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Revision as of 07:16, 29 September 2013

Persona 3 original title

Can I ask you why you changed the original title of Persona 3 from "Persona3" to "Persona 3"? I want to edit the P4 article, and I want to the real original titles of the game. --Shinra.Electric.Power.Company (talk) 00:37, 8 October 2011 (UTC)

Titles

You recently asked how to italicize an article title. Add the template {{italic title}} near the top of the article. Station1 (talk) 07:22, 18 October 2011 (UTC)

Shogi

Well, but the "main" article is Shogi, not shougi. Maybe to avoid confusion(?) it should be shogi and not shougi. For me it's the same though. --Hydao (talk) 14:18, 11 March 2012 (UTC)

Talk pages

Hi. Note that talk pages are meant to be a record of a discussion; deleting legitimate comments, as you did at Talk:Fire Emblem: Seisen no Keifu, is considered bad practice, even if you meant it well. --Jtalledo (talk) 14:47, 16 April 2012 (UTC)

Minor edits

Despatche, first off I'd just like to say great job on helping to clean back up the Novelty article. It obviously needed it and it looks great. Secondly, and it's only a "minor" issue, but it appears that you may be overusing the "minor edit" function. I should know, I had the same issue a couple of years ago. Remember that most of the edits you do should not be marked as minor, particularly the large edits that you seem to be good at. For more detail on this, please check WP:MINOR. Also, don't forget to include your edit summaries my friend. That all said, keep up the good work! ;) Buddy23Lee (talk) 21:08, 17 April 2012 (UTC)

OR, you could just disregard all the above regarding the minor edit function, as it appears you have. Fair enough, I bid you farewell with a well earned trout slapping...

Whack! You've been whacked with a wet trout. Don't take this too seriously. Someone just wants to let you know that you did something silly.

Good day to you sir. Buddy23Lee (talk) 22:07, 22 April 2012 (UTC)

Micro Cabin

Hello Despatche. You've asked for a technical move of MicroCabin to Microcabin. From a quick Google search it seems to me that Micro Cabin is more common. For example, see and . If you agree, you could change your request. If you have doubts, it might be best to open up a move discussion. Thanks, EdJohnston (talk) 03:13, 4 November 2012 (UTC)

The WikiProject Video Games Newsletter (4th Quarter 2012)

The WikiProject Video Games Newsletter
Volume 5, No. 4 — 4th Quarter, 2012
Previous issue | Index | Next issue

Project At a Glance
As of Q4 Template:Vgy, the project has:

Content

• VG Project Main pages

  • Main project – talk
  • Project category – talk
  • Portal – talk

  VG Project Departments

  • Assessment – talk
  • Cleanup – talk
  • Peer review – talk

   

  • Reference library – talk
  • Newsletter – talk
  • Video game images – talk

Your move request for TinHead

I agree with you that 'Tinhead' fits the data better. But there is a clash of names. Lower case Tinhead is a redirect to Edington, Wiltshire and it appears to be legitimate. How would you feel about a move of TinHead to Tinhead (video game)? EdJohnston (talk) 17:15, 10 January 2013 (UTC)

Your solution solves the ambiguity, but you don't really need to place hatnotes on the two articles. Especially the one at Tinhead (video game) isn't needed, because a hatnote from a disambiguated article to the generic one is kind of trivial. See WP:DAB: "There is no need to add disambiguation links to a page whose name already clearly distinguishes itself from the generic term." Thanks, EdJohnston (talk) 17:43, 10 January 2013 (UTC)

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Ristar's title

Why is it you feel that its name wouldn't be capitalized? Sergecross73 msg me 15:42, 11 January 2013 (UTC)

Akibaranger

Do not unilaterally move pages without consent. As there is no material that uses "Hikonin" or "Hikounin" plastered in English, we should not use that as the page title on Misplaced Pages. If we were to not translate the word "Unofficial" then by all means the article should be located at "Hikōnin Sentai Akibaranger" as Misplaced Pages uses the Hepburn romanization system.—Ryulong (琉竜) 04:29, 10 April 2013 (UTC)

Do not unilaterally move pages without consent! Using a fake translation because "no English source uses the romaji" is the most brain-dead thing I've seen from Misplaced Pages yet. crunchyroll, or anyone else for that matter, can not and will not make up whatever translation they please and call that an "official title". You don't understand that what happens at Misplaced Pages gets spread everywhere else and becomes this so-called "official", NOT any other way around. English speakers need to learn some respect for non-English things before they try to comprehend them.

