Misplaced Pages

Revision as of 21:31, 19 January 2006

Inclusionists

I doubt whether yuckfoo cares about them being Christian entries. He consistently votes to keep everything. You could use that to your advantage. They are known as inclusionists. David D. (Talk) 06:54, 18 January 2006 (UTC)

Seriously. Gastrich needs to stop accusing people of things and try to understand the Wiki camps of inclusionists and deletionists). Mark K. Bilbo 19:40, 18 January 2006 (UTC)

Jason I've voted on 2, but I'm just to tired to finish tonight. I'll visit the others tomorrow. I must say the swarm of deletions is weird.Did he have an argument with you on any talk pages before this started? If so you need to include that in your vandalism report, it would show his motivation.This is very important. California 12 02:14 18 January 2006(UTC)

Thanks California. According to his posts, he has a problem with fundamentalist Christianity. He has only been on Misplaced Pages (with "A.J.A.") for about 3 weeks. He could even be a sockpuppet. Who knows. --Jason Gastrich 21:14, 18 January 2006 (UTC)

I do? A.J.A. 22:10, 18 January 2006 (UTC)

Jason, you may want to correct these edits, they are clearly not an accurate reflection of the number of times they are cited on the web. 17 million hits in google and 11 million hits in google. David D. (Talk) 10:42, 18 January 2006 (UTC)

Jason do you want to ask someone from the mediation cabal if it would be permissible to merge the articles that are deleted into the LBU article? This may be your best shot for the lesser known people and the LBU list. California 12 02:58 18 January 2006(UTC)

I should add this, I seriously doubt if they are going to count my vote anyway California 12 03:34 18 January 2006(UTC)

I see no reason why your vote would not be counted, why would you think this? By the way you are still not using the four tildes (~~~~) to sign your talk posts. If you are going to write your signature long hand it should look like this ] not like this ]. David D. (Talk) 18:18, 19 January 2006 (UTC)

Vote stacking

FeloniousMonk talked to you about vote-stacking. I'm going to echo that. You should also know that I consider that this is also open to question, and this would generally be interpreted as a personal attack. Given your clear lack of neutrality in these articles I strongly suggest that you take a step back. - Just zis  Guy, you know? / AfD? 11:52, 19 January 2006 (UTC)

Indeed. "With all due respect, he has likely written more books than you've read" is definitely a personal attack. You should read WP:NPA before proceeding. --Pierremenard 13:10, 19 January 2006 (UTC)

You two are barking up the wrong tree. I've simply encouraged people to vote; perfectly within Wiki guidelines. Furthermore, simply noting that a nominator nominated 10 Christian biography entries for deletion in the same day and saying I don't know if we can assume good faith certainly isn't an attack. Furthermore, my comments to WarriorScribe were a joke. Maybe you two should take a step back. --Jason Gastrich 18:36, 19 January 2006 (UTC)

WP:AGF is policy, accusing others of bad faith in nomination is a big deal and gets people's backs up. AfD is no big deal until someone comes along and makes it one, it's not a vote, the closing sysop's judgment has a lot to do with it. It's all about the project. - Just zis  Guy, you know? / AfD? 20:09, 19 January 2006 (UTC)

If you read wrote I wrote carefully, you'll see that no accusations were made. I simply said that it's hard to assume good faith when someone nominated 10 Christian biographies for deletion in the same day. People can investigate and/or draw their own conclusions. --Jason Gastrich 20:25, 19 January 2006 (UTC)

Nope, it's extremely easy to assume good faith. All it means is that he found a list article, went through all the links and checked them. I've done the same thing many times. And the personal attack was, in any case, not the AG issue (I only said that was open to question); this on the other hand is hard to interpret as anything else. And I think that's probably all I have to say on the matter at this point. Mind how you go, Just zis  Guy, you know? / AfD? 21:12, 19 January 2006 (UTC)

