Misplaced Pages

Revision as of 17:57, 6 April 2012

There are many aspects of Misplaced Pages's governance that seem to me to be at best ill-considered and at worst corrupt, and little recognition that some things need to change.

I appreciate that there are many good, talented, and honest people here, but there are far too many who are none of those things, concerned only with the status they acquire by doing whatever is required to climb up some greasy pole or other. I'm out of step with the way things are run here, and at best grudgingly tolerated by the children who run this site. I see that as a good thing, although I appreciate that there are others who see it as an excuse to look for any reason to block me, as my log amply demonstrates.

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GA review

Hello,

I randomly found your user page and seeing that you have reviewed a large number of articles made me feel it was fine if I asked you to review GA nominate Bloody Thursday (2011). It was nominated last January. Also, do you think it would be better if I improve it further and nominate it for FA? Is using Al-Wasat (Bahraini newspaper) as a major source problematic? Mohamed CJ 17:38, 20 March 2012 (UTC)

It's not a problem per se, but it is for me, as I don't read Arabic and can therefore have no idea whether the sources support what's being said, or whether they've been plagiarised. I'm not suggesting they have of course, but I'd have no way of telling. That so many of the sources are from Al-Wasat (and in Arabic) may well be a problem for other reviewers as well.

Given the length of the article I'd probably be inclined to skip GAN and head straight for FAC. Before then though I'd definitely see if I could find alternative sources in English for at least some of the material, and I'd take a long hard look at sections such as Executive and Other. Bulleted lists tend to be frowned on somewhat at FAC, and those two stick out like a sore thumb, sandwiching as they do the Legislative section, which is written as prose. You also ought to try and find a copyeditor; sentences like "Mahmoud Makki Abutaki was a 22-years old Bahraini male ..." won't cut the mustard. It should of course be "22-year-old Bahraini male". And why is his name italicised? Once you've tidied the article up I'd suggest stopping off at peer review before tackling FAC. Right now, I'm very confident the article wouldn't pass, but there's no reason why it couldn't after a little bit of elbow grease. Malleus Fatuorum 19:49, 20 March 2012 (UTC)

I've now looked at this article in greater detail and made a few copyedits, but it still needs a great deal of work before it meets the GA criteria, so much in fact that if I were to undertake the review I'd fail it straight away. I'd suggest that you withdraw the GA nomination and try to enlist the help of a copyeditor whose native language is English, perhaps via the GOCE. Once it's been cleaned up I'd suggest a peer review before trying GAN again. Without wishing to sound discouraging, there's no way this is even close to reaching the FA standard at present. Sorry. Malleus Fatuorum 22:20, 20 March 2012 (UTC)

I was asking if the source was considered a WP:RS. Verifying can be done with Google translator, but I agree that it's better to use other references where possible. What changes do you recommend for bulleted lists and the prose in Executive and Legislative sections? You don't have to be sorry, this is my first attempt and I know it should contain a lot of mistakes; that's how people learn. Your help is well appreciated ;) Mohamed CJ 08:10, 21 March 2012 (UTC)

I'm sure Al-Wasat would be considered a reliable source, and indeed perhaps the only source for some of this material. The BBC had quite a bit of coverage on the events in Bahrain, so there may be something useful on their web site. As for the bulleted lists, I suggest converting them to prose. Malleus Fatuorum 14:59, 21 March 2012 (UTC)

BTW, you've got several quotes in the lead; the rule is that direct quotes must be cited wherever they appear, even in the lead. Malleus Fatuorum 15:18, 21 March 2012 (UTC)

Thanks for your help, it's much appreciated. I hope it's fine if I come back to you after I'm done with improving the article. Mohamed CJ 09:59, 25 March 2012 (UTC)

Poppy Meadow

The FA was a shame, but thank you very much for your points. I got 2 supports (minus yours), better than the first one! — M. Mario (T/C) 10:10, 24 March 2012 (UTC)

I was too quick to support, didn't check the sources carefully enough, but we could do the work that's needed and make it third time lucky. Malleus Fatuorum 14:48, 24 March 2012 (UTC)

These are the kind of changes that need to be made. Are you up for it? Malleus Fatuorum 21:08, 24 March 2012 (UTC)

I think this looks very good now. I went over some of what I had noted as problem areas in the past and they are resolved. It should be ready for prime-time, so to speak. --Laser brain (talk) 23:03, 27 March 2012 (UTC)

Thanks very much for that, I considered it my penance. I've suggested to MayhemMario that he might reasonably consider a renomination once the mandatory two weeks are up ... and I'm still wondering how the Hell I got involved with this in the first place. I've also suggested to him that as I've never watched even a single episode of Eastenders – and God-willing I'll never have to – that he might like to check that I haven't butchered the Storylines section beyond all recognition. Malleus Fatuorum 23:18, 27 March 2012 (UTC)

Chalk it up to altruism? --Laser brain (talk) 23:23, 27 March 2012 (UTC)

I really can't remember, but it's at least as likely to be sheer bloody mindedness. ;) Malleus Fatuorum 23:27, 27 March 2012 (UTC)

Ship canal

I thought you might enjoy watching this Parrot of Doom 11:52, 24 March 2012 (UTC)

Great, apart from the smarmy Stuart Hall's commentary. Malleus Fatuorum 14:49, 24 March 2012 (UTC)

Ah, Stuart Hall. "Smarmy" is a polite word for it. How the heck did/do people like him get on? In certain circles it is neither what you know nor who you know, but is rather what you know about who you know. But surely that cannot be the case for someone with the journalistic incapabilities of SH? My dog has been puking today, courtesy of some fast food discarded by a **** last night, but having seen a mention of SH, well, I might join in. - Sitush (talk) 01:02, 25 March 2012 (UTC)

I just hate Stuart Hall's false accent. Malleus Fatuorum 01:15, 25 March 2012 (UTC)

Fake tan? Medallion? Belief that he is actually any good at his job? Honestly, it is a multiple choice situation, and I can never make my mind up. Plus, he completely screwed up something about me. Perhaps I bear a grudge, but in fact his screwing up was favourable rather than otherwise, so it merely confirmed that which I had suspected from around the age of ten or eleven. - Sitush (talk) 01:21, 25 March 2012 (UTC)

I didn't realise that you were sufficiently notable to be commented on by Stuart Hall, but anyone who listens to his Radio Five Live football commentaries ought to worry about his sanity. Malleus Fatuorum 01:53, 25 March 2012 (UTC)

Stuart Hall will comment on a discarded fag end if it suits his purpose. IMO. The notability requirements of TV journalism are often wildly different from those that we find here. I am neither notable here nor in the real world, as indeed is the case with most of us. Indeed, journos often make the story rather than report it, especially when local news is involved. I've never heard him on radio (which, as yet, they have not managed to subtitle) but please do add faked joviality to my list, as per It's A Knockout. - Sitush (talk) 02:05, 25 March 2012 (UTC)

Depsite coming from a family which included far more than the normal share of journos, I couldn't agree more with you, Sitush! The liberties that modern journos take with distorting the truth beyond belief, in order to sell more papers and amuse the great unwashed, is disgusting. And if they were just "making mistakes", then they don't deserve to be paid for writing them up! </endrant> Pesky (talk) 08:20, 25 March 2012 (UTC)

ANI

I thought you might remove my comment calling your buddy out on his shaky attempts to justify his incivility. I was making that comment without realising the discussion was being closed. Feel free to remove this comment too, whilst courageously telling me to fuck off in your edit summary, from the safety of your keyboard. Such a lame, indeed puerile action is to be expected, I suppose. Bretonbanquet (talk) 00:56, 25 March 2012 (UTC)

Go take a long walk off a short pier. Malleus Fatuorum 00:59, 25 March 2012 (UTC)

That's just a terrifying response. Aren't you even slightly ashamed of the way you talk to people on here? I'm willing to bet you conduct yourself differently in public, or maybe you swear at people in supermarkets and suchlike. Bretonbanquet (talk) 01:05, 25 March 2012 (UTC)

Not in the slightest. So be a good boy now and fuck off. Malleus Fatuorum 01:09, 25 March 2012 (UTC)

I knew we'd get there! This is great, it's like going to the zoo. Anyway, I'd better fuck off before I violate a guideline or something. Feel free to put me in your risible flattery box. Till the next time, Bretonbanquet (talk) 01:12, 25 March 2012 (UTC)

Oh come on; you came to this talk page to pick a fight and Malleus gave as good as he got. You don't get to feign offence and indignation when he tells you to fuck off! HJ Mitchell | Penny for your thoughts? 01:15, 25 March 2012 (UTC)

+ 1 - Sitush (talk) 01:17, 25 March 2012 (UTC)

If people behave in a reliably amusing fashion, I reserve the right to seek amusement and be amused. Misplaced Pages isn't all work :) Bretonbanquet (talk) 01:23, 25 March 2012 (UTC)

+Alarbus (talk) 04:18, 25 March 2012 (UTC)

I've found it much easier to remember "toa" (the Swedish slang for "toilet") after reading comments like "banning Malleus for a week" (sic.), etc.  Kiefer.Wolfowitz 07:02, 25 March 2012 (UTC)

Bretonbanquet, you quite literally asked for that one! The first two sentences were just fine, but the rest ... reeeeeelly! Never mind, though. Pesky (talk) 08:23, 25 March 2012 (UTC)

Adding: Malleus, maybe you could just become all God-like and use the lyrical language of the King James version: "Go forth and multiply." ;P Pesky (talk) 08:31, 25 March 2012 (UTC)

I never could resist a freak show, especially if one comes knocking on my door. Such a display of internet bravery needed to be fully protracted, complete with sideshows. Bretonbanquet (talk) 08:33, 25 March 2012 (UTC)

Fing is, though, fing is ... that it's called "baiting". I'm sure what God really said was "Now fuck off out of here", but of course people wrote the Bible in their own words ... Pesky (talk) 08:36, 25 March 2012 (UTC)

Guilty, m'lud. There's a way to avoid it though :) Bretonbanquet (talk) 08:41, 25 March 2012 (UTC)

If you're permitted to be you, and amuse yourself with bear-baiting, then Malleus is permitted to be himself, and respond as per your request. You'd probably find lots of a musing stuff on my talk page (it's quite fun over there). F'rinstance, I fell into the garden pond just yesterday ... hehe! Crazy Granny over-reached through sheer bloody-minded stubbornness! Pesky (talk) 08:45, 25 March 2012 (UTC)

Check my talk for amusement also, such as the educational translations of "uneinsichtig, unbelehrbar und beratungsresistent", never to be used, of course, --Gerda Arendt (talk) 09:02, 25 March 2012 (UTC)

Of course ;) Bretonbanquet (talk) 09:12, 25 March 2012 (UTC)

Sure there's a way to avoid it. Still, to abuse your supermarket analogy above, Bretonbanquet, if someone swears at you at the supermarket, do you follow him to the parking lot inquiring whether he feels shame, questioning his courage, inviting him to curse at you again with the addendum that such a puerile action was to be expected, or do you just get on with life? ---Sluzzelin talk 08:52, 25 March 2012 (UTC)

Pesky, of course, that was the desired effect. But such bears ought to be set free to roam as they please - it's unkind to expect them to fit in with civilised society. I'll be sure to keep an eye on your talk page :) Sluzzelin, yes, I might do that. I also expect him to be banned from the supermarket, particularly if he's been thrown out a dozen times already. Bretonbanquet (talk) 08:59, 25 March 2012 (UTC)

I could have sworn I read above that Malleus told you to fuck off. Fuck off in this instance meaning "go away". So why are you still here? Parrot of Doom 09:05, 25 March 2012 (UTC)

Others were addressing me. In any case, someone telling me to fuck off isn't actually going to have that effect, obviously. This is the internet, where people find the intrepidity that they can only dream of in the real world, as you probably know. Bretonbanquet (talk) 09:12, 25 March 2012 (UTC)

@Pesky: no such phrase in the KGV KJV. Genesis 1:28: "And God blessed them, and God said unto them, Be fruitful, and multiply, and replenish the earth, and subdue it: and have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over every living thing that moveth upon the earth." --Shirt58 (talk) 09:18, 25 March 2012 (UTC)

It must have been one of the other versions; but I still love the phrase! Bretonbanquet: Malleus is kindness itself to me, despite me being a HFA and pestersome (Pesky?) soul. MF has a great heart, but (as I've said on my talk page) reminds me a bit of an old horse I once knew, who used to flatten his ears, curl his nostrils, grind his teeth, and stamp his feet at people who were twats around him ... but on whose back you could put any toddler with absolute and certain knowledge that he would look after them! Twats wanting to show off their courage used to bait old Major, too. It only showed their immaturity and want of intelligence and decency; it never demonstrated courage.

