| Revision as of 00:52, 18 December 2008 editCollect (talk | contribs)Extended confirmed users, Pending changes reviewers47,160 edits →This article is too big: too big← Previous edit |
Latest revision as of 07:35, 20 October 2024 edit undoCewbot (talk | contribs)Bots7,341,486 editsm Maintain {{WPBS}}: 7 WikiProject templates. The article is listed in the level 5 page: Tennis.Tag: Talk banner shell conversion |
| (92 intermediate revisions by 61 users not shown) |
| Line 1: |
Line 1: |
|
|
{{Article history |
|
{{WPBiography|living=yes|class=B|importance=}} |
|
|
|
|action1=PR |
|
{{WP-Tennis|living=|class=|importance=High}} |
|
|
|
|action1date=15:41:59 14 November 2017 (UTC) |
|
{{LGBTProject|class=B}} |
|
|
|
|action1link=Misplaced Pages:Peer review/Billie Jean King/archive1 |
|
{{WP1.0|v0.7=pass|class=B|category=Everydaylife}} |
|
|
|
|action1result=reviewed |
|
|
|action1oldid=942180310 |
|
|
|otd1date=2004-09-20|otd1oldid=6403945 |
|
|
|otd2date=2005-09-20|otd2oldid=23581850 |
|
|
|otd3date=2006-09-20|otd3oldid=76854965 |
|
|
|otd4date=2007-09-20|otd4oldid=159102493 |
|
|
}} |
|
|
{{WikiProject banner shell|blp=yes|class=B|vital=yes|listas=King, Billie Jean|1= |
|
|
{{WikiProject Biography |sports-priority=High |sports-work-group=yes }} |
|
|
{{WikiProject California |importance=Mid |la=yes |la-importance=Mid |calstate=yes |calstate-importance=Mid}} |
|
|
{{WikiProject LGBTQ+ studies|person=yes}} |
|
|
{{WikiProject Tennis |importance=High}} |
|
|
{{WikiProject Veganism and Vegetarianism|importance=Low}} |
|
|
{{WikiProject Women's History |importance=High}} |
|
|
{{WikiProject Women's sport |importance=High |tennis=yes |tennis-importance=Top}} |
|
|
}} |
|
|
{{Archive box|search=yes| |
|
|
* ] <small>(2003–2015)</small> |
|
|
}} |
|
|
|
|
|
== Larry King relation? == |
|
== Archived 2003–2015 == |
|
|
|
|
|
|
Just a note that 2003–2015 ]. ] (]) 00:42, 29 March 2016 (UTC) |
|
She wasn't married to the ] from CNN, was she? That's where that link goes. ] 21:10, 20 Sep 2003 (UTC) |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
== Good Article goal == |
|
:No, don't think it's "the" Larry K, no, so I deactivated the link. A search on Larry King shows no Billie Jean among his numerous previous wives... --] 23:53, 24 Jan 2004 (UTC) |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
With a new movie coming out about King's life, this seems like a great opportunity to improve this article and hopefully push it towards Good Article status. Anyone is welcome to participate. Below are some of my observations about what could be improved in this article as a jumping off point. |
|
::It's a different Larry King. (Anonymous User) June 1, 2006 |
|
|
|
:*Find sources --all non obvious facts should be sourced. This article has a lot of facts which are currently not sourced. |
|
|
:*Remove scores --per peer review, scores should be removed from the body of the article unless they are a record |
|
|
:*Make prose less list like --a few early career sections, other activities, and awards are very list like. The prose could be refined. |
|
|
:*Trim excess or repetitive details |
|
|
:*Improve cohesiveness of the article |
|
|
:*Improve headings |
|
|
:*remove/paraphrase block quotes--one or two block quotes would be fine but the article relies on them very heavily. |
|
|
Please feel free to add any thoughts. ] (]) 16:58, 23 September 2017 (UTC) |
|
|
:I've condensed the personal life section, removing all but one of the block quotes. Perhaps that last block quote can be paraphrased, but I'll leave it for now to see if there are other opinions. |
|
|
:I'm also drafting the early part of her career ]. I think for early years its probably easier to not go year by year. I'm also removing mentions of some specific regional tournaments that do not appear significant in part because there is an article devoted to her statistics. ] (]) 03:36, 30 September 2017 (UTC) |
|
|
:: Update: I have created an "In popular culture" section drawing on some things already in the article and adding a few others. Playing style and personality should probably be rewritten eliminating the quotes. If anyone is looking to jump in and do some writing, that could be a good section for someone to pick up. Sourcing for that should be easy as a lot of the sources used elsewhere in the article describe King's personality too. |
|
|
|
|
|
|
::Sourcing remains an issue, and is another great area for other editors to get involved. |
|
== Gay Icon Project == |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
::I'm also currently considering moving the first few paragraphs of "Career," which talks about some of King's biggest career achievements and turning it into a "legacy" section. I'm not always fond of legacy sections or living people but I do think moving the material into some sort of achievement section later in the article would help the flow from Early life into Early career. ] (]) 20:21, 9 October 2017 (UTC) |
|
In my effort to merge the now-deleted list from the article ] to the Gay icons category, I have added this page to the category. I engaged in this effort as a "human script", adding everyone from the list to the category, bypassing the fact-checking stage. That is what I am relying on you to do. Please check the article ] and make a judgment as to whether this person or group fits the category. By distributing this task from the regular editors of one article to the regular editors of several articles, I believe that the task of fact-checking this information can be expedited. Thank you very much. ] 21:04, 24 Mar 2005 (UTC) |
|
|
|
:::I have gone ahead and combined a few of the early years of King's career into a shorter overview. I think this makes sense as it allows for more focus on the peak of her career and avoids devolving into a list of tournaments and their results. I am not opposed to adding back some of the detail, particularly if sourced, so please feel free to add if you think anything important is missing. ] (]) 20:21, 15 October 2017 (UTC) |
|
|
|
|
|
|
== Citations == |
|
:I don't see it in the article and I can't find a link. I know she's married... to a guy, so I really couldn't tell you. ] 16:49, 31 August 2007 (UTC) |
|
|
|
Hello fellow Wikipedians |
|
|
|
|
|
|
I refer you to footnotes 181 & 182 which I have not cited properly. I endeavoured to do this, but then the links of the articles disappeared. Can you improve the citations please, according to the rules?] (]) 10:31, 7 January 2021 (UTC) |
|
== US Open played on 4 surfaces? == |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
== Interview with King on National Public Radio's Fresh Air == |
|
This is stated in the article: |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
King offers some insights as tho why she worked for women's equality in tennis. Some of this should be included in the article. She says that when she was 12 she decided that if she became the best tennis player she would work for change in the sport. |
|
"She is also the only woman to have won the US Open singles title on all four surfaces on which it has been played (grass, clay, indoor, and hard)" |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
https://www.npr.org/programs/fresh-air/2021/08/21/1029711660/fresh-air-for-aug-21-2021-billie-jean-king-kenan-thompson?showDate=2021-08-21 |
|
When was the U.S. Open played indoors? |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
== Removal of longstanding info on title numbers == |
|
:I guess it's possible (due to a rain out), but I don't recall this ever happening. Usually, something similar is said about Jimmy Connors, but I've never seen more than 3 surfaces referred to. |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
I'm at a loss on why one of Kings most vital stats is being removed. It has been here for well over a decade, is used by the WTA and Tennis Hall of fame. I'm talking about the removal by a new editor of "King won 39 Grand Slam titles: 12 in singles, 16 in women's doubles, and 11 in mixed doubles. Why on earth would this be removed? The talks of the feat extensively! The in her bio section. It . The as important. |
|
::Actually it was only three surfaces. 1887-1974; grass courts, 1975-1978; green clay courts, 1979-Present; hard courts. (Anonymous User) June 1, 2006 |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
We seem to have a newer editor who is also editing as an anon IP removing it as useless wording that no one cares about. Baloney! It's a huge part of her persona that is sourced everywhere. The Tennis Hall of Fame tells of her 20 Wimbledon titles too. Those weren't just in singles... they are a total of all her Major titles there. I have no idea why anyone would remove these accomplishments from here... and also from the Serena Williams article. It is supposed to be their job to bring it to talk if someone disagrees with their removal of longstanding consensus. They may not realize that fact even though I've explained it to them over and over... so here we are. ] (]) 20:02, 12 September 2023 (UTC) |
|
==Portrait photo uploaded== |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
== Inclusion of More Information == |
|
Uploaded a black&white photo of Ms. King and removed the "picture wanted" template. --] 19:34, 12 July 2006 (UTC) |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
I think that this article would be much more developed and inclusive of prevalent issues if it went more into depth of BJK’s influence on female athletes as the first openly gay female athlete. This is lightly included at the very end of the article, but would benefit the article if it was included earlier, and depicted the impact that it had on her influence to her fanbase, while also delving into the difficulties on her at that time. Additionally, this article could include more recent information, such as BJK’s interviews and more first-hand sources. Overall, this article holds a lot of information, but avoids some of the heavier topics on issues that are more prevalent today. In simply including this, in a non-biased and neutral way while adhering to Misplaced Pages’s guidelines, would enhance the notability, credibility, and overall relevance of this article. ] (]) 14:17, 3 October 2024 (UTC) |
|
== Where tennis is headed == |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
I like what Billy Jean had to say on television the other day, about how tennis could benefit our youth and that she would like to see more youngsters participating in tennis. |
|
|
|
|
|
I agree 100% of what she had to say and I too think that more young people being active in tennis would lower the obesity rate in children. |
|
|
|
|
|
] 16:47, 6 September 2006 (UTC)Theresa Casey |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
== Seventeen poll == |
|
|
|
|
|
Does anyone know whether the poll was of all the different editions of Seventeen or only the US/UK edition? ] 19:55, 20 September 2006 (UTC) |
|
|
|
|
|
== Dates messed up? == |
|
|
|
|
|
The first paragraph says that she was born in 1943. It later says that she was the "World #1" in 1941, and a few other dates. This is impossible, because she was not born yet. does someone know how to change this? <small>—The preceding ] comment was added by ] (]) 19:10, 21 April 2007 (UTC).</small><!-- HagermanBot Auto-Unsigned --> |
|
|
|
|
|
==Weird Person #1== |
|
|
“King was born Weird Person #1.”—WTF? |
|
|
|
|
|
==About the Trivia Section== |
|
|
Would like to see a consensus from other editors besides Tennis Expert and myself Cr8tiv over the link to ]. This article is very important to me as I am documenting underground lesbian ] that includes Ms King's popularity as a costume in Lesbian Bars. Other editors to well known Lesbian pages such as kd lang and Eleanor Roosevelt have not objected to this inclusion in the Trivia section. Billie Jean is an icon to the Wiki LGBT world. Please chime in and voice your opinion. ] 4:30 June 4 2007 |
|
|
|
|
|
:If I can be blunt, without meaning to be rude: first, trivia is widely considered across the Misplaced Pages community to be non-encyclopedic and its inclusion is generally discouraged, so it should go on that ground alone. Second, while Billie Jean King may be a lesbian meme, that is not, strictly speaking, about her. Hence, this reference should not be here. Feel free to add it to pages on lesbian subculture linked to this article. But this needs to adhere to Misplaced Pages policies, such BLP, BIO, etc... I am removing this pointless and unencyclopedic reference. ] 16:44, 29 June 2007 (UTC) |
|
|
|
|
|
OKAY! One voice heard from. I have reinstated the link to ] Lets here from more than three Wikiies to get a consensus, not just the FINAL opionion of Eusebeus. Enjoy the free speech of Misplaced Pages before Guiliani and the Republicans take over. GO HILLARY CLINTON and VP Obama ] 17:41, 11 July 2007 (UTC) |
|
|
|
|
|
I kinda agree with Eusebeus, trivia isn't to be included in an encyclopedia. Obama for president! <small>—Preceding ] comment added by ] (]) 00:14, 23 May 2008 (UTC)</small><!-- Template:UnsignedIP --> <!--Autosigned by SineBot--> |
|
|
|
|
|
:Remove, per ] and ]. --] <b> μολὼν λαβέ</b> 18:01, 12 July 2007 (UTC) |
|
|
|
|
|
