Misplaced Pages

Latest revision as of 08:14, 6 November 2024

Misplaced Pages is not censored. Misplaced Pages will not remove content because of internal bylaws that forbid information about an organization to be displayed online. Any rules that forbid members of an organization to reveal privileged information do not apply to Misplaced Pages because Misplaced Pages is not a member of that organization.

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This article was nominated for deletion on July 31, 2016. The result of the discussion was Speedy keep.

A fact from First presidential transition of Donald Trump appeared on Misplaced Pages's Main Page in the Did you know column on 26 June 2016 (check views). The text of the entry was as follows: Did you know... that in April, representatives of Donald Trump met with the Partnership for Public Service to receive a briefing on procedures for the presidential transition? A record of the entry may be seen at Misplaced Pages:Recent additions/2016/June. The nomination discussion and review may be seen at Template:Did you know nominations/Planned presidential transition of Donald Trump.

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RFC: Should location of transition office be provided in "location" section of infobox?

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

The infobox template has a "location" field. We have typically used this to put the street address of an organization (see Museum of Modern Art, Blair House, Brookings Institution,) etc. The street address of the transition committee, 1717 Pennsylvania Avenue (which is in the same building as the Clinton transition committee), has been published by Politico and the Washington Post, among others. Should we include it here or should we make an exception to custom to remove it or make it generic to refer only to a general area? An IP editor representing themselves to be a proxy of the transition committee has requested it be removed due to "security concerns." LavaBaron (talk) 21:09, 12 August 2016 (UTC)

Survey

• Keep Street Address as per convention. If certain articles are granted exceptions to our SOP it becomes difficult to track. There can't be legitimate security concerns with posting the address to Misplaced Pages as long as the address is still listed on the websites of the Washington Post, Politico, etc. Besides, this is located on what is probably one of the most heavily defended and fortified intersections in the world. Any attack on the transition office would have to come from a national armed force, and I'm sure the PLA's 15th Airborne Corps don't use WP for recce or intel. LavaBaron (talk) 21:09, 12 August 2016 (UTC)
• Keep Street Address - I agree entirely with LavaBaron. Besides, the street address is already a matter of public record - Misplaced Pages does not publish new information; it republishes knowledge already in the public eye. If someone was truly serious about posing a threat to the transition offices, there are plenty of other places where they could find the address. As a matter of policy, I think WP:OWNERSHIP is quite clear when it says "a person or an organization that is the subject of an article does not own the article, and has no right to dictate what the article may say". Specto73 (talk) 21:25, 12 August 2016 (UTC)
• Remove street address. Misplaced Pages practice has always been to remove the street address at the request of the organization, should they for whatever reason want to discourage visitors, the most notorious example being the Wikimedia Foundation article itself. ‑ Iridescent 21:27, 12 August 2016 (UTC)

Good point. Just one note of clarification - the IP editor in question is not a proved representative of the Trump transition committee. Their IP address geolocates to Iowa. If there is an unambiguous request, and there is precedent, I have no objection. However, there should be a formal request that unambiguously originates with the organization itself, is filed via OTRS ticket for verifiability, and posted here as an administrator ruling. Otherwise we're dealing with things happening in the shadows and smoke-filled backrooms which is antithetical to WP. LavaBaron (talk) 21:33, 12 August 2016 (UTC)

• Leaning towards removal / indifference to keeping it. Frankly I don't see a need to provide a number on the street for an office such as this. Should we also provide the floor number? We don't provide the address for the Presidential transition of Barack Obama or the Planned presidential transition of Mitt Romney. Why? because it's just not interesting. -- zzuuzz 21:32, 12 August 2016 (UTC)

Actually, I wrote the article Planned presidential transition of Mitt Romney so I can affirmatively say the reason I didn't provide the address is because I didn't know it. No other reason. LavaBaron (talk) 21:34, 12 August 2016 (UTC)

Maybe that's an indication of how important it was. -- zzuuzz 21:36, 12 August 2016 (UTC)

• Remove street address per Iridescent, since we don't list the WMF's street address... Geogene (talk) 22:33, 12 August 2016 (UTC)

I thought you were "suspending" your activity on Misplaced Pages because you didn't like the WMF messing with the U.S. constitution or something? Does this mean you're lifting your embargo? LavaBaron (talk) 22:46, 12 August 2016 (UTC)

• Keep Street Address: Nobody owns an article here but I don't consider that private information nor "security concerns". The public already know this and should not visit here. KGirlTrucker81 23:19, 12 August 2016 (UTC)
• Keep The location can be easily found elsewhere anyway. Having it here isn't a security issue.74.70.146.1 (talk) 00:53, 13 August 2016 (UTC)
• Keep unless there is an OTRS verified request We have previously removed the location for other organisations but this has happened only after verifying the request. In this case, the address has been published by Washington Post. If the IP can send a request to OTRS and the authenticity of the request can be verified, I would not be opposed to removing it. --Lemongirl942 (talk) 04:14, 13 August 2016 (UTC)
• Keep unless there is an ORTS verified request An unverified request from an anon is meaningless. Besides, it's not exactly an undisclosed location; it's half a block from the White House complex. There is also the possibility that it's not really there. The address is a virtual office space. There are short-stay office spaces and cubicles starting at $35 a day. John Nagle (talk) 05:43, 13 August 2016 (UTC)
• Keep. needs an OTRS verified request. Now going to check on the Ten Downing Street article. -Roxy the dog™ bark 10:28, 13 August 2016 (UTC)
• Remove street address - because listing a specific street address doesn't increase the readers' understanding of the article's subject matter. I'd suggest using the "Headquarters" parameter in infobox instead to list the city as in Presidential transition of Barack Obama.-- Isaidnoway (talk) 17:13, 13 August 2016 (UTC)

