| Revision as of 13:30, 7 November 2012 editMathsci (talk | contribs)Autopatrolled, Extended confirmed users, Pending changes reviewers66,107 edits →Mathsci et al← Previous edit | Revision as of 14:35, 7 November 2012 edit undoCIreland (talk | contribs)Administrators19,680 edits →Mathsci et al: some historyNext edit → | ||
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| :Am I mistaken that the dispute started with the ] article? I would welcome any assistance in understanding the history of the conflict. I am aware that things are not always what they seem, which is why I am thinking that a case to examine evidence might be helpful. ''']''' ''']''' 11:40, 7 November 2012 (UTC) | :Am I mistaken that the dispute started with the ] article? I would welcome any assistance in understanding the history of the conflict. I am aware that things are not always what they seem, which is why I am thinking that a case to examine evidence might be helpful. ''']''' ''']''' 11:40, 7 November 2012 (UTC) | ||
| ::You are mistaken, SilkTork. A.K.Nole created one of his first sockpuppet accounts on ''2 March 2009'', before A.K.Nole had made any edits as part of {{user|The Wiki House}}. That account was {{userlinks|Holding Ray}}. Things are far more complicated than you imagine and, as Cireland writes, what you put on the RfAr page was "ill-informed twaddle". Please wait for the LTA to be prepared when I am less ill. Whether or not A.K.Nole was active before that, I don't know. Somebody did tell me that his WR username is Grep, which goes back to 2008. He certainly had it in for Elonka: his name is Elonka spelt backwards (as various admins have pointed out) and he edited the article on ], where she used to work. Holding Ray was blocked by CU Shell Kinney as a sockpuppet of A.K.Nole after I left a note on her talk page. Thanks, ] (]) 13:28, 7 November 2012 (UTC) | ::You are mistaken, SilkTork. A.K.Nole created one of his first sockpuppet accounts on ''2 March 2009'', before A.K.Nole had made any edits as part of {{user|The Wiki House}}. That account was {{userlinks|Holding Ray}}. Things are far more complicated than you imagine and, as Cireland writes, what you put on the RfAr page was "ill-informed twaddle". Please wait for the LTA to be prepared when I am less ill. Whether or not A.K.Nole was active before that, I don't know. Somebody did tell me that his WR username is Grep, which goes back to 2008. He certainly had it in for Elonka: his name is Elonka spelt backwards (as various admins have pointed out) and he edited the article on ], where she used to work. Holding Ray was blocked by CU Shell Kinney as a sockpuppet of A.K.Nole after I left a note on her talk page. Thanks, ] (]) 13:28, 7 November 2012 (UTC) | ||
| ::(edit conflict with Mathsci, pardon any repetition) A.K.Nole was part of web of sock or meatpuppets (more likely the latter) - see ] for example. The A.K.Nole account itself seems to have been created originally to target ] who identifies as ] (Obviously A.K.Nole is Elonka reversed; some of the account's earliest substantial edits targeted ], the company Elonka works for). I was never really sure why Elonka was singled out; it could have been just a result of the prior controversy concerning the Elonka Dunin article (see the AFDs) or maybe it all stemmed from one of the areas of dispute resolution Elonka was involved in: since A.K.Nole was obviously not a first account, it's impossible to be sure. | |||
| ::As to where the harassment of Mathsci started, it's again impossible to know. Maybe it was a chance dispute at ]; maybe a sock had had a prior run-in with Mathsci; maybe s/he was just stirring the pot. What is clear is that immediately after the deletion of the ] the harassment of Mathsci began in earnest; following Mathsci to obscure mathematical articles, editing the article ], some kerfuffle about Mathsci's name being trademark infringement or somesuch. And, if we assume, as seems highly likely, that the A.K.Nole account et al. are related to the Echigo mole sockfarm then that pursuit has persisted for over three years now and has increased in severity in include "We know where you live" style edits to articles on Mathsci's town, street and nearby landmarks. | |||
| ::Some arbitrators have suggested that Mathsci "step back" from the "dispute". If there ever was a "dispute" that started all this then it is no longer tenable to dignify it with that title; there is now only harassment. As for "stepping back" - the socks deliberately target articles on obscure advanced mathematics (just as A.K.Nole did) so that only Mathsci will spot them or they inject themselves into other content disputes so that when Mathsci points out what is going on, those unaware of the history may misinterpret Mathsci's understandable impatience as battleground conduct. Mathsci tries to do what is recommended - files SPI reports, informs admins, asks for help at ANI etc., and is absurdly told by some that if he just stopped chasing the socks all this would simply stop. | |||
| ::I hope I have illustrated why the suggestion you made on the arbitration page that this may all be a result of Mathsci's "manner" is untenable. I hope I also made clear why characterising three years of harassment as "needling" was also not the best choice of words. ] (]) 14:35, 7 November 2012 (UTC) | |||
Revision as of 14:35, 7 November 2012
SilkTork
I will listen to you, especially when we disagree.