Adding: and, in response to your comment about civilised society, in most civilised societies such "sports" as badger-baiting and bear-baiting have been deemed illegal, in light of their barbaric and inhumane nature. Pesky (talk) 09:40, 25 March 2012 (UTC)

I can only respectfully disagree with you. Toning down the way you talk to people is easy, and refusing to do so shows a lack of respect, self-awareness and decency. A horse has an excuse; there are no excuses for us. Comparing this discussion with bear-baiting is a little distasteful, both to Misplaced Pages and to actual bears. I am not merely having fun here, and certainly not pretending to display courage (merely highlighting a lack of it in others) - I am making a serious point, one which I feel has been made now. Bretonbanquet (talk) 11:03, 25 March 2012 (UTC)

Reminder about policy under Other uncivil behaviours: "taunting or baiting: deliberately pushing others to the point of breaching civility even if not seeming to commit such a breach themselves." Jus' sayin'. Pesky (talk) 13:15, 25 March 2012 (UTC)

Run along, little Bretonbanquet. Nobody cares about your blather.  Kiefer.Wolfowitz 14:18, 26 March 2012 (UTC)

ygm

Yes, YGM. And destroy immediately after reading because it will not self-destruct ;) - Sitush (talk) 00:58, 25 March 2012 (UTC)

Re: Village Pump discussion

I do not not threats and reading your talk page, you seem to agree that Civility is important. I do not know what you were so angy at me when I clearly said the discussion was not personal to any person. But your remarks to me:

You're the one who's concerned about the speed deletion template Mugginsx, not me, so why don't you re-do it?" Malleus Fatuorum 18:57, 27 March 2012 (UTC) I did, it was just above a few lines. You just weren't listening. Stop making this personal.Mugginsx (talk) 21:10, 27 March 2012 (UTC) Don't start down that road Mugginsx, as I can promise that you won't like the destination. You very clearly addressed this comment to me: "Then re-do the Speedy Deletion template so it does not look so harsh!" Malleus Fatuorum 21:21, 27 March 2012 (UTC) These remarks were uncalled for. I made a point to state that the remarks were not personal. Mugginsx (talk) 22:16, 27 March 2012 (UTC)

I don't understand what you're saying. Anyone reading my talk page would surely know that I consider civility as defined by Misplaced Pages to be at best childish. Malleus Fatuorum 22:19, 27 March 2012 (UTC)

I also don't understand why you think I'm angry with you, and I assure you I am not. But disagreement is something that very many Misplaced Pages editors find difficult to deal with, not just you. Malleus Fatuorum 22:23, 27 March 2012 (UTC)

That's fine. I just wanted to mention it because I was trying to talk to the problem with new editors and did not mean anything directed to you personally, though it may have sounded it. Enough said. Mugginsx (talk) 23:03, 27 March 2012 (UTC)

Let it go.

Can you do me a favor and let the list go? I was told it was wrong and requested in good faith that it be deleted. Please STOP with this. Hghyux (talk to me)(talk to others) 23:23, 27 March 2012 (UTC)

Listening when you were told (that your list was wrong) is a start. Declaring "I was wrong to compile an enemies' list" would be better for all.  Kiefer.Wolfowitz 23:31, 27 March 2012 (UTC)

Once you let this go then so will I Hghyux, but while you continue with your antics then I will not. Your choice. Malleus Fatuorum 23:34, 27 March 2012 (UTC)

"the fault is very clearly on one side, the side that simply won't let go of the bone". At the moment you're both holding onto the bone as if your life depends on it. It might be simpler if you just challenged each other to a duel. Nev1 (talk) 23:38, 27 March 2012 (UTC)

I'd be up for that. Malleus Fatuorum 23:39, 27 March 2012 (UTC)

Come on I asked nicely! Why are you guys so unforgiving? Hghyux (talk to me)(talk to others) 23:43, 27 March 2012 (UTC)

This is surreal. Parrot of Doom 23:44, 27 March 2012 (UTC)

Why are you so unrepentant? Malleus Fatuorum 23:46, 27 March 2012 (UTC)

Your asking me this? I just want a resolution and you seem to have it in your head that you don't want to find one. Hghyux (talk to me)(talk to others) 23:49, 27 March 2012 (UTC)

The resolution is very clear; you admit that you fucked up, you agree never again to create hate pages, and you slow down with CSD tagging. Simple really. Malleus Fatuorum 23:57, 27 March 2012 (UTC)

Haven't I already done this? Hghyux (talk to me)(talk to others) 00:38, 28 March 2012 (UTC)

No. You're still blustering. Malleus Fatuorum 00:41, 28 March 2012 (UTC)

Real smooth guys, I'm proud of you. Nev1 (talk) 00:45, 28 March 2012 (UTC)

I don't want to fall out with you over this Nev1 but I think you're wrong, and I'll fall out with you if I have to; I'm more than a little fed up with the kids like Hghyux. Especially when they pretend to be Harvard graduates. Malleus Fatuorum 00:52, 28 March 2012 (UTC)

The enemies list

Was there anything amusing or shocking?  Kiefer.Wolfowitz 00:09, 28 March 2012 (UTC)

No, just a list of those who would be reported to some unspecified authority if they ever posted on his talk page. Malleus Fatuorum 00:19, 28 March 2012 (UTC)

Now that's not a bad thought! ;) I could use one of those myself! ;D  Kiefer.Wolfowitz 00:29, 28 March 2012 (UTC)

The very fons et origo of religion! A prayer to an omni-impotent deity, a list of infidels, a casting-out of devils… Randy from Boise (talk) 07:10, 28 March 2012 (UTC)

Nietzsche didn't know the half of it! We under-men are always tempted by vengeful thoughts. ;) Luckily, as John Calvin suggested, the institutions of government are present to repress our damnable natures.  Kiefer.Wolfowitz 08:07, 28 March 2012 (UTC)

'scuse the post-op grogginess and brain-fuzz, guys ... can you hold fire on this one a little bit? I'm seeing some magic and passion and fire in this kid, and I think the stuff that's been causing him/ her to foul things up can be redirected into something potentially excellent. Sure, he's made some really gross mistakes, but I think it's lack of nouse and training, and not bad-heartedness. Let me see if we can work something good out, here (at the moment it's a smacked puppy hiding in the shed and feeling snarly, but I think it could be a good 'un if we can find the key.) Pesky (talk) 09:42, 29 March 2012 (UTC)

Pesky,

I was confessing my sins---the log in my eye and the lust (for revenge) in my heart---to my brethren, just as I had urged your acolyte to do previously. A rare case of practicing what I preach. Sincerely,  Kiefer.Wolfowitz 10:52, 29 March 2012 (UTC)

/Hugz! Humans are vengeful creatures! It's what animal behaviourists call "species-normal". We all have that thing, to one extent or another, and it's often very wild and out-of-control during our younger phases, when we're beginning to feel our hormones and want to go on crusades to fix the world .. hehe! I remember it well! My brain is still very out of kilter; the op was much more major than we were expecting it to be (not just a bit of drilling-out and re-boring, but the total removal of the defunct remains of two totally fucked-up discs, combined with fusing and plating the three vertebrae involved). So, I now have a four-inch long wound in the front of my neck, complete with something like 20 staples (looking very much like a zip for future use!"), and very swollen soft tissues around the oesophagus and larynx. Imagine you;d been both severely strangled and had your neck sliced open from side to side a couple of days ago, and you'll get the idea! Still – I now have more feeling and motor function in my left arm and shoulder than I;ve had for months, so it was all well worth it. I'm not allowed even to hold a horse's lead rein for the next three months, and have to remember not to push things, pull things, or lift things ... terribly hard for someone who's naturally physically active! Pesky (talk) 10:58, 29 March 2012 (UTC)

I came across similar discussions of teenagers' problems when I just Googled one of ScottyWong's bon mots, written as SnottyWong.  Kiefer.Wolfowitz 11:13, 29 March 2012 (UTC)

I remember, so clearly, being a teenager! I really wish I could go back to those years, knowing what I know now! Teenage years are dreadful, and anyone who tries to tell you that school years are the best of your life must have had a bloody crappy life! Pesky (talk) 11:55, 29 March 2012 (UTC)

There were some good things about being a teenager, but the acne definitely wasn't one of them. And as for school, the day I left was one of the most enjoyable of my life. I hated it. Malleus Fatuorum 18:28, 29 March 2012 (UTC)

After I had my arm pinned back together I remember asking my doctor how much I should use it, if at all. "Be guided by the pain" was the only advice he would give. Malleus Fatuorum 18:30, 29 March 2012 (UTC)

My school years were almost unmitigated hell. As far as I recall, the only really good times were when I was working at stables at weekends. Music stuff was on the better side of things, too. Instinct is, on the whole, a pretty good guide to what you can risk doing, with stuff like fractures; trouble is, I tend to ignore my instincts and push things a bit too fast. I will have to be very careful about that, with this one, as instinct doesn't know how to cope with solid structures where there used to be joints, and the temptation just to get right back into it is quite amazing. I was itching to do some digging in the garden today, and had to restrain myself to starting off seedlings and potting-on a few of last year's ones. And I have a farm auction to go to tomorrow, at which I must remember not to keep bending down and turning over piles of timber and gates ... hehe! I love buying stuff at auctions. It's addictive. Pesky (talk) 19:56, 29 March 2012 (UTC)

Script list cleanup project

You're receiving this message because somehow I determined that you have some interest in Misplaced Pages's user scripts :)

Misplaced Pages's current list of user scripts is in bad shape, in that it is disorganized and contains many non-working or obsolete entries. It is therefore set to be deprecated, and a new draft list has been created to replace it. Perhaps you regularly use certain scripts, or have authored some yourself, that you know to be currently working and relevant. If so, you are invited to add them to the draft. Thanks! Equazcion 01:15, 28 Mar 2012 (UTC)

A case of mistaken identity? Malleus Fatuorum 03:02, 28 March 2012 (UTC)

No, I've been stalking the vector/common.js files of whoever I come across, and if they have at least a couple scripts there I spam their asses :) I think a reliable scripts list would be pretty valuable and the current one is almost worthless. Consider adding the ones you use and know to work (especially with Vector) to the new list. Equazcion 03:46, 28 Mar 2012 (UTC)

Polecats in Salford?

