Revision as of 10:39, 1 September 2007

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User:Atabek

The user is under civility parole under Armenia-Azerbaijan 2 case. He repeatedly accused me of being immoral in Khojaly Massacre talkpage --VartanM 21:55, 30 August 2007 (UTC)

Ditto, this user has been ratcheting up the rhetoric left and right, trying to get a rise out of ethnic tensions by implying that some of the users are intolerant or racist in their editing and opening up a new front on nationalist grounds on Misplaced Pages.--Marshal Bagramyan 23:03, 30 August 2007 (UTC)

He's actually in violation of number of Principles

• 1 Negotiation
• 4 Consensus
• 5 Misplaced Pages is not a battleground
• 7 Courtesy
• 8 Assume good faith
• 10 Diplomacy
• 14 Provocation
• 17 Users national background and neutrality

He's also in violation of Remedies

1 fail to maintain a reasonable degree of civility in their interactions with one another concerning disputes which may arise.

2 shall apply to any editor who edits articles which relate to Armenia-Azerbaijan and related ethnic conflicts in an aggressive point of view manner marked by incivility.

Its very hard for me to Assume good faith while the user keeps attacking me. VartanM 23:17, 30 August 2007 (UTC)

In discussion at Talk:Khojaly Massacre, User:VartanM is being incivil , and wrongfully accusing me of "personal attack" . I believe his attempts to remove externally linked videos, as well as continuous attempts by User:Pocopocopocopoco - to remove the image of Azeri children victims of Khojaly Massacre from the page, and attempts by User:MarshallBagramyan to purge Misplaced Pages image of Azeri girl from Shusha in traditional dressing at Shusha are assumptions of bad faith and engagement in battle along national lines. Doing so while arguing otherwise on the verifiability of images claimed to be related to Armenian Genocide (which were never touched or questioned), are nothing more than violations of WP:AGF and WP:SOAP. While ArbCom decision has clearly stated the requirements for editing in good faith within the limits of civility, User:VartanM and User:MarshallBagramyan, joined by User:Pocopocopocopoco are engaged only in removing images they don't like from the relevant pages or disruptively attacking contributors.

I would also like to thank User:Thatcher131 for his conclusion on the issue of the image of massacred Azeri children, which should address the questions User:VartanM may have. Thanks. Atabek 11:12, 31 August 2007 (UTC)

I don't know about any arbitration but regretfully I have to agree with User:VartanM and User:MarshallBagramyan about user:Atabek's assumption of bad faith, lack of courtesy and diplomacy, as well as his engaging in WP:BITE. I made a good faith edit removing an image that had an extremely questionable source and which Administrator Francis Tyers had himself removed earlier and user:Atabek assumed bad faith and accused me of fueling conflict, insulting Azeris, and engaging in war along national lines . I'm not sure which national lines Atabek is talking about though. - Pocopocopocopoco 03:23, 1 September 2007 (UTC)

Atabek keeps accusing me of being incivil, what he's forgetting to mention is that, I only repeated what he said about himself that his not an expert. Also note the WP:Personal Attack (Implies that I have not moral) and the WP:SOAP(Armenian Genocide pictures). Here he again questions my morals and accuses me of being racist against Azeri. Also he questions the pictures of Armenian Genocide (in the above comment he says that it was never questioned) He further Soapboxes by denying the Armenian Genocide as a genocide. May I also remind you that Atabek went on a genocide denying spree and changed the term genocide to massacre from a dozen of articles . He again calls me Immoral and accuses me of waring along national lines, while all I did was ask him to follow Misplaced Pages policies. Here he again calls the Armenian Genocide a massacre in early 20th century and claims that the Khojaly Massacre was no different then the Armenian Genocide. Anybody who has a basic knowledge about Armenia, Azerbaijan and Turkey would know that the two are in no way the same thing. I believe he was trying to provoke me. Keeps telling me to calm down, while I was perfectly calm and didn't answer his provocations to get me angry. In 8 months that I have been a wikipedian,I I am yet to have a conversation with Atabek without being attacked. would like to conclude by thanking Thatcher131 for explaining the WP:External Links to Atabek. VartanM 03:39, 1 September 2007 (UTC)

