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Vladimir Spiridonovich Putin

Vladimir Spiridonovich Putin (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View log)

Notability is not inherited, and as the only assertion of Vladimir Spiridonovich is that he is the father of Vladimir Vladimirovich, he does not pass notability guidelines for biographical articles. The information is contained in his son's article, and redirect was undone, so am bringing it to AfD instead. Russavia 06:48, 28 October 2008 (UTC)

• Note: This debate has been included in the list of Russia-related deletion discussions. -- Russavia 06:48, 28 October 2008 (UTC)
• Note: This debate has been included in the list of People-related deletion discussions. -- Russavia 06:49, 28 October 2008 (UTC)
• Reinstate the redirect until such a time that an article of reasonable length can be written. The claim he was a cook for Lenin and Stalin could make him borderline notable, but that info won't be lost if we reinstate the redirect and keep the info in the other article. - Mgm| 10:43, 28 October 2008 (UTC)
  • Vladimir Vladimirovich's grandfather, Spiridon Putin, was a cook for Lenin and Stalin. --Russavia 11:55, 28 October 2008 (UTC)
    • WP:PROVEIT, please. MuZemike (talk) 12:56, 28 October 2008 (UTC)
      • What does proving a fact on Putin's grandfather have to do with have to do with this AfD which is based upon the non-notability of Putin's father? Notability is not inherited. Anyway, read Vladimir Vladimirovich's article. --Russavia 13:25, 28 October 2008 (UTC)

an excellent illustration of the fact that family background is relevent to one's career. Should be elaborated in the articles on father & grandfather DGG (talk) 03:41, 29 October 2008 (UTC)

• Delete or redirect/merge to the Putin we all know and, ahem, love. Per nom.—Ëzhiki (Igels Hérissonovich Ïzhakoff-Amursky) • (yo?); 14:41, 28 October 2008 (UTC)
• Keep. Notability of a person should be defined by independent third-party sources about this person. I provided a book; much more sources can be cited if needed. But perhaps a more notable subject (also discussed in books) is the controversy who were real parents of Putin... I thought we should avoid that subject and simply keep this article.Biophys (talk) 17:31, 28 October 2008 (UTC)
  • Comment. The book you provided, however, is not about this person; he is merely mentioned in passing. We are not considering creating an article about Vera Gurevich (Putin's teacher) just because she was also mentioned in the same book, are we? If there were a book specifically about Putin's father, then it would have been different, but here it's just Putin reminiscing about his past, of which, of course, his father is a part. Including this information into the main article can be somewhat justified, but I don't see how having a completely separate article is. (I might change my vote if demonstrated additional, better qualified sources, though).—Ëzhiki (Igels Hérissonovich Ïzhakoff-Amursky) • (yo?); 23:50, 28 October 2008 (UTC)

The book is not about him, and it should not be. However, it describes the controversy about Putin's parents at several pages.Biophys (talk) 15:27, 29 October 2008 (UTC)

I should point out that Biophys wishes to introduce some serious WP:BLP information on WP; that being that Vladimir Putin's parents are not who they say they are, and that he was born to Georgian parents and was raised in Georgia. He has already introduced this WP:BLP information at Artyom Borovik. Thankfully, Biophy's belief that Putin is a paedophile is not gracing any pages...yet. --Russavia 05:49, 1 November 2008 (UTC)

• Comment. Could use more sources that would demonstrate he was notable. I am still debating creating an article on the father of the current Polish president, who gained some notoriety in media a year ago and has his own article on pl wikipedia... --_{Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| talk} 18:21, 28 October 2008 (UTC)
• Keep Immediate family of heads of state are notable. They are always discussed in conventional biographies and reference books, a the relationship--environmental, familial, even genetic-- is relevant. People are connect to each other in various ways, and the immediate family is one of the most important, and these connections influence the person. Further, the general public considers this information important & significant, which is what is meant by notable. I cannot believe there are no sources, so the information should be much expanded. Is there no equivalent article in the ruWP? DGG (talk) 03:41, 29 October 2008 (UTC)

Explanation. No, there is no such article in the ruWP. The reason: it remains disputed who were biological parents of Putin. Some said he was born in Georgia by different parents (they allegedly found his real mother, took an interview with her, and so on). A notable journalist who dug up this story (Artyom Borovik) suddenly died in an "accident" while trying to publish the story about Putin's parents and materials about Russian apartment bombings. Biophys (talk) 15:27, 29 October 2008 (UTC)

And be forewarned, if any such information is ever introduced in any article on any individual, it will be removed post haste. Time to take off the tin foil hat Biophys. Not everything is a conspiracy. --Russavia 21:10, 29 October 2008 (UTC)

Immediate family of heads of state are not necessarily notable; for if they are, then the same goes for pop stars, movie actors, sports people, and the list goes on to include any other group of people on WP who have had biographies written about them. Not all countries are like the US and UK (and some others) where media attention makes such people notable; in many countries political leaders' families are in the background and not fodder for the media. --Russavia 06:11, 29 October 2008 (UTC)

• Delete or move to userspace. Topic might be notable, but the article in it's present form is a disgrace and does not even merit "stub" name. Asks questions (talk) 18:57, 29 October 2008 (UTC)
• Delete or Redirect per Ezhiki. No notable information at that time Alex Bakharev (talk) 00:46, 30 October 2008 (UTC)

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