Talk:Tea Party movement/Moderated discussion: Difference between revisions

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	*'''Reduce content''' The article should provide a good overview of the Tea Party movement and not stay mired in excessive details. Perhaps merge 2010/2012 elections with another article like ]. Merge anything that deals with protests over to ]. If it's something that happened at a protest, it really belongs in that article. Nothing should be duplicated here in this article, which is a bit long to begin with. ] (]) 03:53, 12 April 2013 (UTC)		*'''Reduce content''' The article should provide a good overview of the Tea Party movement and not stay mired in excessive details. Perhaps merge 2010/2012 elections with another article like ]. Merge anything that deals with protests over to ]. If it's something that happened at a protest, it really belongs in that article. Nothing should be duplicated here in this article, which is a bit long to begin with. ] (]) 03:53, 12 April 2013 (UTC)

			*'''Framing of the article''' The article currently is disjointed, due largely to what I see as efforts by proponents to use the page for advocacy.
			:P&W wants the TPm to be treated like a political party, but it is not. Neither is it a "phenomena" as North claims. It is a loose collection of organizations, some with disparate agendas. Malke states above that the article should "not stay mired in excessive details", which I assume means that, as in the case of the Agenda section, she wants to minimize the content so that the article presents only information that serves the purpose of advocacy as opposed to providing encyclopedic coverage of the topic.
			:The article should be organized more on topical issues as addressed in secondary sources, not primary source material by TPm activists or leaders.
			:The ''Agenda'' section is the prime example of the problem. Whereas secondary sources addressing topical issues related to the TPm focus on issues such as the constitution and immigration, the Agenda section is taken up almost entirely by the "Contract from America", which is basically a document that has been used in an effort to recruit people, including politicians to the TPm. It features a superficial list of items and contains information that is trivialized in the article, "''lawyer Ryan Hecker...stated that he developed the concept of creating a grassroots call for reform''". Not only does that indicate that it was a top-down generated platform, but the Tea Party Patriots are the only group apparently involved in the largely failed effort to have the platform adopted. In other words, the Contract from America is given undue prominence, and there is not a single secondary source discussing it. Seeing as it has its own article, that should be substantially reduced in accordance with WP:UNDUE, and secondary sources introduced.
			:The domestic issues having the greatest import include:
			#The constitution
			#Taxation
			#Immigration
			#The role/size of the government
			:Considering that the TPm is almost entirely restricted to the USA, it is very strange that the Agenda section obscures the domestic issues that could be considered as primary motivators for the grass-roots participants, relegating them to blurbs, yet prominently features foreign policy. That belies a total lack of balance in the ''Agenda'' section.] <sup>]</sup><sub>]</sub> 05:37, 12 April 2013 (UTC)

