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Demonising Turks

It is obvious from certain Misplaced Pages articles that many people are using it as a vehicle to demonise Turks. Wherever possible articles derogatory to these people are being written, media and writings manipulated so that when a search is done of Google - only one version - a completely Christo-Armenia, Greek Othodox version can be found. It is seems that as in America, Armenian and Greek lobbying is alive and well here, too. What a shame that Jews, who found solace in the Turkish Ottoman Empire, while the rest of Europe was have progrom festivals have come on board, too. It seems that all that it needs to get the Jew and the gentile on the same wagon, is to beat the tired old donkey issue of the barbarious Turk.

It wears thin.

To be honest, I don't want Turkey to join the EU. I want you and teh editors and admin that are like-minded to carry on with your actions. We need to perpetuate the misnomers and misrepresentation of the Turks. Forget the Royal Academy's exhibition last year about these people. We need to keep isolating them. Because one day you will help in ending your civilisation by cutting such a large chunk of it out.

I do hope you get what you deserve. 82.145.231.194 14:35, 15 April 2006 (UTC)

Ankaram

You should post this to the admin noticeboard, and offer it to a wider wikipedia audience. As for checkuser, it's not so much that they refuse requests from people not in the clique, but these requests are generally only used when rules have been violated. I don't think any purported sock of Ankaram has been subject to admin action yet. So I suggest you bring this to the wider community and maybe some things will come of that. Having a sockpuppet is not disallowed, so checkuser is rarely used. --Golbez 22:03, 3 April 2006 (UTC)

Agree it should be posted at the admin noticeboard. I also noticed that there seems to be sockpuppetery in contributions that mainly consist of self-promotion. Bertilvidet 15:57, 6 April 2006 (UTC)

SL

Thanks for letting me know about your wiki project plans and user Sedat Laciner. From the above comment I am guessing that you have or are trying to get admin. to watch this guys edits. I will also keep an eye on him and will contact other users and let them know about this; lets keep one another informed.--Moosh88 23:04, 3 April 2006 (UTC)

Germar Rudolf

Some funny guy on Talk:Germar_Rudolf is trying to add POV, help welcome. --tickle me 02:43, 4 April 2006 (UTC)

Guenter Lewy

In case you didn't know already, this guy who happens to be Jewish btw also denies that gypsies were targeted specifically by Nazis: http://www.us.oup.com/us/catalog/general/subject/HistoryWorld/European/Germany/?ci=0195142403&view=usa --Eupator 15:20, 9 April 2006 (UTC)

I doesn't make any differences if he is a Jew or not, what makes a differences is that he is intellectually dishonnest and fabricated a so-called 'Three pillars' which when taken a closer look are rather the three arguments used by those that attempt to draw a parallel with the Holocaust, his task was to try to discredit them rather. I happen to have read his book about the Gypsies, what he does is to polarise both sufferings(Jews and Gypsies), by supporting the intentionalist thesis for one and the functionalism for the other to dismiss the charges of genocide against the Gypsies. He specifically write in that book that he does not believe that the Gypsies faced genocide. His work about the Gypsies on the other hand, really provide a lot of valuable documentation, but his purpouses was else. He took the same path in his work regarding the Vietnam war, in the second part he nearly totally fill the book with American administration apologistic trash dismissing the accusations of war crimes against Vietnamese civilians. But, it is not only the Armenian and Gypsie genocide he denies, he denies also the destruction of American Indians, in an article for example, he write that what happened to the American Indians was not a crime but rather a conflict between two different cultures. The thing here is not about him being a Jew, but rather that as a person who escaped NAZI Germany and becoming conscient of the horror of NAZI crimes against the Jews, he seem to have become alienated of empathy regarding the suffering of other peoples, even though he claims to the contrary. I won't be surprised that he later publish books denying the genocide in Cambodia or Rwanda, or dismiss the Nanking Massacre to preserve the stigmatised Uniqueness of human sufferings which he consider Jews being the sole possessors of.

