Misplaced Pages

Talk:Cuisine of New England: Difference between revisions

Article snapshot taken from Wikipedia with creative commons attribution-sharealike license. Give it a read and then ask your questions in the chat. We can research this topic together.
Browse history interactively← Previous editContent deleted Content addedVisualWikitext
Revision as of 17:58, 31 May 2005 editIke9898 (talk | contribs)Autopatrolled, Administrators11,737 edits old bay← Previous edit Latest revision as of 07:47, 13 February 2024 edit undoCewbot (talk | contribs)Bots7,334,892 editsm Maintain {{WPBS}}: 4 WikiProject templates. Keep majority rating "Start" in {{WPBS}}. Remove 4 same ratings as {{WPBS}} in {{WikiProject Food and drink}}, {{WikiProject United States}}, {{WikiProject Connecticut}}, {{WikiProject Maine}}.Tag: Talk banner shell conversion 
(41 intermediate revisions by 28 users not shown)
Line 1: Line 1:
{{Talk header}}
{{WikiProject banner shell|class=Start|1=
{{WikiProject Food and drink|importance=Low}}
{{WikiProject United States|importance=Low|RI=yes|RI-importance=Mid|VT=yes|VT-importance=Mid|NH=yes|NH-importance=Mid|MA=yes|MA-importance=Mid}}
{{WikiProject Connecticut|importance=Mid}}
{{WikiProject Maine|importance=Mid}}
}}
{{Broken anchors|links=
* <nowiki>]</nowiki> The anchor (Origins) ]. <!-- {"title":"Origins","appear":{"revid":794528947,"parentid":794528088,"timestamp":"2017-08-08T16:06:59Z","removed_section_titles":,"added_section_titles":},"disappear":{"revid":1125706765,"parentid":1125526967,"timestamp":"2022-12-05T11:59:10Z","removed_section_titles":,"added_section_titles":}} -->
}}

== Old Bay ==
Please try to fit in a mention of ]. On the west coast of the US, we've never heard of this stuff. I was surprised when the Northeast, and ordering french fries, to be asked, "you want regular or old bay"? ] 17:58, May 31, 2005 (UTC) Please try to fit in a mention of ]. On the west coast of the US, we've never heard of this stuff. I was surprised when the Northeast, and ordering french fries, to be asked, "you want regular or old bay"? ] 17:58, May 31, 2005 (UTC)

:Old Bay Seasoning is really used in and around the Chesapeake Bay, especially for seasoning steamed crabs and vegetables, in fine restaurants and also at home. Old Bay is also known for its excellent crab, tuna and salmon cake mixes. Only in recent years have Old Bay seasonings become popular in New England.
:Each region of the United States which has seafood as part of everyday life uses different seasonings. In New Orleans, for example, Zatairains, a food company native to New Orleans, is the primary commercially-available seafood seasoning, particularly its seafood boil seasonings and packaged seasonings (mixes) for crab, tuna and salmon cake mixes. A major flavoring ingredient, which New Orleanians call, "seasoning" and is found in the Zatairains seafood mixes, is clam juice. <!-- Template:Unsigned IP --><small class="autosigned">—&nbsp;Preceding ] comment added by ] (]) 01:04, 25 November 2005 (UTC)</small>

::While I love me some Old Bay, it is not typical of New England. As the ] for the stuff makes clear, it is produced in ] and is most associated with that area, in particular it's use on boiled ]. So, although it's great stuff, it's not really appropriate to be listed in this article on New England. -- ] (]) 21:33, 18 December 2008 (UTC)

==Moxie==
Much as I love Farmington, Moxie has nothing to do with the town. It was originally created in Lowell, Mass (as a patent medicine) but it has gained much more fame from Lisbon Falls' Moxiefest. Due to that, I'm not sure which location to use. ~ ] 02:23, 26 February 2007 (UTC)

==New England boiled dinner==
If I trust the ] wiki article, then this dish is not of Irish heritage, and New England boiled dinner, to my personal and referenced knowledge, is much more than corned beef and cabbage. --] 12:01, 2 April 2007 (UTC)

