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regarding "Bourov tries to implement anyway the Moscow version." I don't appreciate your personal attacks and accusations of bias. Especially considering that I did not propose any specific text changes, only quoting other proposed text as well as existing text. Please refrain from further personal attacks and stick to the guidelines.Anatoly.bourov (talk) 23:31, 21 August 2008 (UTC)

please stop changing the page now that you've requested administrative oversight

I see that you've resorted to continually vandalizing the SO page without any new comments. You also claim that you have requested administrative arbitration, please refrain from further vandalism. As far as your claim of sources being outdated, the objection of US embassy to the use of "completely justified" verbiage has already been addressed in the article, the embassy still stands behind the rest of the text. If you have references to new translations of the same text, please include them in the article.Anatoly.bourov (talk) 15:31, 25 August 2008 (UTC)

Third opinion project

Your request (diff) for a third opinion has been edited to comply with Misplaced Pages:Third opinion#How to list a dispute. If your entry as originally worded contained information vital to an understanding of the dispute, please add those details to the article talk page where the dispute exists (Talk:2008 South Ossetia war#US Embassy in Moscow: Kommersant did inaccurately translate US Ambassador's comments). Thanks. — Athaenara ✉ 18:32, 25 August 2008 (UTC)

Third Opinion: Edit conflict at "South Ossetia War"

Sorry for inconvenience. I am not very interested at permanent edit conflicts therefore i am looking for a third opinion in this case the first time. Thanks for your correction you did before i coud do it. ]

Elysander (talk) 18:49, 25 August 2008 (UTC)

Thank you for your reply. I moved your message (diff) back here to avoid fragmenting the discussion. — Athaenara ✉ 18:56, 25 August 2008 (UTC)

Removal of content

Please stop. If you continue to blank out or delete portions of page content, templates or other materials from Misplaced Pages, as you did to International recognition of Abkhazia and South Ossetia, you will be blocked from editing. You were warned twice in edit summary, do NOT remove content without discussion on the article talk page. If it happens again, I will report it at WP:AN/I --Russavia 16:07, 31 August 2008 (UTC)

Regarding your POV/OR postings i'm very amused. You can be sure it happens gain because you did insert again POV/OR content. ;) Elysander (talk) 16:32, 31 August 2008 (UTC)

My POV/OR postings? Everything I post is backed up by sources. Can you say the same? Again, blanking and deletion of content without discussion is not on. --Russavia 18:47, 5 September 2008 (UTC)

I can confirm that and state the same claim about mine edits. User:Elysander should make himself familiar with WP:CIVILITY and muse a little whether elucidating Russian and Nicaraguan positions on SO and Abkhasia is equivalent to POV, especially when founded on Reuters and RIA Novosti. Bogorm (talk) 19:00, 5 September 2008 (UTC)

Welcome to all members of the Kremlin fraction !!  :))) Elysander (talk) 21:25, 5 September 2008 (UTC)

autonomous areas

Hi,

No, Georgia revoked S. Ossetia's autonomy in 1990, so it is a former autonomous area even by Georgia's contention. However, even if that were not the case, it would be misleading at best to claim a de facto independent state is an autonomous area of another state. kwami (talk) 09:44, 2 September 2008 (UTC)

Hello, you are offering an interpretation. Regarding several UN security council resolutions ( last in April 2008) Georgia's territorial integrity ( inc. SO and Abch.) is untouchable. I'm open for other formulations. ;) Elysander (talk) 09:51, 2 September 2008 (UTC)

But Georgia revoked SO's autonomy, so regardless of the UN, it is no longer an autonomous area (oblast). I don't believe that's the case with Abxazia, but in that case saying it is an autonomous area is just as much an interpretation. kwami (talk) 10:06, 2 September 2008 (UTC)

At my opinion there are so many different political developments the last 20 years nobody can overview the several steps. As i know Georgia did offer in 2008 farreaching autonomy inside the Georgian territory but SO & Abch. did reject this offer. Elysander (talk) 10:13, 2 September 2008 (UTC)

I sidestepped the whole issue, but was promptly reverted because I removed the tag which was no longer relevant. I've restored my wording--you might want to tweak it, since it isn't the most elegant. kwami (talk) 10:31, 2 September 2008 (UTC)

Sorry for delay! I believe you are a serious editor. But as you can watch over several articles and talk pages "POV warriors" are spreading their POV/OR stuff - often concerted. You only need to check their individual pages to discover their "born" prejudices. And personally i'm always tending to support minorities. ;) Good luck! Elysander (talk) 11:13, 2 September 2008 (UTC)