Revision as of 05:37, 12 April 2013

Background

Extended content
I made a comment on the ArbCom case that I would be happy to moderate a discussion. I would be looking to draw people together on the broader issues that concern contributors. One of the concerns I have noted is regarding the amount of material in the article, and I think that might be a useful starting point. However, the first stage would be to ensure that nobody has an objection to a moderated discussion, or to me being the person to hold it. I'd like to wait a day or two for responses or queries to my offer of doing this before getting fully stuck into a content discussion. SilkTork 15:25, 8 April 2013 (UTC) support and thanks Darkstar1st (talk) 15:30, 8 April 2013 (UTC) support We need it. North8000 (talk) 15:47, 8 April 2013 (UTC) Support even though I do not qualify as active here really. Collect (talk) 15:50, 8 April 2013 (UTC) ~~Oppose for now~~. per comment on ArbCom talk page. Malke 2010 (talk) 16:04, 8 April 2013 (UTC) Support I reviewed a few ArbCom pages and can see why, in comparison to other cases, the TPM is not on the front burner, so I see no reason to delay until this case is settled. Also, I read again Silk Tork's comments on ArbCom and feel he is very insightful and likely to help sort the situation here to everyone's satisfaction. Malke 2010 (talk) 18:08, 9 April 2013 (UTC) Support Moderation by a previously uninvolved person with some authority is badly needed. Phoenix and Winslow (talk) 16:59, 8 April 2013 (UTC) Support ----Snowded 18:15, 8 April 2013 (UTC) Support Of course, after the Arbcom case is closed. Mediation could be integrated into the remedial measures forthcoming there.--Ubikwit _{見学/迷惑} 18:22, 8 April 2013 (UTC) Support. Binksternet (talk) 23:23, 8 April 2013 (UTC) No objection. I understand Malke's point of view, but I think SilkTork could do something to ameliorate her (Malke's) concerns. As she is a major contributor to the talk page, I think that her concerns need to be dealt with to the extent possible. I should add that now there is strong evidence toward Xenophrenic's tendentious editing in intentionally disregarding the obvious meaning of Malke's comments (in the "anti-immigration" section) in favor of an absurd interpretation, so I'm not sure that Malke's concerns can be met without unjustly protecting Xenophrenic. I would like to support, as it may provide a way out of this mess, but Malke's concerns need to be met so that she can freely participate. — Arthur Rubin (talk) 20:22, 8 April 2013 (UTC) Would the editor who made the redactions kindly so identify themselves? Referring to edits is generally not cnsidered a "personal attack" on Misplaced Pages. Collect (talk) 22:48, 8 April 2013 (UTC) <Collect please undo your post, so I can revert Xenophrenic's redaction of Arthur Rubin's comment. Your edit is in the way. Thanks.Malke 2010 (talk) 22:53, 8 April 2013 (UTC) Nevermind, I reverted it manually. Malke 2010 (talk) 22:59, 8 April 2013 (UTC) Xenophrenic has redacted Arthur's comment three times now and that seems WP:Disrupt to me. Malke 2010 (talk) 23:09, 8 April 2013 (UTC) Xenophrenic reverts/redactions and again and again . Malke 2010 (talk) 23:14, 8 April 2013 (UTC) It's too late to formally add Xenophrenic to the RfAr, as it's already past the workshop stage. And, if someone would point me to an appropriate forum to comment on WP:TE by editors not already named in the RfAr, I would do it there instead of here, for the most part. However, it's also a potential reason why I might object to this proposal, so it's not completely out of line to mention it here, even if Xenophrenic thinks it is. — Arthur Rubin (talk) 00:59, 9 April 2013 (UTC) Redaction was wrong but so was your one sided accusation. P&G would also be a candidate and you're not an innocent. I suggest you try and reduce the temperature rather than provoking others ----Snowded 06:03, 9 April 2013 (UTC) Arthur didn't make a one-sided accusation. He's simply pointing out Xenophrenic's behavior in an accurate, measured, well-written comment that is not at all a personal attack. Xenophrenic has also violated WP:CIVIL and WP:DISRUPT. It's disruptive to keep redacting another editor's comments without bringing it up on the talk page. Why not post an explanation here for other editors to see and comment, too? That gives the editor the chance to redact his own comments. It's also disruptive for Xenophrenic to imply that sources he's using are sanctioned by "ArbCom" because Silk Tork suggested them on the Workshop talk page. And his incivility and refusal to strike through his comments are worrisome. Xenophrenic is quick to demand that other editor's redact their comments about him, but he won't extend the same courtesy when they object to what he's said about them. In fact, he argues more vigorously that's he right and the editor is wrong. Malke 2010 (talk) 12:07, 9 April 2013 (UTC) Malke's concerns are that editors "must be extra careful in what they say", and that an editor has used something from one of the sources I noted. The sources I mentioned were The Guardian, Britannica, The Independent, and infoplease. I'd rather people were extra careful. I'd always rather people were extra careful - all the time, on every page, not just ones that are being watched. Having said that, I understand frustration when editing contentious subjects, and expect tempers to fray now and again. However, when moderating content discussions I encourage focus on content not contributor, and let people know I will hat discussions that are off-topic and distracting. As regards concerns about any sanctions coming from the ArbCom case. I cannot speak for the other Committee members, but I don't see sufficient poor behaviour in those editing this article to justify sanctions. This is a highly contentious and polarising topic, and - if anything - I have been impressed by how you folks have held it together for so long. What I am interested in is not sanctioning anyone, but in helping you folks improve the article and reach a compromise that satisfies the main contributors, and so results in a fair, honest and balanced article that will be helpful to the general reader. I don't think it will be easy, nor will it be quick, but if everyone is willing to have a positive attitude toward this attempt, then I think it will work. I'm not clear on the problem as regards the sources. I suspect, Malke, what you saying is not that you have an issue with the sources, but that suggestions I make may be used to justify actions that may not be helpful. My aim as a moderator, is to assist you folks reach the decisions and actions yourself, rather than me make the decisions for you folks to follow. But, yes, at times I may be pushing for a decision, and if things are deadlocked I will offer suggestions. As Malke is the main contributor to the article, I think working with an objection would be difficult, so will wait for further comments. SilkTork 00:34, 9 April 2013 (UTC) Although I have been in some correspondence with Malke off-Wiki, I would like to ask here on-Wiki, whether Malke's objection is that edits based on sources mentioned by SilkTork might be perceived to have a "stamp of approval", and not be as subject to critical review. If so, if SilkTork could give what asssurances that he honestly can, it might be adequate for Malke. — Arthur Rubin (talk) 00:59, 9 April 2013 (UTC) I have not given my approval for any edits. And that is not the role I would envisage taking. I am not here as a member of ArbCom, but as a fellow editor. My role would be to moderate discussions, assist with keeping them on task, and look for agreement and consensus on how to move the article toward a balanced and acceptable position. SilkTork 01:12, 9 April 2013 (UTC) I believe the Britannica is a problematic source at best - it is tertiary by definition, and solicits proposed edits from readers (one step from a Wiki). In short, we would best be advised not to use it as a source here. IMHO. Collect (talk) 02:03, 9 April 2013 (UTC) As Malke still appears to have an objection I will withdraw my offer of assistance. I do urge folks here to get someone in to moderate a discussion to look at the bigger issues. SilkTork 12:29, 9 April 2013 (UTC) @Malke, I'm waiting to hear your response to ST's withdrawal of his offer to moderate based on a perception that you have some objection to that. Since your objection seems irrational to me, and as I do not particularly share your opinion regarding EdJohnson's qualifications, I would be categorically opposed to him being the moderator. If you are intent on cherry-picking a moderator, perhaps mandatory mediation with Arbcom appointed mediators would be the proper way to proceed.--Ubikwit _{見学/迷惑} 14:37, 9 April 2013 (UTC) While my opinion was opposite to Malke's, I think that they expressed sincere considerations, and a sincere attempt at making a good suggestion. I think it is not warranted and not very nice to call that "cherry-picking" a moderator, which implies several other things. North8000 (talk) 19:02, 9 April 2013 (UTC)

