| Revision as of 08:49, 17 July 2005 editBlankVerse (talk | contribs)15,891 edits →[]← Previous edit | Revision as of 02:41, 19 July 2005 edit undoRaul654 (talk | contribs)70,896 edits I resign as Netoholic's mentorNext edit → | ||
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| ==Comments by Mentors== | ==Comments by Mentors== | ||
| ===Comment by ]=== | |||
| (Sent on 7/18/2005 to the Arbitration Committee mailing list; CC'd to Kim Bruning and Netoholic) | |||
| I resign as Netoholic's mentor. With Grunt inactive, this means Netoholic has no mentors. | |||
| I do this because I believe the mentorship - at least in its current form - is not working. I believe then, that this leaves two options: probation as Fred described it or the original remedy, the namespace prohibition, described in the arbitration committee's Netoholic2 ruling. | |||
| I believe would be the better choice in this case - it would still allow Netoholic to edit what he likes to edit while giving the admins the ability to stop him if he should cause problems. The primary problem with the mentorship was that the mentors were the only ones with the ability to stop netoholic from editing | |||
| inflammatorily; if we were unaware of the problem, it went unresolved (which it often did). As such, I think it would be better to give this ability to the community of admins at large. | |||
| In the meantime, I think it would be possible to offer Netoholic a kind of informal mentorship. We would assign to Netoholic something akin to what the mafia call a consigliere - http://en.wikipedia.org/Consigliere. The mentor/consigliere would be there entirely in an advisorial role; not to punish or reprobate him, but to answer his questions and give him advice (and also possibly to act as a mediary for Netoholic and/or as a neutral voice in his disputes). Obviously, the onus is then on Netoholic to use the mentor - it is *not* the mentor's job to act as his "lookout", so to speak. As it is my idea, I am - reluctantly - willing to do it (if no one else can be found). | |||
| ] 02:41, July 19, 2005 (UTC) | |||
| === Commentary by ] === | === Commentary by ] === | ||
Revision as of 02:41, 19 July 2005
This page is primarily a central place for me and my mentors (users Grunt, Raul654, Kim Bruning) to discuss things. It is also open to those who would like to provide notice to us about anything that comes up.
Current restrictions on Netoholic's editing
- Netoholic may not move Misplaced Pages:Transclusion_costs_and_benefits
Comments by Mentors
Comment by Raul654
(Sent on 7/18/2005 to the Arbitration Committee mailing list; CC'd to Kim Bruning and Netoholic)
I resign as Netoholic's mentor. With Grunt inactive, this means Netoholic has no mentors.
I do this because I believe the mentorship - at least in its current form - is not working. I believe then, that this leaves two options: probation as Fred described it or the original remedy, the namespace prohibition, described in the arbitration committee's Netoholic2 ruling.
I believe would be the better choice in this case - it would still allow Netoholic to edit what he likes to edit while giving the admins the ability to stop him if he should cause problems. The primary problem with the mentorship was that the mentors were the only ones with the ability to stop netoholic from editing inflammatorily; if we were unaware of the problem, it went unresolved (which it often did). As such, I think it would be better to give this ability to the community of admins at large.
In the meantime, I think it would be possible to offer Netoholic a kind of informal mentorship. We would assign to Netoholic something akin to what the mafia call a consigliere - http://en.wikipedia.org/Consigliere. The mentor/consigliere would be there entirely in an advisorial role; not to punish or reprobate him, but to answer his questions and give him advice (and also possibly to act as a mediary for Netoholic and/or as a neutral voice in his disputes). Obviously, the onus is then on Netoholic to use the mentor - it is *not* the mentor's job to act as his "lookout", so to speak. As it is my idea, I am - reluctantly - willing to do it (if no one else can be found).
→Raul654 02:41, July 19, 2005 (UTC)
Commentary by Kim Bruning
Usemod wisdom
Kim Bruning 19:16, 9 May 2005 (UTC)
Commentary by Grunt
I intend to use this section to log commentary relevant to my mentorship position. Feel free to edit at will. -- Grunt 🇪🇺 01:10, 2005 May 5 (UTC)
5 May 2005
As I value my opinion in my recent e-mail piece as much as I do, I'm going to post it here for the sake of posterity. -- Grunt 🇪🇺 01:10, 2005 May 5 (UTC)
- I am going to toss my two cents in here for the sake of doing so.
