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Kevin ryan (whistleblower and folk hero)

A {{prod}} template has been added to the article Kevin ryan (whistleblower and folk hero), suggesting that it be deleted according to the proposed deletion process. All contributions are appreciated, but this article may not satisfy Misplaced Pages's criteria for inclusion, and the deletion notice explains why (see also "What Misplaced Pages is not" and Misplaced Pages's deletion policy). You may contest the proposed deletion by removing the {{dated prod}} notice, but please explain why you disagree with the proposed deletion in your edit summary or on its talk page. Also, please consider improving the article to address the issues raised. Even though removing the deletion notice will prevent deletion through the proposed deletion process, the article may still be deleted if it matches any of the speedy deletion criteria or it can be sent to Articles for Deletion, where it may be deleted if consensus to delete is reached. If you endorse deletion of the article, and you are the only person who has made substantial edits to the page, please tag it with {{db-author}}. GlassCobra (talk • contribs) 05:29, 27 August 2007 (UTC)

A tag has been placed on Kevin ryan (whistleblower and folk hero), requesting that it be speedily deleted from Misplaced Pages. This has been done because the article appears to be a repost of material that was previously deleted following a deletion debate, such as articles for deletion. If you can indicate how Kevin ryan (whistleblower and folk hero) is different from the previously posted material, or if you can indicate why this article should not be deleted, I advise you to place the template {{hangon}} underneath the other template on the article, and also put a note on Talk:Kevin ryan (whistleblower and folk hero) saying why this article should stay. An admin should check for such edits before deleting the article. Feel free to leave a note on my talk page if you have any questions about this. Please read our criteria for speedy deletion, particularly item 4 under General criteria. Please do not remove the speedy deletion tag yourself. We welcome your help in trying to improve Misplaced Pages, and we request you to follow these instructions. P4k 05:29, 27 August 2007 (UTC)

Please sign your posts

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AfD nomination of Architects and engineers for 9/11 truth

Architects and engineers for 9/11 truth, an article you created, has been nominated for deletion. We appreciate your contributions. However, an editor does not feel that Architects and engineers for 9/11 truth satisfies Misplaced Pages's criteria for inclusion and has explained why in the nomination space (see also "What Misplaced Pages is not" and the Misplaced Pages deletion policy). Your opinions on the matter are welcome; please participate in the discussion by adding your comments at Misplaced Pages:Articles for deletion/Architects and engineers for 9/11 truth and please be sure to sign your comments with four tildes (~~~~). You are free to edit the content of Architects and engineers for 9/11 truth during the discussion but should not remove the articles for deletion template from the top of the article; such removal will not end the deletion discussion. Thank you. P4k 08:10, 6 September 2007 (UTC)

Rescuing the info from the above deleted page

Wowest, I think this organization should be mentioned on the 9/11 Truth Movement page (just under the Scholars for 9/11 Truth and Justice). Since the AfD, I can't now access the page to get the info. Have you got a copy? Would you care to make it into a brief, sourced summary on that page? Corleonebrother 21:33, 17 September 2007 (UTC)

your style

you wrote "(Numerous sites on the internet point out that the "Osama bin Laden" on this video is NOT Osama bin Laden. The quality and color of his beard and the shape of his nose are a dead giveaway. The CIA not only botched the actor's appearance, but they didn't even get his script right and had to hoke up the translation as well)" on the article about the Bin Laden tapes. The information is indeed interesting and important, but while you employ such unencyclopediatric style it will be deleted for good. 'Numerous sites on the internet', for instance, is not a source; the CIA, actors and scripts belong to the domain of conspiracy theories, at least as long as the only basis for these daring assumptions are your honest words only. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 84.167.188.251 (talk) 00:52, 24 September 2007 (UTC)