Extended content

I made a comment on the ArbCom case that I would be happy to moderate a discussion. I would be looking to draw people together on the broader issues that concern contributors. One of the concerns I have noted is regarding the amount of material in the article, and I think that might be a useful starting point. However, the first stage would be to ensure that nobody has an objection to a moderated discussion, or to me being the person to hold it. I'd like to wait a day or two for responses or queries to my offer of doing this before getting fully stuck into a content discussion. SilkTork 15:25, 8 April 2013 (UTC)

support and thanks Darkstar1st (talk) 15:30, 8 April 2013 (UTC)
support We need it. North8000 (talk) 15:47, 8 April 2013 (UTC)
Support even though I do not qualify as active here really. Collect (talk) 15:50, 8 April 2013 (UTC)
~~Oppose for now~~. per comment on ArbCom talk page. Malke 2010 (talk) 16:04, 8 April 2013 (UTC)
Support I reviewed a few ArbCom pages and can see why, in comparison to other cases, the TPM is not on the front burner, so I see no reason to delay until this case is settled. Also, I read again Silk Tork's comments on ArbCom and feel he is very insightful and likely to help sort the situation here to everyone's satisfaction. Malke 2010 (talk) 18:08, 9 April 2013 (UTC)
Support Moderation by a previously uninvolved person with some authority is badly needed. Phoenix and Winslow (talk) 16:59, 8 April 2013 (UTC)
Support ----Snowded 18:15, 8 April 2013 (UTC)
Support Of course, after the Arbcom case is closed. Mediation could be integrated into the remedial measures forthcoming there.--Ubikwit _{見学/迷惑} 18:22, 8 April 2013 (UTC)
Support. Binksternet (talk) 23:23, 8 April 2013 (UTC)
No objection. I understand Malke's point of view, but I think SilkTork could do something to ameliorate her (Malke's) concerns. As she is a major contributor to the talk page, I think that her concerns need to be dealt with to the extent possible. I should add that now there is strong evidence toward Xenophrenic's tendentious editing in intentionally disregarding the obvious meaning of Malke's comments (in the "anti-immigration" section) in favor of an absurd interpretation, so I'm not sure that Malke's concerns can be met without unjustly protecting Xenophrenic. I would like to support, as it may provide a way out of this mess, but Malke's concerns need to be met so that she can freely participate. — Arthur Rubin (talk) 20:22, 8 April 2013 (UTC)
- Would the editor who made the redactions kindly so identify themselves? Referring to edits is generally not cnsidered a "personal attack" on Misplaced Pages. Collect (talk) 22:48, 8 April 2013 (UTC)

