Misplaced Pages

Revision as of 12:43, 10 September 2007

Welcome

Hello, Colchicum, and welcome to Misplaced Pages! Thank you for your contributions. I hope you like the place and decide to stay. Here are some pages that you might find helpful:

• The five pillars of Misplaced Pages
• How to edit a page
• Help pages
• Tutorial
• How to write a great article
• Manual of Style

I hope you enjoy editing here and being a Wikipedian! Please sign your name on talk pages using four tildes (~~~~); this will automatically produce your name and the date. If you need help, check out Misplaced Pages:Questions, ask me on my talk page, or place {{helpme}} on your talk page and someone will show up shortly to answer your questions. Again, welcome! Shoessss 13:51, 22 December 2006 (UTC)

Portal

If you are interested in Russia-related themes, you may want to check out the Russia Portal, particularly the Portal:Russia/New article announcements and Portal:Russia/Russia-related Misplaced Pages notice board. You may even want to add these boards to your watchlist.

Again, welcome! Alex Bakharev 13:26, 2 January 2007 (UTC)

Vladimir Putin

Thank you for your contributions to Misplaced Pages. In the future, it is recommended that you use the preview button before you save; this helps you find any errors you have made, and prevents clogging up recent changes and the page history. Thanks again. -- >|< shablog /_cont 19:45, 3 January 2007 (UTC)

Second Checen War

Please do not vandalise this page. If you repeat this offence again, I may get a lengthy ban. JFBurton 12:54, 4 January 2007 (UTC)

Are you joking? I have only made a minor change replacing "oligarch" with "tycoon", which is far more appropriate, and gave a link to Stepashin's interview. Is this some kind of vandalism? Colchicum 13:06, 4 January 2007 (UTC)

Valery Vasiliev

Yes, you are right. I'm sorry - if I look into "Whatlinkshere", I'd definitely find another Vasilyev. Cmapm 11:18, 12 January 2007 (UTC)

Vladimir Putin

It may work fine as a separate article, but it doesn't fit with the objective of the main article. :: Colin Keigher (Talk) 22:03, 17 January 2007 (UTC)

Russian Portal

Hi there! Thanx for all your articles pertaining to Russia! Please, announce your articles at Portal:Russia/New article announcements, so that others could appreciate your work, make corrections or ammendments. See you there! KNewman 17:55, 18 January 2007 (UTC)

Energy Policy of Russia

I regret that my knowledge in this area is limited, but good luck with your contributions. Gralo 14:49, 2 February 2007 (UTC)

What kind of information concerning Russian oil export you are looking for? According to the IEA the Russian oil export in 2004 was 258 Mt. Some data available on this page . —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Beagel (talk • contribs) 18:39, 2 February 2007 (UTC).

Organization of data

Some of your articles include a lot of names and other data. This is great, but sometimes difficult to read and understand. I changed format for two first laws in your article Vladimir Putin legislation and program. What do you think? Is it better? Note that you can just click the reference number and see the reference. Biophys 01:50, 9 February 2007 (UTC)

Mediation case

We do not mediate Potanin issue here if you would like to post it - post it on incident board if you wish.Thanks. Vlad fedorov 04:24, 13 February 2007 (UTC)

Ok, sure, I will post it there. Colchicum 12:11, 13 February 2007 (UTC)

You such a lovely guy.Vlad fedorov 04:39, 15 February 2007 (UTC)

Images

You are doing such great job with images of people! Could you help to find some images for Shchekochikhin, Starovoitova and Yushenkov articles? Thank you for any hints.Biophys 20:32, 14 February 2007 (UTC)

I will try, but it is difficult. Colchicum 21:18, 14 February 2007 (UTC)

Thank you! I thought there is an easy way. Please do not spend too much of your time. Biophys 21:35, 14 February 2007 (UTC)

Thank you

Thank you very much for support. But your time and work here is too important. Please do not be involved in RR wars. Biophys 21:04, 16 February 2007 (UTC)

Unfortunately, now I am also pursued by Vlad (my fault, I shouldn't communicate with him), so I cannot work productively enough on any other topic either. Fortunately, I have plenty of pleasant duties in real life, so I will return to this later. Colchicum 21:12, 16 February 2007 (UTC)

Sorry. I guess it is all my fault. Just take it easy. Wish you to relax a little. Biophys 23:09, 16 February 2007 (UTC)

Please note that it perfectly appropriate to follow logs of other users. We can do it. WP:STALK policy says: "The term "wiki-stalking" has been coined to describe following a contributor around the wiki, editing the same articles as the target, with the intent of causing annoyance or distress to another contributor. This does not include checking up on an editor to fix errors or violations of Misplaced Pages policy, nor does it mean reading a user's contribution log; those logs are public for good reason. The important part is the disruption - disruption is considered harmful." Obviously, it was Vlad who disrupted our work in Misplaced Pages. Biophys 21:24, 17 February 2007 (UTC)

Railway Ministers

Hi there, Colchicum! I gave it some thought myself, but if you visit the РЖД site (rzd.ru), you'll see that it lists all these people under Министры Путей Сообщения. Levitin is the Minister of Transport, that's correct, but it appears that we have two ministries - Министерство Путей Сообщения and Министерство Транспорта (this one is listed at www.government.ru). Or they've been merged at some point. It's all confusing... KNewman 18:13, 19 February 2007 (UTC)

Krasnodar Krai is still a part of Russia, so there's no need to mention Soviet Union :). People should be able to guess that if someone is born in 1948, then it was good ol' USSR. KNewman 18:15, 19 February 2007 (UTC)

Yep, we got it right now. МПС ceased to exist in March of 2004, so all the ministers on my list belong to МПС. Levitin is the first Minister of Transport in the Министерство Транспорта и Связи. I guess we should right a small intro to the list, so that people don't get confused. KNewman 18:25, 19 February 2007 (UTC)

In which article did he mess up the links? KNewman 18:39, 19 February 2007 (UTC)

D*mn, now I'm really confused, maybe KMorozov is right after all. Check out the 2002 article on Sergei Frank, Minister of Transport