Edits

Welcome to Misplaced Pages. Although everyone is welcome to make constructive contributions to Misplaced Pages, at least one of your recent edits, such as the one you made to Prem Rawat, did not appear to be constructive and has been reverted or removed. Please use the sandbox for any test edits you would like to make, and take a look at the welcome page to learn more about contributing to this encyclopedia. Thank you. ≈ jossi ≈ (talk) 14:57, 5 October 2007 (UTC)

BLP warning

You have made an edit to Talk:Teachings of Prem Rawat that could be regarded as defamatory. Please do not restore this material to the article or its talk page. If you do, you may be blocked for disruption. See the blocking policy. ≈ jossi ≈ (talk) 14:38, 8 October 2007 (UTC)

Use of article talk pages

Article talk pages are not a discussion forum or a chat room. Talk pages are provided to discuss improvements to the articles in Misplaced Pages. You can engage in private conversations, to some extent, in your personal talk page User_talk:Wowest, or the personal talk pages of editors. ≈ jossi ≈ (talk) 22:51, 8 October 2007 (UTC)

Request for clarification

I've been assuming that you, Rumiton and Momento are premies, engaging in the PROMOTION of Prem Rawat's business. I'm only requesting that you verify your own status, and I'm addressing you because you seem to be relatively sane. . To be as up-front as possible, I "received the Knowledge" of Prem Rawat in February of 1973. I rode in the back of a VW bug with Rennie Davis as he gave his sat sang about being attacked by a murder of crows for doubting the guru's divinity. I was in Detroit when the underground newspaper reporter hit the guru in the face with a shaving cream pie and was subsequently murdered. This is documented in Chapter Six of Sophia Collier's book "Soul Rush," although I don't think she knew the man actually died of a brain hemorrhage two weeks after the attack. I lived in a premie house with a woman who actually knew the reporter. I was injured at Millenium '73 while doing service in the kitchen, and sent home by my premie house because *I* now had medical bills. There my mother had me talk to a minister, and, later, to Ted Patrick. I was a total true believer. I tried to convert Ted Patrick to my beliefs. The result of that was that it took under twenty minutes for him to "deprogram" me. My original research now indicates that three of the four meditation techniques are likely to harm the people who practice them, but, of course, OR isn't acceptable on Wiki. . I've been away from Prem Rawat for years. Now, I'm surprised to see how things have changed. His brother's web site doesn't even acknowledge that Prem ever existed, and his brother used to support him. He also used to wear glasses, so I assume he's had surgery. . I feel a moral obligation to speak out against the teaching of these particular meditations, since I am convinced that they harm most people. Am I free to create my own article on meditation controversies as long as it's documented? . —Preceding unsigned comment added by Wowest (talk • contribs) 04:05, 9 October 2007 (UTC)

I would suggest you read the following policies: WP:SOAP, in which it is clearly stated that Misplaced Pages is not the place to engage in advocacy for or against something. Then read WP:NOR that explains that in Misplaced Pages we do not engage in "original research", meaning that we only present what published and reliable sources have said about a subject. You also need to read WP:NPOV in which it is explained how to write from a neutral-point perspective (which is a non-negotiable policy in Misplaced Pages), and finally become familiar with our verifiability policy that explains what sources are suitable for Misplaced Pages.

Once you have done that, you may want to collaborate with others in the article about Meditation and Health_applications_and_clinical_studies_of_meditation were material can be added to present such controversies as described in sources that are usable for our articles. ≈ jossi ≈ (talk) 04:14, 9 October 2007 (UTC)

Note that there is a section already called Health_applications_and_clinical_studies_of_meditation#Adverse_effects, to which you can expand with material that is relevant, encyclopedic, and supported by reliable sources. ≈ jossi ≈ (talk) 04:16, 9 October 2007 (UTC)

Another piece of advice, is not to assume or presume the motives of other editors contributing to this project, and you should expect the same treatment. See our policy of no personal attacks that basically states that you need to discuss the edits and not the editors. ≈ jossi ≈ (talk) 04:24, 9 October 2007 (UTC)