Hi Malleus, With your interest in ferrets I thought you may be interested to know that my son was walking his dogs near the Irwell in Broughton last night and saw a small animal running about. As it didn't seem too bothered by him or his dogs he took a photo and a short video which he sent to me, and the photo very clearly shows it to be a polecat - or possibly a polecat ferret. I don't think polecats have ever been seen in this area before and I suspect that, with its lack fear of humans, it's probably an escaped pet that's gone native. I've emailed the Salford Rangers to ask if it's been spotted before. Richerman (talk) 13:52, 28 March 2012 (UTC)

I was wondering why I hadn't heard about any mauled sheep or dead cows but then I googled Polecat. Parrot of Doom 16:37, 28 March 2012 (UTC)

No, not quite the Beast of Bodmin I'm afraid. Richerman (talk) 18:53, 28 March 2012 (UTC)

Maybe if there's relevant information/news, we could include the photograph in River Irwell? Parrot of Doom 21:59, 28 March 2012 (UTC)

If it didn't run away from your son it's almost certainly a pet ferret that's escaped or got lost. You'd be surprised how many polecats there are up here, there's even a polecat release site somewhere in Salford. It's almost impossible to tell a ferret from a polecat without genetic testing, but in general polecats tend to be very much darker than ferrets, almost black. In fact I know of at least one guy in Manchester who breeds polecats and sells them as "dark ferrets". A wild polecat isn't exactly the Beast of Bodmin, but you sure wouldn't want to tangle with one without a very strong pair of gloves, not if you value your fingers. Malleus Fatuorum 22:24, 28 March 2012 (UTC)

Polecat release site - what's that? Richerman (talk) 22:35, 28 March 2012 (UTC)

Believe it or not, it's a site where polecats are released back into the wild, along with other mustelids like stoats and weasels. Maybe a mother's been killed and someone's hand-reared her babies, or a farmer's found one living in his barn and wants it removed, or one's been found injured and been nursed back to health; when they're fit and well and able to look after themselves they're put back into the wild. Malleus Fatuorum 22:46, 28 March 2012 (UTC)

Well, I didn't know that! According to this discussion there are mink there as well. Actually, about 20 years ago we lived in Sedgely Park near Singleton Brook and one morning I saw a black mustelid dragging off one of my chickens. I thought it looked like a mink but convinced myself it must be a ferret. Maybe it was a mink after all. Richerman (talk) 22:52, 28 March 2012 (UTC)

Almost certainly a mink. There are lots of them around as well, as when mink-farming was made illegal some of the more unscrupulous breeders simply set their stock free. Mink tend to prefer more watery habitats than polecats - there are loads along the banks of the Mersey for instance. But it's against the law to release a mink into the wild, so if one is caught it either has to be kept in captivity or killed. Malleus Fatuorum 23:01, 28 March 2012 (UTC)

Some of the animal rights activists 'liberated ' mink too, which was one of the reasons for the disasterous decline in the population of water voles. Richerman (talk) 23:11, 28 March 2012 (UTC)

That seems to be something of an urban myth; "A widespread modern misconception is that the UK’s wild population of American mink originated from mass releases of mink from fur farms by animal rights activists in the 1990s". These are of course American mink, which are bigger and stronger than the European mink, and have had a devastating effect on small mammals such as water voles, as you say. Malleus Fatuorum 23:13, 28 March 2012 (UTC)

I think we should have a large national park up in the north somewhere. And fill it with wolves. No public entry without a guide and a gun, that sort of thing. Parrot of Doom 23:14, 28 March 2012 (UTC)

Haven't wolves been released back into the wild somewhere in Scotland? Malleus Fatuorum 23:22, 28 March 2012 (UTC)

Oh and I'd also support the elimination of the Grey Squirrel in the UK. All of them, dead. Parrot of Doom 23:14, 28 March 2012 (UTC)

Couldn't go along with. We have two living in our back garden, and every winter we put food out for them. I think it's another one of those urban myths that grey squirrels displaced red squirrels; the large-scale planting of conifers by the Forestry Commission had more to do with it I think. Malleus Fatuorum 23:22, 28 March 2012 (UTC)

I'm of the opinion that eliminating them would facilitate the return of the red squirrel. I know there's been a lot in the news today about pasties, just imagine a squirrel pasty. Delicious! Parrot of Doom 23:52, 28 March 2012 (UTC)

"Four dead in Ohio": Kent, Ohio was ground zero for a Viking raid on the Americas, in which Black (Canadian) squirrels were introduced in the 1961. These mutant-ninja rats are displacing the tamer variants, many of which are polite Midwesterners. All squirrels are just photograph-friendly rats, of course. But a town full of ratatoskrs is terrible. Misplaced Pages is annoying with just one!  Kiefer.Wolfowitz 08:49, 29 March 2012 (UTC)

Grey squirrels dig up my plants, they are cute to look at but a damn nuisance. When they got into a neighbour's roof they did so much damage. I'm with PoD, vermin with bushy tails. J3Mrs (talk) 08:54, 29 March 2012 (UTC)

There are definitely more wild / re-released polecats about than there used to be, and some of them (the re-released ones) are quite fearless of humans, and easily mistaken for polecat-ferrets. Quite a few mink about too (and a bloody nuisance they are too, if you keep ducks or chickens, particularly!) I have to say I have a soft spot for squirrels, even the grey ones, having befriended them, as a kid). I've noticed that our grey squirrels locally are coming out with much more reddish coats then they were a few decades ago; probably pressure from the UK environment giving the redder-coated grey squirrels a bit of an advantage in camouflage over the really grey ones. Yes, bushy-tailed and photogenic rats, but hey, we all have our place, and I don't mind rats that much, either ... and I can;t see any way in which we could eliminate the greys, now. There are still strongholds in the islands where it's all reds and no greys, fortunately. Pesky (talk) 10:01, 29 March 2012 (UTC)

Yep, I've noticed a lot of reddish grey squirrels up int' north. It seems we have black squirrels in Merrie England too. Richerman (talk) 19:20, 29 March 2012 (UTC)

It might be interesting to watch and see whether the black squirrel leaves more or less room for the red than the grey does! They look rather cute. It's almost impossible to tell, at the beginning, how a non-native species will impact on our environment. The numbers of green parrakeets in and around south west London are huge now – roosts running into the thousands. Pesky (talk) 19:48, 29 March 2012 (UTC)

Busted

"Harsh and cynical" you are Malleus. I hope indeed that not too many editors emulate your stance. This commaless message brought to you by Drmies (talk).

"Cynical" is right, but I wouldn't agree with "harsh". Perhaps "uncompromising" ... I really don't understand Americans at all. Malleus Fatuorum 03:29, 29 March 2012 (UTC)

Lack of understanding has led to tragedy historically. Equazcion 04:10, 29 Mar 2012 (UTC)

I don't either. Just make sure you're not wearing a hoodie when you come to visit. Hey I thought about applying for a job at Bath Spa University but decided against it after perusing their website: too much puffery. Drmies (talk) 04:20, 29 March 2012 (UTC)

Named after a railway station; has to puff itself up to remain visible. I see the University of Budleigh Salterton is opening a new Media Studies Centre at its Mutters Moor campus. --Ning-ning (talk) 05:08, 29 March 2012 (UTC)

I admire the Orwellian aspects of English life, the gardening, the civilian clothes when soldiers are on leave, etc., and I share your abhorrence of California self-esteem--obsessions. But tell me true, Malleus: How do you pronounce "schedule"?  Kiefer.Wolfowitz 12:46, 29 March 2012 (UTC) (updated)

I pronounce it "itinerary". ;P Pesky (talk) 12:13, 29 March 2012 (UTC)

I pronounce it man and strife. Ning-ning (talk) 14:00, 29 March 2012 (UTC)

The proper way. How do you pronounce "buoy"? Malleus Fatuorum 18:07, 29 March 2012 (UTC)

Just like "boei" I suppose. Or this way. Drmies (talk) 18:14, 29 March 2012 (UTC)

Nice. In "Proper English" it's pronounced "boy". I used to do a lot of sailing, and I remember being rather puzzled on one training course by the instructor's continual reference to "booees"; he'd just come back from America, where he'd obviously picked up some bad habits. Malleus Fatuorum 18:22, 29 March 2012 (UTC)

Ah I didn't know that--I thought that the Am. pronunciation was the only one. Lots of Dutch words in the sailing vocabulary of course; I wonder if Melville got a kick out of "poop". Drmies (talk) 18:26, 29 March 2012 (UTC)

Scatological innuendo from Drmies? Well, I never. I think that Melville's primary interest was the huge Bretonbanquet, per his title. PS: don't forget that Cambridge University, which is a proper one, is marking the demise of Dutch this (western hemisphere) summer. Get over here and save the language, Drmies! - Sitush (talk) 02:13, 30 March 2012 (UTC)

Dumb Gurlz

John Crofton; he was knighted, and I have never paid attention to how to handle that in naming, titles, etc? Is he supposed to have some initials after his name or some such thing? We don't learn those things out my way :) SandyGeorgia (Talk) 17:36, 29 March 2012 (UTC)

You'll see it done both ways, but I'd never include titles and letters after the name in an article title. Take a look at Arthur Conan Doyle for instance, who is almost universally referred to as "Sir Arthur Conan Doyle". Malleus Fatuorum 17:47, 29 March 2012 (UTC)

We do usually put Sir before the name in the lead though, which I've done. "Sir John Crofton, Kt" as opposed to "Sir John Crofton, Bt" is super-extra-formal & never done here. We do rightly have Lord Byron & some others, including some knights I'm sure, but that goes by commonname, and oh yes, Sir John Donne to avoid confusion. Are you following the god-king in taking an interest in our island nobility? You might do a redirect from "Sir ..." anyway. Johnbod (talk) 21:57, 29 March 2012 (UTC)

We do, yes. I should have said that as well. Malleus Fatuorum 22:09, 29 March 2012 (UTC)

Thank you, Johnbod. Found MOS:BIO and Misplaced Pages:Naming_conventions (people)#Titles and styles. Am a wee bit less stupid today, but I'm sure I'll make up for that somewhere somehow. SandyGeorgia (Talk) 13:32, 30 March 2012 (UTC)

Something over at ANI sounds familiar...