Now if you want to protect your precious macrons, feel free to do so. Despatche (talk) 09:39, 10 April 2013 (UTC)

Stop moving the damn page. You made a bold move by moving it to "Hikounin" before and I moved it back to "Unofficial". That means per bold, revert, discuss, we should start a discussion as to what the title of the page should be (namely a requested move discussion). That does not mean that you move the page again to the "Hikōnin" variant. I've moved the page back to the status quo version. If you want to suggest that the article title be changed at this point, follow the instructions at WP:RM and do not continue to edit war or else you may be blocked in order to prevent disruption of the project.—Ryulong (琉竜) 10:41, 10 April 2013 (UTC)

By "plastered in English", I mean that there are no Japanese language sources that show that they use "HIKOUNIN SENTAI AKIBARANGER" or any variation when presenting anything in English language text, at least as far as I am aware. And please heed the request I have on my talk page and respond to my comments here rather than starting another section on my user talk. You are free to remind me to check back here with {{talkback}}, but I do not like having conversations on two separate pages because you treat it as a private messaging system rather than a threaded conversation.—Ryulong (琉竜) 10:46, 10 April 2013 (UTC)

The following photographs were taken at the Tamashii Features Vol. 3 event taking place March 31 and April 1, 2012, before Akibaranger was even broadcast: 1, , , , , . I don't see the English letters spelling out "HIKOUNIN" anywhere.—Ryulong (琉竜) 11:01, 10 April 2013 (UTC)

Took you long enough! Thank you. Case closed.

Why didn't you just say "Unofficial Sentai Akibaranger" is used in Japan, and showed me these images immediately? Why did you have to be vague instead? Is this really so hard? Despatche (talk) 11:09, 10 April 2013 (UTC)

Because I did not know they existed until I went searching for them.—Ryulong (琉竜) 12:56, 10 April 2013 (UTC)

Oh.

Well.

Neither did I. :V

I don't know how I couldn't find them, I searched as hard as I could... Thank you very much. Despatche (talk) 13:30, 10 April 2013 (UTC)

I went to see if the Figuarts boxes had English text on them like I know some of the other ones do. And then I found all that crap from the promo event last year.—Ryulong (琉竜) 14:23, 10 April 2013 (UTC)

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AN3

Notice of Edit warring noticeboard discussion

Hello. This message is being sent to inform you that there is currently a discussion involving you at Misplaced Pages:Administrators' noticeboard/Edit warring regarding a possible violation of Misplaced Pages's policy on edit warring. Thank you. Tbhotch. Grammatically incorrect? Correct it! See terms and conditions. 01:11, 13 May 2013 (UTC)

May 2013

Template:Z10

Pepsi edit war

I agree with you in the dispute at Talk:Pepsi, but not with the way you've conducted it. I hope you'll have a look at Misplaced Pages:Staying cool when the editing gets hot and Misplaced Pages:Civility. It'll help avoid stress for all of us in the future. Ibadibam (talk) 22:37, 15 May 2013 (UTC)

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Romanizations of Japanese titles

I find romanizations of Japanese titles that are just the English words written in Japanese pretty pointless. However, consensus is to include them anyway. So please don't remove them from the articles, as you did at Super Metroid for instance.--Atlan (talk) 14:13, 30 May 2013 (UTC)

The style guide is at WP:VG/NONENG. Please adhere to it rather than going around changing titles to whatever you think is right. Also, if you romanize titles, use revised Hepburn to do it. If you wish to change the guidelines, the talk page would be the place to go.--Atlan (talk) 10:43, 31 May 2013 (UTC)

C1

I think you're right that "C1" is a little vague and I think you're wrong to say that " 'C1 NES TV' ... has no basis in reality." That term ("C1 NES TV") is in fact used by several reliable English-language sources including kotaku, gamesradar, and technologytell. There's no need to change the article name to match the Japanese name because this is English Misplaced Pages. You could make the argument that it should be called the Sharp Nintendo Television as this is its official name in English, but simply "C1" doesn't seem like a good move to me. -Thibbs (talk) 01:41, 1 June 2013 (UTC)

The same goes for the SF1. The original term "SF-1 SNES TV" is used by many reliable sources. There is no need to move the page to some arbitrary new name just because the Japanese article's title doesn't match this one. -Thibbs (talk) 01:44, 1 June 2013 (UTC)

Hi Despatche, I saw your latest note and responded at my user talk page, but this issue is really a matter that should be discussed on the article talk pages. That will allow others to weigh in and I hope it will demonstrate for you that my views on the proper title are based in policy and not just personal prejudice. So if you still think that "C1 (television)" and "SF1 (television)" are the best titles then please express your view at Talk:C1 (television)#New renaming and Talk:SF1 (television)#New renaming. -Thibbs (talk) 13:38, 2 June 2013 (UTC)

Please try to restrain yourself from making edits like these (1, 2) while we're discussing your controversial move. This only exacerbates the problem. There will be plenty of time to make moves like this as appropriate after we've come to a consensus. -Thibbs (talk) 17:35, 2 June 2013 (UTC)

Can I take this edit to mean that you are interested in external opinions on this issue? If so, would it be OK for me to throw the question out to WT:VG? I'm sick of being the target of your frustrations. I understand that you meant well with the title change, but I hope that if you see how your position is not based in policy/guideline and how your view is in the minority then the anti-Thibbs ranting will stop. I didn't invent the rules, I'm merely applying them. If my application of the rules is in error then please rest assured that the others at WT:VG will quickly point that out and may side with you. That's something I'm comfortable with and I'll respect any community decision that is made regarding the title. What do you say? Shall we contact them? -Thibbs (talk) 11:59, 3 June 2013 (UTC)

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Big Angry Destroyer Mastodon!

Hi Despatche, I just read through your recent comments and I'd like to ask you to please cool it with the suggestions that I'm trying to "ruin Misplaced Pages's standards" or that I "seek to destroy" articles, and that I am "a monster" of some kind. None of it is true at all. I have been actively working since before you even joined Misplaced Pages to ensure that these particular articles (the SF1 and C1 articles) meet the requirements to avoid deletion. Nearly all of the reliable sources that are used in these articles - the same ones you are so quick to dismiss as ill-researched know-nothing hack-jobs - were added by me. They're all that stand between the deletion squad and the articles' removal from Misplaced Pages. Does that sound like the work of someone who is seeking to destroy everything? It's not so much an exaggeration on your part as it is a complete inversion of reality. You could at least accuse me of OWNership if you wanted to get into my head and make me feel paranoid. Suggesting that I'm out to ruin the articles I've carefully worked to improve is just false on its face. -Thibbs (talk) 23:36, 3 June 2013 (UTC)

RfC

I've started an RfC on both the C1 and DF1 issues together here. Please read through it to make sure it's accurate and to express your views. Just as I've asked you to keep content-related arguments to the article talk pages, I'd also like to ask you to try to avoid carrying your AN/I complaints about my behavior over into the RfC. I hope we can resolve this fairly quickly. -Thibbs (talk) 03:12, 5 June 2013 (UTC)

Game titles

Hello, I've had to revert some of your edits (Echochrome and related titles). Misplaced Pages's manual of style guidelines say that we should ignore manufacturer's "official" styling of trademarks and product names and just use normal English.(see, MOS:TM). I hope that explains why I reverted your edits, any queries please contact me. - X201 (talk) 10:19, 11 June 2013 (UTC)

That's why I had to undo your edit to Rain. Thanks, and happy editing. --Soetermans. T / C 15:22, 12 June 2013 (UTC)

June 2013

Welcome to Misplaced Pages. At least one of your recent edits, such as the edit you made to Payday 2, did not appear to be constructive and has been reverted or removed. Although everyone is welcome to contribute to Misplaced Pages, please take some time to familiarise yourself with our policies and guidelines. You can find information about these at the welcome page which also provides further information about contributing constructively to this encyclopedia. If you only meant to make some test edits, please use the sandbox for that. Thank you. This is completely unnecessary. Misplaced Pages is far from perfect, but there is no reason go and use profanity AND WRITING IN ALL CAPS about this styling of a game. Soetermans. T / C 15:25, 12 June 2013 (UTC)

Wrong template, Soetermans. There isn't really one for this situation. Template:Uw-harass1 is probably the closest thing. Incidentally, there's supposed to be an edit filter that blocks edit summaries containing profanity. Not sure why that failed in this case. Ibadibam (talk) 17:03, 12 June 2013 (UTC)

I use twinkle, I just went with this. Thanks for the feedback, in the future I'll go old skool manual. --Soetermans. T / C 20:10, 12 June 2013 (UTC)

I also suffer from twinklevision. It's an imperfect tool, isn't it. Ibadibam (talk) 20:38, 12 June 2013 (UTC)

N64

Dunno if this is what you mean by "support" and this may not be the kind of proof you're looking for (I just did a quick little search on the official website), but it's clearly an acronym that they use and acknowledge, and even the company didn't use it, enough major gaming sites/writers use the acronym. I don't think it needs "official support" or whatever to be included, as long as it's a widely recognized/used thing it should be fine for Misplaced Pages.
As for how the name is stylized in the logo, color shouldn't matter per WP:COLOR. And I don't think whether or not the company uses it matters, either. I haven't really searched myself in depth but I'm certain that other articles include a "stylized as" bit for some titles. I'm pretty sure this it's just to help avoid confusion for some readers who wonder why an article is titled in one way when the actual game/magazine/band lists themselves as something else. I don't think the fact that it's "not actually used by them" matters much in this case, either. TheStickMan 01:40, 13 June 2013 (UTC)

What's to confuse between title case and uppercase? If I say WIKIPEDIA you still know what I'm talking about. Your average reader isn't going to have trouble with that. Ibadibam (talk) 01:52, 13 June 2013 (UTC)

I'm not saying that saying typing "WIKIPEDIA", "wikipedia", or "W1k1ped1a" will prevent people from recognizing that what's being said is "Misplaced Pages". That's just plain ridiculous. What I mean is that, if Wikpedia decided to do some rebranding and presented themselves as "wIkIpEdIa" or something else that defies English grammar, people might get confused and wonder why the article on the site doesn't change every instance of "Misplaced Pages" to which title should be considered the "right one." In that case, seeing that the correct way to refer to the site will likely always be "Misplaced Pages", it would be necessary to point out that while the name of the site will appear in a certain stylized manner, the way to refer to it is still "Misplaced Pages". Is that clearer for you? TheStickMan 02:31, 13 June 2013 (UTC)

Sort of. Uppercase and title case are generally used interchangeably by businesses when talking about their own products. It's not uncommon for press releases and print advertisements to put the featured product/topic in uppercase to draw attention to it, even when it would be written in title case in other writing and in independent sources. That doesn't mean that we have to document it on Misplaced Pages. The distinction between Nintendo 64 and NINTENDO 64 seems to be a similar case, which is reinforced by the way the text is styled in the logo. But since title case and uppercase are essentially interchangeable, this doesn't really constitute a major change to the name of the product. In my opinion, case matters when it's something that's distinctive, recognizable and nonstandard. A good example of this is eBay, which is already covered in our MOS, and DeNA, which is trickier (Is it an initialism? A poorly capitalized word?). Ibadibam (talk) 19:17, 13 June 2013 (UTC)

Cool, that's valid enough for me. I guess it fits with the whole "big N" advertising, too.

We should shy away from trying to reproduce logos in text because it's very easy to argue that we should completely reproduce them even when an image of the logo would represent them better; and because when the company doesn't actually use such a form in print, there is absolutely no reason to bloat the lede with what is essentially an invalid form.

From what I understand, the current standard is that "stylized as" is for what's actually being written down in print; I didn't actually start seeing otherwise until I got to the Pepsi article and it kinda went from there. COLOR, as far as I can tell, says absolutely nothing about this, or any specific case that comes up.

Your Misplaced Pages example: if they use "wIkIpEdIa" in print to refer to themselves, then by our current policies we should use "Misplaced Pages" as a default (or "WIkIpEdIa" if it gets big enough in sources), and mention the new branding right beside it, once (unless you want to make a section about etymology and naming, which would always be cool). Otherwise, we simply don't, unless you want to make a section about the logo for some reason (e.g. a source made fun of it). No other scenarios to justify, really.

(And of course I could argue that so many names in the lede confuses readers, we should probably move the pre-release names elsewhere; the GameCube and Wii articles don't mention their code names for a while. And I don't see how anyone would even think about all caps NINTENDO, superscript 64; I sure didn't when I was a kid, and I sure haven't since.) Despatche (talk) 09:50, 13 June 2013 (UTC)

First, you aren't bloating any leads. Some more text ranging from half of to a little over one line isn't bloating anything, so if part of the issue here is the amount of extra text acknowledging stylized titles then that's not really a thing worth worrying over.

Second, what do you mean "completely" reproduce them? If you mean changing font and colors then there are Misplaced Pages policies that prevent that kind of thinking. You can't even use that argument successfully. The standard is text, as you have said.

Third, yes, by current policies like WP:COMMONNAME it will always be "Misplaced Pages". Yes, the alt title will be mentioned once in the lead. I don't know if you're explaining this to me because you think that I believe things should be handled differently or that I'm trying to justify "other scenarios", you just described the scenario that should apply to all articles.

Fourth, in most cases involving alternate titles you're not confusing readers with more than one name in the lead because 1. You have the title and 2. The lead is structured to identify either the primary way of referring to something with some alternates to show people that Misplaced Pages and wIkIpEdIa are the same or, in case of a really long title or a more notable nickname, will identify the main title and then the primarily used alternative (Like "The Great Big Enormous 💕 of Misplaced Pages, also known as/commonly shortened to Misplaced Pages").

And finally, yes, there are probably people out there who might think all caps Nintendo with superscript 64, and I don't see how you're making the article worse by covering that base. TheStickMan 14:49, 13 June 2013 (UTC)

You specifically presented COLOR as an example of such policy, which has nothing to say on the subject, even in spirit. If there's a particular policy against this kind of thing, I'd like to see it. The point is that you're already halfway there, so you may as well do the rest.

It makes the article worse because it's not valid; there's no base to actually cover. No one's actually using it, not even the creator of the work. There is zero reason why a text reproduction of a graphic is necessary or even reasonable if that graphic is not actually being used in text, and please keep in mind that this does not include things like the confusing Out Run situations. There's not a lot else to say on the subject. Despatche (talk) 17:10, 13 June 2013 (UTC)

If you want the color thing said in a more obvious fashion there's WP:MOSTEXT#In prose. And the point is not to recreate the logo but to inform readers of alternate representations of the product or whatever it is. You're missing the point if you argue that the entire logo should be recreated.

Um, yes, you're covering the "people might think the right way to write it is now WIKIPEDIA" (it was becoming a pain to alternate the capitalization of letters) base. I understand that it appears to be a stretch but it's a base worth covering.

And yes, the creator of the work uses it. It's called the logo. The fact that they may not use it in "outside writing" is irrelevant, it's still widely used and represented through the logo. They can be considered alternate titles through WP:LEADALT. In short, they are very valid. I don't see how this is difficult to understand. TheStickMan 18:55, 13 June 2013 (UTC)

Except that logos aren't text; they're graphics that can incorporate text. The style applied to text in a logo only applies to that logo. In other uses the letters stand on their own. I think Despatche is saying that there's a slippery slope here: if you're incorporating graphical elements like case or the relative position of the text, where do you stop? Also, the point about bloating the lead is in important one. The first sentence should read like a sentence as much as possible, while still conveying essential information. This concern is summarized in MOS:LEADALT. Ibadibam (talk) 19:17, 13 June 2013 (UTC)

"Never use color in prose (for colorblind persons)" is a pretty solid statement, but I would like to point out that it's a guideline and is somewhat quicker to change if necessary. Further, there is a small bit of a consensus for what I propose; at least one editor agreed with me concerning Pepsi and felt a similar change was in order. So far, no one has opposed this, not even the initial opposing force demonstrated on the talk page (and they were "fighting" for something else).

By using something like "NINTENDO", you are demonstrating what the logo uses, because it's what people see, yes? The problem is that "what the logo uses" is no different from "the logo" (per Ibadibam above, logos are graphics that can incorporate text and nothing more), and attempting to put some kind of demarcation between the two is exactly why I oppose what you're trying to do. No, "NINTENDO" is not used by the company; "a logo" that might represent such a thing is used by the company, and it is a very different thing from "a name" (it is possible to infer the latter from the former, but only as a form of common sense that can be torn to shreds at the slightest deviation), as observed by so many trademarks and logos and whatever the world over.

Again, in your initial "WIKIPEDIA" (why not) example, "WIKIPEDIA" is actually in usage (this is a huge difference). Technically we already have a logo like that. By your logic the article on Misplaced Pages should mention what the logo prescribes; all caps W and A, small caps between. You would have to do the same thing across all applicable articles (and there are legion) that, somehow, you would probably break MOS:TM many many times.

Here's a fun exercise: how would you handle Wii U? Despatche (talk) 19:33, 13 June 2013 (UTC)

Ibadibam: Relative position is a much trickier issue, I understand uncertainties about that (Like with Despatche's Wii U example). But the case is (or should be) clear for, well, case. The style used in it is valid because that's the way products are promoted; the image they are given as a result of that logo is significant. I see no slippery slope here, WP policies make it clear that you can do as much as you can with text as long as the font is unchanged, the color is kept black, and spacing is not disrupted. So you stop within WP's limits.

Despatche: It is not a flexible guideline that can be "change if necessary", texts of alternate spellings from logos won't be able to bend that rule. It makes no difference whether the logos are texts or graphics using texts, it is still being used by the company that produces the products under that logo. There is still readable text that can be transcribed to an article as a valid alternative styling of the "name" and I still fail to see where the harm is coming from.

I'll admit that there's probably an exception for all-caps titles like WIKIPEDIA (Sigh, that new example didn't work out) or DELL, looking at WP:ALLCAPS/WP:SMALLCAPS. Otherwise, I'd say that LEADALT applies to something like "wikipedia" (which is my brand-new example name) or Nintendo 64 in all caps with a superscrift "64".

Looking at the Pepsi talk page, I don't see any resolution at all. They likely stopped replying because they didn't not see anything productive coming out of further discussion, I didn't see where the problem was "something else." TheStickMan 20:38, 13 June 2013 (UTC)

Yes, Despatche has a nasty bite sometimes, and probably bothered off the Pepsi respondents. On this latest iteration, we seem to be doing a much better job of limiting the discussion to the topic at hand and not letting it get personal. Cookies for everybody Ibadibam (talk) 22:30, 13 June 2013 (UTC)

It seems we're just going to disagree over what's "valid", so I guess this really is at a standstill. But maybe Wii U wasn't such a great example: would you use "COLUMBIA" for Columbia Pictures? Actually, how would you deal with the large N in the N64 logo? It's certainly text, but...

...Anyway, keep in mind that all guidelines are flexible by their very nature, and policies are only somewhat less so.

There wasn't a resolution for Pepsi, no. That's why I restarted whatever discussion there might have been, and I'm kinda bothered that those guys never bothered to join in... I'm not sure it's so simple as you describe. They are frightening people.

Something I'd like to understand, though: where does it say that we need consensus to make a change? I understand the idea of "stability", which is why I pointed out Pepsi. But stability is simply a hard thing to fight for, because it could always be a mistake; I'm more inclined to believe that Whoever never get around to putting in a particular change or consistency check, over some kind of "every editor who's seen this article is OK with it" (I just don't think most people would notice this stuff exists, let alone attempt to care about it). Either way, I would think that some kind of discussion would need to be opened up if sides get created, and that each side would be handled equally.

Sorry this looks like a mess, I just kept thinking of thing upon thing. Despatche (talk) 08:40, 14 June 2013 (UTC)

Looking at ALLCAPS, I'd say that noting "COLUMBIA" as an alt styling probably isn't necessary now.

And if you don't have consensus, well, you get stuff like edit-warring, unhappy editors, etc. It doesn't necessarily involve everyone agreeing on one solution, but it requires the addressing of all editors' concerns. You can't go around making controversial edits all the time because you think it's right. Most of the time discussions can drag on forever (like this one), frustrate many people, veer off-course, etc., but given the alternatives, it's better to try to reach consensus.

