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Cyprus military ranks

I need help with the NCO ranks, i already made the png files how the ranks look but i dont know how to modify the code so i make it look like the greek one, cypriot army have 2 nco ranks for every rank, one for permanent NCOs that completed military academy and the other for SYP-EPY (in Greece EPOP-EMTh) for contracted NCOs that cannot become Warrant Officers, example bellow.

NCO and other ranks

NCO ranks (excl. OR-9 and conscript ranks) have undergone some changes through the years, the latest being in 2004.

NATO code	OR-9						OR-8		OR-7		OR-6						OR-5						OR-4				OR-3		OR-2						OR-1
Hellenic Army v t e																																			Arm/corps insignia only
	Ανθυπασπιστής Anthypaspistis						Αρχιλοχίας Archilochias		Επιλοχίας Epilochias		Λοχίας Lochias												Δεκανέας Dekaneas				Υποδεκανέας Ypodekaneas								Στρατιώτης Stratiotis
Greece (Conscripts)							No equivalent																												No insignia
	Δόκιμος Έφεδρος Αξιωματικός Dokimos Efedros Axiomatikos										Λοχίας Lochias												Δεκανέας Dekaneas				Υποδεκανέας Ypodekaneas		Υποψήφιος Έφεδρος Βαθμοφόρος Ypopsifios Efedros Bathmoforos						Στρατιώτης Stratiotis

1. tanea.gr (2004-10-11). "Aλλάζουν το εθνόσημο και οι «σαρδέλες»". ΤΑ ΝΕΑ (in Greek). Retrieved 2024-06-10.
2. "Διακριτικά Φ/Π Στολών Υπαξιωματικών Αποφοίτων ΣΜΥ" . army.gr (in Greek). Hellenic Army. Retrieved 26 May 2021.

References

Notes

1. ^ Greece has only one level of Warrant Officer. According to the current issue (2021) of STANAG 2116, the Greek Warrant Officers are included in OR-9, however they are afforded the privileges of an officer. See STANAG 2116 note 29, page D-9

• @Hog Farm: Hi. Would you be able to answer this question? I mean, does it come under the field you are knowledgeable about (MILHIST)? I already have a program/bot that finds the creators of discussions, I will ping the OP in few hours. —usernamekiran (talk) 06:09, 24 December 2024 (UTC)

Rules of recommendations to add links in an article

Hello ! I'd like to know if there are rules or recommendations to add links in an article.

I'm talking about internal links to Misplaced Pages in English.

As an example. We can choose the article "Bashar Al-Assad".
If there are a section or a sub-section citing "Moscow" (This is an example but I could take another subject mentionned on this article).

If Moscow is linked one time in the article. Can I do it for others sections or sub-sections if this is not the same sub-section or section ?

If you don't understand what I means with words "section" and "sub-section".
You can see the example below.

Can I draft an article about myself and get it published on this site?

Hi Everyone,

I am new here and I want to contribute a page of my own life story, but it may not work with the management since they prefer to have someone else to write about it. That's my understanding, but what if a person wants to do what I want with integrity and facts? I am trying to establish just one short page on the topic to start later edits by other editors. Thank you, Allpeoplearepeopleofcolor (talk) 22:27, 19 December 2024 (UTC)

Hi Allpeoplearepeopleofcolor. I suggest you take a look at Misplaced Pages:Autobiography, Misplaced Pages:What Misplaced Pages is not and Misplaced Pages:The answer to life, the universe, and everything because it sounds like you might be misunderstanding some things about Misplaced Pages and how it works. -- Marchjuly (talk) 22:33, 19 December 2024 (UTC)

To succeed, a draft submitted to AfC for review must have content verified by references to succeed. You are prohibited from creating a draft about yourself based on what you know to be true with the hope that other editors will provide the references (if there are any). David notMD (talk) 23:50, 19 December 2024 (UTC)

Thank you, David notMD. Allpeoplearepeopleofcolor (talk) 20:00, 20 December 2024 (UTC)

Hi Marchjuly, thank you for your suggestion. I've checked the contents you suggested me to look into and I gathered that there would be no chance for anyone to contribute their biography on Misplaced Pages. The only way apparent to me now is that other people who are willing to cover someone who are noted write a piece about that individual. Am I not misunderstanding now? Allpeoplearepeopleofcolor (talk) 03:12, 20 December 2024 (UTC)

In addition @Allpeoplearepeopleofcolor

I feel there is need for you to understand basic editing, See WP:Editing before creating articles as this can be very difficult for beginners who just joined the project. Tesleemah (talk) 05:24, 20 December 2024 (UTC)

You're not quite understanding. People who are truly notable can write biographies about themselves and have them published, and some have. But this is hard to do when you have a conflict of interest, as we all do about ourselves.

See WP:Golden Rule. That is what's required, in a nutsheell. Are there published reliable sources that are independent of you, providing significant coverage of you? If there are multiple such sources, then yes, you can write a biography citing them. The biography cannot use any information other than what is published, so you cannot write what you know, you must write what has been covered. ~Anachronist (talk) 05:43, 20 December 2024 (UTC)

Thank you for your comments and clarification. I do multiple have published reliable sources in English and Chinese that are independent of myself. I think I will tive i.rLetyme know if you have any more comments. I'd appreciate that. now? Allpeoplearepeopleofcolor (talk) 18:19, 20 December 2024 (UTC)

Yes, I get it. Thank you. Allpeoplearepeopleofcolor (talk) 20:02, 20 December 2024 (UTC)

@Allpeoplearepeopleofcolor: As posted above, even though creating an article about yourself isn't expressly prohibited, it can be quite hard and those who try often end up feeling quite frustrated when they start running into problems while trying to do so. My suggestion to you would be to use the Misplaced Pages:Articles for creation process to first work on a draft for an article and then submit that draft for review when you think it's ready. If the draft is declined (even multiple times), the reviewer will explain why and otherwise leave feedback on what further is needed for the draft to someday be accepted as an article. There's no real deadline when it comes to drafts, and you can work at your own pace on it. The only thing you need to do is continue working on improving it and avoid submitting the same declined version over and over again; you also need to make sure you don't "abandon" the draft by not making any meaningful edits to it for six months because such drafts are eligible for speedy deletion. You're not required to start a draft per se, but once something gets added to the Misplaced Pages article namespace, pretty much anything goes and the page can be edited by anyone at anytime; this could mean improvements, but it could just as easily mean being nominated, proposed or tagged for WP:DELETION. Before pressing ahead, you might want to take a look at Misplaced Pages:Notability (people), Misplaced Pages:Biographies of living persons, Misplaced Pages:Conflict of interest editing (particularly the WP:COISELF and WP:LUC sections), Misplaced Pages:Ownership of content and Misplaced Pages:An article about yourself isn't necessarily a good thing because you'll have pretty much zero final editorial control over any article you create about yourself, and all of it's content will be expected to be in accordance with relevant Misplaced Pages policies and guidelines, which in some cases might not be the same as what you want it to be. -- Marchjuly (talk) 20:29, 20 December 2024 (UTC)

Again, thanks for the thorough explanations. I have gained a lot more understanding now. So, it's the best for other people to write about someone else. I get it, but how about people have someone other than themselves write their biography, for example, people who know the topic person well, or hired writers? Allpeoplearepeopleofcolor (talk) 21:08, 20 December 2024 (UTC)

It's best to avoid COI editing, especially paid editing. It tends to attract hostile scrutiny.

Depending on who you are, there may be someone who would be interested in writing an article about you. Many editors specialize in certain types of biography: sports figures, academicians, scientists; the bios I write are often about chefs. But that would require you to disclose your identity, which you may not want to do. Valereee (talk) 21:15, 20 December 2024 (UTC)

@Allpeoplearepeopleofcolor: Any type of "paid" editing needs to be done in accordance with WP:PAID; it's not expressly prohibited to have an article created by paying someone to do it for you, but basically that's a contract between you and the other party that has nothing to do with Misplaced Pages. It's your money and you're free to spend it as you please, but there are lots of WP:SCAMs out there that promise all kinds of things that simply are impossible to deliver; so, if you do decide to take that path, you should make sure to ask lots of questions before giving someone your money because Misplaced Pages won't help you get it back if things go wrong. Other options to consider might be trying WP:RA (which seems to be more miss than hit) or asking on the talk page of a WikiProject that might be related to whatever you think makes you Misplaced Pages notable. Whatever you do, you're going to most likely find it hard to remain anonymous because Misplaced Pages operates in the WP:REALWORLD, and the way it's set up can make it easy for others to connect the dots and figure out who you really are.Personally, I still find it a bit odd when people seek to either create Misplaced Pages articles about themselves or try to find/pay someone to create such an article on their behalf. That sort of indicates to me that said person might be mistaking Misplaced Pages for some type of social media site or other kind of online profile site, which it's most definitely not. The most natural way for someone to have a Misplaced Pages article created about them is for them to do enough Misplaced Pages notable things so that reliable sources start covering them to the point that someone completely unconnected to them wants to create such an article. Of course, since this tends to work better for really famous people like movie stars. musicians, pro athletes, etc. than it does for other types of people who tend to be ignored by main stream media sources, I can somewhat understand feeling "I've got to do this myself because nobody is going to do it for me". Still it comes down to someone wanting to have a Misplaced Pages article written about them despite the fact that they're pretty much going to have zero control over what that article becomes over time. There seem to be much better WP:ALTERNATIVEs these days for someone to establish an online presence that they'll have total editorial control over and be able to use to let the world know about all about themselves. -- Marchjuly (talk) 23:23, 20 December 2024 (UTC)