...wouldn't you agree? 208.57.254.62 (talk) 17:56, 29 March 2012 (UTC)

Familiar in what way? Seems like a normal AN/I bun fight to me, nothing special. Malleus Fatuorum 18:05, 29 March 2012 (UTC)

It reminded me of this. Just replace YRC with Malleus, "queer" with "cunt", and "homophobic" with "sexist". 208.57.254.62 (talk) 18:21, 29 March 2012 (UTC)

I see, but YRC/Off2riorob and I have rather little in common. Malleus Fatuorum 18:24, 29 March 2012 (UTC)

I disagree entirely. Malleus's "cunts" comment was not directed at any specific user, nor could it be construed as attacking any group of people unless you use a rather impressive amount of imagination (which, unfortunately, someone did). The "queer agenda" is a term usually used by anti-LGBT folks referring to LGBT people trying to fight discrimination and trying to gain acceptance in society etc etc. Totally, totally different kettles of fish. Bunnies! Leave a message :) 20:08, 29 March 2012 (UTC)

Gotta agree with that; very different things. Pesky (talk) 20:12, 29 March 2012 (UTC)

I'm amazed that some remain convinced that I've got some kind of misogynistic agenda. If I really had, I doubt there would be so many female editors posting here. Malleus Fatuorum 20:27, 29 March 2012 (UTC)

I think the fact that you're so obviously not misogynistic is abundantly clear to anyone of even moderate intelligence. Provided that they can be bothered to stop and think, of course. Pesky (talk) 20:29, 29 March 2012 (UTC)

The accusation, and the WMF's escalating attempts to drive me away, seem to have started with the wife selling article, which I thought at the time, and still do, was nothing more than an interesting historical backwater. Malleus Fatuorum 20:34, 29 March 2012 (UTC)

Clear difference between that ANI and Malleus. Malleus pisses off everyone, he's an equal opportunity pisser-offer! (LOL) Montanabw 21:28, 29 March 2012 (UTC)

You got that right. My target isn't gender, religion, race ... whatever. It's quite simply stupidity. And so far as I'm aware that's not gender, religion, race, related. Malleus Fatuorum 21:42, 29 March 2012 (UTC)

I consider myself pretty sharp on USA politically correct lingo, but once caused a minor internal fuss at a place I worked when I explained that assholes are not a protected class. They aren't. I'm quite sure of it. They think they are, though. Sad, as often they don't realize they are assholes, they just think they're special. Montanabw 23:59, 29 March 2012 (UTC)

So let's have a count here. I make it three female editors out of the four who've commented. Given that the received wisdom is that only about 13% of editors are female I must be some kind of babe magnet. (I know, in my dreams, but let me dream.) Malleus Fatuorum 00:44, 30 March 2012 (UTC)

You are Misplaced Pages's rock star and we are your groupies. Or something. I like your assumption that we are all babes. We are, of course. :) Bunnies! Leave a message :) 00:55, 30 March 2012 (UTC)

Of course you're all babes, don't do yourselves down. And in my experience the higher up the quality tree you go the more females you find. Go figure. And I'm just about as far from being a misogynist as a human being could possibly be. In fact I ... no, no, that's probably enough. Malleus Fatuorum 01:56, 30 March 2012 (UTC)

You are ... just yourself! When faced with anatomy-related-descriptor people, or willful stupidity, you can be a grouchy old thing, but I feel a tremendous, generous-hearted warmth from you, and a straightness and openness that I have a profound respect for. Besides, you just called me a babe! Pesky (talk) 03:19, 30 March 2012 (UTC)

You are a babe, and I'm what I am. I'll try and help anyone with anything, but I have absolutely no patience for stupidity or dishonesty. None. Incompetence I can help with, we've all been there. Malleus Fatuorum 04:00, 30 March 2012 (UTC)

Here's an interesting thing though. I'd be very cautious about calling Moni3 a babe, even though I'm sure she is, and I've not infrequently made reference to SandyG's bum, which I've never seen. But I've never meant any of that in anything other than fun. Malleus Fatuorum 04:12, 30 March 2012 (UTC)

I can cope with what I think of as "panic-dishonesty" in youngsters; I think most of us have resorted to that kind of stuff, as kids. It's good to snap them out of it sooner rather than later, but I still cringe at some of the crazy stuff I did as a teenager (hadn't been diagnosed with either EDS or Autism at that point, so got called a lot of bad things, which only made matters worse, of course!) I'm chuffed to bits that you think I'm a babe! I'm just a crazy British Eccentric Granny (who still likes to climb trees, lol!) I would so like to meet you – you'll have to find a good excuse to come down this way some time. We have a wonderful local brewery ... Pesky (talk) 07:28, 30 March 2012 (UTC)

Be scared....

Be very very scared... this has been my latest project. Wanna check it over for GA ommisions? I did it for the Misplaced Pages:The Core Contest, but in all honesty, it badly needed it. I could tell some Hungarian nationalist had been at it, since it had a LOT of undue weight on Hungary ... I like to kid myself that it's a lot more balanced now. It's no where near FA status, but it's close to GA, I'm thinking. Ealdgyth - Talk 03:14, 30 March 2012 (UTC)

Blimey, that's a mega-article! Malleus Fatuorum 04:22, 30 March 2012 (UTC)

Exactly. Having a core contest actually motivates some of us to slog our guts out just that bit more and produce whopping articles. We should really introduce it every month in my opinion and it would get some of our important articles up to scratch quicker. I proposed this ages ao. It seems Sue Gardner is showing an interest as a judge but is the new one Casibler says about funded by the foundation? It needs to be a monthly competition financed by the foundation I think.♦ Dr. Blofeld 09:16, 30 March 2012 (UTC)

The text on the image of Richard of Wallingford says he is "making (I changed that from doing) measurements with a pair of compasses". I don't know about then, but now you measure with dividers not a compass (I don't think a "pair of compasses" is right either) and they do look more like dividers to me. Richerman (talk) 11:49, 30 March 2012 (UTC)

I can only go with the description of the image on Commons - it says compasses. Ealdgyth - Talk 12:33, 30 March 2012 (UTC)

If in doubt, just leave it at "making measurements"? Nev1 (talk) 12:37, 30 March 2012 (UTC)

Good point. At this point, I am sooooo sick of the article ... I need a day or two off from it. Ealdgyth - Talk 12:40, 30 March 2012 (UTC)

I got brave ... diff Ealdgyth - Talk 23:16, 30 March 2012 (UTC)

With something on this scale I'd have been inclined to skip GAN in favour of the PR -> FAC route. But anyway, I just spotted this: "Popes called for crusaders to take place other than the Holy Land ...". Malleus Fatuorum 23:42, 30 March 2012 (UTC)

... you've done one Hell of a job with that Ealdgyth, much respect. Malleus Fatuorum 23:49, 30 March 2012 (UTC)

Fixed that and thanks for the copyedits. Ealdgyth - Talk 01:18, 31 March 2012 (UTC)

There are some great articles there – I've just seen Truthkeeper's as well. Malleus Fatuorum 01:34, 31 March 2012 (UTC)

Looks to me like Richard of W. is scribing out the chapter ring for his astronomical cock. The object hanging in the cupboard might be a weight for it. Ning-ning (talk) 06:21, 31 March 2012 (UTC)

I pray to god that's a typo. 188.29.99.214 (talk) 18:12, 31 March 2012 (UTC)

Can anyone help?

I just received an email from someone on Wikimedia, but I can't even tell what language it's written in. Here's the header:

"വിക്കിപീഡിയ സംരംഭത്തിലെ ഉപയോക്താവിന്റെ സംവാദം"

Malleus Fatuorum 13:23, 30 March 2012 (UTC)

It's Malayalam. Part of it means Laugh Out Loud, not sure the rest yet. Equazcion 13:31, 30 Mar 2012 (UTC)

(edit conflict)I got one too. It's from ml.wiki; you must have visited there whilst logged in (SUL says some time in Feb 2009) and it auto created an account. Some bot is going round posting messages - and that is a "You have a message" mail in Malayalam. No idea what the notice is... --Errant 13:33, 30 March 2012 (UTC)

It might be advertising Wiki Conference India, two of those words are in this page title: Equazcion 13:36, 30 Mar 2012 (UTC)

It alleges it's VsBot, but that doesn't appear to have edited in years (and won't now 'cos I've blocked it). --Elen of the Roads (talk) 15:14, 30 March 2012 (UTC)

Jim Hawkins

At the request of the subject, I read over the deletion debate on his article. I found several of your comments there to be unnecessary and unkind. I just now went through the current article word by word and found it now to be 100% true, and I agree that he passes notability. He continues to complain that it is inaccurate, but refuses to tell me just what is wrong with it. So while I can understand how you might be frustrated, I wanted to suggest that in the future, you try not to say things that will upset someone who is already complaining of feeling hurt. Thanks!--Jimbo Wales (talk) 15:10, 30 March 2012 (UTC)

I couldn't care less how Hawkins feels. Nor how you feel come to that. I think he's a pratt and that's that. Malleus Fatuorum 15:49, 30 March 2012 (UTC)

Reading his complaints on Facebook, I'm forced to agree. His attitude seems to be "everything about me is copyright Jim Hawkins, how dare Misplaced Pages publish information I've already released!" Parrot of Doom 16:27, 30 March 2012 (UTC)

Malleus - this is a rare thing for me to say, but the truth is where it is, so - "I agree with Jimbo Wales". If two people with widely differing perspectives come to the same conclusion about something, while it's not an infallible indicator, would you at least give serious consideration to the idea that you might be in error? Again, I'm not saying you should automatically believe either of us, heaven forbid. But perhaps go over your reasoning with a bit of charity towards the guy? I haven't seen anything like what Parrot of Doom says, though I haven't checked Facebook. What admittedly little I've seen just strikes me as someone very upset and really frustrated at Misplaced Pages, an experience for which I have a lot of sympathy. -- Seth Finkelstein (talk) 17:36, 30 March 2012 (UTC)

No. Malleus Fatuorum 18:32, 30 March 2012 (UTC)

Seth, if Malleus couldn't give a damn what Jimbo or Hawkins think, do you think he is even remotely blinking an eye because you also disagree with him? Why bother letting him know? Seriously, coming to Malleus's talk page and trying to change his view on something or expecting "redemption" would be like requesting him to become director of the Chamber of Wiki Admins and given the challenge of giving a badge and pat on the back to every admin whoever blocked anybody for their "exemplary, honourable work" for the website.♦ Dr. Blofeld 17:52, 30 March 2012 (UTC)

Well, to lay out my reasoning, I thought that he might be slightly more willing to think about a nonthreatening comment from me, given my lack of power over him and my long work criticizing Misplaced Pages's problems, than from someone in a quasi-authority relationship like Jimbo. Granted, I know it likely wasn't a big chance. But I'm feeling a lot of sympathy for Hawkins at the moment, and on a risk/reward basis, it seemed worth a shot. That is, if it didn't work, likely nobody would suffer, if it did work, great. Now, I've been spectacularly wrong on such calculations before, and maybe I should be more cautious. But, regardless of whether my comment was wise (and you provide evidence it wasn't! :-(), can you see the reasoning that led to it? -- Seth Finkelstein (talk) 18:03, 30 March 2012 (UTC)