<Collect please undo your post, so I can revert Xenophrenic's redaction of Arthur Rubin's comment. Your edit is in the way. Thanks.Malke 2010 (talk) 22:53, 8 April 2013 (UTC)

Nevermind, I reverted it manually. Malke 2010 (talk) 22:59, 8 April 2013 (UTC)

Xenophrenic has redacted Arthur's comment three times now and that seems WP:Disrupt to me. Malke 2010 (talk) 23:09, 8 April 2013 (UTC)

Xenophrenic reverts/redactions and again and again . Malke 2010 (talk) 23:14, 8 April 2013 (UTC)

It's too late to formally add Xenophrenic to the RfAr, as it's already past the workshop stage. And, if someone would point me to an appropriate forum to comment on WP:TE by editors not already named in the RfAr, I would do it there instead of here, for the most part. However, it's also a potential reason why I might object to this proposal, so it's not completely out of line to mention it here, even if Xenophrenic thinks it is. — Arthur Rubin (talk) 00:59, 9 April 2013 (UTC)

Redaction was wrong but so was your one sided accusation. P&G would also be a candidate and you're not an innocent. I suggest you try and reduce the temperature rather than provoking others ----Snowded 06:03, 9 April 2013 (UTC)

Arthur didn't make a one-sided accusation. He's simply pointing out Xenophrenic's behavior in an accurate, measured, well-written comment that is not at all a personal attack. Xenophrenic has also violated WP:CIVIL and WP:DISRUPT. It's disruptive to keep redacting another editor's comments without bringing it up on the talk page. Why not post an explanation here for other editors to see and comment, too? That gives the editor the chance to redact his own comments. It's also disruptive for Xenophrenic to imply that sources he's using are sanctioned by "ArbCom" because Silk Tork suggested them on the Workshop talk page. And his incivility and refusal to strike through his comments are worrisome. Xenophrenic is quick to demand that other editor's redact their comments about him, but he won't extend the same courtesy when they object to what he's said about them. In fact, he argues more vigorously that's he right and the editor is wrong. Malke 2010 (talk) 12:07, 9 April 2013 (UTC)

Malke's concerns are that editors "must be extra careful in what they say", and that an editor has used something from one of the sources I noted. The sources I mentioned were The Guardian, Britannica, The Independent, and infoplease.

I'd rather people were extra careful. I'd always rather people were extra careful - all the time, on every page, not just ones that are being watched. Having said that, I understand frustration when editing contentious subjects, and expect tempers to fray now and again. However, when moderating content discussions I encourage focus on content not contributor, and let people know I will hat discussions that are off-topic and distracting. As regards concerns about any sanctions coming from the ArbCom case. I cannot speak for the other Committee members, but I don't see sufficient poor behaviour in those editing this article to justify sanctions. This is a highly contentious and polarising topic, and - if anything - I have been impressed by how you folks have held it together for so long. What I am interested in is not sanctioning anyone, but in helping you folks improve the article and reach a compromise that satisfies the main contributors, and so results in a fair, honest and balanced article that will be helpful to the general reader. I don't think it will be easy, nor will it be quick, but if everyone is willing to have a positive attitude toward this attempt, then I think it will work.

I'm not clear on the problem as regards the sources. I suspect, Malke, what you saying is not that you have an issue with the sources, but that suggestions I make may be used to justify actions that may not be helpful. My aim as a moderator, is to assist you folks reach the decisions and actions yourself, rather than me make the decisions for you folks to follow. But, yes, at times I may be pushing for a decision, and if things are deadlocked I will offer suggestions.

As Malke is the main contributor to the article, I think working with an objection would be difficult, so will wait for further comments. SilkTork 00:34, 9 April 2013 (UTC)

Although I have been in some correspondence with Malke off-Wiki, I would like to ask here on-Wiki, whether Malke's objection is that edits based on sources mentioned by SilkTork might be perceived to have a "stamp of approval", and not be as subject to critical review. If so, if SilkTork could give what asssurances that he honestly can, it might be adequate for Malke. — Arthur Rubin (talk) 00:59, 9 April 2013 (UTC)