... continued

And some info. Pat Haley didn't die.Momento 20:34, 9 October 2007 (UTC)

The Detroit newspapers, at the time, said that he died of a brain hemorrhage two weeks later. He had been treated and released for the fractured skull, and had appeared in public since, a but sliver of bone, which had penetrated his brain, killed him two weeks later. Do you have any evidence that he did anything the next year? Wowest 22:31, 9 October 2007 (UTC)

Ask http://en.wikipedia.org/User:John_Brauns, he spoke to Haley in the last year or so.Momento 03:02, 10 October 2007 (UTC)

I'll get back to you. Wowest 04:22, 10 October 2007 (UTC)

I sent him an email. Wowest 07:35, 10 October 2007 (UTC)

I asked him. He said that he didn't talk to Haley himself, but that someone else told him that. I can see why Haley might wish to pretend to be dead, but you have moved me into agnosticism. Someone tried to kill Haley, but whether he died or not we don't really know right now. Wowest 21:57, 12 October 2007 (UTC)

Why then did the police decide not the pursue the assailants when DLM contacted the police and gave their whereabouts.Momento 00:24, 15 October 2007 (UTC)

Richard whatever-his-last-name-was, the main premie in Detroit, stated that he contacted the police after the initial assault and offered to tell them who did it. He reported that the police told him to forget about it because political radicals are more dangerous than religious people. At the time, there was a call-in poll in one of the Detroit papers. Someone said "I think all gurus are communists." They printed that. The next day, a truck driver at work saw my Guru Maharaj Ji button and said "a communist!" That was a little bit scary. Then, the foreman said "No, he's a good worker," and nobody beat me up after all. Wowest 00:37, 15 October 2007 (UTC)

Wowest, thanks for your recollections. It's hard to recall now the emotions and attitudes of the 70s, both in general and those surrounding Maharaji. I think we were all more than a bit mad in a demonstrably mad society. Something way better is happening around Maharaji today, but it is taking "sources" a while to catch up with it. Rumiton 00:55, 15 October 2007 (UTC)

I appreciate the missionary attempt, I think. You're sure you're onto a good thing, and you want to share it. That's admirable. Wowest 19:52, 15 October 2007 (UTC)

I don't see my words as missionary. Last year I was talking with some friends about India, telling them what a vast, steaming heap of manure I had found the place to be. Someone said: "When were you last there?" and I said: "About 20 years ago." She said: "Well I just came back and it's changed a lot. Cleaner and easier and you can use mobile phones and get good drinking water now." She wasn't suggesting I go there, just telling me something. Same with the premie world. It's unrecognisably different these days, and way better. I'm just letting you know. Rumiton 07:24, 28 October 2007 (UTC)

Prem Rawat A lot of criticism and sources have been omitted

A lot or sources and criticisms have been omitted. See The vast majority of that article is sourced to reputable sources. I believe that there is no justification for the degree the omissions in any of the Misplaced Pages policies and guidelines. The reason for these omissions is that several contributors did not like what reputable sources stated. Andries 17:48, 13 October 2007 (UTC)

More of your nonsense Andries. The record shows that your hatred for spiritual groups and leadership led you to misquote and mistranslate the writings of already biased, anti-eastern churchmen whose opinions would never be acceptable in a biography of a living person anyway. Why don't you do something positive with your life? Start a youth group or something. Rumiton 01:44, 14 October 2007 (UTC)

If that is your opinion then I suggest your or I seek dispute resolution because I think that you are completely wrong in your assesment of the proposed sources and my editing behavior. Andries 01:48, 14 October 2007 (UTC)

All reputable sources have been used in the current article, and placed in the appropriate context. As for your editing behavior, you have had plenty of feedback already. Do you need anymore? Just say so. ≈ jossi ≈ (talk) 01:50, 14 October 2007 (UTC)

Untrue. I missed Mishler's crticism as voiced in the Washinton Post. Andries 01:52, 14 October 2007 (UTC)