The above users have tried to remove an image from the article about Khojaly massacre, but admin explained that the image shall remain: I must also note that Pocopocopocopoco is being suspected by an admin to be a sock: and he has made highly questionable edits to Khojaly massacre article, where he encountered Atabek. And I don't see any serious personal attacks on part of Atabek on anyone posting evidence here. Grandmaster 05:53, 1 September 2007 (UTC)

I said what about the image? Better read it again. Thatcher131 06:41, 1 September 2007 (UTC)

I meant that you said that the image could not be deleted from the article for copyright infringement, as certain users claimed. You recommended to take the issue elsewhere if they believe that copyright has been violated. --Grandmaster 06:50, 1 September 2007 (UTC)

I believe that attempts by User:Pocopocopocopoco, User:VartanM, now with support of User:MarshallBagramyan, to get rid of the image on Khojaly Massacre, which clearly exposes the savagery with which those children were massacred, are nothing other than attempts to start another war which leads straight to ArbCom. They know absolutely well that these actions may cause counter reactions on unverified images on a number of "Armenian Genocide"-related pages, hence starting another war along national lines. Users clearly try to engage in WP:BATTLE and push their WP:POV, other than contributing to the articles in a non-disruptive fashion. I will not be engaging in such provocations. Atabek 10:39, 1 September 2007 (UTC)

User:Matthead and User:Poeticbent.

I submit the following diffs from the late controversy at Talk:Free City of Kraków. They are about equally from the two users at the head of this page; other users grew heated at the discussion, but largely through provocation by one of these two; and one of the others has recognized that he should not have, on my talkpage. This entire exchange would seem to be contrary to the requests for 'reasonable and calm behaviour" at Misplaced Pages:Requests_for_arbitration/Piotrus; and I have not quoted everything. I intentionally list one German and one Pole; we should preserve the balance between the factions. Septentrionalis PMAnderson 20:32, 30 August 2007 (UTC)

• They were inserted by Matthead in order to confuse the issues.....These are the real proportions Matthead tries so hard to misrepresent.
• Do underzealous Poles that are native English speakers promote Kraków then?
• Do you want your town to be listed among the countless absure places with funny names instead?
• P.S.: I refuse to respond to all other claims made by Matthead like the one made above, quote: “English speakers kept Cracow and Warsaw "verbally alive" then, and reinstated Poland after WW1, and this should be respected for decades to come.” — Please read History of Poland to learn more about how Poland was “reinstated” after WW1 by “English speakers” (wink, wink) with blood, sweat and tears, no doubt.
• And why exactly are you advocating peace, PMAnderson, while driving a stick in an ant colony?
  • This must refer to Calm down, everybody! Please remember there is an Arbcom decision on Eastern Europe, advising reasonable and calm behavior out of everybody; and I do mean everybody. - my only previous edit.
• I'm sick of all the talk promoting "Krakuf", which is the way our Polish friends pronounce their "Kraków". Anyone ever heard that spoken, maybe in a BBC radio broadcast of 1978 "... and the new pope is ... the Archbishop of Krakuf"?
• Obviously, the only reason you're here is to pick a fight.
• the Austrian Grand Duchy of Cracow existed from 1846 to 1918. If the English name Cracow gets rejected in favour of a native name, I conclude that this also applies to the name of the 1846-1918 period, Krakau.
• meaning that you also promote the Polish Oświęcim concentration camp for English Misplaced Pages?
• edit summary: smear campaign removing comments by other people, on his arguments.
• lengthy claim that the Polish editors who have written country-specific articles have a right to name them.
• “godlier than though” attitude,
• Move of Grand Duchy of Cracow, as threatened above

User:Pmanderson who requested Arbitration enforcement against me has been actively involved in content dispute regarding article mentioned above and in spite of my repeated pleas, continued to make derogatory comments about me all the way through till the end of his failed request to rename the article.

I submit the following comments against me, made by User:Pmanderson for your consideration.

