Misplaced Pages

Revision as of 00:58, 27 November 2007

• To leave me a message, click here. To email me, click here.
• Respond where the discussion started, please.
• /Archive 1, /Archive 2, /Archive 3, /Archive 4, /Archive 5, /Archive 6.

arbitration

Thanks for the update on the arbitration. Who do I ask for clarification about the meaning of the instruction? My concern is that the other party may take this instruction as a license to own articles; do I need to avoid any article he edits, and stop editing whatever articles I edit if he edits them too? csloat 06:54, 8 November 2007 (UTC)

This is always an issue with this sort of remedy - how are common interests divvied up? I don't have an answer, but you can ask at Misplaced Pages:Requests for arbitration#Requests for clarification. Picaroon (t) 16:49, 8 November 2007 (UTC)

Sorry

Sorry, it was an obvious edit to make. Nobody can have any quarrel with the actual edit, but having me make it, of course ... Smallbones 03:44, 11 November 2007 (UTC)

FallingRain.com Maps

I note that you have deleted the link to http://fallingrain.com/world from the Ajaokuta page. This is a pity, since FallingRain shows things not so clearly showing on other Internet mapping programs such as topography and contours, airports and railways, and small and large thumbnail sketches to help you navigate.

FallingRain Maps are accessable by name of town rather than by longitude and latitude, which means that it does not appear to be accessible from the Coordinates: Missing latitude
Invalid arguments have been passed to the {{#coordinates:}} function link. It would be helpful if someone could solve this missing link.

It has to be said that the railways at Ajaokuta do not appear to be on any map, because it has not caught up with recent changes. However, that is the exception.

Please reconsider your deletion.

Tabletop 09:02, 12 November 2007 (UTC)

The map is already linked, as a reference. Take a look at your revision - the same link is present on two occasions. Picaroon (t) 21:43, 12 November 2007 (UTC)

Hi again

Hi, Picaroon. The discussion on the Mao: The Unknown Story article died down after some issues were resolved, but the matter of the external link wasn't resolved. Giovanni then went away for about a week, so, given he didn't answer any of my points (or indeed any of Folic Acid's in a proper fashion), I removed the link. He then came back just to say "I'm sort of on wikibreak" so it would take him time to get back to me. Yet he conveniently came back to revert the page in a matter of hours.

I feel Giovanni is trying to avoid the matter because he has a revert advantage and hopes that I'll get bored - or he just doesn't care because he can keep the link in by reverting me once a week. What can I do? He's shown that he won't back down in discussion over this particular link despite the fact the points I raised were pretty conclusive, mediation didn't work and arbitration doesn't resolve content disputes. So what is there left to do? I even left a message on the book/literature project but no one seems interested. Please leave your response on my talk page. John Smith's 22:44, 12 November 2007 (UTC)

I only have access to the information in the link and on the article talk page. John Smith's 07:43, 13 November 2007 (UTC)

Signpost updated for November 5th and 12th, 2007.

Weekly Delivery

You are receiving this message because you have signed up for the Signpost spamlist. If you wish to stop receiving these messages, simply remove your name from the list. Ralbot 08:10, 13 November 2007 (UTC)

ok then

Ok then. But I still believe he shouldn't get to decide about something like that. It's not his userspace, after all. — Dorftrottel⁠ 18:09, 14 November 2007 (UTC)

Maybe you want to revert again, on the same grounds, that still hold, I suppose? — Dorftrottel⁠ 02:10, 15 November 2007 (UTC)

DALMATIA

It is going worst and worst. I really need to tell something. It is my right to be protected by a moderator, from insults, personal attacks, edit wars, and reverts, by a group of several users. If you can do nothing, at least tell my what I shall do. --Giovanni Giove 23:23, 14 November 2007 (UTC)

Huh? Can you please provide me with some context to this comment? Picaroon (t) 23:53, 14 November 2007 (UTC)

Macedonia ArbCom

Hi Picaroon, if I want to comment on other people's statements I should edit my comment on the main page or I take it to the Workshop page?--   Avg    01:50, 15 November 2007 (UTC)