:There's also corned beef and dandelion greens...--] 16:26, 25 August 2007 (UTC)

::There's also New England Boiled dinner made with ham instead of corned beef. ] (]) 03:04, 30 March 2008 (UTC)

== I take issue with this Article ==
CT's cuisine is not a "New England" cusine, it is a CT thing influenced by near-by NYC. I wish you Boston propagandists would stop trying to make up something that does not exist. Is New Haven pizza really a New England thing or a NYC immigrant thing? Think before assuming. I keep telling you people that CT is NOT New England styled, we are NYC styled.--] 22:54, 31 May 2007 (UTC)

:I think you meant to say "New Jersey is New York styled." Connecticut is a New England state. The 6 New England states are Connecticut, Rhode Island, Massachussetts, Vermont, New Hampshire, and Maine. see ] <!-- Template:Unsigned IP --><small class="autosigned">—&nbsp;Preceding ] comment added by ] (]) 03:53, 15 August 2007 (UTC)</small>

::As an Italian from the New Haven area who worked in a New Haven-style pizza restaurant for years and is well familiar with New York-style pizza, I think I can say pretty definitively that the top post is wrong. New Haven-style pizza is its own thing. It originated from immigrants who settled in Connecticut directly after leaving Italy. They didn't just jump the border into Connecticut from New York, and quite a few of the restaurant owners are very recent immigrants from Naples, Italy, who make their pizza based on how they made it back home. <!-- Template:Unsigned IP --><small class="autosigned">—&nbsp;Preceding ] comment added by ] (]) 18:10, 22 August 2008 (UTC)</small>

:::Seriously. Connecticut is part of New England. No one cares how much you whine and want it to be part of New York. Thus, anything IN Connecticut contributes to New England Cuisine. <small><span class="autosigned">—Preceding ] comment added by ] (] • ]) 04:38, 2 September 2009 (UTC)</span></small><!-- Template:Unsigned --> <!--Autosigned by SineBot-->

::::As another New Haven resident (but not an Italian, although I do enjoy your pizza), the anonymous poster who "takes issue with this article" could not be more wrong. New Haven -- but a train's ride from New York City -- is a part of New England. There are a lot of New York transplants in Southern Connecticut, but most people identity with New England, even if they don't identify with Boston in particular.
::::New Yorkers themselves see Connecticut as part of New England -- which it is, in an integral, historical, cultural, factual sense. --] (]) 23:30, 28 October 2009 (UTC)

== Cabot Creamery ==
I added Cabot Creamery to Vermont staples, since I think it epitomizes the Vermont dairy industry as much or more as B&J. Especially since it's won so many cheese awards.--] 16:27, 25 August 2007 (UTC)

== Bell's Seasoning ==
I miss in the article any mention on Bell's Seasoning "The William G. Bell Co. Since 1867". A blend of rosemary, oregano, sage, ginger, marjoram, thyme and pepper. ] (]) 08:54, 31 January 2008 (UTC)

== Subway ==
It's not called a sub in reference to subway. It's called a sub as a shortening for submarine. Subway took their name from the northeastern slang for a sandwich, not the other way around.

Edited to remove that. <small>—Preceding ] comment added by ] (]) 20:33, 24 June 2008 (UTC)</small><!-- Template:UnsignedIP --> <!--Autosigned by SineBot-->

== Portsmouth Orange Cake ==
Is this legit? Is it still extant? Or was it famous only in colonial times? Any sources possible? <!-- Template:Unsigned IP --><small class="autosigned">—&nbsp;Preceding ] comment added by ] (]) 06:59, 18 December 2008 (UTC)</small>

== No Scrod ==
I think the mention of scrod should be removed from the list of typical foods. It's served in many restaurants, yes, but most natives won't eat it--it's pretty much restaurant slang for "junk fish." <!-- Template:Unsigned IP --><small class="autosigned">—&nbsp;Preceding ] comment added by ] (]) 18:10, 22 August 2008 (UTC)</small>

:Hey, man, don't dis' the poor man's cod. --] (]) 23:32, 28 October 2009 (UTC)

