Misplaced Pages

Revision as of 21:44, 8 August 2007

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Hello, Bee Cliff River Slob, and welcome to Misplaced Pages! Thank you for your contributions. I hope you like the place and decide to stay. Here are some pages that you might find helpful:

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I hope you enjoy editing here and being a Wikipedian! Please sign your name on talk pages using four tildes (~~~~); this will automatically produce your name and the date. If you need help, check out Misplaced Pages:Questions, ask me on my talk page, or ask your question and then place {{helpme}} before the question on your talk page. Again, welcome! --orlady 21:11, 15 July 2007 (UTC)

Please come talk about Watauga River

Hi. I've been aware of your good contributions, so I'm surprised to be the first to "officially" welcome you. Please stop by Talk:Watauga River#Geographic confusion to help resolve confusion about the location of the river.--orlady 21:11, 15 July 2007 (UTC)

WHGB

The information you added for WHCB-FM in Bristol, TN should be added to that page and not WHGB. The WHGB-AM article is for information about WHGB-AM in Marion, Virginia. - NeutralHomer 08:57, 31 July 2007 (UTC)

• You seem to be terribly confused, T:C --- this information pertaining to WHGB management (same as WHCB) is both accurate and relevant. I would suggest three courses of action with regard to your concern:

• 1) place your comments and reasons for editing WHGB per Wiki standards at the WHGB talk page;
• 2) undo your blanking of this material pertaining to WHGB management and other info, and;
• 3) consider incorporating this the entire WHGB article as a section of the current WHCB article and then nominating the WHGB for deletion.

As there is not a Wiki article for the 501(c)(3) non-profit Applachian Education Communication Corporation organization (holding WHCB, WHGB, and the Cameo Theatre) and WHGB is a subsidary broadcasting operation of WHCB, I am thinking that the third above listed option is the most conforming to Misplaced Pages standards.Bee Cliff River Slob 15:08, 31 July 2007 (UTC)

Got an even better idea, how about you create a page for WHCB? Since WHCB-FM in Bristol, TN and WHGB-AM in Marion, VA are two seperate stations, they are given two seperate articles. This is the manual of style of WP:WPRS.

As for the 501(c)(3) non-profit part, I am not sure if that would be part of either article. You would need to talk to one of the admins about that.

• FCC ownership records (public records) clearly distinguish between commerical and non-commercial applications.

I suggest you make in article for WHCB-FM and then add the information about that station to that article. - NeutralHomer 16:18, 31 July 2007 (UTC)

Radio Infoboxes and WP:WPRS Procedure

OK, on the WPWT, WHGB, and WHGG pages, as they stand now, they are correct under WP:WPRS procedure and the FCC Website, which is the standard site we go by. We do not add management or ratings information, it is not something that is added to any page on Misplaced Pages.

Also, "Motown, soul, and rock n' roll" is not a standard format, this would be classified under Oldies/Classic Rock.

• WHGG 'The Mighty 1090" uses the "Motown, Soul, and Rock 'n Roll" as a pitch line - you might know this if you happened to be in the WHGG listening audience...Bee Cliff River Slob 03:42, 6 August 2007 (UTC)

Then "Motown, Soul, and Rock 'n Roll" would be listed under slogan or branding, not format. - NeutralHomer 04:03, 6 August 2007 (UTC)

Under sister stations, we list only the call letters, not the branding, frequency or any other information.

The first air date is when the station went on the air first. If WXXX went on the air in 1955 as WGGG, but became WXXX in 1988, it's first air date is still 1955.

• Duuuh, Homer - However, if you would bother to actually check the FCC query (for accuracy by Wiki standards) you would find that the feds list actual air dates by call signs AND transfers.Bee Cliff River Slob 03:42, 6 August 2007 (UTC)

Yeah, where do you think I get this information? Magic 8 Ball? - NeutralHomer 04:03, 6 August 2007 (UTC)

Wattage is listed by day and night power, or daytime only is necessary. It would be listed as... 10,000 Watts daytime
5,000 Watts nighttime

...or... 10,000 Watts daytime only It would never be listed as 10 kwatts. Remember, you have to write your articles so that a lay person can understand them as well and within the guidelines and procedures.

Also, we don't list where the station is located, address wise, because of WP:NOT#DIR, which states "Misplaced Pages is not the yellow pages." Even tax exempt status information is normally frowned upon as well.