If you want to respond to another user's statement, start a new section with a title like "Response to user X" at Misplaced Pages talk:Requests for arbitration/Macedonia. Once people have begun providing evidence at /Evidence, you can respond to their evidence in your own section as described in the header their. At /workshop, comments usually aren't too long, so inline responses are fine. That page can get crowded, however, which is why I asked you to use a short signature for commenting at it. Picaroon (t) 01:54, 15 November 2007 (UTC)

Yes I've noted that thanks. If I may ask, do you feel my signature violates WP:SIG or this is a recommendation for this page only?.--   Avg    02:00, 15 November 2007 (UTC)

Unsure whether it violates that policy. It's certainly not as long as many, but nevertheless contains significant unnecessary html markup. I'd recommend you try shortening it - maybe aim for 3/4 of what you've got now? Picaroon (t) 02:12, 15 November 2007 (UTC)

NYBrad

He started the harassing Arb Com, so all i said was the truth. 17:46, 15 November 2007 (UTC)

Re: Pidgin

Nice to meet you, finally! I've been seeing you on Nigeria-related articles for quite some time now. I think that we've run into each other on Talk:Nigerian All Peoples Party before.

I don't know of any real pidgin words referring to sports in general; there are sports analogies in pidgin all the time (e.g., "who wetin go win de prize" etc) and of course people like to praise the Super Eagles as a way of displaying patriotism, but the closest that I can think of to what you want are Yoruba and Igbo words that are used for games in general, sporting or of any other variety.

Sorry that I couldn't offer more, but I'm not sure that any real pidgin term exists in modern usage, at least not in the Lagos or Kano areas. Anywhere else in the country, I can't speak for.

I wish that I had more time to devote to the language articles. I tried working on Nigerian music articles about a year ago but could find very little good info that was from a properly reliable source. There are plenty of podcasts, free websites, and blogs that describe the history of Naija hip hop, for instance, but none of them are reliable sources and I haven't been able to find any books on the subject. I can keep hoping that Newswatch prints something, I guess.

Nice to meet you, again! Heather 01:33, 16 November 2007 (UTC)

User page vandalism

Hey, I'm sorry! I completely forgot to thank you for reverting the vandalism on my user page a couple days ago. :) Anyway, thanks! GlassCobra 05:31, 16 November 2007 (UTC)

Intimidation by User:Giovanni33

I'm sorry I had to do this, but I'd like to report Giovanni for intimidation and false revert parole warnings. He challenged me to undo this edit on my talk page and the article discussion page, claiming it was a reversion. He complained that this edit was also a reversion.

I responded that my edit on the 14th November was not a reversion at all - it was a clarification. User:Cripipper had made a point on 7th November about a supposed abscence of any public response to criticism of the book. I provided fresh material that updated it to what was correct. If Cripipper had objected and changed it further, another edit by myself probably would have counted as a revert. But he agreed with it. Revert parole is designed to stop edit warring, not working out problems between users. As I have said before, if we hold to Giovanni's logic then every edit on wikipedia is a revert. That is complete nonsense.

I'd ask that you take Giovanni in hand and stop him from making warnings like this. I see them as a means of intimidating and controlling the actions of other users. I don't even think my edit today was a revert, as I was merely updating the section to conform with that on the main article. How is that a revert and what have I reverted to? Giovanni never explains any of that, just tries to bully people to get his way. Clearly that is very much against the spirit of Misplaced Pages and a poor way to interact with other users. John Smith's 10:56, 16 November 2007 (UTC)

I'm looking over this now, will respond at AE shortly. Picaroon (t) 23:27, 16 November 2007 (UTC)

I have filed a complaint against Giovanni on the page for making a second revert and throwing out the consensus reached on Mao: The Unknown Story between myself, him and BigTimePeace. I'm sure he will claim it's a different page, but the section on Jung Chang has always been closely linked. He's now trying to change it arbitrarily because BigTimePeace has gone on wikibreak. John Smith's (talk) 11:23, 17 November 2007 (UTC)

You comment at the Dbachmann RfC

Just wanted to say thank you, as I believe you've framed the problem and our expectations better than I could have. Your input is very much appreciated.--Ramdrake (talk) 00:53, 17 November 2007 (UTC)

