is working. I have e-mails from people telling me they are afaraif to edit the Nakba article because Zero and his tag-team "own" that article. In previous arbcom case Jayjg promised to mediate the article but he bailed out at the first sign of opposition to this move by the editors who control this article.

• Now please bear with me and imagine this: assume that there is a user (say me) who hold two wikipedia IDs. In one I edit in an area that has no opposing POVs (example: with that ID I only edit articles about japaneese art - an area in which I am world known expert) but in my 2nd ID I edit articles on the middle -east and run into problems because there are people with a different POV who want to ablance my views (or push their own views). In such a case would you still say that the problem and the edit war are behaviour or personalty issues or that they are subject-based issues ?

• In any case I would ask that you read the evidence in the evidnce page. I admitted my wrong doing and as I said in my previous arbcom case: all I seek is NPOV. Zeq 12:21, 6 May 2007 (UTC)

User:Kd lvr

Now this isn't a post about what you think it is going to be about. I have apologized to User:Kd lvr on his talk page, which is easier said than done. Let's just say I let my pride and my stubborness get in my way alot. So, it was hard, but I apologized. Whether he accepts it or not, I am not sure and I don't expect him to. Just seemed like the right thing to do.

I would like to say, that I am a little disheartened though that my apology on my talk page explaining my actions was shot down as "half-hearted". This hurt just a little, cause I was apologizing whole-heartedly and it was shot down. You can't really show emotion through computers, so it kinda hurt that I was blocked and told to "take to heart assume good faith" and my apology was pushed aside by someone assuming it was a bad-faith, half-assed apology.

Anyway, just thought you would like to know that about my current post on User:Kd lvr talk page. - SVRTVDude 23:27, 5 May 2007 (UTC)

Regardless of what Mangojuice thought of your other remarks, I really like the gesture here , and I'm sure Kd lvr does too. Hopefully it will take you far in cooling the dispute and resolving the problem amicably. I wish you luck in that regard. Dmcdevit·t 00:13, 6 May 2007 (UTC)

Perhaps you could help

Currently there is an edit war being engaged by a user who is obviously reading something I am not or just making things up. Could you revert his changes and protect the Stoop!d Monkey page until the logo situation can be worked out.

The Stoop!d Monkey page was subject of an AfD and the result was "Keep". The admin who closed the AfD said that "I just said the article was to be kept, I don't know about the logos". There wasn't a decision given on the logos and in the AfD only 3 users said the logos should go, only 1 said keep the article, lose the logos.

I am not sure how to handle this, but since the admin who closed the AfD made no decision and the AfD wasn't about the logos in the first place (and the majority said to keep the logos if you want to be picky about it) I have asked that the user's changes be reverted and the page be locked til this can be worked out. Perhaps you could help, I don't need to be in anymore trouble. - SVRTVDude 01:31, 6 May 2007 (UTC)

It looks to me like you've both reverted too much. I'm not going to revert to anyone's preferred version before protecting, because that's not how it works: admin tools are never to be used for content judgments, since admins have no more say in content decisions than anyone else. They just have the buttons to stop an edit war when necessary, but protection is not an endorsement of the version. In any case, you're right that there was no decision about the article content in the AfD, logos or not. Typically AfDs only decide whether the subject merits an article, and, as long as the article doesn't merit speedy deletion it can be kept and cleaned up if so. It means that there is no rule against removing them, if that's what ought to be done, because of the AFD, and many articles have even been redirected after being kept at AfD, since that's an ordinary editorial decision anyone can take without needing an AfD decision. Basically, you should go on as if there had been no AfD; the logos should still be discussed if someone wants to remove them, or to not remove them.

If you want my recommendations about how to resolve the dispute, I would say just cool it. Maybe the other guy is being unreasonable, we all have to deal with unreasonable people at Misplaced Pages at some point. But seriously, it's not a big deal, in the long term, to leave up the other version (especially if it's only about a bunch of logos) while you discuss it. It's not good to continue discussing it as long as you're still going back and forth poisoning the atmosphere on the article itself. You might want to ask some of the people that commented on the AfD (not just the ones that agreed with you) to weigh in at the discussion, as it's always better when it's not a head-to-head negotiation. Dmcdevit·t 03:27, 6 May 2007 (UTC)

I would love to be able to have a conversation with User:Calton, but it is normally one sided (as his side is the only side that matters and is the only side that is right, according to him) hence why I bring it to an admin's attention.

