Misplaced Pages

Revision as of 00:53, 22 November 2006

File:Crystal 128 gadu.png This is the talk page where you can reach user me, ElectricEye. Please leave a new message or scroll down to carry on with a current conversation. Thank you. --ElectricEye (talk) 23:44, 23 December 2024 (UTC)

Archive: Newcomer messages Archive: Esperanza related messages Archive: Template related messages Archive: Deletion related messages

User page warning

I see no reason for your putting a warning on User talk:Fvws talk page since he has not edited very recently. I assume you make have placed the warning on the wrong page and have reverted it. Thanks.--Dakota ~ ° 05:06, 8 April 2006 (UTC)

Hi Dakota. My message to Fvw was the result of adding welcomes and I noticed Fvw first warned the user instead. My message was a suggestion, not a warning. Also, your talk page is locked so there is now no way to send you a message. --ElectricEye 05:14, 8 April 2006 (UTC)

My talk page isn't locked to registered users. You can edit it but very new users can't at the present time due to vandalism. Fvw, who is one of the administrators, has been away for quite awhile and he must have had a very good reason for the warning over a year ago. Thank you for good work welcoming users.--Dakota ~ ° 05:42, 8 April 2006 (UTC)

Bites

Hi Electric. Ignoring the message above this one (which was only to be expected) - you don't appear to have read all of WP:BITE. Newcomers are most welcome and I have helped out hundreds and mentored several.

However, we would be completely overwhelmed in minutes without someone on New Pages patrol, deleting the 5 or 6 articles per minute that come in that are attacks, vanity pieces, nonsense and cruft.

Most NP patrollers delete the articles and move on. I take time to note to the user that their article has been deleted, give reasons why, provide pages for them to look at showing policy and giving guidance and provide a method of contact so they can speak to me directly.

If that is WP:BITE, then I will stop doing it and just delete the articles without comment like others do. I won't give up on vandalism warnings and NP patrol just because people over-apply WP:BITE.

Thanks. ➨ ❝REDVERS❞ 14:32, 8 April 2006 (UTC)

Hi Redvers, thanks for the communication. Regarding Mikemort, I did not ignore his message. I gave him a notice. I did not imply at all that you should not delete, revert, etc. --ElectricEye 14:39, 8 April 2006 (UTC)

Actually I was referring to your warnings to User:B0rk. It is important what you are doing. But I think we should just correct their first offense (revert/etc) while welcoming the person, and then on their second offense give a warning an so on... Please see what I mean at User:ElectricEye/GetWelcomed Anyway, keep up the good work. Waikiki!!! ^_^ --ElectricEye 14:55, 8 April 2006 (UTC)

ignore the above message electriceye, i still stand by what i sed about him hehe —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Mikemort (talk • contribs) .

Hi Electric! I've read your theory at User:ElectricEye/GetWelcomed. It's interesting and well put, but I'm afraid I don't agree with it.

At peak hours, vanity, attack and nonsense (VAN) articles added to the 'pedia at the rate of one every 10 seconds or so - sometimes much more. The vast majority of these new articles are from users who have created an account in order to create their VAN article. They will never be seen again, welcomed or not. These users have enough of a grasp of Misplaced Pages to have created an account, so it's not like they stumbled in and pressed the first button they saw.

Left un"warned", they repost the VAN article and create others. "Warned", they show up on the warner's page and create havoc (that's why the majority go unwarned). If they are welcomed after posting a VAN, that welcome is then often used by the poster as justification for posting the VAN article in the first place: as you've seen today, someone setting out to do something unpleasant will seize on anything that looks like support as a reason to keep on doing what they're doing.

This is counterproductive as it accellerates the user toward being blocked from editing, so they never even get the chance to become a productive editor.

So over-application of WP:BITE has a detrimental effect on the Misplaced Pages, on the admins clearing up New Pages and on the users posting the VAN articles.

I've tried combining a welcome message with a "warning" and it doesn't work; if the "warning" goes above the welcome message, you get sarcastic comments about how unwelcoming you're being. If the "warning" goes below, the text is missed - the first thing the poster then sees is the second "warning" - which is comparatively harsh in tone.

The other thing to note is the "warnings" themselves. The word "warning" is a useful shorthand, but it doesn't really apply to the first level {{test}} which is a very nice, if short, thank-you message with advice on using the sandbox and visiting the newcomers page. The second "warning" is also not so much of a warning - you're up to test3 before you get a real slap on the wrists. For the vast majority, that level is never reached. Either they have left after seeing their articles vaporized, or they grasp the meaning of the {{test}} template and stop, sometimes settling down into becoming productive editors.