You're welcome. If he agrees to my suggestions, I ask that you guys try to put past disputes, both on content and interpersonal issues, behind you, and work for compromise versions on the articles in question. None of the four of you have malicious intentions - which is more than I can say for several editors who've been shown the door with indefinite blocks in the last few months. Picaroon (t) 01:05, 17 November 2007 (UTC)

If he agrees, you have my word that I will do my best to convince the others to discuss differences in editorial views as correctly as they should be discussed on Wikpedia. I'd just like him to make an effort at discussing opposing views based on sourced material rather than based on personal opinions. Right now, what I find hurts the credibility of his positions most on these article is the fact that he doesn't seem to want to bother presenting sources to back up his positions, while I regularly see the other authors backing up their edits with sources (those may later come under debate - but at least there's a source).--Ramdrake (talk) 01:12, 17 November 2007 (UTC)

Anime South

The deleting admin states that I am not allowed to re-create this article under any circumstance because I am involved with the article. -Animesouth (talk) 02:30, 17 November 2007 (UTC)

Misplaced Pages:Requests for arbitration/Stefanomencarelli closed

Copyedit from my "talk" page: "The above-linked arbitration case has been closed. Stefanomencarelli is banned from Misplaced Pages for one year. For the Arbitration Committee, Picaroon (t) 02:43, 18 November 2007 (UTC)."

I hope that Stefanomencarelli will eventually return to en.Misplaced Pages and grow to be one of the editors who can provide substantial contributions to some of the obscure articles that he initiated and developed. FWIW Bzuk (talk) 02:51, 18 November 2007 (UTC).

I agree. He is obviously knowledgeable, and he has the potential to become a positive presence, if only he would edit within our policies and respond to constructive criticism of his actions - this is why I proposed mentorship as an alternative to banning, to try to minimize his violations of policy while helping him contribute content more efficiently. Picaroon (t) 03:03, 18 November 2007 (UTC)

Despite this finding which I still regard as largely a case of "You've made your bed, now lie in it," I for one, would like to thank you and the members of the arbitration committee for the reasoned and principled delberations and efforts to provide a solution to this (and other contentious issues). Although I did not know exactly what the process entailed, all the members of the ARBCOM have endeavoured to assist me and other interested parties in finding a resolution. I reiterate that I wish Stefano well and hope to see the time when he can be welcomed back. FWIW Bzuk (talk) 03:40, 18 November 2007 (UTC).

Re: Certified.Gangsta

Yes, please leave it in place for the time being. Thanks! Kirill 19:16, 18 November 2007 (UTC)

Ethiopian names

Hi Picaroon:

At: http://en.wikipedia.org/User_talk:Altzinn, he is correct about Ethiopian names. Also, Ethiopian women do not take the names of their husbands. Their second names are their fathers' names.

Thanks! Aberra Molla (talk) 05:05, 19 November 2007 (UTC)

To do

• Do something with http://www.guardiannewsngr.com/friday_review/article02
• Write article on Ahmadu Ali
• Expand Association of Nigerian Authors

--Picaroon (t) 03:14, 20 November 2007 (UTC)

Signpost updated for November 19th, 2007.

Weekly Delivery

You are receiving this message because you have signed up for the Signpost spamlist. If you wish to stop receiving these messages, simply remove your name from the list. Ralbot (talk) 10:33, 20 November 2007 (UTC)

Your comment

Thank you for clarifying the IP here. I'm too familiar with him and easily understand his style and ips. Actually, i'm not reverting his edits all the time, i only revert if he puts unsourced statements or irrelevant references to unsourced statements. That's the case in Turko-Persian tradition. I'm working on that article for a very long time, trying to improve its status to good article candidate. Regards. E104421 (talk) 12:12, 21 November 2007 (UTC)

• Is this Tajik? The edit-styles are quite similar. In the first edit , he deleted Azerbaijan. In the second one , he added classical Ottoman, since his aim is overshadow the Turkic. In the third one , he pushed the Shahnameh naming as if it's the only important one. He claims that since Shahnameh is in Persian, everthing in it is Persian. On the other hand, the Shahnameh has a certain anti-Turk bias (Igor Mikhailovich Diakonov. The Paths of History, Cambridge University Press, 1999, p. 100, ISBN 0521643988). In the fourth one , he reverted to his previous version which pushes Arabic-Persian traditions as if Turko-Persian. This time the ip range is different but the style is the same. What do you think on that? Regards. E104421 (talk) 19:36, 22 November 2007 (UTC)

