Talk:List of The Wire episodes: Difference between revisions

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		⚫	== Regions ==
	Why did I rename this? Because the ] said this was the correct page title. ] 11:38, 14 December 2005 (UTC)

⚫	==Regions==

	Why were the Region 4 DVD details removed from this page?		Why were the Region 4 DVD details removed from this page?

			== "Amsterdam" NOT "Hamsterdam" ==
	==Move discussion==

			Contrary to popular belief, ep.304 is called AMSTERDAM and NOT HAMSTERDAM! Can someone change this? <small>—Preceding ] comment added by ] (] • ]) 22:16, 7 December 2007 (UTC)</small><!-- Template:Unsigned --> <!--Autosigned by SineBot-->
			:Is it, really? The information is conflicting. I believe "Hamsterdam" to be the title but I could be wrong.–] <sup>]</sup> 11:37, 29 December 2007 (UTC)
			:* HBO's episode guide gives the title as "Hamsterdam". That may have been changed after production since apparently the mispronunciation was made on-set and only later incorporated into the script. () --] (]) 20:41, 4 March 2008 (UTC)

			:I always heard it as "hamsterdam", a bastardisation of the dutch city, with intent. --] (]) 23:03, 6 March 2008 (UTC)
			::The argument isn't about the malapropism - it is definitely Hamsterdam within the series. We're wondering what the episode title was.--] (]) 08:03, 7 March 2008 (UTC)
			:* And I'm not sure why we're wondering since it's a current HBO series and HBO maintains a fully-fleshed-out website about it which gives the titles of the episodes. Even if they did change the title after the fact, we have ] for accepting changes like that as authoritative. --] (]) 01:08, 8 March 2008 (UTC)

			It would appear that at least one person is applying a personal preference here instead of trying to be accurate. I did apply the change from Hamsterdam to Amsterdam and this person changed it back. Maybe this person thinks it's funny, however, the HBO site that lists the episode clearly lists it as Amsterdam. I'm not sure what is achieved by using some alternate name, when the real name is Amsterdam, but Misplaced Pages gets enough criticism based on its ability to be edited by anyone without people directly adding to the problem by entering clearly inaccurate information.] (]) 18:33, 18 January 2015 (UTC)
			:The episode is also known as "Hamsterdam". It was "Amsterdam" on the season 3 DVD, then changed to "Hamsterdam" for the complete series DVD set. It has appeared as both titles on the HBO website , but currently reads "Amsterdam". I changed it back because simply linking to ] is incorrect, the proper article name would be ], which ] would have to be moved to. ] (]) 18:54, 18 January 2015 (UTC)
			:The point here is accuracy. The original name was Amsterdam and HBO currently lists it as Amsterdam. As for your reference to the hitfix site, are we supposed to take that as some sort of Gospel? I'd say that the HBO site is the accurate source, not a pop media web site. It sounds like you just want to force your opinion in this topic instead of trying to keep it accurate.] (]) 19:52, 18 January 2015 (UTC)

			== Structure ==

			I think we need to change the way we structure individual episode articles in order to better conform to the standards set by WP:TV. When I started these articles I basically only wrote guest stars and plot sections. Now I think each article should aim to include a production, plot and reception section (along with references and external links). I think plot should contain the plot summary (which should be around 10 words per minute of screen time), first appearances and deceased sections as these are all in universe. Production should contains information on the cast, crew and credits, the epigraph, the title reference, locations, music and links to other works. Reception should include viewing figures, reviews and any awards or nominations received. What do people think? If there are no objections I will begin restructuring the episode articles to meet this format soon.--] (]) 17:58, 7 January 2008 (UTC)

			== Merge proposal ==

			There's a merge notice on the current article, also one pointing here on ] and I guess the others too.

			I'd oppose the merge. The article is plenty long enough as is. ] (]) 03:30, 15 March 2008 (UTC)

			:There is clear precedent for keeping individual episode pages for notable series. ] ] 10:40, 15 March 2008 (UTC)

			:I too would oppose the merge - the article would be massive - likely so large that we would be motivated to split it into separate articles. ] (]) 11:14, 15 March 2008 (UTC)

			::Seeing as the proposal has been up for a few months, we're working to improve the articles and the consensus is against merging shall we begin removing these tags?--] (]) 12:48, 15 March 2008 (UTC)

			:::Is there a justification for this merge proposal somewhere? Where? ] (]) 03:41, 16 March 2008 (UTC)

