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Revision as of 01:53, 15 December 2006 editMikker (talk | contribs)4,559 edits 12 December: a bit annoyed← Previous edit Revision as of 02:19, 15 December 2006 edit undoTariqabjotu (talk | contribs)Administrators36,354 edits 12 December: + reply: not our fault thoughNext edit →
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**I think it is certainly of international interest, even if it's not ''the'' biggest event currently on ITN (I don't think it's the most trivial either, however). I personally don't think it's a weaker item replacing a weak item (see from around the world). Thus, it has been added. For what it's worth, I spent so much time trying to word the item that I had not see PFHLai's post before adding it. I was unsure whether to mention that the victims were prostitutes, but I decided to add that since it ''is'' the common link, and thus the fact is not used to degrade the subjects. -- ''']''' 23:13, 14 December 2006 (UTC) **I think it is certainly of international interest, even if it's not ''the'' biggest event currently on ITN (I don't think it's the most trivial either, however). I personally don't think it's a weaker item replacing a weak item (see from around the world). Thus, it has been added. For what it's worth, I spent so much time trying to word the item that I had not see PFHLai's post before adding it. I was unsure whether to mention that the victims were prostitutes, but I decided to add that since it ''is'' the common link, and thus the fact is not used to degrade the subjects. -- ''']''' 23:13, 14 December 2006 (UTC)
***To be honest, I'm a bit annoyed that this has been posted. Firstly, several people have expressed the opinion that this is too local for ITN and you've not really addressed these concerns (Google news searches news sources ''in English'' which are printed throughout the world - mainly through syndication. Hardly evidence that it's of global interest. Is this headline news in Russia? China? France? Germany? Brazil? Spain? Libya?). Secondly, this yet again confirms my view that there is '''sometimes''' distinct bias at ITN - if these murders had happened, say, in South Africa or Nepal, would it have been put on ITN? No, of course not. Yes, sometimes trivial international stories go up (Transnistria election etc.) but that's hardly a reason to put more trivial American and British stories up. ] ] 01:53, 15 December 2006 (UTC) ***To be honest, I'm a bit annoyed that this has been posted. Firstly, several people have expressed the opinion that this is too local for ITN and you've not really addressed these concerns (Google news searches news sources ''in English'' which are printed throughout the world - mainly through syndication. Hardly evidence that it's of global interest. Is this headline news in Russia? China? France? Germany? Brazil? Spain? Libya?). Secondly, this yet again confirms my view that there is '''sometimes''' distinct bias at ITN - if these murders had happened, say, in South Africa or Nepal, would it have been put on ITN? No, of course not. Yes, sometimes trivial international stories go up (Transnistria election etc.) but that's hardly a reason to put more trivial American and British stories up. ] ] 01:53, 15 December 2006 (UTC)
****I think I have addressed the concerns of worldwide notability; even though some news organizations may just carry the story via syndication, the very inclusion indicates they believe the event is of importance to their readers. Also, note that several have endorsed adding this item. Regardless, I think your problem is not with the dynamics of Misplaced Pages, but the dynamics of the world. You may be right that a similar event in Africa or Central Asia may not receive as much international attention, but that's not Misplaced Pages's fault. -- ''']''' 02:19, 15 December 2006 (UTC)