So I think we should move it back to List of Ministers of Railway Transport. Gotta let KMorozov know. KNewman 06:02, 22 February 2007 (UTC)

Allow me

My plans

I will be busy in the "real life" during two next weeks and can not appear in Misplaced Pages frequently. Please let me know if you need any help. A few months ago my edits in article Human rights in Russia and a couple of others were "edited" mercilessly by ellol and Vlad. I asked Alex Bakharev for help, and he sent me a butterfly you can see now on my talk page... Good luck! Your article Political groups during Vladimir Putin's presidency looks really great. Biophys 16:00, 24 February 2007 (UTC)

Romanization and "conventional" names

The general consensus has always been to use romanized modern Russian names for titles of all inhabited localities in Russia. The reason why the number of Google hits is so low is because the settlements in question are extremely obscure, and most of the references you are finding are to their past histories, which, obviously, employ Finnish spelling of the names. This problem is correctly fixed by establishing a network of redirects (I see you were doing that as well, which is good) and by listing the old names in the article, not by using old names as primary.

As for the WP:CYR clause you cited, it generally applies to cases on a larger scale; a smaller settlement would certainly fall under the threshold. The bottom line is that there must be a very good reason to not use a romanized name; names that get only a few hundred google hits certainly cannot be called "conventional". Note, for example, that none of the settlements in Kaliningrad Oblast is titled in German, even though most of the German spellings would get more google hits than romanized Russian versions.—Ëzhiki (Igels Hérissonovich Ïzhakoff-Amursky) • (yo?); 21:27, 26 February 2007 (UTC)

The threshold is implied by the very definition of "conventional" name—if the name is not widely known (which is the case for the vast majority of Russian rural localities), then there is no conventional name. In such cases, other guidelines kick in, and in this particular case that other guideline is WP:RUS.

As for Kaliningrad Oblast, I don't see how the example is irrelevant. You yourself established that Taipale was renamed to Solovyovo, Uusikirkko—to Polyany, and Inkilä—to Zaytsevo. This is very much the same as what happened in Kaliningrad Oblast after WWII.

In case you wondered, all this is not to say that people must be using modern names at all times. On the contrary, in historical contexts it is very much encouraged to use historical names, and if you need to link to the article, you can either do so via a redirect, or via a piped link (i.e., if you are writing about Inkilä, you can link to it like this: Inkilä, or like this: Inkilä). Hope this clears the misunderstanding. Best,—Ëzhiki (Igels Hérissonovich Ïzhakoff-Amursky) • (yo?); 22:03, 26 February 2007 (UTC)

It only looks ugly to those who know where and what these places are :) Anyway, here are a few points to consider:

• Russian is the official language of Russia. Hence, all places in Russia have official names in Russian. Those places could have been directly borrowed from the local languages and adopted to Russian orthography ("Хийтола" is a good example), but even in those cases the Russian version is always official or co-official.
• The term "conventional English name" refers to names which are widely recognized in English. With Russian geography, conventional names are quite often romanized official Russian names, because they are usually taken directly from official Russian sources. Exceptions from this are far and few between, and deal mostly with such established forms as "Moscow", "St. Petersburg", or, a marginal case, "Peterhof". All conventional forms are documented in major English language dictionaries. If a word is not there, it means no conventional form of it exists in English. When no conventional form exists (which is the case for any variation of "Лахденпохья", for example), Misplaced Pages guidelines generally prescribe using romanization of the official name as a title, and listing all other important versions in the article's body and as redirects.
• All English-language maps of Russia use a certain convention. The ones I've seen so far predominantly use BGN/PCGN, ALA-LC, sometimes even the GOST, or some variations of these systems. No matter which romanization system mapmakers choose, however, they consistently romanize official Russian names, not the local names (many don't even show "Moscow", but do "Moskva"). You are, of course, welcome to doublecheck this and look at some maps yourself, but I have my doubts they will be using versions taken from the local languages. In any case, whatever you find, please let me know—I never made a point to verify this, but am very interested in knowing the result. It may very well be I have just not seen a proper map yet :)

Hope this helps!—Ëzhiki (Igels Hérissonovich Ïzhakoff-Amursky) • (yo?); 21:12, 1 March 2007 (UTC)

Update

I realize that you had said that you don't see this issue as a major problem, but I would still like to provide this update, mostly for future reference sake.

I visited a bookstore this weekend, and did some research using the atlases they had on display. The research is by no means scientific, but it should be sufficient to see the main point.

The atlases the bookstore had in stock included Rand McNally, Oxford, Harper-Collins, DK, and Barnes & Noble. Some of these were concise versions, so I couldn't check the names of smaller settlements. Here are the findings:

• All atlases in this roundup (except Rand McNally) use BGN/PCGN romanization (or slightly modified version of it). Rand McNally seems to use scientific transliteration.
• As I previously stated, all atlases romanize the Russian version of the names:
  • Rand McNally uses Lahdenpohja to refer to "Лахденпохья", which matches the scientific romanization of this name in Russian
  • In Oxford's consise atlas, none of the settlements we previously discussed are shown. "Суойарви", however, is romanized from Russian as Suoyarvi.
  • Harper-Collins was the most complete of the atlases in the store. In this atlas, Суойарви, Хийтола, and Лахденпохья are spelled as Suoyarvi, Khiytola, and Lakhdenpokh'ya.
  • DK atlas was also rather concise. It only had Суойарви, rendered as Suoyarvi.
  • Barnes & Noble atlas showed Суойарви and Лахденпохья as Suoyarvi and Lakhdenpokh'ya.
  • National Geographic atlas was, unfortunately, sealed, but its (very) concise version also uses BGN/PCGN. None of the places mentioned above are shown in the concise version.