I've found the {{test}} template to be of limited use with VAN posters, which is why I created my own anti-VAN templates. These may not be perfect, but they do tell the user where they stand: what Misplaced Pages's policies are and even link to a helpful page written in simple language by me offering further advice and explaination. I had tried, in the past, putting a clear link to my talk page in the template - but that led to my March talk archive being full of unsigned abuse and pleas for the article to be restored so mom could see it tomorrow etc. So now, whilst the link is there in my sig, it's not prominent so only the real nutters go looking for it.

And, of course, deleted articles don't show up on a user's contributions page - it may look like they've never posted anything, but the warning you see on a user's page may well be after their 5th or 6th deleted article.

Have you ever done NP or RC patrol? I'd advise spending one evening just monitoring the changes at RC and the additions at NP to see what the "sharp end" can be like. It might change your mind about the WP:BITE guideline being treated like a heavy duty policy :o) ➨ ❝REDVERS❞ 16:46, 8 April 2006 (UTC)

Just seen the edit summary for your last message to me: of course I don't take offence! Don't worry about it, mate :) ➨ ❝REDVERS❞ 16:49, 8 April 2006 (UTC)

Hi REDVERS, I think it is best you and the others combating vandalism continue to do what they are doing and HOW they are doing it. I will be a balancing force and keep welcoming people. After a while, I will learn from this experience and modify my viewpoint and activity accordinglingly. Waikiki!!! --ElectricEye 05:16, 10 April 2006 (UTC)

Hey — hope you don't mind me following your talk page; I had marked it to watch back when you were putting together the template... I got on it to unwatch it, notice that it's huge, and read through this conversation. Can I make a suggestion / ask for some help? The Counter Vandalism Unit could always use dedicated Wikipedians such as yourself to help out. Redvers is a member, and patrolling for garbage new articles is part of it, along with watching for vandalism... take a look at the link, try it out for a while, and see how it works. Helps to give an appreciation for the sheer numbers that go into Misplaced Pages... literally thousands of edits an hour at times. Also may help to better see where Redvers is coming from, as keeping track of nonsense articles can be tedious. Make sure to try out Crypto Derk's Vandal Fighter (available on the CVU page) if you give it a shot; it makes it much, much more manageable.

Anyways, just an idea, if you're looking for more to do — given how much you've gotten into already, it looks like you're already putting that 200 wpm to good use. You must go through several new keyboards each year. Tijuana Brass 04:56, 10 April 2006 (UTC)

Hi Tijuana, and again thank you with the template. It is because of you that I now know how. I think I should just remain on the Welcoming Committee for now. I would rather welcome new users, and choose to get involved on selected cases, until I learn more about Misplaced Pages. I have worked on some articles and have some ideas, and I'll also be focusing on those over time. Also, I will try my hand at dealing with vandalism, but only a little bit, to learn as REDVER has suggested. Waikiki!!! --ElectricEye 05:16, 10 April 2006 (UTC)

Sounds like a plan. You know... just to overwhelm you with more ideas, from one wiki-addict to another... you may also enjoy participating at the Help Desk, which would go hand in hand with the Welcoming Committee. Or even the Reference Desk... oh, and check out the Village Pump to collaborate with other editors sometime... and definitely the Wikipediholic Test. Then, after all of that, I can give you the number for my shrink, who tells me that I really need to stop spending so much time with Misplaced Pages. Tijuana Brass 05:26, 10 April 2006 (UTC)

LOL! Well, I like the idea of assisting with Help Desk! ^_^ Waikiki!!! --ElectricEye 05:30, 10 April 2006 (UTC)

Hi Tijuana Brass. Take a look at this (Tsu). Is that vandalism??? --ElectricEye 06:02, 10 April 2006 (UTC)

Heh, that's kinda funny. Looks like it to me. Typically, if you're unsure whether it's vandalism but it looks probable, it's all right to go ahead and revert it — if the contributing editor considered it impotant, they'll usually come back and defend it, making it easier to tell if it's a returning vandal or a legit edit. The history log is always a click away if a mistake happens, after all. Tijuana Brass 23:14, 10 April 2006 (UTC)

Mozilla Firefox

Hi Gogo Dodo. I am just curious why you reverted Grungen's addition to the Mozilla Firefox article. --ElectricEye 09:13, 16 April 2006 (UTC)

Because I felt that the link was too specific of an item. All the external links are either official sites or very general interest sites. I checked the edit history and many external links to specific topics were removed. As somebody pointed out to me before I had my account, Misplaced Pages is not a collection of external links. On a side note, thank you for the welcome. --Gogo Dodo 16:52, 16 April 2006 (UTC)

Thanks for the response. Ok, I was just wondering. I thought maybe the link was to a virus or something... I didn't know. --ElectricEye 17:38, 16 April 2006 (UTC)

Comments to RGTraynor

Hello. I had a few questions regarding your comments to User:RGTraynor. I have left them on his talk page to keep the discussion in one place. -- JamesTeterenko 16:48, 18 April 2006 (UTC)

Ok, thank you. I have responded there. --ElectricEye 18:09, 18 April 2006 (UTC)

Ken Lloyd

Hi ElectricEye! Thanks for your message on my talk page. I think the service that your committee provides is very important. I certainly have no objections to giving the authors time to develop the article further. In fact, I agree that the "{{importance}}" tag that you placed was a better approach in this case than speedy. (Although, an anonymous user has already removed it.) However, it is important to note, in the spirit of WP:AGF, I posted a welcome message on the users' talk page as well as a notification of the deletion tag. I don't think the templates that we use run afoul of WP:BITE, but if you feel otherwise perhaps we should talk about crafting special WP:UTMs to be used for new users in cases like these? In any event, I'm grateful that you volunteered to keep an "ElectricEye" on this article to ensure that it is developed to satisfy the inclusion criteria. See you around! Regards, Accurizer 19:05, 18 April 2006 (UTC)

Hi Accurizer.

First of all thank you for your message and pointing these things out to me. You have certainly broadened my view.

I don't believe any warning tags were purposely designed to disregard WP:BITE. The intent is clearly justified. Tons of new users simply join Misplaced Pages out of obvious bad faith. But, I have noticed some RC Patrollers inadvertantly or carelessly misusing the tags on faithfully good new users.

For example, several RCPs have warned newbies with a higher level tag without ever having given a level0 or level1. In some of these cases, the RCPs warned newbies and threatened blocking for vandalism. When I checked the newbie's edits they had been done in good faith, although contrary to Misplaced Pages Misplaced Pages's various policies. Some of these new users became upset because they weren't informed on how to do things, instead they were repeatedly warned they may be blocked for vandalism and in at least one case I remember the RC Patroller actually bullying such a new user. And in the last 3 days I have seen at least a half a dozen or more new users quit in protest or simply not return, because of such "abuse".

I am not aware of the guidelines and policies that dictate RCP activity because I have chosen to not get involved in the obvious vandal war. I would rather build a peaceful environment by making new users feel welcomed and helped, and by practicing patience so they may learn Misplaced Pages's policies and guidelines. And ultimately I believe I can help minimize the damage (vandals/etc) with my approach by preventing the creation of new "enemies."

It is a very complicated social phenomenon that needs more study to understand, but I think you see what I am getting at. If not, just ask what I mean and I will try to explain.

I hope to have time to continue what I am doing and also get involved with WP:UTM if the Misplaced Pages community accepts what I may have to offer in the UTM/RCP effort.

Waikiki!!! --ElectricEye 19:57, 18 April 2006 (UTC)

Misplaced Pages:Requests for arbitration/Monicasdude/Workshop

You posted that Monicasdude is a new user. I just wanted to let you know that he has been registered for 11 months, see his first edit. Thanks. Stifle (talk) 12:57, 22 April 2006 (UTC)

Hi Stifle, thanks for letting me know. I guess I made a mistake in assuming he was a new user because his username is in red. --User:ElectricEye (talk) 13:46, 22 April 2006 (UTC)

Anirudhsbh challenge

Thanks for your comments on my challenge page. Would you like to answer some of the questions posted by the user on the same page? Regards, --Andy123(talk) 08:32, 23 April 2006 (UTC)

Hi Anirudhsbs. I'd rather not as I don't know if I can give a worthwhile answer, and now I can't even remember how I got to that page. --User:ElectricEye (talk) 02:54, 26 April 2006 (UTC)

The unhappy newbie

Hello ElectricEye,

I've replied to you on the talk page for Piano.

Yours sincerely, Opus33 16:52, 23 April 2006 (UTC)

Hi, Opus. Thanks for letting me know. Waikiki!!! ^_^ --User:ElectricEye (talk) 06:40, 27 April 2006 (UTC)

My welcome template

You mention my welcome template. I'd love to see that completed, just I am having problems with the html. If you or someone you know can have an attempt at it, please do. It can be found at User:MyNameIsNotBob/Welcome/temp. MyNameIsNotBob 11:49, 29 April 2006 (UTC)

Just letting you know I have managed to fix and upgrade my welcome template at User:MyNameIsNotBob/Welcome. If you can think of ways to improve it be bold and help us all out. Regards. MyNameIsNotBob 13:17, 29 April 2006 (UTC)

Hi NotBob. (What do we call you anyway if you're not Bob?) I got your message and looked at your welcome message, it looks great. I considered your request for html help but wasn't sure what I could do. I'm glad you managed to work that out. Looks like you can fit another column in there. Waikiki!!! ^_^ --ElectricEye (talk) 13:20, 29 April 2006 (UTC)

Yes, I know I can use it as a template. You will notice that I also have a space to mention the page the user has contributed to and a spot for my signature to go. I use a monobook.js script to make inserting the template easier. There is still one problem with the template - it uses a NOTOC tag in it, which will mean their talk pages will have no table of contents ever! Oops! Also, do you think a photo or something might be handy for that? MyNameIsNotBob 13:27, 29 April 2006 (UTC)

Nice! What is this monobook.js think I see people talking about? How can I use it? --ElectricEye (talk) 13:30, 29 April 2006 (UTC)

How about if you put __TOC__ at the top of their talk page when using the template? Would that fix the TOC problem? --ElectricEye (talk) 13:32, 29 April 2006 (UTC)

That fixed it, have a look now. You can see my monobook.js at User:MyNameIsNotBob/monobook.js, try copying that to User:ElectricEye/monobook.js to see what mine does. Or look at WP:WPUS. MyNameIsNotBob 13:47, 29 April 2006 (UTC)

Great! I copied the source of your monobook.js to mine but something doesn't seem right and I don't even know how to use it anyway. I'll have to take a look into WP:WPUS. --ElectricEye (talk) 13:56, 29 April 2006 (UTC)

It works best if you are using Mozilla Firefox MyNameIsNotBob 14:09, 29 April 2006 (UTC)

Hi electric eye Thank you for your instructive comments. The "Personal blogs" I am trying to have listed are essentially my own pieces of research reference. My voluntary work is on behalf of Canadian Senator Bill Rompkey to promote an archive collection project , on the basis of Bill's personal photographs and other scattered information from local folk and the vso teachers of the Labrador coastal communities. Hopefully this will contribute towards the growth of tourism for the many small communities. Using all this new fangled technology is quite a thing! All the best Llewelyn

FOX 30 logos

The two FOX 30 logos in question are fine to be added. I work at KCVU-TV, which is FOX 30. There should be no problem. - Summers95926

Hi Summers95926. Please enter information about copyrights on the image page when you upload it. If it is fairuse, you can specify that there. If you have the authority to grant copyright permission to images then note than in the image upload page with something that can be verified. I am not an expert on the copyright issues within Misplaced Pages so you may want to ask a user more familiar with this for help. If you need further assistance, leave me a message and I will see what I can do. --ElectricEye (talk) 18:18, 6 May 2006 (UTC)

Vandalism: HELP

Hello I am User: RUSSIAN MONK. I am a Science Biographer with special interest in accomplished scientists. I am deeply concerned about a callous abuse of site administration priviledge by the User:Fawcett5, she has vandalized the my article without cause. This is against the rules of Misplaced Pages. I have been expanding this article from cited sources but as you can see from the page FAWCETT5 has some personal issues. I understood that once a source is duly cited and verifiable from public records it CANNOT and should not be deleted at will by parties with special interest regardless of their vendetta. I wish my article returned and perharps Fawcett5 ought to follow Wiki rules just like everyone else. I will relay this message to other administrators who voted her for this user right. Long live Wiki!

Hi RUSSIAN MONK. I received your message and will look into any such problem at the article you have contributed to. --ElectricEye (talk) 18:03, 6 May 2006 (UTC)

Hello

Hi, just coming by so you don't think I vandalised your user page; I removed the Judas Priest album image because it is WP:Fair use, and such images aren't allowed on userpage space. Sorry! Master of Puppets 17:35, 25 May 2006 (UTC)

I am sad now. But I understand it is the rule. Thanks for letting me know. --ElectricEye (talk) 18:08, 2 June 2006 (UTC)

Denys Rayner vandalised

Dear Electric Eye. You have assisted me in the past. I have found that an article to which I have contributed most on Denys Rayner has twice been blanked out with obscene words. I have read the Revert Guide. Can you check that i have followed procedure and is there anything else I can do to prevent this in future? Sibadd 17:52, 2 June 2006 (UTC)

Ok, I'll see what I can do even though I know nothing about Denys Rayner. --ElectricEye (talk) 18:09, 2 June 2006 (UTC)

Don't worry about it

It wasn't you I was upset with. I was upset with Exploding Boy and the way he went about getting me to change my sig. — Nathan 18:05, 5 June 2006 (UTC)

OK :) --ElectricEye (talk) 21:06, 5 June 2006 (UTC)

Thank you for your very kind welcome

It was very much appreciated. AnemoneProjectors 12:26, 12 June 2006 (UTC)

Signing posts

Hi, why is it better to date your posts when you sign them? Is there a reason or rule that says its better or more appropriate to date your posts when signing them? RevolverOcelotX

...Thanks for the welcome!

I just noticed your name on my Talk Page welcome, so thanks a lot! --SilvaStorm

entries get deleted

Hi,

Thank you for your welcome, it is much appreciated!

Hopefully now you can help me with an entry: Every time I try to enter a page for a performance act, it gets tagged for speedy deletion, and within minutes is deleted. There are other acts with less relevant info, and less info, yet they have no problem staying in the Wikepedia. Whats going on??

Thanks, Sarah

Thanks for the welcome

Hi ElecricEye, I think I forgot to thank you for welcoming me when I joined Misplaced Pages. I've had a good experience until today when I was opposed for following WP:BLP and an admin abused his privilidges by blocking me. Do you have any references about any polices over this kind of problem? Thank you. --HResearcher 08:06, 6 August 2006 (UTC)

Hey there

Hi I was just wondering if you could help me - seeing your name was on the top of my talk page. I will just link you to the problem areas.

http://en.wikipedia.org/Wikipedia:Mediation_Cabal/Cases/2006-08-07_The_Potter%27s_House Mediation

http://en.wikipedia.org/User_talk:Potters_house see deleted links.

http://en.wikipedia.org/Talk:Potter%27s_House_Christian_Fellowship The Ross Links

http://en.wikipedia.org/User:Antaeus_Feldspar

Can you help me, this guy doesn't let me breathe on Wiki and because I am quite new I think he is provoking me so that I get banned. I have tried to mediate but am frustrated with no one replying. When he deleted the Wade Watts site I had similar problems. I seem to spend most of my time on Wiki chasing this up, which is what he wants me to do, he goes to each site I go to and is like a net bully. I end up looking like an irrational poster because I am new to this and am not getting anywhere with it. Potters house 02:41, 8 August 2006 (UTC)

Arthur fforde

Dear ElectricEye I contributed my ancestor, Arthur fforde, with what would appear to be a misspelt surname due to the fact that there was no capitalisation on the first 'f'. This is in fact not a mistake but a tradition that has been passed down through the family. I'm not sure why this is exactly, as it always carries some confusion. Apparently it was due to the fact that ff actually stood for F back in the day. Anyway, I like this quirky character in my surname and I would appreciate it if you could amend the amendment or teach me how I can edit the title of an article. I tried to edit it using 'edit this page' but I couldn't change it from there. Many thanks Nic fforde

I have reverted the article back and contacted Miami Vice about this. Not sure on Misplaced Pages policy either (if there is one). However, my own opinion is that it should be at the correct spelling. I have also left a note on the talk page, so hopefully no one else will incorrectly move it.

Pit-yacker 23:39, 24 August 2006 (UTC)

As far as I can tell, the relevant articles would appear to be Misplaced Pages:Naming conventions (people) and Misplaced Pages:Naming_conventions. Giving a quick scan, neither seem to give any consideration to this case. Naming conventions does however, state that what the article states are conventions and not hard rules. In which case, IMHO, we should err on the side of correctness. Pit-yacker 23:50, 24 August 2006 (UTC)

Civility

This edit is IMO uncivil. Be careful :) Computerjoe's talk 21:06, 24 August 2006 (UTC)

And I strongly disagree. I haven't seen any effectiveness of Concordia and I remember you considering closing down ("trashing") the project entirely. I'll try to find your statement in the histories. --ElectricEye (talk) 21:17, 24 August 2006 (UTC)

It reads somewhat uncivil, no need to make a big deal out of it. Just my opinion :) Computerjoe's talk 09:45, 25 August 2006 (UTC)

September Esperanza Newsletter

From another beginner

Thanks for the welcome. Just learning my way. Sorry for the style gaffs. Am sure I will get the idea sooner, thanks to yours and other's edits. Adrian G

November Esperanza Newsletter

Thank you

Hi, I hit 10,000 edits the other day and to commemorate this momentous (?) occasion, I wanted to leave a note to the various people I've run into on Misplaced Pages that have made an impact on my time here. A long time ago, you left me my first message with a "Welcome". Just wanted to say thank you again for making me feel well... welcome here. =) -- Gogo Dodo 00:53, 22 November 2006 (UTC)