Revision as of 07:42, 24 February 2007 edit74.73.81.168 (talk) →Funding sources← Previous edit | Latest revision as of 11:08, 17 February 2024 edit undoQwerfjkl (bot) (talk | contribs)Bots, Mass message senders4,012,377 edits Implementing WP:PIQA (Task 26)Tag: Talk banner shell conversion | ||
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==Vandalism== | |||
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This is why I'm reverting ] edit: | |||
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*MI had nothing to do with ''The Bell Curve''. The Bell Curve was written in 1994. Murray left MI in 1990, precisely because MI support his research in this area, as even this . | |||
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*There is no evidence that "Fixing Broken Windows" says blacks are intellectually inferior. | |||
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*"Predominantly white and male" may be true, but it is original research, contrary to Misplaced Pages standards. It's also true for Brookings, Center for American Progress, ATLA, MoveOn, and the Democratic Party members of the Senate. Why single out MI? | |||
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*MI is so affiliated with the Republican Party that its ] publicly came out against Bush in the last election. | |||
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*All of the edits are POV. | |||
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*WL added an extraneous bracket and capitalization. | |||
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] 14:51, 22 September 2005 (UTC) | |||
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== Manhattan Institute for Psychoanalysis == | == Manhattan Institute for Psychoanalysis == | ||
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== General bias == | ||
Former section title: Energy and environment. Section renamed to reflect the broader discussion here, and the broader work-to-be-done. | |||
I think calling something "Right Wing" rather than simply conservative has PoV issues. That aside, MI is generally known for concentrating on practical solutions to policy problems, rather than doctrinaire ideological positions. Calling MI "free-market" might be more accurate and fair. ] 04:31, 15 February 2007 (UTC) | |||
There seems to be biased language in this section (as well as in other sections of the article). Specifically, it includes the following sentence: "Bryce has argued at length that, even with exorbitant government subsidies, renewable energy sources are simply inadequate to meet America's energy needs." The use of the word exorbitant in this context implies that large government subsidies are unreasonable, which is not a neutral position. Robert Bryce may believe that large subsidies are exorbitant, but it is not clear from the context here that this is merely his opinion. The phrase "simply inadequate" could also be edited to remove the word "simply" in order to appear more neutral. <br> | |||
:I agree with "free-market". I don't think "right wing" belongs because it's POV, imprecise and un-encyclopedic. What does "right wing" mean? Can you give a source for a definition? I might accept "conservative", but that's imprecise too. ] 01:56, 22 February 2007 (UTC) | |||
This sentence is even more biased: "In keeping with its commitment to free-market economic principles, the institute is opposed to high-cost, inefficient government mandates and subsidies." It reads as like a statement from the organization itself rather than a neutral party. It is completely unclear what kind of mandates or subsidies should be considered high-cost or inefficient, and seems to take the inefficiency of such things for granted.<br> | |||
Elsewhere, Bill Gates is quoted praising the book ''The Bottomless Well'' by Institute senior fellows Peter Huber and Mark Mills. The citation for this links to an article put out by the Manhattan Institute themselves. I have not been able to find a more neutral source confirming this quote. In any case, Gates's opinion on the book doesn't seem relevant to the article, and its inclusion is likely to bias the reader. ] (]) 04:58, 22 November 2020 (UTC) | |||
:Statements about climate change are also presented in a way that is not compliant with policy. Secondary reliable sources about the institute should be used and summarized rather than primary advocacy material (], ]). I tagged a source as such and the article has a relevant neutrality tag. I don't have the time to work on this article at current time and invite anyone interested to help per ]. Thanks, —]] – 02:36, 17 February 2021 (UTC) | |||
:Are Floyd Flake, Herman Badillo, or John McWhorter "right wing"? It just doesn't make sense here. ] 04:09, 22 February 2007 (UTC) | |||
::I took a stab at being bold and deleted the Cass primary-source quote, replacing it with material from a New York Times story that describes his and the institute's position on climate science. ] (]) 00:58, 25 February 2021 (UTC) | |||
== Funding sources == | |||
:::Thanks, I just removed ] from Lesser that only cited the advocacy org. I'm not sure if it's usable, but an independent source mentioning Lesser's views is https://www.energyandpolicy.org/lesser-climate-denier-attacks-electric-vehicles/ ; one about Cass is https://www.nytimes.com/2018/05/08/climate/pruitt-epa-red-blue-team-debate-emails.html that is probably usable. I have found Greenpeace reports listing the institute as Exxon and Koch funded like https://www.eenews.net/assets/2019/03/26/document_cw_01.pdf https://www.greenpeace.org/usa/wp-content/uploads/legacy/Global/usa/report/2010/3/koch-industries-secretly-fund.pdf that I'm not sure are usable. —]] – 15:54, 8 March 2021 (UTC) | |||
:I just deleted a completely unsourced paragraph, with unsourced promotional language. It seems pretty clear this article has been influenced by policy-violating ] and/or ] editing. I endorse the NPOV banner, and I endorse anyone who wants to ]ly edit the article to be ]. ] (]) 14:55, 30 April 2021 (UTC) | |||
*I've made an effort to clean the article up. {{ping|Alsee}}, {{ping|PaleoNeonate}}, {{ping|Jackk225}}: Do you think it's better now? Good enough to remove the tag? Or are there still issues? Even with a lot of this cleanup, it feels like the article spends a ''lot'' of time trying to convince the reader how important the Manhattan Institutes' fellows are (there's probably still some stuff about their activities outside the Manhattan Institute that could stand to be cleaned up.) --] (]) 04:04, 13 August 2022 (UTC) | |||
*:@] I didn't review quite all of it, but everything I that did review was great work. | |||
*:I removed the Neutrality tag. I'm seeing about 13 citation neededs. I don't know if you want to make the effort to come back to this article in maybe one-to-six months, but much of that tagged content can probably be nuked if it stays unsourced. Or maybe some random editor will read this months (or years) from now, in which case I invite that future <s>victim</s>''volunteer'' to hack away at it. ] (]) 09:01, 14 August 2022 (UTC) | |||
::It's still far from an ideal article of course, but these were obvious improvements. Thanks, —]] – 21:13, 19 September 2022 (UTC) | |||
== Culture War Issues == | |||
], why did you remove my section on funding sources? ] 01:19, 20 February 2007 (UTC) | |||
The Manhattan Institute has recently gained new prominence after Chris Rufo, one of its Senior Fellows, has started high-profile campaigns about Critical Race Theory and more recently alleged links between Disney and pedophila. Articles about these topics have been published in City Journal as well. Should this be added in the article as a separate header, possible as a new phase in the Institute's development? Happy to provide links if that would be helpful. | |||
That's a New York, NY IP address. Might be somebody from the Institute who doesn't want it to be public, or an MI supporter or something. Pure conjecture on my part I suppose. To answer your unstated question (judging by this talk page's history), I didn't pull it. I'd have no problem with funding sources being in the article. To me that's not a PoV issue, although I know it's been reverted by others in the past. ] 06:47, 20 February 2007 (UTC) | |||
] (]) 15:48, 8 April 2022 (UTC) | |||
:I had the same conjecture, and I did the same whois search. (I originally thought from my misreading of the article history that it was deleted in your revision; my mistake.) I think it's significant, since it tells you where they're coming from in a more NPOV way than "conservative" or "free-market". I think it's POV to ''not'' include it. I'll restore it. ] 20:43, 20 February 2007 (UTC) | |||
Hello, all. I am 66.234.233.50. Nothing personal. Mostly a sourcing issue. I think given the clear agenda of "sourcewatch", it becomes a PoV issue. At least in my book. Misplaced Pages sure presents some interesting challenges... |
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Manhattan Institute for Psychoanalysis
In order to distinguish the Manhattan Institute from the Manhattan Institute for Psychoanalysis (www.manhattanpsychoanalysis.com) should I first create a listing for the organization? After which we can add redirectors from the MI listing and from the MIP listing that clarify the different organizations?
--cbelz
General bias
Former section title: Energy and environment. Section renamed to reflect the broader discussion here, and the broader work-to-be-done.
There seems to be biased language in this section (as well as in other sections of the article). Specifically, it includes the following sentence: "Bryce has argued at length that, even with exorbitant government subsidies, renewable energy sources are simply inadequate to meet America's energy needs." The use of the word exorbitant in this context implies that large government subsidies are unreasonable, which is not a neutral position. Robert Bryce may believe that large subsidies are exorbitant, but it is not clear from the context here that this is merely his opinion. The phrase "simply inadequate" could also be edited to remove the word "simply" in order to appear more neutral.
This sentence is even more biased: "In keeping with its commitment to free-market economic principles, the institute is opposed to high-cost, inefficient government mandates and subsidies." It reads as like a statement from the organization itself rather than a neutral party. It is completely unclear what kind of mandates or subsidies should be considered high-cost or inefficient, and seems to take the inefficiency of such things for granted.
Elsewhere, Bill Gates is quoted praising the book The Bottomless Well by Institute senior fellows Peter Huber and Mark Mills. The citation for this links to an article put out by the Manhattan Institute themselves. I have not been able to find a more neutral source confirming this quote. In any case, Gates's opinion on the book doesn't seem relevant to the article, and its inclusion is likely to bias the reader. Jackk225 (talk) 04:58, 22 November 2020 (UTC)
- Statements about climate change are also presented in a way that is not compliant with policy. Secondary reliable sources about the institute should be used and summarized rather than primary advocacy material (WP:PRIMARY, WP:ABOUTSELF). I tagged a source as such and the article has a relevant neutrality tag. I don't have the time to work on this article at current time and invite anyone interested to help per WP:BOLD. Thanks, —PaleoNeonate – 02:36, 17 February 2021 (UTC)
- I took a stab at being bold and deleted the Cass primary-source quote, replacing it with material from a New York Times story that describes his and the institute's position on climate science. 24.163.84.190 (talk) 00:58, 25 February 2021 (UTC)
- Thanks, I just removed this from Lesser that only cited the advocacy org. I'm not sure if it's usable, but an independent source mentioning Lesser's views is https://www.energyandpolicy.org/lesser-climate-denier-attacks-electric-vehicles/ ; one about Cass is https://www.nytimes.com/2018/05/08/climate/pruitt-epa-red-blue-team-debate-emails.html that is probably usable. I have found Greenpeace reports listing the institute as Exxon and Koch funded like https://www.eenews.net/assets/2019/03/26/document_cw_01.pdf https://www.greenpeace.org/usa/wp-content/uploads/legacy/Global/usa/report/2010/3/koch-industries-secretly-fund.pdf that I'm not sure are usable. —PaleoNeonate – 15:54, 8 March 2021 (UTC)
- I took a stab at being bold and deleted the Cass primary-source quote, replacing it with material from a New York Times story that describes his and the institute's position on climate science. 24.163.84.190 (talk) 00:58, 25 February 2021 (UTC)
- I just deleted a completely unsourced paragraph, with unsourced promotional language. It seems pretty clear this article has been influenced by policy-violating WP:COI and/or WP:PAID editing. I endorse the NPOV banner, and I endorse anyone who wants to WP:Boldly edit the article to be more neutral. Alsee (talk) 14:55, 30 April 2021 (UTC)
- I've made an effort to clean the article up. @Alsee:, @PaleoNeonate:, @Jackk225:: Do you think it's better now? Good enough to remove the tag? Or are there still issues? Even with a lot of this cleanup, it feels like the article spends a lot of time trying to convince the reader how important the Manhattan Institutes' fellows are (there's probably still some stuff about their activities outside the Manhattan Institute that could stand to be cleaned up.) --Aquillion (talk) 04:04, 13 August 2022 (UTC)
- @Aquillion I didn't review quite all of it, but everything I that did review was great work.
- I removed the Neutrality tag. I'm seeing about 13 citation neededs. I don't know if you want to make the effort to come back to this article in maybe one-to-six months, but much of that tagged content can probably be nuked if it stays unsourced. Or maybe some random editor will read this months (or years) from now, in which case I invite that future
victimvolunteer to hack away at it. Alsee (talk) 09:01, 14 August 2022 (UTC)
- It's still far from an ideal article of course, but these were obvious improvements. Thanks, —PaleoNeonate – 21:13, 19 September 2022 (UTC)
Culture War Issues
The Manhattan Institute has recently gained new prominence after Chris Rufo, one of its Senior Fellows, has started high-profile campaigns about Critical Race Theory and more recently alleged links between Disney and pedophila. Articles about these topics have been published in City Journal as well. Should this be added in the article as a separate header, possible as a new phase in the Institute's development? Happy to provide links if that would be helpful. LaurelhurstLiberal (talk) 15:48, 8 April 2022 (UTC)
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