I hope this is sufficient to show that the majority of English-language atlases use BGN/PCGN romanization and romanize the Russian versions of geographic names.—Ëzhiki (Igels Hérissonovich Ïzhakoff-Amursky) • (yo?); 16:11, 5 March 2007 (UTC)

Images from kremlin.ru

Fyi, I’ve started a deletion discussion at commons:Commons:Deletion requests/Template:Kremlin.ru. If the template on Commons is deleted, I will also nominate {{Kremlin.ru}} for deletion. —xyzzy_n 21:16, 4 March 2007 (UTC)

March of the Discontented

Hi,

I do not feel strongly on the title, and I apologize as I seem to have confused two different events and interpreted them as one. In the first RfE/RL reference it is reported that the title of the March is the "March of the Discontented," but if this is a poor translation then your proposed title is acceptable. I have not yet seen their website. Regards, KazakhPol 00:52, 5 March 2007 (UTC)

Sosnovo

That is, unless its status was upgraded, and I missed that. I don't think I did, but I might have. Any comments?—Ëzhiki (Igels Hérissonovich Ïzhakoff-Amursky) • (yo?); 20:02, 7 March 2007 (UTC)

Bus terminals in Moscow oblast

All articles were deleted dispite the majority voted against deletion . All images were deleted as well.--Dojarca 19:15, 10 March 2007 (UTC)

Bot

Thanks a lot for your ideas for this bot project. They seem to work pretty well.

Theoretically, users should be able to add the feeds themselves. I am trying to document this process, on the bot's userpage, so please review.

I did not have problems with Armenian/Azeris. I guess this is because the new art boards we already established processes for them and for the Albanians we are creating a new entity. I remember a few months ago there was a huge edit war between Turks and Iranians over the scopes of their projects. It was despite that nobody forbids an article be in the both projects. If needed I could tell the hot heads to cool down.

Thanks again for your contributions Alex Bakharev 16:34, 16 March 2007 (UTC)

Vladimir Ustinov

I noticed you adjusted the transliteration. You may be interested in this one too: Vladimir Vasilevich Markovnikov. Thanks. --66.41.102.194 03:26, 19 March 2007 (UTC)

Albania

Thank you for the message. I am still working on the articles I've started, but I'll try to take care of the other ones too. I'm just too busy with school so I've left wikipedia behind...--Albanian since Stone Age 21:08, 20 March 2007 (UTC)

Re: Military History

Mmm, I don't really care all that much which name the list is under (although I'm curious why you chose the WP:WARS redirect—it's not one of the more commonly-used ones); so I have no objection to combining the two in principle.

On a more practical matter, though, looking through both the rules you put together and the results so far, I don't think they're very good:

• The results aren't very useful; there's maybe a dozen actual military-related articles in there. It's better to miss a few obscure or badly-worded articles than it is to flood the list with false positives. This is due, in large part, to your inclusion of common English words ("general", "attack", etc.) in the ruleset.
• The rules are overly complicated, in my opinion. You have a lot of redundant and/or extremely specific ones, to the extent that it's quite difficult to keep track of what exactly is being searched for, and why. I think it ought to be cut down to a few dozen common, primarily military-related terms, rather than trying to include every possible permutation of wars, ranks, weapons, etc.

Kirill Lokshin 18:25, 21 March 2007 (UTC)

Looking at the latest sets, I'll point out that the "Wars" ruleset is picking up nearly three times as many articles as the "Military" one, most of them irrelevant; so I'd suggest that we use the latter for a merged (under whatever name) version. Kirill Lokshin 22:35, 23 March 2007 (UTC)

Well, there are two issues here. The theoretical concerns—which articles are we trying to find, and so forth—are one. The practical issue, though, is that a listing that's primarily composed of false positives is of no use to the WikiProject. Even the shorter list is quite long; the longer one is huge, and nobody is going to bother going through it on a regular basis to pick out the relevant articles when most of them aren't applicable; it's simply too much work for too little gain.

So the real question is this: is the point here to create an easy way for members of the project to identify new articles within our scope, or, more generally, to create a way to identify every article that could be related to military history even if the resulting list isn't useful to the project in a practical sense. Obviously, I tend to favor the former. Kirill Lokshin 17:18, 24 March 2007 (UTC)

Discussion Outside of Misplaced Pages

Hey, I would like to talk to you outside of Misplaced Pages. Can you either leave your email on my talk page, or register one for your profile? Thank you. CPTGbr 18:21, 24 March 2007 (UTC)

Ulmus

Thank you for your constructive criticism; I have duly revised the titles to include 'Ulmus' in full; the Coreana entry was unpardonably careless. Regards, Ptelea 09:01, 28 March 2007 (UTC)

Wow!

Great job on newsfeeds on the USA states! And all the other newsfeeds to! Alex Bakharev 01:12, 5 April 2007 (UTC)

Admin

Would you be interested in a career of a Wiki-admin? Alex Bakharev 05:14, 9 April 2007 (UTC)

Probably no. I couldn't stand people knocking in my virtual door so often, and everything I am inerested in I can do without admin privileges.Colchicum 12:00, 9 April 2007 (UTC)

Pity. I'd support your nomination, too. Anyway, it's your choice. Cheers,—Ëzhiki (Igels Hérissonovich Ïzhakoff-Amursky) • (yo?); 17:36, 9 April 2007 (UTC)

Pionerskaya

Thanks! I'll fix it.—Ëzhiki (Igels Hérissonovich Ïzhakoff-Amursky) • (yo?); 18:28, 11 April 2007 (UTC)

Usadishche

Could you, please, clarify, what you meant by "obsolete rural locality" here? From what I have, the village still exists. Thanks.—Ëzhiki (Igels Hérissonovich Ïzhakoff-Amursky) • (yo?); 18:41, 11 April 2007 (UTC)

Never mind, it turned out to be a different village. I'll make corrections. Sorry about that.—Ëzhiki (Igels Hérissonovich Ïzhakoff-Amursky) • (yo?); 18:58, 11 April 2007 (UTC)

Did you know?

On 12 April, 2007, Did you know? was updated with a fact from the article Saint Petersburg–Hiitola railroad, which you created or substantially expanded. If you know of another interesting fact from a recently created article, then please suggest it on the "Did you know?" talk page.