Israel Charny recently answered to one of his articles, the answer was edited, which seems to be purpousful as to mislead the readers, which angered him. Fad (ix) 18:33, 9 April 2006 (UTC)

A KISS Rfa Thanks

Thank you, I've been promoted. pschemp | talk 01:24, 11 April 2006 (UTC)

Thank you

Thank you! Hello Fadix. Thank you for your support in my RfA! It passed with a final tally of 91/3/5. I am quite humbled and pleased by the community's show of confidence in me. If you need help or just want to talk, let me know. Cheers! -- Fang Aili

Thanks

Thanks for supporting me in my RfA. I really didn't think people appreciate my work here that much, but it's nice to see you do: my Request was closed with 66 supports and 4 opposes. I'll do my best not to turn your confidence down. If in any point in the future you get the feeling I'm doing something wrong, do not hesitate to drop me a line. --Dijxtra 11:56, 13 April 2006 (UTC)

Iranian Azerbaijan

Fadix, please re-add the reference to Southern/South Azerbaijan at the Iranian Azerbaijan page. I asked Grandmaster to do it, the article has said that for literally years until some anon removed it yesterday. Thank you. --Khoikhoi 17:57, 13 April 2006 (UTC)

Ok, you don't have to re-add the 2nd paragraph, but "South/Southern Azerbaijan" is still a term used by Azeri nationalists (ultranationalists if you will), and should be mentioned. I don't think people are going to be confused, we can add a footnote if you want. --Khoikhoi 18:05, 13 April 2006 (UTC)

I checked the Google hits for "South Azerbaijan", and most, if not all of them are refering to the region in Iran.

As for Western Armenia, I don't think it's as notable of a term today as "South Azerbaijan" is.

Here's a map that I scanned from my National Geographic atlas. Since is has the region "Azerbaijan" in Iran, it definately seems to be more notable that the southern part of the Republic of Azerbaijan. (Even though it doesn't say "South Azerbaijan")

Also, User:Zereshk pointed out that the movement for independence among Iranian Azeris is growing, therefore, the term is becoming more notable.

I'm not giving in to vocal users. There are a lot of things that I disagree with Grandmaster about, like how he handled the situation at the Khojaly massacre page, but I have to agree that the term "South Azerbaijan" is notable enough to be bolded. —Khoikhoi 22:32, 15 April 2006 (UTC)

Alright, fine fine. I won't get involved in that page anymore. You and Grandmaster work it out. —Khoikhoi 23:23, 15 April 2006 (UTC)

Ok, I'm sorry. :( I promise that I won't, I'm just really stressed out right now with real life and the never-ending cycle of Misplaced Pages. --—Khoikhoi 23:34, 15 April 2006 (UTC)

Fadix, this is not dissimilar to the situation at Persian Gulf. I think the standard for inclusion of such a term is whether or not it is used by non-Azeri/Turkish sources. Personally, I doubt this. If the term "South Azerbaijan" is only used by Azeri nationalists/separatists then it certainly doesn't belong in the intro, but mentioned elsewhere in the article. SouthernComfort 23:48, 15 April 2006 (UTC)

It could be mentioned elsewhere as with Mani's move to its own section as well. The main problem is that this term is sometimes used by academics too as it's just a simple matter of a north south thing as there are two Azerbaijans today and it's easy to say it as South Azerbaijan if one is talking about some sort of comparison between the two. Here's something interesting though. Prof. Frye (of Harvard) wrote the articles on the two Azerbaijans in Encyclopedia Americana and the caption for Azerbaijan is about Iranian Azerbaijan and then the country is under Azerbaijan, Republic of. Clearly there is no universality, but I do agree with Prof. Frye's usage as the historical Azerbaijan was the Iranian portion, while the north was Arran. However, in modern usage since the 19th century this changed and since the two regions are interconnected with the Azeris predominating in both regions the terminology is going to change. Perhaps one could mention some of the background and I wouldn't make a big deal of the South Azerbaijan issue and the edit by SC seems like a good compromise. Tombseye 22:54, 22 April 2006 (UTC)

Norwegian Misplaced Pages (Armenian Genocide)

Hi Fadix,

thanks for the message. Yes I've translated the en:Armenian Genocide article, and as I've expected , it has been a discussed subject. So far Pasja is the only one to react in a "negative" manner to the article. As you mention, he's been quite active in regards to Turkish related subjects. If you don't mind I'll post your comments on the discussion page and also make a note that one of the administrators or bureaucrats should make a decison about it. As I mentioned the article is a clear translation of the en version, and as far as I understood there are no major disputes at the moment. Thanks again for the input and I'll get back to you if we should need any further information. Babaroga 09:20, 18 April 2006 (UTC)

RfA thanks from Petros471

For a more general RfA thanks to all voters see User:Petros471/RFA Thanks.