Already discussed to death. Just to remind you that you blew your previous three attempts at dispute resolution. You have zero credibility in this project as it pertains to any assumptions of good faith, Andries. ≈ jossi ≈ (talk) 01:53, 14 October 2007 (UTC)

You dismissed the opinion from an involved person in dispute resolution as misguided when he contradicted your opinion. So much for your credibility to follow good faith dispute resolution on one of your pet subjects. Andries 01:56, 14 October 2007 (UTC)

I think that I have to follow dispute resolution again when there so much disagreement that cannot be solved by endless discussion. Andries 01:59, 14 October 2007 (UTC)

Hi, Andries. I think you have more to contribute here, but I don't have enough energy right now to say much more than that. Wowest 04:11, 14 October 2007 (UTC)

Please do not...

... troll my page, Thanks. ≈ jossi ≈ (talk) 19:46, 15 October 2007 (UTC)

I am not familiar with that verb, sorry. I'm new here, remember? Are you going to answer my question about the Radha Soami conversation? Wowest 03:22, 16 October 2007 (UTC)

Your edit comments

Please do not randomly refer to other editors as "vandals" as you repeatedly do here. Please see WP:NPA and WP:CIVIL. Thank you. Weregerbil 20:28, 25 October 2007 (UTC)

More edit comments

Just because someone has bad grammar doesn't justify asking if "English is their second language" which frankly is none of your business. Try a little tact. --Marc 01:07, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

2nd Warning

Please do not add commentary or your own personal analysis to Misplaced Pages articles. Doing so violates Misplaced Pages's neutral point of view policy and breaches the formal tone expected in an encyclopedia. If you would like to experiment, use the sandbox. Thank you. ≈ jossi ≈ (talk) 05:05, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

Not a source

This , is not a source that can be used for Misplaced Pages. It is actually an old WP:MIRROR article of Misplaced Pages Anti-cult movement. Please stop re-adding it. Thank you. ≈ jossi ≈ (talk) 05:45, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

Antony Sutton

You might be interested in Antony Sutton; particularly the link to one of his books in the bibliography section (the book about american establishment). Mr.grantevans2 13:03, 11 November 2007 (UTC)

Your theories on 9/11

Thanks for responding to my questions on the Talk page for Controlled demolition hypothesis for the collapse of the World Trade Center. I don't have time to reply now, but you've given me plenty to think about. Terraxos (talk) 02:06, 21 November 2007 (UTC)

WP:WLA

This user wants you to join the Los Angeles area task force.

(♠Taifarious1♠) 02:53, 9 December 2007 (UTC)

9/11 Truth Movement POV

Thanks for making the We are Change section a little less POV! :)Kevin (talk) 04:30, 15 December 2007 (UTC)

Discussion

Maybe you could have a look here. Mr.grantevans2 (talk) 20:02, 17 December 2007 (UTC)

External links

Please do not re-add external links that violate our policies and guidelines. Please read Misplaced Pages:External links#Links_normally_to_be_avoided and WP:BLP#External links ≈ jossi ≈ (talk) 03:35, 19 December 2007 (UTC)

God?

Make a New Year's resolution to get rid of one concept a week. Regards Momento (talk) 00:13, 1 January 2008 (UTC)

• "receive this Knowledge and know God within yourself. That pure energy, God, is within your own heart".
  • Peace Bomb statsang, 11 October 1970, India Gate, New Delhi, India (translated from Hindi)

What is God? You don't know what God is. God cannot be a human being. God is Light; God is power. God cannot talk.

• • Toronto, Ontario, Canada, October 2, 1971
• People think God is a man. People think God has got ears, nose, teeth and he rises daily in the morning, brushes his teeth and washes his mouth. And he is an old man and he has a beard. All these things people think. But no, God is energy. God is perfect and pure energy.
  • Central Hall, Westminster, London, UK, November 2, 1971
• People ask, ‚"Do you say that you are God?‚" I say, ‚"No, I am not God. . . . . . . I don't want to be God.‚" But what I do want to be is a humble servant of God so that I can teach people this Knowledge, so that I can give people this gospel of peace, love and Truth. That' all I want to do. So all these lectures, all these speeches that I am giving are just for this purpose.
  • Johannesburg, South Africa, 2 May, 1972
• Reporter: I was told that probably the best question to ask you, out of sincerity, is: who are you?

  Maharaj Ji: ... really I can't say who I am. But, though, there is a very basic thing, what I feel about myself. And that is that people have been claiming me as God or as Jesus or so on, and ah, many television people have been asking this question, and this is an interesting question of course. I thought maybe you will interested in the answer. I am not Jesus and I am not God or so on, but I am just a humble servant of God, and I am preaching this Knowledge, and it's ideal of humanity. I don't want to form a small sect or a religion. It's open thing to all. It's for all casts, all creeds, all colors. And man is human, and it's OK he can receive it. And it's something that is internal, something that does not interfere with any religion. And this is the highest thing that I am teaching, about the people of this time, today. I don't claim myself to be God. I don't claim myself to be something like that, but I can claim I can show you God.

  • Montrose, Colorado, 25 July, 1972
• When I was born, God existed. But I never new Him. I just never knew Him until Guru Maharaj Ji came into my life, till Guru Maharaj Ji came in my way, and showed me and revealed me that secret. And the day he did that, there it was, I knew God
  • And It Is Divine, (January 1973) Volume 1, issue 3 - Referring to the day his father and teacher gave him the techniques of Knowledge
• Question: Guru Maharaji Ji, are you God? – Answer: No. My Knowledge is God
  • Who is Guru Maharaj Ji?, (November 1973), Bantam Books, Inc.

I do not claim to be God, but do claim I can establish peace on this Earth by our Lord's Grace, and everyone's joint effort.

• • Proclamation for 1975, signed Sant Ji Maharaj the name by which Prem Rawat was known at that time. Divine Times (Vol.4 Issue.1, February 1, 1975

Momento (talk) 23:50, 31 December 2007 (UTC)

License tagging for Image:Greater than god.jpg

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File:Greater than god.jpg

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Image source problem with Image:Fakeosama.jpg

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Same goes for Image:Realosama.jpg.-Wafulz (talk) 05:24, 16 January 2008 (UTC)

Norman Mineta

Dear Wowest,

I would welcome any improvements you could make to my proposal at Talk:9/11#Norman Mineta testimony issue !  — Xiutwel ♫☺♥♪ (speech has the power to bind the absolute) 06:52, 27 February 2008 (UTC)

attributing

Hello Wowest,

I think we need to discuss the claim on the talk page, this is turning into edit warring, I'm afraid.  — Xiutwel ♫☺♥♪ (speech has the power to bind the absolute) 15:05, 2 March 2008 (UTC)

Prem Rawat 1RR probation

Per the discussion at Misplaced Pages:Administrators' noticeboard#Prem Rawat 1RR parole proposal, the articles now in category:Prem Rawat are on special 1RR and disruption probation. A notice describing the probation is at talk:Prem Rawat. ≈ jossi ≈ (talk) 03:06, 6 March 2008 (UTC)

March 2008

Welcome to Misplaced Pages. Although everyone is welcome to contribute constructively to the encyclopedia, we would like to remind you not to attack other editors, as you did on 9/11 conspiracy theories‎ . Please comment on the contributions and not the contributors. Take a look at the welcome page to learn more about contributing to this encyclopedia. Thank you. The Evil Spartan (talk) 06:37, 12 March 2008 (UTC)

request your input in a consensus survey re 9/11

Dear Wowest,

At Talk:9/11#defining consensus I started a survey to get a better picture on how editor's opinions are varying with respect to the following statement:

"The current form of the 9/11 article is at odds with the WP:NPOV policy, and the proposed inclusion of the fact that Michael Meacher alleges the US government of willfully not preventing the attacks, would make the article better, in stead of worse.

I would appreciate it when you could take a look.  — Xiutwel ♫☺♥♪ (speech has the power to bind the absolute) 17:08, 14 March 2008 (UTC)

9/11 Conspiracy Theory medcab

Hello. I am the informal mediator over at 9/11 conspiracy theories, and I'm trying to make an opportunity for editors to resolve some bad blood.

Recently, User:Haemo had posted this diff, where you say "I am aware that some of you people work for Homeland Security because some of those who do have admitted it", among other things that were possibly construed to mean that some of your fellow editors are (to quote Haemo) "repeatedly accusing the other of being paid shills to cover up the murder of thousands, there's a fundamental disconnect about what they're here to do."

Whether you meant this or not is maybe not so important; It has hurt Haemo's feelings, and it's my goal to build more trust. Would you be willing to apologize to him so we can build up some trust within the community? Xavexgoem (talk)

David Icke versus Homeland Security

Hi Wowest,

on March 9 you delivered quite a speech on Talk:9/11 conspiracy theories. I liked it.

People resent accusations, however: --Haemo 18:39, 11 March 2008

I would like you to bring some nuance into your postings, and assume good faith more often. I am a big fan of David Icke, which you seem not to be, and I agree with you he is not representative of the larger Truth Movement. He wrote an interesting piece today, which I've copied on my user page. Would you read it? It may be so that one or two editors are working for Homeland Security. However, this still does not prove they know the OCT is a lie. They might believe it, and be given some alterior motive to fight the Truth Movement. The main path the CIA and other agencies use is: to distribute falsehoods that are self-propagating (Haemo calls them memes). Most editors who are violating wikipedia policy in order to censor the (undisputed) truth, believe they are doing the right thing. If you were God, you could make them go away. You are not, we have to live together, and therefore one should assume good faith, which I interpret as: "the opposing editor is behaving as what he perceives to be the best way he can act in the interests of wikipedia and the World in general." It's tragic that our interpretations of "what's best" vary so much, but assuming bad faith helps not to solve our struggles. How is it for you to be reading this?  — Xiutwel ♫☺♥♪ (speech has the power to bind the absolute) 14:24, 16 March 2008 (UTC)

Arbitration

I have named you as an involved party at Misplaced Pages:Requests for arbitration#9/11 conspiracy theories. Ice Cold Beer (talk) 22:23, 17 March 2008 (UTC)

Misplaced Pages:Requests for arbitration/September 11 conspiracy theories

An Arbitration case involving you has been opened, and is located here. Please add any evidence you may wish the Arbitrators to consider to the evidence sub-page, Misplaced Pages:Requests for arbitration/September 11 conspiracy theories/Evidence. Please submit your evidence within one week, if possible. You may also contribute to the case on the workshop sub-page.

For the Arbitration Committee, AGK § 19:27, 19 March 2008 (UTC)

Misplaced Pages:Requests for arbitration/September 11 conspiracy theories

This arbitration case has been closed and the final decision is available at the link above. Further to this, any uninvolved administrator may, on his or her own discretion, "impose sanctions on any editor working in the area of conflict (defined as articles which relate to the events of September 11, broadly interpreted) if, despite being warned, that editor repeatedly or seriously fails to adhere to the purpose of Misplaced Pages, any expected standards of behavior, or any normal editorial process." The full remedy is located here.

For the Arbitration Committee, Anthøny 15:53, 8 April 2008 (UTC)

Not for ideological struggle

Hi. Misplaced Pages is not to be used for ideological struggle.

Additionally, this edit clearly violates Misplaced Pages's prohibition on original research. At the next instance of disruptive or tendentious editing, you will be banned from editing articles related to the 9/11 attacks. Raymond Arritt (talk) 19:43, 21 April 2008 (UTC)