Misplaced Pages

Revision as of 05:48, 18 March 2015

Im a very big fan of Big L and I know more about him than you so stop changing stuff if you dont know wtf your doing, do you know what a compilation album is? Why are you deleting Big L's work?!!!! He has more material out there and you keep taking it out! Stop being an ass hole and corporate with the facts! You stupid little bitch!

Adding: 03:29, 26 January 2015‎ Mrmike1695 (talk|contribs)‎ (Fixed typo) (Tags: Mobile edit, Mobile web edit)

This is my new favorite thing. Leaving it here as a banner. JesseRafe (talk) 21:20, 17 February 2015 (UTC)

Welcome

I saw that one of the articles you edited was Wolof language. As you may have noticed, Misplaced Pages is always in need of more Africa editors. I don't know if this is a continued area of interest for you, but if it is, here's some other links that you may want to check out:

• Misplaced Pages:WikiProject Countering systemic bias open tasks
• Portal:Africa
• Misplaced Pages:List of missing Africa topics
• Misplaced Pages:African Collaboration of the Fortnight

Good luck, and happy editing! If you ever have any questions, feel free to leave a note on my talk page; lots of folks helped me when I first got here and I'm always glad to pay it forward! --Dvyost 20:18, 17 December 2005 (UTC)

Re:questions

Hey Jesse, glad to hear you're interested. Our coverage of Togo remains pretty thin and could definitely use the help. Unfortunately, you do have to maintain separate accounts for separate wikis; you can, however, add an interwiki link to your user page, like this: ], which would link to my page at the French wiki (as it happens, I'm actually working there at this very moment). As for an edit counter, there's no "official" one, but your best bet is to go here. It's worth remembering, though, that as Kate puts it, editcountitis can be fatal--it's easy to get sucked into racking up the numbers (almost everyone here does at one point or another), but the best way to win respect here is to put up a good article, whether it takes you one edit or four hundred. Hope this helps! If you need help with anything else, don't hesitate to ask. Cheers, --Dvyost 04:55, 18 December 2005 (UTC)

Re: Nas

I'll admit I'm not too active on the hip hop wikiproject. Although the plurality of the articles I edit are related to hip hop. I see a lot of crap on these kinds of articles, so I tend to lean twoards editing them (plus I love hip hop). Anonymous users are always screwing up these pages. --Ted87 22:23, 28 June 2006 (UTC)

Kaplan

JesseRafe, by removing my additional link to Kaplan (Surname) you're missing the point. I appreciate you adding the disambiguation page in the place, but by simply linking "Kaplan" on the page it's not clear that this link in fact leads to another page (i.e. Kaplan_(surname)). Proof of this is in that we've been batting around what text belongs in this article in the first place or not - if it were more obvious (which it is not), I wouldn't have kept adding information about the surname in this article at all. So blame it on Misplaced Pages formatting, but folks are messaging me asking what happened to the surname info. So please.... leave the surname link alone in this disambiguation post. It doesn't change the content of the article and only helps to clarify where the additional info is. You win.

Also, thanks for the "watchlist" tidbit. Turns out I had the page on the list, I just had the wrong e-mail address in my profile! Fixed. Thanks for pointing that out. Cheers. Kaplansa 04:10, 17 December 2006 (UTC)

Knicks-Nuggets brawl

Responded to your concern on my talk page.--The Fat Man Who Never Came Back 13:31, 17 December 2006 (UTC)

I know about previews, but often even after a preview, I'll have forgotten an item, or will have overlooked a misspell. JAF1970 21:32, 20 December 2006 (UTC)

Al Leong

Excellent work on the Al Leong article. -- BBlackmoor • 2007-01-08 03:56Z

Good catch on the Al Leong article. -- BBlackmoor • 2007-02-19 16:59Z

Seeking community input re standardizing baseball roster pages

Hi ... I'm leaving you this note because you recently made edits to one of the Major League Baseball roster pages. I've made a proposal for standardizing the format, structure and content of these pages here and would appreciate your input so that we may reach a consensus. Thanks. --Sanfranman59 03:16, 24 April 2007 (UTC)

Btw, I checked the Phillies roster the other day and unless I missed something (certainly not beyond the realm of possibility), it should be accurate. --Sanfranman59 03:49, 24 April 2007 (UTC)

Phillies

Phillies standings

Sorry I took so long to reply...it's been hectic. What was exactly the intention? I saw there was talk about breaking it off into its own article, kind of like the Yanks, but I'm a little leary of that, only because if we only show the last 5 or 10 seasons on the main page, it appears to the unknowing glancing viewer that the Philles are an expansion team and not the oldest team in MLB. So, I'll have to read more when I get some time, but thanks for bringing it to my attention.

On a side note, I'm really glad to see they're starting to kick it into gear, but they still need to fire Charlie! EaglesFanInTampa (formerly Jimbo) 16:20, 1 May 2007 (UTC)

Phillies seasons

My bad. It's got to be reformatted, though, to match the rest of the abbreviations and cited properly in the footnotes. Killervogel5 (talk) 03:25, 22 April 2008 (UTC)

OK, as much as I should be asleep right now, I pulled all the Phillies rookies of the year (another reason why one lone award had to be removed) and got them all up there and cited. Thanks for your help... we could use you at WP:PHILLIES too. Our helpers there are pretty sparse. Thanks again. Killervogel5 (talk) 03:37, 22 April 2008 (UTC)

Great, thanks. We appreciate your contributions! Killervogel5 (talk) 11:06, 22 April 2008 (UTC)

History discussion

I'm opening a discussion on the Phillies talk page about breaking out the history page. We could use some input. Thanks! KV5 (talk) 21:17, 30 April 2008 (UTC)

Next step is in place for breaking out the history article. Input appreciated. See the Phillies talk page for more info. Thanks. KV5 • Squawk box • Fight on! 15:53, 22 May 2008 (UTC)

Barnstar for the WP

Check out my sandbox to see my rough draft of a barnstar for WikiProject Phillies and let me know what you think on my talk page! Thanks. KV5 (talk) 02:24, 3 May 2008 (UTC)

WP:PHILLIES question

A message to all members from the coordinator: Please stop by the project talk page and contribute to the discussion regarding the Wall of Fame. We would like to reach a consensus ASAP. Thank you. KV5 • Squawk box • Fight on! 15:52, 30 May 2008 (UTC)

RE: WP:PHILLIES

No problem, Jesse; it's great to have you back on board! Welcome back. KV5 • Squawk box • Fight on! 15:02, 19 July 2008 (UTC)

By the way, we are starting a newsletter, and I'm having a little trouble figuring out what all we should put in it. I want to feature good Phillies articles with a little mini-lead, acknowledge DYKs (and I would like to have one new one in every newsletter, which means the project needs to make sure that they are writing DYK-style articles or expanding stubs significantly), and we are going to have an analysis page. I've got a guy who is going to write game analysis for us on selected games, but he's really not so involved in Wiki as a whole, just with this project. The newsletter template is in my sandbox (see the link at the bottom of my userpage), and I'd appreciate ideas as to what else we can put in the newsletter. Thanks! KV5 • Squawk box • Fight on! 15:14, 19 July 2008 (UTC)

Re: Phillies pictures

Thank you! I was going to get to editing them ASAP. With the Phillies and Eagles playing today, I have been very busy. But thank you for reminding me. Go Phillies! (and Eagles, now too!) Peetlesnumber1 (talk) 23:32, 11 September 2011 (UTC)

Adam Mansbach

I just created the article on Adam Mansbach, and saw that it was in your list of things to work on, feel free to expand if you like. Also, his new book is nominated for Did You Know, should you be interested. I was looking for some coverage of Angry Black White Boy, but have, as of yet, been unsuccessful. Cheers--kelapstick 08:21, 13 May 2011 (UTC)

Thanks for telling me! I was just modifying my user page, and saw that it was still a red link a few days ago. I was literally going to work on it next week. (I have my last final today, in two hours!) I read Angry Black White Boy like 4 years ago, and I think that's how long I've been meaning to start Mansbach's article. JesseRafe (talk) 15:20, 13 May 2011 (UTC)

The Two Mrs. Nahasapeemapetilons

Hello. Whilst I appreciate that you made the edit in good faith, Misplaced Pages's policy on reliably sourcing is clear. IMDb is not considered a reliable source for much other than film credit information because it is based on user-submitted information (see WP:IMDb). The article in question is a Good Article; absolutely no unsourced content can be included in a Good Article. I have done a quick search and I cannot find any reliable source to support it, so I am going to have to remove it. The article links to both IMDb and SNPP in the external links so people can see those for further information. If you find a reliable source you are welcome to re-add it, but if it was as easy as just being able to put anything in with a citation needed tag and leaving it then my job would be far easier. Sorry, Gran 20:37, 17 June 2011 (UTC)

SNPP is a fansite, as is Simpson Folder so neither passes as a reliable source, while TV.com is also user constructed and far less reliable than IMDb and indeed, currently in the process of being removed from all external links sections across Misplaced Pages. To stress, I know what you are adding is correct, but the rules say they must be reliably sourced, and the rules say none of these are reliable. Gran 21:11, 18 June 2011 (UTC)

There are numerous uncited references throughout wikipedia, including many on Simpsons articles, and many of them are obviously true, though without superscript italicized hyperlinked backup. I just clicked randomly on the page for Season 15 and chose the first one that was a parody title, The Fat and Furriest, and of course the cultural reference says it is a nod to the movie . Is there a reference? No. Is it original research? Kinda. Is it likely to find a reliable third-party source that would publish that nugget of wisdom? Not at all. It's so obvious that no one would ever bother to write it out conclusively, as it's not a hidden gem of allegory with clever allusions, but a broadside pun on something in the popular consciousness. So, yes, it's original research, but one that I am not alone in having made, if everyone (who has knowledge of the film in question, obviously more people are aware of The Fast and the Furious than The Two Mrs. Carrolls) gets "it". I mean, how do you find a source for a joke that explains the joke? It's a joke. You're supposed to do original research mentally and temporaneously, and if you cannot then you "don't get the joke". But if you wanted to look up the joke on wikipedia, you'd be disappointed if you didn't find an explanation, just a lot of people who got the joke talking about how great it is. So rather than thinking of it as "original research" it seems more like "collective research" and as someone in I believe it was the Simpson Folder said, the title was an "obvious play" on the movie. Why not inform those who come to that page and may have previously been unaware of the reference? Again, thank you for not removing the item again, but I just don't think the "rules" in this case are right. JesseRafe (talk) 13:47, 19 June 2011 (UTC)

Well if you disagree with the rules or how they are applied then maybe you should take it up on the talk page of the rules? I write articles. I don't really care about the rules. I just apply them to the best of my ability. Just because something is obvious to someone, doesn't mean it is universally so. As WP:V states "The threshold for inclusion in Misplaced Pages is verifiability, not truth". Maybe I'm applying the rules incorrectly. I don't know. But your fundamental point is one you should raise at a wider community level, because I lack the knowledge and interest to debate it. Gran 14:38, 19 June 2011 (UTC)

Let me repeat what I said above: if you don't like the rules, or my widely accepted interpretation of those rules, then take it up on the talk page of the rules. I'm sorry if that's "not cool", and really, I understand your point, but it's not my problem. Gran 22:03, 16 July 2011 (UTC)