Finally, we don't add schedules to a page, also because of WP:NOT#DIR, which states "an article on a radio station generally should not list upcoming events, current promotions, phone numbers, current schedules, etc."

There are certain rules that have to be followed for a article to remain within the set rules of Misplaced Pages, I don't make the rules, I just follow them. Also, there are set procedures with WP:WPRS, the group that watches over all the radio station articles on Misplaced Pages and keeps them within the Misplaced Pages Rules.

I would ask that you read over WP:NOT, WP:MOS, WP:WPRS among others. If you have further questions, please let me know. - NeutralHomer 21:23, 5 August 2007 (UTC)

Answers

I answered your many points on the WHCB talk page. Also, if you are going to have an on-going discussion, don't do it on the station's talk page, do it on your own. - NeutralHomer 06:40, 7 August 2007 (UTC)

Impressive....you tried to get me blocked by citing the same things I am citing you for....you actually copied exactly what I wrote. Didn't work, of course.

See, I have 164 radio station articles under my belt, so I know exactly what I am doing. I have been taught how to make these articles within the rules by some of the best editors from WP:WPRS and some of the best editors on Misplaced Pages. I have been taught the naming convensions and the manual of style of Misplaced Pages and WP:WPRS. I know what doesn't go in an article about a radio station and what does.

Add some history about that the station, not a paragraph and a half about a Tennessee Representative who hosts a show on one of the stations, not all three. Add a logo for the stations (please add fair-use rationales). Add something that is within the rules, not links to a blog critical of that same Tennessee Representative and not associated with the station itself. - NeutralHomer 07:07, 7 August 2007 (UTC)

• "Run, Forrest, run!"

Rep. Hill is a VP over ALL of the for-profit radio stations in question and hosts a kiddie program over WHCB (and therefore of WHGB) --- all relevant. Like his older brother Timothy Hill was a former WPWT talk show host, but he also worked on both the for-profit and non-profit radio stations---all relevant information.

Read WP:COATRACK, only information about Kenneth C. Hill, owner of the stations is allowed and has been added within the rules. Your edits, which you have been told by an admin are coatrack edits, will continue to be reverted and you will be from this point on issued vandalism warnings.

• Legally, Information Communications Corporation only owns a majority share 51% of the for-profit radio stations (Information Communicationsitself owned by Kenneth C. Hill), while the 501 (c)(3) Applachian Education Communication Corporation owns the other 49% ownership share - both Information Communications Corporation and Applachian Education Communication Corporation are joint owners of the for-profit radio stations.

If you would only bother to check the pertinent FCC onwership records for the radio stations in question, then you would learn this information to be accurate. Bee Cliff River Slob 19:26, 8 August 2007 (UTC)

Once you are issued an Warn4 warning, you will be reported to WP:AIV and they will block you. I hope it doesn't come to that, so I suggest you straighten up and fly right or you will be blocked. - NeutralHomer 05:44, 8 August 2007 (UTC)

Radio station articles

Hello - I see that you appear to be involved in a dispute with another editor over these articles. Can I suggest that you do not insert irrelevant information into articles; for instance, on the WHGG article, it is OK to mention that Mr.Hill is the owner, but all the information after that (about his other interests, his sons, and other AECC employees) is irrelevant; this is known as coat-racking, and will always be removed. Thanks, ELIMINATORJR 11:20, 7 August 2007 (UTC)

• Shortcuts
  • WP:COAT
  • WP:COATRACK

This is an essay. It contains the advice or opinions of one or more Misplaced Pages contributors. This page is not an encyclopedia article, nor is it one of Misplaced Pages's policies or guidelines, as it has not been thoroughly vetted by the community. Some essays represent widespread norms; others only represent minority viewpoints.

==What is not a coatrack==

An article about an astronaut might mostly focus on his moon landing. A moon trip that took only tiny fraction of the astronaut's life takes up most of the article. But that does not make it a coatrack article. The event was a significant moment in the subject's life, and his main claim to notability. A reader is not misled by the focus on the moon trip.

The salient points that you are missing ELIMINATORJR with regards to the Coatrack essay are the following:

• 1) this is an article pretaining to a radio and management team(and not a biographical article);

The management team would fall under WP:NOT#DIR and WP:COATRACK. - NeutralHomer 05:49, 8 August 2007 (UTC)

• 2) the talk radio format of WPWT of Information Communications Corporation is that of a political talk format;

Political Talk is classified as Talk Radio and nothing more, per

• 3) the same management team operated both the for-profit and non-profit radio operations (if you should ever visit the studios at the Leitner Buiding in Bristol, Tennessee from the sidewalk outisde, you would observe that the studios of each of the radio stations in question are divided only by glass walls);

Location of studios, etc. is not allowed per WP:NOT#DIR. - NeutralHomer 05:49, 8 August 2007 (UTC)

• 4) the same management of both the profit and non-profit radio operations are involved in related political activity.

Doesn't matter, it doesn't have to do with the station itself, so it doesn't go on the article, per WP:COATRACK. - NeutralHomer 05:49, 8 August 2007 (UTC)

All accurate, all relevant ---and unlike your comments, ELIMINATORJR, and not lifted from an essay and spun as Wiki policy. Bee Cliff River Slob 05:19, 8 August 2007 (UTC)

Your edits are in violation of several rules, rules you have been cited many times, rules you have been cited by an admin and yet you continue to blatantly ignore them. You will now be issued vandalism warnings as you behaviour and edits are such. - NeutralHomer 05:49, 8 August 2007 (UTC)

Complying with policy

No. These are articles about radio stations, not "radio stations, their management, and people peripheral to them". If you believe Mr.Hill is independently notable, then that information belongs in a separate article about themselves; whilst it is fine to say "X and Y are the management of radio station Z", further information, unless relevant to the actual station, is spurious.

• Welcome to WikiProject Radio Stations. We are a group dedicated to improving Misplaced Pages's coverage of radio stations.

Scope

This project's scope is mostly articles about individual radio stations. However, technology and content contributions are also appreciated, along with articles related to the people who produce such material.

And whilst about the scope statement from the WikiProject Radio Stations ? Bee Cliff River Slob 19:13, 8 August 2007 (UTC).

Taking your version of WHCB as an example;

• The first paragraph of the Kenneth C. Hill section is fine
• The second and third are irrelevant to the article, especially the part about Mr. Branscomb.
  • Brannscomb is a key employee of the Appalachian Education Communication Corporation (public record AECC IRS Form 990, 2003) and on official records of the Tennessee Secretary of State as being the Treasurer of the State of Franklin PAC. AECC owns 49% ownership of Information Communications Corp. d.b.a. WPWT - a radio station with a conversative political talk radio format.Bee Cliff River Slob
• The first part about Matthew Hill is semi-relevant, the latter part isn't.

A resonable paragraph would be "Dr. Kenneth C. Hill is the owner and president of the for-profit Information Communications Corporation,d.b.a. WPWT 870 AM, and his son, Tennessee State Representative Matthew Hill, is Vice-President and also hosted a "Mister Matthew" show for children on the station".

• • That was perhaps the goofiest staement that I have ever read on any Wiki Talk --- read slowly ---> AECC owns 49% of ICC d.b.a. WPWT, WHGG, etc. It is all relevant.Bee Cliff River Slob 18:59, 8 August 2007 (UTC)

You are also not doing yourself any favours by editing the articles anonymously; this is effectively sock-puppetry. Please stop edit-warring and leave the articles in a policy-compliant state. ELIMINATORJR 11:02, 8 August 2007 (UTC)

• • "Run, Forrest, run!" Bee Cliff River Slob 19:13, 8 August 2007 (UTC)

Vandalism warning

Please do not abuse the warnings system of Misplaced Pages; it is considered vandalism. If you want to experiment, please use the sandbox. Thank you. - NeutralHomer 06:00, 8 August 2007 (UTC)

Last comment

Firstly, you quote...

"This project's scope is mostly articles about individual radio stations. However, technology and content contributions are also appreciated, along with articles related to the people who produce such material."

Note - "along with articles related to the people..." i.e. articles about notable people involved in radio stations. This does not mean including irrelevant information about non-notable people in the articles.

"Brannscomb is a key employee of the Appalachian Education Communication Corporation (public record AECC..."

Fine. Mention that they're the controlling company. If they're notable enough, they can have an article on themselves, and your information on Brannscomb can go in there. It does not belong in the radio station articles.

Next... "That was perhaps the goofiest statement that I have ever read on any Wiki Talk"

That's your opinion. However, that "goofy" opinion was in line with Misplaced Pages policy. It is your choice whether you feel your editing conforms to policy, not your interpretation of it. Also, feel free to read WP:CIVIL, WP:NPA and WP:SOCK. ELIMINATORJR 21:44, 8 August 2007 (UTC)