I'm sorry that you didn't feel able to support my RfA. If you want to, I would be very happy to know why you opposed, so I know if there is anything I need to fix. Either way, please do let me know at any time how I am doing as an admin, or if there is anything I can improve on. Cheers, Petros471 21:08, 18 April 2006 (UTC)

FYI

Misplaced Pages:Requests for comment/Fadix --Cool Cat 15:31, 22 April 2006 (UTC)

Request

Hey Fadix,

I was wondering if you could keep an eye on the Adana page for me. Some user keeps adding this to the article, although their source is the Turkish government. :-/ Another page is the Ardahan article, in which some user wants the Armenian name removed, calling it "Armenian vandalism". Thanks. —Khoikhoi 04:30, 2 May 2006 (UTC)

Armenian Patriarch speaks at symposium

Hi Fadix, if you haven't read and if you are interested you can find the patriarch's speech in my talk page. Cansın 3 May 2006

Barev, vonts es? well, I was trying to finish my ph.d. and finally I defended my dissertation in March. now there is job search in academia which turned to be more stressful...I do not have time to contribute to articles however from time to time I follow the hot topics ;). Regards. Cansın 4 May 2006

Armenians living in Turkey

Hi Fadix, I wanted to know the general feeling or image in Diaspora about Armenians living in Turkey today. Can you help me understand this issue? Thank you. Btw I like your approach in Misplaced Pages, good work. Cheers --Gokhan 07:04, 4 May 2006 (UTC)

Sari Gyalin documentary

Hey Fadix, have you watched this Turkish documentary? Its Turkish name is "Sari Gelin" and I think in Armenian it means "The bride from the mountain". It is about the Turkish stance on 1915 events. It is also in English and in French. I think it is very important to try to learn how the other side thinks and feels. If you are interested, I can mail you my copy as a gift. Let me know. Regards. Cansın 4 May 2006

Kurds

I was thinking the other day that the AG article doesn't mention much about the Kurdish involvement. One can easily say that most Armenians who were killed directly (not during the marches etc.) were killed by Kurds and not Turks. I'm not sure how that would be incorporated but without mentioning this I find the article incomplete.--Eupator 22:31, 6 May 2006 (UTC)

User:Cool Cat's disruption of Kurdish categorization efforts

Misplaced Pages:Administrators' noticeboard/Incidents#User:Cool Cat's disruption of Kurdish categorization efforts

Care to comment? --Moby 13:30, 8 May 2006 (UTC)

Thank you 2

The Working Man's Barnstar Barev Fadix! I would like to give you The Working Man's Barnstar, for all the crap you've had to put up with at Talk:Armenian Genocide—past and present! :) —Khoikhoi 03:46, 12 May 2006 (UTC)

BTW, I know you're busy, but perhaps when you have the time, you could review this edit and make sure it's neutral, thanks. —Khoikhoi 04:26, 14 May 2006 (UTC)

Request for Editor / User Page Review

Hey Fadix –

You opposed my last RfA in March on rationale I believe may have been related to my user page. In the time since then, I have changed my page to be more universalist (which still conforms with my personal beliefs) and removed the majority of information regarding my conversion to Islam in favor of a section on my philosophy (as well as yours if you desire). Now, I'm looking for your feedback on what you think of the redesign of the page and whether it is sufficient in quelling the March controversy over the page as well as solving the issue about possible inability to maintain a neutral point of view, especially in religion-related articles. For what it's worth, the reason I kept a condensed version of the timeline was because there were, and still are, many people who find it interesting instead of a form of proselytization. Many people have also given me positive feedback on my talk page regarding the look of the page. I personally believe that it is okay to insert individuality onto user pages, especially if it still promotes a sense of community. That is what I was going for with this current version of my user page.

Please make comments regarding the user page on my editor review page. Thanks in advance. joturner 15:21, 13 May 2006 (UTC)

Oh man

Surely he knows that there was an even larger anti-Armenian massacre by Azeris in the same time frame and same location. They're turning every single Armenian-Azeri event into a spectacle. They might as well make a 1945 Azeri Deportations from Armenia for all we know. I'll keep an eye on it. By the way, Baku87 made the article not GM. Thanks for informing me.