  Certainly seems like him, so I've reverted and blocked. Whoever was behind that IP has definitely been here before. Based on their knowledge of Misplaced Pages and their point of view, Tajik is the most likely culprit. Even if it isn't him, no one should be logging out to make reverts, so the block is necessary regardless. Picaroon (t) 19:46, 22 November 2007 (UTC)

• Yes, they are definitely related. Thank you. In addition, the user de:Benutzer:Postmann Michael in German Misplaced Pages who is banned infinitely for POV aus zweifelhaften Quellen, Verharmlosung des Nationalsozialismus. Schadet der Misplaced Pages seems to be Tajik-related along with de:Benutzer:Phoenix2 and de:Benutzer:Tajik. All these give an impression that Tajik causes same kind of problematic issues in both German and English Wikipedias. Regards. E104421 (talk) 13:51, 26 November 2007 (UTC)

Wrong information. de:Benutzer:Phoenix2 is a medical student from Hamburg and is not related to Tajik (de:Benutzer:Tajik) who studies Islamic history. Both of them are at the University of Hamburg (along with me). German admins have confirmed this. In case of de:Benutzer:Postmann Michael, you either got your information wrong or you are purposely misleading the admin. Postmann Michael was a Turkish nationalist and he was permanently banned because of Turkish nationalist POV (ask User:Elian, a.k.a. admin de:Benutzer:Elian). Postmann Michael is allied to de:Benutzer:Westthrakientürke, another disruptive Turkish nationalist and POV-pusher. He is known by the name User:Moorudd in the English Misplaced Pages (as he confirms on his German user page: ) and he is currently vandalizing various articles as IP-socks: 85.178.179.115, 85.178.149.27, 85.178.185.30, 85.178.131.182, 85.178.148.58, etc. An easy checkuser file can confirm that (I frankly ask admin Picaroon to check that).

What is also interesting is that your edits are almost the same as those of User:Moorudd (a.k.a. de:Benutzer:Westthrakientürke). They are perfectly matched, and you always show up to revert to his version (= meatpuppet). You share the same anti-Persian views. That's why you have blindly reverted here, and why you deleted this (although this information was linked to a Google books reference). That's very disruptive, E104421.

• Tajik, you're wrong. It's not diffucult to compare the articles German and English Misplaced Pages. Since it's well-known that you're from Germany and you edit German Misplaced Pages, too. I searched the edit histories and compared them. That's why they seemed to be suspicious. You're banned by the arbitration committee along with your sockpuppet German-Orientalist and the anonymous ips. Your block will reset each time you edit under different names (see this). You're making your case even worse. Regards. E104421 (talk) 16:55, 26 November 2007 (UTC)

Btw, User:Tajik, along with User:Beh-nam posted several spam-like messages on several users talk pages. As happened, ,,,, . Regards. E104421 (talk) 17:07, 26 November 2007 (UTC)

E102241, I really do not care if you still believe that I am Tajik or not. It's your right to believe whatever you want. But here, you are purposely misleading the admin, claiming that Tajik is the same user as a Turkish-nationalist POV pusher who was not only banned because of his Turkish bias, but also because he glorified the Third Reich. You could simply ask User:Elian (the one who banned Postmann Michael). What you are doing here is spreading wrong accusations against Tajik. It is known to everyone that you and the "Turkish block" were very happy that Tajik was banned (very obviously because of wrong accusations, as checkuser has proved). But do you still need to spread wrong accusations? I also find it very interesting that you are so well informed about the German Misplaced Pages, although you do not speak a word German (sollte das nicht der Fall sein, so bitte ich um Entschuldigung). It is very obvious that you are coordinating your moves with User:Moorudd (or his IP socks). So basically, you are a meatpuppet of the German user de:Benutzer:Westthrakientürke. A simple checkuser file can prove that the mentioned IPs are IP socks of User:Moorudd, the one who is giving you instructions (for example your coordinated edits in Babur or Timur). And if that it confirmed, User:Moorudd and and his IP socks need to get banned in accordance with Misplaced Pages rules. Also keep in mind that you are not allowed to have more than one revert in all Turkish- or Iranian-related articles. You are on a 1RR parole because of edit warring and disruptive behaviour.