Sorry to bother you again. Did you mean that the persons (such as celebrities, known politicians) who have a page written by unconnected people is not able to edit that page which is about the very themselves? Allpeoplearepeopleofcolor (talk) 18:57, 22 December 2024 (UTC)

They can edit it, but anyone else is free to edit, too. Article subjects have no control over the articles about them. Other editors can add stuff you'd prefer not to include and can remove stuff you'd like to include. Valereee (talk) 20:23, 22 December 2024 (UTC)

@Allpeoplearepeopleofcolor: The subjects of articles can edit said articles, but they're going to be expected to do so in accordance with relevant Misplaced Pages policies and guidelines just like any other editor; the subjects of articles don't "own" the articles in the sense that they've got total control over what's written in the article, and they can't stop others from editing the article. When the subject of an article has a problem with what's written about them, Misplaced Pages has processes in place to try and help them sort things out as explained here; Misplaced Pages, however, doesn't do what the subject wants just because the subject wants it done. -- Marchjuly (talk) 00:00, 23 December 2024 (UTC)

The general guidance is that the subject of an article can make minor corrections to grammar, spelling, numers, names, etc, can add citations to reliable independent sources, and can revert obvious vandalism. Anything more substantive than that should be proposed on the article talk page.

That's after the article has been published. While it's still a draft, the subject is free to make any edits to it, and a reviewer would either accept the draft for publicaiton or decline it. ~Anachronist (talk) 00:09, 23 December 2024 (UTC)

Sandbox

Is there any way to use existing articles as template sorta things for the sandbox? Any help is appreciated! Willzdawgh (talk) 04:05, 21 December 2024 (UTC)

Hello, Willzdawgh. Yes. you can copy an existing article into your sandbox, but for attribution purposes, you should use an edit summary of something like "Copying (article title) into my sandbox for article development purposes". Wikilink the article in question where I said (article title). Cullen328 (talk) 04:18, 21 December 2024 (UTC)

Copying Donald Trump into my sandbox for article development purposes

Like that? Willzdawgh (talk) 04:20, 21 December 2024 (UTC)

That is a massive and highly controversial article, Willzdawgh. Why on earth would you select that article? Cullen328 (talk) 04:34, 21 December 2024 (UTC)

srry if I did something wrong bro. I'm new and I also forgot to mention that I was wanting to do this merely bc I was bored. I'm sorry if that's a problem. More specifically I wanted to mess around with hypertranslate and replace the article's text with the result on hypertranslate. I'm sorry if I'm unknowingly planning on doing something I'm not allowed to. I'll refrain from doing this if that's the case. Once again, very sorry. Willzdawgh (talk) 04:42, 21 December 2024 (UTC)

No need to apologize. If you're here to experiment, I recommend scouting scouting out stub articles via Special:RandomPage, pasting the wikitext into your sandbox, and messing around with the source there. If you need any help, you can refer to the tutorial at Help:Wikitext, the cheatsheet at Help:Cheatsheet, or an experienced editor (not me.) Thanks for asking, Sparkle and Fade _edits 04:45, 21 December 2024 (UTC)

Something like that should be done either A) on your computer or B) in your sandbox. Certainly not on a massive and controversial page like Donald Trump User:Someone-123-321 (I contribute, Talk page so SineBot will shut up) 07:18, 24 December 2024 (UTC)

Willzdawgh Applying the Hypertranslate software to the text of an existing article and then replacing the original text would be considered vandalism and would result in your account being indefinitely blocked. If all you are is curious about what repeated Google Translate would do to any Misplaced Pages text, do that on your own computer and do not bring it back to Misplaced Pages. David notMD (talk) 11:45, 21 December 2024 (UTC)

Passive voice in articles

 Courtesy link: Sacred Reich (sandbox)

I'm working on a draft for the Sacred Reich article (at my sandbox) for a major edit, and I ran my text through numerous grammar/spellcheckers like EasyBib and Grammarly. The most common—and most confusing—is on the use of passive voice. For context, passive voice is "the ball was kicked by Jeremy", while active voice is "Jeremy kicked the ball". I don't know whether or not I should be using passive voice in my prose (i.e. "Greg Hall was fired from the band and was replaced by drummer Tim Radziwill). I have attempted to use featured articles as examples, but usually doesn't seem to happen because of the abundance of information on the subject (i.e The Beatles or Alice in Chains) compared to a band like Sacred Reich. In my opinion, I'm not sure whether or not to use passive voice because it sounds rough when introducing a new member.

For example, "Greg Hall ... was replaced by Dave McClain ... later that year." vs. "Dave McClain replaced Greg Hall later that year." usually justifies using passive voice, but in context, this his first mention in the article and it disrupts the flow of the prose. In context:

Sacred Reich toured for nearly two years in support of The American Way, headlining major tours with Atrophy, Obituary, and Forced Entry. They also supported Venom in Europe and for Sepultura on their Arise tour in both Europe and North America. In 1991, the band released an EP, titled A Question. Former S.A. Slayer member Dave McClain replaced Greg Hall, who found their extensive touring to be difficult, later that year.

I'm still not sure if it justifies using active voice or not. If it does, please let me know. On a side note, I've noticed an abundance of the phrase "later that year" in my writing, and I don't know how to rewrite it properly because of vague dates in the source material. If anyone can help me with that as well, please let me know so I can get rid of the repetition. Thanks for reading. —Sparkle and Fade _edits 04:33, 21 December 2024 (UTC)

I think it's clunky because of where you put 'later that year'. It reads much better if you put it first - Later that year former S.A. Slayer member Dave McClain replaced Greg Hall, who found the extensive touring difficult. I don't think you should worry too much about active vs passive voice. Despite what grammar checkers might tell you, there's no one right way to write. Blackballnz (talk) 06:29, 21 December 2024 (UTC)

Thanks for the tip, Blackballnz. I appreciate the advice, it does actually seem more about the word placement than the voice construction, and I'll make sure to refactor the article to read better. Thanks, Sparkle and Fade _edits 06:56, 21 December 2024 (UTC)

In my view, Sparkle & Fade, the active voice is almost always best for writing encyclopedia articles. We favor a direct, clear and concise style of writing. Here is a good explanation from the University of Wisconsin - Madison. Misplaced Pages:Writing better articles also offers a lot of good advice. Cullen328 (talk) 07:50, 21 December 2024 (UTC)

passive voice is best used when you have to avoid to ascribe an action to someone. Example: somebody was fired from the band. The reference uses passive voice, thereby avoiding to say who did it. Now you have a choice. Either search for a reference, that says who was firing or use passive voice too to avoid to say who did the firing. What you can't do is to figure out who could do the firings in general and then ascribe that firing to him in active voice! 176.0.139.10 (talk) 12:03, 21 December 2024 (UTC)

When it matters (and you know) who took the action, use the active. When it's not important who was the actor, by all means use the passive. Grammarly and its friends express a prejudice against the passive which appeared in the early 20th C, often by writers who failed to follow their own injunction, and sometimes appeared unable to detect a passive accurately. See http://itre.cis.upenn.edu/%7Emyl/languagelog/archives/003380.html. ColinFine (talk) 15:33, 21 December 2024 (UTC)

here's what every professor in college ever told me about writing expository, "use active voice!" It doesn't always sound good, but we aren't trying to be artistic or poetic with expository, we are trying to be clear and concise, and active voice is always the clearer choice.

Also, if you move "later that year" to the beginning of the sentence as one contributor suggested, please put a comma after "year" as it is a prepositional phrase. I.e. Later that year, former S.A. Slayer member... BTW, I do agree with putting it at the beginning. It sounds better and makes the sentence clearer. Dougjaso (talk) 18:04, 24 December 2024 (UTC)

However, also note what our Manual of Style says in MOS:PASSIVE:

The passive voice is inappropriate for some forms of writing, but it is widely used in encyclopedia articles, because the passive voice avoids inappropriate first- and second-person constructions as well as tone problems. The most common uses of encyclopedic passive are to keep the focus on the subject instead of performing a news-style shift to dwelling on a non-notable party.

CodeTalker (talk) 23:04, 24 December 2024 (UTC)

New editor needs some help.

Hi there, I'm new. I wrote 2 drafts: 1 about an Internship Program which I found interested in, 1 is a course in social science field. I submitted 2 drafts and all rejected.

After editing few more things. I still don't know how to make references more reliable, or which content is the promoting material?

Here is my 2 drafts: MIP and Vietnamese writing practice Miyano25 (talk) 08:15, 21 December 2024 (UTC)

Miyano25 Hello and welcome to the Teahouse. Note that "rejected" has a specific meaning in the draft process, that a draft may not be resubmitted. Your drafts were "declined", meaning that they may be resubmitted.

