Talk:Nakoula Basseley Nakoula: Difference between revisions

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⚫	{{~~WPBiography~~\|~~living~~=yes\|listas=Nakoula, Nakoula Basseley}}
			{{Old AfD multi\| date = 13 September 2012 (UTC) \| result = '''keep''' \| page = Nakoula Basseley Nakoula }}
	{{notaforum}}
			{{American English}}
		⚫	{{WikiProject banner shell\|collapsed=yes\|blp=yes\|class=C\|listas=Nakoula, Nakoula Basseley\|
			{{WikiProject Biography
			\|filmbio-work-group=yes
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			{{WikiProject Crime and Criminal Biography\|importance=Low}}
			{{WikiProject United States\|importance=Low}}
			{{WikiProject Egypt\|importance=Low}}
			{{WikiProject Islam\|Islam-and-Controversy=yes\|importance=Low}}
			}}

			== Additional topis of discussion in this entry? ==
	== Should merge ==
			I'm surprised that a page search on this entry does not find words such as Clinton, Obama, Benghazi, Ambassador Stevens, and many more. Aren't these words unavoidable when discussing this topic? Shouldn't these references be added in a factual-neutral way ("it's claimed that Nakoula's video was a direct cause of ambassador Stevens' death")?
			== BLP / NPOV violation in opening paragraph? ==

			Insulting Islam and insulting Mohammed are death penalty crimes in certain islamic schools of justice. As it stands now, the opening paragraph is citing secular news sources to establish guilt in a death penalty case. The man's already got death threats from this. So a number of problems arise. When the phrase "insults Islam's prophet, Muhammad" is used in the lead sentence, is that done in the secular sense or as a statement of guilt in an islamic court, making him a legitimate target to be killed under islamic law? This is a BLP problem. The article also seems to be taking sides on the contentious Aisha issue, whether Mohammed was, indeed, what modern people would consider a pedophile. Historical claims of the Aisha marriage have the age of the marriage ceremony as early as 6 (but possibly as late as 10) and the age of consummation as early as 9 (but possibly as late as 15). Taking sides is both an NPOV problem and hashing out the underlying Aisha issues on this page would be a COATRACK. What's needed is a clearer statement on whether we're talking about the generally understood insult or the islamic crime. ] (]) 22:36, 19 October 2012 (UTC)
	This should be merged to ] per ]. I don't think the guy is notable for any other newsworthy event than this one (though the bank scheme comes close, and if you have find good sources about it I could be convinced). The article comes close to being a "]". And ultimately, there's not much you'd say here that wouldn't be relevant to the other article. ] (]) 16:41, 13 September 2012 (UTC)
	*My gut would tend to agree with the merger suggestion, though I suspect that it’s still a bit too early to tell how significant ''the making of the film'' will prove to have been, as opposed to the events in Libya, Egypt, and Yemen —— all in connection with that third prong of the test in ]. I’m not sure it becomes an attack page. My guess would be that the ''making of'' the film, and this man’s role in it, are not, at this point, yet significant, and that the biography, which otherwise has little of notability to it, would be best merged into the film. If subsequent events change things, warranting a separate biography, then of course a biography can always be separated out. My 2¢ ] (]) 21:27, 13 September 2012 (UTC)

			Why was he on probation to begin with? Can anyone answer that? <span style="font-size: smaller;" class="autosigned">— Preceding ] comment added by ] (]) 02:28, 9 May 2014 (UTC)</span><!-- Template:Unsigned IP --> <!--Autosigned by SineBot-->
	== Why is an AP story in the NY Post removed (NY post, no thanks)? ==
			==Conspiracy Theory==

			Even if Garcia, in her interviews, claims that Nakoula told her he was Muslim and he made the film at the behest of the US or some other such crazy conspiracy theory, there is no actual evidence any of that is true or newsworthy. She has no evidence to back up her charge. ] (]) 05:00, 18 June 2014 (UTC)
	Why is an AP story in the NY Post removed (NY post, no thanks)?