Also, the reason I suggested reverting, was I thought admins switched it to the previous version before locking the page. So, that was my mistake there.

I will go through and ask the people who made comments on the AfD, like you said, about their opinion on it...if it comes out that the majority want the logos, do I revert them back? Cause User:Calton will just revert again. User:Calton is one for wanting things his way and no one elses. - SVRTVDude 03:40, 6 May 2007 (UTC)

One-sided discussions are not very useful, so yes, that's why I think getting other interested people involved will be useful. (WP:3O is another way for this, though less directed.) If the discussion concludes with a consensus, then you won't even have to worry about reverting back, because there will be others in agreement with you. However, in theory, demonstrating consensus is indeed a good reason for reverting back, and no one should revert unless they can successfully argue their perspective on the talk page first. If someone continues to revert against demonstrated consensus, then you might need an administrator to deal with that. Dmcdevit·t 04:31, 6 May 2007 (UTC)

I kinda mass posted, if you will, my request for the opinions of the people who responded to the AfD. What I posted was the exact same on each page (simple cut and paste) cause I was lazy. But alot of people are responding and I said either way their opinions go, I welcome them. So, this is ALOT better. Thanks for you help. Many thanks....SVRTVDude 04:41, 6 May 2007 (UTC)

Just wanted to give you an update. After talking with several people, I had incorporated the Stoopid Monkey explanations of the logos and their respective links into the episode list for Robot Chicken (the show the Stoopid Monkey logos are a part of). The Stoopid Monkey page itself was locked by another admin, but that is OK, there won't be a need for that now since the information has been moved. Thanks for your help and Take Care...SVRTVDude 02:58, 7 May 2007 (UTC)

Robdurbar/Wonderfool RfCU

Hi. FYI if you haven't seen it, there is ongoing discussion on WP:CN about, and some questions have been raised regarding, your checkuser finding on the above. Part of me doesn't want to see any more time spent on this situation, but I and am sure others would still be interested if there is anything you can add to the discussion there. Regards, Newyorkbrad 05:10, 6 May 2007 (UTC)

Release of Checkuser Information

Your edit here released the IP addresses of editors in a manner inconsistent with http://meta.wikimedia.org/CheckUser_policy#Wikimedia_privacy_policy. I have removed such addresses from the current version ; please oversight all revisions of Misplaced Pages:Administrators' noticeboard/Incidents which contain this information. Thank you. John254 02:53, 7 May 2007 (UTC)

Please don't be silly. This is in most certainly accordance with the privacy policy. Dmcdevit·t 02:55, 7 May 2007 (UTC)

What provision of the privacy policy permits the release of this information? John254 02:56, 7 May 2007 (UTC)

Did you read the policy? This is vandalism, and that information is vital to the investigation, to protect the encyclopedia, and to make a block on the IP. Now, listen closely: someone just deleted the main page, this is important and time-sensitive, and I don't need you fooling around, I'm trying to ensure the safety of the project here, and you are just trolling for old grudges. Your attempts to harass me need to stop now. Dmcdevit·t 03:02, 7 May 2007 (UTC)

You've blocked the IPs already. The claim that you need to release them on WP:ANI, precisely identifying the users with whom they are associated under the provision which states "Where the user has been vandalizing articles or persistently behaving in a disruptive way, data may be released to assist in the targeting of IP blocks, or to assist in the formulation of a complaint to relevant Internet Service Providers" is therefore unpersuasive. You could have revealed the checkuser results without stating the precise IPs in question. John254 03:10, 7 May 2007 (UTC)

Request for Arbitration

Due to your improper release of checkuser information, I am filing a request for arbitration against you. Please see Misplaced Pages:Requests for arbitration#Dmcdevit. John254 03:47, 7 May 2007 (UTC)