It's an important part of the historical record. Given the importance of the U.S. presidency, everything associated with it is important. The place where Clinton and/or Trump developed the apparatus that ultimately ruled the U.S. for 4-8 years is an historic location and a record of it should be preserved. (Also, the GPS coordinates are in this article already and reveal the exact location anyway.) LavaBaron (talk) 19:29, 13 August 2016 (UTC)

Do you think you could find a reference that actually verifies the content you have added, as it stands now, I'd have to change my !vote to failed verification, because the WaPo ref says: If they accept, Clinton and Trump staffs will ride the same elevators to their offices...and goes on to say...In keeping with his unorthodox campaign, Trump may steer clear of Washington for transition planning. “You wouldn’t believe the amount of office space in New York,” Lewandowski said. He said it’s “highly likely” the transition will use GSA space, but may seek it instead in New York, where the campaign is headquartered now, - (note that Lewandowski is no longer the campaign manager), The other source says: Once the Government Services Administration turns on the lights for the transition offices. So it doesn't sound like it's definitive to me that the Trump campaign has actually moved into those offices, hell, it doesn't even sound like the lights are on yet.-- Isaidnoway (talk) 20:54, 13 August 2016 (UTC)

That's nice. But we can debate what the address is later. This RfC asks if a street address should be provided, not what the street address is. LavaBaron (talk) 22:27, 13 August 2016 (UTC)

More info: this is just short term leased space until Election Day. Then the winner gets office space in a GSA government office building at 1800 F Street NW, where the real work of transitioning takes place. John Nagle (talk) 22:43, 13 August 2016 (UTC)

Great find, John Nagle. LavaBaron (talk) 22:50, 13 August 2016 (UTC)

Then why did you put 1717 Pennsylvania Avenue in the infobox with those sources that don't support the content, if the debate will take later on what the specific address is? And also, why did you cite that specific street address (1717 Pennsylvania Avenue) and ask up above: Should we include it here or should we make an exception to custom to remove it or make it generic to refer only to a general area? - if the debate is going to be later on what the specific address is.-- Isaidnoway (talk) 04:39, 14 August 2016 (UTC)

I'm not debating it. You're debating it. And we'd prefer you start a different thread to do it in. Thanks. LavaBaron (talk) 07:37, 14 August 2016 (UTC)

• Keep We wouldn't want incompetent terrorists to go to the wrong address. However, remove if formal request received from affected transition team. After all: "1-7-15 The two masked men brandishing automatic weapons had the wrong door. They were looking for the offices of Charlie Hebdo, a satirical weekly. After learning from a pair of maintenance workers that their target was two doors over, the gunmen killed one of the unfortunate duo." Terrorists are not the only ones who make "honest" mistakes: 4-28-13 Police in Fort Worth, Texas, are blaming “poor lighting” after two officers went to the wrong home in search of a possible burglar and ended up shooting a 72-year-old man dead in his garage. The officers, were responding to a burglary alarm on May 28 when the tragic mistake occurred. 4-25-13 Lebanon, TN: A 61-year-old man was shot to death by police while his wife was handcuffed in another room during a drug raid on the wrong house. Police admitted their mistake, saying faulty information from a drug informant contributed to the death of John Adams Wednesday night. They intended to raid the home next door. 6-9-16 Stockbridge, GA: David Powell, 63, was shot late Tuesday or early Wednesday when police arrived outside his home and he went outside, with a gun, to see what the commotion was about. Police said Powell refused their instructions to put down his weapon. Henry County police were responding to a call to 911 reporting gunshots and a woman crying for help. A preliminary review of the 911 call indicates “the officers were at the wrong location,” said the GBI, which is investigating the shooting. Activist (talk) 14:40, 15 August 2016 (UTC)
• Remove per Iridescent and WP:COMMONSENSE. There is no encyclopedic value and that isn't a permanent location like a museum. Just because a location is known does not mean it should be on Misplaced Pages. Mr Ernie (talk) 12:24, 16 August 2016 (UTC)
• Keep. Not Censored superseded all other considerations except a BLP violation, or a real threat. If there is a real threat, it should go through LEGAL or OFFICE, who can deal properly with such matters in a way that prevents inappropriate discussion. Individual OTRS agents do not have authority to decide policy, just to facilitate interactions between WP and the outside world. DGG ( talk ) 19:20, 16 August 2016 (UTC)
• Weak remove Little to no encyclopedic value. Plus I doubt everyone is operating out of that office, given Trump HQ is in NY. Instaurare (talk) 18:22, 17 August 2016 (UTC)
• Keep per DGG and I sincerely hope Activist's comments above were meant as humour. FoCuS contribs; talk to me! 13:12, 19 August 2016 (UTC)
  • Keep Much as I admire them, I'm not remotely as able as Lewis Carroll or Dean Swift, but I would hope satire and sarcasm are allowed (and hopefully recognized as such) here. Activist (talk) 07:56, 20 August 2016 (UTC)

IP 65.152.141.197 is the General Services Administration

operating out of the 1717 Pennsylvania Avenue address. The geolocation is just showing a proxy server. Which of course makes it possible, even likely that it is someone from the transitional team. Doug Weller talk 14:54, 14 August 2016 (UTC)

Has anyone considered just asking them if they're happy having the address listed? I can think of plenty of perfectly legitimate reasons why they wouldn't want it listed; if it's just an administrative office rather than a public-facing campaign facility, presumably they don't want supporters turning up out of the blue to offer their support, or opponents turning up to heckle. The Ten Downing Street comparison above isn't really relevant, as that's a public building (presumably should Trump win, we'd decline any request to conceal the fact that he lives in the White House as unreasonable). A closer British equivalent would be the Labour Party (UK) article which lists the address as their public contact address in Newcastle rather than their actual address of 105 Victoria Street, London, as the latter is an administrative office and not set up to handle visitors or large amounts of incoming mail. ‑ Iridescent 15:21, 14 August 2016 (UTC)