===10 December=== ===10 December===

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14 December

  • South Dakota Senator Tim Johnson is in critical condition following surgery for an arteriovenous malformation, throwing control of the Senate into doubt.
    • I'm not sure whether this is too U.S.-centric or not, which is why I'm proposing it here instead of putting it on the page. The reason this might be of international interest is that if Sen. Johnson, a Democrat, dies or is forced to relinquish his seat, his replacement would be chosen by the Republican governor of South Dakota. If he chooses a Republican, that would tip the balance of control back to the Republicans, and I think that possibility may make the story of international interest. However, as someone once said, "I'm smelling a lot of 'if' coming off of this plan", so I open the floor to discussion. (I'm about to go on a wikibreak, so someone else will have to put the story up if people decide they want it.) —Josiah Rowe (talkcontribs) 15:52, 14 December 2006 (UTC)
    • Well I feel what this news event has that others don't is that this is an ongoing event. Based on something that is still up in the air, there can be huge repercussions. This unfortunate event can effectively cancel out one of the huge implications of this past November's elections. I think that Governor Rounds is to appoint a Republican, it can be a scandal comparable to the Corrupt Bargains of the 19th Century. I think that this is a developing story that can become the start of something huge but I think perhaps it's best to hold off for a short while. Stephen 18:54, 14 December 2006 (UTC)
    • I believe that this would meet criterion C of the deaths criteria, the effect on current events. I also feel that it's best to wait for further developments: there's still a possibility that Johnson lives through this, which would mean that there's no news story to write about. Aecis 18:58, 14 December 2006 (UTC)
    • I agree that, if he dies, it ought to go up on ITN. However, him being ill (even seriously ill) is not sufficient IMO. Mikker 20:14, 14 December 2006 (UTC)
    • I would wait till a Republican successor is named, shifting the balance of power in the US Congress (if this actually happens as speculated.) IMO, Tim Johnson himself is not famous enough outside the US to get his obituary on ITN. --PFHLai 22:18, 14 December 2006 (UTC)
    • Definitely oppose this going up now, ITN is not for speculation of such relatively trivial things as death unless it's a head of state or the Pope. Oppose this being included should he die. Sen. Johnson is not particularly notable outside America and he one out of hundred Senators in a legislative body which is not even in session at the moment. Nor is it particularly notable if his death gives the Republican Party a majority in the Senate; legislative bodies change hands all the time, and unless it happens through an election of some sort i don't think it's notable, despite how much fuss it will cause, and feathers it will ruffle in Washington D.C. Also this would fail criteria 5c should the Senator die, as it does not affect international events in the slightest. If however there is a big scandal over the appointing of a Republican to fill his seat, complete with a blocking or opposing of his appointment of some sort, that might be notable because it is a first, or something. I don't know, that bridge can be crossed if it is ever gotten to. Thethinredline 23:07, 14 December 2006 (UTC)

12 December

  • Fourth and fifth bodies found in prostitute murder case in Ipswich, East England. http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2006/12/12/ap/world/mainD8LVFLT80.shtml
    • If there's an updated article, I endorse putting this up. Aecis 00:21, 13 December 2006 (UTC)
      • This seems like too local an event to me.--Pharos 00:24, 13 December 2006 (UTC)
        • Agreed. A murderer in my hometown was linked to the deaths of 12 prostitutes in 2004, and stories like that happen every ten years! (Prospect Avenue, John E. Robinson, Wayne Court). I don't recall seeing a story about that on the main page; why throw up one on five murders in the U.K.? --KHill-LTown 01:39, 15 December 2006 (UTC)
        • This has received attention from all over the world. See e.g. ARD (Germany), Sydney Morning Herald (Australia), La Repubblica (Italy), etcetera. It may not have "international importance", but it definitely has "international interest". There is an updated article btw: 2006 Suffolk murder investigation. Aecis 00:33, 13 December 2006 (UTC)
          • It's too local IMO. Besides, 5 is not much of a body-count as far as serial-killers go. This guy first has to be a notable serial killer before it's ITN worthy - the mere fact that there is a serial killer in GB is hardly that newsworthy. Mikker 00:53, 13 December 2006 (UTC)
              • I do kinda have to point out that if notability of serial killers is determined solely by body count, Jack the Ripper wouldn't have merited a place in the section, with only five victims to his name. GeeJo(c) • 01:15, 15 December 2006 (UTC)
                • Sure, I agree. Body count is only one factor - but I made seperate points (1) he has a low body count, (2) he's not a notable serial killer (only partly because of 1). Mikker 01:37, 15 December 2006 (UTC)
          • For a serial murder case that is unquestionably of international importance, see Female homicides in Ciudad Juárez.--Pharos 01:46, 13 December 2006 (UTC)
            • Good Lord. I'm horrified, both by the case and that I'd never heard of it. —Josiah Rowe (talkcontribs) 07:25, 13 December 2006 (UTC)
              • This is probably the biggest international news story in Australia right now, certainly bigger than most of the other events listed in the "In The News". It's probably been mentioned before, but if the cabbage poisoning incident in the US a few months ago was considered global enough for listing on the main page, then so should this.--Phil500 (Talk / Contribs) 02:19, 14 December 2006 (UTC)
                • Two wrongs don't make a right. --Golbez 03:10, 14 December 2006 (UTC)
                • As I recall, the tainted veggie bit and 2 other items were posted (by me) with reluctance, and they were the best available news items after several consecutive days of peace and tranquility on Earth, keeping ITN unchanged for days. This is not the case right now. I'd suggest waiting. I hope we won't have to stick this in on, say, Sunday. We should be able to report on the discovery of St. Paul's tomb or the expansion of the International Space Station soon, anyway, if that's good (major) enough for ITN. -- PFHLai 05:18, 14 December 2006 (UTC)
                • Not the veggie thing again!! Mikker 20:09, 14 December 2006 (UTC)
                  • Given that it's listed in the international news sections of CNN, ABC, and CBS, and gets front-page coverage by the BBC and Sky, as well as prominent mentions by other national news agencies, I'd say this warrants a position more than an election in a country unrecognised by the UN or the world at large. GeeJo(c) • 20:38, 14 December 2006 (UTC)
                    • Yes, but IMO, it's like replacing a weak item on ITN with a even weaker item. --PFHLai 22:42, 14 December 2006 (UTC)
                    • So if something is on the Anglo-American news it's of international interest? Last time I checked there were 190 countries other than America and Britain. (And ABC and CBS are hardly "global"). Besides, you're making an ordinal statement, like this: the appointment of the new principal at my neighbourhood school is more ITN worthy than the what I ate for dinner. Now that's true but irrelevant - one is closer to the minimum requirements than the other, but neither passes. Transnistria's election may not be ITN worthy, but that has nothing whatsoever to do with the notability of some random veggie making some random Americans sick. Mikker 01:27, 15 December 2006 (UTC)
    • I think it is certainly of international interest, even if it's not the biggest event currently on ITN (I don't think it's the most trivial either, however). I personally don't think it's a weaker item replacing a weak item (see Google News results from around the world). Thus, it has been added. For what it's worth, I spent so much time trying to word the item that I had not see PFHLai's post before adding it. I was unsure whether to mention that the victims were prostitutes, but I decided to add that since it is the common link, and thus the fact is not used to degrade the subjects. -- tariqabjotu 23:13, 14 December 2006 (UTC)
      • To be honest, I'm a bit annoyed that this has been posted. Firstly, several people have expressed the opinion that this is too local for ITN and you've not really addressed these concerns (Google news searches news sources in English which are printed throughout the world - mainly through syndication. Hardly evidence that it's of global interest. Is this headline news in Russia? China? France? Germany? Brazil? Spain? Libya?). Secondly, this yet again confirms my view that there is sometimes distinct bias at ITN - if these murders had happened, say, in South Africa or Nepal, would it have been put on ITN? No, of course not. Yes, sometimes trivial international stories go up (Transnistria election etc.) but that's hardly a reason to put more trivial American and British stories up. Mikker 01:53, 15 December 2006 (UTC)
        • I think I have addressed the concerns of worldwide notability; even though some news organizations may just carry the story via syndication, the very inclusion indicates they believe the event is of importance to their readers. Also, note that several have endorsed adding this item. Regardless, I think your problem is not with the dynamics of Misplaced Pages, but the dynamics of the world. You may be right that a similar event in Africa or Central Asia may not receive as much international attention, but that's not Misplaced Pages's fault. -- tariqabjotu 02:19, 15 December 2006 (UTC)

10 December

Added, although I found a higher resolution image from NASA. -- tariqabjotu 04:05, 10 December 2006 (UTC)
Actually I would suggest Image:Christer Fuglesang.jpg
Christer Fuglesang
Christer Fuglesang
is the better image to have. While the launch of the shuttle may be the main event, a shuttle launch is a shuttle launch. There's nothing particularly unique about the shuttle launch picture, a lot of people probably would have seen one before. On the other hand, a lot of people wouldn't have seen Christer Fuglesang and since we do mention him... Nil Einne 21:20, 10 December 2006 (UTC)
Yes, good point. I have changed the picture. -- tariqabjotu 05:51, 11 December 2006 (UTC)

8 December

7 December

  • Launch of STS-116 (planned)
    • Please sign your comments. And please hold off on putting things on here til they actually happen. --Golbez 21:51, 8 December 2006 (UTC)
      • The ITN candidates do not really need to be signed; some people sign them, while others do not. Looking at the contributions of the person who added this, I believe the editor is familiar with signing comments, but just didn't think it was necessary here. -- tariqabjotu 23:23, 8 December 2006 (UTC)
    • Endorse. Space shuttle launches are usually notable, the project (ISS) is notable, and this should fly well with us geeks ;) Aecis 16:53, 9 December 2006 (UTC)

6 December

Marc Ravalomanana
Marc Ravalomanana
Needs a little more updating, but should be do-able soon. --PFHLai 00:05, 7 December 2006 (UTC)
The vote tallying is finally complete. Should this be on ITN yet? --199.71.174.100 21:02, 10 December 2006 (UTC)
Didn't we already mention him a while back? I remember because I'm the one who found and added the picture (which was never used on the main page :-P) Nil Einne 21:14, 10 December 2006 (UTC)
Last month, the news was about General Andrianafidisoa's alleged attempt to seize control of the country from Ravalomanana, not the election. --199.71.174.100 02:49, 12 December 2006 (UTC)
Posted.--Pharos 00:18, 13 December 2006 (UTC)
File:Bainimarama.jpg

5 December

4 December

The women's tournament is 2+ weeks old, so I'll pass. Great photos and nice tables in the men's tournament's page, but it lacks descriptive prose on the games (Same problem with 2006 Davis Cup below) and much of the current text (on the tournament format) is in the future tense. So, I'll pass, too, for the time being. -- PFHLai 08:17, 5 December 2006 (UTC)
Posted. --PFHLai 08:15, 4 December 2006 (UTC)
Posted the confirmed death toll of 406 reported in 2006 Pacific typhoon season#Typhoon Durian (Reming). -- PFHLai 08:31, 4 December 2006 (UTC)
Posted a simpler version. -- PFHLai 09:03, 4 December 2006 (UTC)

3 December

  • Former Chilean President Augusto Pinochet had suffered a heart attack and is in critical but stable condition in Santiago's Military Hospital.
    • Not sure his current health condition is notable enough for wikipedia. I do believe that his death would meet the criteria for deaths on ITN though. Aecis 16:28, 3 December 2006 (UTC)
      • From what I've heard in the Chilean press, his situation is life-threatening. Last rites had been administered by a Catholic priest, and he is also suffering from pulmonary edema. Dr. Juan Ignacio Vergara from the Military Hospital emphasized the potentially fatal situation the former president is in. The government spokesman, Ricardo Lagos (Jr), is already talking about whether Pinochet should be given a state funeral. Marmaduque 17:08, 3 December 2006 (UTC)
        • We had Castro going into surgery, so why not this?--HamedogTalk| 02:39, 4 December 2006 (UTC)
          • Well Castro was/is the leader of Cuba for decades. Augusto Pinochet is a controversial figure and his death may affect world affairs sufficient to warrant inclusion in ITN but I'm skeptical if his current situation is enough. If it's true he's near death them IMHO we just wait. If he survives with no immediete changes then I doubt it will be sufficient enough on world affairs Nil Einne 08:43, 4 December 2006 (UTC)
            • Also, Pinochet is 91. It's not as if his death would surprise anybody. He meets none of the criteria of ITN#5. -- Kicking222 13:46, 4 December 2006 (UTC)
              • He wouldn't meet criteria A (in a high ranking office of power at the time of death) and B (a key figure in their field of expertise, and died unexpectedly or tragically), but he might meet criterion C (a major international impact that affects current events). Time will tell. Aecis 13:59, 4 December 2006 (UTC)
  • Yes, IMO, his dying while his trials are still on-going would meet criterion C, though it's not really that international. Pinochet is such a notable figure in history (My POV?) that I might be bold and post his death on ITN, anyway. --PFHLai 18:36, 4 December 2006 (UTC)
I don't think just holding a large convention is enough for ITN. In August 2006, the International Astronomical Union conference didn't get on ITN till the announcement of the re-definition of the term "planet". What is on deck from the ITU ? BTW, please expand the stubby ITU Telecom World 2006 page. --PFHLai 09:37, 4 December 2006 (UTC)

2 December

1 December

30 November

high-casualty event and big military confrontation --TheFEARgod (Ч) 15:33, 30 November 2006 (UTC)
This is nb enough for ITN but the article still needs some more work... Mikker 20:24, 30 November 2006 (UTC)

Article is stub-size, putting it ITN would contribute to its enlargement --TheFEARgod (Ч) 20:42, 30 November 2006 (UTC)

As long as an article covers all the bases and is solid, I don't think the length really matters. —Centrxtalk • 00:05, 1 December 2006 (UTC)
I think the article is good enough for ITN, so I endorse putting this up. Aecis 00:08, 1 December 2006 (UTC)
Added. Aecis 21:26, 3 December 2006 (UTC)
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