:So, Trivia sections are not so great - its usually one of the first things I try to dump from an article. But when I do remove a trivia section, it is typically because I have integrated the trivia into the article. If Ms. King has ever commented on her popularity as an LGBT icon and/or popularity for look alike contests, you should be able to incoporate it into the article proper - perhaps the personal life section. So I guess I say... No to the trivia section, but yes to including that bit of information if done with continuity. <b><i><font face="Times New Roman" color="darkblue">]</font></i><font face="Times New Roman" color="blue">]</font><small> (])</small></b> 22:15, 12 July 2007 (UTC) <br><small>]</small> |
|
|
|
|
|
==Would prefer a different PHOTO== |
|
|
|
|
|
Thanks for the photo, whoever uploaded it. However, I think it would be much more appropriate to have a photo of her during her prime, during her tennis career, and preferably in tennis gear. Those who have never heard of her (I'm educating some young Brits about the Battle of the Sexes) would benefit more from that than from this one now in place. A photo of her in her athletic prime should at least be ''somewhere'' in the article. (Don't ask me to find one -- images are not my expertise.) Thanks! ] (]) 08:17, 9 February 2008 (UTC) |
|
|
|
|
|
== Peanuts == |
|
|
|
|
|
I'm pretty sure I heard that one of the characters in Peanuts was based on Billie Jean, she wasn't just referenced. Does anyone else know anything about this? ]<sup>]/]/]</sup> 17:29, 10 March 2008 (UTC) |
|
|
|
|
|
== This article is too big == |
|
|
|
|
|
See ] and ] for tips. Specifically the parts about long articles not being "readable and easy to navigate". Maybe a summary of her life, and in a clearly separated section, a more compact history, by decade, only pointing out the notable things. |
|
|
|
|
|
Also, considering someone put a lot of effort into making it, maybe there is tennispedia or some website you can paste all the to-be-pruned information under GFDL licence. |
|
|
] (]) 18:56, 6 June 2008 (UTC) |
|
|
|
|
|
:The article is not "too big" because tables are not counted when evaluating the size of articles. ] (]) 21:06, 6 June 2008 (UTC) |
|
|
|
|
|
::Biggest article I've ever seen <small>—Preceding ] comment added by ] (]) 05:34, 12 June 2008 (UTC)</small><!-- Template:UnsignedIP --> <!--Autosigned by SineBot--> |
|
|
|
|
|
:::Its bigger than UK, USA, Queen Elizabeth, World War Two, EVERYTHING?! Its damn crazy. Why is there a year by year account for 3 decades! <small>—Preceding ] comment added by ] (]) 00:29, 22 June 2008 (UTC)</small><!-- Template:UnsignedIP --> <!--Autosigned by SineBot--> |
|
|
|
|
|
::::Yep, And when I trimmed it a tiny bit, it got reverted. Back to full size. ] (]) 02:04, 17 December 2008 (UTC) |
|
|
|
|
|
:::::I strongly object to your wholesale deletion of the following well-referenced material: |
|
|
:::::(1) "Speaking about the lawsuit in 2007, 26 years after it was filed, King said, "It was very hard on me because I was outed and I think you have to do it in your own time. Fifty per cent of gay people know who they are by the age of 13, I was in the other 50%. I would never have married Larry if I’d known. I would never have done that to him. I was totally in love with Larry when I was 21."<ref name = "TimesOnline-20071209"/> |
|
|
:::::(2) "], who frequently played King but never felt close to her, said about King's personality, "One of the reasons I've never gotten close to Billie Jean is that I've never felt strong enough to survive against that overwhelming personality of hers. People talk about me being the smart one. Let me tell you, Billie Jean's the smartest one, the cleverest one you'll ever see. She was the one who was able to channel everything into winning, into being the most consummate tennis player."<ref></ref> , another frequent opponent of King, said, "For a time, I think I was as close to Billie Jean as anyone ever was. But as soon as I got to the point where I could read her too well, she tried to dissociate the relationship. She doesn't want to risk appearing weak in front of anybody. She told me once that if you want to be the best, you must never let anyone, anyone, know what you really feel. You see, she told me, they can't hurt you if they don't know."<ref></ref> King once said, "Victory is fleeting. Losing is forever."<ref>{{cite web |url=http://www.allthingswilliam.com/victory.html |title=all things William |accessdate=2007-02-15}}</ref> |
|
|
:::::] (]) 05:42, 17 December 2008 (UTC) |
|
|
|
|
|