P.S. This is the same Justin "2.5 million Muslims died from 1914-1920" McCarthy he's referring to right?--MarshallBagramyan 05:41, 14 May 2006 (UTC)

Armenian Genocide

Hi, sorry to see that you're still getting so much crap thrown at you. I'm still trying to do what I can to help, so if you need someone to back you up just drop me a line. Same for if you want to get the administration involved again. John Smith's 20:24, 14 May 2006 (UTC)

Destruction of the 366th Division Barracks

I thought you might find it interesting that I have some video footage of the destruction of the 366th's barracks in Nagorno-Karabakh in 1992. I'm not sure if the damage was done before or after the Khojaly attacks, but the attackers were definitely Azeris.--MarshallBagramyan 22:31, 16 May 2006 (UTC)

Adana massacre

Hey Fadix,

Nice work on the Armenian Legion page. There are some facts that need to be cited at the Adana massacre page as well. BTW, the Adana page still mentions the “Adana rebellion” term. Cheers. —Khoikhoi 18:59, 17 May 2006 (UTC)

The way the word rebellion is used is OK I think. And yes, I plan to source and expend the Adana massacre page in due time. Thanks. Fad (ix) 19:42, 17 May 2006 (UTC)

Civility

Regarding edits such as this:

I feel you are being uncivil, and I'd like to remind you to be civil and not to create personal attacks or take part in edit wars. --InShaneee 21:16, 18 May 2006 (UTC)

I wasn't taking his word, I looked into the matter myself. Additionally, you should not be referring to him as a 'troublemaker'. WP:CIVIL requires that we treat ALL users with respect, even during a heated argument. There are no excuses for this. --InShaneee 02:29, 19 May 2006 (UTC)

You're free to bring the case to whomever you like, but that doesn't mean you can get away with using personal attacks such as 'troublemaker'. WP:AGF says that we must assume that other users have good motives even if they are making bad controbutions. So proceed as you see fit, but know that if you continue to be incivil towords any other user, you will be temporarily blocked from editing. --InShaneee 02:44, 19 May 2006 (UTC)

As I said, do what you will, but know that further incivility will not be tolerated. The above is a catch-all template message relating to incivility. --InShaneee 03:06, 19 May 2006 (UTC)

I think you should look at User:Grandmaster's Behaviour

You say there has been threats agaisnt you? It is a sad state wikipedia is coming to with all these sockpuppets and false information being pushed. I am having the same sort of problems as are others with user:Grandmaster. He even tries to push Armenian terrorism, something I have never even heard of. 72.57.230.179

User:InShaneee

Hi, I've saw the situation you are involved with InShaneee and notice that we are both in similar situations. I haven't looked to much into your situation, but with mine InShanee is making comments that me saying things like "you are acting like a child" are personal attacks. I feel that InShanee doesn't quite understand the policies he is enforcing. If you plan to bring the matter to WP:RfC, WP:AN or the ArbCom, could you please let me know so I can get involved? I will do the same like-wise. Paul Cyr 02:58, 19 May 2006 (UTC)

Big Bang

Hey - I noticed you had taken part some discussion of the Big Bang article in the past. I recently stumbled upon it when I was searching for an analysis of the views of big bang supporters and opponents. I was suprised to see that oposing views were not even mentioned in the article. I have tried to rectify that situation by adding a brief summary of the various opposing views and some links, but some people there apparently don't want other viewpoints to even be mentioned. So I thought you might be interested in taking a look at the recent discussion there... Helvetica 08:04, 20 May 2006 (UTC)

RfAr

Gladly :) - FrancisTyers 17:01, 20 May 2006 (UTC)

When you file it, please provide me with the direct link so I can have a look. Thanks, John Smith's 18:38, 20 May 2006 (UTC)

Same here please ! Angus McLellan (Talk) 20:05, 20 May 2006 (UTC)

Not to join the bandwagon or anything but could that also be provided to me also? Thanks!--MarshallBagramyan 00:53, 21 May 2006 (UTC)

So whats this all about anyway? --THOTH 13:32, 21 May 2006 (UTC)

