| Revision as of 15:09, 8 October 2014 editRationalobserver (talk | contribs)11,997 edits →Seeking guidance: someone needs a nap!← Previous edit | Latest revision as of 10:18, 25 December 2024 edit undoVoceditenore (talk | contribs)Autopatrolled, Extended confirmed users, File movers, New page reviewers, Pending changes reviewers, Rollbackers123,168 edits →Merry Christmas: new sectionTag: New topic | ||
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| |quote = During my current work interim position, I have found myself with not a lot of spare time that isn't consumed by family. I can go long periods without logging in to Misplaced Pages. If you have an urgent note for me here, please consider alerting me via email at {{nospam|mdennis|wikimedia.org}}. (This is my work email address, and I do not mix work and volunteering, but mailing that address makes sure I will see it promptly, usually within a day.) If not urgent, I'll come by as soon as I can, and I heartily welcome talk page stalkers. :) Oh, I have discovered that sometimes when people don't ''tell'' me it's a volunteer contact, I have handled it with the wrong hat on. Please make which "me" you want clear! | |||
| |quote = In general, I check in with Misplaced Pages under this account around 12:00 ] on weekdays. I try to check back in at least once more during the day. On weekends, I'm here more often. When you loaded this page, it was {{Time|UTC}}. ] your page to see what time it is now. | |||
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| == Question, can you release Misplaced Pages contributions into CCO instead of CC BY-SA 3.0 == | |||
| I would prefer the former, but I always thought by clicking that save edit button I was agreeing to "irrevocably agree to release your contribution under the CC BY-SA 3.0 License and the GFDL". I recently saw this ] and became confused, especially since PD isn't a license and is incompatible with CC BY-SA 3.0. As an aside, am I to understand that since that notice appears on all edits that all edits to talk pages and userpages are released under CC BY-SA 3.0? Apologies for burdening you with these questions, and thank you for any response.] (]) 03:22, 1 October 2014 (UTC) | |||
| :Hi, ]. No apologies necessary. :) Yes, everything you put on your talk page or user page is licensed. (That's the easy one; I'm starting there. :D) There are no exceptions for any space to the ], and §7.a. is very specific as to license. Multi-licensing is certainly possible; it's the principle that allows you to release your content simultaneously under CC By SA and GFDL. People may choose which license to select for reuse, so theoretically anyone who wishes to release their content on Misplaced Pages under other licenses may do so, so long as it is ''also'' available under CC By SA and GFDL. However, I don't know if there is problem in multilicensing with CC0. I have put on my ] and written to the legal team to ask if feedback can be provided for this question. I have also updated ], which was so far out of date that it indicated that dual licensing was not requested or required on Misplaced Pages. (wince) It may need to be updated further based on the legal team's response. --] <sup>]</sup> 11:35, 1 October 2014 (UTC) | |||
| ::Thank you for the response and for looking into this. If it is the case that I can release contributions under both then I will do that. In the meantime take care and good luck with keeping the copyright policies up to date.] (]) 02:58, 6 October 2014 (UTC) | |||
| == Help needed (I am using the same headline too often) == | |||
| Hi Moonriddengirl! I'm going to take a Wikibreak from 4 Sep'14 to 10 Sep'14. But I am really sceptical about vandalism in certain articles which are in my watchlist. If you have no problem then, could you please please add the following articles in your watchlist? The articles are: | |||
| *'']'' (My concern - IP address users have a tendency to regularly add double names of characters inspite of hidden notices making the cast section confusing. For instance, the character Ayesha was married twice in this soap opera (but in the same family) and many (''many many'') Indian women have their husband's name as their middle name. So some add her name as Ayesha Siddhant Kapoor while some add her name as Ayesha Ram Kapoor. So I have written her name as Ayesha Kapoor. Similarly some add double names of various other characters. And I'm just sick and tired of undoing and reverting such edits - I don't know if this could be termed as vandalism...but still could you please watchlist this article) | |||
| *] | |||