Misplaced Pages is not a place to just tell about something. A Misplaced Pages article summarizes what independent reliable sources with significant coverage have chosen on their own to say about the topic, showing how it meets the special Misplaced Pages definition of notability- such as a notable organization. Regarding MIP, you did a great job telling about the structure of the program and its offerings- but that's not what we're looking for(alone, at least). We're looking for a summary of what others say about the program. The same goes for the Vietnamese course. You can't "make references more reliable"- they either are, or they're not. Reliable sources are those which have a reputation of fact checking and editorial control- like reputable news outlets(just one example). 331dot (talk) 08:41, 21 December 2024 (UTC)

Oh I see, thanks for explaining. Is it okay if I can summarize what other people say about the program but don't have a source to back it up, or have a source but it's not reliable to make it as a source? Miyano25 (talk) 14:23, 23 December 2024 (UTC)

Watchlist preferences and settings

My watchlist continues to show categorization edits, despite checking <Hide categorization of pages> in my preferences. I've tried both the javascript and the non-javascript watchlists. The unwanted watchlist edits that do appear seem to all be made via either HotCat or Cat-a-lot. They aren't marked as minor edits, but I actually don't want to hide all minor edits. I have also selected the watchlist filter <Human (not bot)>, without luck; perhaps because they're merely semi-automated edits (as opposed to actual bots?). I have checked the tag to exclude all AWB edits, which does work for those. Does anyone have any thoughts? Scottyoak2 (talk) 02:00, 22 December 2024 (UTC)

Are you speaking about the Watchlist for Misplaced Pages in English language ?

Can you make screenshots ? I can possibly help you with some screenshots but I can't guarantee I can help you with efficiency. Anatole-berthe (talk) 04:56, 22 December 2024 (UTC)

Thanks for your reply. The English Misplaced Pages, yes. I just was hoping that someone might already know how to filter out streams of edits made with HotCat or Cat-a-lot that sometimes flood my watchlist. If not, I can take a pair of pruning shears to my watchlist--an activity which might make a good New Year's resolution. Scottyoak2 (talk) 14:25, 22 December 2024 (UTC)

Are you seeing edits to pages on you watchlist that happen to change the categories? Or is the category itself on your watchlist? Because I think the "Hide categorization of pages" setting only applies to categories you are watching. So if you uncheck that preference, and you add a category to your watchlist, you'll see any page that is added to or removed from that category show up in your watchlist. With the preference enabled, you won't see those changes, but you'd still see changes to the category itself, for example to the description.

I'm not sure if there's an easy way to filter out category-change edits to pages you see watching, because those edits are fundamentally just regular edits. And they are usually not minor edits, because category changes can be quite controversial sometimes, especially around BLPs or other contentious topics. --rchard2scout (talk) 03:12, 23 December 2024 (UTC)

Technical question about the long hyphen

Hi!

I've been editing the timeline of Polermo where the long hyphen dominates, but I can't seem to generate one.Typing a regular hyphen, gives me just that - a regular hyphen, typing two hyphens gives me two hyphens (--) and trying to make one through the keboard shortcut which I found on internet forums (Alt+0151), just gives me one that's too long (—). So far I've been copying and pasting existing long hyphens which is kind of annoying, does anyone have any better solutions?

Thanks! Moonshane1933 (talk) 14:38, 22 December 2024 (UTC)

Hello, @Moonshane1933. I think you're talking about an em-dash. See MOS:EMDASH ColinFine (talk) 14:52, 22 December 2024 (UTC)

Yes! That's what I meant! Thank you! Moonshane1933 (talk) 15:15, 22 December 2024 (UTC)

I don't think you could find a better character in "unicode table".

This "article" is listing the most common characters.

There are also the "Unicode block" entry on Misplaced Pages that can be maybe helpful. Anatole-berthe (talk) 14:54, 22 December 2024 (UTC)

Excellent. Thank you too! Moonshane1933 (talk) 15:16, 22 December 2024 (UTC)

I don't think ressources I shared with you will help you but I hope it will. Anatole-berthe (talk) 15:45, 22 December 2024 (UTC)

Ignoring the Minus sign, there are three 'horizontal line' characters most commonly used in text, the hyphen, the N-dash and the M-dash. There are various ways to insert the latter two; usually I do so with +0150 and +0151. Despite being a former professional book editor, I have not previously encountered a "long hyphen" (a term not found anywhere in Misplaced Pages). Note that the lengths of all these characters may look different in different typefaces: I suspect your "long hyphen" is an N-dash. {The poster formerly known as 897.81.230.195} 94.1.223.204 (talk) 17:00, 22 December 2024 (UTC)

@Moonshane1933 If you use the source editor, which you can do even if you mainly edit with the visual editor, you'll find that the N-dash and M-dash appear at the foot of the editing window, where you can click on them to insert them into text. Other useful tags like <ref></ref> are also available with a single click. Mike Turnbull (talk) 14:11, 24 December 2024 (UTC)

OOOOOOOHHHH... THANK YOU! That makes life easier! I hadn't even thought of looking at the source editor, because it always looks headache inducing to me. I'll give it a try. Thank you so much. Moonshane1933 (talk) 13:07, 25 December 2024 (UTC)

Yes, well, the "long hyphen" is a term that I coined, simply because I lacked the knowledge of its correct name, So I would have been very surprised if it had appeared in Misplaced Pages. Anyway, thank you, oh mysterious IP poster, I hope our paths cross again! Moonshane1933 (talk) 13:03, 25 December 2024 (UTC)

This may be the wrong place to mention this

On the page Lowercase Sigmabot |||, there is a infobox; in that infobox lies an image of a supposed “plane” labeled “Lowercase sigmabot ||| archiving a discussion” or something like that. Is this a joke by the moderators of Misplaced Pages? Selectortopic (talk) 16:06, 22 December 2024 (UTC)

This is not an article but an Userpage. Humor is allowed on this kind of page.

If you click on my nickname. You could read my page. Anatole-berthe (talk) 16:17, 22 December 2024 (UTC)

No, @Selectortopic, it's a joke by whoever edited that page (actually the user, @Lowercase sigmabot III). We don't have moderators, and admins have no role in the content of articles (though the users who are admins may have, but not in their admin role) ColinFine (talk) 16:18, 22 December 2024 (UTC)

@Selectortopic: It's a humorous remark added by the bot operator who is not an administrator. Many bot operators are normal users. PrimeHunter (talk) 16:56, 22 December 2024 (UTC)

Someone know how to create a bot for a repetitive task ? Anatole-berthe (talk) 17:01, 22 December 2024 (UTC)

@Anatole-berthe See WP:BOTR page where you can make a request. There may already be a bot to do what you want and you need to explain in detail what you want and why. Mike Turnbull (talk) 17:38, 22 December 2024 (UTC)

Thanks ! Anatole-berthe (talk) 20:59, 22 December 2024 (UTC)

How can i improve my page?

I'm actually working on the wikipedia page Villa Fraccaroli for a university project, i need to improve the page to be categorized as B before the 31 of december to get a good mark (it's actually start class), it is really difficult to find some good and reliable sources. Thank you in advance! Liucmicol01 (talk) 17:35, 22 December 2024 (UTC)

I think it is not realistic to expect this page be categorized B before the 31 of december.
Anatole-berthe (talk) 17:41, 22 December 2024 (UTC)

Liucmicol01, the lead (opening section) of an article should summarise the body of the article. As faar as I can tell, the second paragraph of Villa Fraccaroli does not relate to anything in the body of the article. Maproom (talk) 18:12, 22 December 2024 (UTC)

That seems like an unreasonable expectation, as the assessment depends on someone else doing the assessing, and Misplaced Pages has no deadlines. If your prof -- Limelightangel, it looks like? -- wants to do the assessments, they can, but it's not really reasonable to expect assessments to be done by others. Valereee (talk) 18:12, 22 December 2024 (UTC)

Hello, @Liucmicol01. As you were told two days ago, there is no way to guarantee that the article will get any particular rating by a particlar date, and few editors are much concerned with ratings anyway. But since you are concerned with ratings, you would do best to ask at the talk page of one of the Wikiprojects related to the article. ColinFine (talk) 18:15, 22 December 2024 (UTC)

@Liucmicol01 .... or just assign a "B" yourself and hope that your instructor doesn't notice who did that edit ;-) Mike Turnbull (talk) 18:28, 22 December 2024 (UTC)

Although as MDT pointed out, you could yourself change the rating from C-class to B-class, don't. The article does not qualify. From just a quick look at some of the content and references, the refs do not always verify the content. David notMD (talk) 13:41, 23 December 2024 (UTC)

Search suggestions have changed for the worse

I have always been able to count on Misplaced Pages's search function to provide me with a list of articles connected with the term entered in the search field. Today, however, I'm not getting these, but rather only short and apparently arbitrary lists of articles that I've viewed or edited. When I type "A", for example, I get:

ajedrez
Angelou
Alvin Bragg
Abbot and Costello
Athena
Ari

When I add a "b" to this, the list becomes:

Abbot and Costello
Abe Fortas

When I add an "r", I get nothing, no Abrahams or anything else.

And so on. This is a purely arbitrary example, but I hope it serves to illustrate. What I would always get before would be a list of a dozen or so articles, which was limited but very often helpful. I checked my preferences but all I saw was "Disable the suggestions dropdown-lists of the search fields", which was unchecked as always. Any info or advice on this would be very welcome, thanks. Bret Sterling (talk) 17:36, 22 December 2024 (UTC)

I personally always use advanced search, but you can try google with the modifier site:en.wikipedia.org to force it to only search wikipedia (or just type "wikipedia" before your search query) Cmrc23 ʕ•ᴥ•ʔ 17:43, 22 December 2024 (UTC)

@Bret Sterling Are you using the current default WP:VECTOR22 skin? I find that its search box is better than for other, older, skins and the results for "Abr" are perfectly sensible, with the first suggestion being Abr. Mike Turnbull (talk) 18:35, 22 December 2024 (UTC)

Thanks for these suggestions, Cmrc23 and Michael D. Turnbull. The Advanced search option does provide me with many good finds and I should have been using it previously, but Content pages gives me results like I used to get directly under the search text field only more of them. I checked my WP skin and saw I was using the current default but still not getting the suggestions, so then I could figure it was something on my end and checked to see if I had "Block scripts" activated in Brave Shields. I saw that I did, deactivated it and now I'm getting the suggestions as before. Sorry, false alarm, this wasn't a Misplaced Pages change as I wrongly suspected. It's interesting that I could get suggestions on pages I've frequented by turning "Block scripts" back on, and I'm curious as to how that works – I mean the apparently default behavior without whatever the script is. Bret Sterling (talk) 19:32, 22 December 2024 (UTC)

But wait a minute. Now I'm not getting the alternative search options (Content pages, Multimedia, Everything, Advanced). Claude AI tells me to type "Special:Search" in the search box to access these and this works, but I had them there just now today without doing this. (I couldn't have done it because I was unaware of the possibility.) So how did I have those options for a while but then didn't have them afterwards? And (what may be the same question) how do I get them without having to type "Special:Search" in the search box? I can do that, but it seems clunky and I have to remember the text to type it. Bret Sterling (talk) 19:49, 22 December 2024 (UTC)

There a variety of userscripts to enhance the search function: Misplaced Pages:User_scripts/List#Search_form Cmrc23 ʕ•ᴥ•ʔ 10:34, 23 December 2024 (UTC)

@Bret Sterling I assume that by turning on "Block scripts" Brave Shields is preventing Javascript from running in your browser. The problem is that, as WP:JAVASCRIPT explains, Java is a core part of how much of Misplaced Pages works, both the standard Mediawiki software and many optional extras like gadgets and userscripts. So, if you are prevernting that running, you are sacrificing functionality for security. Is there an option in Brave Shields to exempt the Misplaced Pages domain from the block? Mike Turnbull (talk) 11:03, 23 December 2024 (UTC)

Misplaced Pages Timezone

Out of sheer curiosity, what Time zone does Misplaced Pages operate under? I'm in the Pacific Standard time zone, and the Did You Know... and On This Day... update at around 4:00pm every day. Shovel Shenanigans (talk) 18:36, 22 December 2024 (UTC)

@Shovel Shenanigans WP operates under UTC but you can change the defaults you see in your preferences. Mike Turnbull (talk) 18:37, 22 December 2024 (UTC)

@Shovel Shenanigans If you need help to change this in your preference. I can help. Anatole-berthe (talk) 18:39, 22 December 2024 (UTC)

@Anatole-berthe That's okay, thank you! Honestly, the daily change at 4:00 helps me stick to my schedule. Since I almost always have Misplaced Pages open, I know it's time to take a break from my other computer-related work when the DYK and OTD changes.

@Michael D. Turnbull Thanks for the quick reply, and my curiosity has been sated :) Shovel Shenanigans (talk) 20:09, 22 December 2024 (UTC)

That's wonderful ! Anatole-berthe (talk) 20:31, 22 December 2024 (UTC)

Papiermark and other money from Weimar Germany

Hi, I inherited some German banknotes from between 1908 and 1923 and I was wondering wether I could upload scans of them to Wikimedia. I scanned them in out of personal interest and then thought they might be useful.

My main question is about copyright, as in, do I have to ask someone for permission and if so who? But also whether I should digitally sharpen them and how do I properly sort them in? I'm quite new to this and any help is appreciated! The scans are at 1200dpi and saved as 98% JPEGs, with filesizes between 5 and 20MB. I already skimmed over WP:IUP but couldn't find anything related to money or bank notes and I read the copyright data of this scan but I'm unsure if this also applies to my case. Skylar Mlem (talk) 18:46, 22 December 2024 (UTC)

Hello, do you know who made the designs for the original banknotes? You might want to review the copyright information for this file: File:Banknote - Sächsische Bank zu Dresden - 100 Mark - 1911.jpg Cmrc23 ʕ•ᴥ•ʔ 19:39, 22 December 2024 (UTC)

Hello, @Skylar Mlem. The best place to ask about this sort of question is WP:MCQ. ColinFine (talk) 19:48, 22 December 2024 (UTC)

Skylar Mlem Another place, possibly better?, is at Misplaced Pages Commons where you will upload your images, and ultimately will have to defend copyright status. The help center for copyright issues at Commons is at c:Commons:Village pump/Copyright. You might find this old, archived Commons discussion on the copyright status of § German currency interesting as well. Mathglot (talk) 06:08, 23 December 2024 (UTC)

How do I welcome a new user?

I noticed a new user that hasn't been welcomed yet. I've seen the templates used on other talk pages; should I just copy paste the source and adapt, or is there a welcome button I can use instead? guninvalid (talk) 22:13, 22 December 2024 (UTC)

Hi @Guninvalid. There are a number of welcome templates to choose from. Also, if you enable WP:TWINKLE, it has a dropdown menu that lets you select the welcome message that you want to leave on a user talk page, much easier that way. (Twinkle has a bunch of other really useful functions as well.) Hope that helps. Schazjmd (talk) 22:25, 22 December 2024 (UTC)

@Guninvalid this might be of use to you, Misplaced Pages:Welcoming committee Knitsey (talk) 22:33, 22 December 2024 (UTC)

Doesn't matter anymore, the user I wanted to welcome got blocked by the checkuser. I only wanted to welcome them because I posted them on WP:AN and I noticed they had never been welcomed. guninvalid (talk) 22:54, 22 December 2024 (UTC)

Mystery Dungeon additional info

Hey I just noticed that the mystery dungeon series is missing an entry and I wasnt sure where to ask to add it, this just seemed like the closest thing to an editor contact place. The entry in question is "Chocobo's Mystery Dungeon Every Buddy!" , released back in 2019 176.6.56.156 (talk) 02:51, 23 December 2024 (UTC)

The article "Chocobo (series)" is not at all long; adequately referenced material about individual items in the series could be added to this article. -- Hoary (talk) 04:10, 23 December 2024 (UTC)

I have a edited page when I was not logged in,now I am logged in,how do I get it back?

How,how do I get it back? 219.78.249.54 (talk) 04:24, 23 December 2024 (UTC)

You were not logged in when you made this post. When you are correctly logged in, you can edit your userpage to reflect articles that you have worked on as an IP editor. Cullen328 (talk) 07:07, 23 December 2024 (UTC)

And to find the pages you edited, look for your contributions: Special:Contributions/--Your-username--. eg Special:Contributions/219.78.249.54 shows editing Residence Oasis, but Sumanuil reverted all the edits. Graeme Bartlett (talk) 08:51, 23 December 2024 (UTC)

Moving my English Misplaced Pages user page to media wiki for a global user page

I can move my English user page to media wiki to have a global page for all sister projects? I know I can just ask to delete my English page and make a media wiki one but I kinda wanna move it for the edit history. If I can't move it to media wiki ill just move it to User:Anthony2106/old user page Anthony2106 (talk) 04:55, 23 December 2024 (UTC)

What you are asking for @Anthony2106: is an import. You would have to find an administrator on meta, but even so may not be actionable. Instead I would advise you just to create a new page yourself on meta, as you will find that many templates are unavailable there. Graeme Bartlett (talk) 08:46, 23 December 2024 (UTC)

You saying they will only import important things -- not user pages? Also i'm not worried about the templates as I can use {{:w to get wikipedia templates. Anthony2106 (talk) 08:58, 23 December 2024 (UTC)

On this topic, I was wondering if making an account on english wikipedia counts as a global account for wikipedia purposes Cmrc23 ʕ•ᴥ•ʔ 10:24, 23 December 2024 (UTC)

@Cmrc23 Did you created your account on "Misplaced Pages in English language" as first account for projects of Wikimedia ?

If you go on any Misplaced Pages language version or another Wikimedia project. If you click on "login" you can log into it.

I created my account on "French Misplaced Pages" as first account for projects of Wikimedia.

I can create accounts with the stuff I explained. Anatole-berthe (talk) 11:03, 23 December 2024 (UTC)

So there are not enough userboxes on meta-wiki and that trick {{w: didn't work so maybe ill just leave it on Misplaced Pages. Anthony2106 (talk) 06:23, 25 December 2024 (UTC)

Problematic BLP and stubifying

I've come across a BLP, Clifford M. Sobel, which seems to be highly problematic. There is a high amount of unsourced information and likely original research, and also substantial edits from a user named "SOBEL1" who I'm 90% sure has a conflict of interest or is a UPE. Digging through the revision history, there doesn't seem to be much salvageable revisions/info to revert to, and I'm considering stubifying it. However, I have concerns regarding if I should do it or not. Should I try and seek consensus to do it, if so where? Should I contact VRT? If anyone can give me an answer on this, it'd be appreciated. —Sparkle and Fade _edits 06:14, 23 December 2024 (UTC)

Thank you for the question, @Sparkle & Fade. Per WP:BLPRS (specifically: contentious material about living persons that is unsourced or poorly sourced should be removed immediately and without discussion emphasis not mine), you should be free to remove such poorly sourced content since you're challenging it. Unless you're successful in finding good sources of course. Tarlby 06:43, 23 December 2024 (UTC)

2024 events

What local incidents around the world, like the 2024 Magdeburg car attack are allowed to be mentioned in the events section of the 2024 year article. Marksaeed2024 (talk) 06:36, 23 December 2024 (UTC)

Hello, Marksaeed2024. In my view, this tragic attack which has been the subject of significant coverage worldwide, ought to qualify. But potentially gigantic list articles such as year articles need to be restricted somewhat by consensus among editors interested in year articles, especially the current year. So, feel free to make a bold edit, but if you are reverted, Talk:2024 is the place to make your thoughtful case. Cullen328 (talk) 07:16, 23 December 2024 (UTC)

wtf?

since the fuck when is "black people" a "radical" term????? so is "white people" also considered radical? i am very curious to know.. seems pretty fucking retarded..... 68.142.49.124 (talk) 08:11, 23 December 2024 (UTC)

Where did you see it being called radical? ''']''' (talk • contribs) 08:13, 23 December 2024 (UTC)

Can we watch the vulgar language here? We try to be friendly and civil on this page. 331dot (talk) 08:53, 23 December 2024 (UTC)

If you look at Black people it says "racialized classification", not "radical" Graeme Bartlett (talk) 10:04, 23 December 2024 (UTC)

New page for author

Hello

i am a published author quoted on two Misplaced Pages pages . I would like to create a page about myself. It looks complicated and I need some help. This is my basic text:

Sarah Bax Horton is a British author of true crime and historical biography. Her first two books, One-armed Jack: Uncovering the Real Jack the Ripper (Michael O’Mara Books, 2023) and Arm of Eve: investigating the Thames Torso Murders were inspired by her great-great grandfather who worked on those original investigations.

Bax Horton proposed new prime suspects in each of her published works, putting forward East End cigar maker Hyam Hyams as Jack the Ripper and Thames waterman James Crick as the Thames Torso Killer. SCC68 (talk) 09:48, 23 December 2024 (UTC)

Read this : Misplaced Pages:Conflict of interest. Write about yourself isn't a thing to do.

Do you want more informations ? Anatole-berthe (talk) 09:51, 23 December 2024 (UTC)

SCC68 Hello and welcome to the Teahouse. Writing about yourself is highly discouraged, please see the autobiography policy. Misplaced Pages is not a place for people to tell about themselves. Misplaced Pages articles summarize what independent reliable sources say about topics that meet our special Misplaced Pages definition of notability- like a notable author. Also note that a Misplaced Pages article is not necessarily desirable. There are good reasons to not want one. 331dot (talk) 09:52, 23 December 2024 (UTC)

and please don't promote your book on the Thames Torso Murders. Theroadislong (talk) 10:02, 23 December 2024 (UTC)

I am an expert on this subject wishing to update an out of date and misleading page. I am also an author of books on this subject. SCC68 (talk) 13:05, 23 December 2024 (UTC)

@SCC68, not an article, but Sarah Bax Horton is now a redirect. Gråbergs Gråa Sång (talk) 10:39, 23 December 2024 (UTC)

Thank you SCC68 (talk) 13:06, 23 December 2024 (UTC)

SCC68, you write: I would like to create a page about myself. It looks complicated and I need some help. People in a number of dodgy little companies are likely to read this, think "Maybe she'll pay" and may then solicit your business. (Perhaps individual Misplaced Pages editors will do the same.) But if you're wise, you'll ignore such offers. Please read and digest what's said in "Misplaced Pages:Articles for creation/Scam warning". -- Hoary (talk) 12:31, 23 December 2024 (UTC)

Messed up title when reverting a non-discussed page move. Not sure how to proceed.

Hi. I don't know whether it's appropriate to ask but I messed up reverting a page move on the Man vs. Bee article. (renamed it to the upcoming sequel show, not the original by mistake), and I cannot fix it as another redirect article already exists. I'm unsure how to fix it and I have royally messed up. Thanks. Cheezknight (talk) 11:34, 23 December 2024 (UTC)

Hi Cheezknight, I've moved the page back to Man vs. Bee for you. Let me know if everything looks good now! If a similar issue happens again, feel free to submit a request at Misplaced Pages:Requested moves/Technical requests. That page is watched by a lot of page movers, who have more extensive permissions relating to moving and renaming articles than most users. ModernDayTrilobite (talk • contribs) 15:29, 23 December 2024 (UTC)

Thanks for the help! I really appreciate it as I was stumped on what to do. I don't usually move/ merge articles so thanks for fixing it and for pointing me in the right direction if future issues occur. Cheezknight (talk) 16:01, 23 December 2024 (UTC)

Citations

How to present a citation? 2600:1700:60F8:B010:5113:50DB:F873:638B (talk) 12:06, 23 December 2024 (UTC)

See "Referencing" at WP:TUTORIAL. Gråbergs Gråa Sång (talk) 12:27, 23 December 2024 (UTC)

Im trying to make a page for Jessica Christine Ritchie

This article is a summary of Jessica Christine Ritchie Magdaleno’s professional and personal journey. Qualek (talk) 14:43, 23 December 2024 (UTC)

This looks largely promotional - which is not allowed on Misplaced Pages. Furthermore this text does not contain any independent secondary sources. Simply put - this text is inappropriate for Misplaced Pages as it stands. Simonm223 (talk) 14:48, 23 December 2024 (UTC)

Hello, Qualek, and welcome to the Teahouse. My earnest advice to new editors is to not even think about trying to create an article until you have spent several weeks - at least - learning about how Misplaced Pages works by making improvements to existing articles. Once you have understood core policies such as verifiability, neutral point of view, reliable, independent sources, and notability, and experienced how we handle disagreements with other editors (the Bold, Revert, Discuss cycle), then you might be ready to read your first article carefully, and try creating a draft.

Misplaced Pages has little interest in what the subject of an article says or wants to say about themselves, or what their associates say about them. Misplaced Pages is almost entirely interested in what people who have no connection with the subject, and who have not been prompted or fed information on behalf of the subject, have chosen to publish about the subject in reliable sources. If enough material is cited from independent sources to establish notability, a limited amount of uncontroversial factual information may be added from non-independent sources. So writing an article starts with finding reliable independent sources (see 42). What you know about the subject is irrelevant, except where it can be verified from a published source. --ColinFine (talk) 15:42, 23 December 2024 (UTC)

How I can improve my page?

Hi, I write here a few days ago, to ask if you all can help me to get my page approved (name page: Bove Path), and you all help me but also all my colleagues to get our draft page approved (we really appreciate your help).

I found myself here again to ask you what I can improve to possibly increase the score of the page. I already add the sources that were missing, as one of you recommended, any more suggestion? thank you in advance. LIUCChia.05 (talk) 14:48, 23 December 2024 (UTC)

You can add pronunciation in "Italian language" indicated in "IPA". Anatole-berthe (talk) 14:55, 23 December 2024 (UTC)

Bove Path is rated C-class. See Misplaced Pages:Content assessment to understand the differences between C-class and B-class. Although any editor, including you, can change the rating, I personally perfer to not upgrade ratings on articles I have been editing. David notMD (talk) 15:21, 23 December 2024 (UTC)

Where can we see class of an article ? Anatole-berthe (talk) 15:25, 23 December 2024 (UTC)

Top of Talk pages usually has ratings: Stub, Start, C-Class, B-class. For GA and FA there is additional detail as to when approved.

Back to article - in my opinion Biodiversity should be limited to what is near the trail, not the entire park. David notMD (talk) 15:31, 23 December 2024 (UTC)

Even if the path cross the park itself? it is not a dispersive area you can find and encounter, with a bit of luck, all those species during the trekking itself. LIUCChia.05 (talk) 16:23, 23 December 2024 (UTC)

I have reassessed the article as "B". Cullen328 (talk) 17:39, 23 December 2024 (UTC)

Thanks for you help ! Now , I know where to find the class of an article. Anatole-berthe (talk) 19:55, 24 December 2024 (UTC)

Diffs

I always forget the best way to show a "diff" in a post. Can someone explain to me how I'd show this edit, in a diff? Did I do it right? Just link the URL? I feel as if some editors do it so seamlessly and easily. Iljhgtn (talk) 16:06, 23 December 2024 (UTC)

Thank you for the question, @Iljhgtn. Yes, you linked the diff perfectly. There are also other ways to link diffs which you may or may not find easier. You can see Help:Diff#Linking to a diff for more examples. Here's one form I really like to use:

Typing this--->

Would create this--->

I hope this all helps! Tarlby 16:19, 23 December 2024 (UTC)

I use visual editor except on talk pages where sometimes it is not possible or other pages where it might not be possible for some reason. I really wish they would enable visual editor everywhere too by the way! It is SO much better than source editor! Iljhgtn (talk) 16:21, 23 December 2024 (UTC)

But thanks, I am glad that my copying and pasting of the "diff" URL is essentially all that you need to do. I did not think it was that simple. Iljhgtn (talk) 16:22, 23 December 2024 (UTC)

What about finding a specific diff in the page history? Some people in talk page discussions seem to find tons of perfectly relevant diffs nearly instantly and it routinely blows my mind. Iljhgtn (talk) 16:23, 23 December 2024 (UTC)

For articles, the Who Wrote That? browser extension makes it really easy to locate when something was added. Schazjmd (talk) 16:33, 23 December 2024 (UTC)

I use Microsoft Edge as my browser. Is that supported for this tool? Seems like such an interesting tool that it would almost make it worth to switch the browser that I use, though I'd rather not do that if I can avoid it. Iljhgtn (talk) 17:24, 23 December 2024 (UTC)

It does. Schazjmd (talk) 17:33, 23 December 2024 (UTC)

@Iljhgtn Assuming you're using a PC to edit, clicking "page history" at the top right will show you the list of revisions the page has went through. Each revision has "prev" and "cur" next to them. Clicking prev will show you the difference (diff!) with that revision and the previous one. Cur will show the difference between that revision and the current one. Tarlby 16:36, 23 December 2024 (UTC)

Yes, I edit using a PC. Thanks for this information. Iljhgtn (talk) 17:13, 23 December 2024 (UTC)

I have never quite figured out how to edit from a phone, plus I am worried that it would be from an IP then and might cause me problems somehow. Iljhgtn (talk) 17:14, 23 December 2024 (UTC)

Iljhgtn, please read my essay User:Cullen328/Smartphone editing. If you are logged in on your phone, your IP address will not be disclosed and you will not have any unusual problems. I have made about 100,000 phone edits going back many years. Cullen328 (talk) 17:48, 23 December 2024 (UTC)

Are "phone edits" logged any differently in your contribution history than PC-based edits? 100,000 on the phone is an impressive achievement! Iljhgtn (talk) 19:54, 23 December 2024 (UTC)

I was a bit discouraged to try phone editing too after the incident where there was a recent admin that seemed to really assault someone for trying to use phone editing and then it became a real ordeal for them to come back into editing. Though it looks like that admin has lost their adminship, rightfully so, so maybe I will look into it again. Iljhgtn (talk) 22:40, 23 December 2024 (UTC)

You can force the visual editor in any namespace by adding ?veaction=edit to the end of the URL (for example, en.wikipedia.org/User_talk:Skarmory?veaction=edit would let me access my user talk page in VE). Skarmory (talk • contribs) 20:10, 23 December 2024 (UTC)

I'm really not sure why my article was declined.

It is a biography of a living person who created a global food chain and is now writing poetry and songs. His journey to Canada was significant. CLWwrites (talk) 16:45, 23 December 2024 (UTC)

You will need to show how he could pass the criteria at WP:GNG, your draft gives no indication of that so far. Theroadislong (talk) 16:48, 23 December 2024 (UTC)

Presumed - there is coverage in the Toronto Star Business section and in multiple newspapers globally. Many of the smaller papers have not archived all of their papers. Andy has a poem in the Kennedy Accessions Library (accessible online).

Significant coverage - no additional research is needed to extract the content. The history of his coming to Canada and how he grew his business here are clearly laid out.

Reliable - as mentioned above, I used verifiable sources and for a few instances, the smaller papers have not archived all of their earlier articles.

Sources - I have used secondary sources.

Independent of the subject - there are many messages of congratuations and thanks for participating in events. I was having difficulty uploading their private photos.

If you can tell me what is wrong I can fix it. Right now I don't know what is wrong. CLWwrites (talk) 17:01, 23 December 2024 (UTC)

@CLWwrites You appear to have written that article WP:BACKWARDS. Please read that essay and if and when you have found appropriate sources start again. Shantavira| 17:03, 23 December 2024 (UTC)

What do you mean? I wrote the article in the time sequence it occured... CLWwrites (talk) 17:05, 23 December 2024 (UTC)

I am feeling frustrated right now. CLWwrites (talk) 17:14, 23 December 2024 (UTC)

Hello, @CLWwrites, and welcome to the Teahouse.

I'm afraid that that frustration is a common experience for editors who start editing Misplaced Pages and immediately plunge into the challenging task of creating an article without spending time learning how Misplaced Pages works first. Would you enter a major competation in a sport you have only just taken up? Would you expect to understand the feedback you got if you did?

My earnest advice to new editors is to not even think about trying to create an article until you have spent several weeks - at least - learning about how Misplaced Pages works by making improvements to existing articles. Once you have understood core policies such as verifiability, neutral point of view, reliable, independent sources, and notability, and experienced how we handle disagreements with other editors (the Bold, Revert, Discuss cycle), then you might be ready to read your first article carefully, and try creating a draft.

When Shantavira says you have written your draft backwards, that is a link to a page that explains; but in short: you appear to have written what you know and then looked for sources. Baldly, Misplaced Pages doesn't care what you know (or what I know, or what any random person on the internet knows). Misplaced Pages only cares about material that is verified by reliable published sources, so writing an article starts by finding such sources. Then, if you have found several sources which each meet the criteria in WP:42, you can start writing a summary of what those sources say (not what you know). ColinFine (talk) 17:21, 23 December 2024 (UTC)

@CLWwrites, its not about time sequence. First, find the multiple reliable independent sources that describe the topic. Each such source must be in-depth, reliably published, and independent of the subject, all three at the same time. Next, write the article using only those sources. That is writing an article in the proper direction. Backward is writing what you know and looking for sources to support it later. That is almost never successful. StarryGrandma (talk) 17:18, 23 December 2024 (UTC)

Thank you StarryGrandma...at least this helps me know what to do. CLWwrites (talk) 17:20, 23 December 2024 (UTC)

To expand on this, we are asking you to show that he is already well-known by providing material that people independent of him have written in-depth about him and published in places with editorial oversight. If he is not already well-known then he can still be a significant person, but we don't include him in this encyclopedia. StarryGrandma (talk) 17:25, 23 December 2024 (UTC)

Race condition on talk page?

It seems like two people welcomed me to Misplaced Pages at the same time (thank you to User:Clovermoss and User:Masterhatch by the way), which has led to two different revisions where the current revision doesn't have the past revision's message and vice versa. What is the proper thing to do here? Should I "merge" the two revisions so both messages are visible? YAQUBROLI 18:38, 23 December 2024 (UTC)

Hello, @Yaqubroli, and welcome to the Teahouse! Yes, you can "merge" the two revisions, make both messages visible, and say so in the edit summary. Please see also Help:Edit conflict#Resolving an edit conflict. Rotideypoc41352 (talk · contribs) 19:13, 23 December 2024 (UTC)

Tangentially, I prefer to link revisions like so: Special:Permalink/cur, replacing cur with the revision ID (the number after &oldid=). Doing something similar with Special:Diff shows what was changed from the previous version. Rotideypoc41352 (talk · contribs) 19:20, 23 December 2024 (UTC)

Awesome, that is way less clunky. Thanks! YAQUBROLI 19:23, 23 December 2024 (UTC)

Question

If an editor makes several blatantly RGW arguments for removing sections of content, refuses to read sources contradicting his arguments on the grounds that I have been editing in this area for years and am very confident that no source exists and then states that what he really wants is for this article to redirect to a completely different article but that since he can’t do that he’s instead grinding out this same debate one passage at a time until the article is empty. but also that he doesn’t want to, and would much rather save ourselves some time and just do the redirect,

Does that become a conduct issue? Snokalok (talk) 19:57, 23 December 2024 (UTC)

@Snokalok, the ongoing discussion is about a contentious topic. I don't see any conduct issues in the discussion, just very strong opinions on both sides. It does seem as though you've cherry-picked quotes out of context; for example, the full sentence was But I've got very little interest in grinding out this same debate one passage at a time until the article is empty. I recommend that you all continue to work through the issue via discussion. You can see Misplaced Pages:Dispute resolution for other options. Schazjmd (talk) 20:12, 23 December 2024 (UTC)

@Schazjmd The fuller quote was But I've got very little interest in grinding out this same debate one passage at a time until the article is empty. We could save ourselves some time and just do the redirect., operative phrase being “we could save ourselves some time and just do the redirect”, implying that is still the course of

action being pursued and that, one way or another, the result is the same.

Regardless, my assessments have been wrong before, hence why I ask here instead of at ANI Snokalok (talk) 20:17, 23 December 2024 (UTC)

The even fuller quote is The bold move would be to redirect this article to Gender-critical feminism on WP:POVFORK grounds. Since I expect that would be immediately reverted, I am attempting to gain consensus first. It's good if you now agree that the passage in question is inappropriate and can be removed. But I've got very little interest in grinding out this same debate one passage at a time until the article is empty. We could save ourselves some time and just do the redirect. What do you think? I would not recommending going to ANI with this, @Snokalok. Schazjmd (talk) 20:22, 23 December 2024 (UTC)

Would like some feedback

I have just, well you could say, abusing the recent changes page for things i need to revert. I've done my first few and it's going very quickly reverting all these users. Thoughts? 千乇丨丂ㄒㄚ尺ㄖㄖ丂ㄒ乇尺 (talk) 20:13, 23 December 2024 (UTC)

I don't see anything wrong with that and I have no knowledge of any Misplaced Pages guideline articles discouraging/forbidding those actions. I, myself, have done the same before multiple times and I know a couple of Users doing the same thing as well. Hacked (Talk|Contribs) 20:19, 23 December 2024 (UTC)

Thank you very much. 千乇丨丂ㄒㄚ尺ㄖㄖ丂ㄒ乇尺 (talk) 20:34, 23 December 2024 (UTC)

Hello, @千乇丨丂ㄒㄚ尺ㄖㄖ丂ㄒ乇尺. What you're doing is actually encouraged and quite the noble act. Patrolling recent changes is a very efficient strategy to fighting vandalism. If you wish, you can download some tools like WP:Twinkle or WP:Ultraviolet to make this process even quicker. Those scripts also give you options to warn problematic editors in the hopes of preventing future disruptive editing.If you continue this process for a month, successfully reverting and warning vandals with those tools, you can request to get Wp:Rollback permissions at WP:RFP/R. Just keep in mind, the goal of reverting vandalism is not a race against other patrollers. Be slow and cautious if need be. Thank you for joining the fight against vandalism! Tarlby 20:50, 23 December 2024 (UTC)

WE STAND UNITED AGAINST VANDALISM! 千乇丨丂ㄒㄚ尺ㄖㄖ丂ㄒ乇尺 (talk) 20:52, 23 December 2024 (UTC)

Lol. Tarlby 20:53, 23 December 2024 (UTC)

Yeah I can be a bit chaotic sometimes xD 千乇丨丂ㄒㄚ尺ㄖㄖ丂ㄒ乇尺 (talk) 20:53, 23 December 2024 (UTC)

I put the humorous userbox on my user page 千乇丨丂ㄒㄚ尺ㄖㄖ丂ㄒ乇尺 (talk) 20:53, 23 December 2024 (UTC)

Maintenance template removal?

Hello, I've made an edit and I was wondering if the sources that I added justify removal of the “This article does not cite any sources. Please help improve this article by adding citations to reliable sources” template at the top of the article? Also, are my sources good? I read Help:Maintenance template removal. Samolukadjo (talk) 21:03, 23 December 2024 (UTC)

Since you have cited sources, the template has done its job and now it should be removed. (Or it could be replaced by this template). Hacked (Talk|Contribs) 21:09, 23 December 2024 (UTC)

Username question

Hi there! I've bumped into a user whose name includes "42069". I checked through the username policy, and I'm not sure if this is the sort of thing that ought to be reported anyplace? Would it be considered "inappropriate" enough?

The user showed up about a week ago, tried to upload and insert a couple of copyrighted images (deleted and reverted, respectively), and hasn't done anything since, so it's not really an immediate need - this is mostly for my own curiosity if a situation like this pops up in the future. NekoKatsun (nyaa) 21:52, 23 December 2024 (UTC)

(Non-administrator comment) @NekoKatsun: I don't think strings of numbers are prohibited from being used in usernames, unless perhaps when read aloud they're something really vulgar that pretty much most people would clearly understand and find offensive. Even if this particular string of numbers means what Google says it can mean, I don't think that it meets such a standard. You can, however, ask for administrator input at WP:AN or WP:UAA if you want, but it's probably better to just ignore it. If the account resumes editing and starts creating problems unreleated to its name, then you can seek administrator action because of that. -- Marchjuly (talk) 22:29, 23 December 2024 (UTC)

I'm pretty sure they do indeed mean what Google says they do, and I can recall at least one instance where someone faced a lot of heat for having, ostensibly, the last two digits of their birth year in their username, which just so happened to be 88 (a white supremacist thing). I wanted to err on the side of caution.

Since they're not doing anything I'll ignore, although that username sure won't do them any favors if they start back up with their copyright problems. Thanks for the reply! NekoKatsun (nyaa) 23:43, 23 December 2024 (UTC)

How do I get enough credible sources when interviews go beyond webpages but videos, podcasts, etc?

Hi,

I'm trying to write a biography about an important contemporary muralist. His work has been in two Asian Art Museums in addition to murals all over the world and for corporations. He has many interviews; I included some in the citations but they were not accepted. Would love any guidance. Thank you Rnza45 (talk) 22:29, 23 December 2024 (UTC)

The AFC reviewer has left a comment saying that, "Submission is about a person not yet shown to meet notability guidelines". Some faults noted by me was the way the sections were displayed and most of the citations were unreliable and not properly generated. There's also no hyperlinks and no infobox. Fixing those faults would probably help your chance for the biography to be accepted. Hope this helps. Hacked (Talk|Contribs) 22:49, 23 December 2024 (UTC)

Hello, @Rnza45, and welcome to the Teahouse.

You have made several common beginners' errors: you have created your draft on your user page, which is not the right place for it. You have written your draft BACKWARDS (writing from what you know, and then looking for sources) - Misplaced Pages doesn't care what you know: it only cares what independent reliable sources say about the subject. And Misplaced Pages has little interest in what the subject of an article says or wants to say about themselves, or what their associates say about them. Misplaced Pages is almost entirely interested in what people who have no connection with the subject, and who have not been prompted or fed information on behalf of the subject, have chosen to publish about the subject in reliable sources. If enough material is cited from independent sources to establish notability, a limited amount of uncontroversial factual information may be added from non-independent sources. So interviews don't count towards establishing notability.

There's nothing wrong with making mistakes: that's how we all learn. But newcomers who plunge straight into the challenging task of crating a new article often get frustrated and disillusioned. And it's even harder when you have a conflict of interest (thank you for declaring that).

My earnest advice to new editors is to not even think about trying to create an article until you have spent several weeks - at least - learning about how Misplaced Pages works by making improvements to existing articles. Once you have understood core policies such as verifiability, neutral point of view, reliable, independent sources, and notability, and experienced how we handle disagreements with other editors (the Bold, Revert, Discuss cycle), then you might be ready to read your first article carefully, and try creating a draft. ColinFine (talk) 23:10, 23 December 2024 (UTC)

Thank you for the thorough reply. Where is the correct place to write a draft?

I don’t know why you think I cited sources backwards; I didn’t start that way. I did go back after I thought I needed more outside sources. I did look up what Misplaced Pages considers reliable sources, but I need to understand this better. I thought I went back and added, but they still dont seem to meet the criteria. I pulled from LA Times, ABC News, NPR, art websites and a local wiki.

I did not write the article about myself. 2603:8000:7300:CB21:AC86:1F37:7217:3A5D (talk) 00:36, 24 December 2024 (UTC)

The correct place to write a draft is WP:Article Wizard. Hacked (Talk|Contribs) 00:38, 24 December 2024 (UTC)

I have moved the draft to Draft:Dave Young Kim, Rnza45. Please remove the CoI template from it, and affix the former to your user page.

You tell us that:

Kim's artwork engages with the intangible quality of home and explores themes of nostalgia, war, conflict, and displacement. By incorporating cultural motifs into personal and broader histories of struggle, he examines the universal search for belonging across diverse conditions.

And you add a reference pointing to a page of Kim's website. But this is evaluative: we need a source independent of Kim to tell us that he actually explores such-and-such (and doesn't merely glance at it and hurry away). Also, this sounds curiously like PR-speak. I wondered what Kim actually wrote. Here it is:

His work engages with the intangible quality of home and explores themes of nostalgia, war, conflict, and displacement. By interpolating cultural motifs into personal and larger histories of struggle, Kim explores the unifying search for belonging across disparate conditions.

So it's just a copy 'n' paste job, with minor changes. If a quotation would benefit a draft, then it must be in quotation marks (and square brackets should make clear any changes that have been made to it). -- Hoary (talk) 03:57, 24 December 2024 (UTC)

COI tag moved to your User page. David notMD (talk) 04:06, 24 December 2024 (UTC)

Thank you! 2603:8000:7300:CB21:B9F0:228F:2F05:87F5 (talk) 22:04, 24 December 2024 (UTC)

"Content not properly deflated" sign

I have gotten this sign several times during editing, idk why or how it came to be. Please help Wentwort12 (talk) 23:04, 23 December 2024 (UTC)

I've never seen such a message, @Wentwort12. Could you describe (step by step) what you did, on what page(s), and how the message displayed? Schazjmd (talk) 23:21, 23 December 2024 (UTC)

first I edit like I always do, I prefer to edit visually, so I want to put an image and caption into the article, that's it and then I clicked publish and this sign popped up "Content provided is not properly deflated" so I was unable to make such edit.

this page and several others

John Campbell, 5th Duke of Argyll Wentwort12 (talk) 00:17, 24 December 2024 (UTC)

@Wentwort12 This sounds like phab:T381673 which was reported somewhat recently. Can you confirm what browser (including version) you were using when you saw the error? AntiCompositeNumber (talk) 04:20, 24 December 2024 (UTC)

Safari version 16.5.2, yeah it used to be fine but recently it's not maybe 2 weeks give or take Wentwort12 (talk) 06:57, 24 December 2024 (UTC)

Britannica books Pre 2012

How would a person attain copy's of all Encyclopaedia sets printed since 1768? Jarrod Samuel Burchett (talk) 01:02, 24 December 2024 (UTC)

Hello, Jarrod Samuel Burchett! The Teahouse is a place to ask about editing Misplaced Pages specifically. If you have other general knowledge questions, try asking at the Reference Desk, where editors who work in that area can help you. Happy editing, Perfect4th (talk) 01:37, 24 December 2024 (UTC)

Jarrod Samuel Burchett. Find a rare books dealer who specializes in encyclopedias. Fly to their nearest airport. Take the rare books dealer out to breakfast, lunch and dinner and buy drinks after dinner. Then, make a generous offer on what they have. Rinse and repeat. Cullen328 (talk) 07:32, 24 December 2024 (UTC)

Yeah. Hopefully the OP has a substantial 5-figure sum available. A set of the 1773 First London Edition is currently advertised on Ebay for £16,436.25, and there have been (at least) 15 printed editions since the 1768–71 original (the abovementioned "London Edition" is not one of them), ignoring the updates added in every reprint of a volume from 1933 and the pirated editions, such as the Thomas Dobson (Philadelphia) of 1790. {The poster formerly known as 87.81.230.195} 94.1.223.204 (talk) 14:40, 24 December 2024 (UTC)

@Jarrod Samuel Burchett On the other hand, the ninth edition in full is freely available at Wikisource. Mike Turnbull (talk) 14:45, 24 December 2024 (UTC)

Tools

I have the rater and auto-ed scripts installed but they don't show up in my more tab. I use Vector Legacy. Does anyone know how to fix this. History6042 (talk) 01:33, 24 December 2024 (UTC)

@History6042 do they appear on the left side of the screen, under "tools"? ''']''' (talk • contribs) 05:16, 24 December 2024 (UTC)

No they do not. History6042 (talk) 14:10, 24 December 2024 (UTC)

User:CanonNi, I checked all the skins but still none of them show up. History6042 (talk) 19:51, 24 December 2024 (UTC)

If you are using the new skin WP:VECTOR2022, its on the right or in a dropdown at top right. Ca 08:16, 24 December 2024 (UTC)

I switched to 2022 but it still doesn't show up. History6042 (talk) 14:10, 24 December 2024 (UTC)

Submission declined because subject already exists.

What to do? My draft (Draft:Cyclopygoidea) has been declined because Cyclopygidae exists, but my draft encompasses more than just that family, how should I proceed? Abdullah raji (talk) 05:03, 24 December 2024 (UTC)

@Abdullah raji you can merge the contents of your draft into the existing article. ''']''' (talk • contribs) 05:14, 24 December 2024 (UTC)

Abdullah raji, you can also start by writing more than three sentences about the topic, whatever it is. Certainly, a "superfamily" deserves more than three basic sentences. Cullen328 (talk) 07:10, 24 December 2024 (UTC)

How "good" does a user essay have to be for it to be able to be moved to project space?

I've recently gotten into the habit of writing user essays so that newcomers and medium-level editors alike can learn something new. I've been wondering - how good would the essay have to be before it can be moved into project space? For example, my favourite essay is my one about meditating to COOL down but I have no idea what the criteria for moving a user essay even is. User:Someone-123-321 (I contribute, Talk page so SineBot will shut up) 07:23, 24 December 2024 (UTC)

Hello, Someone-123-321. The only requirement for moving an essay from userspace to Misplaced Pages space is that no one objects. Your essay reflects your own view that may not be and probably isn't shared by most other editors. Your definition of meditation is somewhat inclusive but is deeply biased by claiming that editing Misplaced Pages cannot possibly be a form of meditation. Sez who? Are you trying to tell me that chanting Namu Myōhō Renge Kyō 100,000 times or chanting Hare Krishna Hare Krishna Krishna Krishna Hare Hare Hare Rama Hare Rama Rama Rama Hare Hare 100,000 times is meditation, but my meditation practice of thoughtfully editing Misplaced Pages 100,000 times is illegitimate? You confidently assert that meditation requires stepping away from editing Misplaced Pages while you do it while my meditation practice requires stepping into level headed and thoughtful Misplaced Pages editing. So, should Misplaced Pages space host essays that many editors believe to be completely incorrect? Perhaps you can write another essay on that dilemma. Or perhaps you can improve a 💕 article, which is, in my opinion, the greatest form of meditation known to humanity. Cullen328 (talk) 08:31, 24 December 2024 (UTC)

Sorry for not elaborating. I meant "editing Misplaced Pages articles which caused you to meditate in the first place" - i.e "don't edit articles you know will make you angrier" User:Someone-123-321 (I contribute, Talk page so SineBot will shut up) 09:00, 24 December 2024 (UTC)

Editing

How can I include photos to a page I want Dissainkabi (talk) 07:37, 24 December 2024 (UTC)

I meant to say how can I include photos to a page Dissainkabi (talk) 07:38, 24 December 2024 (UTC)

Hi, Help:Pictures is a step-by-step guide to adding one. Just make sure to read the note about copyright as most images on the internet prohibit sharing. See Misplaced Pages:IUP Ca 08:21, 24 December 2024 (UTC)

Thank you! Dissainkabi (talk) 10:52, 24 December 2024 (UTC)

খসড়া পাতা পর্যালোচনা

আমার খসড়া পাতা (https://bn.wikipedia.org/%E0%A6%96%E0%A6%B8%E0%A6%A1%E0%A6%BC%E0%A6%BE:%E0%A6%AE%E0%A7%81%E0%A7%81%E0%A6%B9%E0%A6%BF%E0%A6%AC%E0%A7%8D%E0%A6%AC%E0%A7%81%E0%A6%B2_%E0%A6%B9%E0%A6%95) দ্রুত পর্যালোচনা করার অনুরোধ জানাচ্ছি। এটি পর্যালোচকদের মানদণ্ড পূরণ করে বলে মনে করি। Jahangir Rayhan (talk) 10:29, 24 December 2024 (UTC)

Jahangir Rayhan This is the English Misplaced Pages - Questions about the Bengali Misplaced Pages must be raised there - Their Teahouse is at Arjayay (talk) 10:34, 24 December 2024 (UTC)

thanks Jahangir Rayhan (talk) 10:41, 24 December 2024 (UTC)

Reason for Rejection of Sunnah Muwakkadah Article

Hello, I recently posted an Article on Sunnah Muwakkadah. I used correct citations. And I created the Article by myself and I cited Sunnah.com links. But for some reason it has been rejected pls inquiry the situatio. Thanks Enter your Log (talk) 10:41, 24 December 2024 (UTC)

@Enter your Log Did you read the comment at the top of the declined (not "rejected") draft at Draft:Sunnah_Muwakkadah? Misplaced Pages articles are based on multiple references to reliable sources independent of the topic. As far as I can tell, sunnah.com is just a website that provides access to Islamic texts, without detailed commentary. You need to find independent scholarly work that describes these prayers. Also, please follow Misplaced Pages's manual of style regarding the formatting of references (see this guidance) and note that we don't use the honorific ﷺ. That's explained at WP:PHUB. Mike Turnbull (talk) 10:54, 24 December 2024 (UTC)

To add more references

Is it necessary to add more references to make it clearer and properly cited, if possible? DerryGer120 (talk) 12:29, 24 December 2024 (UTC)

@DerryGer120 Welcome to the Teahouse. Yes, it’s always helpful to add references to support statements which might be challenged. They do need to be reliable ones, as defined HERE. Nick Moyes (talk) 12:38, 24 December 2024 (UTC)

However, over-referencing can be a problem. Quality is more important than quantity. A simple fact can do with one reference, not five or ten. David notMD (talk) 13:27, 24 December 2024 (UTC)

David notMD, yes indeed. -- Hoary (talk) 13:51, 24 December 2024 (UTC)

I see. What if a content short but reliable. Isn't it better to add more content? DerryGer120 (talk) 13:54, 24 December 2024 (UTC)

thanks DerryGer120 (talk) 13:54, 24 December 2024 (UTC)

@DerryGer120 Are you asking about the draft article you have (incorrectly) placed on your userpage? If so, please note that Misplaced Pages articles are almost entirely based on sources meeting our golden rules to help show the topic is wikinotable. Currently you have no such sources and you need to carefully read this guidance, which also explains how to start in the correct place at articles for creation. However, I would strongly advise that you work on existing articles for a while until you understand Misplaced Pages's requirements in more detail. Mike Turnbull (talk) 14:40, 24 December 2024 (UTC)