Misplaced Pages

Talk:Balochistan: Difference between revisions

Article snapshot taken from Wikipedia with creative commons attribution-sharealike license. Give it a read and then ask your questions in the chat. We can research this topic together.
Browse history interactively← Previous editContent deleted Content addedVisualWikitext
Revision as of 15:17, 13 June 2015 editTripWire (talk | contribs)Extended confirmed users, Pending changes reviewers, Rollbackers2,780 edits →Decline to temporary Page Protection: new section← Previous edit Latest revision as of 14:26, 14 October 2024 edit undoLowercase sigmabot III (talk | contribs)Bots, Template editors2,291,945 editsm Archiving 1 discussion(s) to Talk:Balochistan/Archive 1) (bot 
(126 intermediate revisions by 40 users not shown)
Line 1: Line 1:
{{Talk header}} {{Talk header}}
{{WikiProject banner shell|class=B|1=
{{WikiProjectBannerShell|1=
{{WikiProject Geography|class=start|importance=mid}} {{WikiProject Geography|importance=mid}}
{{WP Pakistan|class=Start|importance=High|Balochistan=yes}} {{WikiProject Pakistan|Balochistan=y|importance=Low|Balochistan-importance=Mid}}
{{WikiProject Afghanistan}} {{WikiProject Afghanistan|importance=Mid}}
{{WikiProject Iran}} {{WikiProject Iran |importance=Low}}
}}
{{User:MiszaBot/config
| algo = old(31d)
| archive = Talk:Balochistan/Archive %(counter)d
| counter = 1
| maxarchivesize = 128K
| archiveheader = {{Talk archive navigation}}
| minthreadstoarchive = 1
| minthreadsleft = 4
}} }}



==Delete the page==
this page talks about a mythical area that have never existed... --] (]) 01:22, 4 August 2011 (UTC)

==Merge with other Balochistan Page==
Why have a separate page for a place that has never existed ? --] (]) 00:29, 30 April 2011 (UTC)

== One article ==
I dont see why the history and complete demographics plus socio economic setup of Balochistan cannot be in one article ,there is no sense to divide it as most other articles on States and Provinces are detailed into one article and/or comprehensive enough.This article covers everything there is to know about Balochistan and thats what a reader must have and should have.--] 04:33, 29 May 2005 (UTC)

== Two Images ==
Also I have noticed that user:] has removed some images without due reason from this article.Please provide legitimate reasons before deleting anything of significance in an article.--] 04:56, 29 May 2005 (UTC)

== Opinionated article ==
"Gwadar is in the clutches of a land-grab mafia from Punjab"

While I am not from Punjab, the sentence above sounds highly opinionated. It seems the article has been written from one point of view rather than from a general academic view.

The three major ethnic groups in Balochistan, Baloch, Pashtun and Punjabi have very different views on the whole system and an outsider (or someone with a view thereof) is required to reflect on the current state.

I am from Balochistan and from neither of the three above ethnicities, yet I'm fully aware of my bias and do not feel I can write an impartial article.

Emotions can run high on all sides when the history and current status of this province is mentioned, and this article should be always taken with a grain of salt. <small>(''preceding ] comment by'' ] --]</small>

The last sentence of the lead says ''Now it is recognised by UNPO as an Un-represented Nation.'' UNPO, besides having a somewhat misleading acronym, does not seem notable enough for this part of the article. What this sentence really says is that Baluchistan has a nationalist movement big enough to join an organization for nationalist movements; except it's written from a pro-Baluchistan point of view. That kind of thing should be discussed in a section on Baluchistani politics. ] (]) 16:51, 20 November 2008 (UTC)


== History section == == History section ==
The history section here should be put into the Balochistan (Pakistan) article because it is only speaking about that area. <small>(''preceding ] comment by'' ] --]</small> The history section here should be put into the Balochistan (Pakistan) article because it is only speaking about that area. <small>(''preceding ] comment by'' ] --]</small>



== Strictly grammatical ==

I have clarified some terms and corrected some grammar and punctuation, in order to make this comprehensible. Let me emphasize that my only input is technical and I have no opinion on the situation, yet I feel that readers who come to Misplaced Pages for information would be turned off by the non-neutral language, thus counteracting the writer's obvious desire for people to be informed of his/her cause. If you wrote this, please consider removing the non-neutral language, so that the message will come through clearly and sensibly. ] 00:20, 1 November 2005 (UTC)