As for the Pepsi discussion, no offense, but I'd be hard-pressed to continue discussion with someone who acted very aggressive, edit-warred then got mad at other admins for edit-warring, and directed insults and accusations of "lying" at them. You seemed far more frightening, coming from someone who just looked in on the discussion yesterday. But that's another conversation, there are places you can go if you want to talk about admin abuse. TheStickMan 15:02, 14 June 2013 (UTC)

Oh dear, I don't like where this is going, no.

They were indeed lying, telling me that something was there that simply wasn't; no accusation there. Once again, I maintain that being aggressive and doing things you really shouldn't be doing is the only kind of language that these people understand; once good faith is gone, there is literally nothing else you can do. Seeing them disappear like they did just makes it all the more terrifying. I don't know where you're getting the admin abuse thing from; I've stated so many times that I don't really care about the block that I'm ready to remove the term "good faith" from my vocabulary.

"You can't go around making controversial edits all the time because you think it's right." <-- Even though that's the entire point of Misplaced Pages? The only time something actually becomes controversial is when someone opposes a particular new change to a long standing thing for the sake of it being long standing.

(Hilarious how you claim ALLCAPS, even though I could say the same about "NINTENDO".) Despatche (talk) 15:28, 14 June 2013 (UTC)

You can't say the same about the N64 logo because of the superscript 64. And no, that's not the point of Misplaced Pages, and no, I didn't see anyone opposing something new because they didn't want change (although that's not to say that that line of thinking never happens on here).

Patience and open-mindedness are far better tools for discussion than aggressiveness. Would you prefer talking to someone who thinks differently but is still willing to listen or someone who talks angry, acts angry, and appears unwilling to compromise? I've learned a few things about the whole alt title thing from this discussion and that's obviously a good thing. If you stop assuming good faith you're only making it harder on yourself and other editors to improve Misplaced Pages. I'd say those admins left not because they had no good faith in you but because you stopped maintaining good faith in them. You talked to them as if they were obstructing you and deliberately stopping you from improving the page and that's never a good idea unless there is obvious vandalism going on. TheStickMan 15:44, 14 June 2013 (UTC)

Also I brought up admin abuse not as you abusing admins but as admins abusing you, since that seemed to be your worry, in case that wasn't clear. TheStickMan 15:46, 14 June 2013 (UTC)

Oh, the pain. No, just because there are some superscript numbers in there does not mean ALLCAPS is somehow null and void. Yes, that is the point of Misplaced Pages. Yes, a resistance to change is always considered the default around here, and you yourself are arguing that position with Nintendo 64. I believed actually trying to care about being a decent human being was and is not going to work with the folks who encountered me at Pepsi. They were "obstructing and deliberately stopping" from improving the page; I mentioned several times that the original points brought up were in error, but everyone in the original "discussion" ignored all that. And yes, obviously I mean admins abusing me, when at least one was also part of that "discussion" and was also deliberately ignoring what I was trying to say.

There is no way in hell that you can argue I came down first when the obvious sentiment was "look at him edit war, he's clearly a troll, we should ignore everything he says"! Despatche (talk) 20:25, 15 June 2013 (UTC)

You're starting to sound super-exasperated/pissed about this, but please bear with me.

I'm assuming that ALLCAPS/SMALLCAPS refers to titles that consist solely of all captial letters. Is that wrong? I'm not saying ALLCAPS is suddenly null and void, I just think that it doesn't apply. And if my really long paragraphs aren't clear enough for you, no, this is not a case of me wanting to keep the status quo. I see benefit (not much, as I've admitted, but at least some) in keeping it and I just fail to see why it's such a big deal to you and Ibadibam that they go away. In the end this amounts to a little bit of extra text in the lead. I'll be honest, I've been sorely tempted to just abandon this conversation multiple times or call in someone else to deal with it because I believed the subject matter to be pointless overall.

"Be bold" goes only so far and doesn't cover reverting edits over and over again simply because you think you are right. It's too easy to jump from being bold into disruptive editing territory, and I mean no offense when I say that, at the time, you were being disruptive. I've been there before and it sucks when you think that no one is listening. But when a bold edit is reverted, you discuss and you leave the page alone for the time being, regardless of whether you're right or wrong. I don't even know why we're talking about your Pepsi behavior, you clearly aren't acting the same way now and I primarily brought it up to give you a tip on dealing with annoyed admins. TheStickMan 22:19, 15 June 2013 (UTC)

i don't know either, but that's apparently the trend you were looking for. this whole time i was referring to "controversial edits" that no one challenges (again, an edit isn't actually controversial until someone challenges it) Despatche (talk) 22:24, 15 June 2013 (UTC)

Well, in any case, there's no need to discuss that anymore. TheStickMan 23:38, 16 June 2013 (UTC)

Talkback

A barnstar for you!

