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More concrete evidence?

The RfC/U states "He adds negative material to articles about conservative political figures and organizations, no matter how trivial or irrelevant it might be, or how much it employs fallacies such as guilt by association; and he removes negative content about progressive political figures and organizations." Diffs of such behavior should be presented. Having a generic call for "Any Editor: Please provide any evidence here. Will work on formatting the evidence as it builds." is not an appropriate substitute. 5.12.68.204 (talk) 09:21, 25 May 2013 (UTC)

I don't know about others, but I'm here just help give Xenophrenic a nudge to change their behavior a little. The 10 day snapshot from one article that I was forced to build at ANI (which someone linked here) give a really good glimpse. The nature of the behavior is the sum of the parts, not any individual really bad items. What would you want......a list of their last 1,000 edits, and notes showing that 90% are relentlessly towards tilting articles towards one particular end of the political spectrum? Would Xenophrenic want someone to make that effort? My own hope is just saying enough here to convince Xenophrenic to change a bit, NOT enough to get them in trouble. Unless someone forces the latter by declaring that any input without the latter is illegitimate. Sincerely, North8000 (talk) 18:24, 25 May 2013 (UTC)

This is a quote from WP:TE: "Thus a single edit is unlikely to be a problem, but a pattern of edits displaying a bias is more likely to be an issue, and repeated biased edits to a single article or group of articles will be very unwelcome indeed." As the WP:TE policy confirms, looking at a diff of a single edit by Xeno isn't going to prove anything. Looking, with enormous patience and diligence, through 100 diffs of 100 different edits by Xeno might adequately convey what he's doing. Four different editors have given summaries of Xeno's behavior, or endorsed such summaries, and found that behavior to be problematic. Xeno, rather than participating, is attempting to get the RfC/U deleted by edit-warring it into the "Candidates" section rather than the "Certified" section. This is actually a pretty good example of his editing style. Phoenix and Winslow (talk) 20:22, 25 May 2013 (UTC)

With the risk of sounding pedantic, proving that a pattern of edits exists requires listing some sample edits from said pattern. Your presentation of evidence against Xenophrenic was found by Arbitrators to be lacking substance. Simply copying your assertions from there over here--which is what the bulk of the evidence presented insofar consists of--isn't likely to convince many uninvolved editors either. 5.12.68.204 (talk) 00:44, 26 May 2013 (UTC)

@5.12.68.204 - Thanks for asking for evidence. Looking at the responses that follow from North and P&W, it doesn't appear likely we're going to see any. There is a tendency to cite the WP:TE essay as a free pass to cast aspersions without having to produce substantiation. They misrepresent it as a license to not have to cite even a single "biased edit". They conveniently overlook the fact that the essay also defines tendentious editing as "not conforming to the neutral point of view" policy, which, if it is actually occurring, can always be demonstrated through the citation of diffs.

@North - Tell me something, if I wanted you to change your behavior of repeatedly beating your wife, but you denied doing it, how productive do you think my nudging you to change your behavior "just a little" would be? Would you stop beating your wife if I said that I otherwise liked you? Would you stop beating your wife if I said I thought your repeated wife beatings were "not a big deal"? What would be the best way to get you to stop beating your wife; behavior that you deny?

@P&W - Please understand that editing toward NPOV and against your personal POV is not tendentious editing. Disagreeing with your personal POV is not against policy. Yes, 4 editors, all presently on the same side in an ongoing content dispute, have have all whispered the same allegations without substantiation. (Yes, I've looked closely at the few diffs on the RFC/U page.) That doesn't make them any more true than the thousands of whispered allegations against McCain. If you'd like to participate in collaborative editing instead of POV editing, I highly recommend it and would welcome that. Xenophrenic (talk) 01:01, 26 May 2013 (UTC)

It looks like a most experienced editor has offered some practical advice regarding evidence and the advice was well received, at least in theory . 5.12.68.204 (talk) 05:05, 26 May 2013 (UTC)

So what becomes of this...

... Punitive blocks, topic ban, some type of probation?