== Should be Rewritten ==

In my opinion, the article must be redone. It is too one-dimensional, as it talks largely about only one aspect of Baluchistan's history, ignoring more general information that would normally be found in an article about a geographic region. ] 14:46, 23 December 2005 (UTC)

== This article could use a rewrite ==

This article could use a rewrite ] 01:48, 1 March 2007 (UTC)

== Proposed change ==

This page should be the disambiguation page for the word Balochistan with redirects from Baluchistan and Baluchestan. The content of this article could be moved to a Balochistan (region) article. ] 05:15, 29 January 2006 (UTC)

:Well, it depends on what pages link to this one. If most link to the larger region, then don't make it a disambig page, but if a great deal of the pages are supposed to link to the other meanings as well as this one, it might be a good idea. See . --] 05:25, 29 January 2006 (UTC)

== Summarizing ==

From the point of view of someone completely unfamiliar with this subject, I find the article in desperate need a brief summary. After reading through the first page or so of the article, I'm pretty sure Balochistan is located in the country of Pakistan, but am not sure. This is a problem. <br>
] 10:33, 1 February 2006 (UTC)

:Balochistan is a region currently divided between Pakistan, Iran, and possibly Afghanistan (there are Balochis in the south of that country). In Pakistan it makes up the province of ]. For the article about Balochistan in Iran, see ]. --] 20:28, 1 February 2006 (UTC)

::Most of the content of this article is almost completely identical to the content of the ] page. Starting from the second paragraph of the '''History''' section to the '''Recent Developments''' section the only difference is a little extra text in the '''Military Cantonments Issue''' section. Altogether some 276 pages link to this page but of those 126 pages do so specifically in the context of linking to ] and not the wider region (including 28 pages on the districts of Pakistani Balochistan which make no mention of the wider region). That works out at about 45% of the pages linking here. I can understand ] confusion because so many links are pointing here without intending to do so.

::To remove this ambiguity, I will eliminate the matching sections with ] from this page and move the remaining content to a ] page with a link from this page. This page should become a disambiguation page on the lines of ], ] and ]. ] 21:27, 1 February 2006 (UTC)

:::Ok, good job. I agree. --] 02:09, 2 February 2006 (UTC)

==Fair use rationale for Image:ArjunaParataraja.jpg==
]
''']''' is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under ] but there is no ] as to why its use in '''this''' Misplaced Pages article constitutes fair use. In addition to the ], you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with ].

Please go to ] and edit it to include a ]. Using one of the templates at ] is an easy way to insure that your image is in compliance with Misplaced Pages policy, but remember that you must complete the template. Do not simply insert a blank template on an image page.

If there is other fair use media, consider checking that you have specified the fair use rationale on the other images used on this page. Note that any fair use images uploaded after 4 May, 2006, and lacking such an explanation will be deleted one week after they have been uploaded, as described on ]. If you have any questions please ask them at the ]. Thank you.<!-- Template:Missing rationale2 -->

] 10:12, 27 October 2007 (UTC)

== Bertistan ==

Incorrect old maps have Balochistan labeled as "Bertistan". ] should redirect here. For an example, see
--] (]) 22:27, 9 November 2009 (UTC)

== "Herodotus in 650 BC described ..." ==

Herodotus lived over 150 years later, so how can he have described anything in 650 BC? ] (]) 16:46, 4 July 2010 (UTC)

== Requested move ==
<div class="boilerplate" style="background-color: #efe; margin: 2em 0 0 0; padding: 0 10px 0 10px; border: 1px dotted #aaa;"><!-- Template:RM top -->
:''The following discussion is an archived discussion of a ]. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. No further edits should be made to this section. ''

The result of the move request was: '''page moved to ]'''. ]&nbsp;<sup><b>(])</b></sup> 13:31, 9 August 2010 (UTC)

----

] → {{noredirect|1=Balochistan region}} — - why do we need the parentheses, when a simpler name will be easier to type and search for? ] (]) 04:27, 26 July 2010 (UTC)
'''Support''' per nom. <span style="text-shadow:grey 0.3em 0.3em 0.1em; class=texhtml">]]</span> 21:28, 26 July 2010 (UTC)
*'''Comment''' Or alternatively, just ], which would involve moving the disambiguation page back to ]. The hatnotes already redirect to other uses. ] (]) 06:47, 27 July 2010 (UTC)
*'''Support''' proposal by Skinsmoke. ] (]) 05:29, 3 August 2010 (UTC)
:''The above discussion is preserved as an archive of a ]. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.</div><!-- Template:RM bottom -->


== Spelling == == Spelling ==
Line 106: Line 24:
Why must Misplaced Pages force a nationalist-inspired oddball spelling down our throats every single time? It hurts your credibility. It's Baluchistan. The only context in which the average person might have heard of the place is in "beast of Baluchistan", spelled thus. Are you going to try to make the genus "balochitherium"? You are annoying the hell out of I daresay a lot of us with this nonsense. Ask me why I bother, and I'll say I don't know. Why must Misplaced Pages force a nationalist-inspired oddball spelling down our throats every single time? It hurts your credibility. It's Baluchistan. The only context in which the average person might have heard of the place is in "beast of Baluchistan", spelled thus. Are you going to try to make the genus "balochitherium"? You are annoying the hell out of I daresay a lot of us with this nonsense. Ask me why I bother, and I'll say I don't know.


== Another rubbish article in Misplaced Pages. ==
== Merge to ] ==

This article is about an '''administrative province of Pakistan''', not about the historic and geographic region of ]. I strongly suggest the Ethymology and at least Early History (if not British Rule, too) sections are '''merged''' with ] article. Also, the info in the Ethymology section currently seems to contradict the explanation contained in ] ("''Balochistan is named after the native Baloch tribes''"). <span style="font-family:'Candara',sans-serif;font-weight:bold;font-style:italic;text-shadow:#AAAAFF 0.2em 0.2em 0.1em;class:texhtml">]</span> 17:20, 21 April 2013 (UTC)
:I did not understand you, you are already in the article of ], the article of '''administrative province of Pakistan''' is ]! Do you want to merge the Etymology and Early History to ]. ] -''']'''

== Army's So Called Atrocities ==

I have added another source from amnesty who are reliable <small class="autosigned">—&nbsp;Preceding ] comment added by ] (]) 15:54, 12 June 2015 (UTC)</small><!-- Template:Unsigned IP --> <!--Autosigned by SineBot-->
: The amnesty article that you have quoted does not use the phrase 'Pakistani Army' for once?! Just because the the report says ''"The victims’ '''relatives''' and Baloch groups '''blame''' the ‘kill and dump’ incidents on Pakistani security forces, particularly the Frontier Corps and intelligence agencies."'' this does not automatically mean that they are actually involved. Adding this unconfirmed info mean that you are POV-pushing. Stop it!]&nbsp;<sup>] </sup> 16:02, 12 June 2015 (UTC)

Source days credible investigation carried out <small class="autosigned">—&nbsp;Preceding ] comment added by ] (]) 16:09, 12 June 2015 (UTC)</small><!-- Template:Unsigned IP --> <!--Autosigned by SineBot-->
: Show me where? But then first, get a reliable source. The talk page here: https://en.wikipedia.org/Talk:Balochistan#Opinionated_article already says UNPO is NOT a reliable source. We cant go in circle over something which already has been discussed. ]&nbsp;<sup>] </sup> 16:19, 12 June 2015 (UTC)

Amnesty is reliable source <small class="autosigned">—&nbsp;Preceding ] comment added by ] (]) 18:22, 12 June 2015 (UTC)</small><!-- Template:Unsigned IP --> <!--Autosigned by SineBot-->
: Sure is, but does the website proves your POV? Or is it just your own interpretation and thus the POV-pushing? ]&nbsp;<sup>] </sup> 18:34, 12 June 2015 (UTC)

Read source also another here http://www.dawn.com/news/681889/balochistan-at-point-of-no-return-mengal-tells-nawaz <small class="autosigned">—&nbsp;Preceding ] comment added by ] (]) 18:37, 12 June 2015 (UTC)</small><!-- Template:Unsigned IP --> <!--Autosigned by SineBot-->
: You call this is a source? Just because something is published online doesnt make it a source. Direct quotes (without proper interpretation by a secondary source) and allegation by some politician against the Government because he is in the opposition is not a reliable source. Did you see the word '''"accused"''' in the very first sentence of the so called 'source' you have added? Please use commonsense. Had Mr Mengal been an elected member, may be we could pay heed to his rants, but quoting a 4 year old 'news' as source is not what we do here at Misplaced Pages, especially if you are going to further misinterpret it to push your own POV.
:None of the sources you have been pushing say anything near to what you are trying to include in your edits. This amounts to ] and any further edits as ]. ]&nbsp;<sup>] </sup> 00:19, 13 June 2015 (UTC)