Hello. This message is being sent to inform you that there is currently a discussion at Misplaced Pages:Administrators' noticeboard/Incidents regarding an issue with which you may have been involved. Thank you. Theleftorium 22:04, 17 July 2011 (UTC)

See Talk:The_Two_Mrs._Nahasapeemapetilons#Content_dispute_re_episode_title. Cheers, JoeSperrazza (talk) 23:07, 17 July 2011 (UTC)

Animal Farm in popular culture

Please be advised that your name has been raised in a discussion at the Dispute Resolution Noticeboard. Please see Misplaced Pages:Dispute resolution noticeboard#Animal Farm in popular culture for additional information. Doniago (talk) 03:02, 17 August 2011 (UTC)

Looks like this has been revived. Let me know if you have a problem with my criterion of verifiable identifiable source with blue link establish prima facie reliability and significance. μηδείς (talk) 21:36, 19 October 2011 (UTC)

Medeis, I trust that you do get the apply here, rather than your page. I will put my two cents in, but as I'm in school right now and the previous flare-up was in the summer, I won't have as much time in general to keep up, nor to check-in on developments throughout the day. I am in agreement about a lot of the prima facie elements of unambiguous reference to AF. In my opinion every permutation of "# __ good, # __ bad" or "All X are equal, but some X are more equal than others" belongs as a reference to AF in the other work without any secondary sourcing needed. Some of the last bit of things included are not meritorious, the Jericho show mention for one, and I think including that together with some of the others is the weakest link in the additions and it makes it easier for detractors to be inclined to wholesale revert the edit. Also, any reference to Napoleon or Snowball or something like that would need to be secondary sourced, or just to the theme of it would also need an impartial source -- because that requires an editor to make the inference. That's my standing. In short, I agree about the self-referential original sources being enough to merit inclusion, but not all of the items in the latest round. JesseRafe (talk) 03:09, 20 October 2011 (UTC)

According to wp:notability, "The criteria applied to article content are not the same as those applied to article creation. The notability guidelines do not apply to article or list content (with the exception that some lists restrict inclusion to notable items or people)". Given that the article only now includes notable material with its own article (i.e., only bluelinked topics), this policy seems conclusive. I will take up the reversions there that insist on a different criterion from the published one, assuming others support my interpretation. Check the edits at the article and let me know if you think I am mistaken in my interpretation. μηδείς (talk) 03:04, 20 October 2011 (UTC)

I am not about to insist that items you don't find notable should be included. You will note I have deleted plenty on my own. But please do restore only what you find deserves it and I will support it wholeheartedly. μηδείς (talk) 03:40, 20 October 2011 (UTC)

High Five

Sorry, didn't mean to imply it didn't have "merit", any good faith edit on Misplaced Pages has merit. What I'm saying is, section breaks and paragraph breaks are similar, the question is when to use one vs the other. Paragraph breaks provide logical breaks in the content. In this case there is a new section header at the top of almost every paragraph, which is redundant, that's what paragraphs are made for. By adding those section headers, I believe, it chops up the article which discourages reading it as a single block of text from top to bottom, and encourages skimming and skipping, like reading an outline that hasn't been filled in, or a "list of" sort of thing, rather than a chronological and somewhat inter-related history of the origin of the high five. If we thought those origin theories were going to be greatly expanded.. say 4 or 5 or more paragraphs each.. I could see section headers making more sense, but until then, I believe it reads better as a single block of text. Green Cardamom (talk) 01:23, 9 September 2011 (UTC)

I responded on the article talk page here. I see what you're saying, but I disagree. I think it looks better the way it is now, especially with the long block quote in the first section. I mean, the other option to me is bullets, but I think we both would agree that's not that aesthetically pleasing. Without some kind of division, it makes it harder to see that the three options are mutually exclusive, or arose independently at best. Without the divisions, in my opinion, it sounds like one origin narrative that all together led to the high five, rather than three separate possibilities. JesseRafe (talk) 04:18, 9 September 2011 (UTC)

Nomination of Jesus Gonzalez (politician) for deletion

A discussion is taking place as to whether the article Jesus Gonzalez (politician) is suitable for inclusion in Misplaced Pages according to Misplaced Pages's policies and guidelines or whether it should be deleted.

The article will be discussed at Misplaced Pages:Articles for deletion/Jesus Gonzalez (politician) until a consensus is reached, and anyone is welcome to contribute to the discussion. The nomination will explain the policies and guidelines which are of concern. The discussion focuses on good quality evidence, and our policies and guidelines.

Users may edit the article during the discussion, including to improve the article to address concerns raised in the discussion. However, do not remove the article-for-deletion template from the top of the article. Mtking 01:22, 11 September 2011 (UTC)

Hello. This message is being sent to inform you that there is currently a discussion at Misplaced Pages:Administrators' noticeboard/Incidents regarding an issue with which you may have been involved. Thank you. Valenciano (talk) 18:56, 13 September 2011 (UTC)

Please use this block as an opportunity to apologize here to User:Valenciano for WP:UNCIVIL. VanIsaac_WS 19:22, 13 September 2011 (UTC)

Lulz, at Vanisaac! Racists and bigots not welcomed here, please do not write on my talk page ever again -- Unless Nelson Mandela apologizes to his prison captors, then maybe I owe Valenciano an apology. As far as I'm concerned, I'm done with the matter entirely, but if you have any more funny jokes, please, leave them here! JesseRafe (talk) 05:18, 14 September 2011 (UTC)

That is a very worrying attitude. Learning to disagree amiably is a skill absolutely necessary to long-term success on this project, and I fear that your lack of perspective in matters like this are going to lead to more incidents at a later date. Please take some time to try to really understand the WP:AGF guidelines. Its purpose is to guide us when we are at our most vulnerable - when we are angry, scared, frustrated, and outraged - and making some effort to internalize the ethos is how we protect ourselves from escalating disagreements. From what I can tell, you are a passionate and well-intentioned editor who is working toward the goals of this project, and I don't like when editors like you end up at ANI with a history that requires a more forceful approach. It's not good for you, it's not good for the people who referred you, and it's not good for the project overall. VanIsaac_WS 08:03, 14 September 2011 (UTC)

"Disagree amicably"???? Did you read the other comments from the admins on the board? There was consensus that he used racist, derogatory, baiting language. I can't disagree amicably with that, I point it out, and say his opinion on the notability of the subject is invalid because he has evidence of systematic bias. Please, don't be an apologist for this kind of behavior. It's very sad. JesseRafe (talk) 13:48, 14 September 2011 (UTC)

JesseRafe (block log • active blocks • global blocks • contribs • deleted contribs • filter log • creation log • change block settings • unblock • checkuser (log))

Request reason:

First, I understand why a certain user has decided to get me blocked. I did not make any personal attacks and I did not do so repeatedly. It is really sad, actually, that I am the one getting blocked because another user was being extremely racist and offensive, and I'm the only one who pointed it out. And I am not a thin-skinned person who sees prejudice everywhere, but tried to explain how the words this user was employing were racist and unfounded in a logical way, but he did not respond to any of my points. I made a purely objective critique of some very hurtful and derogatory language used by editor Valenciano, comments Valenciano made which when read were clearly, unambiguously and objectively racially-motivated. I did not attack him, but pointed out that he was attacking millions with his views he was subtly placing, that Hispanic and Latino people are incapable of achievement without kickbacks and winks and secret cabals. What he said was something akin to "that it is no surprise that a Spanish-language newspaper would endorse an Hispanic politician" (I no longer have access to my pages to find the exact quote). I pointed out that this was prima facie evidence of him being prejudiced, and that it violated being civil, and on top of that, he was uninformed since all three candidates running for the position were Hispanic. It is offensive in so many ways: 1. To Hispanics and Latinos because it means that they can't be judged on their own merits, but can only secure endorsements from "their" people. 2. It is insulting to newspaper journalists to think that they cannot be objective to the facts and policies of politicians, and would solely endorse someone based on their race/ethnicity/language/culture/gender/age/orientation, etc. Would user Valencian have said this if a White candidate were endorsed by any newspaper in the country? I responded by stating that I was almost beyond words that someone could say something like that in 2011. It's a comment that would not surprise me in the 19th century, but it was shocking and disturbing to see it on wikipedia of all places. JesseRafe (talk) 01:28, 14 September 2011 (UTC)

Accept reason:

This is a conditional unblock. I understand why you feel Valencian's comments to be ill-considered – and frankly I agree with you – but at this point there is no benefit to further critiquing them. I am therefore unblocking on the condition that you not comment further on them, or on Valencian or his motivations and/or alleged prejudice, and focus only on the notability of the article. If this condition is acceptable to you, then you can go ahead and resume editing. I will also be leaving a note to Valencian urging him to be more judicious with his comments in the future. 28bytes (talk) 04:49, 14 September 2011 (UTC)

I am sure an administrator will consider this request. I'd like JesseRafe to know that members of the community are also interested in the outcome here. My76Strat (talk) 02:31, 14 September 2011 (UTC)

Thank you, My76Strat, I'm glad some users were able to read what he had actually said instead of just focusing on his cherry-picked comments he chose to post of mine. JesseRafe (talk) 05:02, 14 September 2011 (UTC)

Thank you, 28bytes, but I'm still blocked. And unfortunately have a lot of work to do. Rest assured, I wish to have nothing whatsoever to do with Valencian ever again. When does this take effect? JesseRafe (talk) 05:11, 14 September 2011 (UTC)

Try it now. 28bytes (talk) 05:19, 14 September 2011 (UTC)

Thanks! JesseRafe (talk) 05:21, 14 September 2011 (UTC)

You're welcome. Incidentally, please avoid this sort of comment in the future. Calling people racists and bigots is not OK, and will get you reblocked, even if you feel the charges are accurate. 28bytes (talk) 05:23, 14 September 2011 (UTC)

I'm just shocked at how quickly I was railroaded. I understand that it's not cool to use those words, but it's far less cool for the words he used to be anywhere on wikipedia, even an AfD page. And for what it's worth, I felt it was a description of his actions/words, not a name-calling - it's not rude to say that about Apartheid or Nazism. It seems like there were a few other admins who came on that ANI board after I had been blocked and were the first ones to actually discuss the true issue, i.e. evidence of views expressing a systematic bias being a problem with objectivity when an article's deletion is at stake. It seems like that other user was the baiter and then, being the first to complain (I don't even know how), he got what he wanted, and I had no chance for appeal. This was an especially dirty trick since this happened as the election of which the subject of the article was a candidate's results were being announced and, had he won, I would've wanted to (and been in the best position to) update his article accordingly. Thank you for the somewhat quick and painless resolution, but this whole experience has left me pretty upset with this blocking procedure. It should not have been done so quickly like I was some anonymous IP (been editing for over 6 years, have created dozens of articles) and I should have had a chance to appeal, or at least get judged on the merits of the issue, not just on what kind of grease the squeakiest wheel wanted. JesseRafe (talk) 05:34, 14 September 2011 (UTC)

All I can say is, I understand why you feel that way, and I hope you are able to put this unpleasant experience behind you. 28bytes (talk) 05:43, 14 September 2011 (UTC)

Jesse, here is the thing, NPA exists as a way to try an minimize conflict here. Calling someone who seems racist a racist doesn't minimize conflict, even if true - an conflict is minimized because the purpose of wikipedia is not social debate but writing encyclopedic articles and conflict generally keeps one from doing that :). As you can see from his comment, in the case of Valenciano it was not true - even if I and others can see how you could see it that way. If you have an interest in these issues in a systemic way, I think WP:CSB might be of interest to you.--Cerejota  21:06, 14 September 2011 (UTC)

