Revision as of 16:41, 7 May 2024 editIroncurtain2 (talk | contribs)393 edits Interview with Tucker Carlson - Ex-CIA Agent Felix Rodriguez on Che Guevara death == Ex-CIA Agent on Capturing Che Guevara, Who Truly Killed JFK, and Election Predictions https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bwohQJrJeo8&ab_channel=TuckerCarlson Che Guevara was executed in 1967 in a remote Bolivian village. One of the last people to speak to him alive was CIA officer Felix Rodriguez (former CIA agent). Here’s his story. Felix Rodriguez worked for the CIA until 1976.← Previous edit | Latest revision as of 03:30, 24 December 2024 edit undoAldrich.Faithful (talk | contribs)5 edits →Che was a mass murderer | ||
(20 intermediate revisions by 14 users not shown) | |||
Line 1: | Line 1: | ||
{{Talk header |
{{Talk header}} | ||
{{WikiProject banner shell|collapsed=yes|class=GA|vital=yes| |
{{WikiProject banner shell|collapsed=yes|class=GA|vital=yes|blp=no|listas=Guevara, Che|1= | ||
{{WikiProject Biography|military-work-group=yes|military-priority=top|politician-work-group=yes|politician-priority=top|core=yes}} | {{WikiProject Biography|military-work-group=yes|military-priority=top|politician-work-group=yes|politician-priority=top|core=yes}} | ||
{{WikiProject Socialism|importance=top}} | {{WikiProject Socialism|importance=top}} | ||
Line 11: | Line 11: | ||
{{WikiProject Atheism|importance=mid}} | {{WikiProject Atheism|importance=mid}} | ||
{{WikiProject Bolivia|importance=mid|Selected=yes}} | {{WikiProject Bolivia|importance=mid|Selected=yes}} | ||
{{WikiProject |
{{WikiProject History|importance=}} | ||
}} | }} | ||
{{Not a forum}} | {{Not a forum}} | ||
Line 78: | Line 78: | ||
|archive = Talk:Che Guevara/Archive %(counter)d | |archive = Talk:Che Guevara/Archive %(counter)d | ||
}} | }} | ||
{{Broken anchors|links= | |||
* <nowiki>]</nowiki> Anchor ] links to a specific web page: ]. The anchor (#Che Guevara) ]. <!-- {"title":"Che Guevara","appear":{"revid":533887122,"parentid":533886813,"timestamp":"2013-01-19T19:23:37Z","removed_section_titles":,"added_section_titles":},"disappear":{"revid":716573772,"parentid":716148560,"timestamp":"2016-04-22T13:47:48Z","removed_section_titles":,"added_section_titles":}} --> | |||
}} | |||
== Views in Argentina == | == Views in Argentina == | ||
Line 92: | Line 90: | ||
::], the editor is unlikely to show up with this particular IP again, as it's not static. That said, it's been pointed out to me that the age of the edit is such that I'm probably causing confusion more than helping (which makes sense); I only noticed today that he'd become active again for a while last year and was clearly overzealous ]. I've reverted my strikethrough. ] (]) 06:25, 22 March 2024 (UTC) | ::], the editor is unlikely to show up with this particular IP again, as it's not static. That said, it's been pointed out to me that the age of the edit is such that I'm probably causing confusion more than helping (which makes sense); I only noticed today that he'd become active again for a while last year and was clearly overzealous ]. I've reverted my strikethrough. ] (]) 06:25, 22 March 2024 (UTC) | ||
:::Okay. --] (]) 06:28, 22 March 2024 (UTC) | :::Okay. --] (]) 06:28, 22 March 2024 (UTC) | ||
== Semi-protected edit request on 10 November 2023 == | |||
{{edit semi-protected|Che Guevara|answered=yes}} | |||
Source 100 doesn't make any sense. Quote is from the point of view of someone rescued by Che Guevara during combat, from Joel Iglesias' diary, his "teenage lieutenant". The quote starts by mentioning that Joel is getting shot at, gets rescued by Che. Che does not get shot because the guards overhear him being referred to as "Che". the part that doesn't make sense is the following: ". Later . . . they told me he made a great impression on them when they saw him run out with his pistol stuck in his belt, ignoring the danger, they didn't dare shoot.", | |||
how and why would he be communicating, so colloquially at that, to the enemy who was just shooting at him? the formatting of the quote makes me very dubious as well, considering it leads the statement with "later...", which tells us that they took out a part of the quote. | |||
Therefore, I am uncertain of the validity of this statement, it is also the only online source of the quote i could find. I would suggest to remove the quote. | |||
hope this finds you well ] (]) 20:03, 10 November 2023 (UTC) | |||
:{{not done}} That's what the source says. You don't have to believe it. ] (]) 23:41, 10 November 2023 (UTC) | |||
== Semi-protected edit request on 17 November 2023 == | |||
{{edit semi-protected|Che Guevara|answered=yes}} | |||
Physician should be removed as he was never a doctor, never practiced medicine, never graduated medical school and his diploma has never been shown ] (]) 16:33, 17 November 2023 (UTC) | |||
:] '''Not done for now:''' please establish a ] for this alteration ''']''' using the {{Tlx|Edit semi-protected}} template.<!-- Template:ESp --> I don't have access to the specific sources that we've cited but per our article it looks like he did complete his degree and practiced briefly in Mexico. Looking through the talk page archives this has been discussed sporadically in the past, and it looks like the consensus have generally been that he was a physician. However, per ] the first sentence should only contain occupations/activities a BLP subject is notable for and completing a medical degree and briefly practicing medicine IMO is certainly not what Guevara is mainly known for and IMO it should not be in the lead sentence. ] (]) 17:54, 17 November 2023 (UTC) | |||
== Che was a mass murderer == | == Che was a mass murderer == | ||
Line 117: | Line 100: | ||
::in Cuba he lined up innocent people against a wall “pared” and executed them without a trial for the public to witness. My Cuban family witnessed these executions and knew people who disappeared. He forced at gunpoint the removal of families from their homes. The only way to enforce socialism is to take away everything the people own by execution and physical violence. No one will willingly give the government their possessions. What I stated are facts. ] (]) 11:51, 25 December 2023 (UTC) | ::in Cuba he lined up innocent people against a wall “pared” and executed them without a trial for the public to witness. My Cuban family witnessed these executions and knew people who disappeared. He forced at gunpoint the removal of families from their homes. The only way to enforce socialism is to take away everything the people own by execution and physical violence. No one will willingly give the government their possessions. What I stated are facts. ] (]) 11:51, 25 December 2023 (UTC) | ||
:::Then it shouldn't be hard for you to provide some reliable sources here. Facts aren't hard to find in reliable sources. ] (]) 12:48, 25 December 2023 (UTC) | :::Then it shouldn't be hard for you to provide some reliable sources here. Facts aren't hard to find in reliable sources. ] (]) 12:48, 25 December 2023 (UTC) | ||
::::Lots of sources exist, but they're very easy for you to ignore. ] (]) 01:23, 5 June 2024 (UTC) | |||
:::::If you have sources, ]. ] (]) 00:46, 9 June 2024 (UTC) | |||
::::::Alvaro Vargas LLosa, ''The Killing Machine; Che Guevara, from Communist Firebrand to Capitalist Brand"'' (Independent Insitiute:July 11, 2005, https://www.independent.org/news/article.asp?id=1535) | |||
::::::Guillermina Stutter Schneider. ''Che Was a Racist, Homophobe, and Mass Murderer'' (Human Progress: December 15, 2017, https://humanprogress.org/the-truth-about-che-guevara-racist-homophobe-and-mass-murderer/) | |||
::::::Troy J. Sacquety, ''Che Guevara: A False Idol for Revolutionaries'' (U.S Army Special Forces Command History Office: 2008, https://arsof-history.org/articles/v4n4_false_idol_page_1.html#fn:2) | |||
::::::These three sources support the idea that Che was ruthless, brutal, and guilty of more than enough human rights violations to earn multiple in-depth paragraphs for this article. | |||
::::::] (]) 03:30, 24 December 2024 (UTC) | |||
== Semantic Error == | == Semantic Error == | ||
Line 138: | Line 131: | ||
] (]) 16:38, 7 May 2024 (UTC) | ] (]) 16:38, 7 May 2024 (UTC) | ||
:That's not a reliable source. ] (]) 16:57, 7 May 2024 (UTC) | |||
::It is his own testimony!!! ] (]) 16:58, 7 May 2024 (UTC) | |||
:::That's not how ] works. ] (]) 16:59, 7 May 2024 (UTC) | |||
::::Edit conflict, "please provide the acronym that supports your logic". LOL. ] (]) 17:01, 7 May 2024 (UTC) | |||
::::Specifically see points 1 and 2: | |||
::::{{tq|1. The material is neither unduly self-serving nor an exceptional claim 2. It does not involve claims about third parties;}} ] (]) 17:01, 7 May 2024 (UTC) | |||
::::::Wow, you know how to make pretty colored text. I am impressed. LOL. Thanks for making my day, ] LOL. ] (]) 17:02, 7 May 2024 (UTC) | |||
;South Park: Officer Barbrady - There's nothing to see here. | |||
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LW6RWSiR88s&ab_channel=MiamiBadBoyBOSS | |||
] (]) 18:37, 7 May 2024 (UTC) | |||
== Lies & propaganda surrounding Che. == | |||
https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/che-guevara-executing-women/ | |||
Example number 1: The link listed above where the accusation of him “Killing 2 woman” came out including him being accused of being a mass murderer (which is false, the people executed weren't innocent and were those working with Batista, war criminals etc. | |||
Example number 2: The accusation that he was responsible for the UMAP camps/Imprisonment of homosexuals. | |||
in 1965 Che resigned his position as minister of industries and went to the Congo. He wasn't in Cuba during the operations of the camps and nor was he involved, Castro later took accountability for these camps stating how he failed the LGBT community in Cuba. ] (]) 16:40, 9 November 2024 (UTC) |
Latest revision as of 03:30, 24 December 2024
This is the talk page for discussing improvements to the Che Guevara article. This is not a forum for general discussion of the article's subject. |
|
Find sources: Google (books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL |
Archives: Index, 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22Auto-archiving period: 2 months |
This level-4 vital article is rated GA-class on Misplaced Pages's content assessment scale. It is of interest to multiple WikiProjects. | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
|
This page is not a forum for general discussion about Che Guevara. Any such comments may be removed or refactored. Please limit discussion to improvement of this article. You may wish to ask factual questions about Che Guevara at the Reference desk. |
Che Guevara is a former featured article. Please see the links under Article milestones below for its original nomination page (for older articles, check the nomination archive) and why it was removed. | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Che Guevara has been listed as one of the Social sciences and society good articles under the good article criteria. If you can improve it further, please do so. If it no longer meets these criteria, you can reassess it. | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
This article appeared on Misplaced Pages's Main Page as Today's featured article on June 18, 2006. | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
|
Views in Argentina
I travelled extensively in Argentina and the views on Guevara were unanimous; he is rarely mentioned there and is certainly not a source of pride. Many I met described him as a "psychopath" who enjoyed killing people. He apparently told his father that he "enjoyed the smell of cordite and blood" after he had shot someone through the head. Not sure if this is worth extra exploration. 86.153.86.158 (talk) 17:03, 7 September 2023 (UTC)
- It definitely isn't, I for one know plenty of Argentinians that are in awe of Guevara. Hearsay is not worth being mentioned on Misplaced Pages. 2A02:1811:C1F:8200:3564:4278:E78B:F860 (talk) 12:45, 22 October 2023 (UTC)
- Che was a psychopath who enjoyed killing people. He was also a homophobic and racist who hated black people. This is not hearsay. He publicly executed innocent Cubans by gunshot in front of many witnesses as a warning to anyone who tried to oppose their new government. Hectorgavilla (talk) 11:55, 25 December 2023 (UTC)
Striking out material from block evader. Grandpallama (talk) 00:23, 22 March 2024 (UTC)
- @Grandpallama: Although I agree that the heresay is irrelevant to our article, I looked at the IP and saw no evidence of block evasion. Is there a link that shows it? If so, it would be helpful if that is mentioned on the IP's talk page in case that editor continues making edits. --David Tornheim (talk) 00:39, 22 March 2024 (UTC)
- David Tornheim, the editor is unlikely to show up with this particular IP again, as it's not static. That said, it's been pointed out to me that the age of the edit is such that I'm probably causing confusion more than helping (which makes sense); I only noticed today that he'd become active again for a while last year and was clearly overzealous in wanting to scrub his unproductive contributions. I've reverted my strikethrough. Grandpallama (talk) 06:25, 22 March 2024 (UTC)
- Okay. --David Tornheim (talk) 06:28, 22 March 2024 (UTC)
- David Tornheim, the editor is unlikely to show up with this particular IP again, as it's not static. That said, it's been pointed out to me that the age of the edit is such that I'm probably causing confusion more than helping (which makes sense); I only noticed today that he'd become active again for a while last year and was clearly overzealous in wanting to scrub his unproductive contributions. I've reverted my strikethrough. Grandpallama (talk) 06:25, 22 March 2024 (UTC)
Che was a mass murderer
Please add that Che Guevara was a mass murderer in the first sentence of this article. He should be put in the same category as Hitler. the sentence should read as follows:
was an Argentine Marxist Mass Murderer, physician, author, guerrilla leader, diplomat, and military theorist. Hectorgavilla (talk) 04:00, 19 December 2023 (UTC)
- When was he convicted of being a mass murderer? HiLo48 (talk) 05:39, 19 December 2023 (UTC)
- in Cuba he lined up innocent people against a wall “pared” and executed them without a trial for the public to witness. My Cuban family witnessed these executions and knew people who disappeared. He forced at gunpoint the removal of families from their homes. The only way to enforce socialism is to take away everything the people own by execution and physical violence. No one will willingly give the government their possessions. What I stated are facts. Hectorgavilla (talk) 11:51, 25 December 2023 (UTC)
- Then it shouldn't be hard for you to provide some reliable sources here. Facts aren't hard to find in reliable sources. StephenMacky1 (talk) 12:48, 25 December 2023 (UTC)
- Lots of sources exist, but they're very easy for you to ignore. 73.100.184.209 (talk) 01:23, 5 June 2024 (UTC)
- If you have sources, WP:PROVEIT. Flounder fillet (talk) 00:46, 9 June 2024 (UTC)
- Alvaro Vargas LLosa, The Killing Machine; Che Guevara, from Communist Firebrand to Capitalist Brand" (Independent Insitiute:July 11, 2005, https://www.independent.org/news/article.asp?id=1535)
- If you have sources, WP:PROVEIT. Flounder fillet (talk) 00:46, 9 June 2024 (UTC)
- Lots of sources exist, but they're very easy for you to ignore. 73.100.184.209 (talk) 01:23, 5 June 2024 (UTC)
- Then it shouldn't be hard for you to provide some reliable sources here. Facts aren't hard to find in reliable sources. StephenMacky1 (talk) 12:48, 25 December 2023 (UTC)
- in Cuba he lined up innocent people against a wall “pared” and executed them without a trial for the public to witness. My Cuban family witnessed these executions and knew people who disappeared. He forced at gunpoint the removal of families from their homes. The only way to enforce socialism is to take away everything the people own by execution and physical violence. No one will willingly give the government their possessions. What I stated are facts. Hectorgavilla (talk) 11:51, 25 December 2023 (UTC)
- Guillermina Stutter Schneider. Che Was a Racist, Homophobe, and Mass Murderer (Human Progress: December 15, 2017, https://humanprogress.org/the-truth-about-che-guevara-racist-homophobe-and-mass-murderer/)
- Troy J. Sacquety, Che Guevara: A False Idol for Revolutionaries (U.S Army Special Forces Command History Office: 2008, https://arsof-history.org/articles/v4n4_false_idol_page_1.html#fn:2)
- These three sources support the idea that Che was ruthless, brutal, and guilty of more than enough human rights violations to earn multiple in-depth paragraphs for this article.
- Aldrich.Faithful (talk) 03:30, 24 December 2024 (UTC)
Semantic Error
Cite error: There are <ref>
tags on this page without content in them (see the help page).
This edit request has been answered. Set the |answered= or |ans= parameter to no to reactivate your request. |
Please change "Cause of death Execution by shooting" to "Cause of death Elimination by shooting"
Che Guevara's capture and immediate execution without a legal trial would be more accurately described as an extrajudicial killing which is considered a form of murder. This differs from a lawful execution which typically involves a formal trial. Thirdfemalelead (talk) 05:31, 26 January 2024 (UTC)
- Done I replaced it with extrajudicial killing (per what's covered in the article's body). M.Bitton (talk) 15:17, 26 January 2024 (UTC)
- Can you also take care of the "Battles/wars" section, where he was labeled to be executed after a conviction. LackOfInspiration1 (talk) 10:21, 17 April 2024 (UTC)
Interview with Tucker Carlson - Ex-CIA Agent Felix Rodriguez on Che Guevara death
Ex-CIA Agent on Capturing Che Guevara, Who Truly Killed JFK, and Election Predictions
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bwohQJrJeo8&ab_channel=TuckerCarlson
Che Guevara was executed in 1967 in a remote Bolivian village. One of the last people to speak to him alive was CIA officer Felix Rodriguez (former CIA agent). Here’s his story.
Felix Rodriguez worked for the CIA until 1976.
Ironcurtain2 (talk) 16:38, 7 May 2024 (UTC)
- That's not a reliable source. Simonm223 (talk) 16:57, 7 May 2024 (UTC)
- It is his own testimony!!! Ironcurtain2 (talk) 16:58, 7 May 2024 (UTC)
- That's not how WP:ABOUTSELF works. Simonm223 (talk) 16:59, 7 May 2024 (UTC)
- Edit conflict, "please provide the acronym that supports your logic". LOL. Ironcurtain2 (talk) 17:01, 7 May 2024 (UTC)
- Specifically see points 1 and 2:
1. The material is neither unduly self-serving nor an exceptional claim 2. It does not involve claims about third parties;
Simonm223 (talk) 17:01, 7 May 2024 (UTC)- Wow, you know how to make pretty colored text. I am impressed. LOL. Thanks for making my day, User:Simonm223 LOL. Ironcurtain2 (talk) 17:02, 7 May 2024 (UTC)
- That's not how WP:ABOUTSELF works. Simonm223 (talk) 16:59, 7 May 2024 (UTC)
- It is his own testimony!!! Ironcurtain2 (talk) 16:58, 7 May 2024 (UTC)
- South Park
- Officer Barbrady - There's nothing to see here.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LW6RWSiR88s&ab_channel=MiamiBadBoyBOSS
Ironcurtain2 (talk) 18:37, 7 May 2024 (UTC)
Lies & propaganda surrounding Che.
https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/che-guevara-executing-women/
Example number 1: The link listed above where the accusation of him “Killing 2 woman” came out including him being accused of being a mass murderer (which is false, the people executed weren't innocent and were those working with Batista, war criminals etc.
Example number 2: The accusation that he was responsible for the UMAP camps/Imprisonment of homosexuals. in 1965 Che resigned his position as minister of industries and went to the Congo. He wasn't in Cuba during the operations of the camps and nor was he involved, Castro later took accountability for these camps stating how he failed the LGBT community in Cuba. Sproogli (talk) 16:40, 9 November 2024 (UTC)
Categories:- GA-Class level-4 vital articles
- Misplaced Pages level-4 vital articles in People
- GA-Class vital articles in People
- GA-Class biography articles
- GA-Class biography (military) articles
- Top-importance biography (military) articles
- Military biography work group articles
- GA-Class biography (politics and government) articles
- Top-importance biography (politics and government) articles
- Politics and government work group articles
- GA-Class biography (core) articles
- Core biography articles
- Top-importance biography articles
- WikiProject Biography articles
- GA-Class socialism articles
- Top-importance socialism articles
- WikiProject Socialism articles
- GA-Class military history articles
- GA-Class South American military history articles
- South American military history task force articles
- GA-Class Cold War articles
- Cold War task force articles
- GA-Class Argentine articles
- Top-importance Argentine articles
- WikiProject Argentina articles
- GA-Class Cuba articles
- Top-importance Cuba articles
- WikiProject Cuba articles
- GA-Class Caribbean articles
- High-importance Caribbean articles
- WikiProject Caribbean articles
- GA-Class Basque articles
- Unknown-importance Basque articles
- All WikiProject Basque pages
- GA-Class politics articles
- Mid-importance politics articles
- WikiProject Politics articles
- GA-Class Atheism articles
- Mid-importance Atheism articles
- GA-Class Bolivia articles
- Mid-importance Bolivia articles
- Selected articles on the Bolivia Portal
- GA-Class history articles
- Unknown-importance history articles
- WikiProject History articles
- Misplaced Pages former featured articles
- Misplaced Pages good articles
- Social sciences and society good articles
- Featured articles that have appeared on the main page
- Featured articles that have appeared on the main page once
- Old requests for peer review