• "Please leave us to our sloth and heathen folly, and allow us to follow our policies and write in English."
• "who else was least constructive in this discussion."
• "not the only contestant for the least constructive editor award, which is not awarded here."
• "this is not the place for awarding least constructive editor awards."
• "If PoeticBent indeed knows our customs, he should, as a matter of civility, abide by them."

Also, please note that a number of examples cited above by User:Pmanderson are several months old, hardly acceptable in the face of the recent Eastern European amnesty decision by the ArbCom.

My comments on examples provided by PMAnderson

• The first example from seven and a half months ago, refers to a heated debate regarding a different subject. To bring it here, after the amnesty declared by ArbCom, is a clear proof of defiance by Septentrionalis PMAnderson.
• The next two examples originate with Matthead.
• The following edit was made as of 19:19, 12 January 2007, again, seven and a half months ago, about a baiting comment made by Matthead that disregarded Polish historical drive for independence.
• User:Pmanderson's next comment seemingly based in WP:NCGN was a clear misrepresentations of policy, and if it was to be taken literally, it would indicate that the place called Cracow doesn't exist anymore.
• User Septentrionalis PMAnderson repeated the same comment twice in a survey, above and below my vote, claiming that is was a "red herring". His aggressive repetition of the same statement sounded like a warning and had a threatening look to it. Meanwhile, his supporter, Charles, wrote next to him about my vote: "grievously misleading or misunderstood interpretations of the conventions." In fact, following the vote, User Charles only intensified his personal attack on me in support of abusive comments by Septentrionalis PMAnderson, making me feel swarmed by the two of them. Please read the list of fantastic accusations by User Charles right under my refutation. The user has no business commenting here, yet feels compelled to continue his harassment.
• Please read for yourself my comment at Talk:Free City of Kraków. User Septentrionalis PMAnderson is attempting (above) to make me sound wrong by interpreting my message contrary to its spirit. The User supports his claim with a statement by an unsuspecting editor who since asked Pmanderson to have his diff removed from the above.
• And one more baiting comment by Septentrionalis PMAnderson about me, quote: "contestant for the least constructive editor award", etc.

Thank you for your consideration. --Poeticbent talk 06:14, 31 August 2007 (UTC)

• Admin response Obviously someone who is involved in a dispute can make a report here, it is the job of admins reading this page to attempt to decide if the complaint is legitimate or not. Unfortunately there are no enforceable remedies in that case, so even if one or more users have ignored the advice to play nice, there is nothing that can be done from this board. General blocks for incivility or just being a dick can be requested at WP:ANI. or you can ask ArbCom to review the case and apply new remedies. Thatcher131 02:09, 31 August 2007 (UTC)

My comments

I know this is coming after the admin response, but I must say that I was driven to respond to PoeticBent's behaviour each and every time because I did find it to be grievously misleading, disruptive, uncivil and just plain rude. I don't feel that PoeticBent has observed WP:NPOV, WP:POINT, WP:OWN, WP:CIVIL, WP:UE, WP:NCGN because he simply does not feel like it. Such behaviour obviously causes stress for all editors and makes it incredibly difficult for anyone to keep their cool. I truly feel that Pmanderson was not trying to make feel PoeticBent wrong because PoeticBent was wrong. The twisting and manipulation can be observed on the talk page and it is not Pmanderson doing it. The clear misrepresentations are all on the part of PoeticBent to obviously achieve a bias, which is disheartening for the quality of Misplaced Pages. I find most of PoeticBent's "dispute resolution" methods to be inflammatory and chiefly for the purpose of insulting the intelligence of others. Also, I found PoeticBent removing other individuals' comments to be entirely inappropriate. PoeticBent is not a censor and has no right to be.

Matthead, of course, is wrong, very wrong. The fact that he supported the move to the correct title using Cracow and then moved the Grand Duchy article to an entirely German form makes absolutely no sense to me whatsoever. I think that is all I need to say on the matter. Charles 07:45, 31 August 2007 (UTC)

The above statement by User Charles is yet another example of his personal attacks on me following his failed attempt to rename the article. Please read my refutation to accusations by User Septentrionalis PMAnderson for particulars about corresponding harassment by Charles. --Poeticbent talk 15:44, 31 August 2007 (UTC)

I'm sorry to say, but PoeticBent can best be described as one who shifts blame. Charles 17:21, 31 August 2007 (UTC)

Please stop the swarming, you two. There must be a better way. Septentrionalis PMAnderson abuse was directed at me if one follows the thread. No denying it now. --Poeticbent talk 17:36, 31 August 2007 (UTC)

Again, shifting blame, swarming, etc, etc. Own up to your transgressions some time? I wholly believe that PB's behaviour has been entirely discourteous, a little at first but extremely so later, from the point I first disagreed with him on the talk page, if not earlier. To me, the fact that PB had to significantly augment his posting here to include his thoughts on me speaks to the fact that he feels he can continually be discourteous with one hand and wrongfully try to discredit someone with the other. The fact that PB says that he feels cornered but owns up to none of his poor actions and the fact that PB insists that it's just other people insulting him is wholly ridiculous. PoeticBent, consider for a moment that I am not Pmanderson's supporter because I like him or whatever, I'm agreeing with him because he's right, you're wrong and you have spoken out contrary to so many conventions it's not funny. I would have said what I said regardless of whether Pmanderson had said anything or not. Anyone who can read the naming conventions without a bias to hide would do so. I have every amount of business to comment here. Like the articles you insist being named the way it suits you, read WP:OWN. I can disagree with people, but I also do not stand by when someone else thinks that I'm stupid and can be convinced that naming conventions don't say what the text spells out. I still cannot believe that you see it fit to call out shots, insult others, accuse them of swarming you, etc. All of these delusions. Unreal. People tend to address problems as they see them. Are we to stand by while you have your way with whatever you want? Charles 17:43, 31 August 2007 (UTC)

I deplore Poeticbent's removal of my comments. I repeat them for the record; but unless some admin disagrees with Thatcher131, and feels that the ArbCom decision does encourage action short to returning to them, this is moot.

• The quotation from Kipling was not addressed to him, as the diff will show; the "sloth and heathen folly" is self-deprecation on behalf of all anglophones.
• I went out of my way not to indicate any editor as least constructive, and I still am not sure which was. Unless Poeticbent obviously has the worst record, this is not an attack on him. Is he claiming that he has?
• And it would be civil of Poeticbent to comply with our customs, wouldn't it? Septentrionalis PMAnderson 17:18, 31 August 2007 (UTC)

User:Hajji Piruz

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section. A summary of the conclusions reached follows.

I concur with GRBerry in this instance Thatcher131 01:56, 31 August 2007 (UTC)

User:Hajji Piruz (formerly User:Azerbaijani) has been restricted by the 1RR/week parole per ArbCom decision. He has recently violated his parole at Azerbaijan.

Version reverted to: 11:14, 22 August 2007, note the controversial point: "The name Azerbaijan was chosen as the name for what later became the Republic of Azerbaijan in 1918 by the Musavats for political reasons", which Hajji Piruz was trying to reinsert in reverts below.

• First Revert: 00:48, 23 August 2007 - inserting the quote again.

• Second Partial Revert: 05:55, 27 August 2007 - removing another source, citation of the author, and partially resinserting the same quote again: "The name Azerbaijan was chosen as the name for what later became the Republic of Azerbaijan in 1918 by the Musavats"

Interestingly, the user has been inactive for few days, and his first edit after coming back is yet another revert. Atabek 07:09, 27 August 2007 (UTC)

Can you not once make a report without it being completely incorrect? Also, please assume good faith. You not assuming good faith is a complete setback to the issues of the arbcom. Read the terms of the parole, reverting anonymous vandalism is an exception to the rule, and as the first revert clearly shows, the anonymous user simply came to remove sourced information which is vandalism.Hajji Piruz 22:15, 28 August 2007 (UTC)

Weren't you removing the sourced text here ? Please, assume good faith. I don't see how reporting disruptive editing would be an assumption of bad faith. Atabek 03:07, 29 August 2007 (UTC)

Compromising and gaining consensus often requires using part of text A and part of text B when two texts are proposed for a section. The "Second Partial Revert" is at least as well described as an attempt at compromise as it is as a "revert"; I choose to disregard it completely on that basis. Seek compromise and consensus always. GRBerry 18:49, 30 August 2007 (UTC)

User:Skinny McGee

As a result of Misplaced Pages:Requests_for_arbitration/Midnight_Syndicate, Skinny_McGee is barred from editing any articles related to Midnight Syndicate or Nox Arcana.