			This article is outdated. At Hillary Clinton's testimony on October 22, 2015, she said that they knew immediately at the time of the Benghazi attacks that it was a terrorist attack, and not inspired by a little-known video. She told the Egyptian prime minister within the first day that the attack had nothing to do with the video. It's unclear from this text how this obscure video came to be known, other than the publicity given to it by the administration. It's not clear why he was arrested in the middle of the night, since that's not the usual procedure for a parole violation, which are fairly commonplace. I'm no exper on all thist, but perhaps someone who knows more than I do should update this to reflect current knowledge. <small class="autosigned">— Preceding ] comment added by ] (]) 18:13, 24 October 2015 (UTC)</small><!-- Template:Unsigned IP --> <!--Autosigned by SineBot-->
	--] (]) 22:27, 13 September 2012 (UTC)
	:Because the NY post digs up so much shit just to sell their paper, it's not a source for biographies. ] <sup>]</sup> 22:30, 13 September 2012 (UTC)
	::If the source meets guidelines for reliability it should not be removed. Such actions seem biased and agaisnt Misplaced Pages policy. Please don't fan flames on the talk page. As long as the claim is referenced per policy to BLPs it may be used.--] (]) 23:56, 13 September 2012 (UTC)
	:::The New York Post is a tabloid and generally should not be used for ]s. However, if they are just reprinting or quoting an AP story, I think it is usable. ] (]) 00:02, 14 September 2012 (UTC)
	::::Although one wouldn't need to use the NYP, it could be sourced directly to the AP.--] (]) 00:06, 14 September 2012 (UTC)
	:::::The New York Post reference was just reprinting an AP story. http://www.nypost.com/p/news/international/anti_muslim_film
	--] (]) 00:08, 14 September 2012 (UTC)

			== External links modified (February 2018) ==
	:::::: The same person removed the AP story from Google. http://en.wikipedia.org/search/?title=Nakoula_Basseley_Nakoula&diff=512261513&oldid=512261385 --] (]) 00:09, 14 September 2012 (UTC)

			Hello fellow Wikipedians,
	== Coptic an ethnicity? ==

			I have just modified one external link on ]. Please take a moment to review ]. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit ] for additional information. I made the following changes:
	Is Coptic an ethnicity, a religion, or both? I can't tell from the ] WP article. Right now it is shown as both in the infobox. ] (]) 00:10, 14 September 2012 (UTC)
			*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20120916100638/http://nymag.com/daily/intel/2012/09/ap-sam-belice-man-behind-anti-islam-film.html to http://nymag.com/daily/intel/2012/09/ap-sam-belice-man-behind-anti-islam-film.html
	:Yes, it is. The cited sources clearly put it in contrast to "Arab"; therefore, it is used as an ethnicity in this context. ] <sup>]</sup>
	::Exactly. Both. Copts are an ethnoreligous group. Many members specifically identify as a non-Arab ethnicity. See ]. ] (]) 00:15, 14 September 2012 (UTC)
	:::Coptic is generally considered a religion. His ethnicity is Arab, as people born in Egypt are considered Arabs. --] (]) 00:16, 14 September 2012 (UTC)
	::::Not all of them; read the sources relevant to this case. Other sources do not matter here. ] <sup>]</sup> 00:17, 14 September 2012 (UTC)

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	== Democrat ==

			{{sourcecheck\|checked=false\|needhelp=}}
	So... can we get his penis-size, too? That's probably what led him to make the movie. ] <sup>]</sup> 00:18, 14 September 2012 (UTC)

			Cheers.—] <span style="color:green;font-family:Rockwell">(])</span> 15:56, 11 February 2018 (UTC)

	Nakoula was a registered ]. This is relevant as this involves political controversies.
	http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2012/09/13/mohammed-movie-s-mystery-director.html
	--] (]) 00:20, 14 September 2012 (UTC)

	:Yeah, it's true, but what the fuck does it matter??? You can't just throw every snippet in here just 'cause someone says so. It's called editing not copy-pasting. ] <sup>]</sup> 00:21, 14 September 2012 (UTC)

	::] your behavior on this page is becoming perilously close to uncivil. While we may not censor at Misplaced Pages, you show no reason for your choice of words except to possibly create an uncomfortable atmosphere. Please consider treating all members with more respect.--] (]) 00:26, 14 September 2012 (UTC)
	::::Commenting on users is a personal attack. Do you have anything substantial to contribute? ] <sup>]</sup> 00:30, 14 September 2012 (UTC)
	:::::I see nothing in either policy or guidleines that substantiates that claim. Your overwhelming the talkpage could be seen as disruptive.--] (]) 00:34, 14 September 2012 (UTC)

	::::Agree, political party does not seem very relevant. ] (]) 00:29, 14 September 2012 (UTC)
	:::::Then we should take it out and have Uc-c make his case here before putting it back in. ] <sup>]</sup> 00:31, 14 September 2012 (UTC)
	::::::I can agree to removing the mention at this time. If consensus changes it can be returned.--] (]) 00:37, 14 September 2012 (UTC)
	:::::::Thanks; but I can't do that (>]). Someone else please. ] <sup>]</sup> 00:38, 14 September 2012 (UTC)
	::::::::Well, there does at least appear to be consensus for it's removal once you clear 24 hours and i will support the change by another if needed.--] (]) 00:41, 14 September 2012 (UTC)
	:::::::::We don't have 24 hours. I'll take to the BLP noticeboard. ] <sup>]</sup> 00:43, 14 September 2012 (UTC)
	::::::::::OK, but what is the ]?--] (]) 00:48, 14 September 2012 (UTC)
	:::::::::::This is a living person. ] <sup>]</sup> 00:49, 14 September 2012 (UTC)
	::::::::::::OK, you mean, as a Biography of a living person, you are concerned about the information? It seems to be pretty harmless if perhaps, more detail than is needed.--] (]) 01:00, 14 September 2012 (UTC)
	:::::::::::::That was in response to "no rush" . BLP is always a rush to get it right and relevant. It's gone now. And DreamFocus's edit summary is perfect. Read it. ] <sup>]</sup> 01:01, 14 September 2012 (UTC)

	==Infobox==
	:I have removed the specific date of birth as being irrelevant to his bio, and per ]. Also removed a "death date" line from the infobox that thankfully was typo'ed and not showing up in the article itself. Smarten up, people. ] (]) 00:27, 14 September 2012 (UTC)

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Additional topis of discussion in this entry?

I'm surprised that a page search on this entry does not find words such as Clinton, Obama, Benghazi, Ambassador Stevens, and many more. Aren't these words unavoidable when discussing this topic? Shouldn't these references be added in a factual-neutral way ("it's claimed that Nakoula's video was a direct cause of ambassador Stevens' death")?

BLP / NPOV violation in opening paragraph?

Insulting Islam and insulting Mohammed are death penalty crimes in certain islamic schools of justice. As it stands now, the opening paragraph is citing secular news sources to establish guilt in a death penalty case. The man's already got death threats from this. So a number of problems arise. When the phrase "insults Islam's prophet, Muhammad" is used in the lead sentence, is that done in the secular sense or as a statement of guilt in an islamic court, making him a legitimate target to be killed under islamic law? This is a BLP problem. The article also seems to be taking sides on the contentious Aisha issue, whether Mohammed was, indeed, what modern people would consider a pedophile. Historical claims of the Aisha marriage have the age of the marriage ceremony as early as 6 (but possibly as late as 10) and the age of consummation as early as 9 (but possibly as late as 15). Taking sides is both an NPOV problem and hashing out the underlying Aisha issues on this page would be a COATRACK. What's needed is a clearer statement on whether we're talking about the generally understood insult or the islamic crime. TMLutas (talk) 22:36, 19 October 2012 (UTC)

Why was he on probation to begin with? Can anyone answer that? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 146.115.153.39 (talk) 02:28, 9 May 2014 (UTC)

Conspiracy Theory

Even if Garcia, in her interviews, claims that Nakoula told her he was Muslim and he made the film at the behest of the US or some other such crazy conspiracy theory, there is no actual evidence any of that is true or newsworthy. She has no evidence to back up her charge. 96.251.15.7 (talk) 05:00, 18 June 2014 (UTC)

This article is outdated. At Hillary Clinton's testimony on October 22, 2015, she said that they knew immediately at the time of the Benghazi attacks that it was a terrorist attack, and not inspired by a little-known video. She told the Egyptian prime minister within the first day that the attack had nothing to do with the video. It's unclear from this text how this obscure video came to be known, other than the publicity given to it by the administration. It's not clear why he was arrested in the middle of the night, since that's not the usual procedure for a parole violation, which are fairly commonplace. I'm no exper on all thist, but perhaps someone who knows more than I do should update this to reflect current knowledge. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2602:301:77C6:8E90:F8C7:B56C:E066:BC17 (talk) 18:13, 24 October 2015 (UTC)

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