I'll be happy to ask. Since we don't have an email or phone for the transition office I guess I'll have to send them a letter if I can find their street address. I wonder where I can find that at? Oh I know, I'll check their Misplaced Pages article! LavaBaron (talk) 17:07, 14 August 2016 (UTC)

It's where to send a resume if you want a job with the incoming administration. Each new administration has to fill about 4,000 high level jobs in a hurry. They have to have a public point of contact for such HR functions. John Nagle (talk) 20:19, 14 August 2016 (UTC)

Frankly, it is none of their business what we post about them in WP, provided we don't disclose actually private information or engage in libel or misrepresentation. Just like everyone else. I also point out we have learned to be very skeptical about edits coming from official government ip addresses. Altogether too many of them have been from out-of-control staffers. DGG ( talk ) 19:23, 16 August 2016 (UTC)

Is this a case of "I don't like it"?

Why are these well sourced claims about notable information being disappaeared wholesale, without any effort to at least include some of the material? There is no way you can tell me none of this is relevant to this article. I am being persecuted unjustly. 63.143.192.228 (talk) 22:57, 11 November 2016 (UTC)

Your additions violate WP:LEDE, that's why. LavaBaron (talk) 23:00, 11 November 2016 (UTC)

How so? What aspect of LEDE do they violate?63.143.192.228 (talk) 23:02, 11 November 2016 (UTC)

MOS:INTRO, Relative Emphasis, and Scope of Article LavaBaron (talk) 23:05, 11 November 2016 (UTC)

You are completely wrong. This is the most notable aspect of his transition thus far: that thousands of protests have been organized against it. There are over 10,000 references I could add here. Looks like this is indeed a case of "I don't like it, make it go away!" Deleting my material won't make the protests end, friend. 63.143.192.228 (talk) 23:07, 11 November 2016 (UTC)

Your objection is noted. LavaBaron (talk) 00:13, 12 November 2016 (UTC)

It is notable and noteworthy but 63.143.192.228 (talk · contribs) should instead post a draft version here to the talk page and we can all discuss it and tweak it. The prior methodology of instead repeatedly adding it in, after all the objections, is not the best way to go here. Maybe you could try collaboration and see if it works to get a compromise version. 69.50.70.9 (talk) 00:51, 12 November 2016 (UTC)

Oh, I hadn't noticed the existing article at Protests against Donald Trump. Perhaps a link from this article to that one would be enough. That article is huge with over 200 sources LOL. So yeah, a simple link to there should suffice. 69.50.70.9 (talk) 00:53, 12 November 2016 (UTC)

Update history of Chris Christie and his close associates Bill Palatucci and Richard Bagger

This edit request has been answered. Set the |answered= or |ans= parameter to no to reactivate your request.

Chris Christie joined the as head of the transition planning team of Donald Trump, after he endorsed the presidential candidate when Christie dropped out of the race in the primary. Christie brought along two of his close associates — Richard Bagger and Bill Palatucci. After calls for Christie's impeachment as Governor and felony convictions in U.S. federal court for high-ranking members of his staff in the Bridgegate scandal, Christie was dropped by Trump as leader of the transition team, in favor of Mike Pence. On the same day, Bill Palatucci and Richard Bagger were also both removed by Trump from the transition team; they each then returned to working in the private sector.

Please add above to update article content. Sources are from: The Washington Post, The Guardian, The New York Times, and CNN.

Please also remove the two close associates of Chris Christie from the infobox (Bill Palatucci and Richard Bagger) as they are no longer associated with the transition team at all and both returned to the private sector.

Thank you ! 69.50.70.9 (talk) 00:49, 12 November 2016 (UTC)

References

1. ^ Robert Costa, Philip Rucker and Elise Viebeck (11 November 2016), "Pence replaces Christie as leader of Trump transition effort", The Washington Post, retrieved 12 November 2016
2. ^ David Smith (11 November 2016), "Chris Christie dropped as head of Trump's White House transition team", The Guardian, retrieved 12 November 2016
3. ^ Michael D. Shear, Michael S. Schmidt, and Maggie Habermannov (11 November 2016), "Vice President-Elect Pence to Take Over Trump Transition Effort", The New York Times, retrieved 12 November 2016{{citation}}: CS1 maint: multiple names: authors list (link)
4. Jeremy Diamond, Jake Tapper, Phil Mattingly and Stephen Collinson, CNN (February 26, 2016). "Chris Christie endorses Donald Trump". CNN. Retrieved February 27, 2016. {{cite web}}: |author= has generic name (help)CS1 maint: multiple names: authors list (link)

 Done IP editor - I made this change with a slight textual modification. Let me know if this form is okay. LavaBaron (talk) 03:28, 12 November 2016 (UTC)

Toggled request as done — Andy W. (talk) 03:32, 12 November 2016 (UTC)

Thanks, looks great! Probably should say a teeny bit more about Bridgegate, and also fix the link to Fort Lee lane closure scandal so it doesn't go to Bridgegate which is a less specific page about other things also. 69.50.70.9 (talk) 04:00, 12 November 2016 (UTC)

Sorry - fixed wikilink. LavaBaron (talk) 04:09, 12 November 2016 (UTC)

Much better, thank you ! 69.50.70.9 (talk) 05:05, 12 November 2016 (UTC)

Greatagain.gov - content under Creative Commons Attribution 4.0 License

This edit request has been answered. Set the |answered= or |ans= parameter to no to reactivate your request.

Please add:

Content at the Greatagain.gov website was made available under the Creative Commons Attribution 4.0 License. The website explained: "Except where otherwise noted, content on this site is licensed under a Creative Commons Attribution 4.0 License. Content includes all materials posted by the Trump Presidential transition. Visitors to this website agree to grant a non-exclusive, irrevocable, royalty-free license to the rest of the world for their submissions to this website under the Creative Commons Attribution 4.0 License."

Thank you ! 69.50.70.9 (talk) 09:25, 12 November 2016 (UTC)

Not done: please establish a consensus for this alteration before using the {{edit semi-protected}} template. -- Dane2007 01:12, 13 November 2016 (UTC)

Okay then. What do people think about adding this small bit of vital info to the page? 69.50.70.9 (talk) 02:08, 13 November 2016 (UTC)

Why? Calibrador (talk) 02:03, 15 November 2016 (UTC)

It's important to know so that we can use media files posted to the site for upload to the Commons, but is it vital to include in the article itself? LavaBaron (talk) 04:13, 15 November 2016 (UTC)

Seems noteworthy for a very brief mention being it is same policy used by Obama Transition website. 69.50.69.34 (talk) 17:00, 15 November 2016 (UTC)

The problem is, the noteworthiness of mentioning the website has a CC v 4.0 license can't be in the eye-of-the-beholder. If there are secondary sources discussing it, that would be one thing, but us observing it through a primary source (the website itself) and then declaring it noteworthy, is problematic. LavaBaron (talk) 21:35, 15 November 2016 (UTC)

• Mike Masnick (15 November 2016), "Trump Transition Website Has Some Copyright Problems -- Both In Copying Content & In Claiming Copyright", Techdirt, retrieved 15 November 2016
  • @LavaBaron:You raise some good points, here is a secondary source with commentary and discussion about the Creative Commons Attribution 4.0 license. 69.50.70.9 (talk) 23:54, 15 November 2016 (UTC)

OK, I added a sentence sourced to Politico since it actually contacted the copyright holder for comment. LavaBaron (talk) 00:22, 16 November 2016 (UTC)

Thank you, LavaBaron, can you also add that it is Creative Commons Attribution 4.0 License ? 69.50.70.9 (talk) 01:19, 16 November 2016 (UTC)

 Done ... I'll get to your other request shortly. LavaBaron (talk) 08:01, 17 November 2016 (UTC)

Employment of relatives in Executive Branch against US Federal law

• 5 U.S. Code § 3110 - Employment of relatives; restrictions -- Title 5 of the United States Code
  • https://www.gpo.gov/fdsys/granule/USCODE-2010-title5/USCODE-2010-title5-partIII-subpartB-chap31-subchapI-sec3110
  • https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/5/3110
  • https://www.gpo.gov/fdsys/pkg/USCODE-2010-title5/pdf/USCODE-2010-title5-partIII-subpartB-chap31-subchapI-sec3110.pdf

Media analysis:

• Could Donald Trump's kids serve in his administration?, CNN
• Donald Trump Jr. for Interior secretary?, The Washington Post

69.50.70.9 (talk) 22:19, 12 November 2016 (UTC)

References

1. ^ Trump Presidential transition (12 November 2016), "Copyright Information - Copyright Notice", Greatagain.gov, retrieved 12 November 2016, Except where otherwise noted, content on this site is licensed under a Creative Commons Attribution 4.0 License. Content includes all materials posted by the Trump Presidential transition. Visitors to this website agree to grant a non-exclusive, irrevocable, royalty-free license to the rest of the world for their submissions to this website under the Creative Commons Attribution 4.0 License.

• I'm not sure what the request here for addition is - IP editor could you clarify? To say "if X did Y, he would break the law" when X hasn't done Y, seems to skirt WP:CRYSTALBALL. LavaBaron (talk) 04:15, 15 November 2016 (UTC)

Trump Transition just asked for top security clearance for his family members. Seems to be moving quickly in that direction. 69.50.69.34 (talk) 17:01, 15 November 2016 (UTC)

Can you provide recommended text or wording? LavaBaron (talk) 21:28, 15 November 2016 (UTC)

@LavaBaron:Recommended text and wording:

CBS News reported that the Trump Transition team asked the Obama Administration White House for top security clearances for his children — however regulations discouraging nepotism within the government prevent the President of the United States from hiring family members to work in the executive branch.

With secondary sources to back it up using both CBS News and International Business Times. 69.50.70.9 (talk) 00:05, 16 November 2016 (UTC)

The issue I have with this is the sources say that there is no exclusion to family members receiving security clearances, only working in the government. As established in this article (or maybe it should be), the transition group is a private corporation. Your suggested wording strongly implies (without technically saying so) that a law has currently been broken, which the sources don't support LavaBaron (talk) 00:14, 16 November 2016 (UTC)

@LavaBaron:Recommended text and wording:

CBS News reported that the Trump Transition team asked the Obama Administration White House for top security clearances for his children during the transition period. Regulations discouraging nepotism within the government prevent the President of the United States from hiring family members to work in the executive branch.

LavaBaron, better? 69.50.70.9 (talk) 01:18, 16 November 2016 (UTC)

New article: Donald Trump Requests Security Clearance for Son-in-Law Jared Kushner, NBC News -- "While it's unclear when Kushner would receive security clearance, the legality of such a move is murky as well, as it raises questions about whether Trump is contravening the anti-nepotism law that bars presidents from appointing family members to cabinet positions or formal government jobs." -- Getting more and more relevant and covered by thousands of sources now. 69.50.70.9 (talk) 03:27, 16 November 2016 (UTC)

IP editor - OK, OK, I get it. I'll get to this as soon as possible. I'm not the Trump Transition Misplaced Pages Curator. LavaBaron (talk)

No problem, and thank you. 69.50.70.9 (talk) 05:44, 16 November 2016 (UTC)

Mike Rogers out from transition team amid purge of Chris Christie allies

This edit request has been answered. Set the |answered= or |ans= parameter to no to reactivate your request.