Problems come in all sorts of shapes and sizes, but some are secondary symptoms rather than a root cause, if you see what I mean. Periodic RFCs cannot hurt, even though the chances of an RFC helping are vanishingly small. Anyway, it only took five minutes. I couldn't even do a bad translation in that time. Cheers ! Angus McLellan (Talk) 16:28, 21 May 2006 (UTC)

Wow, that's a lot of evidence. Damn. Anything I should do? —Khoikhoi 04:45, 22 May 2006 (UTC)

Copyediting it. I think we need a couple of diffs (I have marked them with → or ←) if you can find them. There are a couple of sections I'm not 100% clear on. Best to make it as bulletproof as possible ! Should an RFAR cite policy (Khoijoi will know) and precedents ? Angus McLellan (Talk) 18:23, 22 May 2006 (UTC)

Oh, I'm not worrying. If I'm told by an admin that I've been incivil, I'll apologise, but not before. I'll have a look for the links and diffs to add to the RfAr a bit later if I have time. Cheers ! Angus McLellan (Talk)

Incorporating this into the Genocide article

I'm not sure if this will fit accordingly into the Armenian Genocide article, however I feel that if we include an example of academic dishonesty in the Turkish government well lend weight to the Armenian "side" of the argument. Here is what I was proposing of adding:

Enver Zia Karal, the writer of “Armenian Question: (1878-1923), a work that denies the existance of the Genocide, inaccurately and grossly adulterated testimony by an American fact finding group (gives the impression that Genocide didn't occur and that Armenians were safe afterall) on page 22 of the work:

(The falsified quote of Major General James G. Harbord by Karal)

“Meanwhile, the Armenian, unarmed at the time of the deportations, a brave soldier by thousands in the armies of Russia, France, and America, is still unarmed and safe in a land where every man but himself need to carry a rifle.”

Italics denoting adulterated lines.

The actual quote by General Harbord:

“Meanwhile, the Armenian, unarmed at the time of the deportations and massacres, a brave soldier by thousands in the armies of Russia, France, and America, is still unarmed in a land where every man but himself carries a rifle.”

Source for actual quote found at: U.S. Congress, 66th Congress, 2nd Session. Major General James G. Harbord by Karal “Conditions in the Near East: Report of the American Military Mission to Armenia.” Washington D.C. 1920. p.11

So what do you think? worthy to add after the article is unprotected?--MarshallBagramyan 00:53, 21 May 2006 (UTC)

Should be included in an article on the denial of the Genocide - twisting of history, distoritions, denials and such...--THOTH 13:31, 21 May 2006 (UTC)

Admin InShaneee

Hi, I was hoping you could voice your views on the conduct of InShaneee here: Misplaced Pages:Administrators' noticeboard/Incidents#Inappropirate conduct by admin InShaneee. Basically, I am making the case that InShaneee hands out unfair warnings, refuses to discuss them and holds double standards. Paul Cyr 21:47, 22 May 2006 (UTC)

Hi Fadix

I guess you may be interested in this one. You are declared among Takip edilecek tescilli Türk düşmanları (Notorious enemies of Turks to be pursued). Ciao! Behemoth 00:44, 3 May 2006 (UTC)

Tags

Gm inappropriately put this tag:

This article relies excessively on references to primary sources. Please improve this article by adding secondary or tertiary sources. Find sources: "Fadix" – news · newspapers · books · scholar · JSTOR (Learn how and when to remove this message)

on the Sumgait article so I promptly attached the same to the March Massacre.--MarshallBagramyan 19:50, 27 May 2006 (UTC)

POV

Can you point out which parts where you see the POV issues? If its found in both the article and the footnotes, I'll just revert back to a few versions back. Thanks.--MarshallBagramyan 23:06, 29 May 2006 (UTC)

When are we Going to See Proof that Azaris are Genetically Turkic

Please keep an eye on Azari and the talk:Azari. I have started the following in the discussion.

It has been ages since these citations have not been verified. Verification is needed. If not delete the material. the amount of time granted has been generious. The Azaris Iranian background has been verified through various scientific and academic sources, but the Turkic claim has not. The only think that has been verified is the Turkic langauge. 72.57.230.179

Civility again

Regarding edits such as this:

This is your last warning. If you continue to make personal attacks, you may be blocked for disruption. --InShaneee 22:15, 5 June 2006 (UTC)