I have not given my approval for any edits. And that is not the role I would envisage taking. I am not here as a member of ArbCom, but as a fellow editor. My role would be to moderate discussions, assist with keeping them on task, and look for agreement and consensus on how to move the article toward a balanced and acceptable position. SilkTork 01:12, 9 April 2013 (UTC)

I believe the Britannica is a problematic source at best - it is tertiary by definition, and solicits proposed edits from readers (one step from a Wiki). In short, we would best be advised not to use it as a source here. IMHO. Collect (talk) 02:03, 9 April 2013 (UTC)

As Malke still appears to have an objection I will withdraw my offer of assistance. I do urge folks here to get someone in to moderate a discussion to look at the bigger issues. SilkTork 12:29, 9 April 2013 (UTC)

@Malke, I'm waiting to hear your response to ST's withdrawal of his offer to moderate based on a perception that you have some objection to that.

Since your objection seems irrational to me, and as I do not particularly share your opinion regarding EdJohnson's qualifications, I would be categorically opposed to him being the moderator.

If you are intent on cherry-picking a moderator, perhaps mandatory mediation with Arbcom appointed mediators would be the proper way to proceed.--Ubikwit _{見学/迷惑} 14:37, 9 April 2013 (UTC)

While my opinion was opposite to Malke's, I think that they expressed sincere considerations, and a sincere attempt at making a good suggestion. I think it is not warranted and not very nice to call that "cherry-picking" a moderator, which implies several other things. North8000 (talk) 19:02, 9 April 2013 (UTC)

Setting up

Malke has been in touch - User_talk:SilkTork#Moderator. We can start. I suggest we create a subpage in which to hold the discussions. It can be linked and/or transcluded on this page. I know there has been friction and frustration, but in order to move the discussions forward there should be no personal comments. Allow me to hat any personal comments that creep in. It would be better if I, or another uninvolved person, did that; and if, while waiting for the comment to be hatted, people did not respond, even if the comment sits there for a while. Something I have found useful, is when annoyed, type out what you want to say - but don't post it; edit it down to something polite, then discard it. It gets it out of your system, but doesn't upset anyone.

If there's no objections I will start a subpage sometime tomorrow, and on that we can briefly discuss and lay out the main issues, and consider if the article needs trimming, and if so, the best way of doing that. There was a suggestion recently of creating split-off articles. We could also consider that. SilkTork 22:44, 9 April 2013 (UTC)

Hello SilkTork. I think that it is important to acknowledge that the underlying cause here is conflicting goals, not personal chemistry. (Although good chemistry would make a lot of other things go better). I think that it must also be acknowledged that if an article has been pulled to one "side" that the objectives on that one "side" are to maintain the status quo, while the immediate objectives of the other "side" are to pull it towards neutral. Sincerely, North8000 (talk) 23:36, 9 April 2013 (UTC)

I'd like a clarification about the "personal comments" restriction. In some cases, a particular edit may strike me as absurd (in some cases, to the point where I do not see how any competent person could see it as appropriate), regardless of the identity of the editor. Since we will be talking about the future of the article, rather than the past edits, this shouldn't come up, but, I'd like clarification. I would avoid commenting that a particular editor is taking inappropriate actions, but it may be necessary to indicate a particular edit is absurd. Any ideas? — Arthur Rubin (talk) 09:50, 10 April 2013 (UTC)

Anything judgemental not factual is probably a mistake here. I would say why you thought it was absurd, avoiding sarcasm and irony. Ive had irony taken as consent for absurdity before now. ----Snowded 10:14, 10 April 2013 (UTC)

Yes, Arthur, comment on the edit rather than the editor. And yes, Snowded, it is helpful to explain one's thinking. I would hope, however, at this stage, that we would be considering broad issues, and getting consensus for actions rather than dealing with individual edits or smaller points. Once the broad issues are agreed, folks here can deal with the fine tuning, and I would think at that stage my role would be over. SilkTork 09:01, 11 April 2013 (UTC)

Thanks SilkTork, for setting this up and serving as our moderator. It will generally be a difficult, time-consuming and thankless task, but I hope we can resolve some issues and improve the article. Individual edits concerning use of the terms "grass-roots" and "anti-immigration" to generally describe TPm (installing the first term in the lede and removing the second term from the "Agenda" section) have been very contentious, and devoured a great deal of editor time and Talk page space. Most troublesome to me is the apparent lack of any real progress regarding these two edits, which I consider to be self-evident, based on the number of reliable sources which actually support these terms per WP:WEIGHT. Somebody with authority needs to be able to step up and say, "We have consensus for this," or "There's no consensus for that, and I doubt there ever will be." Are you that person of authority? If so, would you review the article Talk page and try to make these determinations? Phoenix and Winslow (talk) 16:12, 11 April 2013 (UTC)