• Tajik, your comments are ridiculous. Check the ip of the mails i sent to you for the Tajik-Professor case and compare with Germany ips, and see the difference in kilometers. Regards. E104421 (talk) 17:14, 26 November 2007 (UTC)

You have to ask Tajik. I did not receive any E-Mails from you. All I know is that you are well informed about the "internal fights" between Phoenix2 and Westthrakientürke. And that could only be through a direct contact to Westthrakientürke. Your coordinated moves in Misplaced Pages (you reverted to his version in the Babur article, you reverted to his version in the Timur article, he is removing references to Persian culture and language, you are deleting references to Persian culture and language, you reverted to his version in the Seljuqs page, etc.) only point to that fact: that you and Westthrakientürke (a.k.a. User:Moorudd a.k.a. various 85.xxx.xxx IPs) are coordinating your edits. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 82.83.133.46 (talk) 17:25, 26 November 2007 (UTC)

• Take a bottle of Vodka and drink. Tomorrow come to my talk page, when you become Tajik again. E104421 (talk) 17:31, 26 November 2007 (UTC)

If that's all you have to say, E104421. I am anxious to see the results of checkuser. I hope that Picaroon files checkuser in case of User:Moorudd and the strange IPs in order to clear things out. Once checkuser has proved Moorudds suckpuppet abuse and vandalism, and once he gets banned, you and me can sit together and drink some grünen Tee (I do not drink alcoholic drinks).

Oh my God, it is the same as in German wikipedia. (I followed the link of 82.83/Tajik as I often do to protect Misplaced Pages from nationalistic falsifications or violations of copyrights by User:Tajik (see or ) and so I found this page) If User:Tajik a.k.a. de:Benutzer:Phoenix2 is really a medical student, I think, he strictly must medicate at first himself.
It is the same madhouse-style as in German wikipedia. (I am mostly at German wikipedia not so much here in English.) I have nothing to do with Michael Postmann. It is almost always lies by Tajik to discredit the others to be free to make the edits that moslty are forged, selective citations and copyright violations. The only aim is to make the Turkic or Turkish identity as not existent. This is what Persian nationalists have to do to declare Central Asian history "free of Turks" and consequently "Persian dominated".
In German wikipedia the block log of Tajik/Phoenix2 is full because of lies and verbal slanders (see here), he also made disruptive use of sock puppet (see his most commonly known sock puppet de:Benutzer:Christoffel whom he did not need anymore in the last time period because his main combatant (Michael Postmann) has been blocked because of Phoenix' falsified messages. After the Postmann-block Tajik could conveniently falsify the Turkic central asian history so he did not need Christoffel anymore. But in the last time period other users in German wp has discovered his falsifying character of articles)
Finally, also in German wikipedia he has been warned that he will be blocked indefinitely if he does not change his (madhouse-like) style.
His sentence German admins have confirmed this (that de:Benutzer:Tajik would not be his sock puppet) is again a falsification. German admins have confirmed nothing. He does not write often as Tajik in German WP why should the admins confirm anything? and where is the diff link to prove this allegation? (It is the same as in German WP: 95% of the unsourced allegations of Tajik/82.83./Phoenix2 are lies to discredit his "enemies".) It is the opposite in German WP: Actually the German admins are thinking about indefinitely blocking him. 85.178.185.30 (talk) 19:49, 26 November 2007 (UTC)