==Frappe vs milkshake==
Before McDonalds straightened everything out, if you ordered a "milkshake" in northern Vermont (I can't speak for the rest of NE), the waitress would take a glass of milk, and spoon in some ice cream. There were no blenders! If you wanted what the rest of the country called a "milkshake", you had best order a "frappe!" McDs, of course, has changed all of this and the distinction is lost today. ] (]) 12:46, 29 April 2010 (UTC)

==Smuttynose==
The problem with entering "any food/beverage production place with an article" is that the article could be jammed with, essentially promo ] links. Smuttynose is a local microbrewery, perhaps barely known in NY outside of New England.

But whatever. The links should be for chains/food producers that are known elsewhere than New England. Within the region is insufficient. Smuttynose shouldn't really be there IMO. ] (]) 02:34, 25 May 2010 (UTC)

==Maple syrup==
An editor correctly asked for a citation about Vermont having the "best" maple syrup. I could not find one. I am "pretty sure" that there is a higher percentage of "grade a fancy light" syrup produced in Vt than anywhere, but not sure where that gets me for this article. A bit obscure, even if I could find ref. Please replace claim if you can find a citation. ] (]) 20:44, 9 January 2011 (UTC)

:I used to make maple syrup. The grades have nothing to do with the quality, per se. It's about color and consistency. Some people prefer darker syrups, which are by definition not "Grade A." It will be hard to find an unbiased "best" reference, considering that maple syrup is not something that many people feel passionate about. On the other hand, there is probably something to be said for per capita production being higher in Vermont than elsewhere, and for the fact that Vermont has special laws protecting the naming and branding of maple syrup. (The state's in the process of suing McDonald's for using the expression "natural maple syrup" on a product that is not, by Vermont standards, maple syrup.) --] (]) 00:52, 10 January 2011 (UTC)

==Hoagies==
The editor may be correct about hoagies not being used in the area generally, but there several shops named (and selling) "Hoagies" in a rural area in northeastern Vermont, of all places. Not a trendy section of NE! Not sure where they got if from. Philadelphia? Wow. I don't know. Long ways from there. ] (]) 23:09, 4 February 2011 (UTC)

== Photos ==
This page could do with more photos? <span style="font-size: smaller;" class="autosigned">— Preceding ] comment added by ] (]) 06:55, 20 October 2011 (UTC)</span><!-- Template:Unsigned IP --> <!--Autosigned by SineBot-->

== Union Oyster House the oldest restaurant in the country? ==
The White Horse Tavern in Rhode Island has been operating as a pub/restaurant since the 1600s. How factual is the claim that the Union Oyster House is the oldest?

http://www.whitehorsenewport.com/about/history/ <!-- Template:Unsigned IP --><small class="autosigned">—&nbsp;Preceding ] comment added by ] (]) 22:33, 18 November 2014 (UTC)</small>

== External links modified ==
Hello fellow Wikipedians,

I have just modified one external link on ]. Please take a moment to review . If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit ] for additional information. I made the following changes:
*Added archive https://archive.is/20131008013424/http://usiweb.usi.edu/Spring2008/educ214-1/16/somefoods.htm to http://usiweb.usi.edu/Spring2008/educ214-1/16/somefoods.htm

When you have finished reviewing my changes, you may follow the instructions on the template below to fix any issues with the URLs.

{{sourcecheck|checked=false|needhelp=}}

Cheers.—] <span style="color:green;font-family:Rockwell">(])</span> 07:49, 15 August 2017 (UTC)

== Dunkin Donuts ==
Excuse me, how does one talk about cuisine of New England without a mention of Dunkin Donuts??? ] (]) 00:29, 16 September 2020 (UTC)

== The Thanksgiving Lie? In 2022? ==
Surely by now we have all learned that "the first Thanksgiving" as the myth is told, with Pilgrim immigrants cordially inviting local citizens to sit down together for a meal is absolutely not at all how it actually went down. This myth has been dispelled for a long time now. So why is it still in this article? ] (]) 07:56, 11 February 2022 (UTC)

Latest revision as of 07:47, 13 February 2024

This is the talk page for discussing improvements to the Cuisine of New England article.
This is not a forum for general discussion of the article's subject.
Article policies
Find sources: Google (books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs· FENS · JSTOR · TWL
This article is rated Start-class on Misplaced Pages's content assessment scale.
It is of interest to the following WikiProjects:
WikiProject iconFood and drink Low‑importance
WikiProject iconThis article is within the scope of WikiProject Food and drink, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of food and drink related articles on Misplaced Pages. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.Food and drinkWikipedia:WikiProject Food and drinkTemplate:WikiProject Food and drinkFood and drink
LowThis article has been rated as Low-importance on the project's importance scale.
Food and Drink task list:
To edit this page, select here

Here are some tasks you can do for WikiProject Food and drink:
Note: These lists are transcluded from the project's tasks pages.
WikiProject iconUnited States: Massachusetts / New Hampshire / Rhode Island / Vermont Low‑importance
WikiProject iconThis article is within the scope of WikiProject United States, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of topics relating to the United States of America on Misplaced Pages. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the ongoing discussions. United StatesWikipedia:WikiProject United StatesTemplate:WikiProject United StatesUnited States
LowThis article has been rated as Low-importance on the project's importance scale.
Taskforce icon
This article is supported by WikiProject Massachusetts (assessed as Mid-importance).
Taskforce icon
This article is supported by WikiProject New Hampshire (assessed as Mid-importance).
Taskforce icon
This article is supported by WikiProject Rhode Island (assessed as Mid-importance).
Taskforce icon
This article is supported by WikiProject Vermont (assessed as Mid-importance).
WikiProject iconConnecticut Mid‑importance
WikiProject iconThis article is within the scope of WikiProject Connecticut, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of Connecticut on Misplaced Pages. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.ConnecticutWikipedia:WikiProject ConnecticutTemplate:WikiProject ConnecticutConnecticut
MidThis article has been rated as Mid-importance on the project's importance scale.
WikiProject iconMaine Mid‑importance
WikiProject iconThis article is within the scope of WikiProject Maine, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of the U.S. state of Maine on Misplaced Pages. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.MaineWikipedia:WikiProject MaineTemplate:WikiProject MaineMaine
MidThis article has been rated as Mid-importance on the project's importance scale.
Tip: Anchors are case-sensitive in most browsers.

This article links to one or more target anchors that no longer exist.

Please help fix the broken anchors. You can remove this template after fixing the problems. | Reporting errors

Old Bay

Please try to fit in a mention of Old Bay Seasoning. On the west coast of the US, we've never heard of this stuff. I was surprised when the Northeast, and ordering french fries, to be asked, "you want regular or old bay"? ike9898 17:58, May 31, 2005 (UTC)

Old Bay Seasoning is really used in and around the Chesapeake Bay, especially for seasoning steamed crabs and vegetables, in fine restaurants and also at home. Old Bay is also known for its excellent crab, tuna and salmon cake mixes. Only in recent years have Old Bay seasonings become popular in New England.
Each region of the United States which has seafood as part of everyday life uses different seasonings. In New Orleans, for example, Zatairains, a food company native to New Orleans, is the primary commercially-available seafood seasoning, particularly its seafood boil seasonings and packaged seasonings (mixes) for crab, tuna and salmon cake mixes. A major flavoring ingredient, which New Orleanians call, "seasoning" and is found in the Zatairains seafood mixes, is clam juice. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 69.3.85.41 (talk) 01:04, 25 November 2005 (UTC)
While I love me some Old Bay, it is not typical of New England. As the Misplaced Pages article for the stuff makes clear, it is produced in Maryland and is most associated with that area, in particular it's use on boiled Chesapeake Bay Blue Crabs. So, although it's great stuff, it's not really appropriate to be listed in this article on New England. -- Friejose (talk) 21:33, 18 December 2008 (UTC)

Moxie

Much as I love Farmington, Moxie has nothing to do with the town. It was originally created in Lowell, Mass (as a patent medicine) but it has gained much more fame from Lisbon Falls' Moxiefest. Due to that, I'm not sure which location to use. ~ RagingZangetsu 02:23, 26 February 2007 (UTC)

New England boiled dinner

If I trust the Corned Beef and Cabbage wiki article, then this dish is not of Irish heritage, and New England boiled dinner, to my personal and referenced knowledge, is much more than corned beef and cabbage. --Dumarest 12:01, 2 April 2007 (UTC)

There's also corned beef and dandelion greens...--75.68.233.187 16:26, 25 August 2007 (UTC)
There's also New England Boiled dinner made with ham instead of corned beef. Chefette1313 (talk) 03:04, 30 March 2008 (UTC)

I take issue with this Article

CT's cuisine is not a "New England" cusine, it is a CT thing influenced by near-by NYC. I wish you Boston propagandists would stop trying to make up something that does not exist. Is New Haven pizza really a New England thing or a NYC immigrant thing? Think before assuming. I keep telling you people that CT is NOT New England styled, we are NYC styled.--71.235.81.39 22:54, 31 May 2007 (UTC)

I think you meant to say "New Jersey is New York styled." Connecticut is a New England state. The 6 New England states are Connecticut, Rhode Island, Massachussetts, Vermont, New Hampshire, and Maine. see New England — Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.105.93.166 (talk) 03:53, 15 August 2007 (UTC)
As an Italian from the New Haven area who worked in a New Haven-style pizza restaurant for years and is well familiar with New York-style pizza, I think I can say pretty definitively that the top post is wrong. New Haven-style pizza is its own thing. It originated from immigrants who settled in Connecticut directly after leaving Italy. They didn't just jump the border into Connecticut from New York, and quite a few of the restaurant owners are very recent immigrants from Naples, Italy, who make their pizza based on how they made it back home. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 96.233.24.88 (talk) 18:10, 22 August 2008 (UTC)
Seriously. Connecticut is part of New England. No one cares how much you whine and want it to be part of New York. Thus, anything IN Connecticut contributes to New England Cuisine. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Cad2222 (talkcontribs) 04:38, 2 September 2009 (UTC)
As another New Haven resident (but not an Italian, although I do enjoy your pizza), the anonymous poster who "takes issue with this article" could not be more wrong. New Haven -- but a train's ride from New York City -- is a part of New England. There are a lot of New York transplants in Southern Connecticut, but most people identity with New England, even if they don't identify with Boston in particular.
New Yorkers themselves see Connecticut as part of New England -- which it is, in an integral, historical, cultural, factual sense. --71.235.239.166 (talk) 23:30, 28 October 2009 (UTC)

Cabot Creamery

I added Cabot Creamery to Vermont staples, since I think it epitomizes the Vermont dairy industry as much or more as B&J. Especially since it's won so many cheese awards.--Sailor Titan 16:27, 25 August 2007 (UTC)

Bell's Seasoning

I miss in the article any mention on Bell's Seasoning "The William G. Bell Co. Since 1867". A blend of rosemary, oregano, sage, ginger, marjoram, thyme and pepper. jmcw (talk) 08:54, 31 January 2008 (UTC)

Subway

It's not called a sub in reference to subway. It's called a sub as a shortening for submarine. Subway took their name from the northeastern slang for a sandwich, not the other way around.

Edited to remove that. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 67.165.67.32 (talk) 20:33, 24 June 2008 (UTC)

Portsmouth Orange Cake

Is this legit? Is it still extant? Or was it famous only in colonial times? Any sources possible? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 209.6.216.65 (talk) 06:59, 18 December 2008 (UTC)

No Scrod

I think the mention of scrod should be removed from the list of typical foods. It's served in many restaurants, yes, but most natives won't eat it--it's pretty much restaurant slang for "junk fish." — Preceding unsigned comment added by 96.233.24.88 (talk) 18:10, 22 August 2008 (UTC)

Hey, man, don't dis' the poor man's cod. --71.235.239.166 (talk) 23:32, 28 October 2009 (UTC)

Frappe vs milkshake

Before McDonalds straightened everything out, if you ordered a "milkshake" in northern Vermont (I can't speak for the rest of NE), the waitress would take a glass of milk, and spoon in some ice cream. There were no blenders! If you wanted what the rest of the country called a "milkshake", you had best order a "frappe!" McDs, of course, has changed all of this and the distinction is lost today. Student7 (talk) 12:46, 29 April 2010 (UTC)

Smuttynose

The problem with entering "any food/beverage production place with an article" is that the article could be jammed with, essentially promo WP:PR links. Smuttynose is a local microbrewery, perhaps barely known in NY outside of New England.