::::::An encyclopedia article does not need every single quote you can find from or about the subject. Second, the lead is not the place to put lots of praise or condemnation from others. see ] "The lead section should briefly summarize the most important points covered in an article in such a way that it can stand on its own as a concise version of the article. It is even more important here than for the rest of the article that the text be accessible. " ] (]) 11:21, 17 December 2008 (UTC) |
|
|
|
|
|
:::::::I'm not sure why you are citing ] for this article. Maybe you're confusing this article with ]. But because you brought up the issue here, your remedy for not liking certain information in the lead of the Navratilova article was to delete the information completely. Instead of doing that, you should have proposed to move the information elsewhere in the article. "Don't throw the baby out with the bath water", in other words. It's very doubtful that this article (]) has "every single quote" about King that could be found. Hyperbole like this is unconstructive and often leads to disruptive disputes, which I know you've experienced elsewhere and don't want to happen again. ] (]) 20:20, 17 December 2008 (UTC) |
|
|
|
|
|
*I agree this article is way too long. I suggest we revert back to the version from December 2007 before ] (now retired) ballooned its size up to the present version. ] (]) 18:31, 17 December 2008 (UTC) |
|
|
** I stand corrected, Tennis expert is now editing from the anonymity of the IP above. ] (]) 20:03, 17 December 2008 (UTC) |
|
|
:::And even trivial edits get reverted by that editor (sigh) ] (]) 00:52, 18 December 2008 (UTC) |
|
With a new movie coming out about King's life, this seems like a great opportunity to improve this article and hopefully push it towards Good Article status. Anyone is welcome to participate. Below are some of my observations about what could be improved in this article as a jumping off point.
I refer you to footnotes 181 & 182 which I have not cited properly. I endeavoured to do this, but then the links of the articles disappeared. Can you improve the citations please, according to the rules?Andrew Rabel (talk) 10:31, 7 January 2021 (UTC)
King offers some insights as tho why she worked for women's equality in tennis. Some of this should be included in the article. She says that when she was 12 she decided that if she became the best tennis player she would work for change in the sport.
I'm at a loss on why one of Kings most vital stats is being removed. It has been here for well over a decade, is used by the WTA and Tennis Hall of fame. I'm talking about the removal by a new editor of "King won 39 Grand Slam titles: 12 in singles, 16 in women's doubles, and 11 in mixed doubles. Why on earth would this be removed? The Tennis Hall of Fame talks of the feat extensively! The in her bio section. It heads the Billie Jean King website. The History Channel looks at it as important.
We seem to have a newer editor who is also editing as an anon IP removing it as useless wording that no one cares about. Baloney! It's a huge part of her persona that is sourced everywhere. The Tennis Hall of Fame tells of her 20 Wimbledon titles too. Those weren't just in singles... they are a total of all her Major titles there. I have no idea why anyone would remove these accomplishments from here... and also from the Serena Williams article. It is supposed to be their job to bring it to talk if someone disagrees with their removal of longstanding consensus. They may not realize that fact even though I've explained it to them over and over... so here we are. Fyunck(click) (talk) 20:02, 12 September 2023 (UTC)
I think that this article would be much more developed and inclusive of prevalent issues if it went more into depth of BJK’s influence on female athletes as the first openly gay female athlete. This is lightly included at the very end of the article, but would benefit the article if it was included earlier, and depicted the impact that it had on her influence to her fanbase, while also delving into the difficulties on her at that time. Additionally, this article could include more recent information, such as BJK’s interviews and more first-hand sources. Overall, this article holds a lot of information, but avoids some of the heavier topics on issues that are more prevalent today. In simply including this, in a non-biased and neutral way while adhering to Misplaced Pages’s guidelines, would enhance the notability, credibility, and overall relevance of this article. Anastasia.barr (talk) 14:17, 3 October 2024 (UTC)
level-5 vital article is rated B-class on Misplaced Pages's content assessment scale.
_(cropped).jpg)