Hi, Since you have !Voted twice in this AfD, would you mind, just striking out your Keep !vote at the top of the page, (in case you do not know how this can be done by adding <strike> and </strike> around your first comment). Mtking 05:50, 14 September 2011 (UTC)

You may also wish to consider the option of adding {{db-author}} to the top of Jesus Gonzalez (politician), this should make it easer to re-create at a later date should he meet any of the other notability standards. Mtking 06:09, 14 September 2011 (UTC)

strike that someone else has commented on the AfD. Mtking 06:10, 14 September 2011 (UTC)

Yes I did assist in trying to get this article in accordance with inclusion criteria. I'm afraid after some effort, I am left to concur that the subject does not currently meet the criteria. I am confident that it is likely that he soon will, and I hope you or someone remembers to create the article at that time, because the subject is interesting. Good luck to you. My76Strat (talk) 12:51, 14 September 2011 (UTC)

I hope so too, thanks for your help and support (in both realms). Man, would I have been pissed if he had won and I couldn't be the one to say so in his article because of Valenciano's block! I have the word doc from last night, and I'll see what I can uncover later and re-add it when I have some more time again. Thanks again, take care. JesseRafe (talk) 13:52, 14 September 2011 (UTC)

High and Mighty disamb page

Greetings Jesse, you restored the previous version of the page after my line from Hamlet edit. Is there an alternate version of my edit that would be more acceptabe? I do think the reference to hamlet is notable, because Shakespeare frequently either originated many sayings and phrases or frequentluy at least made the phrases popular. In any case, seeing or hearing "high and mighty" makes a lot of people think of Shakespeare. Best wishes, Rich Peterson24.7.28.186 (talk) 03:08, 30 September 2011 (UTC)

thanks for edit

Thanks for your edit on animal farm, i didn't mean to delete material μηδείς (talk) 19:23, 18 October 2011 (UTC)

Laura Ramsey userfied

At your request I've userfied the article at User:JesseRafe/Laura Ramsey. causa sui (talk) 00:47, 6 January 2012 (UTC)

Have you given any thought to this lately? I haven't delved too deeply into the recent DRV, but your version was the best that I have seen by far and I don't think it's very far from being ready. --Bongwarrior (talk) 04:20, 4 May 2012 (UTC)

Causa Sui, and Bongwarrior: Sorry, shortly after that episode, I was pretty bummed the fuck out about wikipedia becoming so Vogon-esque bureaucratic that I took a break from being as active as an editor, and have just been getting back into it now, and looking at my talk page I see that I forgot all about this for a bit.

Since we three seem to agree that while she's not going to win an Oscar or star in anything A-list she's obviously notable nonetheless, what needs to be done to fix this version? More notability? And the current mainspace page is blocked, no?

In rereading Misplaced Pages:Deletion_review/Log/2012_January_3 I'm still confused about how the deletion vote went down, as it was deleted/nommed BEFORE my version of the article went up and all the rationales were based on previous poor attempts. I'm looking over the page on my userspace now and it looks like it's just as good and notable and sourced as 40-60% of the articles on here. Click "random page" for a little while and see pages much much worse than Laura Ramsey. I just don't get it.

Also, I don't really care about the topic, just was filling in a redlink with an actress who is obviously notable, given the number of credits she has, the upper echelon magazine industry write-ups she gets, and the NINE other language wikipedia articles on her. Cheers, JesseRafe (talk) 17:42, 31 October 2012 (UTC)

I think it's probably ready right now - the current version more than addresses the reasons why it was deleted, and it would survive an AfD today without much difficulty (not that I would expect it to be nominated again). I probably could have moved it back to mainspace back in May, but I didn't want to do that without your consent, since you're the one who put the work into it. If you have no objections, I'd be happy to do that now. --Bongwarrior (talk) 20:20, 31 October 2012 (UTC)

I'd be more than happy to have this go live. Are you kidding me??? This is why wikipedia is broken. Because of the "rules" which people follow to the letter and not the spirit. THIS is the version of the article that was deleted. And why? Because someone else deleted a different version of the article before me and THAT was deleted. Unbelievable... JesseRafe (talk) 00:34, 1 November 2012 (UTC)

It is now restored - if you see any technical problems with the move, please let me know. Thanks for your hard work, and sorry for the runaround. --Bongwarrior (talk) 01:35, 1 November 2012 (UTC)

Thanks a bunch! Hopefully the rulebook has been looked at since this was ~10 months ago, I hope others don't have the same troubles I did. Appreciate your efforts, cheers! JesseRafe (talk) 02:22, 1 November 2012 (UTC)

Removing cited information at Hyperforeignism

Hello JesseRafe. You recently edited Hyperforeignism, removing several bits that you called "mispronunciation not hyperforeignism". Articles like that can be really trying to edit, since many people seem anxious to add their own two-cents worth of knowledge without citing reliable sources. In at least four of the cases that you removed, though, there was a source cited, and the source explicitly says, "For example, there is an awareness based on French that /dʒ/ is an English-type consonant, for which /ʒ/ is the 'foreign' equivalent. But when this leads to raj, Taj Mahal, mah-jongg, or adagio with /ʒ/ instead of /dʒ/ (although the language of origin have affricates in these words), we have what might well be called a hyperforeignism" (Wells 1982, emphasis in the original).

I've restored those four examples, but left out Beijing, Punjab, and various other mispronunciations that you removed. Happy editing, Cnilep (talk) 08:11, 19 October 2012 (UTC)

A kitten for you!

D

— JL 09 _contribs    12:40, 27 February 2013 (UTC)

This kitten looks delicious, thank you. But what did I do to deserve it? I looked back through some of your recent edits, doesn't seem to be any page overlap... Cheers! JesseRafe (talk) 15:02, 27 February 2013 (UTC)

R.A. the Rugged Man

I am an OTRS agent, which means I field issues affecting Misplaced Pages articles which are sent directly to the Wikimedia Foundation. I hope you can appreciate that those conversation are confidential, and I cannot reveal details without permission.

I can say that the actions taken on the article R.A. the Rugged Man were not undertaken lightly or carelessly.

The edits did remove some material which may well belong in the article. As you know, we always like to have material supported by references. While this desire is not always met, we are more rigorous about following it in the case of BLPs. Another OTRS agent removed material that was not adequately sourced. I added a list of sources to the talk page, and it may now be time to carefully add back some of the removed material, if it can be supported by references.

I do not plan on making any material additions, as I want to leave that to editors like you who know the subject material better. Sorry it looked like your toes were being stepped on, but I assure you it wasn't without reason.

Do you know if there is any other editor I should contact? (I'll also post this to Wetdogmeat).--SPhilbrick(Talk) 18:14, 3 March 2013 (UTC)

Plcoopr

NO I will not — Preceding unsigned comment added by Plcoopr (talk • contribs) 12:26, 4 March 2013 (UTC)

Bowery

Would you mind reverting Epicgenius in regard to "The" - I'm out of options. Beyond My Ken (talk) 18:29, 31 May 2013 (UTC)

Next time I see it unattended I'll surely do so. However this is not the answer to whether I'd mind doing so, to which the answer is "yes, very much". If he ignores the Talk Page on this subject do you think this is ANI-worthy? I don't want this to drag my watchlist into the clusterfuck that was Cooper Square again... JesseRafe (talk) 19:43, 31 May 2013 (UTC)

Neutral notice

As an editor with an interest in New York City articles, you are invited to participate in an RfC at The Dakota. --Tenebrae (talk) 21:32, 25 June 2013 (UTC)

Gerard

Please do not recreate Gerard after I tag it for speedy deletion (again). I was going to move Gerhard there and was just waiting a few days for comments at Misplaced Pages talk:WikiProject Anthroponymy#Gerard vs. Gerhard before proceeding with the move and split I stated there. Clarityfiend (talk) 04:25, 26 June 2013 (UTC)

Considering I was looking for information on Gerard, found it was an empty spot and all the info that wasn't in Gerald was in Gerhard it seemed the obvious thing to do. If I come across alternative spellings or easy mistakes with blank/red pages, I make redirects. Full stop. It's what redirects are for and how wikipedia works. For all users, not whatever pet game you're playing with the page. Misplaced Pages is NOT for editors, it's for readers. JesseRafe (talk) 05:56, 26 June 2013 (UTC)

True Grit (2010 film)

Hi, Glad to see your revision to the burdensome cast list  –
 – Gareth Griffith-Jones |The Welsh Buzzard|— 18:56, 17 July 2013 (UTC)

Orange Is the New Black

Hi. I saw you reverted my edits on the Orange Is the New Black article. I had been adding the rest of the recurring characters. By which criteria you reverted that? Which character should be included and which shouldn't. You deleted a couple of characters like Lorna Morello or Janae Watson that I think should be included. There are some guidelines? PeterCantropus (talk) 05:15, 23 July 2013 (UTC)

Yes, there are guidelines. The cast listed should not be the entire litany of insignificant and even unnamed characters to ever appear in one episode. It should be significant only, no fixed number or cut-off but the explanation can be found at Misplaced Pages:CASTLIST:

"Misplaced Pages is not an indiscriminate collection of information, so it is encouraged to name the most relevant actors and roles with the most appropriate rule of thumb for the given film: billing, speaking roles, named roles, cast lists in reliable sources, blue links (in some cases), etc."

The version I edited had something like 30 or 40 names on it, so I reduced it accordingly. JesseRafe (talk) 05:26, 23 July 2013 (UTC)

The Two Mrs. Nahasapeemapetilons (2)

1. The title reference for "Sweet Seymour Skinner's Baadasssss Song" is referenced. 2. Something being wrong somewhere else doesn't make it right here. All it means is that it should be removed from "The Canine Mutiny" etc.