• Damian Paletta and Carol E. Lee (15 November 2016), "Intelligence Expert Mike Rogers Leaves Trump Transition Team Amid Shake-up - Former House Intelligence Committee Chairman seen as Chris Christie ally; Ben Carson turns down cabinet post", The Wall Street Journal, retrieved 15 November 2016

"Mr. Rogers, a Republican who represented Michigan until last year, held a central role overseeing the national-security transition process for Mr. Trump’s team since before last week’s election. But he is considered a close ally of New Jersey Gov. Chris Christie, and multiple people close to Mr. Christie were removed from the transition team in recent days amid a major shake-up."

Significant development. 69.50.69.34 (talk) 17:04, 15 November 2016 (UTC)

And also: Trump Transition Shake-Up Part of 'Stalinesque Purge' of Christie Loyalists, NBC News. 69.50.69.34 (talk) 17:13, 15 November 2016 (UTC)

Not done: it's not clear what changes you want to be made. Please mention the specific changes in a "change X to Y" format. JTP 17:32, 15 November 2016 (UTC)

Former Congressman Mike Rogers, a national security expert on the Trump transition team, was additionally another close associate of Chris Christie who was also removed a few days after Christie's departure.

@NotTheFakeJTP: Please add that to update the page. Thank you ! 69.50.69.34 (talk) 18:02, 15 November 2016 (UTC)

@69.50.69.34: Add it where? SPERs require a specific "change XX to YY" format. Thank you. JTP 18:30, 15 November 2016 (UTC)

@NotTheFakeJTP:Please add at bottom of section Presidential_transition_of_Donald_Trump#Procedures_and_protocol. Thank you ! 69.50.69.34 (talk) 18:32, 15 November 2016 (UTC)

 Done LavaBaron (talk) 21:31, 15 November 2016 (UTC)

Looks great, thank you. 69.50.70.9 (talk) 00:06, 16 November 2016 (UTC)

References

1. "Trump team seeks top-secret security clearances for Trump's children", CBS News, 15 November 2016, retrieved 16 November 2016
2. Nicole Rajas (15 November 2016), "Trump team looking to get security clearance for president-elect's children", International Business Times, retrieved 16 November 2016
3. ^ Nicole Rajas (15 November 2016), "Trump team looking to get security clearance for president-elect's children", International Business Times, retrieved 16 November 2016
4. "Trump team seeks top-secret security clearances for Trump's children", CBS News, 15 November 2016, retrieved 16 November 2016
5. Damian Paletta and Carol E. Lee (15 November 2016), "Intelligence Expert Mike Rogers Leaves Trump Transition Team Amid Shake-up - Former House Intelligence Committee Chairman seen as Chris Christie ally; Ben Carson turns down cabinet post", The Wall Street Journal, retrieved 15 November 2016
6. Ken Dilanian and Alexandra Jaffe (15 November 2016), "Trump Transition Shake-Up Part of 'Stalinesque Purge' of Christie Loyalists", NBC News, retrieved 15 November 2016
7. Jennifer Jacobs (15 November 2016), "Ex-Intelligence Chairman Rogers Leaves Trump Transition Team", Bloomberg Politics, retrieved 15 November 2016

Miscellaneous Recent Developments

Presidential daily briefings were offered on Nov 9th rather than "provided" as stated in the article. They were finally availed upon on Nov 15th http://www.cnn.com/2016/11/15/politics/trump-getting-first-presidential-daily-briefing-tuesday/index.html (71.233.204.242 (talk) 02:49, 16 November 2016 (UTC))

 Done I've made this change. Thank you. LavaBaron (talk) 05:27, 16 November 2016 (UTC)

Infobox

The infobox makes it appear that this article is about one or more nonprofit organizations. However a reader would reasonably expect this title to refer to the transition process, funded by the U.S. government. Which is it? - Brianhe (talk) 00:02, 23 November 2016 (UTC)

It is both, simultaneously. There is an official 'social welfare org' 501(c)(4) designation, per the official website. There is also federal in-kind 'funding' but it is very new, per CNN: "Before the 2012 cycle, all pre-election transition activity was privately funded... This year, Congress appropriated $13.7 million for pre-election transition efforts... any actual cash." See also about the pre-election fundraising, this FOIA-specific description about how the transition is quasi-governmental and thus both non-transparent AND heavily bureaucratic, this bit about the post-election continuation of private funds for unspecified costs not covered by federal budget allocations. 47.222.203.135 (talk) 17:47, 6 December 2016 (UTC)

Business interests section

Hi everyone,

This article that I created: Conflicts of interest of President-elect Donald Trump looks like it will be deleted as an attack page. While I disagree, I respect any decision made and wanted to ask what people think about adding the specific potential conflicts of interest to this page about the presidential transition?

1. Trump International Hotel, Washington is leased with the General Services Administration, which specifically prohibits elected officials from deriving benefit from the lease.
2. Deutsche Bank is owed $365 million for a hotel in Washington DC, a hotel in Chicago, and a golf course in Florida. There is a $14 billion fine being negotiated with Deutsche Bank and the Department of Justice for matters unrelated to Trump, that he as President would have power to influence.
3. The Internal Revenue Service receives a new appointed head by the President of the United States every five years, the next head due November 13, 2017. Trump is currently under audit by the Internal Revenue Service.
4. The National Labor Relations Board sometimes has had disputes with the Trump organization, and Trump will be appointing the members of the organization.
5. The Trump organization's foreign investments around the world will be affected by policy decisions while Trump is president. The organization has business holdings in at least 20 countries.
6. The Industrial and Commercial Bank of China currently rents space in Trump Tower.
7. Trump favors completing the Dakota Access Pipeline, and owns stock in the company building it.

Victor Grigas (talk) 14:34, 3 December 2016 (UTC)

References

1. "Trump's foreign business interests: 144 companies in 25 countries". CNN. Retrieved 1 December 2016.
2. ^ Buchanan, Larry; Yourish, Karen (December 1, 2016). "The Array of Conflicts of Interest Facing the Trump Presidency". The New York Times. Retrieved December 2, 2016.
3. Newmyer, Troy (December 1, 2016). "Donald Trump's Looming Giant Conflict of Interest With His New Hotel". Fortune. Retrieved December 2, 2016.
4. Popovich, Nadja; Diehm, Jan; team, Guardian US interactive. "Trump's conflicts of interest: a visual guide". the Guardian. Retrieved 2016-12-03.
5. "Trump's Loans From Troubled German Bank Pose Conflict Of Interest". Morning Edition. NPR. December 1, 2016. Retrieved December 2, 2016.
6. Paddock, Richard C.; Lipton, Eric; Barry, Ellen; Nordland, Rod; Hakim, Danny; Romero, Simon (November 26, 2016). "Potential Conflicts Around the Globe for Trump, the Businessman President". The New York Times. Retrieved December 2, 2016.
7. Lopez, Linette (November 28, 2016). "And here's Trump's conflict of interest with the Chinese government..." Business Insider. Retrieved December 2, 2016.
8. Reporter, Michael McLaughlin; Post, The Huffington (2016-12-02). "Trump Supports Dakota Access Pipeline. Did We Mention He's Invested In It?". The Huffington Post. Retrieved 2016-12-03.

Adding this box so the cites will stop falling to the bottom of the talkpage. 47.222.203.135 (talk) 17:49, 6 December 2016 (UTC)

• In my opinion, the fact that this has been a concern SHOULD be mentioned in the article, with sources documenting that experts have expressed concern and a few of the most important examples. However a list of everything that someone has been mentioned anywhere is a little too much. Remember that until he takes office these are only POTENTIAL conflicts.Kitfoxxe (talk) 15:48, 4 December 2016 (UTC)
  • My suggestion is that we create Presidency of Donald Trump#Personal Connections with Foreign Countries which can point out the positive connections, as well as the potential-conflict-of-interest-connections (in some cases they will be the same connection but most of the time they will be different things -- Trump has a golf course in Scotland and is also part-Scottish ancestry on the maternal side of his family). We can also summarize the history of the Foreign Emoluments Clause in a sentence or two (Title of Nobility Clause#Foreign_emoluments), which covers the Constitutional basis and the broader history of financial entanglements with foreign governments. Because it was a campaign issue (first raised by Bernie Sanders and then later continued by various Republican contenders if memory serves), I also believe we need to link to Clinton_Foundation–State_Department_controversy#Transparency_and_foreign_donations or a similar summary. There have often been potus-elect (and potus-proper) people with international connections, and some criticism; Mitt Romney visited Poland to meet Lech Walesa (and was accused of soliciting foreign funds thereby), Barack Obama received the Nobel Prize (and the million bucks in prize money), GHWB/GWB had extensive ties in the middle east from their work in the oil industry (and the associated controversy which accompanied their potus-actions in the region), and so on. 47.222.203.135 (talk) 16:32, 9 December 2016 (UTC)
  • There are a couple 'conflicts' that I believe should NOT be covered in that new subsection, including nepotism (e.g. children playing a role in the administration) and patronage (e.g. major donors or supporters being given administration roles) which should probably be covered instead at the appropriate chronological timepoint in List of Donald Trump political appointments and in Presidential transition of Donald Trump. We might give a summary here, with a sentence about each of them, under the transition-team portion for nepotism and under the cabinet-level appointments section for patronage. 47.222.203.135 (talk) 16:32, 9 December 2016 (UTC)
  • Discussion of specifics: I have changed from a bullet-point list to a numbered list (in the content-listing above), for ease of talking about the factoids. I think #7 is something that can be mentioned more with respect to Harold Hamm, one of Trump's advisors and a key figure in the pipeline project; Trump's stock is a potential conflict, but only if he retains it once potus, in broad strokes. Trump's acceptance of policy-help and campaign donations from Hamm, is a larger topic that will get plenty of scrutiny (cf Bush family and their connections to the oil industry). Rumour has it that Hamm will not be a formal member of the administration, but he was a formal member of the campaign, and has been under serious consideration by the transition team, so I would merge that pipeline factoid into those articles. 47.222.203.135 (talk) 16:32, 9 December 2016 (UTC)
  • I think #6 and the BoC connection is worth mentioning under the section called Presidency of Donald Trump#International Relations with China, along with the call to Taiwan, the tweets about the South China Sea, the campaign rhetoric about currency manipulation, and a brief pointer to Trump's political activism going all the way back to the 1980s with respect to getting better trade-deals with Asian industrial giants. BoC renting office-space on 5th Avenue is really more of a footnote, rather than a full-sentence-worthy factoid, in my book, but time will tell. 47.222.203.135 (talk) 16:32, 9 December 2016 (UTC)
  • I think we can cover #1/#2/#5 in detail over in the Trump Organization article, or maybe in the Donald Trump#Business article, and then mention them here in this article about foreign connections ("as head of the Trump Organization potus-elect has properties and investments in dozens of countries, and as real estate is a capital-intensive business has outstanding loans with foreign banks as of late 2016") but my suspicion is that those direct ties are going to be blind-trustified in fairly short order. We should still note them, here in the presidency-article, but unless they blow up into scandals, they are more potential-conflicts-that-were-avoided-during-the-preliminary-transition-phase, rather than stuff which had a material impact on Presidency-of-Donald-Trump (aka the topic of this article). In other words, it is a bigger deal for the Trump Organization, that they had to lose Trump as their titular head, than it is for the Trump Presidency that he was temporarily in a potential conflict of interest PRIOR to taking office. 47.222.203.135 (talk) 16:32, 9 December 2016 (UTC)
  • Quickly glancing at it, the IRS thing in #3 is a non-sequiter; every potus pays taxes, and lots of repub potus candidates promise tax cuts. That is not corruption, that is not a conflict of interest, that is an ideology that the NYT dislikes.  ;-) There were 72 repubs in the House that voted to impeach the commissioner of the IRS -- the vote came after Trump was potus-elect, but it was not for his benefit -- the vast majority of them endorsed somebody else for president, besides Trump. See also the NRLB thing, below. 47.222.203.135 (talk) 16:32, 9 December 2016 (UTC)
  • There might be more meat to the #4 point about the NRLB, but if so that belongs under the Secretary of Labor discussion (and Deputy Secretary and NRLB member-appointees) rather than as a purported "conflict" -- unless the sentence can be neutrally rewritten, I don't think we should say in wikipedia's voice that "sometimes" (vague & weasel-wordy) in the unspecified past there have been some unspecified sort of "disputes" (again with the vague & weasel-wordy) between Trump and/or Trump's company and the NRLB. As with taxes, every business that hires employees is subject to the NRLB; unless Trump has been involved with a bunch of *unusual* NRLB actions, this is not something I could support as being encyclopedic (it implies wrongdoing and/or corruption when no such thing is being shown). NYT mentions a specific NRLB ruling, which went "against" some hotel that Trump partially owns, but gives no indication of wrongdoing, no indication of corruption, and most importantly in my mind, no indication of how often this happens relative to other major hotels owned by other people (union disputes are not unique to Trump Hotel Vegas I'm sure!). Where's the beef, would be my question here. If we don't have anything but this, at most we can say "the NYT criticized Trump for being potus because his businesses have to follow NRLB regulations" but we cannot call THAT a conflict of interest in wikipedia's voice. Credit Mobilier was corruption and a conflict of interest; appointing pro-business repubs to the NRLB would be partisan (just like Obama appointed mostly pro-regulatory dems), but not corrupt, and wikipedia must not imply something that isn't there. 47.222.203.135 (talk) 16:32, 9 December 2016 (UTC)
  • All told, I don't like the infographic-heavy approach that NYT and CNN are taking with respect to this inherently non-neutral topic; wikipedia can do better, by covering the topic with an eye to the history of presidential candidates and office-holders with foreign connections, in a neutral fashion that compares apples to apples. And although I have written a lot of advice here, on how we ought to revamp the content to "do better" than the media, I have not taken an actual stab at doing so... this is a tricky area, and it will be hard to strike the proper balance of neutrality and proper weighting. I invite the bravest wikipedian to step forward and give it a shot  :-) 47.222.203.135 (talk) 16:32, 9 December 2016 (UTC)