I consider the last hint about the individual pages an insupportable Argumentum ad hominem. kwami is completely right about Georgia abolishing unilaterally Abkhazian and South Ossetian authonomy - this has been been disclosed by President Vladislav Grigoryevich Ardzinba. (See the the article's talk page for a quote and its translation). Bogorm (talk) 13:05, 2 September 2008 (UTC)

If I were Bogorm I would criticize "authonomy" ;-). I am using this talkpage to express personal views and opinions. It is your problem if you are sure you were meant ;) I didn't drop one name. To the topic: once upon a time ... there was a history before and after. BTW .. Preselecting activities provoke similar activities. :)) Elysander (talk) 15:15, 2 September 2008 (UTC)

"If I were Bogorm I would criticise "authonomy"" - would you expound the sense of this conundrum? "to express personal views and opinions" - WP:NOTFORUM Bogorm (talk) 15:30, 2 September 2008 (UTC)

Could it be you have too much time ?? ;) Sorry i'm not interested to waste my time. Anyway i have the impression you are taking the mickey out of us. (EOD) Elysander (talk) 15:52, 2 September 2008 (UTC)

Reprehensible edits

Welcome to Misplaced Pages. Although everyone is welcome to contribute constructively to the encyclopedia, we would like to remind you not to attack other editors, as you did on Talk:International recognition of Abkhazia and South Ossetia. Please comment on the contributions and not the contributors. Take a look at the welcome page to learn more about contributing to this encyclopedia. one of your edits is extremely inimical to editors - this one. Bogorm (talk) 13:41, 2 September 2008 (UTC)

Please stop. If you continue to add defamatory content, as you did to Talk:International recognition of Abkhazia and South Ossetia, you will be blocked from editing Misplaced Pages. This ediy of yours is a flagrant abuse of WP:NOTFORUM and WP:NPA Bogorm (talk) 19:47, 3 September 2008 (UTC)

Bogorm, opinions are not defamation. And no, he won't be blocked for expressing his opinions on a talk page. The worst that might happen it that they could be deleted if agreed to be excessive and off topic. kwami (talk) 23:52, 4 September 2008 (UTC)

@ Bogorm - please read this very interesting article ]. As i wrote above: I'm now convinced you are taking the mickey out of us all. Elysander (talk) 19:56, 3 September 2008 (UTC)

No, you are overtly derogating rulers of sovereign countries by calling them "mad"(=Loco) and I have never expressed my personal opinion to any Occidental ruler and I am not going to, because of reverence to the Misplaced Pages politics. If your statement "I am using this talkpage to express personal views" concerns this talk page, I shall abstain from commenting it, but what you have done is indulging in promulgating your personal stance in an article talk page, which ought to be dedicated to umproving the article and not defaming heads of states (regardless of the state!). Iterum I recommend you to peruse assiduously: WP:NOTFORUM Bogorm (talk) 20:03, 3 September 2008 (UTC)

Excellent edits

Great job editing articles related to the Georgia situation! Just ignore the harrassment above. Ostap 23:29, 4 September 2008 (UTC)

I like such debunking comments of definite "POV-Warriors". :) Elysander (talk) 23:34, 4 September 2008 (UTC)

The only debunking impertinent and POV activity here are the derogatory insults by User:Elysander towards President Hugo Rafael Chávez Frías. I urge you both not to indulge further in scornful contumelies towards editors who do not abuse Misplaced Pages by misusing it as forum and by uttering Argumenta ad hominem when unable to refute the matter-of-fact inconvenient sooth and who do not propagate unsourced dubitable rumours. Bogorm (talk) 18:33, 5 September 2008 (UTC)

If you don't stop harrassing other users you will be reported. Ostap 02:54, 6 September 2008 (UTC)

Let him croak, my friend!! ;) Anyway i'm amused about such living prayer wheels. :)) Elysander (talk) 12:19, 6 September 2008 (UTC)

Recognition Stats

Hey, seems your up-to-date with those who do and don't recognize SO and A. Can you filter the faulty information on in the article? Good work. jamescp 00:23, 5 September 2008 (UTC)

September 2008

This is the last warning you will receive for your disruptive edits.
The next time you delete or blank page content or templates from Misplaced Pages, as you did to International recognition of Abkhazia and South Ossetia, you will be blocked from editing. You were warned above about the continual removal of information without discussion. You may or may not take me seriously, but the wholesale removal of information from articles based upon your own POV, and without discussion is not on, and the next time it occurs, I will seek admin intervention. Russavia 22:16, 5 September 2008 (UTC)

Your activities here and elsewhere seem ridiculous to me: you are disguising your deep POV mentality behind a spate of not seriously meant wikipedia formulas. ;) Elysander (talk) 22:34, 5 September 2008 (UTC)

Please stop. If you continue to blank out or delete portions of page content, templates or other materials from Misplaced Pages, as you did to 2008 South Ossetia war, you will be blocked from editing. The sheer deletion of sources without deigning to seek a sourced refutation and contumelies towards the sources are more than reprehensible, but WP:NPA restrains me from concluding mine indignation unverblümt. Anyway, my patience is evanescing by your incessant reluctance to engage in discussions. Bogorm (talk) 18:09, 8 September 2008 (UTC)

You seem rather crazy today! ;) Talk was done! Elysander (talk) 18:11, 8 September 2008 (UTC)

Renaming

I made a move of Ossetian war article. Please see my last comments and contribute if you wish. Thanks,Biophys (talk) 03:50, 6 September 2008 (UTC)

Reverts

Howdy, as you probably know I'm just hanging around International recognition of Abkhazia and South Ossetia watching and trying to keep divisions to a minimum. I happened to notice this sequence of edits. While I commend you guys for not continuing to revert each other, its still not what it could be. The edits I'm talking about are revert by Russavia revert by Elysander and revert by Russavia.

Please be sure that that you guys are able to discuss this and come to a valid conclusion. I'd suggest starting a talk page discussion if there is not one already (I did not see one).

Finally please note that I am including the same message to User:Russavia. —— nixeagle 15:04, 7 September 2008 (UTC)

Edit warring

Hello, I have noticed your two reverts here and here. I'm warning you now that excessive reverts is considered disruptive. If you continue to revert without discussing on the talk page, you will be blocked for disruption. In addition please see Talk:International recognition of Abkhazia and South Ossetia#Editwarring. Thanks —— —— nixeagle 19:09, 11 September 2008 (UTC)

Check talk page! There's no consensus regarding a 3rd list ! http://en.wikipedia.org/Talk:International_recognition_of_Abkhazia_and_South_Ossetia#Non-recognition_section - Elysander (talk) 19:14, 11 September 2008 (UTC)

________________________________________________________________

If there's no concensus, that doesn't justify edit-warring. HistoricWarrior007 (talk) 20:45, 5 October 2008 (UTC)

Hmm .. what do you mean? I didn't delete bomb car subsection or move it to another place ]. What i did: editing at both places to get a rather neutral view. My advice to you: check all sources about this incident. And you will check that " terrorist attack on HQ" is an assertion - not more! And an assertion cannot be title of an encyclopedic subsection. We need a 3rd party view. According several Russian sources minimum 2 versions about the incident exist. And that Russian soldiers moved the suspicious car to their HQ themselves. Elysander (talk) 07:47, 6 October 2008 (UTC)

You wrote and I qoute, "A typical debate! One serious incident which will be reduced to a 3-line-sentence few weeks ahead. And still assertions stand against assertions. Is it an "attack" or more an "accident" ?" Can you please explain to me how someone could have accidentally rigged a car with explosives? Was it like "Dad I don't know where to put these" "oh ok son, dump them on the car"? I don't get it, please explain. HistoricWarrior007 (talk) 09:23, 7 October 2008 (UTC)

Sorry .. but i cannot waste my time for prejudgements. Obviously you know exactly what happened on a certain day anywhere in Georgia. At my opinion in this case nothing is absolutely certain today. It can be an attack if ... , it can be an accident during negligent car searching, it can be .... and so on. Elysander (talk) 11:49, 7 October 2008 (UTC)

Life Goes On

Russavia failed to delete Life Goes On (The Article), and is now trying to delete its sources using the copyright angle. Could you weigh in on the dispute? WH Coordinator (talk) 10:30, 10 October 2008 (UTC)

1. WP:Possibly_unfree_images#Image:Life_goes_on_p1.png
2. WP:Possibly_unfree_images#Image:Life_goes_on_p2.png
3. WP:Possibly_unfree_images#Image:Life_goes_on_p3.png
4. WP:Possibly_unfree_images#Image:Life_goes_on_p4.png
5. WP:Possibly_unfree_images#Image:Life_goes_on_p5.png
6. WP:Possibly_unfree_images#Image:Life_goes_on_p6.png
7. WP:Possibly_unfree_images#Image:Life_goes_on_p7.png