But this isn't a clear issue. I believe no cultural references should be in articles unless they are reliably sourced. Period. But your view has the support of Hamsterlopithecus (talk · contribs) (see the talk page of "The Last Temptation of Krust"). My reasoning for this is on the episodes' talk page. But I would advise you to open a wider community discussion about this issue. Maybe here? I don't really care what the result is, I'd just like a result. Gran 20:28, 24 July 2013 (UTC)

Over a month since I left the above message. Have you given any thought about starting a wider discussion to fully clarify this issue? Thanks. Gran 18:02, 31 August 2013 (UTC)

I said my piece on the Nahasapeemapetilon page however long ago that was. Jokes that are title parodies and obvious, are, for the most part, completely uncitable. But that doesn't mean they don't belong on an encyclopedia article. Are they OR? Not really, especially given that with The Simpsons they have an established history of title-parodies, and there are a few episodes that are cited. What we have to remember is Misplaced Pages is for the readers, and this is the kind of information that they would need or want to know on a show's page. Especially given this episode's place in the pantheon of shows that have named themselves after that particular movie. JesseRafe (talk) 19:08, 31 August 2013 (UTC)

Yeah, I understand your view. And, as I have said, I totally disagree (based on my understanding of Misplaced Pages policy) and would like to establish some clear consensus one way or the other. Am I to conclude you have no interest in starting any such discussion? If so, that's cool. Gran 20:43, 31 August 2013 (UTC)

Usain Bolt

I disagree but respect your opinion and will let your revision stand. In my opinion this is not only legit but one of the best examples. If somone "bolts", it has always meant running quickly though usually in the context of leaving somewhere after being startled. "The horse bolted when he fired his gun." Mr. Bolt makes the lightning bolt gesture after victories because it symbolizes speed and quickness, not because he lights up the night sky. Ok maybe he means to convey that as well :) RacerX Talk to me 16:27, 1 August 2013 (UTC) Consider also the superhero Flash's symbol is a lightning bolt. It's a well know metaphor. RacerX Talk to me 16:33, 1 August 2013 (UTC)

Thanks. I appreciate your candor. As you no doubt know that article like others is a magnet for additions. Every so often I try to pare it down to a manageable number and only noteworthy examples, as well as on the quality of the aptronym itself. While there's no established criterion, it seems to me that keeping things as concrete as possible is the best stance on the slippery slope. Hence why I was also adamant about "Marc Rich" - not apt enough to simply be rich and a banker and be a Rich, but a name like "Rich Fairbank" is great or a poker player (but not a banker) named "Chris Moneymaker" (or that'd be good for a minter/engraver as well). To me, Usain Bolt seems like "Sally Ride" - sure you can see the connection, but it's not as evident as Sam Whitelock or Tommy Tune. JesseRafe (talk) 17:05, 1 August 2013 (UTC)

That's fine and I should have mentioned before, you have done a great job in keeping the list from growing out of control. Tough decisions. Thank you for that! RacerX Talk to me 18:10, 1 August 2013 (UTC)

Thanks! They sure are tough sometimes, and I find myself pouring over them if I decide to remove one whether that means I have to take out 3 or 4 more as well. I made some changes to the layout just then in responding and realizing Marc Rich was back in there, the secondary list and redundant introductions had bothered me a while, I hope they can stick or more "inaptronyms" can be found. JesseRafe (talk) 18:52, 1 August 2013 (UTC)

A barnstar!

		The Cleanup Barnstar
		For years of maintaining and trimming the list of Aptronyms, which without your diligence, would have likely grown to unmanageable and unwieldly proportions. RacerX Talk to me 00:05, 2 August 2013 (UTC)

UFCW Local 1776

Did you notice that many of the "notable" places are redlinks, and likely to remain so? Did you notice that there are very few footnotes in this entire article, and that the requisite WP:NPOV is not there? I'm a union local president, eager to see our coverage of labor improved here; but by that very token, I insist that we must apply the same standards to articles about labor as we do to articles about capital. --Orange Mike | Talk 13:26, 8 August 2013 (UTC)

MF Doom RM

Hey, I noticed you recently edited MF Doom, and you might be interested in commenting here, Talk: MF Doom#Requested move to Daniel Dumile at the recently opened requested move. STATic message me! 05:46, 21 August 2013 (UTC)

Scarface

Eh, I don't understand why you said my edits were unconstructive. Can you please explain? Herzlicheboy (talk) 21:08, 22 August 2013 (UTC)

"greaser film"

You're an idiot. Bye. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 210.22.142.82 (talk) 07:02, 8 September 2013 (UTC)

That wasn't an attack. It was an observation. The Wanderers is no more a "greaser" movie than West Side Story is. Or the Gangs of New York. Or Romeo and Juliet. Or the Iliad, for that matter. This post-modern obsession with jamming everything in life into some retarded Category Of Knowledge so that we can pretend to be wise is ... retarded. Hence, the comment.

If you can't handle the heat, best stay out of the kitchen. But children can't do that these days, can they ? 210.22.142.82 (talk) 09:53, 11 September 2013 (UTC)

Cool story, bro! JesseRafe (talk) 12:30, 11 September 2013 (UTC)

Tish James

It says in the second paragraph "James gave up her seat on the Council to run for New York City Public Advocate, effective January 1, 2013." How does this not say that she's not currently a city council woman? You also erased a whole bunch of other changes I made without justifying those. --69.2.120.11 (talk) 15:35, 16 September 2013 (UTC)

Your more recent edit revert left the section undersectioned and you exaggerated about the number of one-sentence paragraphs: There was only one.--69.2.120.11 (talk) 18:48, 19 September 2013 (UTC)

G.I. Joe: Retaliation cast list

Hello. While I respect where you are coming from, we are both close to violating WP:3RR with our edits on the cast list of G.I. Joe: Retaliation. It appears that you are not familiar with WP:BRD, because when I reverted your bold edit of paring down the cast list, that was the point where a discussion should have taken place, before any more reverting. I am happy to discuss this with you, but in the meantime, the article should reflect the cast list before the content dispute, until a consensus is reached on the talk page. Fortdj33 (talk) 19:01, 24 September 2013 (UTC)

Jordanian footballers of Palestinian origin

For your information I'm not trying to attack other editors like -85.165.42.67, I'm the one who was actually trying not to cause any of us both trouble. All I did was respectfully and politely ask this editor to stop removing my accurate and undoing all my recent edits to articles of Jordanian footballers of Palestinian origin, which most of them were created by me while the rest were adjusted and improved by me as well. I even apologized to him for making us go through all that trouble. But, he never apologized to me. This editor is just making things worse. I mean if he really wanted to help contribute to articles like those, he wouldn't even be doing any of that. He acts like he owns all these articles, but he actually doesn't, and thinks only he has the right to edit or make changes to them. I'm pretty sure he doesn't even know much about stuff like this. Even his English is not that well. He has no (valid) reason to go on an edit war with me because his edits don't even make sense and he just likes to remove new info added onto these articles. I'm telling you, he doesn't even know what he's doing. If anyone should be suspended or expelled from making anymore edits or creating articles here on Misplaced Pages, it should be him because he's the one who first caused all this trouble and started it all. And don't even think about taking his side because you have no reason to. I'm not the one who's doing anything wrong, he is. So why don't you tell him to stop, and if he doesn't, report him to Wiki authorities and have him suspended because honestly this isn't fair for me at all.

Götaland

Another editor has suggested that I make sure you are aware of this. While removing those citation tags, you also changed King to king before a name, which you probably know is not correct in English. SergeWoodzing (talk) 15:26, 28 February 2014 (UTC)

Please do not remove maintenance templates from pages on Misplaced Pages, as you did to Götaland, without resolving the problem that the template refers to, or giving a valid reason for the removal in the edit summary. Your removal of this template does not appear constructive, and has been reverted. Thank you. SpinningSpark 16:07, 28 February 2014 (UTC)

You might also care to read WP:Edit war which is also against policy. SpinningSpark 16:17, 28 February 2014 (UTC)

The maintenance tags were used maliciously, and this sole editor is waging a war himself while three other editors and myself are all providing evidence contrary to his assertions. Should he maliciously add another misleading tag, I likewise will remove it again. JesseRafe (talk) 17:58, 28 February 2014 (UTC)

Your recent editing history at Götaland shows that you are currently engaged in an edit war. Being involved in an edit war can result in your being blocked from editing—especially if you violate the three-revert rule, which states that an editor must not perform more than three reverts on a single page within a 24-hour period. Undoing another editor's work—whether in whole or in part, whether involving the same or different material each time—counts as a revert. Also keep in mind that while violating the three-revert rule often leads to a block, you can still be blocked for edit warring—even if you don't violate the three-revert rule—should your behavior indicate that you intend to continue reverting repeatedly.

To avoid being blocked, instead of reverting please consider using the article's talk page to work toward making a version that represents consensus among editors. See BRD for how this is done. You can post a request for help at a relevant noticeboard or seek dispute resolution. In some cases, you may wish to request temporary page protection. —/Mendaliv//_Δ's/ 18:29, 28 February 2014 (UTC)

See the Talk Page and Misplaced Pages:Editor_assistance/Requests#Removing_source_tags_without_sources_or_discussion until resolution, status quo should be preserved. JesseRafe (talk) 18:31, 28 February 2014 (UTC)

Hello. This message is being sent to inform you that there is currently a discussion involving you at Misplaced Pages:Administrators' noticeboard/Edit warring regarding a possible violation of Misplaced Pages's policy on edit warring. The thread is Misplaced Pages:Administrators' noticeboard/Edit warring#User:JesseRafe reported by User:Mendaliv (Result: ). Thank you. —/Mendaliv//_Δ's/ 18:31, 28 February 2014 (UTC)

Sorry, I really did not want to do this, but you have indicated that you will continue to revert no matter what and I now have no choice but to block you. You have stated that the maintenance tags you are reverting were inserted disruptively. I see no evidence for that and you need to make that case. Accusations in edit summaries are not the best place for making such a case. Note that this is a different question from whether or not the facts tagged are true. SpinningSpark 18:47, 28 February 2014 (UTC)

Really, User:Spinningspark, you'd block me without actually reading my statements and allowing me to respond at all on the noticeboard and that's a complete lie by User:Mendaliv to claim I was "unwilling to discuss". Did any of you actually read the Talk Pages? The consensus was overwhelmingly against the complaining user 3-1. Did any of you weigh in on the subject and its merits? The offending user was putting CN tags on the article subject itself. And we provided cites and he willfully ignored them each time. All the while being completely silent on what exactly kind of citation would sate him. A decade-old article is severely undermined by the header and article title having a CN tag on it. The CN tags should remain off (i.e. the status quo should be restored) until the Talk Page on all three articles are resolved. And, they basically were. Except for the Serge Woodzinger who just threw CN tags everywhere willy-nilly, then complained when everyone told him he was wrong, and then via his complaints his detractors are silenced, and thus Misplaced Pages, intellectual honesty, and academic rigor are all tarnished by this lemmings-like mentality among many of the site's administrators to blindly follow rules without investigating the heart of the matter. Spirit of the law should trump the letter. Sad. JesseRafe (talk) 18:50, 28 February 2014 (UTC)

JesseRafe (block log • active blocks • global blocks • contribs • deleted contribs • filter log • creation log • change block settings • unblock • checkuser (log))

Request reason:

Respecting the Talk Page consensus and undoing what was, essentially academic vandalism. Inattentive admins decided to block me rather than wait to hear my side on the ANI or actually investigate the matter. JesseRafe (talk) 18:58, 28 February 2014 (UTC)

Decline reason:

You edit warred. Believing that your edits were right does not justify edit warring: in almost all edit wars, everyone involves believes they are right. The editor who uses the pseudonym "JamesBWatson" (talk) 15:29, 1 March 2014 (UTC)

If you want to make any further unblock requests, please read the guide to appealing blocks first, then use the {{unblock}} template again. If you make too many unconvincing or disruptive unblock requests, you may be prevented from editing this page until your block has expired. Do not remove this unblock review while you are blocked.

If this statement isn't an indication of your intent to continue edit warring, I don't know what is. —/Mendaliv//_Δ's/ 18:54, 28 February 2014 (UTC)

Reads a lot like someone commited to fighting vandalism if you ask me. Is 3-1 not consensus? Is ignoring the Talk Page and wholesale pushing your own agenda preferred? That was SW's route, and he won! I was just trying to respect consensus and keep the status quo as the page had been. JesseRafe (talk) 18:58, 28 February 2014 (UTC)

That's not vandalism. I strongly urge you to read WP:VAND, specifically the sentences: "Even if misguided, willfully against consensus, or disruptive, any good-faith effort to improve the encyclopedia is not vandalism. Edit warring over content is not vandalism." Until such time as you understand and acknowledge why your reverts were improper, I would strongly advise any reviewing administrator to decline your unblock request. —/Mendaliv//_Δ's/ 19:01, 28 February 2014 (UTC)

Ok, so if it's not vandalism what is it? And should it not, regardless, be removed? How is acting "willfully against consesnus" also a "good-faith effort to improve the encyclopedia" -- It can't be both. The first time, yes, he was in good faith, but on three pages he did this, and was disputed by three editors, at that point it's no longer good faith -- how could it be? So if it's not vandalism, what is it? How is his behavior exalted, but mine vilified? Did you even read the talk pages? I've asked you that several times.JesseRafe (talk) 19:08, 28 February 2014 (UTC)

(after multiple edit conflicts) I was not even aware that there was a case open at the EW noticeboard when I blocked you. It is beside the point, your behaviour and stated intention is to continue reverting. That in itself is disruptive regardless of the rights and wrongs of the substantive issue. I looked at the article talk page and the talk pages of you and SergeWoodzing before blocking and am not seeing any evidence for claiming disruptive use of tags. It would help if you provided diffs to the supposed disruption and discussion about it. The principle of reverting to the status quo while a dispute is discussed cannot sensibly be extended to maintenance tagging. The correct response to a maintenance tag on a legitimate fact is to provide a citation, not summarily remove the tag. The burden of proof is on the person removing the tag. Having said that, I appreciate that there is such a thing as disruptive tagging, but just being mistaken or doubtful about something and tagging a legitimate passage is not disruption. SpinningSpark 19:12, 28 February 2014 (UTC)

I don't know what "the talk page" you are referring to in singular is so don't know what you haven't seen, but as I have said multiple times, there are THREE pages SW was engaging in his disruptive edits in disregard to consensus. The citation of every single use of the term "Geat" throughout Misplaced Pages would have been beyond distracting. The complaining user, as close as we can deduce seemed to be disputing the very word which is, prima facie, absurd. As I said he put CN tags on the bolded subject lede on the article itself. Why not request the page deleted if he didn't believe Geats existed? JesseRafe (talk) 19:17, 28 February 2014 (UTC)

So apparently, these pages were never viewed?

https://en.wikipedia.org/search/?title=Lands_of_Sweden&action=history

https://en.wikipedia.org/search/?title=Geats&action=history

Also, note that those edit summaries and the Talk pages of those articles had been happening for DAYS before I was reported on the Gotaland article, which, apparently this kerfuffle is based on. JesseRafe (talk) 19:21, 28 February 2014 (UTC)

I didn't view them, nor do I particularly see anything indicating a practice of tendentious editing on the part of Serge. When you claim someone's acting in bad faith, or acting disruptively, it is important (nay, essential) to provide proof in the way of diffs. You still haven't even provided diffs, though you have now (finally) provided links to some talk page. And even had you provided diffs, it would not excuse edit warring. —/Mendaliv//_Δ's/ 19:28, 28 February 2014 (UTC)

That's exactly my point. You didn't engage in the actual matter, didn't easily look up the page history (how is the above histories not "a diff" just view them, simple) and didn't see that there were three pages and their talk pages which all showed SW being against consensus and irrational ("Finally"??? They've ALWAYS been there! It's called the history tab, just view it and INVESTIGATE.). You just blindly block me. Engage. There's a reason for the rules, and this is not them. Engage in the subject matter, please, this is an encyclopedia not a rulebook.JesseRafe (talk) 19:33, 28 February 2014 (UTC)

With that, I'll take the opportunity to disengage from this. It's clear you have no intent of recognizing or acknowledging the incorrectness of the conduct that led to your block, and further discussion is a waste of time for both of us. —/Mendaliv//_Δ's/ 19:38, 28 February 2014 (UTC)

You're ridiculous. I asked you direct questions which you ignored time and time again. To wit:

"Ok, so if it's not vandalism what is it? And should it not, regardless, be removed? How is acting "willfully against consesnus" also a "good-faith effort to improve the encyclopedia" -- It can't be both. The first time, yes, he was in good faith, but on three pages he did this, and was disputed by three editors, at that point it's no longer good faith -- how could it be? So if it's not vandalism, what is it? How is his behavior exalted, but mine vilified? Did you even read the talk pages? I've asked you that several times.JesseRafe (talk) 19:08, 28 February 2014 (UTC)"

I'm clearly trying to address the issue. You wantonly disregard direct questions. How can I acknowledge my conduct if you don't explain what I did wrong? Where did you explain my wrongdoing? I explained my understanding of the issue and you ignored it. Typical. JesseRafe (talk) 19:43, 28 February 2014 (UTC)

User:Spinningspark are you still there? Did you see User:Til_Eulenspiegel's comments backing up the fact that SW was the disruptive one? Did you see User:Mendaliv's dishonesty and dismissive comments while skirting direct questions? Mendaliv said SW was not vandalism, so therefore I am wrong about the issue because I used the wrong word. I asked what would it be and he ignored it. How is fighting bad-faith malicious edits that willfully ignore consensus bad policy? How again and why am I in the wrong here? JesseRafe (talk) 19:50, 28 February 2014 (UTC)

I am not going to go hunting around multiple talk pages to find out where Til Eulenspiegel agreed that SergeWoodzing was being disruptive. You have been here since 2005 and if you do not know how to link to diffs its time you learnt (hint: WP:DIFF). In any case, it is not so important what Til Eulenspiegel thinks unless they are citing some evidence of disruption. Merely disagreeing is not in itself disruption and I am still not seeing any disruption by SergeWoodzing, only requests for citations. Please link to one or more incontrovertibly disruptive edits then I might start to listen. Your rant against Medaliv is also not helping your case. I have always found Mendaliv to be a thoughtful and fair user who goes out of his wat to help others. There is nothing in his posts on this page that amount to dishonesty. I don't know how many times we have to repeat this, but it is not relevant who is right and who is wrong in the dispute over the meaning of Geats. It is your repeated removal of tags without addressing them that is at issue. I might have more sympathy if SergeWoodzing had been spamming articles with numerous tags just for the sake of it, but that is not what is happening. Serge is asking for a very specific issue to be cited. That is not disruptive and the onus is on the editors wishing to keep the material to cite it per WP:V. SpinningSpark 20:14, 28 February 2014 (UTC)

Please, please, please, engage and answer my questions. This conversation: Misplaced Pages:Editor_assistance/Requests proves SW's disruption and violation of consensus from the other editors. Why has it never been answered what to call SW's behavior if not vandalism? I have linked to all of my edits and their summaries and shown how SW was disruptive, what else is there to do? I have "ranted" because Mendaliv (thoughtful??? Ha, I have seen evidence of laziness and herd mentality, but not a shred of thoughtfulness. Fair??? Vindictive and power-happy, maybe.) ignored direct questions again and again. Why has no one answered why/what I did wrong when I was undoing another editor's rule-breaking and policy violations? Why does consensus get disregarded when the losing party complains? (which seems to be the sole issue). Should I have let SW flaunt Misplaced Pages's rules, policies, and conventions? If I had been the one to go and cry to an admin board then I would have been right, but since the opposite side of the argument did so first, he is right. Logical! JesseRafe (talk) 20:27, 28 February 2014 (UTC)

Not really sure what you're hoping for here. Your tone is hardly likely to encourage editors to respond. I'd recommend chilling out and coming back when you've had some time away from here.

I'd also recommend not removing maintenance templates without a thorough discussion and consensus at an article's Talk page, and not accusing an editor of disruptive behavior unless you can, clearly, provide both diffs and links to what specific policies they are violating.

I think this would have gone better for you if you'd stopped repeatedly removing the maintenance tags and let the discussion run its course first. DonIago (talk) 21:00, 28 February 2014 (UTC)

I'm hoping to get my block lifted, which I see is not going to happen. I'm also hoping for an explanation of what I did wrong. How was SergeWoodzing right? He ignored consensus and consistently re-did what the Talk Page discussion agreed was best not to do. I was observing and following the protocol and consensus on the issue. But then I get railroaded because SW complained, and the admins just acted unilaterally without actually looking at the issue. And they completely refuse to confess that they were too lazy to consider that the one complaining was, actually, in the wrong. The maintenance tags weren't genuine but just part of one user's agenda. That's it. Merely calling into question a verified fact, lends credence to one's own crackpot view, and having to cite the mere fact that a word is a word and exists is disruptive to the article. Why should one editor who absolutely refuses to believe he is wrong on an issue get his way, and those who are fixing Misplaced Pages get blocked? How does that help? JesseRafe (talk) 22:33, 28 February 2014 (UTC)

Since my name is being bandied about so mich, I'm being called a "crackpot" and generally under personal attack, let me ask one essential question: why should you be exempt from discussing reverts as well as from providing sources to substantiate article text that without those sources can be considered speculative POV by any reasonable reader? I hope that question helps you in your quest for an explanation of what you did wrong. I know what it's like not to understand that at times, so I sincerely sympathize with you on that. --SergeWoodzing (talk) 23:03, 28 February 2014 (UTC)

This right here is a picture showcase of one of the biggest black marks on wikipedia's reputation. The admins here don't know anything about the subject matter Geats and don't want to know. They don't care who is correct and who is incorrect, or what justice is. They only apparently care about treating those who know about the topic Geats like children, wielding authority and handing out blocks while coddling the editor who says the Geats never existed and all scholarship is wrong and he is right (or WHATEVER lame WP:POINT he is trying to make) Til Eulenspiegel /talk/ 14:47, 1 March 2014 (UTC)

Jesse: What you did wrong was engage in edit-warring when you had many alternative options available to you. Nobody forced you to continue removing the maintenance templates; you chose that course. Whether or not the information "required" sourcing becomes irrelevant at that point. What harm would have been caused by waiting until you had a clear consensus to remove the templates before doing so? Little to none, as near as I can tell. Do not edit-war; it's that simple, especially when the edit-warring is itself a violation of policy/guidelines (removing maintenance templates without resolving the underlying issues they refer to). If your root issue was with another editor's conduct, you should have resolved that first as well. Stop pointing fingers at other people and show a bit of humility and acknowledgement that you acted improperly even if your reasons for doing so were, in your opinion, justified. It doesn't matter whether anyone else was right; what matters for the purposes of your block is that you did not behave in a constructive manner. DonIago (talk) 15:00, 1 March 2014 (UTC)

I really wish I knew what you admins were reading, because it's not what I wrote about the incident... There was a clear consensus on the issue. Q.E.D. Did you look at what Til Eulenspiegel just said above? Is consensus not a policy standard anymore? Why was I punished for enforcing the rules, and SW exalted for violating the rules? There only underlying issue was in the one user's head. Challenging whether the subject of an article even exists? Absurd.

• Please clarify, I am wrong in assuming that the rules are "find a consensus on the Talk Page" (which is what I did), but, in fact, the rules now are "complain on an ANI board when three other editors all disagree with me" (which is what SergeWoodzing did)? Is that correct? DonIago? JamesBWatson? Spinning? Mendaliv? I'm not being passive aggressive here, I really want to know the new rules. JesseRafe (talk) 20:59, 1 March 2014 (UTC)

I'm not an admin, though all things being equal I'd be somewhat flattered to be mistaken for one. If you don't believe that a non-admin can contribute in a positive manner to this discussion, please let me know and I'll fall silent. I spoke up because I felt I could contribute in a positive manner to the discussion.

When it comes to edit-warring, I would say the general guideline is do not do it unless the disruptive behavior is blatant (obvious vandalism, for instance). When you engage in edit-warring, all other issues become secondary, including whether or not your edits are correct in principle. If anything, the fact that your edit involved the removal of maintenance templates makes matters more difficult, because proving that the addition of maintenance templates is disruptive behavior is, to my mind, a difficult task.