If you can help me to write it, I'd be happy to post it. Everything you've drafted above sounds entirely reasonable to me. I'd say we should start with one well-reasoned part at a time? Victor Grigas (talk) 20:08, 10 December 2016 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 4 December 2016

This edit request to Presidential transition of Donald Trump has been answered. Set the |answered= or |ans= parameter to no to reactivate your request.

National Security: Yleem Poblete was named as advisor for National Security. http://www.washingtonexaminer.com/former-house-foreign-affairs-chief-of-staff-named-to-trumps-nsc-landing-team/article/2608666#.WECl2Oyl8kA.facebook Saraiblack (talk) 13:12, 4 December 2016 (UTC)

 Not done This page is no longer protected - you can edit it directly. — xaosflux 04:21, 12 December 2016 (UTC)

Poblete is a member of the "landing team" which is to say that they are a staffer assigned to help the transition team that is dealing with national security issues. (The position of National Security Advisor very high level, Michael T. Flynn is the expected appointee.) Currently we only list the vice-chairs and the executive-committee of the transition team, not the individual landing team staff members. Yleem Poblete is currently a redlink, so maybe it is better to keep the landing team out, but by contrast Mark Neuman is a bluelink (another landing-team person who had a name I recognized). Might be worth mentioning some of these in the Presidential transition of Donald Trump#Leadership subsection, in a prose paragraph at the bottom? 47.222.203.135 (talk) 11:56, 14 December 2016 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 6 December 2016

This edit request to Presidential transition of Donald Trump has been answered. Set the |answered= or |ans= parameter to no to reactivate your request.

Please change the following section -- Presidential_transition_of_Donald_Trump#Leadership -- by inserting the following information:

• ... originally had six vice-chairs, which was expanded on November 29, 2016 to thirteen vice-chairs, ...
• ... Marsha Blackburn (formerly on the executive committee), incoming Deputy National Security Advisor KT McFarland, Governor Mary Fallin, Senator Tim Scott, Rep. Cathy McMorris Rodgers, Rep. Tom Reed, and outgoing Rep. Cynthia Lummis.

• ... Executive Committee which includes:
• Rep. Marsha Blackburn

• The following members of the Executive Committee were added on November 29, 2016:
• Rep. Sean Duffy
• Rep. Trey Gowdy
• Rep. Dennis Ross
• Pastor Darrell Scott
• Kiron Skinner

Source is . Thanks 47.222.203.135 (talk) 18:12, 6 December 2016 (UTC)

 Not done This page is no longer protected - you can edit it directly. — xaosflux 04:21, 12 December 2016 (UTC)

 Done, thanks. 47.222.203.135 (talk) 11:52, 14 December 2016 (UTC)

Secretary of Interior and Secretary of Energy picks

http://thehill.com/policy/energy-environment/309628-trump-to-pick-rep-mcmorris-rodgers-for-interior-secretary-report

http://www.wsj.com/articles/donald-trump-picks-former-texas-gov-rick-perry-as-energy-secretary-1481641430 — Preceding unsigned comment added by 207.245.44.6 (talk) 16:18, 13 December 2016 (UTC)

The main article for this material is at Cabinet of Donald Trump, which is where those sources could be best put to use. However, there is a discussion about whether or not Rodgers is really going to be the pick for Interior, see page above, plus Template_talk:Cabinet of Donald Trump for the Zinke-vs-Rodgers problem. The media is reporting what anonymous leaks from the transition team say, with titles crafted to confuse the general public into clicking. Thanks for the links to those news pieces, however, they are helpful. 47.222.203.135 (talk) 12:00, 14 December 2016 (UTC)

energy secretary and interior secretary picked

http://fortune.com/2016/12/14/donald-trump-rick-perry-energy-secretary/

http://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-trump-zinke-idUSKBN1422R1

172.98.159.242 (talk) 12:26, 14 December 2016 (UTC)

Is Gary Cohn tapped to be Chairman of the Council of Economic Advisers?