	The Barnstar of Diplomacy
	For successfully resolving the titling dispute for the C1 and SF1 product articles through peaceful discussions, despite a difficult start. I am impressed, great job! :) ·Salvidrim!· ✉ 11:32, 14 June 2013 (UTC)

Game titles again

Please stop adding Japanese language titles to games that are not originally Japanese. This is English Misplaced Pages. Thanks.--Atlan (talk) 12:40, 18 June 2013 (UTC)

Haven't you read WP:VG/NONENG last time I pointed it out to you? It says only to list the Japanese (or other foreign language) title if the game is originally from that country (which makes sense). Again, please adhere to this style guide rather than ignoring it. I suppose if the Japanese title is in some way notable, one could make an exception, but this is certainly not the case here with these NBA games. If you feel Japanese should get preferential treatment where video games are concerned, take it to the guide's talkpage.--Atlan (talk) 17:45, 18 June 2013 (UTC)

I meant no offense. Anyway, I was just pointing it out. Also, don't take the guide as hard rule. You may deviate from it if you find it useful. I don't see the use for the the NBA games though.--Atlan (talk) 20:47, 18 June 2013 (UTC)

The WikiProject Video Games Newsletter, Q2 2013

The WikiProject Video Games Newsletter
Volume 6, No. 2 — 2nd Quarter, 2013
Previous issue | Index | Next issue

Project At a Glance
As of Q2 2013, the project has:

Content

• VG Project Main pages

  • Main project – talk
  • Project category – talk
  • Portal – talk

  VG Project Departments

  • Assessment – talk
  • Cleanup – talk
  • Peer review – talk

   

  • Reference library – talk
  • Newsletter – talk
  • Video game images – talk

MuZemike delivered by MuZebot 15:36, 4 July 2013 (UTC)

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LaFerrari

I have again removed "The" in the lead - "LaFerrari" means "The Ferrari" so adding a "The" at the beginning is completely redundant and unnecessary.--ukexpat (talk) 20:24, 5 August 2013 (UTC)

So how do I use it in a sentence if I want to describe a single car? "I'd really love to drive UnaFerrari"? No way. We'd say "drive a LaFerrari". The "la" particle isn't English. When we use "LaFerrari" in English, we add English articles as necessary. Even the LA Times article uses "the LaFerrari." Ibadibam (talk) 20:47, 5 August 2013 (UTC)

Read the LA Times article again - it uses both inconsistently, but it does also explain the name: ...a car whose name translates to TheFerrari. And it's not a Ferrari LaFerrari. It's just LaFerrari.--ukexpat (talk) 01:18, 6 August 2013 (UTC)

I understand where you're coming from. "La" means "the"; to that there's no disagreement. I'm just saying that treating "La" as though it were functionally or grammatically equivalent to "the" makes for awkward constructions that have the potential to confuse or distract the average English-language reader. Which is why the L.A. Times (and a few other reliable sources) ends up treating "LaFerrari" as a typical car name without any inherent article in it, and why we should as well. Ibadibam (talk) 17:40, 6 August 2013 (UTC)

August 2013

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Don't remove the improvement tags before fixing the problems in question

--Niemti (talk) 07:31, 9 September 2013 (UTC)

Also, when the tag specifically tells you this:

This article's lead section may be too short to adequately summarize the key points. Please consider expanding the lead to provide an accessible overview of all important aspects of the article.

try to not be such a dick and don't CULL THE LEAD INSTEAD OF EXPANDING. --Niemti (talk) 07:45, 9 September 2013 (UTC)

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Pokémon/Pocket Monsters

Stop enforcing your damn proposed changes to the formatting when you do not have anything close to consensus behind you. Status quo prevails when you get reverted and you have to convince the other party or more than one person that your way is best. Do not revert me again.—Ryulong (琉竜) 07:16, 29 September 2013 (UTC)