Your block is related strictly to the edit-warring...whether your changes were "right" is immaterial because they were not right "enough" to outweigh the violation of WP's edit-warring policy, which is essentially, "If you have to ask whether it was correct to edit-war, it almost certainly wasn't."

I would approach an unblock request from that perspective. Whether your edits were right in and of themselves is immaterial. What other editors did is irrelevant. It's about what you specifically did.

If and when faced with this type of scenario again, I would pursue it as a matter of editor conduct and follow the appropriate guidelines, and unless you can establish unambiguously that the other user's edits are actively harming the project, resist any urge you might have to continue reverting them.

I hope this is in some manner helpful, and am sorry that the situation has been so frustrating for you. DonIago (talk) 22:46, 1 March 2014 (UTC)

That was in fact, extremely helpful and appreciated. I guess I still don't understand this concept of "edit warring" as there've been umpteen times I've reverted a user more than 3 times within 24 hours and in those occasions it's called "fighting vandalism". The number of restoring previous versions of pages to remove non-notables on articles for local topics is in the hundreds, but this is not edit warring, either, or is it not edit-warring merely because a burner account or random IP didn't know to go to the ANI boards so their vandalism could be protected?

I'm generally flummoxed by the fact that being right does not make me right. Being right is immaterial to being right? I didn't have to ask whether it was right to "edit-war", or, in my terms "remove one editor's pet crusade to mystifyingly deny the existence of the Geat people" and I approached it the same way I approach "BALLLLLZZZZ!!!1", so the maxim didn't apply to that occasion even had I known it.

Still, though, is 3-1 not consensus? Why has SergeWoodzing's persistent and without cause conspiracy-theorizing celebrated, and my respect of Talk Page consensus vilified?

Can no admin admit they may have been wrong? Can they admit that had I started an ANI thread and said that SW was ignoring consensus and he had added another CN tag and he would have been blocked? Can they admit this simple fact that I was blocked not for what I did, but that one person (who just happened to be wrong, as all editors on those three pages agree (Point of order, a citation was recently added to appease him and he immediately reverted it again and restore his "Says whom?" So fair and objective, that guy!)) complained first and the squeaky wheel got the grease? Does that not seem wrong. Shouldn't substance come first and rules follow? JesseRafe (talk) 23:11, 1 March 2014 (UTC)

Well, glad I could be helpful then. :) IIRC (and I may not) we once had a bit of a dispute ourselves, so I'm particularly glad I'm able to provide any degree of helpful feedback now.

The thing about edit-warring is that the admins aren't everywhere at all times, and often won't know about it when it occurs. I'm sure plenty of well-meaning editors have violated 3RR without realizing it, and other editors have edit-warred figuring they could get away with it. The bottom line is that if you feel you've entered such a scenario, the best things you can do are start a discussion at the article's Talk page, warn the warring editor (a friendly might be nice, followed by a formal warning), and if they ignore both the Talk page discussion and the warnings, then take it to the edit-warring noticeboard. Otherwise, the simple reality is that nothing's being done in all likelihood because the admins aren't aware of the problem. I've heard editors accuse others of "whining" to the admins, and that's horribly inappropriate; if an editor feels they have a legitimate complaint, they should be encouraged to pursue their issue through proper channels, not castigated for it.

I know how you feel about the frustration of not being able to fix what you believe to be wrong simply because of a policy, by the way. It sucks when an ignorant IP (for instance) persistently inserts inappropriate information into an article while your hands are tied because you don't want to be on the receiving end of a policy violation. Trust me, though it sucks to do so, the best thing you can possibly do if they won't discuss the situation with you is report them and then wait while the admins make a determination. To some degree this is why I tend not to frequent Misplaced Pages on weekends; it gives me a couple of days to let some things settle without me feeling like I'm sitting on any triggers. BTW, consider it a compliment that I feel invested enough in this situation to be violating my own policy. :)

I don't mean to sound like I'm brushing you off here, but beyond the edit-warring situation I'd really prefer to minimize my involvement in this situation. As I've said, I'm not an admin...there's nothing I can do about your block, and I don't know enough about the specific subject matter to even offer much of an opinion as far as that goes. Also...FWIW, I tend to favor sourcing, and believe the most practical approach to having anything here challenged is to provide a source, so... if I did review it we might disagree on the best approach. I'd rather try to keep things positive between us.

If you genuinely feel your arguments aren't being heard, you might consider the admin's noticeboard or another appropriate venue, but keep in mind that if the admins don't support your viewpoint it could WP:BOOMERANG on you.

I will say some of the comments here are of a somewhat negative nature toward the admins. While I doubt anybody here always agrees with their decisions, it would behoove everyone to remember that they're people too. They're not obligated to respond (or at least, not necessarily in a timely manner) and antagonizing them probably won't help anything. It certainly won't incline more admins towards getting involved in the situation.

I hope this helps. I sympathize with your frustrations, but I have to admit that aside from offering a friendly ear and trying to provide an interpretation of what's transpired, I'm not really wanting to get too involved with this. He said after writing a mini-essay... :p I hope the rest of your weekend is less frustrating! DonIago (talk) 03:06, 2 March 2014 (UTC)

Your edit to Bradley

I won't rv it, but in fact you are mistaken here! all English surnames can be used as given names although not all of them necessarily have been (yet).Jsmith1000 (talk) 01:12, 24 June 2014 (UTC)

Yeah, that's exactly why I changed it, because it's so vacuous. All colors can be used as given names, all breeds of dog and all countries in Africa, too! Doesn't really add much there and the absolute struck me as a little jarring. JesseRafe (talk) 01:30, 24 June 2014 (UTC)

Harold Baines Edit Response

This was a true and accurate detail about Harold Baines. I would understand your edit if there was no other information about his children but the page lists every child so it seems strange that this would be excluded about his new son-in-law. I'm new to Misplaced Pages edits so I don't know the rules but I certainly wasn't vandalizing this page. Mwjjohnston11 (talk) 06:13, 23 July 2014 (UTC)

There simply wasn't a better template that didn't include "vandalism" that also included the message that that kind of information has no place on Misplaced Pages. The fact that it's irrelevant trivia, that's it's not sourced/cited, but moreover the fact that it included a vanity nickname ("Polish") put it over the top as something that didn't belong in wikipedia and was either a joke or a conflict of interest, because non-celebrities do not get nicknames in the encyclopedia, in fact very few people get their sobriquets included in their pages or in passing mentions. In short, it didn't belong, but thanks for contributing and discussing the issue! I do hope you read a few of those links I pasted for you to learn how to continue to contribute to wikipedia is a positive manner. Cheers, JesseRafe (talk) 17:04, 24 July 2014 (UTC)

Bumpy Johnson NYC Mugshot

JesseRafe none of my editing is disruptive i am new to wiki and I am still learning how to edit so I made a few mistakes as for Johnson's page I was simple uploading a better photo of a younger Johnson that was a lot better than the one you guys had. Most of the information you guys have is false like there was no proof that Johnson was ever into bootlegging but yet it's on the page. If your wish is to falsely inform people than so be it I will no longer and my editing which comes from years of research not speculation or hearsay. With that being said I reframe from any editing or viewing of Misplaced Pages if the informations is going to be false, thank you.Madeguy1931 (talk) 12:42, 23 October 2014 (UTC)

The fact is, not only I, but several people all within hours reverted or undid almost all of your edits. Working independently without communication. That alone speaks volumes about the quality and professionalism of your edits. Please read the wikipedia guidelines, then. Especially the bits about "Original Research", which is obviously a foible of yours, considering how you brag about knowing "most of the information you guys have is false" and "my editing which comes from years of research" -- then cite it. Also, please learn about encyclopedic style, and English style, if that is not your native language. Writing that someone is a "mob boss, a criminal, and a crime boss" is boring and horrible writing, which is something you did on one of those pages, I don't have the time or desire to check which one right now. Please, take all of this constructively, and don't treat articles as if you have an axe to grind, but read the pillars, learn the protocols, and cite your additions, avoiding OR. Cheers! JesseRafe (talk) 23:36, 23 October 2014 (UTC)

Recent wording issues.

Hello. Like I said, I have recently cleared my talk page of templated things. Furthermore, I am not a new user so I would appreciate if you did not use such templates on my userpage.

If you wish to discuss the recent wording issues we've been having, I would be happy to do so here. Alternatively, if you would like to discuss them on my talk page, feel free to do so, though I ask that you do not template me.

Also, like I said in the edit summary of my talk page, I am sorry for getting all riled up earlier. No hard feelings.

(NOTE: I am currently at school at the moment, so I might not be able to get back to your responses as swiftly as I would usually. I'll be able to get into deeper discussions with you later on in the afternoon.) (NOTE 2: I've been having some severe health issues recently as well, so I've been more hot-headed than usual. Usually I'm just adamant, but recently I've bordered on brash. Once again, my apologies.) Tharthandorf Aquanashi (talk) 15:19, 5 November 2014 (UTC)

Sorry, but all of your claims are false. I don't care for your half-hearted insincere apologies. If you don't know that your wording is absurd and affected and not appropriate, then you seem like a new user. Likewise if you didn't know that you had violated 3RR with your edit-warring. Shows inexperience. Further, to the point: 1) You absolutely did not add the Etymology section to Yo. That's been there for years. I would know as it happened about 6 years into my watching the page, do your research before making baseless claims. In fact, I didn't notice this, but you actually removed confirmed sources from the article, which I will be adding back once this kerfuffle is settled with your violations. 2) Nowhere and Nohwere nor Erewhon and Erehwon would NOT be pronounced the same at that time, even if it were true it would be limited to Middle English which that novel was not. The idea that the voiceless labio-velar approximant () is the same thing as the digraph "wh" is one thing, and sometimes in phonetics that pronunciation is written "/hw/" out of convenience, but that does NOT mean it could be both. It's one or the other, at best. All your superfluous non-encyclopedic wording aside. Especially in the lede, maybe academic-up your prose and drop it down into the meat of the article, not there. JesseRafe (talk) 15:44, 5 November 2014 (UTC)

Your belief that my apologies are insincere are unfortunate, because I truly do mean them. I don't know what has possessed you to believe that I come bearing ill-will, but if it was the personal attack, then once again I do apologise. That was without question my fault, and I take full responsibility for that. I know that it does not change anything, but I have been going through some harsh times as of late.

The reason why I removed those sources was because they were part of a folk etymology. I agree that they could have been kept to refer to the etymology notwithstanding in a section relating to folk etymology, which is most certainly viable, but I hadn't thought of that when I removed them. I was only thinking "This is an incorrect etymology; it needs to be replaced with the correct one."

What is different between "wh" and "hw"? In fact, if one were to pronounce "hw", they would almost certainly utter /hw/, which is quite close to /ʍ/. It's quite possible that such was the logic of the author.

Finally, what possessed me to get riled up in the first place was the fact that you seemed to show no respect nor understanding whatsoever towards the fact that my English variety is different than yours. This much is quite clear linguistically from the get go; New England English is a very conservative and particular branch of dialects. As such, when you try to belittle my statements with claims that come off as "New England English is little different from General American", it comes off quite rudely. We are supposed to respect each other's dialects of English, whether we personally like them or not, and as such unless there is some particular stark affiliation of an article with a certain country, wording should not be changed merely to comply with an editor's personal tastes. Tharthandorf Aquanashi (talk) 20:01, 5 November 2014 (UTC)

First of all, I don't care about your health or excuses. I don't care if you're a talking dog; you're wrong and you're rude, and you wantonly violate WP pillars such as being civil, ownership of articles, 3RR, and edit-warring, perhaps among many other policies. More importantly, and content-wise, you're just plain wrong. Consistently. The fact that you still don't know that "whilst" is CONSENSUS out of favor in ALL dialects of English, moreover North American ones, and accuse me of not knowing about the differences between dialects YET think "hw" and "wh" and are the same thing really makes me wonder which one of us is the "callow fool". You pass yourself off as some sort of blowhard linguistics expert, but you don't even know the difference between // and for phonemes and phones, do you? The prior etymology was cited, ergo it belongs, your contributions are merely unverified musings you made up and are NOT CITED. Which belongs on Misplaced Pages? JesseRafe (talk) 21:37, 5 November 2014 (UTC)

Claiming so strongly that I am wrong simply because a concept seems foreign to you isn't really all that fair. The idea that I take ownership of the article(s) in question is hearsay. Unlike many other languages, English does not have a sole, all-official language regulation body. Furthermore, what question is there that, in English, "wh" is /ʍ/, and "hw" (if it is ever used as representing a phoneme) is /hw/, which is quite close to /ʍ/. I am aware of the difference between // and , but because I always make as clear and specific transcriptions as possible, I use both relatively interchangeably (except when I need to be even more specific about a pronunciation, in which case I use ). Notwithstanding, I don't claim to be a "blowhard linguistics expert", just that I self identify as a linguist and that I am an Anglo-Saxon linguistic purist. My etymology is not made up, I merely expanded upon the existing etymology in question. The fact that "yo" (and its variant forms) have been in use for "hey" since the Middle English times as a clear derivative of Old English ġēa (as are "yea", "yeah", "yay", etc.) means that the term does not derive from Italian "io", as the previous folk etymology that was listed there suggested. As such, I removed it from the etymology section and expanded upon the bit of the etymology that actually related to its true origins.

Now, is it possible that Italian "io" reinforced the already existing word "yo"? Perhaps; maybe even likely. But it in no way whatsoever is the etymon of the word "yo".

Finally, the only instance in which I was particularly uncivil was that personal attack that you have mentioned, which I have apologised for multiple times now. I've been quite civil with you since that point.

(Also, as a side note, regional dialects and their lexicons and grammars are not decided by linguistic consensus, for they are, after all, regional dialects. Linguistic consensus only works to form "standardised" or "international" varieties of a language. The people of my area who do not work in the journalism or law fields couldn't give two blasts about what some individual believes is "the proper way a true American should speak English" when that individual's mind is fraught with biases in regards to dialects, and otherwise pays little to no attention to other regional dialects that don't happen to tickle their particular fancy). Tharthandorf Aquanashi (talk) 22:05, 5 November 2014 (UTC)

1) You don't know what "leave off" means, 2) You don't know how to properly use :s (remember when you were so desperately claiming to not be new to Misplaced Pages?), 3) Of course you didn't claim to be a blowhard, I called you a blowhard, but you're still claiming to be a linguist (a concept I find offensive given your gross and ill-guided negligence of the most fundamental aspects of the discipline), 4) Using two CONTRASTING notations interchangebaly and then bragging about it does not strengthen your claim, 5) who cares what silly idiolect you have and imagine others do too, every STYLE GUIDE (the things that suggest how to write) says not to use "whilst", simple as that. It's over, you're wrong on the subject, especially when the topic is a North American one, 6) All of that "derived from ġēa" hogwash is uncited, therefore does not belong. The derivation from Io is cited, therefore belongs. See the difference? End of discussion on my Talk Page. Bye. JesseRafe (talk) 22:17, 5 November 2014 (UTC)

Yo

• I asked you politely to discuss this on the article's talk page, and you chose instead to edit-war, which is why you have received the above warning. --AussieLegend (✉) 07:51, 6 November 2014 (UTC)

Not to be rude, but I think there is a fundamental misunderstanding on your end, AussieLegend, and there is no contradiction between my, Drmagi, the MOS, or Strunk and White's interpretation of the rule. ALL singular nouns take "'s" with very few exceptions (Moses, goodness, etc.) (I see now in my haste I said "plural" instead of "possessive" in one of my edit summaries, but that doesn't make any sense so I assume the reading was understood to be "possessive" as plurality had nothing to do with anything). I think the confusion on AL's end is the wording in the MOS that says there are three practices, however AL perhaps interpreted that to mean one could choose which of those options listed as bullets at a whim, but they were specific to the situation and explicit as which should be used. I copied and pasted in my last edit summary from the pertinent part of the second of these three bullets listed under #3 for Singular Nouns in the Possessives section of the MOS, it couldn't be any more clear. Alexis /a-lex-is/ is possessively pronounced /a-lex-is-iz/ and as such needs to be spelled "Alexis's" to reflect the pronunciation, unlike say, "Gates" which is up to the speaker how it is pronounced as /gayts/ or /gaytsez/ and to which it should be spelled "Gates'" or "Gates's" accordingly. JesseRafe (talk) 19:48, 6 November 2014 (UTC)

I've addressed this response at the article's talk page. I would have thought that you would have at least acknowledged your edit-warring with a commitment not to do so in the future. --AussieLegend (✉) 05:06, 7 November 2014 (UTC)

Could you please explain this edit summary? Specifically, when was that version of the article in place? I looked through the edit history and can't see how the edit was a restoration. Regarding "keep as status quo", this is inconsistent with your actions at List of castle episodes, where I restored the status quo and yet you chose to edit war. My point is that you can't expect others to respect the status quo if you won't do so yourself. --AussieLegend (✉) 11:13, 8 November 2014 (UTC)

I don't see how you being bad at research puts the onus on me to do it for you. Look at the edits before Tharstan started adding his own opinions and original research, it's a synthesis of several cited facts (what I initially called Tharstan out on as his edits are largely OR and he added his OR at the expense of removing cited material) that had been piecemeal removed from the article. Also, NB: I changed his wording because it was largely also his own conjecture. A source says "Middle English", he writes, "specifically the 15th and 16th centuries".JesseRafe (talk) 15:17, 8 November 2014 (UTC)

I have looked through the history of the article and don't see how your recent edit constitutes a restoration. I had hoped that you might provide some evidence that it was a restoration. If you are not willing to... The phrase "specifically the 15th and 16th centuries" was in the article before Tharthan started editing there. "Specifically in the 15th century" was added in 2012. --AussieLegend (✉) 16:00, 8 November 2014 (UTC)

I easily could later when I have the time on mobile now, it was literally copy-and-paste from prior version from Etymology section, how far back did you go? I didn't say Thatstan did the removal per se, he removed some cited material but not everything that was removed that was cited was removed by him. Fair point on that 15/16th bit, I had thought it was him, i noticed it with his additions.JesseRafe (talk) 16:14, 8 November 2014 (UTC)

Unclear re: John_F._Kennedy_School_of_Government

Reverted edits by User:JesseRafe on John_F._Kennedy_School_of_Government

Why:

Choice of what is "notable" was arbitrary. For example, editor kept:

• Marilinda Garcia (MPA '10) - member of the New Hampshire House of Representatives

Yet deleted:

• Fernando Martín García (JD '75) - Puerto Rican politician and former Senator

For example editor kept:

• Timothy S. Sullivan - U.S. Coast Guard Rear Admiral

(no graduation date sourced)

Yet deleted:

• Rowayne A. "Wayne" Schatz Jr. (MPP '85) - U.S. Air Force Major General

... need more information why certain items need to be removed. Are they not notable, not alumni, or some other reason? Benutzernamen188 66 8 4 (talk) 07:55, 29 November 2014 (UTC)

Pretty obvious someone with only a JD went to law school, not the school that grants an MPA or MPP (Kennedy), other one was not notable - no wikilink or citation. JesseRafe (talk) 08:54, 29 November 2014 (UTC)

Your edits are arbitrary are without criteria, please discuss on talk page before doing this again. As noted in the example, you did not remove someone who had no degree listed. You did not remove someone who had just an Executive Degree listed. You did not remove someone who had their degree removed. Thus your criteria is not clear and being incompletely applied. Are you really saying someone from a State legislature is more notable than a former Senator? Seems capricious. Benutzernamen188 66 8 4 (talk) 09:43, 29 November 2014 (UTC)

Also, recommend you read the page at Fernando_Martín_García -- it says individual received both a JD from Harvard and a MPP from the Kennedy School. Your slash-and-burn edits would have missed this. Benutzernamen188 66 8 4 (talk) 09:45, 29 November 2014 (UTC)

Schatz is not notable, Garcia went to the wrong school. I recommend you read the page Fernando_Martín_García and then if she does have an MPP from Kennedy, then fix the article yourself. If she has a JD, who cares? Why not list everyone's undergraduate BAs too while we're at it? If you see a problem, fix it, but your irrational edit-warring solves nothing but makes that article an inconsistent mess. JesseRafe (talk) 17:49, 29 November 2014 (UTC)

Moving discussion to the article's talk page. We need to work towards consensus. Why are you keeping someone who does not have a graduation date or degree references JesseRafe? That seems to be inconsistent. Let's discuss on the article's talk page the criteria. Thank you. Benutzernamen188 66 8 4 (talk) 18:22, 29 November 2014 (UTC)

The Promotion and the parking lot gang

Regarding the edit by 70.31.37.239 on The Promotion, which you restored:

It's not unheard of for me to edit articles on movies that I haven't seen, so don't be insulted when I ask: have you seen the movie? Race plays an important part in some scenes. After the incident where Doug is hit with a thrown bottle, and he sprays one of the gang members with mace, the store hosts a large public relations effort with many people from the black community attending. (The community leader is played by Chris Gardner, who published his memoirs, "The Pursuit of Happyness".) It's here that Richard embarrasses himself, and annoys the community leader, by accidentally saying "It's just a few black apples." So I see race as an important element in the plot.

For articles that have more than 30 watchers, I usually let the revert go, figuring that if nobody else changes it back, it's just me, or other watchers don't consider it important. Since this article has fewer than 30 watchers, I'd really like to change it back, if I can convince you. I await your input.