Establishing broad issues

This is just a suggestion, but it might be a good idea for editors to briefly name an issue they feel needs addressing, like 'article length,' etc. Just list something and sign your name. Then once we have a list, we could sort it and decide which issues seem most important, as I imagine that would be respectful of Silk Tork's time here. Then we could work our way through the revised list. If editors agree, then simply name an issue below and sign your name. Malke 2010 (talk) 17:31, 11 April 2013 (UTC)

Article organization. It should be laid out like the other articles about political movements. All commentary, particularly by persons, publications or entities that can reasonably be construed to be politically opposed to the Tea Party, should be near the end of the article if it gets into the article at all. After all, if we allow politicians and political organizations to be defined by their opponents, there would be a certain biography starting with the words, "Barack Obama is a socialist born in Kenya ..." To control the length of the article, we create sub-articles with links such as Allegations of bigotry in the Tea Party movement. Phoenix and Winslow (talk) 18:25, 11 April 2013 (UTC)
Hot button words. Certain terms, such as "grass-roots" and "anti-immigration," have proven to be very controversial. They trigger edit wars, reams and reams of text on the article Talk page, and ultimately a lot of frustration and anger. Let's find a way to short circuit all the frustration and anger. I propose a procedure to be limited to this moderated discussion. All participants are asked to sign on below. The procedure is this: an editor seeking to introduce or change a particular descriptive word proposes the edit in a new section on this page. All editors active on this page have seven days to Support or Oppose the edit, and present policy-based arguments supporting their positions. At the end of the seven days, SilkTork determines whether there is consensus one way or the other, and announces that finding at the end of the section.

Support. It's relatively fast, and it has finality and certainty. Phoenix and Winslow (talk) 18:25, 11 April 2013 (UTC)

We should establish that the highest priority objective is to make this article informative. Endless effort/ battles/ on trying to fight/wiki-lawyer in swipes or praise should be recognized as contrary to that. 02:06, 12 April 2013 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by 99.141.248.152 (talk)

Reduce content The article should provide a good overview of the Tea Party movement and not stay mired in excessive details. Perhaps merge 2010/2012 elections with another article like List of Tea Party politicians. Merge anything that deals with protests over to Tea Party protests. If it's something that happened at a protest, it really belongs in that article. Nothing should be duplicated here in this article, which is a bit long to begin with. Malke 2010 (talk) 03:53, 12 April 2013 (UTC)

Framing of the article The article currently is disjointed, due largely to what I see as efforts by proponents to use the page for advocacy.

P&W wants the TPm to be treated like a political party, but it is not. Neither is it a "phenomena" as North claims. It is a loose collection of organizations, some with disparate agendas. Malke states above that the article should "not stay mired in excessive details", which I assume means that, as in the case of the Agenda section, she wants to minimize the content so that the article presents only information that serves the purpose of advocacy as opposed to providing encyclopedic coverage of the topic.

The article should be organized more on topical issues as addressed in secondary sources, not primary source material by TPm activists or leaders.

The Agenda section is the prime example of the problem. Whereas secondary sources addressing topical issues related to the TPm focus on issues such as the constitution and immigration, the Agenda section is taken up almost entirely by the "Contract from America", which is basically a document that has been used in an effort to recruit people, including politicians to the TPm. It features a superficial list of items and contains information that is trivialized in the article, "lawyer Ryan Hecker...stated that he developed the concept of creating a grassroots call for reform". Not only does that indicate that it was a top-down generated platform, but the Tea Party Patriots are the only group apparently involved in the largely failed effort to have the platform adopted. In other words, the Contract from America is given undue prominence, and there is not a single secondary source discussing it. Seeing as it has its own article, that should be substantially reduced in accordance with WP:UNDUE, and secondary sources introduced.

The domestic issues having the greatest import include:

The constitution
Taxation
Immigration
The role/size of the government

Considering that the TPm is almost entirely restricted to the USA, it is very strange that the Agenda section obscures the domestic issues that could be considered as primary motivators for the grass-roots participants, relegating them to blurbs, yet prominently features foreign policy. That belies a total lack of balance in the Agenda section.Ubikwit _{見学/迷惑} 05:37, 12 April 2013 (UTC)