I understand how saying "To those that read (written for your amusement, of course)" may seem like a personal attack from an outsider. However, when I wrote "written for your amusement" it was as good as saying, "just joking." As an outsider, you may not know WarriorScribe (Dave Horn) but he has a long history of personally attacking me, so rest assured that a joke like mine pales in comparison to the things he has said and done. --Jason Gastrich 21:17, 19 January 2006 (UTC)

Ah, the Christlike attitude of tit for tat. Mark K. Bilbo 21:29, 19 January 2006 (UTC)

• I received an email from Jason Gastrich, a listing which has led me to be more involved in the wiki project. I post the entire email here if it might influence the discussion on vote stacking:

Dear Subscribers,

I hope you're well.

If you've been on JCSM's list for awhile, you know that I don't like to bother you with unimportant things. The devotions are succinct and focused. The midweek messages let you know about important new ministries. Similarly, this message is to let you know about something important as well.

Misplaced Pages is an online encyclopedia that you can edit! It's currently listed in the top 40 most popular sites on the internet. Its articles frequently get listed in the top 10 search results in Google. The web site has been featured in newspapers and on television.

Several weeks ago, JCSM noticed this trend and created a new ministry called Wiki4Christ. It's an organization that exists to make sure Christians have a united and represented voice on Misplaced Pages. As you may imagine, unbelievers also edit there and they actively try to silence Christian input and revert our contributions; especially Christian biographies! This is where we need you, now. (personal emphasis added)

Yesterday, the entries below were nominated for deletion. This means there will be a vote on whether or not to keep them. Please come and let your voice be heard! This endeavor will only take 10-15 minutes and it will be something you can do with your online time that will further the kingdom of God. Wouldn't you like to vote to keep Christian entries on Misplaced Pages? (personal emphasis added)

How do you do this? First, you need a Misplaced Pages account. You can create a free one and it only takes seconds. Go to http://en.wikipedia.com. In the upper right corner, you'll see a link called "Sign in / create account." Click it. Next, all you have to do is create a Username and password. It's that simple!

Afterwards, click the links below, click "Edit" and simply add your vote at the bottom of the page, using the same format as the others. If you have any questions, please let me know. This is important, so I would be happy to walk you through it if you have any trouble.

Here is a list of the entries that need your help. They're all Christian people; some are presidents of Christian universities, others are authors, professors, and scholars.

http://en.wikipedia.org/Wikipedia:Articles_for_deletion/List_of_Louisiana_Baptist_University_people_%28second_nomination%29

http://en.wikipedia.org/Wikipedia:Articles_for_deletion/Ron_Moseley

http://en.wikipedia.org/Wikipedia:Articles_for_deletion/Mike_Randall

http://en.wikipedia.org/Wikipedia:Articles_for_deletion/James_Combs

http://en.wikipedia.org/Wikipedia:Articles_for_deletion/Neal_Weaver

http://en.wikipedia.org/Wikipedia:Articles_for_deletion/Greg_Baker

http://en.wikipedia.org/Wikipedia:Articles_for_deletion/Daniel_Dorim_Kim

If you'd like to be a part of Wiki4Christ, and be notified of future ways you can help, please fill out the form at Wiki4Christ.

May God richly bless you.

Sincerely,

Jason Gastrich

If this is what is frowned upon for articles for deletion standing on their own merits and not who can scrub up enough votes, I would agree.

Jazzscrub 21:30, 19 January 2006 (UTC)

Your contributions at AFD

Hi there, and a belated welcome to Misplaced Pages. I noticed a number of your articles on AFD today, and I wanted to let you know why in many cases I have voted to delete them.

Firstly, about the articles. Many of your articles are unverifiable outside of sources you control or sources directly associated with the person named in the article. Misplaced Pages does not accept articles about unverifiable matters, people, etc. If your articles have reputable, third-party sources I would encourage you to cite them on the relevant page(s).