--GeeJo ⁄_(c) • 13:11, 12 April 2007 (UTC)

Vyborg redir

Done. Thanks for catching this! Are you still sure you don't want to try for adminship? :)—Ëzhiki (Igels Hérissonovich Ïzhakoff-Amursky) • (yo?); 00:56, 18 April 2007 (UTC)

Vyborg translation

Just to let you know that it might be a ridiculous amount of time before anyone gets around to translating the article as I seem to be the last remaining active member of the FI-translation "team" :D -Yupik 22:34, 18 April 2007 (UTC)

Yehp, sorry that translation for stuff from Finnish is that slow. If you speak Finnish, feel free to help out with the translations as there is a lot more material in the Finnish wiki from that side of Finland (and the ceded areas) that I would like to translate but as I'm currently translating a couple hundred pages of the same stuff for my day job, I need a break from it when I get home. Thank you for doing such a fine job by the way with the articles that I've come across. It's made my day job a lot easier in the last couple of weeks! :) -Yupik 22:45, 18 April 2007 (UTC)

Can you translate this, please?

User ellol posted the following comment on my talk page (Russian criminal slang): "Бабки рулят", "Путин меня не вставляет", "Пацанские распальцовки на стрелках -- всё-таки цивилизованнее, чем заточка в бок", "Западло не отвечать за базар".

I translated this as follows: "Anything can be done for money". "I am not satisfied with Putin" "It is better to decide everything at the gangster's "court" meetings than to get a knife into the heart" "Someone must be punished for making too much noise".

Could you tell please if this translation correct?Biophys 01:38, 4 June 2007 (UTC)

Well, frankly, I haven't mastered Russian slang that well, so I cannot. Try not to take it personally. I agree that this is inappropriate in Misplaced Pages, but such behavior is sort of standard in Russian blogs and forums. Unlike some other contributors you know, ellol doesn't look really nasty and disruptive, although it would certainly be better for him to comment on content rather than contributors and not to ask personal questions (Talk:Human rights in Russia shouldn't look like this, my fault as well). Yes, he has a strong point of view and probably thinks that his ideas are sort of mainstream in Russia and that the rest of the world cares too much of this, which I believe is not true, but we all have our prejudices. Try to abstract away form edit histories of such editors. Just think of them as contributors you have never encountered before. They don't really deserve any special attention. Colchicum 13:35, 4 June 2007 (UTC)

Thanks. Sure, no problem. I understand that you do not want to be involved, and that you have a rather favorable opinion about ellol. That's fine. I appreciate your comment. With great respect, Biophys 15:09, 4 June 2007 (UTC)

No, I certainly don't have any positive opinion about ellol, but yes, I don't think that he is a problem. There are thousands of people like him. He seems to be extremely naive when he suggests that his opponents don't know Russia well enough, but it is his problem. I don't think I can do anything with this. Neither do I think this would be a worthy undertaking. Colchicum 15:52, 4 June 2007 (UTC)

That is understood. But I only asked you about impartial translation of the text as a native speaker, not about ellol. Sorry for that. I should not be asking. As about ellol, he believes that it was me who did wikistalking of Vlad (his RfC), makes comments like that , and you may also take a look at his recent edits of article Internet brigades. He also has a habit of coming to my page and posting all kind of cryptic messages with "double meaning" on Russian, such as science fiction prose that describes torture, poetry telling that Russia is great, statements by extremists (he thinks I am one of them), and messages of the kind I asked you to translate. Sorry for interruption. I understand and appreciate your response.Biophys 21:03, 4 June 2007 (UTC)

Then are we going to go to war against all the Russian anti-Polish, anti-Chechen, anti-Estonian, anti-American, pro-Soviet editors here? It would be fruitless. Would a 24 h block of ellol help you? I don't think so. Don't take it personally. A user has just called Freedom of assembly in Russia "very hardworking shitdigging by the Department of State" and the entire urgent announcements section now looks like a garbage, but I don't care. It has always amazed me how weak some personalities could be with their strong feelings. Colchicum 10:26, 5 June 2007 (UTC)

Of course, not. You are right, and I do not take it personally at all. Please do not think that I can be easily offended. Thank you for advice. A few days ago Yulia Latynina made an interesting presentation at Ekho of Moscow about money laundering (or perhaps simply business) by Kremlin administration in Europe (there is an investigation), and Putin just visited the same places - perhaps to make some money transfers. Next day, no trace of her translation could be found at web site of Ekho of Moscow, and she started doing her work over the phone from Israel. Do you know anything about that?Biophys 16:26, 5 June 2007 (UTC)

Minor edits

Hello. I just thought the issue was about whether I consider my edits significant. But now I see, that minor edits should be only typo corrections, formatting and presentational changes, rearranging of text without modifying content, et cetera. Thank you, I took this. ellol 12:08, 5 June 2007 (UTC)

Plans (get involved!)

create

• Freedom of movement in Russia
• Property rights in Russia
• Mikhail Fradkov's First Cabinet
• Mikhail Kasyanov's Cabinet
• Vladimir Putin's Cabinet
• Sergei Stepashin's Cabinet
• Federal Tax Service of Russia
• Deputies in the State Duma of the 4th convocation
• Deputies in the State Duma of the 3th convocation
• Deputies in the State Duma of the 2th convocation
• Deputies in the State Duma of the 1th convocation
• Members of the Federation Council of Russia
• Petroleum export of Russia

summarize Putin's addresses to the parliament and put them in Vladimir Putin legislation and program. Summarize the latter and put it in Vladimir Putin

reorganize List of heads of federal subjects of Russia to cover former governors

Colchicum 16:39, 6 June 2007 (UTC)

Nanotechnologies in Russia?

by Roman Kutuzov Colchicum 13:05, 8 June 2007 (UTC)

What do you mean? There was an interesting talk about it: .Biophys 02:29, 26 June 2007 (UTC)

Strange adventure of Lemmy Caution

Colchicum 14:11, 8 June 2007 (UTC)