Well, well, well, de:Benutzer:Wetsthrakientürke a.k.a. User:Moorudd a.k.a. different 85.xxx.xxx ... finally you have shown up. Now Picaroon should check your IP. You need to explain to us why you are vandalizing with your IP socks. Where is your proof that de:Benutzer:Christoffel is sockpuppet?! Where is the diff?! Maybe you should medicate yourself (wait a minute - you are not a doctor. So you need professional help.) Out of frustration that the German Misplaced Pages categorizes the Armenian Genocide as a genocide, you went mad and began to vandalize other articles, claiming that "all Germans have a sick mentality" and that "Germany is denying a genocide in Africa" . And your friend de:Benutzer:Danyalov calls all Kurds "Neanderthals" . This is what you people are and what you people represent: a bunch of racists filled with hate, writing propaganda against everyone who is against you: Kurds, Armenians, Persians, and now even Germans. Postmann Michael was no different. That'S why he was permanently banned. But why doesn't it surprise me that you and E104421 are supporting him and the rest of the gang?!

I think it is your insane brain, that brings you to think only in dimensions of "supporters" and "enemies". In Misplaced Pages exclusively the arguments do count. Nothing else. and this is the reason that no one accepts your claims "that everyone who does not support your theses is an enemy" of you. They laugh at you at German wikipedia. see your insane vandalism message (whole German wikipedia laughed at you) or the classification of you by an admin.

Sorry it is impossible to work for an encyclopedia with racistic feelings against Turks, Mongols and in fact against anyone who does not support your insane private theses for those you abuse the wikipedia platform, Tajik. 85.178.185.30 (talk) 21:18, 26 November 2007 (UTC)

Happy Thanksgiving!

I just wanted to wish my fellow Wikipedians a Happy Thanksgiving! Sincerely, --Le Grand Roi des Citrouilles 17:15, 22 November 2007 (UTC)

Musharraf

what's your problem —Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.182.26.234 (talk) 23:24, 24 November 2007 (UTC)

Please help

Please help stop this fool/troll. <sigh> - Jeeny 05:08, 25 November 2007 (UTC)

Blocked. Picaroon (t) 05:11, 25 November 2007 (UTC)

Thanks. :) - Jeeny 05:15, 25 November 2007 (UTC)

He's back. 222.153.110.86 (talk · contribs) - Jeeny 06:22, 25 November 2007 (UTC)

Someone else got him, but I've extended the block to a week. I'm going to look into a rangeblock. Picaroon (t) 19:59, 25 November 2007 (UTC)

As per Dmcdevit's go-ahead a few days ago, I've blocked 222.153.0.0/16 for 48 hours - tell me if Hayden manages to get through. Picaroon (t) 20:07, 25 November 2007 (UTC)

OK, thanks. I think he's more active on the weekends anyway. - Jeeny 22:23, 25 November 2007 (UTC)

Help me, I'm drowning. - Jeeny 11:32, 26 November 2007 (UTC)

Evidentiary procedures

Hi, I have just posted to

• Misplaced Pages:Requests for arbitration/Episodes and characters/Evidence

I would appreciate any procedural advice you can offer. If there are any conflict of interest concerns, I will understand. Thanks, Jack Merridew 08:38, 26 November 2007 (UTC)

Your talk page

I'm sorry for carrying Tajik here. I hope you do not mind the cluttering above. Regards. E104421 (talk) 17:17, 26 November 2007 (UTC)

See it the way you want, E104421. Fact is that you are actively working and coordinating your edits with IP-sockpuppets of User:Moorudd. You have also - once again - vandalized the article Timurid dynasty, removing authoritative sources. It was certainly a good decision to put you on a 1RR parole, since your edits are disruptive. The history of that article clearly proves that your edits are coordinated with those of the IP socks: . Both of you revert to the same wrong version, removing authoritative sources. You have even ignored the discussion with User:Ali_doostzadeh.

• I'm getting bored of these ip reverters. I'll stop replying these messages, since it's not useful to take into account of the banned users comments. Sorry for bothering you. Regards. E104421 (talk) 23:29, 26 November 2007 (UTC)

  No need for apologies, I've blocked his latest address. Have you tried reporting to WP:AIV for when I'm not online? Quote this comment from me: "Admins reading this quote, please block any IP in the "82.83.0.0/16 range that is being disruptive on Central Asia articles and is accused of being banned user Tajik by E104421, because these IPs are without fail him (Tajik). Thanks, Picaroon". Picaroon (t) 00:58, 27 November 2007 (UTC)