You called me vandal and admin said I no, so stop accusing wiki will not let me post quotes here? ] (]) 12:14, 13 June 2015 (UTC)
:: Hold your horse and read through the discussion on the so called sources that you are trying to add. Also, this article is about Balochistan, the area, not about the 'atrocities' that takes place there. ]&nbsp;<sup>] </sup> 12:18, 13 June 2015 (UTC)

== Comments requested ==

{{rfc|hist|rfcid=DDD9E50}}

Should article have human rights atrocities in? resources are in edit I did. More resource ] (]) 12:28, 13 June 2015 (UTC)

=== Comments ===
*'''Oppose''' The sources being cited are unreliable/blogs. The link from Amnesty website does not support the POV that is being pushed into the article and is being quoted just to provide credibility which anyone can see is lacking. The info from Dawn that is being quoted is being deliberately misrepresented and misinterpreted. This discussion has already taken place here https://en.wikipedia.org/Talk:Balochistan#Army.27s_So_Called_Atrocities, but the IP is unable to improve its sources nor the quality of info. Since the past 48 hours, this is the third IP which have tried to insert "exactly" the same info repeatedly. It seem like as if a certain group is carrying out planned ] by using different IPs. Also, the reasons of reverts made by editors opposing this edit should be seen in the history of the article who have amply tried to explain this point over and again. ]&nbsp;<sup>] </sup> 12:30, 13 June 2015 (UTC)
: Nowhere does the sources being quoted says "The pakistani army carries out atrocities against the Baloch people", as if it were systamtic and planned. Moreover, there's a full article ] on the subject. The IPs can have a field day over there, but not here. And lasty, quoting sources like http://www.balochitvonline.com is laughable to say the least. ]&nbsp;<sup>] </sup> 12:37, 13 June 2015 (UTC)

:: No blogs ] (]) 12:34, 13 June 2015 (UTC)
::: Did you bother reading the word '''accused''' in the title of the source you are trying to quote? Google doesnt help much, or does it? :) ]&nbsp;<sup>] </sup> 12:40, 13 June 2015 (UTC)

I gave quote see "Pakistan's military has escalated its brutal campaign of abduction and extra-judicial execution targeting nationalist rebels in Balochistan province, human rights groups have said." ] (]) 13:18, 13 June 2015 (UTC)

* '''Oppose''' Already have articles on the ] and ]. This is an article on the geographic region. It doesn't meet the scope, and it is also highly ] and ] to place that material in the article lead which the editor is doing. If we take other examples, we don't have the ] article going into detail about ] or the ] article discussing the ]. ''']''' (]) 13:49, 13 June 2015 (UTC)

== Decline to temporary Page Protection ==


Just a general read of the article revels the sources for many of the utterances as Web Pages that are written by hacks without any sources of themselves. May as well call the whole Article a flight of fancy written by some young ideologue. ] (]) 08:43, 26 August 2024 (UTC)
Hi, this is with reference to: https://en.wikipedia.org/Wikipedia:Requests_for_page_protection#Balochistan . Where does the good-faith leave us after the following discussions and explanations given to all 3 x IPs:


== Contradictory Etymology ==
https://en.wikipedia.org/Talk:Bangladesh_Liberation_War#What.27s_up_with_the_recent_IP_Edits.3F
https://en.wikipedia.org/Talk:Balochistan#Army.27s_So_Called_Atrocities
https://en.wikipedia.org/Talk:Balochistan#Comments_requested


The first, and only, two sentences of the first paragraph under the Etymology heading directly contradict each other. The first states the name of the country, given as Balochistan as well as other forms, derives from the name of the Baloch people. The second maintains exactly the opposite: " . . . it is likely that the Baloch were known by some other name in their place of origin and that they acquired the name "Baloch" only after arriving in Balochistan sometime in the 10th century." Did someone throw this thing together by cutting and pasting from disparate sources, without even reading what he, she, or they was, or were, pasting. ] (]) 20:44, 13 October 2024 (UTC)
Quoting sources that casually makes a mention of a certain word and then misinterpreting it to ones own POV and then adding that info at Wiki is not good faith. Moreover, adding blogs and nationalist websites which infact are blogs cannot be taken as reliable. A book makes a passing reference to a phrase in totally a different context and of an editors picks that up and add that reference here as a source, it surely isnt good faith, sir. I request you to go through the above referred talk pages and the comments left while reverting the edits made by these IPs on that Page. Thanks ]&nbsp;<sup>] </sup> 15:17, 13 June 2015 (UTC)

Latest revision as of 14:26, 14 October 2024

This is the talk page for discussing improvements to the Balochistan article.
This is not a forum for general discussion of the article's subject.
Article policies
Find sources: Google (books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL
Archives: 1Auto-archiving period: 31 days 
This article is rated B-class on Misplaced Pages's content assessment scale.
It is of interest to the following WikiProjects:
WikiProject iconGeography Mid‑importance
WikiProject iconThis article is within the scope of WikiProject Geography, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of geography on Misplaced Pages. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.GeographyWikipedia:WikiProject GeographyTemplate:WikiProject Geographygeography
MidThis article has been rated as Mid-importance on the project's importance scale.
WikiProject Geography To-do list:

 Here are some tasks awaiting attention:
WikiProject iconPakistan: Balochistan Low‑importance
WikiProject iconThis article is within the scope of WikiProject Pakistan, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of Pakistan on Misplaced Pages. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.PakistanWikipedia:WikiProject PakistanTemplate:WikiProject PakistanPakistan
LowThis article has been rated as Low-importance on the project's importance scale.
Taskforce icon
This article is supported by WikiProject Balochistan, Pakistan (assessed as Mid-importance).
WikiProject iconAfghanistan Mid‑importance
WikiProject iconThis article is within the scope of WikiProject Afghanistan, a project to maintain and expand Afghanistan-related subjects on Misplaced Pages. If you would like to participate, you can edit the article attached to this page, or visit the project page, where you can join the project and/or contribute to the discussion.AfghanistanWikipedia:WikiProject AfghanistanTemplate:WikiProject AfghanistanAfghanistan
MidThis article has been rated as Mid-importance on the project's importance scale.
WikiProject iconIran Low‑importance
WikiProject iconThis article is within the scope of WikiProject Iran, an attempt to build a comprehensive and detailed guide to articles related to Iran on Misplaced Pages. If you would like to participate, please join the project where you can contribute to the discussions and help with our open tasks.IranWikipedia:WikiProject IranTemplate:WikiProject IranIran
LowThis article has been rated as Low-importance on the project's importance scale.

History section

The history section here should be put into the Balochistan (Pakistan) article because it is only speaking about that area. (preceding unsigned comment by Binsaleemz --Hottentot


Spelling

Why must Misplaced Pages force a nationalist-inspired oddball spelling down our throats every single time? It hurts your credibility. It's Baluchistan. The only context in which the average person might have heard of the place is in "beast of Baluchistan", spelled thus. Are you going to try to make the genus "balochitherium"? You are annoying the hell out of I daresay a lot of us with this nonsense. Ask me why I bother, and I'll say I don't know.

Another rubbish article in Misplaced Pages.

Just a general read of the article revels the sources for many of the utterances as Web Pages that are written by hacks without any sources of themselves. May as well call the whole Article a flight of fancy written by some young ideologue. 2001:8003:70F5:2400:959E:9700:E2AB:8D86 (talk) 08:43, 26 August 2024 (UTC)

Contradictory Etymology

The first, and only, two sentences of the first paragraph under the Etymology heading directly contradict each other. The first states the name of the country, given as Balochistan as well as other forms, derives from the name of the Baloch people. The second maintains exactly the opposite: " . . . it is likely that the Baloch were known by some other name in their place of origin and that they acquired the name "Baloch" only after arriving in Balochistan sometime in the 10th century." Did someone throw this thing together by cutting and pasting from disparate sources, without even reading what he, she, or they was, or were, pasting. Smanion (talk) 20:44, 13 October 2024 (UTC)

Categories: