Talk:Armenian Orphan Rug: Difference between revisions

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Revision as of 21:39, 20 November 2014 editTiptoethrutheminefield (talk \| contribs)Extended confirmed users9,169 edits →Date it was woven: note← Previous edit		Latest revision as of 16:21, 25 January 2024 edit undoCewbot (talk \| contribs)Bots7,337,437 editsm Maintain {{WPBS}} and vital articles: 2 WikiProject templates. Create {{WPBS}}. Keep majority rating "C" in {{WPBS}}. Remove 2 same ratings as {{WPBS}} in {{WikiProject Armenia}}, {{WikiProject United States}}.Tag: Talk banner shell conversion
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			{{dyktalk\|11 December\|2014\|entry= ... that the ''']''' ''(pictured)'' was woven by 400 orphans of the ], and contains over four million hand-woven knots?}}
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	{{WikiProject ~~United~~ ~~States~~\|class=C}}		{{WikiProject banner shell\|class=C\|
		⚫	{{WikiProject Armenia\|importance=low}}
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	==pov tag==		==pov tag==
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	::::::I disagree that it's POV. But I will remove it for now so that it wont obstruct the DYK nomination process. I will return to it after it goes on the main page. ] (]) 21:22, 20 November 2014 (UTC)		::::::I disagree that it's POV. But I will remove it for now so that it wont obstruct the DYK nomination process. I will return to it after it goes on the main page. ] (]) 21:22, 20 November 2014 (UTC)
	:::::::That's fine for a temp fix. When you return it, to avoid the pov tag it has to be explained that it is an unsubstantiated claim, and that legitimate reasons for not allowing the display of the rug were presented by the White House. ] (]) 21:28, 20 November 2014 (UTC)		:::::::That's fine for a temp fix. When you return it, to avoid the pov tag it has to be explained that it is an unsubstantiated claim, and that legitimate reasons for not allowing the display of the rug were presented by the White House. ] (]) 21:28, 20 November 2014 (UTC)
			Photos of 2014 exhibit https://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set=a.10152597257896859.1073741909.16968936858&type=1 ] (]) 03:22, 24 November 2014 (UTC)

	==Date it was woven==		==Date it was woven==
	The ] article says he moved to Ghazir in October 1922 and established the orphanage there. The Armenian Weekly article says he established the carpet weaving factory there, with the implication that this is where the rug was woven. So where does the 1920 date come from? ] (]) 20:56, 20 November 2014 (UTC)		The ] article says he moved to Ghazir in October 1922 and established the orphanage there. The Armenian Weekly article says he established the carpet weaving factory there, with the implication that this is where the rug was woven. So where does the 1920 date come from? ] (]) 20:56, 20 November 2014 (UTC)
	:NB: 1920 date now changed to "early 1920s". ] (]) 21:39, 20 November 2014 (UTC)		:NB: 1920 date now changed to "early 1920s". ] (]) 21:39, 20 November 2014 (UTC)

			'''Suggestions for additional content.''' More needed about why Ghazir, and why a rug factory there. If the "gift of the rug received nationwide coverage", how about having some content detailing those contemporary news reports. Maybe they would also have said something about the carpet's design. And who is the person next to the president in the carpet photo? "Vice-President of Near East Foundation", given on the image's page, is too general to be helpful given that each US region had its own NEF branch with its own president and vice-president. ] (]) 00:33, 1 December 2014 (UTC)

			According to the White House's exhibition caption (see the facebook link I posted), the second person in the photo is Dr. John H. Finley. And the photo was taken on the White House lawn just south of the west wing. There is other content that could be usefully taken from this caption, but I'm not sure how it could be cited (and the content is probably derived for Deranian's book anyway). ] (]) 00:54, 1 December 2014 (UTC)

Latest revision as of 16:21, 25 January 2024

A fact from Armenian Orphan Rug appeared on Misplaced Pages's Main Page in the Did you know column on 11 December 2014 (check views). The text of the entry was as follows:

Did you know... that the Armenian Orphan rug (pictured) was woven by 400 orphans of the Armenian Genocide, and contains over four million hand-woven knots?

A record of the entry may be seen at Misplaced Pages:Recent additions/2014/December.

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pov tag

I have added this tag to the exhibition section because of the content dealing with the alleged 2013 proposed "exhibition". It contains serious distortions of reality. For example the supposed "exhibition" was just a half-day private viewing as part of a private event to launch a book about the carpet, and the proposal to display it at this private commercial event was rejected due to the proposer being unable to detail how the rug was to be safeguarded, how the cost would be covered, and why it should be made available at all for such a limited event. These reasonable objections were ignored as some Armenian activists rushed to make superficial propaganda to "big themselves up" amongst their community. It had nothing at all to do with "official policy over the Armenian Genocide". I'll add some sources that should enable the npov tag to be removed. Tiptoethrutheminefield (talk) 19:57, 20 November 2014 (UTC)

Tiptoethrutheminefield (talk · contribs) You better do it quick because this is going up for DYK. Étienne Dolet (talk) 20:03, 20 November 2014 (UTC)

I don't think it should go to DYN in its current state. There should be a mention of the exact size of the carpet if there is a source for its exact dimensions (rather than just saying "about") - since it is HUGE. Tiptoethrutheminefield (talk) 20:07, 20 November 2014 (UTC)

But that's not a DYK requirement. At any rate, if you find small problems like that then WP:FIXIT. Étienne Dolet (talk) 20:13, 20 November 2014 (UTC)

Tiptoethrutheminefield (talk · contribs) If you fail to provide verification for your above mentioned claims, then I will have to remove the POV tag. Please find sources that support your initial statement here and amend the article accordingly so we can move forward with this. Étienne Dolet (talk) 20:29, 20 November 2014 (UTC)

There is justification enough given for the tag to be there - remove it and I'll put it back. You could delete the content that needed the tag, the "was rejected by pressure from the White House over its official policy over the Armenian Genocide" claim. Tiptoethrutheminefield (talk) 20:54, 20 November 2014 (UTC)

I disagree that it's POV. But I will remove it for now so that it wont obstruct the DYK nomination process. I will return to it after it goes on the main page. Étienne Dolet (talk) 21:22, 20 November 2014 (UTC)

That's fine for a temp fix. When you return it, to avoid the pov tag it has to be explained that it is an unsubstantiated claim, and that legitimate reasons for not allowing the display of the rug were presented by the White House. Tiptoethrutheminefield (talk) 21:28, 20 November 2014 (UTC)

Photos of 2014 exhibit https://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set=a.10152597257896859.1073741909.16968936858&type=1 Tiptoethrutheminefield (talk) 03:22, 24 November 2014 (UTC)

Date it was woven

The Jakob Künzler article says he moved to Ghazir in October 1922 and established the orphanage there. The Armenian Weekly article says he established the carpet weaving factory there, with the implication that this is where the rug was woven. So where does the 1920 date come from? Tiptoethrutheminefield (talk) 20:56, 20 November 2014 (UTC)

NB: 1920 date now changed to "early 1920s". Tiptoethrutheminefield (talk) 21:39, 20 November 2014 (UTC)

Suggestions for additional content. More needed about why Ghazir, and why a rug factory there. If the "gift of the rug received nationwide coverage", how about having some content detailing those contemporary news reports. Maybe they would also have said something about the carpet's design. And who is the person next to the president in the carpet photo? "Vice-President of Near East Foundation", given on the image's page, is too general to be helpful given that each US region had its own NEF branch with its own president and vice-president. Tiptoethrutheminefield (talk) 00:33, 1 December 2014 (UTC)

According to the White House's exhibition caption (see the facebook link I posted), the second person in the photo is Dr. John H. Finley. And the photo was taken on the White House lawn just south of the west wing. There is other content that could be usefully taken from this caption, but I'm not sure how it could be cited (and the content is probably derived for Deranian's book anyway). Tiptoethrutheminefield (talk) 00:54, 1 December 2014 (UTC)

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