Revision as of 17:38, 21 December 2023 editSanAnMan (talk | contribs)Extended confirmed users, Pending changes reviewers, Rollbackers13,067 edits →Portrayal of Stan Marsh: nope← Previous edit |
Latest revision as of 08:38, 20 October 2024 edit undoCewbot (talk | contribs)Bots7,235,381 editsm Maintain {{WPBS}}: 6 WikiProject templates. The article is listed in the level 5 page: Long-running, continuing.Tag: Talk banner shell conversion |
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== Adult Show == |
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South Park is an adult animated show, so wouldn't it make sense to put "adult" before "animated sitcom" in the first sentence? ] (]) 20:28, 9 July 2022 (UTC) |
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== Production Companies == |
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] is being removed from the infobox of the ]. In the description of the edits, it was said that there was no need for it to stay there and can go. The thing is I have a fear that this can be a little misleading. MTVES may not be the main producers, but they are a label that is displayed in the series and specials credits since. Is it unnecessary to have them on the infobox? ] (]) 18:49, 15 October 2022 (UTC) |
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:Being shown in the credits does not warrant inserting them in the infobox alongside the main production company of the show; see ]. ] (]) 10:56, 16 October 2022 (UTC) |
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::You see the thing is, MTV Entertainment Studios pretty much IS the main production company behind the show right now. Comedy Central has been folded under MTV Entertainment Group for while and anything under it is produced through MTV's studio. It not only appears in the credits, but MTV Entertainment Studios is mentioned in near all official South Park press releases. I have to side with Ramses here. ] (]) 20:06, 18 November 2022 (UTC) |
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:::Per ], the "production company or companies that funded/organized series production” should be listed; MTV Entertainment Studio counts as a company that funds/organizes series production, as they formed a deal with Parker and Stone to continue the series. I side with Ramses and Avery here. ] (]) 01:57, 22 February 2023 (UTC) |
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::::@] what's ur explanation of this issue? ] (]) 07:05, 25 February 2023 (UTC) |
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:::::@] MTV Entertainment Studios produces every Comedy Central show without involvement from CBS, further proof that they should be included in the production company list is in the sources that I sent before. ] (]) 08:53, 11 March 2023 (UTC) |
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::::::MTVES is not stated or referenced as the main production company in the sources that have been provided or any as of yet and concluding that constitutes ], until sources cite it as such its mention in the production section is sufficient. ] (]) 16:32, 11 March 2023 (UTC) |
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:::::::@] If this is the case then you ought to remove the studio’s mentions from every Comedy Central show without involvement from CBS Media Ventures, the studio has been producing them since 2021. Also season 24 was produced at MTV when South Park Studios was closed down due to COVID-19. ] (]) 00:12, 12 March 2023 (UTC) |
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:::::::@] by that logic that means Celluloid Studios, which helped out with production should be deleted from the list; also MTV is the funder of the show nowadays, according to https://variety.com/2021/tv/news/south-park-trek-parker-matt-stone-paramount-plus-movies-1235035295/; Comedy Partners are just executives of the network. ] (]) 14:26, 13 March 2023 (UTC) |
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::::::::See ]; as per the above the mention of them in the body is enough for now. ] (]) 21:02, 13 March 2023 (UTC) |
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:::::::::@] You ought to refer to the article for MTV Entertainment Studios, they currently produce every film and TV series under the MTV Entertainment Group brand; this applies to every Comedy Central show produced since its 2021 rebrand. If you think this does not apply to South Park, it would not apply to most other Comedy Central shows either. ] (]) 07:09, 18 March 2023 (UTC) |
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== Semi-protected edit request on 22 February 2023 == |
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{{edit semi-protected|South Park|answered=yes}} |
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Under the category "Voice cast," the name "Token Black" should be changed to "Tolkien Black," as was revealed to be his true name in Season 25 Episode 2. ] (]) 00:10, 22 February 2023 (UTC) |
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:It’s been dealt with, thanks for helping. ] (]) 01:58, 22 February 2023 (UTC) |