Misplaced Pages has an unnatural concentration of progressive logicians who would inevitably find Malleus a compelling conundrum that simply must be solved, even though they're aware it probably can't be. Equazcion 18:04, 30 Mar 2012 (UTC)

I'm completely open to reasoned arguments, but I'm completely closed to emotional appeals, hand-wringing, and childish tickings off. Hawkins has no special rights just because he thinks he does or ought to have; he's a pratt pure and simple, a real-life Alan Partridge. Malleus Fatuorum 18:55, 30 March 2012 (UTC)

That wasn't the contention, at least not as far as this section goes. It has to do with the manner of your reaction rather than the substance. Misplaced Pages is an overwhelmingly progressive place, whose patrons couldn't possibly comprehend your conservative perpetual certainty in the face of overwhelming criticism. Equazcion 19:03, 30 Mar 2012 (UTC)

This counterposing of conservative and progressive reminds me of Communist Parties around 1948.  Kiefer.Wolfowitz 19:09, 30 March 2012 (UTC)

Communists also ate and slept. Are you a Communist? The point being that broad parallels can usually be drawn to unpopular groups in history from both sides of any debate, and usually end up more of a distraction than a revelation. Equazcion 19:33, 30 Mar 2012 (UTC)

To move past the distraction, I'm not making any judgments. I'm just saying the distinction exists, and the two often fail to understand each other. And my use of "progressive" has nothing to do with any particular political stance, but rather a belief system of open-mindedness (being open to progressing one's beliefs rather than remaining steadfast in conserving them). Malleus is instead proud to be absolutely unwilling to re-examine his convictions. That's conservative (again not referring to the traditional "conservative agenda"). Some might even find it admirable. Few people possess such a degree of assuredness. Either way it explains the perpetual conflict. Equazcion 20:07, 30 Mar 2012 (UTC)

Using the term "progressive" sadly does bring the political stance into the discussion, as the term has really been co-opted into politics. And it's worth noting that being progressive does not automatically make one open-minded. In fact, it can in some people simply replace one set of firm beliefs with another set of equally-firm ones. I don't know that we can say that Malleus is unwilling to re-examine his convictions (a rather sweeping statement) any more than we can say that his opponents are open-minded progressives (which is also a very sweeping statement and one that seems to be inaccurate based on what I've seen). Progressive, sadly, also has overtones of being smugly certain that one is correct. I'm not saying that you're using it in that sense, mind, just observing that it does have a certain weight and meaning beyond stark definitions.Intothatdarkness (talk) 20:12, 30 March 2012 (UTC)

I'd think it would be enough to expressly note that I wasn't using those definitions, as I did, but anyway. As I also noted, this isn't a judgment call but something Malleus has all but said himself, if he hasn't actually said it. Though if I'm wrong, then all the better -- I'd be interested in hearing Malleus' take on whether or not he is open to constructive input that might conflict with his long-held views. Equazcion 20:22, 30 Mar 2012 (UTC)

Equazcion, you must surely have got the idea by now that I believe you to be a pretentious twat without any real understanding of what you're talking about. So I don't think there's anything further for us to discuss is there? There's absolutely nothing progressive about Misplaced Pages or its denizens, quite the reverse in fact. It's a repressive totalitarian regime in my book, with a complete blind spot where its self-evident failings are concerned. Malleus Fatuorum 20:24, 30 March 2012 (UTC)

I don't presume to know what anyone believes prior to their saying so. Since I just asked a question of you above (and you haven't actually answered it), I obviously think there is more to discuss. It was just a curiosity though. You're under no obligation. Equazcion 20:37, 30 Mar 2012 (UTC)

The "logicians" caboose from the "progressive logicians" trainwreck should also be ignored. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Kiefer.Wolfowitz (talk • contribs) 20:39, 30 March 2012 (UTC)

Facebook moan. Here he complains about errors in the article but refuses to identify them. Parrot of Doom 18:07, 30 March 2012 (UTC)

And here's a blog posting which mentions Malleus. Parrot of Doom 18:08, 30 March 2012 (UTC)

Interesting comment about "Internet handles" there, given that "Jim Hawkins" isn't his real name any more than Malleus is mine. Malleus Fatuorum 18:38, 30 March 2012 (UTC)

Perhaps his father is Jack Sparrow.. Malleus there's a photo of Wigan town hall here which is useable in terms of license. I didn't upload it because the bus seems to be the focus of attention!♦ Dr. Blofeld 20:03, 30 March 2012 (UTC)

Thanks for that. If I can't find one without a bloody great bus in the foreground it might have to do. Malleus Fatuorum 20:17, 30 March 2012 (UTC)

LOL that's what I thought you'd say! I could crop the bus out if you want, it still features the door and at least part of the facade..♦ Dr. Blofeld 20:19, 30 March 2012 (UTC) The commons folk will delete the image you uploaded unfortunately because its "no deriratives". I think its time we accepted such images. In fact I lost out on a photo very recently because the flickr user wouldn't change the license to attribution only.♦ Dr. Blofeld 21:49, 30 March 2012 (UTC)

I did wonder about that, but if/when they do I'll upload it to Misplaced Pages instead. Malleus Fatuorum 22:47, 30 March 2012 (UTC)

... but actually I think it's wrong building anyway. This looks more like it. That one must be the "new" town hall. Malleus Fatuorum 23:09, 30 March 2012 (UTC)

Does this help? J3Mrs (talk) 08:15, 31 March 2012 (UTC)

Sadly that's not the same town hall; Wigan's had at least three. Malleus Fatuorum 13:42, 31 March 2012 (UTC)

There's usually some hyper paranoid busybody though who would find it and delete it even if uploaded to wikipedia. That's all some people do on here is go through images drilling people warnings. Observation though is that the situation is better than in 2007-2009, although it might be because I've been drilled warnings for every image I ever uploaded and have mostly all been fixed to "adhere to standards" now!♦ Dr. Blofeld 08:43, 31 March 2012 (UTC)

RE hyper paranoid busybodies deleting images, my self portrait (morphing Jack Carl Kiefer and Jacob Wolfowitz) has been nominated for deletion.... :(  Kiefer.Wolfowitz 18:08, 31 March 2012 (UTC)

As I'm now convinced that's a picture of the wrong building it doesn't matter anyway. Malleus Fatuorum 13:42, 31 March 2012 (UTC)

Thanks

Thanks for the copyedits to Brothers Grimm. It was a sprint, I had a very busy week at work, and honestly reached the point where I needed to step away before I could see errors. So thanks for stepping in - it's very much appreciated. Truthkeeper (talk) 00:14, 1 April 2012 (UTC)

You're welcome. I'm in awe of what you guys have achieved in the Core Contest. Malleus Fatuorum 00:47, 1 April 2012 (UTC)

That's quite a compliment, thanks a lot. I'm quite in awe of the other articles, so I guess it's been a success. Truthkeeper (talk) 00:57, 1 April 2012 (UTC)

Roger Norreis

I think you'd like this guy... and especially his nickname... Ealdgyth - Talk 02:02, 1 April 2012 (UTC)

(mutters)

Why did I bother? Apparantly actually using a talk page or conforming to the citation style in use is too much trouble... Ealdgyth - Talk 22:40, 1 April 2012 (UTC)

I guess you're talking about Middle Ages? Big articles like that are almost always too much trouble; even many of the little ones are. Malleus Fatuorum 23:06, 1 April 2012 (UTC)

Yes, Middle Ages. I guess it's too much bother to actually use the talk page... The thing is ... I worked hard to incorporate as much as possible of the previous wording ... when I could find support in teh sources for the information (and when it wasn't undue weight) but... it looks like it's easier to just edit war your own preferred version in and damn the improvements to the referencing or anything like that... that's for someone else to worry about. Ealdgyth - Talk 23:10, 1 April 2012 (UTC)

I've often agonised over trying to preserve whatever was there before I started serious work on an article, particularly when the referencing is dodgey or non-existent, but it's often easier just to start again. That's why I doubt I'll ever do what you've tried to do with this one; life's too short. Malleus Fatuorum 23:28, 1 April 2012 (UTC)

There is little that can be done that won't kill the GAR. I think that Biondo refers to Flavio Biondo. --Guerillero | My Talk 23:32, 1 April 2012 (UTC)

What GAR? Malleus Fatuorum 23:34, 1 April 2012 (UTC)

I think he means GAN. Ealdgyth - Talk 23:35, 1 April 2012 (UTC)

Your attention is appreciated

Dear Malleus, I understand that you're the best reader and writer around, and a nice human being to boot. Would you, or any of your friends here, care to have a look at De zwarte met het witte hart? There may be matters of style that I don't see (should it be an English title?). Also, I cannot upload a cover image (as an IP), and I do not know if the original or the one from the English translation would be appropriate. Can one of you all maybe do me that favour? Thank you all very much. 66.168.247.159 (talk) 19:51, 2 April 2012 (UTC)

Try User:Ucucha for this one if you haven't already. As far as I know, he's the only Misplaced Pages regular who is both familiar with Misplaced Pages custom-and-practice at the high end of the quality assessment scales, and also a fluent Dutch speaker. 188.29.152.50 (talk) 21:46, 2 April 2012 (UTC)

Thank you Malleus for your edits. IP 188.29.152.50, I thank you for the suggestion but judging from his edits on the Dutch Misplaced Pages Ucucha is not Dutch--he's from Friesland, so Dutch is a foreign language for him. 66.168.247.159 (talk) 22:01, 2 April 2012 (UTC)

How's that? I've created a redirect for the English title, but I think it would be better to rename the article with the English title and redirect from the Dutch. A sad story. Depending on what you decide the title should be (Dutch or English), then upload the respective cover page. I'm pretty sure that User:Drmies is a Dutch speaker if that's important, which I don't see that it is in this case. Malleus Fatuorum 22:03, 2 April 2012 (UTC)

Drive by thanks from the random bystander who happened to have yanked it from AfC space: Thanks Malleus! Martijn Hoekstra (talk) 22:07, 2 April 2012 (UTC)

What's AFC space? Malleus Fatuorum 22:11, 2 April 2012 (UTC)

Articles for creation. A way (the only way maybe?) for IP editors to create articles. Martijn moved it into article space. --Floquenbeam (talk) 22:15, 2 April 2012 (UTC)

Ah, another of Misplaced Pages's dusty corners I had no idea existed. How the Hell do IP editors find it? Malleus Fatuorum 22:20, 2 April 2012 (UTC)

That's a good question, actually. I'll log off and see. --Floquenbeam (talk) 22:23, 2 April 2012 (UTC)

If you type a page name into the search box as an IP editor, and the page doesn't exist, you get the message: The page "Silver backed flying chipmunk" does not exist. You can ask for it to be created, but consider checking the search results below to see whether the topic is already covered. --Floquenbeam (talk) 22:29, 2 April 2012 (UTC)

(edit conflict) Presumably IP editors can't rename articles either, so assuming that 66.168.247.159 doesn't object I think that the article ought to be renamed to its English title and redirected from its Dutch title? I'm not even sure I'm allowed to do that though. Malleus Fatuorum 22:25, 2 April 2012 (UTC)

Right, he can't move the page. I believe you'd be able to, since the target is a redirect with only 1 edit in the history, but if not, ping an admin; that's what we're for (well, that, and blocking you for looking at us the wrong way). --Floquenbeam (talk) 22:29, 2 April 2012 (UTC)

I'm so used to finding things I can't do here that I just tend to assume I can't do anything. Malleus Fatuorum 22:52, 2 April 2012 (UTC)

I love these little articles; Misplaced Pages needs lots more of them. Malleus Fatuorum 22:14, 2 April 2012 (UTC)

Thank you! That's really nice and I do appreciate your work. Yes, IP editors can't create or move, unfortunately, and AfC is totally backed up. What sucks is that I added the title to a few articles but since it wasn't created yet it was a red link; I hope no overzealous New Page Patrollers undid those edits (I have two IPs, as you can see in the article). Alpha Quadrant has helped me before with an article and a DidYouKnow so I went to his talk page, and then to another editor, and then I saw that Martijn Hoekstra was in the office. Last time I looked there was a backlog of 168 articles. I don't know if Chzz is still working in that area; I think he's another editor who got disappointed with the process. So it goes. Thank you all for your assistance: not everyone cares for IPs. Oh, Malleus: please do what you think is best with the article title. You have all these Featured Articles; you know what's proper. Thanks again. 66.168.247.159 (talk) 23:01, 2 April 2012 (UTC)

I do, and I already moved it, even without your permission. ;-) If you've got an image of the cover page of the English edition you'd like to upload then email it to me and I'll upload it for you. Malleus Fatuorum 23:04, 2 April 2012 (UTC)

PS. Now I know what AFC is, please feel free to ping me to move any other articles you write into mainspace, unless that's something that only administrators can do. Malleus Fatuorum 23:09, 2 April 2012 (UTC)

You can do it for just about any page, Malleus. The only restriction we peons have in moving pages is that we can't move pages to an already existing title unless it's just a redirect with a trivial edit history (to avoid losing attributions, of course). AFC is actually an interesting area to browse around every once in a while because you often find some little gems, and a bit of encouragement can sometimes lead to us gaining another good editor. --RexxS (talk) 23:28, 2 April 2012 (UTC)

Probably not for me then, as the consensus within the WMF as expressed at my recent ArbCom case is that I drive new editors away. Malleus Fatuorum 23:32, 2 April 2012 (UTC)

Well that's easily fixed. We'll just get a new WMF. Problem solved and you can go back to encouraging new editors again. It's not fair on the youngsters to be denied your inspiration just because somebody came to a daft conclusion in an ArbCom case - again. --RexxS (talk) 02:30, 3 April 2012 (UTC)

• Malleus et alii, I have another one for you, this one not nearly as exciting, I'm afraid: Misplaced Pages talk:Articles for creation/Libris Prize. That page tells me there is a backlog of 269 articles waiting to be reviewed... I think mine is good to go, though; there isn't much to it anyway, just a Dutch literary award. Oh, again I am not entirely sure about the title: "Libris Prize" is used in a few WP articles (I got it from Arthur Japin), but the literal translation is "Libris Literature Award". Thank you all very much. 207.157.121.92 (talk) 18:33, 3 April 2012 (UTC)

I accepted the submission and moved the page into article space as Libris Prize. If you think Libris Literature Award would be a better title, just let me know and I'll move it there and leave a redirect for folks searching on the current title. Happy Editing! --RexxS (talk) 19:11, 3 April 2012 (UTC)

Thank you RexxS. If you could make the redirect for Libris Literature Award to point to Libris Prize I'd appreciate it. By the way, I noticed that there's a Libris Award also, a Canadian award. If you want to bump up your "Articles created" count...I can't write it since I don't care for Canadian literatue, unless we re-categorise Malcolm Lowry. Thanks again. 207.157.121.92 (talk) 19:34, 3 April 2012 (UTC)

Redirect done in passing, --Gerda Arendt (talk) 19:42, 3 April 2012 (UTC)

Thank you Gerda Arendt, that is very kind of you. One more request and then I'll leave you all in peace: please create Category:Libris Prize winners, with the text "Winners of the Libris Prize, a Dutch literary award" and the categories Category:Writers by award and Category:Dutch literary awards. Thank you so much. 207.157.121.92 (talk) 19:49, 3 April 2012 (UTC)

Category created. There's a certain pure joy in collaboration, and this thread is a charming vignette to that theme. I must admit that I've no interest in any count bumping, but I'm sure there's a talk page watcher who has an interest in Canadian literature and so it continues ... Many thanks to Malleus for hosting these conversations. May your archives never overflow! --RexxS (talk) 19:54, 3 April 2012 (UTC)

I once had a dream

My dream was that just like Jean Luc Picard on the Enterprise we would all be able to ask our computer questions like "Who is Edmund Sharpe?

It may seem like a small trigger, but the fuss over Jim Hawkins has convinced me that Misplaced Pages will never be what I thought I'd signed up to. Malleus Fatuorum 01:18, 3 April 2012 (UTC)

That show exists in a setting where they have matter-energy conversion technology and go around in spaceships powered by nuclear reactions with the ease as we do with burning oil. That is, it's way advanced from what have now. Misplaced Pages is to that computer like the Model T car is to warp drive. And having warp drive centuries in the future wouldn't justify running people over with cars now. -- Seth Finkelstein (talk) 01:31, 3 April 2012 (UTC)

Some of us aren't still driving around in Model T Fords though, and my patience has worn thin with those who still (metaphorically, as I love old cars) are. Particularly if they're Californians. Malleus Fatuorum 01:35, 3 April 2012 (UTC)

But if you type "Who is Edmund Sharpe?" into Google, you get this: https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=Who+is+Edmund+Sharpe%3F - the Wikpedia biography first, followed by the list of his architectural works. I can get decent voice recognition from the Opera browser sometimes, and considering that a friend of mine who only has one-sixth vision can control his entire PC with "Dragon Naturally Speaking", I'd suggest we're a lot closer to Jean Luc's experience than you might think. --RexxS (talk) 02:53, 3 April 2012 (UTC)

Let's hope so. I visited a visually impaired sister of a friend a few months ago, and she invited me to use use her computer to book us in for lunch at a local restaurant. I was amazed at the speed at which she could hear with her browser software! Malleus Fatuorum 03:23, 3 April 2012 (UTC)

What DID you think you signed onto, Malleus? ;-) An escape from human nature? Dreamer! Montanabw 18:08, 3 April 2012 (UTC)

ANI notice

Hello. This message is being sent to inform you that there is currently a discussion at Misplaced Pages:Administrators' noticeboard/Incidents regarding an issue with which you may have been involved. Thank you. Mjroots (talk) 09:33, 3 April 2012 (UTC)

Does anyone else think that Jim Hawkins is just out for a bit of Streisand-like publicity? Parrot of Doom 10:06, 3 April 2012 (UTC)

Jim Hawkins Ltd- a commercial vehicle for the marketing of his abilities and personality. Note the section on JH Ltd's website for his personality. Ning-ning (talk) 12:09, 3 April 2012 (UTC)

I see that the BBC, no less, tells us "He loves riding his bike and playing guitar, and is also a keen photographer ... You can also hear Jim on Saturdays, weaving a web of eclectic music from 6pm .... Text during the show: 81333 and start your message with shrop." Note Malleus. that's "shrop" not "strop". But, um, not sure I feel like adding that info to his article just at the moment. Martinevans123 (talk) 12:54, 3 April 2012 (UTC)

I sure as Hell don't, I'm sick to death of him and his pusillanimous cronies. Malleus Fatuorum 16:13, 3 April 2012 (UTC)

That must count as progress in some quarters, surely. All we need now is for dear Jim to play a classic album track request or three, for his dedicated wiki followers, on his Shropshire home show. I often drive my taxi to Shrewsbury, just to listen. Martinevans123 (talk) 18:10, 3 April 2012 (UTC)

All Saints' Church, Shuart, anyone...?

Hello Malleus– I wonder, would you fancy having a look at another article for a non-existent church for me? I worked it up over the last couple of weeks and made it live yesterday. No-one else has looked at it yet (that I know of), so I'm wondering if it's the right shape, covers the right sort of stuff, or is even any good. If it passes muster, obviously it would be nice to have it as a GA, so I'd appreciate any opinions...! Trusting you're well, Nortonius (talk) 16:10, 3 April 2012 (UTC)

• What was that report criticizing FA writers for producing articles on bullshit topics that only dogs and geeks would be interested in? This looks like another one of those--well-written, on a historically relevant topic, with proper references and all. Congratulations Nortonius, but don't let the Foundation know. 207.157.121.92 (talk) 17:19, 3 April 2012 (UTC)
• Wow. Next stop FA as far as I'm concerned. 207.157.121.92 (talk) 17:24, 3 April 2012 (UTC)

Haha! You're too kind! :o) I've seen your edits, and they're just the kind of thing I was looking for– a fresh pair of eyes, etc.– but I'm very touched by your comments, they've made my day, cheers! :o) Nortonius (talk) 17:29, 3 April 2012 (UTC)

Anglo-Saxon...you know you're in a dying industry, right? Best to shift toward business and professional writing, or maybe the cultural history of <fill in repressed minority of your choice>. Thanks, BTW. I try not to impose too much in terms of punctuation. 207.157.121.92 (talk) 18:46, 3 April 2012 (UTC)

I'm not too bothered about being in a dying industry with Anglo-Saxons, they've been around a hell of a lot longer than me, and will be long after I'm gone! Somehow, the alternative doesn't appeal too much, but thanks for the advice. ;o) Punctuation's a funny thing sometimes, and I appreciate both your changes and your efforts not to change too much! Nortonius (talk) 19:18, 3 April 2012 (UTC)

"... the division of the Isle of Thanet into two eastern and western parts in the 7th century". That can't be quite right; surely there weren't two eastern and western parts but two parts, one eastern and the other western? Malleus Fatuorum 19:22, 3 April 2012 (UTC)

"... these parts of the church were connected by a recessed passageway". What parts? The chancel and the nave? Malleus Fatuorum 19:25, 3 April 2012 (UTC)

That's yes to both– thanks! I'll have a tinker... Nortonius (talk) 19:29, 3 April 2012 (UTC)

Ah, I see you're busy, I'll leave it alone for now, in that case! :o) Nortonius (talk) 19:31, 3 April 2012 (UTC)

Nearly done, but here's another: "But by 1723 the settlement was a matter of historical record". I don't think that's quite what you mean to say. Only a matter of historical record perhaps?

Yes, sort of: there's no settlement any more, just a nice farmhouse! Maybe the sentence needs re-writing...? Perhaps it could just say that the settlement had disappeared leaving only the "good farm house", or something? Nortonius (talk) 19:48, 3 April 2012 (UTC)

(edit conflict) I'd probably say something like "the settlement was a matter of historical record only". But over to you now, I'm done. Malleus Fatuorum 19:55, 3 April 2012 (UTC)

When visiting Prof. Malleus (Tarc: this position still needs to be confirmed), be prepared to take the medicine. 207.157.121.92 (talk) 19:52, 3 April 2012 (UTC)

Always– I'm quaffing mine now! Nortonius (talk) 19:53, 3 April 2012 (UTC)

I think I may join you. Another nice article BTW. I'm amazed what you can find to write about something that doesn't exist. You may even inspire me to see what I can dig up on Malkin Tower. Malleus Fatuorum 19:57, 3 April 2012 (UTC)

(edit conflict) Ah, that's fabulous Malleus, thanks so much! I'll see if you've left me anything to do. ;o) I suppose I've just spent too much of my life trying to penetrate the murk, must be something wrong with me! Senra doesn't seem to be around (hope he's ok, he said something about real life issues back in February...), so I might be touting for a GAN reviewer ere long...! Nortonius (talk) 20:02, 3 April 2012 (UTC)

Whenever you like. Obviously I haven't checked the article against all the GA criteria, but I'd be very surprised to find it wasn't a walk in the park. Malleus Fatuorum 20:05, 3 April 2012 (UTC)

You're on! I've got nothing better to do right now, apart from to continue taking my medicine! ;o) Hmm, what section to list a GAN under, though: places? I can't see anywhere more suitable, unless it's just that the medicine's working already... Nortonius (talk) 20:14, 3 April 2012 (UTC)

I'd list it under Art and architecture. Malleus Fatuorum 20:17, 3 April 2012 (UTC)

Fine, I'll do that now, and keep an eye out for you! Thanks. Nortonius (talk) 20:20, 3 April 2012 (UTC)

OK. I'm about to pop out for some essential supplies now (wink, wink, say no more) before the shops shut, so I'll pick it up later. Malleus Fatuorum 20:24, 3 April 2012 (UTC)

Art and architecture for sure Johnbod (talk) 20:28, 3 April 2012 (UTC)

(edit conflict) Thanks Johnbod. 'Tis done– fortunately I already have supplies, probably more than is wise! ;o) Nortonius (talk) 20:30, 3 April 2012 (UTC)

OK, the GA review is done, just a few little things for you to iron out, or persuade me that I'm wrong. Malleus Fatuorum 00:10, 4 April 2012 (UTC)

I don't know why but I love reading British articles on British topics. It's always so green and old. I want to go to Kent now. By the way, Malleus, I hope you didn't mind my dropping comments on the GA review; it didn't occur to me until too late that this wasn't a free-for-all FA. Obviously this article has my full support, and all my comments are minor. Speaking of articles, ehhh, I wrote another one...Misplaced Pages talk:Articles for creation/Frida Vogels...and that meanie Jasper Deng won't move it... 66.168.247.159 (talk) 03:58, 4 April 2012 (UTC)

I guess it's their quaintness? ;-) Your comments are very welcome, and you made a few good points. Some people have the wrong idea about GAN; any editor is free to voice an opinion, just like at FAC. The only convention is that the reviewer opening the review makes the final decision whether or not to list the article. Malleus Fatuorum 04:06, 4 April 2012 (UTC)

I've found it strangely satisfying ferreting out info on this deserted place, as I did with the related and similar Reculver: green, old and pretty much forgotten! Maybe something to do with faded glory... I've responded and commented at Talk:All Saints' Church, Shuart/GA1, and made related changes to the article, plus some further changes that occurred to me along the way– when you're ready! :o) Nortonius (talk) 13:32, 4 April 2012 (UTC)

Why won't Jasper move it? Seems fine to me. Malleus Fatuorum 04:09, 4 April 2012 (UTC)

I'm no expert on this subject, and therefore am not good at assessing notability here.--Jasper Deng (talk) 04:11, 4 April 2012 (UTC)

You're a buzzard after my own heart 66.168.247.159, and I'm sure it's only a matter of time before someone asks for an SPI on us. I'm going to move your new article into mainspace. Malleus Fatuorum 04:15, 4 April 2012 (UTC)

... Or I would if I had even the faintest idea of how AFC works. Click what "accept button"? Malleus Fatuorum 04:27, 4 April 2012 (UTC)

— Preceding unsigned comment added by 66.168.247.159 (talk) 04:46, 4 April 2012 (UTC)

It's tricky; if the article's ready for publishing, simply move it to the mainspace, no accept button necessary. The hard part is when a rejection occurs...--Jasper Deng (talk) 04:31, 4 April 2012 (UTC)

I've just done that and removed the AFC tag. But where's that accept button? Malleus Fatuorum 04:32, 4 April 2012 (UTC)

Not that I've heard of, unless you're using a script of some sort...--Jasper Deng (talk) 04:36, 4 April 2012 (UTC)

I was just quoting from the instructions for accepting an article, which make no sense at all. But I think everything's OK now? Malleus Fatuorum 04:38, 4 April 2012 (UTC)

Yeah, now it's time to WP:G6 the created redirects. I'll do some of that for you.--Jasper Deng (talk) 04:39, 4 April 2012 (UTC)

Thanks. I realise I left a trail of redirects behind me trying to get my head around what was going on. Malleus Fatuorum 04:43, 4 April 2012 (UTC)

I've never seen an 'accept' button, Malleus. Maybe you can give it another go? Try it with Misplaced Pages talk:Articles for creation/Thomas Rosenboom. Jasper, here's a consideration: click on the references to see if the name is mentioned and if the reference is indeed in something that has an article. Then click on Libris Prize. You win a 50,000 Euro prize in the Netherlands, you're automatically notable. It's not that hard. Malleus, Frida doesn't have a talk page yet, and I need to put a translation template up there before the GFDL cops come knocking on my door. You know, Moonriddengirl and her troupe of leather-clad, long-legged women. 66.168.247.159 (talk) 04:42, 4 April 2012 (UTC)

I'm just a person whose notability assessment ability is very confined... I don't think there will be licensing problems there.--Jasper Deng (talk) 04:44, 4 April 2012 (UTC)

WP:CWW. Rosenboom and Vogels are translations of parts of the Dutch article, plus added references and text derived from those references. But attribution is mandatory. 66.168.247.159 (talk) 04:48, 4 April 2012 (UTC)

There's an "accept" button if you install the script located here. It's a bit like Twinkle for AfC, there's an accept, a decline etc, with pre-made reasons and stuff. I'm personally a big fan of AfC, it really gives new editors a chance to work at their drafts and learn about various policies etc as they go, instead of them creating a bad stub and having it instantly CSD tagged. Bunnies! Leave a message :) 04:51, 4 April 2012 (UTC)

Ah, I'll try that out tomorrow. AFC looks like a very good idea; strange I'd never heard of it until yesterday. Malleus Fatuorum 04:54, 4 April 2012 (UTC)

It is a good idea! There's often a lot of submissions that will never be passed, for notability reasons, but some just need working on and the users taught about sources and neutrality etc. I'm not sure how long it's been around for, not that long that I know of. My familiarity with it comes from hanging out in the IRC help channel. There's a link to that channel in a few places around AfC so most of the people popping in are looking for advice with their submissions. They're usually very determined to get the submissions accepted, so very willing to read all the links to sourcing guidelines etc. I think it's a really good way to improve and filter the new articles coming into Misplaced Pages. ..I think I'm done singing its praises now, heh. Bunnies! Leave a message :) 05:01, 4 April 2012 (UTC)

I seem to have buggered up moving Thomas Rosenboom from AFC. Can you sort it out, or does it need an administrator? I thought I'd got my head round it, but obviously I was deceiving myself. Malleus Fatuorum 05:04, 4 April 2012 (UTC)

Yeah, I've gone ahead and G6'd those redirects.--Jasper Deng (talk) 05:07, 4 April 2012 (UTC)

A kind admin fixed the Thomas Rosenboom page. Just forgot to remove the "Articles for Creation/" prefix, I think? Anyway, all fixed now. Bunnies! Leave a message :) 05:09, 4 April 2012 (UTC)

It's a fair swap - MF turns my plodding prose into poetic er... poetry, and I do the occasional admin-related favour for him (delete his accidental redirects, block his enemies, protect his articles in his favourite version, etc...) Bencherlite 05:14, 4 April 2012 (UTC)

Hopefully the script that OohBunnies drew my attention to will ease your burden in cleaning up after me. Malleus Fatuorum 05:20, 4 April 2012 (UTC)

If only there was a script that would ease your burden in cleaning up what I write! Bencherlite 05:24, 4 April 2012 (UTC)

• Thank you all, again. Bencherlite, your name triggers the word "Belcher" in my brain, for which I apologize. Malleus, I don't think I care for this Rosenboom dude, but I am going to get my hands on Vogels' trilogy. 207.157.121.92 (talk) 14:24, 4 April 2012 (UTC)

why I read ...

puss ... poossa ... pussel ... <deep breath> ... pusillanimous .... whew! Great word!!! — Ched :  ?  21:22, 3 April 2012 (UTC)

It's a good word. I'm also quite fond of "ineluctable", which I probably overuse. Strangely though I don't think I've ever used either of those words in speech, only in writing. Malleus Fatuorum 00:14, 4 April 2012 (UTC)

GA for All Saints'!

Thanks so much Malleus, I was busy answering a question from 207.157.121.92 and didn't even notice you'd already given it GA! The medicine must've worked then...! I'll be off in a bit as a mate's coming over with more BEER, but I'll be sure to offer a toast to you! :D Nortonius (talk) 17:56, 4 April 2012 (UTC)

I've run out of medicine, time for another trip to the shops. Malleus Fatuorum 17:58, 4 April 2012 (UTC)

PS. Don't be afraid to drop by any time you've got another article on a non-existent church. ;-) Malleus Fatuorum 18:03, 4 April 2012 (UTC)

Ah, I've had my medicine for tonight, feeling quite chipper by my standards thanks in no small part to you! I'd be rubbing my hands with glee and cackling ominously, but I don't have another non-existent church up my sleeve right now! I wonder... ;o) Nortonius (talk) 23:11, 4 April 2012 (UTC)

Block party for Kiefer.Wolfowitz

Salvio has announced he's going to block me, after the usual searching discussion at ANI by the usual suspects, some of whom sighed that they had wished I had learned from my RfC and my two previous blocks....

Scottywong chastised me at Design of experiments, explaining to me that "we repeat reliable sources but don't need to be experts"---this, after I removed unsourced material from the lede (that had many problems).

Nice knowing you! :)

You all are too good for this place.

 Kiefer.Wolfowitz 20:40, 4 April 2012 (UTC)

Apart from those "usual suspects" there doesn't seem to be much support for a block. Malleus Fatuorum 22:40, 4 April 2012 (UTC)

I was in a foul mood 2-4 April over the ridiculous Peter Orno. Am I such a shallow person that I really cared about 10 thousand more readers and possible media coverage...? Yes---but not Yes (band) or Yes (band) album covers or---"my masterpiece"---~Category:Yes (band) Yes Album album covers, which does serve a purpose  Kiefer.Wolfowitz 22:53, 4 April 2012 (UTC)

I see I spoke too soon. Ah well, enjoy your break. Malleus Fatuorum 00:03, 5 April 2012 (UTC)

South Stoneham House

Thanks hugely for your review of this article and for the substantial clean-up job you carried out to the article itself. I've now responded to all your comments at Talk:South Stoneham House/GA1 - there are still some things I need to address by going away and finding some more sources, but I'd appreciate it if you could check you're happy with the things I've marked as done. Thanks again, waggers (talk) 08:30, 5 April 2012 (UTC)

Yes, I'm quite happy with what you've addressed so far. The only thing holding us up now is that Interior section. Malleus Fatuorum 17:15, 5 April 2012 (UTC)

Dispute resolution survey

Dispute Resolution – Survey Invite Hello Eric Corbett. I am currently conducting a study on the dispute resolution processes on the English Misplaced Pages, in the hope that the results will help improve these processes in the future. Whether you have used dispute resolution a little or a lot, now we need to know about your experience. The survey takes around five minutes, and the information you provide will not be shared with third parties other than to assist in analyzing the results of the survey. No personally identifiable information will be released. Please click HERE to participate. Many thanks in advance for your comments and thoughts. You are receiving this invitation because you have had some activity in dispute resolution over the past year. For more information, please see the associated research page. Steven Zhang 11:31, 5 April 2012 (UTC)

How...ironic.Intothatdarkness (talk) 13:38, 5 April 2012 (UTC)

How so? Are you saying that Malleus's opinions don't matter, or that Steven shouldn't be trying to identify why Misplaced Pages's dispute resolution process aren't working? – iridescent 2 15:46, 5 April 2012 (UTC)

I just happen to find it ironic.Intothatdarkness (talk) 16:17, 5 April 2012 (UTC)

In what way? Malleus Fatuorum 16:55, 5 April 2012 (UTC)

It just happens to hit my sense of irony, in part I suspect because of the dove graphic. Nothing more. Actually, I do hope that there are some useful outcomes from such a survey.Intothatdarkness (talk) 17:13, 5 April 2012 (UTC)

Interestingly and quite appropriately the dove is flying out of the image. Which is entirely consistent with my own experiences at venues like ArbCom and AN/I, where the main agenda seems to be to punish and exact vengeance in pursuit of some long-standing vendetta or other. Malleus Fatuorum 17:18, 5 April 2012 (UTC)

That's just how the image was rotated. If I had placed it on the left side of the message, it'd have been flying into it. Purely unintentional, but a little ironic. I've offered the survey to around 1,100 people (with another 800 to be offered depending on response rate) so I do hope some decent responses come out of the survey. Early results look good, this was exactly why I wanted to survey the community. I'd appreciate your input on the survey Malleus, as I would appreciate everyone's comments. Steven Zhang 00:57, 6 April 2012 (UTC)

You could just rotate it back. Anyway, I've completed the survey for whatever that may be worth. Malleus Fatuorum 01:01, 6 April 2012 (UTC)

Great, thanks. Steven Zhang 02:35, 6 April 2012 (UTC)

Proper English

Hey Mal, I've been pondering an English situation that I've seen mentioned several times on Wiki. I recently ran across an article I thought would be a good example to ask about. Yes (band); the first sentence: Yes are an English rock band who achieved worldwide success with their progressive,... My question revolves around the use of "is" vs. "are". Now, my own personal thought is this. "Yes are an English rock band..." simply feels awkward to me. Now I grew up with a mother who was an American grade school English teacher, so perhaps that has some influence on my views here. My thought is that "Yes" as a collective group is a singular entity, and the word "is" should be used. If the sentence were along the lines of "The members of Yes are such and such" .. then I agree with the use of the "are", but as it is, "is" feels more comfortable to me. I've been told that there are different views on proper English between British vs. American speech, and I wanted to hear your thoughts on this. Thanks. — Ched :  ?  16:32, 5 April 2012 (UTC)

Sorry to chime in on this one, but as I recall under British English "are" is correct because in this instance the band is viewed as a collective, and thus plural, entity. In U.S. English we tend to view the band as a singular entity, hence the use of "is." I agree that to U.S. ears it does sound awkward, but I've had enough experience with the British use to recognize the difference. And if I'm wrong, I'm sure Malleus will smack me upside the head with a cricket bat.Intothatdarkness (talk) 16:43, 5 April 2012 (UTC)

Either could be correct, so long as it's used consistently. The same issue crops up frequently with football (soccer) teams, which it's common to refer to as plural here: "Manchester United have won the Premier League title 19 times" for instance. But it starts to look a bit awkward when later the same article says something like "the club is ...", as the "the club are" is just wrong, wrong, wrong.

The strict rule is the one you'd apply to a decision made by your local council: was the decision made by the council or the members of the council? If the former, as it would usually be, then "the council has decided ..." would be correct. To put another perspective on it, would you say "the family owed its wealth" or "the family owed their wealth"? The distinction there is that in the latter case the family's wealth is distributed among the members of the family, rather in some central pot. So, to come back to your example of Yes, it depends on whether you're talking about a conglomeration of the individual members of the band, or the band as a corporate entity so to speak, and in your specific example you could probably plausibly argue for either. My slight preference would be to consider "Yes" to be a corporate entity, and in that case singular, but as I said, the trick is to be consistent throughout the article whichever side of the argument you come down on. Malleus Fatuorum 17:09, 5 April 2012 (UTC)

The real trick is not to worry about it, as somebody will eventually "fix" the issue for you. A minute's quick browse reveals a slight lack of consistency within and among our articles:

• Genesis are an English rock band ... The band currently consists ... Genesis (band)
• Blind Faith was an English blues-rock band ... Blind Faith
• Family were an English rock band ... Family (band)

Malleus is absolutely right about whether we are thinking about several individuals or a corporate entity to decide between plural and singular. Of course, anything that depends on context will inevitably been seen in different ways by different folks. Diversity is good. --RexxS (talk) 17:26, 5 April 2012 (UTC)

• Thank you all for the clarification(s). 28bytes also pointed me to WP:PLURALS and WP:ENGVAR. I probably should have searched through the mounds of MOS stuff first, but I was looking for a quick reply. And I agree that consistency is the key here - but like Diogenes, I suppose I better fill up my lamp and not count on it. As cynical as I've gotten though, I do enjoy it when I learn something new here - and once again, that's what just happened. cheers. — Ched :  ?  20:02, 5 April 2012 (UTC)

Prenatal Care in the United States

My name is Allyssa Abacan, a student from Rice University. I see that you have done a number of edits to the article Prenatal care in the United States.

I am writing this article for a course. Template:WAP assignment

I would love to hear your feedback so I can improve my writing and editing skills in the Wiki format for this particular article. Any feedback or advice would be greatly appreciated. Thank you. Allyssa.abacan (talk) 16:50, 5 April 2012 (UTC)

I'll have a proper read through later today or tomorrow and leave any observations I may have on your talk page. Malleus Fatuorum 17:11, 5 April 2012 (UTC)

Sock puppet

Mr. Malleus, your love for ferrets has gotten the better of you: User:Larrythefunkyferret? 66.168.247.159 (talk) 02:30, 6 April 2012 (UTC)

Nothing to do with me. Malleus Fatuorum 02:33, 6 April 2012 (UTC)

Judging only by a quick look at the user page, it doesn't strike me that Larry resembles you in the least. It's not that surprising to find more than one ferret-lover on Misplaced Pages, is it? LadyofShalott 02:41, 6 April 2012 (UTC)

I dunno: "This user is an out of control renegade editor who's thought of by some Wikiprojects as a...loose cannon." But it's definitely not me. Malleus Fatuorum 02:45, 6 April 2012 (UTC)

And wouldn't say that I love ferrets exactly, any more than I'd say that I love cats or dogs. I love individual ferrets, cats, or dogs, but ferrets have many unappreciated good qualities, and they've had a consistently bad press for far too long. They're domesticated animals and they deserve our respect and friendship. So if anyone visits they have to be prepared for the possibility that they'll be kissed and licked by little furry animals with big teeth, which they might previously have thought of as being nasty, bitey, and smelly. Seems to have worked so far, as there's tumbleweed blowing down the drive now. :lol: Malleus Fatuorum 03:06, 6 April 2012 (UTC)

"nasty, bitey, and smelly" sounds like a lot of the Recent Change Patrollers that ran into me recently. 66.168.247.159 (talk) 03:11, 6 April 2012 (UTC)

(talk page stalker) Ferrets smell truly weird, like a jar of honey that's been fermenting in an "off" way in an open container in the middle of a summer day. How else do you describe it? Doc talk 03:15, 6 April 2012 (UTC)

I've not spent any time around ferrets, though I suspect I'd enjoy changing that. You're right that that the description you quote could be applicable to you - I was thinking more in terms of editing interests. In any case, I think 66 was being a bit tongue-in-cheek with the socking accusation, and if not, well, I'd enjoy seeing the response of the SPI clerk who turns down the case. LadyofShalott 03:25, 6 April 2012 (UTC)

Just a bit, yes. However, I wasn't kidding about the patrollers. 66.168.247.159 (talk) 03:28, 6 April 2012 (UTC)

How they smell depends on their reproductive state, which will obviously vary throughout the year. Intact males can smell pretty rank when they're in season, but neutered ferrets don't really smell of anything except their bedding; our first ferret spent so much time sitting in my wife's lap that he smelt of her perfume. In general though I'd say that ferrets have a "biscuity" smell, and the darker ones a very slight smell of chocolate. Malleus Fatuorum 03:34, 6 April 2012 (UTC)

I must have smelled too many of the males: the last "business" of ferrets (I looked it up '>) that I encountered was a group of six in Maine, mixed males and females (half of them "albino"). Only one of them was "bitey", BTW, and she'd sneak up on the unsuspecting. Nice animals, nothing bad to say about them. I haven't found a good replacement for a nice loyal cat though. Doc talk 03:41, 6 April 2012 (UTC)

I'm with you there. I had a beautiful black cat I'll never forget. She was passionately in love with me, and me with her. Whenever I was packing to go away on business she'd try and get in my suitcase, and she'd mope until I came home again. I was devastated when she had to make that final trip to the vet, couldn't stop crying. Malleus Fatuorum 04:05, 6 April 2012 (UTC)

I have a dog that's getting old. I don't enjoy looking ahead. 66.168.247.159 (talk) 04:09, 6 April 2012 (UTC)

1740 Batavia massacre

Hi Malleus, it looks like (for better or for worse) Misplaced Pages:Featured article candidates/Chrisye/archive1 will close within a week. I was thinking of putting 1740 Batavia massacre (an A-class article) through FAC next, but the prose could probably using a little polishing. Last time user Dank opposed due to prose issues. I'd appreciate if you could look at the article and let me know if anything is unclear for someone unversed in Indonesian history, as well as put it in accordance with British English standards (I'm not a native BrE speaker, but CaE). If you could help that would be greatly appreciated! Also, thanks for the help with Chrisye Crisco 1492 (talk) 08:06, 6 April 2012 (UTC)

I had noted....

Yes, I noted you'd held of commenting at the RFA (I was waiting for it!), and as ever you're being consistent. No arguments from me at all. Best. Pedro :  Chat  08:39, 6 April 2012 (UTC)

Your personal attacks

Please consider reverting your replacement of the personal attack against another wiki user -we all have a mind, please remove your insult - thanks in advance -Youreallycan 17:57, 6 April 2012 (UTC)