| *] | |||
| *] | |||
| *] (as per the consensus achieved the show names should be italicised and the tenplate should be classified on the basis of format, but I fear that User:सुनील मलेठिया may undo all the edits) | |||
| *] (same as above) | |||
| *{{No redirect|Template:STAR Plus shows}} (सुनील मलेठिया is continuing to undo the edits and removing the redirect to the above mentioned template) | |||
| *] | |||
| *] (a disambiguation page) | |||
| Please, could you add these to your watchlist? --] (]) 17:34, 2 October 2014 (UTC) | |||
| :Hi, ]. I'm sorry, but I really think you're better asking somebody with more time on Misplaced Pages. I'm way behind on copyright work, and I have a hard time keeping up with my watchlist as it is! When I have time on Misplaced Pages, I've got a lot I need to do. I hope you enjoy your break. :) --] <sup>]</sup> 22:16, 2 October 2014 (UTC) | |||
| ::Thank you Moonridengirl! Could you please suggest anyone who can help me? :) --] (]) 10:54, 3 October 2014 (UTC) | |||
| :::I would just approach somebody who works in the area. This could, for instance, be a good opportunity for you to collaborate well with that one editor with whom you often disagree. --] <sup>]</sup> 10:55, 3 October 2014 (UTC) | |||
| ::::Uh huh! You mean TheRedPenOfDoom! Correct you are right...let me give it a try...I hope he helps me...(fingers crossed) --] (]) 11:17, 3 October 2014 (UTC) | |||
| {{-}} | |||
| == Plagiarism dispatch == | |||
| == Nomination of ] for deletion == | |||
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| Hi MRG, given ], I'd like to re-run your old "]" dispatch from 2009. Would you have any objections? If needed, I'd love for you to make any pertinent updates or changes. Best, ] <sup>]] ]]</sup> 17:38, 2 October 2014 (UTC) | |||
| :]! Absolutely no objections from me. :) I feel like I was more a support person there, though. But I'm delighted to see it run again and will be happy to give it a once-over to see if processes have changed anywhere. Is there a deadline? --] <sup>]</sup> 22:14, 2 October 2014 (UTC) | |||
| ::I'd ideally like to publish in the next 24-36 hours, although I've frequently set publishing goals and missed them. ;-) I've copied the text to ], and I'd love any updates, corrections, or tweaks! ] <sup>]] ]]</sup> 19:08, 3 October 2014 (UTC) | |||
| :::Ahh! I'm too late! I'm sorry, ]. I didn't realize that this was that imminent. :/ --] <sup>]</sup> 16:42, 5 October 2014 (UTC) | |||
| ::::No worries! If you see anything pressing, please feel free to make the change! ] <sup>]] ]]</sup> 18:54, 5 October 2014 (UTC) | |||
| Users may edit the article during the discussion, including to improve the article to address concerns raised in the discussion. However, do not remove the article-for-deletion notice from the top of the article until the discussion has finished.<!-- Template:Afd notice --></div> ] (]) 12:04, 6 October 2024 (UTC) | |||
| == Seeking guidance == | |||
| == Invitation to participate in a research == | |||
| I still cannot figure out if I am way off, or right on. Will you please tell me what your opinion is regarding this example: | |||
| Hello, | |||
| * : "We often recorded at night after everyone at the office had left." | |||
| :Article: "They usually recorded at night when XL's staff had left". | |||
| The Wikimedia Foundation is conducting a survey of Wikipedians to better understand what draws administrators to contribute to Misplaced Pages, and what affects administrator retention. We will use this research to improve experiences for Wikipedians, and address common problems and needs. We have identified you as a good candidate for this research, and would greatly appreciate your participation in this ''''''. | |||
| From my standpoint, the structure is unchanged, and the swapping of "We often" for "They usually" and "everyone at the office" for "XL's staff" fails as an attempt at fair paraphrasing. I think this is plagiarism, but what do you think? ] (]) 18:16, 2 October 2014 (UTC) | |||