- My advice would be this: If you change for which you believe there is consensus, and it is changed back, your response should *not* be to implement the original change again - doing so will most likely result in the other person reverting your change again, leading to an edit war, which is bad and will only make yourself and your "opponent" mad. Instead, bring it up (again?) on the talk page and perhaps initiate something (a poll, an RFC) which will help you decide what the consensus is.
- If there's no clear consensus for either course of action, don't do anything, as your change is going to be opposed by the "other faction". If you really feel you must change something, try to make it something that is not going to incite a conflict.
- So, in this case, seeing as this is causing a lot of people a lot of grief, you should probably step back and let the community sort out the issue. Just bring attention to it in a relatively safe manner (if there's not already a lot of attention focused on it).
- It's my hope that we can all learn to get along here... after all, the energy you put in screaming at each other could much better be used writing article content.
- ~Grunt
Comments by Netoholic
Firebug and Omegatron
There are two users who have taken a rather obsessive stance with regards to me. They have in recent days repeatedly reverted tons of good (or at least good faith) edits on my part and continue to challenge and attack me. I'd like to ask the mentors to step in, and make contact with these two to find out what their issues are and hopefully get them to lay off.
- Firebug (talk · contributions)
- Has reverted many of my good changes to Misplaced Pages pages, intentionally voted against me and my nominations on WP:TFD.
- He's edited TFD exactly twice - once to make a nom and once to vote against something you nominated. One edit does not a pattern make. →Raul654 04:49, May 7, 2005 (UTC)
- Omegatron (talk · contributions)
- Makes it a point to try and belittle me and this mentorship. His last few edits to the Arbitration case pages show a desire not to allow this mentorship to work. He also has reverted edits of mine in recent days and "tattled" to whoever he thinks will listen.
Basically, I just want them to go their own way, and not make a point to insert themselves in my work. The manner in which they are doing it seems to show they're watching my contribs and finding ways to make my time here difficult. -- Netoholic @ 23:48, 2005 May 6 (UTC)
Template:Notpolicy
(copied from User talk:Raul654)
I don't feel that being a party to a revert war is a very good way to "mentor" me. If anyone have an issue with my edit, and I'm not explaining myself well, it is your responsibility to help me communicate. I think this applies if it is you that has an issue. Why didn't you try to talk to me first? Why didn't you make any use of the Talk page before reverting me? I hope you can see how I'm confused as to how you're going to help me on an on-going basis if you're not following the mentorship process. Neither you nor Firebug (which I reported to you as being a thorn in my side) made any attempt to discuss my edit. I made use of the talk page at the time I made the change in the first place (see Template talk:Notpolicy#Wording and formatting). I'm doing my part already. -- Netoholic @ 16:45, 2005 May 13 (UTC)
- It takes two to revert war. - Omegatron 18:54, May 13, 2005 (UTC)
- Insightful, if vague. I reverted that template exactly twice over the course of 3 days. Both reverts were when Firebug and Raul undid the change I explained on the talk page, without themselves bothering to explain their reasons there. Who is in the wrong here? -- Netoholic @ 19:18, 2005 May 13 (UTC)
Community comments
This section is only to be used to report ongoing problematic editing by Netoholic.
spoiler-other conversion
Please take a look at the recent edit histories of:
And tell me if you think these chnages, and the continued reverts to enforece them without discussion, a poll, or any attempt to reach consensus on the issue are appropriate. DES 29 June 2005 16:00 (UTC)
Template:Reqimage
{{reqimage}} has been that "monstrous piece of ugliness" for over a month. Why does Netoholic need to get into an revert war over that template when he has not participated at all in the discussion at Misplaced Pages talk:Template locations#Design and layout issues, nor has he participated at all in the discussion at Template talk:Reqimage until today. I HATE revert wars, and to have Netoholic paraphrase me as the justification for this most resent revert war has me doubly pissed off. Revert wars are a pox upon the Misplaced Pages and Netoholic is the prime warrior. BlankVerse ∅ 08:41, 17 July 2005 (UTC)