Not sure what Xeno has been up to lately, but from what I experienced he's definitely tenacious in his POV-pushing. Personally, I don't have a problem with people having their own opinions and such -- But, editors around here should at least try to temper those views in the name of NPOV. The next time I witness Xeno doing this will be the first. No joke. †TE†Talk 18:44, 25 May 2013 (UTC)

In other venues, I've suggested a topic ban from all articles related to U.S. politics, broadly construed; I've also suggested that Xeno could get this topic ban lifted after a suitable period (six months to a year) of productive editing on other types of articles. Malke has also suggested the involvement of a mentor. And I've also indicated that Xeno could participate in this RfC/U, admit that his behavior is problematic, and resolve to change. Furthermore, I've indicated that I would welcome that resolution of this matter, and that it would make such a topic ban unnecessary. I think Xeno is capable of being a very productive editor. He simply needs to check his progressive bias at the door, give up his tendentious behavior, and work as part of a team of colleagues. Phoenix and Winslow (talk) 20:28, 25 May 2013 (UTC)

Hiya, Mookie! Dusting off the ol' TE?

P&W, thank you for the kind words. I think you have the potential to be a very productive editor, too. If you are willing to make an attempt at working collaboratively instead of competitively, I think that would be awesome. In the meantime, it has been suggested by WhatamIdoing that I politely request that you try to explain their concerns to me again. Can we try that? I can't make heads or tails out of huge 216 edit, 18 user diffs like this that you gave as examples. Regards, Xenophrenic (talk) 01:01, 26 May 2013 (UTC)

Do you think you may have a blind spot regarding your own behavior, Xeno? You've been blocked for editwarring three times. User:WhatamIdoing has confirmed that this RfC/U is appropriate, and moved it back to "Certified" herself. User:NE Ent and User:Nyttend have both indicated, in the WP:ANI thread that you started, that these concerns are legitimately stated. On the Project page itself, North8000, Malke 2010, Arthur Rubin, Collect, ThinkEnemies, and Nathan Johnson have all indicated support for various versions of "Xenophrenic is a tendentious editor." Now here's something else that should make you stop and think long and hard. Yes, I canvassed, and you've been very diligent about tracking down my canvassing efforts. So certainly you're aware I was also very careful to canvass two people who were on your side in these content disputes: Ubikwit and TFD. Judging from his edits on your User Talk page, TMCk is also well aware of this RfC/U. And none of these three editors is stepping in here to defend you. Phoenix and Winslow (talk) 02:19, 26 May 2013 (UTC)

One thing I remember, not so fondly, of Xeno's edit warring ways was his ability to circumvent 3RR. There would always be some IP out of nowhere on unprotected pages (Like the IP above 5.12.68.204 (talk · contribs)) who would step in on Xeno's behalf. On protected pages you would get a named user who just happened to be at the right place, right time (Geolanz (talk · contribs)) . Xeno is calculated and intelligent, so far as I can tell, physical evidence like IP addresses would lead nowhere. But come on, ending talk page comments with "Regards, signpost" is uniquely Xeno . More like a trademark if you check his user page (and that's just what's left standing as Xeno opts to delete instead of archive). †TE†Talk 02:45, 26 May 2013 (UTC)

Mmh. Going down to your level, this IP's edits must be yours? Using any other accounts? Maybe meanwhile you're gone for quite some time? Like those questions and accusations? If not maybe don't make them yourself... wink-wink.TMCk (talk) 03:24, 26 May 2013 (UTC)

Intriguing. I suggest you look into it as the aforementioned possible socks. †TE†Talk 03:34, 26 May 2013 (UTC)

Given that even administrators easily throw around such poorly supported accusations, TE can be forgiven for not knowing that "Regards, <signature>" is a standard idiom in written English communication. 5.12.68.204 (talk) 05:12, 26 May 2013 (UTC)

Please be careful with your interpretations of others' words. I made no comment on the merits of the RFCU nor said anything about the legitimacy of the concerns of its originators; all I said was that the procedural requirements of the RFC process had been met and that the page therefore didn't qualify for deletion. Nyttend (talk) 02:50, 26 May 2013 (UTC)

That's correct, I said you indicated the "concerns are legitimately stated." I did not say you indicated the "concerns are legitimate," nor did I intend to misrepresent what you said. Phoenix and Winslow (talk) 04:35, 26 May 2013 (UTC)