— Barack Obama
Category:People associated with The Beatles
Category:People associated with The Beatles, which you created, has been nominated for possible deletion, merging, or renaming. If you would like to participate in the discussion, you are invited to add your comments at the category's entry on the Categories for discussion page. Thank you. —Justin (koavf)❤T☮C☺M☯ 09:13, 3 November 2012 (UTC)
- Thanks for the notice. Do you have a viable alternative for how to categorise the people associated with the Beatles? Deleting that cat will simply push those people unsorted into the main Beatles cat. SilkTork 09:54, 3 November 2012 (UTC)
Takashi Yanase
Takashi Yanase - please restore the old version, he is clearly notable for wikipedia. See for example , , . -- M.Marangio (talk) 19:33, 3 November 2012 (UTC)
- It wouldn't be appropriate to restore the article as it is unsourced. Your links, though, are interesting. I'm not sure they are enough by themselves to allow a stand alone article, but the first one appears to contain a reasonable amount of information to allow a start to be made. I suggest you start an article in a subpage of your user space, and when you feel it is ready to move into mainspace I'll be happy to look it over for you. If you are not sure how to set up a subpage, let me know, and I'll do it for you. SilkTork 20:12, 3 November 2012 (UTC)
RfC close
Thanks for the close. I've read it through a couple of times, and it's fair, thoughtful, and makes the key points for both support and oppose. I appreciate the time and effort you put into it. Mike Christie (talk - contribs - library) 15:29, 6 November 2012 (UTC)
- Thank you. SilkTork 15:50, 6 November 2012 (UTC)
Mathsci et al
While I understand that arbitrators have the misfortune to have to make comments based only on snapshots and summaries, to anyone who remembers the relevant events of 2009 this will read like so much ill-informed twaddle. CIreland (talk) 11:27, 7 November 2012 (UTC)
- Am I mistaken that the dispute started with the Jeremy Dunning-Davies article? I would welcome any assistance in understanding the history of the conflict. I am aware that things are not always what they seem, which is why I am thinking that a case to examine evidence might be helpful. SilkTork 11:40, 7 November 2012 (UTC)
- You are mistaken, SilkTork. A.K.Nole created one of his first sockpuppet accounts on 2 March 2009, before A.K.Nole had made any edits as part of The Wiki House (talk · contribs). That account was Holding Ray (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · logs · filter log · block user · block log). Things are far more complicated than you imagine and, as Cireland writes, what you put on the RfAr page was "ill-informed twaddle". Please wait for the LTA to be prepared when I am less ill. Whether or not A.K.Nole was active before that, I don't know. Somebody did tell me that his WR username is Grep, which goes back to 2008. He certainly had it in for Elonka: his name is Elonka spelt backwards (as various admins have pointed out) and he edited the article on Simutronics, where she used to work. Holding Ray was blocked by CU Shell Kinney as a sockpuppet of A.K.Nole after I left a note on her talk page. Thanks, Mathsci (talk) 13:28, 7 November 2012 (UTC)
- (edit conflict with Mathsci, pardon any repetition) A.K.Nole was part of web of sock or meatpuppets (more likely the latter) - see Misplaced Pages:Sockpuppet investigations/The Wiki House/Archive for example. The A.K.Nole account itself seems to have been created originally to target User:Elonka who identifies as Elonka Dunin (Obviously A.K.Nole is Elonka reversed; some of the account's earliest substantial edits targeted Simutronics, the company Elonka works for). I was never really sure why Elonka was singled out; it could have been just a result of the prior controversy concerning the Elonka Dunin article (see the AFDs) or maybe it all stemmed from one of the areas of dispute resolution Elonka was involved in: since A.K.Nole was obviously not a first account, it's impossible to be sure.
- As to where the harassment of Mathsci started, it's again impossible to know. Maybe it was a chance dispute at Jeremy Dunning-Davies; maybe a sock had had a prior run-in with Mathsci; maybe s/he was just stirring the pot. What is clear is that immediately after the deletion of the Jeremy Dunning-Davies the harassment of Mathsci began in earnest; following Mathsci to obscure mathematical articles, editing the article Mathsci, some kerfuffle about Mathsci's name being trademark infringement or somesuch. And, if we assume, as seems highly likely, that the A.K.Nole account et al. are related to the Echigo mole sockfarm then that pursuit has persisted for over three years now and has increased in severity in include "We know where you live" style edits to articles on Mathsci's town, street and nearby landmarks.
- Some arbitrators have suggested that Mathsci "step back" from the "dispute". If there ever was a "dispute" that started all this then it is no longer tenable to dignify it with that title; there is now only harassment. As for "stepping back" - the socks deliberately target articles on obscure advanced mathematics (just as A.K.Nole did) so that only Mathsci will spot them or they inject themselves into other content disputes so that when Mathsci points out what is going on, those unaware of the history may misinterpret Mathsci's understandable impatience as battleground conduct. Mathsci tries to do what is recommended - files SPI reports, informs admins, asks for help at ANI etc., and is absurdly told by some that if he just stopped chasing the socks all this would simply stop.
- I hope I have illustrated why the suggestion you made on the arbitration page that this may all be a result of Mathsci's "manner" is untenable. I hope I also made clear why characterising three years of harassment as "needling" was also not the best choice of words. CIreland (talk) 14:35, 7 November 2012 (UTC)