Ossetian shelling of Georgian villages

It was interesting to see the news you had found about the South Ossetian shelling of the Georgian village Avnevi on the 7th of August. Because that confirms what the Georgian refugees from Kekhvi (north of Avnevi) said that I met in Tbilisi. They had fled their home village during the day of the 7th after the village had been under heavy shellings from Ossetian fire. They didn't dare to go on the main road so they had to walk through the forest first and then by car to get around Tskhinvali. But while escaping by car they were shelled by fire from Tskhinvali that they believed came from Russians. One car was hit and two women were killed. This explains why Mikheil Saakashvili asked for ceasefire in the evening, but after no response the Georgian side launched its attack. Another refugee I talked to had actually seen a killed Russian Spetsnaz in that area, which also confirms that Russian troops were there already then. But so far I haven't seen anything of this in any news. Närking (talk) 11:09, 12 October 2008 (UTC)

I believe both sides are not ready to open their books. Some European governments especially France & Germany are sure Georgia had walked in the trap Russia had prepared for months. But these governments cannot answer the questions what Georgia should have done regarding the escalation since spring 2008. German foreign minister's diplomatic failure before war in Abkhazia when the separatists rejecting the Western plans and Georgia's offer of far-reaching autonomy must have been a signal to the "West" that the dice was cast. The Scandinavians and Baltics are sure that Bucharest NATO decision against Ukraine & Georgia was like an invitation to invasion in Georgia. Elysander (talk) 20:46, 20 October 2008 (UTC)

Putin's Pandora Box opens up ? Elysander (talk) 16:25, 21 October 2008 (UTC)

Yes, I'm sure Putin will soon have more problems at home after this. From the outside it might have seen to be stable in Putin's Russia but it has just been boiling on low heat for a while and soon it will boil over again.

And it's true it will take some time before we will know for sure what was exactly going on there in early August. Although I was there at the time it sure was very hard to know what was happening. There were so many strange rumours going around, like that Saakashvili had had a heart attack and was under surgery in Turkey! But I did interview some refugees from South Ossetia and got to know more information from the war scene, but at that time I couldn't compare it with other information. But from what they told me and what I know now it seems more clear what was leading up to Saakashvili's decision to attack. And by the way that part is missing in the lead. Now it seems like Georgia launched its offensive just out of nowhere.

And it was also interesting to see how Russia was treating its real citizens that were visiting Georgia at the time of the war. Because indeed there were many Russian citizens in Georgia during the war, but they were not in South Ossetia, many more were in Tbilisi. And while other countries tried to help their citizens during the war by evacuating them (I didn't follow the evacuation though) all the Russian embassy said to its citizens were you are on your own, and get yourself out by yourself! In fact the Georgians were treating the visiting Russians there much better. Närking (talk) 19:44, 21 October 2008 (UTC)

mined buildings

My bad. So much reverting going on there that I missed that sentence. --Xeeron (talk) 20:09, 18 October 2008 (UTC)

No problem at all. This article is a perpetuum mobile. The biggest nonsense you will find if you are checking the sources. As i told before - real work on article is just beginning. :)) Elysander (talk) 16:25, 21 October 2008 (UTC)

Please don't accuse others of disruptive editing during a content dispute

Pocopocopocopoco (talk) 20:32, 25 October 2008 (UTC)

Don't provoke an edit war by changing a stable version As i can watch you are trying to revert a rather "stable" sentence in article's leader to a version which is in this formulation the version of one conflict party. If you prefer another version don't start an edit war but discuss the questions on talk page. Personally you were also trying to insert a corrupt version of the events in Poti harbour. --Elysander (talk) 21:30, 25 October 2008 (UTC)

The version that you are trying to push isn't the same version as I started editing so you can't claim that your version isn't the stable version either. Plus you can't claim that I'm trying to insert a corrupt version, I am using the proper term for what happened to the Georgian Naval vessels. Pocopocopocopoco (talk) 23:46, 25 October 2008 (UTC)

3 Revert Warning

You currently appear to be engaged in an edit war according to the reverts you have made on 2008 South Ossetia war. Note that the three-revert rule prohibits making more than three reversions on a single page within a 24 hour period. Additionally, users who perform a large number of reversions in content disputes may be blocked for edit warring, even if they do not technically violate the three-revert rule. If you continue, you may be blocked from editing. Please do not repeatedly revert edits, but use the talk page to work towards wording and content that gains a consensus among editors. If necessary, pursue dispute resolution. Pocopocopocopoco (talk) 23:46, 25 October 2008 (UTC)