Could you translate the heading, please? --Ghirla 10:41, 12 June 2007 (UTC)

No, I can't. Colchicum 10:44, 12 June 2007 (UTC)

Please consult WP:TALK. --Ghirla 10:51, 12 June 2007 (UTC)

I have already done so. Thank your for your suggestion. Colchicum 10:53, 12 June 2007 (UTC)

Then why do you use extremely obscene language to characterize the current head of the Russian State? Jimbo Wales is known to have permabanned people who bring Misplaced Pages into disrepute by such tricks. I also recommend you to consult the Russian Criminal Code (article 319). (Ab)using Misplaced Pages for criminal activities is sort of subversive. --Ghirla 11:07, 12 June 2007 (UTC)

Russian legislation doesn't apply overseas . Please consult WP:LEGAL (policy, not guideline!) and never comment here anymore. Bye. Colchicum 11:17, 12 June 2007 (UTC)

You'll find that Russian legislation does apply overseas, if you follow my suggestion and read the Criminal Code carefully. As for WP:LEGAL, I don't "threaten" to "take legal action" against you. God forbid. I just point out that using extremely obscene language to characterize the current head of the largest state in the world is not what is expected from wikipedians. Or do you think otherwise? --Ghirla 11:24, 12 June 2007 (UTC)

It seems to me that I have just asked you not to comment here. Bye. Colchicum 11:27, 12 June 2007 (UTC)

It seems to me that your request was considered and refused. --Ghirla 11:39, 12 June 2007 (UTC)

Google translation DLX 11:05, 12 June 2007 (UTC)

It has already been translated. I can provide the reference if anybody is interested. Ghirlandajo meant the title of the section, I presume. So far I have had ∞ tolerance towards trolls. Colchicum 11:17, 12 June 2007 (UTC)

Ah, I didn't know about the translation - was just interested in the article and my Russian is not good enough to understand the article - so I decided to give link to others as well. As for the title... my Russian is good enough to understand that ;). DLX 11:25, 12 June 2007 (UTC)

I have changed the section's title to avoid profanity. As a rule of thumb if the lexical form of our ideas offend people than lets change the form. It does not mean that we censor facts Alex Bakharev 13:57, 12 June 2007 (UTC)

This Putin's interview reminds me brief story "Srezal" by Vasily Shukshin (Putin "srezal" his Western opponents in view of Russian listeners).Biophys 20:11, 26 June 2007 (UTC)

Estonian national awakening

Thanks for creating (expanding) Estonian national awakening. Why is it, that our Estonian editors have not been able or willing to create this?

...Which brings me to the question, I was going to ask you earlier: What languages do you use? Can you access Finnish sources? -- Petri Krohn 20:06, 11 June 2007 (UTC)

About a dozen to some extent enough for Misplaced Pages purposes, I think (or even more, if some closely related languages that I have never learned but can understand are counted) -- but I wouldn't like to disclose them all. As to Finnish sources, well, not that I can understand everythig, but generally I am able to read and find what I need if I am familiar with the topic. Colchicum 10:22, 12 June 2007 (UTC)

P.S. This should go to WP:DYK -- Petri Krohn 20:07, 11 June 2007 (UTC)

I agree to this suggestion.--Alexia Death 08:06, 12 June 2007 (UTC)

Hey! Just wanted to say thanks for filling that stub I started in :)--Alexia Death 08:06, 12 June 2007 (UTC)

Thanks! Colchicum 10:22, 12 June 2007 (UTC)

I nominated the article, but I still have questions about this edit. You can't say that the Estonians were less literate than the Grand Duchy of Finland. Either we compare administrative divisions (Governorate of Estland and Grand Duchy of Finland) or we compare ethnic groups (Ests and Finns, Poles and Germans, etc). Comparing Estonians with Grand duchy does not make sense. --Ghirla 11:39, 12 June 2007 (UTC)

• The source is available to subscribers only. Colchicum, can you check that they indeed compared the ethnic group to the population of an administrative unit. Maybe they compared populations of the Grand Duchy to the Revel Governorate? Alex Bakharev 14:00, 12 June 2007 (UTC)

Yes, it was me who added this source, and I have already fixed the text, they meant Estonian-speaking population of the Baltic governorates. Colchicum 14:05, 12 June 2007 (UTC)

Thanks! Alex Bakharev 14:08, 12 June 2007 (UTC)

Holocaust issues

So there was no Holocaust in Estonia? What's the point of these edits? --Ghirla 10:46, 12 June 2007 (UTC)

Don't you speak English? Is adding more details now considered Holocaust denial? Colchicum 10:48, 12 June 2007 (UTC)

One may deny Holocaust either by adding or removing information, it does not matter which. For instance, "information" that most European Jews had emigrated overseas before WWII is a favourite point of Holocaust deniers. --Ghirla 11:10, 12 June 2007 (UTC)

One may deny nothing by adding or removing information as well. I don't care what is the favorite point of Holocaust deniers. I am not interested in Holocaust denial. Colchicum 11:21, 12 June 2007 (UTC)

The point is that trying to paint the Estonians all black is not good. Colchicum 16:28, 12 June 2007 (UTC)

Estonian national awakening

On 14 June, 2007, Did you know? was updated with a fact from the article Estonian national awakening, which you created or substantially expanded. If you know of another interesting fact from a recently created article, then please suggest it on the Did you know? talk page.

--howcheng {chat} 02:04, 14 June 2007 (UTC)

On June 21, 2007, Did you know? was updated with a fact from the article Soviet deportations from Estonia, which you created or substantially expanded. If you know of another interesting fact from a recently created article, then please suggest it on the Did you know? talk page.

Hello Colchicum and thanks for all your hard work in keeping Estonia represented on the main page. Keep it up!Blnguyen (bananabucket) 03:47, 21 June 2007 (UTC)

Soviet deportations from Estonia

Thanks (again) for creating Soviet deportations from Estonia. It is strange, that this article was not created earlier. There however seems to be simple explanation to this slow progress in Estonia related articles; as long as Estonians and Balts insist of keeping the German annexation/occupation in the same articles with the Soviet annexation/occupation there can be no progress. Only when we have separate main articles for Soviet and German actions, can the coverage of "Soviet" Estonia 1940 - 1945 expand and improve. -- Petri Krohn 12:53, 19 June 2007 (UTC)

Well, to be frank here, they are forced to waste their time fighting, and they are not the only party to blame (because there are indeed contributors willing to paint the Estonians all black in Misplaced Pages; I was really shocked when one had requested sources specifically about the role of Ain Mere in Estonian emigration community rather than better sources on the trials. What for?). It is also worth mentioning that the Estonian community in Misplaced Pages has just emerged. Let's hope that they will eventually shift to adding content. Colchicum 13:05, 19 June 2007 (UTC)

WP:RFC/U on Petri Krohn filed

You might be interested to know that Misplaced Pages:Requests for comment/Petri Krohn has been filed. Digwuren 20:14, 19 June 2007 (UTC)

Valge Raamat

I plan to, but my personal life is rather hectic right now. I'm moving house, and it will take time to get back to the Internet. So, regrettably, the translated references will not happen before next week. Digwuren 14:13, 21 June 2007 (UTC)

I am back, and will hopefully get some time to add the English references into the article. Digwuren 16:39, 5 July 2007 (UTC)

Putin on himself

Sorry, Colchicum, do you exactly think this was said seriously? VLADIMIR PUTIN: (laughs) Am I a ‘pure democrat’? Of course I am, absolutely. But do you know what the problem is? Not even a problem but a real tragedy? The problem is that I’m all alone, the only one of my kind in the whole wide world. Just look at what’s happening in North America, it’s simply awful: torture, homeless people, Guantanamo, people detained without trial and investigation. Just look at what’s happening in Europe: harsh treatment of demonstrators, rubber bullets and tear gas used first in one capital then in another, demonstrators killed on the streets. That’s not even to mention the post-Soviet area. Only the guys in Ukraine still gave hope, but they’ve completely discredited themselves now and things are moving towards total tyranny there; complete violation of the Constitution and the law and so on. There is no one to talk to since Mahatma Gandhi died. ellol 17:37, 22 June 2007 (UTC)

Well, yes, maybe I lack sense of humor, but I take presidential interviews very seriously. I am sorry if he himself doesn't. Colchicum 18:24, 22 June 2007 (UTC)

Removal of referenced information

CENSORED

Look at the talk page of the article with more attention and get out. Colchicum 09:59, 24 June 2007 (UTC)

DEFAULTSORT:

Howdy, Thought you might like to know that the preferred syntax for DEFAULTSORT is with a ":" and not a "|". Ref: template:defaultsort. Thanks! Schmiteye 03:22, 28 June 2007 (UTC)

Transwiki of Vladimir Putin quotes

Hello, this is a message from an automated bot. A tag has been placed on Vladimir Putin quotes, by Sceptre (talk · contribs), another Misplaced Pages user, requesting that it be speedily deleted from Misplaced Pages. The tag claims that it should be speedily deleted because Vladimir Putin quotes is an article that has been discussed at Articles for Deletion (or Miscellany for deletion), where the outcome was to transwiki, and where the transwikification has been properly performed and the author information recorded (CSD A5).

To contest the tagging and request that administrators wait before possibly deleting Vladimir Putin quotes, please affix the template {{hangon}} to the page, and put a note on its talk page. If the article has already been deleted, see the advice and instructions at WP:WMD. Please note that this bot is only informing you of the nomination for speedy deletion; it did not nominate Vladimir Putin quotes itself. Feel free to leave a message on the bot operator's talk page if you have any questions about this or any problems with this bot. --Android Mouse Bot 2 01:10, 5 July 2007 (UTC)

Please do NOT copy and paste content to rename pages--use the Move tab

The PRIMA (news agency) article page should have been Moved to Prima (news agency)--not transfered via cut&paste. Using cut&paste separates the content from its edit history, which is a problem with the GFDL license, among other things, which admins then have to clean up. Thanks. Seattlenow 20:41, 12 July 2007 (UTC)

It was impossible to move PRIMA to Prima. Misplaced Pages considers them to be one and the same page for the purpose of movement. It is impossible to change capitalization via movement. Thanks. Colchicum 08:42, 13 July 2007 (UTC)

If that was correct, how do you explain "21:05, 2007 July 12 Mattbr (Talk | contribs) m (moved PRIMA (news agency) to Prima (news agency): Merging histories" in the history? I've moved pages between different capitalizations previously with no problems. If you have problems moving a page in the future, I would suggest you post it at Misplaced Pages:Requested moves#Uncontroversial proposals instead of resorting to cut&paste. Thanks Seattlenow 19:01, 13 July 2007 (UTC)

Ok. I don't know what was wrong, but then I got a message "Source and destination titles are the same; can't move a page over itself" Colchicum 19:23, 13 July 2007 (UTC)

Vyborg translation, pt. 2

Hei! It's taken me a heck of a long time to get back to you, but this translation seems to still be undone. Would you still like me to do it? I also have a question on the section Kaupungit, kauppalat ja kunnat vuonna 1939; would you happen to know what the names of these should be in the English translation? Thanks! -Yupik 13:15, 15 July 2007 (UTC)

Domiziana Giordano

Special:Contributions/DomizianaGiordano Colchicum 11:44, 18 July 2007 (UTC)

FAR nominations

Hi, Colchicum. I noticed you made two FAR nominations back-to-back. Please have a look at the instructions at the top of WP:FAR, particularly:

• Please post only one FAR request at a time.
• Please improve an article that you nominate for review to the best of your ability.

The concern is that no one WikiProject be overwhelmed by multiple FARs at once, as that may strain resources to improve the article. By nominating two Russia-related articles at once, it may make it harder for regular editors in that topic area to work on the articles. I hope you'll be able to pitch in on those articles, or any of the articles nominated at FAR. Thanks, SandyGeorgia (Talk) 21:15, 18 July 2007 (UTC)

Ok, I thought that "at a time" meant that one should not nominate several articles in the same nomination. Colchicum 09:28, 19 July 2007 (UTC)

Award of the Soaring Swallow

The WikiProject Estonia has determined that you deserve the Award of the Soaring Swallow:

Award of the Soaring Swallow to Colchicum for outstanding contributions to Estonia-related articles 25 July 2007 from WikiProject Estonia Digwuren (diff), Sander Säde (diff), Alexia Death (diff), E.J. (diff), Suva (diff)

Yours clerkishly, Digwuren 15:52, 25 July 2007 (UTC)

And boy do you deserve it :) --Alexia Death 16:03, 25 July 2007 (UTC)

Thanks! Colchicum 10:04, 26 July 2007 (UTC)

Timelines

Hi Colchicum. I noticed you are making timeline of post-Soviet Russia. Are you going to improve Timeline of Russian history or have other plans?Biophys 21:52, 25 July 2007 (UTC)

I was going to make a separate timeline for this period (and also for the Russian Civil War and for the Soviet external relations in 1922-1941), but it looks like a good idea to improve this one, thanks. Colchicum 10:04, 26 July 2007 (UTC)

It is a good idea to make more detailed separate timelines because Timeline of Russian history is enormously long. I think that Russian Civil War article has a serious gap: it represents this war as a fight of "whites" and "reds", whereas a majority of victims were peasants killed in numerous rebellions (primarily against "reds", see "Harvest of sorrow"). We probably need an article about Peasant war in Russia.Biophys 16:53, 26 July 2007 (UTC)

Well, I am too lazy to write an article, but a timeline should be an easy way. Yes, info on peasant revolts and secessionist political entities is absolutely necessary.Colchicum 17:56, 26 July 2007 (UTC)

sova-center

Please refrain from further vandalasing this page by removing information that you don't like, otherwise I will have to report you to WP administration.--Ram2006 18:27, 29 July 2007 (UTC)

• I guess you meant SOVA Center. Removing unreferenced POV information and original research does not constitute vandalism. Please avoid abusing the term vandalism as it is constitutes Personal attack Alex Bakharev 00:50, 30 July 2007 (UTC)

Former Finnish municipalitys in Russia

You have started articles Usadishche, Vyborgsky District, Leningrad Oblast (Finnish Kintere) and Pionerskoye (Finnish Kuolemajärvi (kirkonkylä)). I have already change the Usadishche Finnish name from Vahviala to Kintere. And there is lot of mistakes in Pionerskoye. In Pionerskoye there is no railwaystation. Krasnaya Dolina is not same village than Pionerskoye and its Finnish name is Akkala and its located south from Pionerskoye. Ryabovo is south from Akkala and in Ryabovo (Finnish Pentikkälä) there is railwaystation (Kuolemajärvi). Before Winter War Pentikkälä/Ryabobo, Kuolemajärven kirkonkylä/Pionerskoye and Akkala/Krasnaya Dolina were part of Kuolemajärvi municipality in Finland. The municipalitys administrative center was Pionerskoye. So what is your source in these articles? Anyway its full of mistakes. --Kyzyl 21:41, 12 August 2007 (UTC)

New Article Bot

Hi, Colcicum. I thought you might like a little feedback for the literature new article bot you set up. I wrote the article William Joseph Snelling yesterday, and somehow your bot instructions list missed him. Here's the text from the log:

Article William Joseph Snelling matched rule \Wpoet 10 points

Lead of the article William Joseph Snelling matched rule \Wpoet 20 points
Article William Joseph Snelling matched rule \Wwriter 10 points
Lead of the article William Joseph Snelling matched rule \Wwriter 20 points
Article William Joseph Snelling matched rule \Wcritic 10 points
Article William Joseph Snelling matched rule Category:]*\Wpoet 30 points
Article William Joseph Snelling matched rule Category:]*\Wwriters\W 30 points
Article William Joseph Snelling matched rule journalist -10 points

Lead of the article William Joseph Snelling matched rule journalist -20 points

It seems that Snelling met a lot of the criteria but was, in the end, kicked out because of his journalism background. I'm guessing you were catching a bunch of journalists by accident and added in those exceptions? It might be worth looking back into, since Snelling is primarily known as a writer today. Like I said, just a little feedback! Hope it helps. — Brian (talk) 22:41, 14 August 2007 (UTC)

D'oh! Snelling is in fact on the new results page for literature. It was the Massachusetts bot instructions that didn't pick him out. Here's the log:

Total 12 points

Article William Joseph Snelling matched rule \Wmassachusetts 10 points
Article William Joseph Snelling matched rule \Wboston 7 points

Article William Joseph Snelling matched rule \Wnew\syork -2 points

The instructions list doesn't seem to be looking for categories with "Boston" in their name, and many of these don't have "Massachusetts" in their name too. Hope this helps, and sorry for the confusion! — Brian (talk) 23:27, 14 August 2007 (UTC)

Could you take a look at History of Russians in Estonia?

Hello - the headline says it all: could you take a look at History of Russians in Estonia, please? A little while ago, user Fisenko (talk · contribs) went over it, allegedly using "Kahk J., Palamets H., Vahtre S. "Estee NVS Ajaloost Lisamaterjali VII-VIII Klassi NVS Liidu Ajaloo Kursuse Juurde 7. Trukk" Tallin: "Valgus", 1974" as a source - but considering how many spelling errors he made even in the name of that booklet, I doubt he was actually using it as a source. Also, a Soviet mid-school book textbook from the height of Russification really isn't a source I would trust. As I don't have an access to many history-related sources (working towards improving that, though), his edits and that page in general could use some critical fact- and source-checking. Sander Säde 05:20, 15 August 2007 (UTC)

Riihimäki-Saint Petersburg railroad

Thanks for creating Riihimäki-Saint Petersburg railroad. This has been missing for a long time. I was planning to expand the article, but ended up writing about the Russian frigate Rurik (1851) instead :-) -- Petri Krohn 22:50, 20 August 2007 (UTC)

Move

Hi there! I would like to voice my disagreement with this move. The page in question deals only with 1708–1744 not because it was intended to, but because it was never expanded beyond 1744. We already have articles dealing with shorter periods of time between 1708 and 1744, so this one ends up neither here nor there. I'd appreciate your comments though. Thanks!—Ëzhiki (Igels Hérissonovich Ïzhakoff-Amursky) • (yo?); 15:10, 28 August 2007 (UTC)

Yes, I was planning to expand that article, but as of now I am still in the "planning to" phase, unfortunately... How about organizing these articles by centuries? What I mean is that we'll have one umbrella article ("History of administrative divisions of Russia") providing a brief summary covering all history (from the 17th century, or even earlier if anyone has the data, through present), which would link to a set of "Administrative divisions of Russia in ## century" articles, which, in turn, would link to composition lists for the periods of stability (1710–1713, for example). This way readers could drill down to the amount of detail they need, instead of being overwhelmed by a one huge article covering the 17th through 21st centuries containing a multitude of links to year-specific lists.

As for the 2002 Census, the populations of cities and towns under jurisdiction of federal subjects are never included into the totals of the administrative districts, but the populations of towns under jurisdiction of these districts are included (so, for example, the population count of Vyborgsky District would not include Vyborg itself, because it is an oblast-level town, but it would include Kamennogorsk, Primorsk, Svetogorsk, and Vysotsk, because these are the district-level towns). If you need to know which city/town is on which level, you can use administrative divisions of Leningrad Oblast. Hope this helps.—Ëzhiki (Igels Hérissonovich Ïzhakoff-Amursky) • (yo?); 19:19, 28 August 2007 (UTC)

DYK

On 30 August, 2007, Did you know? was updated with a fact from the article Nikolay Kruchina, which you created or substantially expanded. If you know of another interesting fact from a recently created article, then please suggest it on the Did you know? talk page.

--Peta 23:57, 30 August 2007 (UTC)

DYK

Did you know? was updated. On 3 September, 2007, a fact from the article Estonian Ruhnu sheep, which you recently nominated, was featured in that section on the Main Page. If you know of another interesting fact from a recently created article, then please suggest it on the Did you know? talk page.

--Carabinieri 00:24, 3 September 2007 (UTC)

Did you know...

Did you know? was updated. On 3 September, 2007, a fact from the article history of emerging infectious diseases, which you recently nominated, was featured in that section on the Main Page. If you know of another interesting fact from a recently created article, then please suggest it on the Did you know? talk page.

--Allen3  12:27, 3 September 2007 (UTC)

Bald Cypress: Actually a type of Cypress

Just thought you might want to know that Bald Cypress is, in fact, a type of cypress tree. You may be interested to learn that the term "Cypress" is applied to all members of the Cypress FAMILY in taxonomical terms... not just the trees which are in the three "cypress-only" genuses. I hope that in the future you'll take a moment to actually read the pages you're linking to when you try and make a boldly assertive claim, because I like to see all people look less like morons. Thanks! —Preceding unsigned comment added by 74.135.194.227 (talk) 22:55, 4 September 2007 (UTC)

I know well enough what Bald Cypress is to make boldly assertive claims. The common names juggling is meaningless. Cypress is not a term, contrary to what you have just said, so it is applied to whatever you wish. Still, Taxodium is never referred to as just cypress, except maybe in some very informal discussions, wich might be ok in a newspaper, but not in Misplaced Pages. So Bald Cypress is not a Cypress, regardless of their taxonomic relationships, which I am perfectly aware of. No more than sea cabbage or skunk cabbage are sorts of cabbage. Thanks. Colchicum 23:13, 4 September 2007 (UTC)

Well, to be frank, it appears that Cypress is occasionally used to refer to Taxodium when disambiguated otherwise: . However, it is NOT a term and we have some guidelines in Misplaced Pages concerning this: WP:NC (flora). Colchicum 23:43, 4 September 2007 (UTC)

DYK September 6

Did you know? was updated. On 6 September, 2007, a fact from the article Kristjan Jaak Peterson, which you recently nominated, was featured in that section on the Main Page. If you know of another interesting fact from a recently created article, then please suggest it on the Did you know? talk page.

--Andrew c  14:18, 6 September 2007 (UTC)

Your user page

Thank you for helpful advice ("What is WP") at your user page. I agree with everything and especially like the first and last paragraphs. Let's use our time here more efficiently.Biophys 22:04, 6 September 2007 (UTC)

DYK

Did you know? was updated. On 8 September, 2007, a fact from the article Atmosphere of Mercury, which you recently nominated, was featured in that section on the Main Page. If you know of another interesting fact from a recently created article, then please suggest it on the Did you know? talk page.

---- Anonymous Dissident 02:56, 8 September 2007 (UTC)

Lean Construction

back in march '07, you left comments at the 'Lean Construction' article about its copyright issues. while that was solved, the issue regarding all those ads and links to private companies was never cleared up. it was only briefly mentioned in the discussion page that its a legitimate technique used for a legitimate company. but the WORDING of the article still reads like one big ad. it still promotes only 1 technique, giving no pros-and-cons or comparisons. it even names the exact companies to contact for their services. this is in addition to the format not being very encyclopedic. the user (Tabdelhamid) who created and worked most on the article isnt even around anymore. and in the 'what links here' page for the article, theres very few (5) links to it, which should indicate something. ive listed this article in the Misplaced Pages:Cleanup project, due to the ads. perhaps u might want be a character witness in case the idea to delete the article comes up. thanks. 4.230.162.237 03:14, 9 September 2007 (UTC)

Well, frankly, I don't remember anything about that particular article. The idea to clean it up is ok with me, but I am an inclusionist and almost never vote for deletion (maybe only unless there is some misrepresentation of the sources). Colchicum 14:19, 9 September 2007 (UTC)

RFA?

I remain impressed with the quality and integrity of your work, and believe you'd make a good administrator. Would you care to be nominated? Digwuren 12:43, 10 September 2007 (UTC)