			::::].--] (]) 09:38, 16 March 2008 (UTC)

			:::::Hmmm, OK. Then I'm inclined to think the tags should be removed. As you say, there seems no prospect of consensus to merge. ] (]) 05:40, 17 March 2008 (UTC)

			:Oppose merge. The Wire is notable and these episode summaries are long enough that merging them would be unfriendly to users. ] (]) 18:39, 10 September 2008 (UTC)

			:I know I am pretty much alone here, but '''support merger''' into new season articles (because a merger into the List of episodes is unlikely to gain consensus). I've had a look at the episode articles of the first season, and apart from the first two eps, they consist of unsourced trivia (everyone can make up trivia), cast lists (every TV episode has a cast) and sourced plot (every TV episode has a plot); no production or reception section to make the article not violate ] and establish ] => why do these episode articles need to exist? Is someone seriously working in the articles, as claimed above? – ] <sup>]•]</sup> 08:46, 10 October 2008 (UTC)
	There is a proposed move of several episodes of The Wire that don't follow standard wikipedia naming conventions. More info and voting/discussion at ]. --] 21:29, 5 December 2006 (UTC)
	: Just to make sure this is clear to everyone -- There is currently a ''massive'' dispute at ]. As part of that dispute, a group of editors has taken it upon themselves to ignore existing objections, and work their way through Misplaced Pages, changing category after category to a different naming convention. The next target on their list is "The Wire", and they are planning on moving ''many'' articles. If you like the ''Wire'' categories the way that they currently are, please go to the "Proposed moves" poll, and say '''Oppose''' to try and stop this change. If, however, you like the idea of changing everything around, you should '''Support'''. --] 23:14, 5 December 2006 (UTC)

			* Without forming an opinion on the proposal yet, I'd support stripping the episode articles of unencylopedic trivia and detailed plot descriptions. Maybe then the picture would be clearer. --] (]) 13:32, 10 October 2008 (UTC)
	::This ''massive'' dispute is currently 13-3 in favor of moving in compliance with the guideline. Elonka's objections have been heard, but are not sufficient to negate the application of the guideline. If anyone has any problem with the guideline or the move specifically, you are more than welcome to contribute to the discussion at ]. <span style="color: #F06A0F">–</span><small><span style="border: 1px solid #F06A0F">]]</span></small> 15:01, 6 December 2006 (UTC)
	:::Actually, that would be 14...as nominator, my support is a given. Is it generally acceptable for the nominator to add an entry in the "voting" list? --] 15:07, 6 December 2006 (UTC)
	::::Being nominator automatically means you support. But i don't think there's any reason not to add an entry in the voting list. Most people just don't bother i guess. --] 00:17, 7 December 2006 (UTC)
	::::: The majority of people supporting the move, are the disruptive group of editors who are working their way through Misplaced Pages, ignoring valid objections. For awhile, they'd been moving pages and claiming, "See, no one's complaining." Then, once complaints started, they switched to, "Well, not many people are complaining." Then, more complaints came in, and they're now, "Too bad, we have more votes than you." This is a clear violation of ]: "''at times, a group of editors may be able to, through persistence, numbers, and organization, overwhelm well-meaning editors ... This is not a consensus.''". --] 03:19, 7 December 2006 (UTC)

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To-do list for List of The Wire episodes: edit · history · watch · refresh · Updated 2007-10-19

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Regions

Why were the Region 4 DVD details removed from this page?

"Amsterdam" NOT "Hamsterdam"

Contrary to popular belief, ep.304 is called AMSTERDAM and NOT HAMSTERDAM! Can someone change this? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Jdpeck2147 (talk • contribs) 22:16, 7 December 2007 (UTC)

Is it, really? The information is conflicting. I believe "Hamsterdam" to be the title but I could be wrong.–FunkyVoltron 11:37, 29 December 2007 (UTC)

HBO's episode guide gives the title as "Hamsterdam". That may have been changed after production since apparently the mispronunciation was made on-set and only later incorporated into the script. () --Dystopos (talk) 20:41, 4 March 2008 (UTC)

I always heard it as "hamsterdam", a bastardisation of the dutch city, with intent. --Boris Barowski (talk) 23:03, 6 March 2008 (UTC)

The argument isn't about the malapropism - it is definitely Hamsterdam within the series. We're wondering what the episode title was.--Opark 77 (talk) 08:03, 7 March 2008 (UTC)

And I'm not sure why we're wondering since it's a current HBO series and HBO maintains a fully-fleshed-out website about it which gives the titles of the episodes. Even if they did change the title after the fact, we have precedent for accepting changes like that as authoritative. --Dystopos (talk) 01:08, 8 March 2008 (UTC)

It would appear that at least one person is applying a personal preference here instead of trying to be accurate. I did apply the change from Hamsterdam to Amsterdam and this person changed it back. Maybe this person thinks it's funny, however, the HBO site that lists the episode *clearly* lists it as Amsterdam. I'm not sure what is achieved by using some alternate name, when the real name is Amsterdam, but Misplaced Pages gets enough criticism based on its ability to be edited by anyone without people directly adding to the problem by entering clearly inaccurate information.GTGeek88 (talk) 18:33, 18 January 2015 (UTC)

The episode is also known as "Hamsterdam". It was "Amsterdam" on the season 3 DVD, then changed to "Hamsterdam" for the complete series DVD set. It has appeared as both titles on the HBO website , but currently reads "Amsterdam". I changed it back because simply linking to Amsterdam is incorrect, the proper article name would be Amsterdam (The Wire), which Hamsterdam would have to be moved to. Drovethrughosts (talk) 18:54, 18 January 2015 (UTC)

The point here is accuracy. The original name was Amsterdam and HBO currently lists it as Amsterdam. As for your reference to the hitfix site, are we supposed to take that as some sort of Gospel? I'd say that the HBO site is the accurate source, not a pop media web site. It sounds like you just want to force your opinion in this topic instead of trying to keep it accurate.GTGeek88 (talk) 19:52, 18 January 2015 (UTC)

Structure

I think we need to change the way we structure individual episode articles in order to better conform to the standards set by WP:TV. When I started these articles I basically only wrote guest stars and plot sections. Now I think each article should aim to include a production, plot and reception section (along with references and external links). I think plot should contain the plot summary (which should be around 10 words per minute of screen time), first appearances and deceased sections as these are all in universe. Production should contains information on the cast, crew and credits, the epigraph, the title reference, locations, music and links to other works. Reception should include viewing figures, reviews and any awards or nominations received. What do people think? If there are no objections I will begin restructuring the episode articles to meet this format soon.--Opark 77 (talk) 17:58, 7 January 2008 (UTC)

Merge proposal

There's a merge notice on the current article, also one pointing here on Hamsterdam (The Wire episode) and I guess the others too.

I'd oppose the merge. The article is plenty long enough as is. Andrewa (talk) 03:30, 15 March 2008 (UTC)

There is clear precedent for keeping individual episode pages for notable series. gren グレン 10:40, 15 March 2008 (UTC)

I too would oppose the merge - the article would be massive - likely so large that we would be motivated to split it into separate articles. Quadparty (talk) 11:14, 15 March 2008 (UTC)

Seeing as the proposal has been up for a few months, we're working to improve the articles and the consensus is against merging shall we begin removing these tags?--Opark 77 (talk) 12:48, 15 March 2008 (UTC)

Is there a justification for this merge proposal somewhere? Where? Andrewa (talk) 03:41, 16 March 2008 (UTC)

Just up here.--Opark 77 (talk) 09:38, 16 March 2008 (UTC)

Hmmm, OK. Then I'm inclined to think the tags should be removed. As you say, there seems no prospect of consensus to merge. Andrewa (talk) 05:40, 17 March 2008 (UTC)

Oppose merge. The Wire is notable and these episode summaries are long enough that merging them would be unfriendly to users. Sevenstones (talk) 18:39, 10 September 2008 (UTC)

I know I am pretty much alone here, but support merger into new season articles (because a merger into the List of episodes is unlikely to gain consensus). I've had a look at the episode articles of the first season, and apart from the first two eps, they consist of unsourced trivia (everyone can make up trivia), cast lists (every TV episode has a cast) and sourced plot (every TV episode has a plot); no production or reception section to make the article not violate WP:NOT#PLOT and establish WP:NOTABILITY => why do these episode articles need to exist? Is someone seriously working in the articles, as claimed above? – sgeureka 08:46, 10 October 2008 (UTC)

Without forming an opinion on the proposal yet, I'd support stripping the episode articles of unencylopedic trivia and detailed plot descriptions. Maybe then the picture would be clearer. --Dystopos (talk) 13:32, 10 October 2008 (UTC)

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