Secondly, your own votes. I am not sure if you are aware of Misplaced Pages's AFD process, but you voted to Speedy Keep on a number of discussions where that vote was not valid. Please see Misplaced Pages:Speedy keep, specifically that to speedy keep, there can be no other delete votes whatsoever.

Thirdly, I note that you posted similar requests on User_talk:Hall Monitor, User_talk:Hvnhlpr, User_talk:SWD316, User_talk:God's child, User_talk:Michaelwmoss, User_talk:Yuckfoo, and User_talk:Jaysuschris asking them to support your other articles which are on AFD. You should be aware that this could be seen as meatpuppetry or vote stacking, and the closing administrator will be asked to take this into account when assessing the result of the AFD. Your article should be kept or deleted on its own merits, not on the basis of who can round up the most users to support them.

I wish you all the best. Stifle 18:01, 19 January 2006 (UTC)

Thanks, Stifle. And nice to meet you. Thanks for clarifying the Speedy Keep. I suppose I used it incorrectly. Oops.

As for those talk pages, I said "Thanks for voicing your opinion on several of the Christian biographies that A.J.A. nominated for deletion, yesterday. Here are several others that could use your input." As you can see, I didn't ask them to "support" my articles. I just asked them to come and vote. --Jason Gastrich 18:41, 19 January 2006 (UTC)

As an addendum to this, if you are going to leave messages on Talk pages about AfD debates, doing that as web links rather than Wikilinks as you have been doing will prevent it showing up in "what links here" - which may well be interpreted as subterfuge. - Just zis  Guy, you know? / AfD? 18:12, 19 January 2006 (UTC)

I didn't know this, but I'll take it into consideration. In the meantime, I suggest to you that you should tone down your overall hostility toward me. --Jason Gastrich 18:41, 19 January 2006 (UTC)

Do not confuse hostility towards abuse of the project with personal hostility. - Just zis  Guy, you know? / AfD? 19:42, 19 January 2006 (UTC)

Questions

I assumed that, in questioning my voting you were serious. So I explained my votes. And asked about yours. It seems only fair that if you requested an explanation for my voting that you should be willing to extend the same courtesy you asked of others, and explain your own actions. So, your reason for voting "Keep" on a whole slew of articles which fall short of the notability guidelines at WP:BIO would be... ? Guettarda 20:35, 19 January 2006 (UTC)

I felt you avoided my question. However, since you want an answer, and since I asked you on your talk page, I'll go there and respond. There's no need to have a conversation in 2 places at once. --Jason Gastrich 21:11, 19 January 2006 (UTC)

Well?

Jazzscrub recieved the following e-mail from you.

"...Several weeks ago, JCSM (Jesus Christ Saves Ministries) noticed this trend and created a new ministry called Wiki4Christ. It's an organization that exists to make sure Christians have a united and represented voice on Misplaced Pages. As you may imagine, unbelievers also edit there and they actively try to silence Christian input and revert our contributions; especially Christian biographies! This is where we need you, now.

Yesterday, the entries below were nominated for deletion. This means there will be a vote on whether or not to keep them. Please come and let your voice be heard! This endeavor will only take 10-15 minutes and it will be something you can do with your online time that will further the kingdom of God. Wouldn't you like to vote to keep Christian entries on Misplaced Pages?..."

This borders on paranoia "unbelievers also edit there and they actively try to silence Christian input and revert our contributions". First, I suspect that not all people voting to "revert Christian input" are "unbelievers". I challenge you to offer evidence for a single case of "Christian input", that is both notable and NPOV, being successfully reverted by a unbelievers. I have only seen non-notable edits and POV edits from Christians being reverted. This is not a conspiracy since we all know that the "unbleievers" who post POV and non notable contributions are also reverted. Please stop trying to provoke trouble. David D. (Talk) 21:27, 19 January 2006 (UTC)

So Gastrich is astroturfing the AfD votes. What a surprise (not). Mark K. Bilbo 21:31, 19 January 2006 (UTC)