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== Logo == |
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The show's logo is the ''South Park'' text on the sign, it's been used on every season release. ] (]) 17:18, 29 March 2023 (UTC) |
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:I suggest you open up a discussion here before making such a dramatic change as the article's logo which has stood for some time now. IMO it looks like you're just trying to justify replacing the logo because you created the png file of the just the text version. - ] (]) 19:37, 29 March 2023 (UTC) |
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::Editor has also removed content without valid reason and has a long history of edit warring. Should we report him if he does such a radical change again? ] (]) 01:01, 30 March 2023 (UTC) |
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:::{{yo|SanAnMan}} Hardly. The current image in the infobox, though similar in art style, is unofficial fanart. The original artwork by Comedy Central can be seen . In terms of a logo, the show has not really had a consistent one, given that besides the town sign there's also logos like ] and ]; though both were not used until the movie and later, and their current use is mostly limited to promotion and merchandising. The font on the sign is the closest to a logo the show has had, it is used alone on the season releases, and is consistent in format with most TV logos used in this site as they primarily consist of text of the show's title in an SVG file. ] (]) 04:24, 30 March 2023 (UTC) |
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::::{{yo|QuestFour}} And yet that "unofficial fanart" has been used for a long time without contention. Now I can understand that maybe the picture with the four kids is a little too much, and I'm willing to suggest a compromise and change the infobox image to (the picture with the same text on the well-known wooden sign), which has been in use in multiple other SP articles, but the image you created with just the words looks absolutely horrible to be blunt. - ] (]) 16:24, 31 March 2023 (UTC) |
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:::::It's just the text sans the sign, how exactly is it "horrible"? Is having it plastered on the cover of the ] release horrible? Also, I didn't make it, but found it along with the ] looking up ''South Park'' logos. I think the sign is too much; if the text was never used outside the sign then yes, obviously there wouldn't be an argument about not using it, but it is. Your reasoning against it seems entirely arbitrary. ] (]) 22:30, 31 March 2023 (UTC) |
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::::::Besides it being unofficial, the infobox image fails criteria 1 of ], so I'm replacing it with the logo for now. The sign or no sign disagreement can be further discussed here. ] (]) 21:12, 2 April 2023 (UTC) |
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:::::::@] please don't add and remove stuff just because u like it while other editors object to this, u're doing it in a very uncivilised way; @] you oughtta do something about this, this user has been abusively removing content and provoking multiple edit wars. ] (]) 12:17, 3 April 2023 (UTC) |
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::::::::Excuse me? The image clearly fails ]. If this is because of the text version then so be it, the sign it is. ] (]) 12:27, 3 April 2023 (UTC) |
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:The sign is a much-more recognized logo for the show. If the logo needs to be replaced, then so be it, but the sign is definitely a better choice than just the text. As discussed earlier, there really doesn't seem to be an "official" logo for the show, so this compromose is the best I can think of. - ] (]) 16:12, 3 April 2023 (UTC) |
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::Since the show doesn't have a clear logo, restoring the title card until further decision is made seems to be the best option per ], as it was the file used in the infobox prior to the previous image, already is used in the article and has a non-free media rationale, and is much more representative of the show. I'll go ahead and replace it for the time being. ] (]) 02:06, 4 April 2023 (UTC) |
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== Production Companies/Distributiors == |
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There is absolutely nothing "subsidiary" about the specials. They were part of a new deal signed only a few years ago, and they are episodes that continue upon or add to existing plotlines, and the plots of the specials continue to influence the regular season episodes. The comments about the specials being "subsidiary" and such appear to be biased in your own view. As for the fact that the Episodes table in this article doesn't include the section for the Specials, that is definitely something that needs to be worked on in the ], but that doesn't deter from the fact that the specials are still episodes, and have no greater or lesser importance than any other episode. - ] (]) 14:53, 18 October 2023 (UTC) |