Willondon (talk) 12:48, 18 December 2014 (UTC)

re: Canibus

Actually, yes it does. It's a primary source relaying information about the artist's own work. See WP:FACEBOOK. - Forty.4 (talk) 20:22, 17 February 2015 (UTC)

The relevent MOS entry which you cited above also clearly states, "4. there is no reasonable doubt as to its authenticity", and there is no verifaction that what you claim is true. Other than his putative manager using ALL CAPS to declare himself so. It's just a CD-R with some Sharpie scribbled on it, who cares? Is there even an information about the album? No, none, it's just unsubstantiated. WP should only have info on it that is independently verifiable, and not original research. The album could be complete right now, but it might not even be released. Doesn't merit inclusion (keyword:) yet. JesseRafe (talk) 21:10, 17 February 2015 (UTC)

It's actually the announcement that the album is finished being mastered, and the reveal of what the initials TFLDPR stand for (that's all it's been referred to as so far). But whatever. And there is no reasonable doubt as to its authenticity, it's his official Facebook, all announcements regarding his past few releases have been made through it by his manager/himself. And yes there is other info about the album, if you took a cursory glance at any of the posts immediately below the linked post you'd see it. And confirmed upcoming albums are routinely included in Wiki discogs. Canibus's next album is finished and is called Time Flies, Life Dies, Phoenix Rise, and will be out in March/April. And all this info is on his official FB, which per WP:FACEBOOK is considered a reliable primary source for basic information about the artist and his career (and rightly so, because if this weren't the case, Misplaced Pages would have an extreme bias against underground music, given that this is how underground musicians typically make their announcements, via their social media platforms). - Forty.4 (talk) 22:37, 17 February 2015 (UTC)

Hi there. You realise that WP:BRD requires you to participate in the discussion? Opting out of the discussion implies you have no argument to back up your edits (hence my restoration of the contested info). When you ignore the discussion and continue to revert my edits you're violating BRD. Regarding the objections in your edit summary: per WP:FACEBOOK social media sources are permitted as primary sources for such information. Therefore I don't need any media coverage of it, it's enough on its own. By the way, you realise this is an underground artist, yes? The kind of blogs that would/will cover this release will mostly fail WP:RS. There is no reasonable doubt as to the authenticity of the account, it is his official Facebook account, through which all information about his last few albums has been released before being reported elsewhere, all of which has been authentic. Explain this supposed 'reasonable doubt' of yours, because it seems arbitrary and contrary to WP:FACEBOOK. - Forty.4 (talk) 21:39, 23 February 2015 (UTC)

I did participate. That facebook page is not an unambiguous no-reasonable-doubt official page. You do realize that whether or not you need to find any media coverage is immaterial to my reasonable doubt about the authenticity of that facebook page? But the fact that you can't find any certainly doesn't play to the strength of your argument. I don't need to explain myself more than once, I apologize if you only accept authority when it's written in ALL CAPS like the author of Canibus's supposedly official page. Also note, the "official website" of this "official facebook page" is ... http://rtjcollection.com/ ? Oh, yeah, real "official". Sorry, buh bye. JesseRafe (talk) 21:54, 23 February 2015 (UTC)

No you didn't. Participation would entail responding to my points. Which you still haven't done. However, his Twitter is verified, so I don't need to talk to your filibustering contrarian bureaucratic ass anymore: see WP:FACEBOOK & WP:TWITTER. Peace. - Forty.4 (talk) 22:05, 23 February 2015 (UTC)

What'd the pot call the kettle? You ignored my points. That's a dubious source. That's all I need to say, the onus is on you to prove it isn't. Look at the links for crying outloud. Show how it merits inclusion, what substantive things are there? Just a sharpie scribble again? PS, I know you have some problems reading, but please try to be WP:CIVIL. I am anything but a bureaucratic ass, they ruin Misplaced Pages, but nowhere near to the extent of the rabid fanboys who fill up pages with clutter and nonsense and unverified personal opinions and blah blah blah from a site run by a friend of a friend of a guy they wished they knew. Leave off, troll. You are obviously suffering from a combination of an intense case of being a Stan or have CoI or NPOV issue on this matter. JesseRafe (talk) 22:10, 23 February 2015 (UTC)

Actually I don't think Canibus has made a good album in 12 years, so I'm hardly a Stan, I just don't like sourced information that I add being baselessly removed by wikicrats, particularly on terms that evidence Wiki's sourcing bias against underground hip hop. I demonstrated to you why the source is reliable (and an out-of--date link suggests nothing, since he doesn't actually have an official site anymore). Again: all of the info re his last album Fait Accompli was released via that FB profile. How would this be the case if it weren't authentic? Is there a spy with a fanpage in Canibus HQ?? That's what you have not explained. Your own 'feelings' about its authenticity are irrelevant, although I'm sorry if I hurt them. Anyway, as I said, I don't need to discuss it with you anymore. Leave the info where it is; his Twitter account is verified. - Forty.4 (talk) 22:18, 23 February 2015 (UTC)

And did I take it off? No. I already said goodbye to this troll. The facebook link is a shit source. End of story. The twitter is verified. Shoulda led with that, no? And don't start about this being biased against underground hip hop, it's a bias against all things "underground" because they dont get coverage, don't make this something it's not. I've been a member of WikiProject Hip Hop for longer than you've even heard of wikipedia. And if I had any bias against underground MCs that'd mostly be because one time Aesop Rock stole my lighter. Or the time that Metro stepped on my toe and scuffed my Timbs, RIP. Yeah, I'm a biased wikicrat.

Further, to the point, an out-of-date link suggests everything -- if one cannot be bothered to update or remove a website link, how can another be expected to believe one is accurate in all other information thus presented? Sorry, but that argument, that someone doesn't have the time to take down a link, is just too ridiculous to accept.

Also, correlation does not imply causation. I could mistakenly read the weather report from last year and it might be eerily accurate four days in a row, would it be accurate the next day? The fact that prior things were accurately foretold by that source is irrelevant if the source is poor. Besides that I don't care. In fact, I do care because underground artists are exactly the types of articles that get the Stans and the everything-under-the-sun-included wannabes. Look at the Big L page history for the bigger targets than the relatively better maintained Canibus-man. JesseRafe (talk) 22:53, 23 February 2015 (UTC)

Grown Ups 2

Have you actually seen the movie to know if the actors you removed are worth removing? Cause your coming off quite unprofessional by the constant reverting. If you know anything about the collaborative process of Misplaced Pages you would know that reverting something constantly gets you absolutely nowhere. Koala15 (talk) 01:24, 18 February 2015 (UTC)

Koala, you are wrong in every way imaginable. In fact because you haven't seen WP:CASTLIST AND because you haven't even seen Grown Ups 2, you're so wrong you're not even wrong. This is ridiculous in so many ways: 1, I regrettably have seen the movie; 2, if you haven't seen the movie why are you on that page anyway, you're either 2a, trolling for edits or, 2b, intentionally bloating the cast past the styleguides' suggestion in a way of making the article look silly; 3, no movie deserves (or even has) a cast listing in the 50s. None. My trimmed version is still WELL PAST the recommended 12 entries; 4, that recommendation is in WP:CASTLIST which I have asked you to refer to repeatedly; 5, you obviously haven't; 6, I said take it to the article talk page. This is not constructive; 7, Actors and characters are different things. In MANY cases the removed were BOTH non-notable. Unless you can give an account of the notability of Kris Murrell as Kitty (please, just one review mentioning it! Even if it's written by her mom!) it's obvious your blanket reversions are proof-positive that you are just trolling this article not because you disagree with my edits but for entirely different reasons that you seem incapable of expressing. I gave a reason for my changes, and you responded with, "Derp". 8, and you call this unprofessional? I gave reasons (even though I didn't have to) and was in line with the MOS, you literally don't have a reason for anything that you're doing; 9, Seriously how full of shit are you? In consecutive edit summaries you say I "clearly removed a lot of notable roles" and then say you haven't seen the movie Wowww... 10, Also, protip: You can't just make up your own "rules" and expect other, better editors to follow them and then accuse them of being non-professional because they don't, "The person that removes it should take it to the talk page and discuss it." -- Umm, no. That's not a thing. The person who thinks this random article is somehow an exception to established Misplaced Pages film article guidelines and the MOS in general should state why on the Talk Page. JesseRafe (talk) 06:33, 18 February 2015 (UTC)

How am i "trolling for edits"? Also, i was not the one who added all those cast members. Like i said, i haven't seen the movie yet. But i think you might have trimmed it down a little too much. Koala15 (talk) 20:42, 18 February 2015 (UTC)

You're still beyond ridiculous. OK, you haven't seen this movie, that's fine. But have you seen WP:CASTLIST? How many times have I asked you that direct question? Similarly, have you seen any other movie's wikipedia article? Ever? Is this your whole experience of the internet, this one wikipedia article for a film you haven't seen? JesseRafe (talk) 21:21, 18 February 2015 (UTC)

What about this? "If there are many cast members worth identifying, there are two recommended options: the names may be listed in two or three columns, or the names may be grouped in prose." Koala15 (talk) 22:12, 18 February 2015 (UTC)

That is exactly what was done! Is it not two columns to you? What is your beef? Again, what is the notability of "Kris Murrell as Kitty" that you care about it so much? Non-notables were removed, end of story. Bye. JesseRafe (talk) 22:16, 18 February 2015 (UTC)

Question.

Why do you think it more reasonable that "yo" suddenly popped up from two different sources at two different periods of time for very similar purposes, when:

1. Nautical fiction (especially pirate fiction) has been known to use "yo" to a ridiculous extent, and such nautical fiction was most certainly available in some way or another in Pennsylvania.

2. There is no reason to believe that "yo" comes from the Italian first person pronoun when it doesn't even serve a purpose vaguely similar to it. Contrarily, "yea" was in use both as meaning "yes" and "thus, so, it is such": a reasonable semantic ancestor of "yo".

3. Even if you argue that "yo"'s pseudopronoun use could be evidence for its etymon being the Italian first person pronoun, that could easily be explained by any of the following: One- Misanalysis of phrases such as "Hey, yo." Two- Misinterpretation of an unemphasised "you" Three- A conflation of both one and two.

So, again, why do you insist on claiming that this word goes back to Italian? Tharthandorf Aquanashi (talk) 22:07, 18 February 2015 (UTC)

You're boring. One, there are literally thousands of words that have popped up over time unrelatedly. Especially for such simple ones as "yo". Two, they are not for similar purposes. The one used 600 years ago meant "yes", the one in use in the past ~100 years meant "hey" more or less. Three, the nautical fiction (Pirate Talk, Arr me hearties, I assume you mean) uses this word without not only the "yes" or the "hey" meanings, but no meaning at all. It's a nonce word. It's a sound, like "Arrgh, shiver me timbers!" what does "arrgh" mean? Four, read the article, it explains semantic shift. Four, your #3 isn't in English, sorry, no response. Five, I never insisted it goes back to Italian. I am merely keeping sourced material on the page and removing nonsense fantasies. JesseRafe (talk) 22:12, 18 February 2015 (UTC)

That was unnecessarily cold of you. Please assume good faith. There is no need to be uncivil.

"Arr" is a dialectal variant of "aye". It's still used in parts of the England with the meaning of "yes". Not the best example to try and disprove my point, hm?

What I have said is not a fantasy, but the most likely case out there for the word. I don't understand why, when ever I try to discuss things with you, you almost always reply to me hostilely. It's quite unproductive. Tharthandorf Aquanashi (talk) 03:09, 19 February 2015 (UTC)

So that we may finally come to a civil compromise, I have requested some help with our current disagreement here:

Misplaced Pages:Dispute_resolution_noticeboard#Talk:Yo Tharthandorf Aquanashi (talk) 18:41, 20 February 2015 (UTC)

White House Down

Some of the characters you removed had key factors in that movie. BattleshipMan (talk) 15:52, 23 February 2015 (UTC)

List of most common surnames in Asia

Why you decided that my edit was unhelpful? My edit was saying something true and quoting sources. What authorises you to revert it without discussion? Devi means lady, it is not a surname, please google it. The fact that i am an unregistered user does not mean that i cannot edit true things on wikipedia. Why this? Please answer me in a talk instead of just saying that my eedit is unhelpful without any explication. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 62.212.123.60 (talk) 18:58, 1 March 2015 (UTC)

Because your edit was nonsense, your sentence was horrible, your sources are Nazis, and not even quotations, just bare links. You linked a google search you did. Do you even internet? JesseRafe (talk) 19:03, 1 March 2015 (UTC)