But whatever. The links should be for chains/food producers that are known elsewhere than New England. Within the region is insufficient. Smuttynose shouldn't really be there IMO. Student7 (talk) 02:34, 25 May 2010 (UTC)

Maple syrup

An editor correctly asked for a citation about Vermont having the "best" maple syrup. I could not find one. I am "pretty sure" that there is a higher percentage of "grade a fancy light" syrup produced in Vt than anywhere, but not sure where that gets me for this article. A bit obscure, even if I could find ref. Please replace claim if you can find a citation. Student7 (talk) 20:44, 9 January 2011 (UTC)

I used to make maple syrup. The grades have nothing to do with the quality, per se. It's about color and consistency. Some people prefer darker syrups, which are by definition not "Grade A." It will be hard to find an unbiased "best" reference, considering that maple syrup is not something that many people feel passionate about. On the other hand, there is probably something to be said for per capita production being higher in Vermont than elsewhere, and for the fact that Vermont has special laws protecting the naming and branding of maple syrup. (The state's in the process of suing McDonald's for using the expression "natural maple syrup" on a product that is not, by Vermont standards, maple syrup.) --TimothyDexter (talk) 00:52, 10 January 2011 (UTC)

Hoagies

The editor may be correct about hoagies not being used in the area generally, but there several shops named (and selling) "Hoagies" in a rural area in northeastern Vermont, of all places. Not a trendy section of NE! Not sure where they got if from. Philadelphia? Wow. I don't know. Long ways from there. Student7 (talk) 23:09, 4 February 2011 (UTC)

Photos

This page could do with more photos? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 203.126.210.99 (talk) 06:55, 20 October 2011 (UTC)

Union Oyster House the oldest restaurant in the country?

The White Horse Tavern in Rhode Island has been operating as a pub/restaurant since the 1600s. How factual is the claim that the Union Oyster House is the oldest?

http://www.whitehorsenewport.com/about/history/ — Preceding unsigned comment added by 66.66.231.29 (talk) 22:33, 18 November 2014 (UTC)

External links modified

Hello fellow Wikipedians,

I have just modified one external link on Cuisine of New England. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:

When you have finished reviewing my changes, you may follow the instructions on the template below to fix any issues with the URLs.

This message was posted before February 2018. After February 2018, "External links modified" talk page sections are no longer generated or monitored by InternetArchiveBot. No special action is required regarding these talk page notices, other than regular verification using the archive tool instructions below. Editors have permission to delete these "External links modified" talk page sections if they want to de-clutter talk pages, but see the RfC before doing mass systematic removals. This message is updated dynamically through the template {{source check}} (last update: 5 June 2024).

  • If you have discovered URLs which were erroneously considered dead by the bot, you can report them with this tool.
  • If you found an error with any archives or the URLs themselves, you can fix them with this tool.

Cheers.—InternetArchiveBot (Report bug) 07:49, 15 August 2017 (UTC)

Dunkin Donuts

Excuse me, how does one talk about cuisine of New England without a mention of Dunkin Donuts??? Theclownfromit (talk) 00:29, 16 September 2020 (UTC)

The Thanksgiving Lie? In 2022?

Surely by now we have all learned that "the first Thanksgiving" as the myth is told, with Pilgrim immigrants cordially inviting local citizens to sit down together for a meal is absolutely not at all how it actually went down. This myth has been dispelled for a long time now. So why is it still in this article? 203.71.145.200 (talk) 07:56, 11 February 2022 (UTC)

Categories: