Misplaced Pages:Third opinion: Difference between revisions

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Revision as of 16:25, 6 August 2007 editAnomie (talk \| contribs)Edit filter managers, Autopatrolled, Administrators33,898 edits →Active disagreements: Giving opinion on Talk:Meme#Deletion of Uncited Material; one left← Previous edit		Latest revision as of 18:09, 26 December 2024 edit undoDoniago (talk \| contribs)Extended confirmed users, Pending changes reviewers, Rollbackers113,273 edits →Active disagreements: rm one; no thorough discussion at this time; list is clear
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			<noinclude>{{Short description\|Informal dispute resolution process}}
	{\| class="messagebox"
			{{redirect\|WP:3}}</noinclude>
	\|-
			{{ombox
	\|
			\| text = '''The third opinion process is neither mandatory nor binding.''' This is a voluntary, nonbinding, informal process, enabling two editors involved in a current dispute to seek advice from an uninvolved third party.
	\| ]
			\| imageright = {{ombox/shortcut\|WP:3O\|WP:THIRD}}
	\| '''This page is not an official policy or a guideline. It is a non-binding informal process by which editors interested in lending a hand on content disputes can meet those that need such help, and those that seek that help can advertise their need for assistance.'''
			}}
	\| {{Shortcut\|WP:3O\|WP:30\|WP:THIRD\|WP:RF3O}}
	\|}
	{{dispute-resolution}}		{{dispute-resolution}}

			'''Third opinion''' ('''3O''') is a means to request an outside opinion in a content or sourcing disagreement between two editors. When two editors do not agree, either editor may list a discussion here to seek a third opinion. The third opinion process requires observance of ] and ] from both editors during the discussion in order to be successful.

			The less formal nature of the third opinion process is a major advantage over other methods of resolving disputes. For more complex disputes that involve more than two editors, or that cannot be resolved through talk page discussion, editors should follow the other steps in the ] process such as the ] or ].
	'''Misplaced Pages:Third opinion''' is a suggestion for the use of third-party mediators in a dispute. When editors cannot reach a compromise and need a third opinion, they may list a dispute here. The third-opinion process requires ] on both sides of the dispute.

			== How to list a dispute ==
	This page is primarily for informally resolving disputes involving only two editors. More complex disputes should be worked out on article talk pages or by following the dispute resolution process.

			Before making a request here, be sure that the issue has been '''thoroughly discussed''' on the article talk page. 3O is only for assistance in resolving disagreements that have come to a standstill. If no agreement can be reached on the talk page and '''only two editors''' are involved, follow the directions below to list the dispute. Otherwise, please follow other methods in the ] process such as the ] or ]. 3O is usually flexible by allowing a few exceptions, like those involving mainly two editors with an extra editor having minimal participation. Further guidance is available in ].
	==Listing a dispute==
	Please discuss the dispute on the talk page ''before'' coming here.
	#If, after discussion, '''only two editors''' are involved, you may list the dispute here. Otherwise, follow other parts of the dispute resolution process.
	#Provide a '''short, neutral description''' of the disagreement, with links to the specific section of the talk page where it is discussed.
	#Sign with five tildes ("<nowiki>~~~~~</nowiki>") to add the date '''without your name'''.

			It is recommended that the <u>filing editor notify the second editor about the post here</u>. If the second editor disagrees with this process, the first editor still has the right to receive a third opinion; however, since this is non-binding, the second editor is free to ignore the third opinion if they wish to.
	* '''Do not discuss on this page.''' Leave the discussion to the linked talk page.
	* Listings that do not follow the above instructions may be removed.

			In cases involving long discussions or topics requiring prior technical knowledge, <u>editors are requested to present a short summary of the dispute</u>, in ] and preferably in a new subsection below the main discussion, so that 3O volunteers may find it easier to respond to.
	{{clear}}
	<blockquote style="border: 1px solid green; padding: 2em;">
	;→ <u>Example</u>

			Some disputes may involve editor conduct issues as well as issues regarding article content. In such cases, the third opinion request should be framed in terms of content issues, even if the conduct of an editor is also at issue. For disputes that are ''exclusively'' about an editor's conduct and are not related to a content issue, other forums may be more appropriate such as the ]. If in doubt, post your request here at third opinion and a neutral editor will help out.
	"]: Disagreement about existence of nonprescriptive ]s. 12:34, 5 June 2006 (UTC)"
	</blockquote>

			=== Instructions ===
	==Providing third opinions==
	*Provide third opinions on the disputed article talk pages, not on this page. Sign your comments on the associated talk page as normal, with four ''tildes'', like so: <nowiki>~~~~.</nowiki>

			'''No discussion of the issue should take place here'''—this page is only for listing the dispute. Please confine discussion to the talk page where the dispute is taking place.
	*Read the arguments of the disputants.

			Follow these instructions to make your post:
	*Do not provide third opinions recklessly. In some cases your opinion is a tie-breaker, while in others both sides may have presented valid arguments, or you may disagree with both.
			* Edit the following "Active disagreements" section on this page to begin a new entry in the section. Your entry should be at the end of the list if there are other entries, and the first character should be a ''']''' symbol to create a numbered list. This preserves the numbering and chronological order of the list.
			* Your entry should contain the following:
			** a ''']''' to a section on the article's talk page dedicated to the 3O discussion.
			** a brief neutral description of the dispute—'''no more than a line or two'''—without trying to argue for or against either side. Take care (as much as possible) to make it seem as though the request is being added by both participants.
			** a '''date, but no signature'''. You can add the date without your name by using '''five tildes''' (<nowiki>~~~~~</nowiki>). (Note: your name will still be shown in your contributions and the page edit history.)
			* Be sure to provide a notification of your request on the page where the dispute is occurring.

			Requests are subject to being removed from the list if no volunteer chooses to provide an opinion within six days after they are listed below. If your dispute is removed for that reason (check the {{History\|Misplaced Pages:Third opinion\|history}} to see the reason), please feel free to re-list your dispute if you still would like to obtain an opinion—indicate that it's been re-listed in your entry. If removed a second time due to no volunteer giving an opinion, please do not relist again.
	*Write your opinion in a ] way.

			If you are a party to a dispute and another party has requested an opinion it is improper for you to remove or modify the request, even if the request does not meet the requirements for a third opinion or because you do not want a Third Opinion. If you feel that the request does not meet the requirements for a third opinion and should be removed, post a request on the Third Opinion talk page to be evaluated by an uninvolved volunteer.
	*Third opinions must be ]. If you have previously had dealings with the article or with the editors involved in the dispute which would bias your response, do not offer a third opinion on that dispute.

			== Active disagreements ==
	*Consider keeping pages on which you have given a third opinion on your ] for a few days. Often, articles listed here are watched by very few people.
			{{ombox\|text='''After reading the above instructions, <span class="plainlinks"></span> to this section, below this message.''' '''If you provide a third opinion, please remove the entry from this list.''' ''Example entry'':<br><nowiki># ]</nowiki>. Disagreement about relevance of section and sources. 12:23, 13 June 2024 (UTC)}}<onlyinclude>{{#ifeq:{{{transcludesection\|Active disagreements}}}\|Active disagreements\|{{expand wikitext\|{{#invoke:String\|replace\|
			<!-- ALL CURRENT REQUESTS MUST BE PLACED BELOW THIS LINE. ADD YOURS BELOW ANY OTHER REQUESTS THAT ARE OPEN. -->

	*When providing a third opinion, remove the listing from this page and mention in the summary which dispute you have removed and how many remain.

			<!-- ALL CURRENT REQUESTS MUST BE PLACED ABOVE THIS LINE.
	===Third opinion project===

	*The informal nature of the third opinion process is its chief advantage over more formal methods of resolving disputes. If you are a third opinion provider, you are part of the project and are encouraged to add the ] (with or without the {{tl\|User Third opinion}} userbox, as you prefer) to your userpage.
			THERE MAY BE SEVERAL OR NONE. ADD YOURS BELOW ANY OTHERS.

			CAREFUL—DO NOT ALTER (OR REMOVE) ''THESE'' FOUR LINES!!! -->

			\|%%]\|{{format linkr{{!}}%1}}\|plain=false}}}}}}</onlyinclude> <!-- DO NOT EDIT THIS LINE ---->

	==~~Active~~ ~~disagreements~~==		== Feedback ==
			Respondents appreciate feedback about the outcome of the dispute, either on the article's talk page or on their own talk page. We want to know whether the outcome was positive or not, helping us to maintain and improve the standards of our work. If a respondent's third opinion was especially helpful or wise, you might want to consider awarding {{mono\|<nowiki>{{subst:The Third Opinion Award\|your message}}</nowiki>}} on their user talk page. It can also be given once for diligent service to this project which is generally any volunteer who has more than 50 edits to this page. For more information see ] and ].
	<div style="border: 1px solid green; padding: 1em; margin: 1em;">'''Reminders:'''
	*Your description must be neutral — see Example above.
	*Link to the correct talk page discussion '''section.''' (You may wish to pipe the link to keep it short).
	*Do not enter into discussion here.
	*Sign with '''five''' tildes <nowiki>~~~~~</nowiki> for timestamp only.
	*Use an accurate edit summary.</div>
	<!-- ADD NEW ENTRIES BELOW THIS LINE, AT THE BOTTOM OF THE LIST. SIGN WITH FIVE TILDES FOR TIMESTAMP ONLY. USE THE HASH KEY (NUMBER SIGN) TO PROVIDE A NUMBERED LIST. -->

			== Providing third opinions ==
	#] A single paragrapgh was deleted. Some think it should be restored 14:57, 5 August 2007 (UTC)
			{{anchor\|Remove answered entry and summarize on how many are left}}
			When providing a third opinion, please ''remove the listing from this page'' before you provide your third opinion. Doing so prevents other volunteers from duplicating your effort. Please mention in the ] ''how many disputes remain.'' Example of summary message: {{code\|5 items remain on the list}}

			* Third opinions must be ]. If you have had dealings with the article or with the editors involved in the dispute that would bias your response, do not offer a third opinion on that dispute.
	]
			* Read the arguments of the disputants.
			* Do not provide opinions recklessly. Remember that Misplaced Pages works by ], not a ]. In some cases both sides may have presented valid arguments, or you may disagree with both. Provide the reasoning behind your argument.
			* Provide third opinions in the relevant section of the disputed article talk pages following the discussion of the dispute. Sign your comments with four tildes, like so: <nowiki>~~~~.</nowiki>
			* Write your opinion in a ] way.
			* Unless there's a clearly urgent problem, don't make immediate article-content changes of your own which affect the ongoing discussion.
			* Consider keeping pages on which you have given a third opinion on your ] for a few days. Often, articles listed here are watched by very few people.
			* If it's not clear what the dispute is, put {{tls\|third opinion\|your_username}} on the talk page of the article. This template will post sections for the disputing editors to summarize their opinions.
			* For third opinion requests that do not follow the instructions above, it is possible to alert the requesting party to that fact by employing {{tl\|uw-3o}}.

			=== Use template ===
			* The {{tl\|3OR}} template is handy for providing a third opinion on the talk page. For a shorter alternative, {{tl\|3ORshort}} can also be used. Usage (either):
			{{tls\|3OR \| <your response> }}
			{{tls\|3ORshort \| <your response> }}

			== Declining requests ==

			If you remove a dispute from the list for any reason, it is good practice to also leave a message on the dispute talk page explaining what you have done. The message should have the following characteristics:
			* It should be civil and assume the request was made in good faith.
			* It should explain why the request was declined (e.g. "There are too many people involved already.")
			* It should suggest alternatives (e.g. "Perhaps you should try ], the ], the talk page of a ] or one of the other ] options.")

			==Volunteers==
			'''Active contributors''' who watchlist the page, review disputes, and update the list of active disagreements with informative edit summaries, are welcome to add themselves to the ]. If you support this project you may wish to add the {{tl\|User Third opinion}} userbox to your user page, which automatically adds you to this category.

			Adding {{t\|Third opinion}} to your dashboard or userpage will produce or transclude only the active disagreements for viewing. Sample code with additional links:
			{{mono\|<nowiki>Third opinion disputes {{Misplaced Pages:Third Opinion}}<small>, {{purge}}</small></nowiki>}}


			{{Misplaced Pages community}}
	]		]

			]

Latest revision as of 18:09, 26 December 2024

Informal dispute resolution process "WP:3" redirects here. For other uses, see WP:3 (disambiguation).

The third opinion process is neither mandatory nor binding. This is a voluntary, nonbinding, informal process, enabling two editors involved in a current dispute to seek advice from an uninvolved third party.

Shortcuts

Dispute resolution (Requests)
Tips
Assume good faith Use etiquette Be civil Be open to compromise Discuss on talk pages Failure to discuss Help desk (Request)
Content disputes
Third opinion (Request) Mediation Noticeboards Request comments (Request) Resolution noticeboard (Request)
Conduct disputes
Administrator assistance (Request) Arbitration (Request)
v t e

Third opinion (3O) is a means to request an outside opinion in a content or sourcing disagreement between two editors. When two editors do not agree, either editor may list a discussion here to seek a third opinion. The third opinion process requires observance of good faith and civility from both editors during the discussion in order to be successful.

The less formal nature of the third opinion process is a major advantage over other methods of resolving disputes. For more complex disputes that involve more than two editors, or that cannot be resolved through talk page discussion, editors should follow the other steps in the dispute resolution process such as the dispute resolution noticeboard or request for comment.

How to list a dispute

Before making a request here, be sure that the issue has been thoroughly discussed on the article talk page. 3O is only for assistance in resolving disagreements that have come to a standstill. If no agreement can be reached on the talk page and only two editors are involved, follow the directions below to list the dispute. Otherwise, please follow other methods in the dispute resolution process such as the dispute resolution noticeboard or request for comment. 3O is usually flexible by allowing a few exceptions, like those involving mainly two editors with an extra editor having minimal participation. Further guidance is available in Third Opinion frequently asked questions.

It is recommended that the filing editor notify the second editor about the post here. If the second editor disagrees with this process, the first editor still has the right to receive a third opinion; however, since this is non-binding, the second editor is free to ignore the third opinion if they wish to.

In cases involving long discussions or topics requiring prior technical knowledge, editors are requested to present a short summary of the dispute, in plain English and preferably in a new subsection below the main discussion, so that 3O volunteers may find it easier to respond to.

Some disputes may involve editor conduct issues as well as issues regarding article content. In such cases, the third opinion request should be framed in terms of content issues, even if the conduct of an editor is also at issue. For disputes that are exclusively about an editor's conduct and are not related to a content issue, other forums may be more appropriate such as the administrators noticeboard. If in doubt, post your request here at third opinion and a neutral editor will help out.

Instructions

No discussion of the issue should take place here—this page is only for listing the dispute. Please confine discussion to the talk page where the dispute is taking place.

Follow these instructions to make your post:

Edit the following "Active disagreements" section on this page to begin a new entry in the section. Your entry should be at the end of the list if there are other entries, and the first character should be a # symbol to create a numbered list. This preserves the numbering and chronological order of the list.
Your entry should contain the following:
- a section link to a section on the article's talk page dedicated to the 3O discussion.
- a brief neutral description of the dispute—no more than a line or two—without trying to argue for or against either side. Take care (as much as possible) to make it seem as though the request is being added by both participants.
- a date, but no signature. You can add the date without your name by using five tildes (~~~~~). (Note: your name will still be shown in your contributions and the page edit history.)
Be sure to provide a notification of your request on the page where the dispute is occurring.

Requests are subject to being removed from the list if no volunteer chooses to provide an opinion within six days after they are listed below. If your dispute is removed for that reason (check the history to see the reason), please feel free to re-list your dispute if you still would like to obtain an opinion—indicate that it's been re-listed in your entry. If removed a second time due to no volunteer giving an opinion, please do not relist again.

If you are a party to a dispute and another party has requested an opinion it is improper for you to remove or modify the request, even if the request does not meet the requirements for a third opinion or because you do not want a Third Opinion. If you feel that the request does not meet the requirements for a third opinion and should be removed, post a request on the Third Opinion talk page to be evaluated by an uninvolved volunteer.

Active disagreements

After reading the above instructions, add your dispute to this section, below this message. If you provide a third opinion, please remove the entry from this list. Example entry:
# ]. Disagreement about relevance of section and sources. 12:23, 13 June 2024 (UTC)

Feedback

Respondents appreciate feedback about the outcome of the dispute, either on the article's talk page or on their own talk page. We want to know whether the outcome was positive or not, helping us to maintain and improve the standards of our work. If a respondent's third opinion was especially helpful or wise, you might want to consider awarding {{subst:The Third Opinion Award|your message}} on their user talk page. It can also be given once for diligent service to this project which is generally any volunteer who has more than 50 edits to this page. For more information see its documentation and Misplaced Pages:Third opinion/Service award log.

Providing third opinions

When providing a third opinion, please remove the listing from this page before you provide your third opinion. Doing so prevents other volunteers from duplicating your effort. Please mention in the edit summary how many disputes remain. Example of summary message: 5 items remain on the list

Third opinions must be neutral. If you have had dealings with the article or with the editors involved in the dispute that would bias your response, do not offer a third opinion on that dispute.
Read the arguments of the disputants.
Do not provide opinions recklessly. Remember that Misplaced Pages works by consensus, not a vote. In some cases both sides may have presented valid arguments, or you may disagree with both. Provide the reasoning behind your argument.
Provide third opinions in the relevant section of the disputed article talk pages following the discussion of the dispute. Sign your comments with four tildes, like so: ~~~~.
Write your opinion in a civil and nonjudgmental way.
Unless there's a clearly urgent problem, don't make immediate article-content changes of your own which affect the ongoing discussion.
Consider keeping pages on which you have given a third opinion on your watchlist for a few days. Often, articles listed here are watched by very few people.
If it's not clear what the dispute is, put {{subst:third opinion|your_username}} on the talk page of the article. This template will post sections for the disputing editors to summarize their opinions.
For third opinion requests that do not follow the instructions above, it is possible to alert the requesting party to that fact by employing {{uw-3o}}.

Use template

The {{3OR}} template is handy for providing a third opinion on the talk page. For a shorter alternative, {{3ORshort}} can also be used. Usage (either):

{{subst:3OR|<your response>}}
{{subst:3ORshort|<your response>}}

Declining requests

If you remove a dispute from the list for any reason, it is good practice to also leave a message on the dispute talk page explaining what you have done. The message should have the following characteristics:

It should be civil and assume the request was made in good faith.
It should explain why the request was declined (e.g. "There are too many people involved already.")
It should suggest alternatives (e.g. "Perhaps you should try WP:Requests for Comment, the dispute resolution noticeboard, the talk page of a Wikiproject or one of the other WP:Dispute resolution options.")

Volunteers

Active contributors who watchlist the page, review disputes, and update the list of active disagreements with informative edit summaries, are welcome to add themselves to the Category:Wikipedians willing to provide third opinions. If you support this project you may wish to add the {{User Third opinion}} userbox to your user page, which automatically adds you to this category.

Adding {{Third opinion}} to your dashboard or userpage will produce or transclude only the active disagreements for viewing. Sample code with additional links:

Third opinion disputes {{Misplaced Pages:Third Opinion}}<small>, {{purge}}</small>

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