• Skinny McGee has broken his ban on 3 occasions and exhibits a strong (or at the very least suspicious) bias toward any editor who mentions the name of the former band member, Joseph Vargo, for whom Skinny McGee holds a strong aversion, as indicated in his past when calling the person a "dispicable human being." It was this contempt for his former band member and efforts at self-promotion for his band Midnight Syndicate that resulted in an edit war, and resulted in the ban in the first place. This could be Wikistalking in its infancy steps.

• Skinny McGee adding a promotional link to Midnight Syndicate. Skinny McGee was suspected to be a member of that band, which was part of the reason the ban was placed.

• Removal of content (twice) from the Nox Arcana's Darklore Manor album and. Skinny McGee was previously found to be biased against Joseph Vargo, who is the frontman for Nox Arcana, and former producer of Midnight Syndicate. Again, this is the reason for the ban above.

• Lobbying to Prevent further investigation into references that relate to Midnight Syndicate album credentials

• Wrongful allegations by Skinny McGee against User:Ebonyskye about what was posted. Ebonyskye never posted what Skinny McGee accused (he accused Ebonyskye of saying that Midnight Syndicate "copied" someone). Ebonyskye only defined an album that "inspired" Midnight Syndicate.. The part about the band's being "similar" was already in the article posted by another user.

• Skinny McGee also complains of an item referring to his band's former producer however, the post is cited and validated. Skinny McGee also complained that this post qualified as reason to block Ebonyskye. The post was not biased in any way, it was also supported and even lengthened by another user later and remains.

• Due to the complaints inaccurately reported to admins by Skinny McGee as something they were not, Ebonyskye was indeed blocked for 48 hours. According to User:Thatcher131 who blocked Ebonyskye, "I am reasonably convinced that Skinny McGee is, or is associated with, Edward Douglas." (Edward Douglas being a member of Midnight Syndicate).

• Skinny McGee did NOT notify Ebonyskye of his displeasure of the edits that Ebonyskye made and did not report to Ebonyskye's page anything in regard to the request for block, giving Ebonyskye no opportunity to reply.

• Thatcher131 has refused to block Skinny McGee and cites a VERY unstable reason for not unblocking Ebonyskye... that being that an IP is "similar" or in the "vicinity" of another older user. That in addition to Skinny McGee's slanted report against Ebonyskye, conspired to cause an uneccessary block of Ebonyskye.

• Ebonyskye requested a review of the block, and it was summarily done (within 09 seconds of the request) which means that no "review" was actually done at all. Thatcher131 exhibited some bias in his refusal to consider this mistake.

I request a punitive temporary block of User:Skinny McGee for 1) breaking his ban as per Misplaced Pages:Requests_for_arbitration/Midnight_Syndicate and 2) causing undo strife and confusion in regard to making false reports. Thanks. Ebonyskye 04:02, 25 August 2007 (UTC)

Note to interested admins: Be sure to read User_talk:Ebonyskye/Archive1. Thatcher131 04:09, 25 August 2007 (UTC)

I edited the link given by Thatcher131 to point to my archived talk page, as it includes a contents directory to make finding my points easier. Ebonyskye 20:51, 26 August 2007 (UTC)

I just found out about this, a past Check User report about many alias' of Skinny McGee. Misplaced Pages:Requests_for_checkuser/Case/Skinny_McGee. I'm not sure what it all means but it seems rather suspicious that he would try to lay blame on me for only one edit when he has all this other stuff going on. Ebonyskye 06:26, 30 August 2007 (UTC)

That report appears to be from before the arbitration case started. Newyorkbrad 02:09, 31 August 2007 (UTC)