| :Hi, ]. I know you'd really like a clear answer, but I'm afraid I can't give you one - not with a label. :/ I honestly do not involve myself a whole lot in plagiarism, especially not after finding out how much variance there is what people define as plagiarism in our context. We went back and forth over that years ago in getting the guideline promoted, and I don't even know if the current definition is one I'd agree with. Does it still talk about "inadvertent" plagiarism? Even though sources openly discuss it (), that was a hot point of contention. Anyway, since plagiarism is a social construct and not a legal code, I'm afraid I'm not comfortable declaring something that's kind of boderline as plagiarism or not plagiarism. It's not a word I often use now that I'm out of academia myself. I focus on copyright. I will say that I think those two sentences are too close in structure. I agree that simple word and phrase substitutions are a pitfall from the paraphrasing standpoint. And if there were a whole bunch of it from a non-free source, I would consider it a problem of close paraphrasing and remove or revise it for fear that we would be appropriating the total concept and feel. --] <sup>]</sup> 22:10, 2 October 2014 (UTC) | |||
| :: Thanks, Moonriddengirl! You are a wonderful editor and a wealth of knowledge. I hope you don't mind if I ask you questions from time to time! ] (]) 22:20, 2 October 2014 (UTC) | |||
| You do not have to be an Administrator to participate. | |||
| * Do you ? ] (]) 16:58, 7 October 2014 (UTC) | |||
| :*I have responded. I don't plan to hang out at that conversation, though. As I mentioned, there are a lot of other things calling to me when I'm on Wiki. --] <sup>]</sup> 21:37, 7 October 2014 (UTC) | |||
| ::: Thanks, but per a recent dispute with Dan56, "Note: even with in-text attribution, distinctive words or phrases may require quotation marks" does not apply to close paraphrasing. Is it your position that the note ''does'' apply to close paraphrasing? ] (]) 21:43, 7 October 2014 (UTC) | |||
| ::::Why wouldn't it? --] <sup>]</sup> 22:12, 7 October 2014 (UTC) | |||
| ::::: That's what I think, but because it is not ''under'' the close paraphrasing example it does not explicitly apply, or so says Dan56. All I'm trying to do here is affirm that it ''does'' apply, but nobody will address the problem. It's an oversight, I'm sure, but my efforts are being framed like I am ''changing'' the guideline, which I don't believe I am. Flyer22 with Dan56. If you think the note applies to close paraphrasing then why do you oppose repeating it under the CP example? ] (]) 22:28, 7 October 2014 (UTC) | |||
| ::::: FTR, Dan56's argument that in-text attribution remediates the need for quotation marks enclosing distinctive language can be seen in all its glory ]. ] (]) 22:43, 7 October 2014 (UTC) | |||
| ::::::But so far as I can see you're not talking about repeating it (which I wouldn't support) or clarifying what it applies to (which I might) - you're talking about a new statement, one that is aimed specifically at non-free text and which is stronger in its wording. :) The current statement is not limited to non-free sources, and it says "may". (] talks about the use of non-free sources in more detail, and is explicitly linked from the plagiarism guideline section on close paraphrasing.) If this all stems from that one article, though, wouldn't it be better to follow ] regarding it? --] <sup>]</sup> 23:49, 7 October 2014 (UTC) | |||
| ::::::: I don't know anything about DR except that most people think it's a waste of time, and I don't plan to ever cross paths with that editor again, but I am concerned that, if left open-ended in this regard, the policy might ''encourage'' him and others to rely on close paraphrasing. If you ''might'' support clarifying the guideline, then may I respectfully suggest that you be bold and do so? You are respected, and they'll trust and listen to you. All I'm asking for is less ambiguity. Nobody can seem to explain how the last two examples under avoiding plagiarism are different. Can you? ] (]) 00:03, 8 October 2014 (UTC) | |||
| {{unindent}}I don't think they ''are'' different. It looks to me like two examples of close paraphrasing with in-text attribution. That example is a relatively recent innovation - it was added in , along with some sweeping changes in the days that followed. Prior to that, there were only two: . It seems to me that if nobody can identify how they differ, then ''that'' may be the heart of this problem. I am willing to ask people if they see the point in the third example. --] <sup>]</sup> 01:26, 8 October 2014 (UTC) | |||
| The survey should take around 10-15 minutes to complete. You may read more about the study on its ] and view its ] . | |||
| ::::::::You would do well not to state that "Flyer22 seems to agree with " unless it is very clear. First, to you, , and now, to you, I do agree with Dan56. Or you're just stating that to make a point. Better yet, just don't mention me, whether you link my username or not. And before you make claims about me following you, you might want to check the number of times I've visited Moonriddengirl's talk page. ] (]) 01:17, 8 October 2014 (UTC) | |||
| :::::::::Are you trying to intimidate me, because you're wasting your time. I'll mention you wherever and as often as I want, and I don't care how many times you warn me that I do something, as your threats are empty and embarrassing. ] (]) 15:09, 8 October 2014 (UTC) | |||
| Please find our contact on the project Meta page if you have any questions or concerns. | |||
| == question about quoting articles == | |||
| Kind Regards, | |||
| Hi MG, I know there's a limit on quoting from books, but is there a limit on quoting newspapers? Specifically, using a person's quote from say the New York Times, and then later, quoting someone else from the same article? ] (]) 23:21, 2 October 2014 (UTC) | |||
| :Hi, ] . There's limits on quoting everything, but unfortunately there is no specific word count or percentage that it is safe to use. :/ As a general rule of thumb, I'd recommend trying to use paraphrase where possible and limiting the amount of quotations you take from any one source. However, if I were going to take multiple quotes from a NYT article, quoting what they've quoted somebody ''else'' as saying is probably a safer bet than quoting the content of the article itself. --] <sup>]</sup> 00:19, 3 October 2014 (UTC) | |||
| ] | |||
| ::Ah, yes I see the difference. So the quotes from somebody they're interviewing are okay, but paraphrase all the rest. Thanks much. ] (]) 00:32, 3 October 2014 (UTC) | |||
| :::Well, more okay, in my opinion, ]. :) The question of who owns the words of a person being interviewed had not been settled in copyright law last time I looked into it, but I would feel more comfortable using that a little more liberally than content original to the journalist. In any event, it shouldn't be extensive to accord with policy. Just more wriggle room, I think. :) --] <sup>]</sup> 10:09, 3 October 2014 (UTC) | |||
| <bdi lang="en" dir="ltr">] (]) 19:22, 23 October 2024 (UTC) </bdi> | |||
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| |style="vertical-align: middle; border-top: 1px solid gray;" | For ] help with close paraphrasing. ] ]] 13:19, 3 October 2014 (UTC) | |||
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| == Info about deleted article == | |||
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| I was looking through some old pages and found one that I made some edits on that had been deleted. The article was: ]. I'm not asking that it be undeleted, but I am curious about reading any archives that give specifics about why it was deleted. Any help would be appreciated. ] (]) 19:57, 3 October 2014 (UTC) | |||
| :{{tps}} {{ping|Sf46}} From what I can see in the deleted edits, the copyright holder of sent WP a complaint (OTRS ticket 2012101210000775) that the article violated the copyright of that page. (In a quick glance I can see some definite copyvio in the deleted article, but I haven't looked carefully to determine the totality of it.) MRG therefore blanked the article and listed it at ] (open the collapsed list to see). After about two and a half months with no improvement to the article, and having noted the response you can see on the copyright-problems page, she finally deleted it. (MRG, if I've misrepresented the situation, please apply a wet trout on my talk page.) ] (]) 20:28, 3 October 2014 (UTC) | |||
| ::Thank you, ]. :) That's it in a nutshell. Unfortunately, the copyvios could not be just reverted as it was a foundational issue or easily excised, and nobody worked on the article in the time it was listed for salvage. --] <sup>]</sup> 16:37, 5 October 2014 (UTC) | |||
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| == Close paraphrasing from PD source == | |||
| <bdi lang="en" dir="ltr">] (]) 00:18, 13 November 2024 (UTC) </bdi> | |||
| Hi MRG, I wonder if you could look at something for me please. It relates to some close paraphrasing on the list ]. uestions have been raised at the ] by one other editor and myself (in my capacity as FLC delegate). The information - and close paraphrasing - comes from: | |||
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| *{{cite journal|last1=Ward |first1=Philip S. |year=2007 |title= Phylogeny, classification, and species-level taxonomy of ants (Hymenoptera: Formicidae). |journal=] |volume=1668 |issue= |pages=549–563 |publisher= |doi= |url=http://www.mapress.com/zootaxa/2007f/zt01668p563.pdf }} | |||
| == ArbCom 2024 Elections voter message == | |||
| Could you advise as to whether you think that this close phrasing fits within our remit, as I am a little uncomfortble with it as it stands. Many thanks - ] (]) 07:44, 6 October 2014 (UTC) | |||
| <div class="ivmbox " style="margin-bottom: 1em; border: 1px solid #a2a9b1; background-color: #fdf2d5; padding: 0.5em; display: flex; align-items: center; "> | |||
| :Hi, ]. :) Well, the licensing statement certainly isn't easy to find on that source. :/ But an important distinction here is that while it is compatibly licensed, it ''isn't'' PD. Compatibly licensed material can legally be merged into our own works as long as the terms of the license are met. This is usually given through a notice on the page itself, and I see there is such a notice in the "references" section. However, while the note is a good faith attempt to comply with licensing, it doesn't quite fit the bill - to reuse content under CCBy, you . It's not adequate to refer people to a document that contains no information on the license. This is one of the terms mandatory for use of content under that license. This seems to be a problem with the template, but it needs to be repaired, either through the addition of an explicit link to the license where it is used or through reworking the template. Until it is repaired, that content is not compliant. | |||
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| :In terms of close paraphrasing, while I am seeing more people voicing discomfort with it lately, our current guideline at ] is satisfied with that general attribution without further notation of copying when the content is public domain or compatibly licensed. I don't know if featured criteria have a stricter stance, but could well imagine they ''might''. :) --] <sup>]</sup> 10:32, 6 October 2014 (UTC) | |||
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| ::I've opened the question of the template at ]. --] <sup>]</sup> 10:55, 6 October 2014 (UTC) | |||
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| Thanks MRG, I'll highlight the need for the link directly to the licence, as that is certainly needed here. Slightly surprisingly the ] do not have a stricter stance on paraphrasing, although I wish they did: I am not entirely comfortable in signing off something as featured when it is 95% taken from another source, and as closely paraphrased as it is here. Cheers - ] (]) 13:53, 6 October 2014 (UTC) | |||
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| |text = On ], ''']''' was updated with a fact from the article ''''']''''', which you recently created or substantially expanded. The fact was ''... that the founder and executive director of ''']''' is credited with almost single-handedly eradicating the practice of female genital mutilation in Ethiopia?'' {{#if: |The nomination discussion and review may be seen at ].|{{#ifexist:Template:Did you know nominations/KMG Ethiopia|The nomination discussion and review may be seen at ].|{{#ifexist:Template talk:Did you know/KMG Ethiopia|The nomination discussion and review may be seen at ].}} }} }} You are welcome to check how many page hits the article got while on the front page <small>(], , )</small>, and it may be added to ] if the total is over 5,000. Finally, if you know of an interesting fact from another recently created article, then please feel free to suggest it on the ]. | |||
| }}<!-- Template:UpdatedDYKNom --> —] | ] 12:04, 7 October 2014 (UTC) | |||
| Hi. A former helper of copyright clean-up here who last interacted with you ! I know you haven't been as active as you used to be, but thought I'd let you know that we have ] that's keen to help out in CCI. If ever you'd like to take an interest in Copyright cleanup again, I'm sure she'd be happy to collaborate with you. If not, that's OK, just saying hello to you. ] <sup>(])</sup> <sub>(])</sub> 09:40, 19 December 2024 (UTC) | |||
| == Before I block this editor, can you please check == | |||
| == Merry Christmas == | |||
| that is copyvio from (that is, that the source is copyright. It's clearly copied). He's ignored warnings or claimed fair use, and I've created a CCI. Thanks. ] (]) 12:47, 7 October 2014 (UTC) | |||
| :Hi, ]. The ] was first printed in the 1970s. It claims in the front of the book itself to be copyrighted with all rights reserved, and I see no reason at all to doubt it. So, | |||
| ::Thanks. I'll go ahead and revert and block. ] (]) 13:37, 7 October 2014 (UTC) | |||
| ] | |||
| == Don't worry == | |||
| '''Merry Christmas from London ...''' | |||
| I'm sure no one noticed . <small>]</small> 02:34, 8 October 2014 (UTC) | |||
| :LOL. :) --10:10, 8 October 2014 (UTC) | |||
| '''and may the New Year be a safe one, filled with peace and plenty.''' | |||
| == Coaching == | |||
| Best wishes, ] (]) 10:18, 25 December 2024 (UTC) | |||
| '']''<br/> | |||
| ] | |||
| Sister OR Fellow Wikipedian OR Moonriddengirl (whichever you like)<br/> | |||
| I want you to resume ] whenever you'll get time, as one more user has asked me for it. I need to clean up and revise everything. I attended 3—6 th October's India Wikimedia Conference, I am adding an image so that you can see "exactly who" you are talking to --<span style="background:orange;border:orange ridge">]</span><span style="color:blue;background:white;otit;border-bottom-style:ridge;">☸</span><span style="background:#57C738;border:green ridge">]</span> 12:12, 8 October 2014 (UTC) | |||
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If you are here with questions about an article I have deleted or a copyright concern, please consider first reading my personal policies with regards to deletion and copyright, as these may provide your answer. While you can email me to reach me in my volunteer capacity, I don't recommend it. I very seldom check that email account. If you do email me, please leave a note here telling me so or I may never see it. I hardly ever check that account. To leave a message for me, press the "new section" or "+" tab at the top of the page, or simply click here. Remember to sign your message with ~~~~. I will respond to all civil messages. I attempt to keep conversations in one location, as I find it easier to follow them that way when they are archived. If you open a new conversation here, I will respond to you here. Please watchlist this page or check back for my reply; I will leave you a "talkback" notice if you request one and will generally try to trigger your automatic notification even if you don't. (I sometimes fail to be consistent there; please excuse me if I overlook it.) If I have already left a message at your talk page, unless I've requested follow-up here or it is a standard template message, I am watching it, but I would nevertheless appreciate it you could trigger my automatic notification. {{Ping}} works well for that. If you leave your reply here, I may respond at your talk page if it seems better for context. If you aren't sure if I'm watching your page, feel free to approach me here. Admins, if you see that I've made a mistake, please fix it. |
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During my current work interim position, I have found myself with not a lot of spare time that isn't consumed by family. I can go long periods without logging in to Misplaced Pages. If you have an urgent note for me here, please consider alerting me via email at mdennis
wikimedia.org. (This is my work email address, and I do not mix work and volunteering, but mailing that address makes sure I will see it promptly, usually within a day.) If not urgent, I'll come by as soon as I can, and I heartily welcome talk page stalkers. :) Oh, I have discovered that sometimes when people don't tell me it's a volunteer contact, I have handled it with the wrong hat on. Please make which "me" you want clear!
Nomination of Susan Alice Buffett for deletion
A discussion is taking place as to whether the article Susan Alice Buffett is suitable for inclusion in Misplaced Pages according to Misplaced Pages's policies and guidelines or whether it should be deleted.
The article will be discussed at Misplaced Pages:Articles for deletion/Susan Alice Buffett until a consensus is reached, and anyone, including you, is welcome to contribute to the discussion. The nomination will explain the policies and guidelines which are of concern. The discussion focuses on high-quality evidence and our policies and guidelines.
Users may edit the article during the discussion, including to improve the article to address concerns raised in the discussion. However, do not remove the article-for-deletion notice from the top of the article until the discussion has finished.Clarityfiend (talk) 12:04, 6 October 2024 (UTC)
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Long time no see!
Hi. A former helper of copyright clean-up here who last interacted with you a long time ago! I know you haven't been as active as you used to be, but thought I'd let you know that we have a new candidate for adminship that's keen to help out in CCI. If ever you'd like to take an interest in Copyright cleanup again, I'm sure she'd be happy to collaborate with you. If not, that's OK, just saying hello to you. Am (Notes) 09:40, 19 December 2024 (UTC)
Merry Christmas
Merry Christmas from London ...
and may the New Year be a safe one, filled with peace and plenty.
Best wishes, Voceditenore (talk) 10:18, 25 December 2024 (UTC)