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2016-12-12/goldman-s-cohn-accepts-national-economic-council-job-cnbc-says

207.245.44.6 (talk) 16:24, 15 December 2016 (UTC)

No -- instead Cohn is expected to become the director of the National Economic Council, which is managerial, and distinct from the to-be-announced person that will act as chair of the Council of Economic Advisors, which is analysis&statistics. Longer explanation is at Political appointments of Donald Trump#Chair_of_the_White_House_Council_of_Economic_Advisers. There was a *rumor* that Larry Kudlow was going to be CEA chair, but it turned out to be premature, and we don't know who that will be yet. 47.222.203.135 (talk) 22:49, 19 December 2016 (UTC)

analysis article

That will be useful to editors working here: The Atlantic A President without an Administration, January 3.E.M.Gregory (talk) 10:41, 4 January 2017 (UTC)

official interim portrait of the PEOTUS, versus the still-not-available POTUS-portrait

Does this pic belong here in the transition-article? File:Donald Trump Presidential portrait.jpg It is black-n-white, and has a scowl similar to his book-cover Crippled America, so it is not likely to be used in the biography-page Donald Trump (see talkpage there for rough consensus).

But it seems appropriate for this article, about the transition-process. Currently we have File:TrumpTransitionMontage.jpg at the top in the infobox, which is a wide-shot of a meeting with Obama, on top of two smaller photos which illustrate the first-lady-meeting and the construction-of-the-inauguration-platform. Can somebody with the graphics art skills, possibly create File:TrumpTransitionMontage2.jpg, with the official interim PEOTUS-portrait in the top-righthand-corner of the four pictures, and the current wide-shot of the trump-with-obama meeting cropped down so it will fit into the top-lefthand-corner of the new montage?

Alternatively (or simultaneously), we could just stick the File:Donald Trump Presidential portrait.jpg (which needs to be renamed to Donald_Trump_interim_presidential_transition_portrait.jpg please) into the Presidential transition of Donald Trump#Leadership section, right above Mike Pence? 47.222.203.135 (talk) 11:24, 14 January 2017 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 14 January 2017

This edit request to Presidential transition of Donald Trump has been answered. Set the |answered= or |ans= parameter to no to reactivate your request.

Please change this:

• On December 14, Trump met with CEOs and representatives from Silicon Valley tech companies in his Trump Tower.

To this:

• On December 14, Trump met with CEOs and representatives from Silicon Valley tech companies in his Trump Tower.

Wikilinks to the main article on the meeting, and removes redundant 'his Trump Tower' to just say Trump Tower. 47.222.203.135 (talk) 12:09, 14 January 2017 (UTC) 47.222.203.135 (talk) 12:09, 14 January 2017 (UTC)

 Done Thanks! _ennasis @ 18:17, 16 Tevet 5777 / 18:17, 14 January 2017 (UTC)

Sonny Perdue

You have it right on this page but on President Trump's main page you forgot to mention that Sonny Perdue was picked as President Trump's nominee for Secretary of Agriculture Coxc4673 (talk) 05:42, 9 February 2017 (UTC)

2017 dismissal of U.S. attorneys controversy

2017 dismissal of U.S. attorneys controversy may need to be mentioned in the article's prose, but I added this link to the "See also" section for now. ---Another Believer _(Talk) 01:00, 11 March 2017 (UTC)

End of transition process

The article says that the transition ended with the inauguration of Mr. Trump. This is in line with United States presidential transition. But (as usual with such transitions) many office holders are subject to approval by the Senate, so in the meantime there was (and in some cases still is) an 'acting' office-holder, appointed by the previous president. It seems to me that it would be logical to see this as part of the transition process, which could also mean that the transition period finally ends when the Senate will have approved all office-holders. Bever (talk) 22:31, 3 April 2017 (UTC)

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Cross outs for transition team members

What is the criteria for crossing people out? Should this be updated, or should we remove the cross outs? It seems outdated as other people e.g. Scaramucci have also moved on and are no longer associated with the Trump administration. -KaJunl (talk) 03:35, 6 September 2020 (UTC)

Put Christie in infobox?

He was the head of the transition for the first several days that Trump was president-elect. Should he be listed in the infobox? SecretName101 (talk) 09:23, 21 May 2021 (UTC)

"GreatAgain" listed at Redirects for discussion

An editor has identified a potential problem with the redirect GreatAgain and has thus listed it for discussion. This discussion will occur at Misplaced Pages:Redirects for discussion/Log/2022 June 10#GreatAgain until a consensus is reached, and readers of this page are welcome to contribute to the discussion. QueenofBithynia (talk) 20:31, 10 June 2022 (UTC)

Move article to "2016 Presidential Transition of Donald Trump"?

Trying to figure out what to name the 2024 presidential transition article... Superb Owl (talk) 16:19, 29 August 2024 (UTC)

Planned presidential transition of ... is the nomenclature for transitions that didn't happen / won't happen / haven't happened yet. – Muboshgu (talk) 16:51, 29 August 2024 (UTC)

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