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There is absolutely nothing "subsidiary" about the specials. They were part of a new deal signed only a few years ago, and they are episodes that continue upon or add to existing plotlines, and the plots of the specials continue to influence the regular season episodes. The comments about the specials being "subsidiary" and such appear to be biased in your own view. As for the fact that the Episodes table in this article doesn't include the section for the Specials, that is definitely something that needs to be worked on in the ], but that doesn't deter from the fact that the specials are still episodes, and have no greater or lesser importance than any other episode. - ] (]) 14:53, 18 October 2023 (UTC) |
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:I have successfully fixed the Episodes table at the top of ], and that table has updated itself in this article as well, so the special episodes are now included properly in this article. - ] (]) 15:22, 18 October 2023 (UTC) |
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:I have successfully fixed the Episodes table at the top of ], and that table has updated itself in this article as well, so the special episodes are now included properly in this article. - ] (]) 15:22, 18 October 2023 (UTC) |
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The PP specials, even if argued to not be secondary to the main CC episodes, constitute less than 5% of the show's episodes. As such, placing PP in a footnote is best reflective of this as per ] and ]; with the former stating that undue weight is given through prominence of placement. ] (]) 06:12, 3 March 2024 (UTC) |
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:There's nothing in the guidelines stating that a network needs to have aired a particular percentage of episodes to be noted in the infobox. ] (]) 10:00, 3 March 2024 (UTC) |
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::There isn't because that's not how guidelines work; there won't be a list of every possible situation a guideline could be applicable. The network is noted in the infobox, and I moreover made the note appear more prominently than before. As per ], this is now the second compromise I've proposed, yet there doesn't seem to be much effort from yourself to do so. ] (]) 12:22, 3 March 2024 (UTC) |
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:::You've failed to convince either me or SanAnMan that any "compromise" is necessary. As already suggested, you may want to think about raising an RfC somewhere to garner further opinions on the matter. ] (]) 09:53, 4 March 2024 (UTC) |
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::::As demonstrated above, the aforementioned guidelines clearly and evidently apply here; unless you're able to prove otherwise, ] is not a counterargument. ] (]) 10:56, 4 March 2024 (UTC) |
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:::::I don't believe either WP:UNDUE or WP:PROPORTION apply in this case. By that rationale, we should also be removing mention of Paramount+ from the lede. ] (]) 11:40, 4 March 2024 (UTC) |
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::::::PP's scope and proportion of mentioning in the lead is not the same as it is in the infobox parameter; ]. And a note as discussed ''ad infinitum'' does not remove or omit text. You're most certainly entitled to your belief, but it doesn't decree Misplaced Pages, policies and guidelines do. ] (]) 16:12, 4 March 2024 (UTC) |
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:::::::And you're most certainly entitled to your belief that listing Paramount+ as an original network in the infobox is somehow against guidelines simply because it has aired fewer episodes than Comedy Central. Claiming that hiding the information in a footnote does not "remove or omit text" is disingenuous at best. ] (]) 17:05, 4 March 2024 (UTC) |
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::::::::That's a straw man, and not what's presented above; your flawed understanding of ] too doesn't constitute an argument. Also, per ], do without the "disingenuous" remark. ] (]) 11:20, 7 March 2024 (UTC) |
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:::::::::{{tq|"The PP specials, even if argued to not be secondary to the main CC episodes, constitute less than 5% of the show's episodes. As such, placing PP in a footnote is best reflective of this as per WP:UNDUE and WP:PROPORTION"}} |
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:::::::::They may well constitute only 5% of the total number of episodes, but that's hardly surprising for a show which was running for over twenty years on a single network before Paramount+ entered the equation. |
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:::::::::On the other hand, there are now six episodes per year airing on Comedy Central and two double length specials per year airing on Paramount+. So since 2021, the specials are accounting for 67% of the show's total annual runtime. Your argument that "the specials are peripheral to the show's standard episodes" doesn't hold water. ] (]) 14:00, 7 March 2024 (UTC) |
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::::::::::As the quote you cited already addresses that argument, restating it amounts to no more than a red herring. As for the specials, they're set at 14; their percentage will only decrease. ] (]) 03:16, 14 March 2024 (UTC) |
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*'''Comment:''' I must state I regard this pagespace disagreement as edit warring, regardless of the pace. If it requires an RFC to settle this disagreement, the sooner the better. Such mainspace edit warring from longtime contributors is unseemly and reflects badly on our best practices. ] (]) 13:07, 29 April 2024 (UTC) |
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::Demanding an RFC is merely part of Barry's disruptive ] here, as the only argument he seemingly has to offer is "no consensus". ] (]) 13:52, 29 April 2024 (UTC) |
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:::You've been attempting to unilaterally make this change multiple times since October 2023 despite being reverted on each occasion by two editors including myself. I've issued a 3RR warning, but can't make a further reversal without breaking the rule myself. Per ], I believe the original text should be reinserted until further discussion has taken place. |
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:::{{tq|the only argument he seemingly has to offer is "no consensus"}} |
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:::As anyone who reads the above discussion will realize, this simply isn't true. As pointed out by {{ping|SanAnMan}}, many shows have broadcast on ] and a quick check reveals that most if not all the listed shows have every original broadcast network in the infobox. Your arguments for removing Paramount+ have been along the lines of "Paramount is not on a par with Comedy Central", that "the specials are peripheral/subsidiary to the show's standard episodes", that listing two networks constitutes "clutter" and that the specials have consisted of fewer episodes than the standard ones. None of these arguments are valid. ] (]) 14:31, 29 April 2024 (UTC) |
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::::The 2023 and 2024 discussions are not one, and the former's finalized, as made clear by the first post of the latter, which the matter in hand is concerning; so don't even try to straw man this. ] (]) 14:55, 29 April 2024 (UTC) |
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:::::To clarify - you're retracting your previous arguments and your sole argument for your change is now that Paramount+ has aired fewer episodes than Comedy Central? ] (]) 15:08, 29 April 2024 (UTC) |
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::::::Sure and no, that's your straw manned version. ] (]) 15:19, 29 April 2024 (UTC) |
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:::::::Is there any reason to be so gnomic? It would obviously be helpful if you clearly summarized your reasoning for hiding Paramount+ in a footnote. ] (]) 16:21, 29 April 2024 (UTC) |
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::::::::Gnomic? When constantly and consistently misconstrued, as in referring to placing text in a footnote as "hiding", then perhaps. All is in the ], and is in no need of any further summarization. ] (]) 16:54, 29 April 2024 (UTC) |
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== Portrayal of Stan Marsh == |
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== Portrayal of Stan Marsh == |
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I believe that the portrayal of Stan Marsh in this article about ] is wrong. Stan Marsh is not portrayed as an "average 4th grade student". After seeing the later videos, you would realize that he actually has a very unique character. In the 8th episode of the 15th season in South Park (Ass Burgers), Stan Marsh develops a different world view seeing everything as literal "shit" and is later diagnosed with Aspergers, his parents get divorced. Even if his life returns to normal at the end of this episode, this definitely does not count Stan as "an average 4th grader". The tenth episode of the eleventh season marks the beginning of the Imaginationland Series, in which Stan Marsh has an important role, as he helps in opening the door to Imaginationland and defeat the terrorists by singing a song (This is not what happens in the life of an "average 4th grade student"). There are many more incidences in South Park which make do not make Stan an "average 4th grade student". I hereby propose that this statement should be removed and changed as it spreads misinformation about the character of Stan.] (]) 16:51, 21 December 2023 (UTC) |
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I believe that the portrayal of Stan Marsh in this article about ] is wrong. Stan Marsh is not portrayed as an "average 4th grade student". After seeing the later videos, you would realize that he actually has a very unique character. In the 8th episode of the 15th season in South Park (Ass Burgers), Stan Marsh develops a different world view seeing everything as literal "shit" and is later diagnosed with Aspergers, his parents get divorced. Even if his life returns to normal at the end of this episode, this definitely does not count Stan as "an average 4th grader". The tenth episode of the eleventh season marks the beginning of the Imaginationland Series, in which Stan Marsh has an important role, as he helps in opening the door to Imaginationland and defeat the terrorists by singing a song (This is not what happens in the life of an "average 4th grade student"). There are many more incidences in South Park which make do not make Stan an "average 4th grade student". I hereby propose that this statement should be removed and changed as it spreads misinformation about the character of Stan.] (]) 16:51, 21 December 2023 (UTC) |
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:{{Yo|Helper who is a human}} - The description of Stan as quoted comes directly from South Park's website and is cited and sourced. If you don't like it, I suggest you contact them and get them to change it. - ] (]) 17:38, 21 December 2023 (UTC) |
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:{{Yo|Helper who is a human}} - The description of Stan as quoted comes directly from South Park's website and is cited and sourced. If you don't like it, I suggest you contact them and get them to change it. - ] (]) 17:38, 21 December 2023 (UTC) |
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::Dude the citated source was literally retrieved in 2010 from Internet Archive. Currently its 2010 and in 13 years character sketches will obviously go through changes. The source that is citated is very outdated and thus unreliable. ] (]) 09:29, 22 December 2023 (UTC) |
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== "]" listed at ] == |
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The redirect <span class="plainlinks"></span> has been listed at ] to determine whether its use and function meets the ]. Readers of this page are welcome to comment on this redirect at '''{{slink|Misplaced Pages:Redirects for discussion/Log/2024 January 25#I'm going down to South Park, gonna have myself a time.}}''' until a consensus is reached. <!-- Template:RFDNote --> <span style="background-color: #FFCFBF; font-variant: small-caps">] <sub>(''']''' / ''']''')</sub></span> 08:19, 25 January 2024 (UTC) |
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== Trey Parker and Matt Stone did an interview with Vanity Fair which revealed South Park won't be returning until 2025 == |
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You can read it for yourself. ] (]) 12:50, 15 September 2024 (UTC) |
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I'll accept not putting it in the lede. However, I do feel it is relevant for the article. The article doesn't have a broadcast section like how the Rick and Morty article does. Trey Parker stated that they were “waiting for Paramount to figure all their shit out.”] (]) 13:02, 15 September 2024 (UTC) |
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:{{Yo|Speakfor23}} The information is already in the article under the "Streaming" subheading. ] (]) 03:12, 16 September 2024 (UTC) |
Syndicated runs of South Park feature the Debmar Studios logo and the Mercury entertainment logos separate (both known as Debmar-Mercury today) in place of the Braniff Television logo. The syndication credits also feature the 20th Television logo. I think it's best to add them to the distribution part of the page.
Simply put, Paramount plus's mention in the lead is more than sufficient, there's no need to include it in the infobox as done with the specials in the episode table template, it's superfluous. QuestFour (talk) 20:58, 15 October 2023 (UTC)
There is absolutely nothing "subsidiary" about the specials. They were part of a new deal signed only a few years ago, and they are episodes that continue upon or add to existing plotlines, and the plots of the specials continue to influence the regular season episodes. The comments about the specials being "subsidiary" and such appear to be biased in your own view. As for the fact that the Episodes table in this article doesn't include the section for the Specials, that is definitely something that needs to be worked on in the List of South Park episodes, but that doesn't deter from the fact that the specials are still episodes, and have no greater or lesser importance than any other episode. - SanAnMan (talk) 14:53, 18 October 2023 (UTC)
The PP specials, even if argued to not be secondary to the main CC episodes, constitute less than 5% of the show's episodes. As such, placing PP in a footnote is best reflective of this as per WP:UNDUE and WP:PROPORTION; with the former stating that undue weight is given through prominence of placement. QuestFour (talk) 06:12, 3 March 2024 (UTC)
I'll accept not putting it in the lede. However, I do feel it is relevant for the article. The article doesn't have a broadcast section like how the Rick and Morty article does. Trey Parker stated that they were “waiting for Paramount to figure all their shit out.”Speakfor23 (talk) 13:02, 15 September 2024 (UTC)