Revision as of 20:10, 17 February 2021

This article has not yet been rated on Misplaced Pages's content assessment scale. It is of interest to the following WikiProjects:

Please add the quality rating to the {{WikiProject banner shell}} template instead of this project banner. See WP:PIQA for details. Former countries This article is within the scope of WikiProject Former countries, a collaborative effort to improve Misplaced Pages's coverage of defunct states and territories (and their subdivisions). If you would like to participate, please join the project.Former countriesWikipedia:WikiProject Former countriesTemplate:WikiProject Former countriesformer country Please add the quality rating to the {{WikiProject banner shell}} template instead of this project banner. See WP:PIQA for details. Classical Greece and Rome Low‑importance This article is within the scope of WikiProject Classical Greece and Rome, a group of contributors interested in Misplaced Pages's articles on classics. If you would like to join the WikiProject or learn how to contribute, please see our project page. If you need assistance from a classicist, please see our talk page.Classical Greece and RomeWikipedia:WikiProject Classical Greece and RomeTemplate:WikiProject Classical Greece and RomeClassical Greece and Rome Low This article has been rated as Low-importance on the project's importance scale. Please add the quality rating to the {{WikiProject banner shell}} template instead of this project banner. See WP:PIQA for details. Iran Low‑importance This article is within the scope of WikiProject Iran, an attempt to build a comprehensive and detailed guide to articles related to Iran on Misplaced Pages. If you would like to participate, please join the project where you can contribute to the discussions and help with our open tasks.IranWikipedia:WikiProject IranTemplate:WikiProject IranIran Low This article has been rated as Low-importance on the project's importance scale. Please add the quality rating to the {{WikiProject banner shell}} template instead of this project banner. See WP:PIQA for details. Ancient Near East Low‑importance This article is within the scope of WikiProject Ancient Near East, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of ancient Near East–related articles on Misplaced Pages. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.Ancient Near EastWikipedia:WikiProject Ancient Near EastTemplate:WikiProject Ancient Near EastAncient Near East Low This article has been rated as Low-importance on the project's importance scale. Please add the quality rating to the {{WikiProject banner shell}} template instead of this project banner. See WP:PIQA for details. Turkey Low‑importance This article is within the scope of WikiProject Turkey, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of Turkey and related topics on Misplaced Pages. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.TurkeyWikipedia:WikiProject TurkeyTemplate:WikiProject TurkeyTurkey Low This article has been rated as Low-importance on the project's importance scale. Please add the quality rating to the {{WikiProject banner shell}} template instead of this project banner. See WP:PIQA for details. Armenia Commagene is within the scope of WikiProject Armenia, an attempt to improve and better organize information in articles related or pertaining to Armenia and Armenians. If you would like to contribute or collaborate, you could edit the article attached to this page or visit the project page for further information.ArmeniaWikipedia:WikiProject ArmeniaTemplate:WikiProject ArmeniaArmenian ??? This article has not yet received a rating on the project's importance scale.

Comments

Photo

The eagle on the pillar is NOT a part of the grave sanctuary of Antiochos on Mount Nemrud; it is situated in Karakus. So either change the photo, or change the accompanying text... The are some errors in the text on the Nemrud monument as well, I might correct them if I can find the time.

Move

The following discussion is of a move from Kommagene

Support: English usage is clear and almost invariable. (Nominator vote) Septentrionalis 18:04, 20 September 2005 (UTC)

• Support — the spelling with C is in general use and standard; a spelling in K is used with the mistaken idea that it is more 'authentic'. Gareth Hughes 23:03, 22 September 2005 (UTC)
• Support — Commagene is also even the Latin name. Also, no reason not to keep this as a redirect. Satyadasa 09:28, 24 September 2005 (UTC)
  • I expect to keep the redirect, which would be automagically created by the move; getting rid of it would be a separate process at WP:RfD, and I'm not going to make that nomination. Septentrionalis 16:45, 24 September 2005 (UTC)

Edit

Most of the stuff in this article was a mess/unverifiable so I cleaned up and removed irrelevan content.Hetoum I 05:21, 3 September 2007 (UTC)

Merge

Why not to merge this small article into the larger article of Kingdom of Commagene (or vice versa)? Ellipi (talk) 11:08, 8 March 2009 (UTC)

So-called Armenian origin

although the origin of Kingdom was not clear but it is believed to Greek or Persian.193.140.194.102 (talk) 21:46, 26 March 2011 (UTC)

Bring some sources. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 46.70.55.213 (talk) 12:49, 27 March 2011 (UTC)

You wrote some history books but you didn't understand and did not ask "is it true?" or "what is historical chronology". Did you see Commagene ancient ruins or Mt. Nemrut - Kahta or any statue of Commagene? I can say a lot of about Commagene because I'm a tourist guide in Turkey. 1- Kahta Mt. Nemrut's up side, that is a masonry stone tomb (tumulus) build in BC 80-60, you can see god-goddess statues in east terrace. That statue's back side have a inscription with two language: Parsian and Greek... Not letter or word in Commagene statue with Armenian, alphabet or word.. 2- BC 160-60 period, a lot of Armenian family make small feudal lord in west & south Caucasia. A lot of lord's name Mithridates, Tigran, Orontes / Oronthes, Vagran, Pharnes, etc... Those are not Armenian names. Many of the names of Armenian origin comes from Part languages. So, if the kings name Mithridates (in Parthian mean "light, sun" like Armenian) you cant say Armenia or Parthia. You must check control "what is the royality and citizens language?" Part Pontos Kingdom (BC 201-60 free, BC 60 AD 60 Roman Vassal) royal writing language is Greek, citizens use a lot of (may be 12-13 different) language. 3- If Mithridates mean is same in Parthia and Armenia, you must check control linguistic rules. In Akhemenid - Persian period, BC550, Armenian vassal kingdom build in this period (look http://en.wikipedia.org/Achaemenid_Empire). Word ethymological time, come before Urartu Kingdom period BC 858, King Arame. This kingdoms origin is Assyrian kingdoms - period (http://en.wikipedia.org/Urartu). So Mithridates is not a Armenian word. Anatolia heritage (talk) 12:17, 5 February 2014 (UTC)

Very misleading map and too many links to Armenia

Surely this article is about the "Kingdom of Commagene", not Armenia. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 82.18.202.82 (talk) 13:13, 7 March 2012 (UTC)

Article hijacked by Armeno-centrists! — Preceding unsigned comment added by 94.209.78.54 (talk) 19:25, 1 July 2012 (UTC)

I used to believe that its ruling elite had Iranian roots but today I saw myself that at least one serious source (Cambridge Ancient History, see respective citation) insists on the Armenian identity.--Dipa1965 (talk) 21:05, 15 July 2013 (UTC)

Ok, I see that the anonymous nationalist ip does not care about references. Perhaps some kind of semi-protection is needed due to this constant edit warring.--Dipa1965 (talk) 14:20, 16 July 2013 (UTC)

Article protected

This article has been protected from editing for three days to try to generate talk page discussion of the disputed content. Please follow the WP:BRD guideline. You may also wish to consider dispute resolution (WP:DR). Mark Arsten (talk) 15:17, 16 July 2013 (UTC)

Trying to resolve the dispute on the Armenian identity of the Commagene kingdom

Following the suggestion given by the admin in the section above, and although I am very new to this article, I will try to explain what is happening now and suggest some means to stop this useless edit war:

• At least one reliable (see WP:Reliable Sources) source (The Cambridge History of Iran, The Seleucid, Parthian and Sasanian Periods, Cambridge University Press, 1983, ISBN 052120092X, see article's Notes where a link to Google Books is provided) states that the kingdom was an Armenian one
• Some anonymous ip editors revert any Armenian element in the article, including names, categories and the reliable source mentioned above. These editors so far have not brought any reliable source that supports a non-Armenian origin. These edits are speedily reverted
• There was at least one opinion (see discussion above) that the origin of Commagene identity was Iranian or Greek. This claim was not accompanied by reliable sources

Deniers of the Armenian origin of Commagene are perfectly justified to add any kind of properly referenced "non-armenian" view. Keep in mind that "properly referenced" means that, among else, these views must not be marginal ones. Additionally, since the contrasting view (i.e. the Armenian origin theory) is properly referenced, no one is justified to remove it. Two or more contrasting views can perfectly co-exist in an article. In the end, it's only a matter of sources.--Dipa1965 (talk) 21:42, 16 July 2013 (UTC)

I can find sources that talk about Commagene's Hellenistic and Persian heritage, its more remote Neo-Hittite roots, and above all its Syrian connections. I haven't found anything that says "PS: Commagene was not Armenian". Yarshater (1983), one of the sources claimed to show that Commagene was Armenian, also talks about its culture being commonly termed "Parthian" but in any case Iranian (p. 841). Yarshater goes on to talk about the Achaemenid origins of the royal family, Antiochos Theos' sanctuary to syncretic Greek-Persian deities at Nemrut Dagh, etc. Nothing particularly Armenian that I see so far. Now, Commagene was tributary to Tigranes I for about twenty years, but this wouldn't make the kingdom itself Armenian, any more than we would describe the principality of Wallachia as Turkish even though it was under Ottoman suzerainty. Q·L·1968 ☿ 22:57, 1 April 2015 (UTC)

Once again, I don't think we should read more into secondary sources than they actually say. Here's the source that's supposed to substantiate the characterization of the Commagene as an Armenian kingdom:

Now, what does this amount to? The ruling family of Commagene was partly of Armenian descent, though it also made much of its descent from the Achaemenids (and from Alexander, which Lang doesn't mention in this quote). And Commagene was formerly an Armenian satellite kingdom. Nobody disputes that, but it was only in the Armenian orbit for a few decades; at other times, it was also a Roman satellite kingdom, a Roman province, a Syro-Hittite state (Kummuh), a Persian possession, etc. Elsewhere Lang describes Commagene, along with Sophene, as "buffer states between Parthia and Armenia on the one hand, Syria and Rome on the other" (p. 510), which seems balanced and apt. Lang also juxtaposes the ruling family's "strong dynastic links with the Armenian Orontid house" with the kingdom's character as "great centres of Hellenistic and then of Roman art and civilization" (p. 510). Seeing Commagene from a primarily Armenian prism seems really misleading to me. Q·L·1968 ☿ 17:43, 17 July 2015 (UTC)

1. Cambridge Histories Online http://universitypublishingonline.org/cambridge/histories/ The Cambridge History of Iran Edited by E. Yarshater Book DOI: http://dx.doi.org/10.1017/CHOL9780521200929 Online ISBN: 9781139054942 Hardback ISBN: 9780521200929 Chapter 12 - IRAN, ARMENIA AND GEORGIA pp. 505-536 Chapter DOI: http://dx.doi.org/10.1017/CHOL9780521200929.016 Cambridge University Press By: David M. Lang Chapter DOI: http://dx.doi.org/10.1017/CHOL9780521200929.016 The Cambridge History of Iran Volume 3: The Seleucid, Parthian and Sasanid Periods, Part 1 Edited by: E. Yarshater Publisher: Cambridge University Press Online Publication Date: March 2008 Print Publication Year: 1983

Having heard no objection, I've incorporated the above information into the article, along with additional gleanings from Commagene by Blömer and Winter, while cutting some of the more unbalanced items that so many editors have objected to down the years. Q·L·1968 ☿ 20:50, 25 July 2015 (UTC)

Commagene Kingdom is not part of Armenia Kingdom

You wrote some history books but you didn't understand and did not ask "is it true?" or "what is historical chronology". Did you see Commagene ancient ruins or Mt. Nemrut - Kahta or any statue of Commagene? I can say a lot of about Commagene because I'm a tourist guide in Turkey. 1- Kahta Mt. Nemrut's up side, that is a masonry stone tomb (tumulus) build in BC 80-60, you can see god-goddess statues in east terrace. That statue's back side have a inscription with two language: Parsian and Greek... Not letter or word in Commagene statue with Armenian, alphabet or word.. 2- BC 160-60 period, a lot of Armenian family make small feudal lord in west & south Caucasia. A lot of lord's name Mithridates, Tigran, Orontes / Oronthes, Vagran, Pharnes, etc... Those are not Armenian names. Many of the names of Armenian origin comes from Part languages. So, if the kings name Mithridates (in Parthian mean "light, sun" like Armenian) you cant say Armenia or Parthia. You must check control "what is the royality and citizens language?" Part Pontos Kingdom (BC 201-60 free, BC 60 AD 60 Roman Vassal) royal writing language is Greek, citizens use a lot of (may be 12-13 different) language. 3- If Mithridates mean is same in Parthia and Armenia, you must check control linguistic rules. In Akhemenid - Persian period, BC550, Armenian vassal kingdom build in this period (look http://en.wikipedia.org/Achaemenid_Empire). Word ethymological time, come before Urartu Kingdom period BC 858, King Arame. This kingdoms origin is Assyrian kingdoms - period (http://en.wikipedia.org/Urartu). So Mithridates is not a Armenian word. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 88.247.145.120 (talk) 12:05, 5 February 2014 (UTC)

History of Armenia template

This whole talk page is testament to how controversial it is to consider Commagene only or even primarily as part of the Armenian cultural sphere. Bear in mind, the scope of the article is the Kingdom of Commagene, i.e. second century BCE to first century CE. To be sure, Armenians settled in large numbers in this area afterwards. It's also true that the Kingdom of Armenia briefly exercised political hegemony here, and that the Commagenian royal house had dynastic links with that kingdom (which the article already states). But I can't find a shred of (reliable, independent) evidence that the Kingdom of Commagene defined itself as Armenian, or even ascribed much importance to its Armenian connections. To the contrary, Antiochos Theos clearly foregrounded the Persian and Hellenistic roots of his ancestors. The language most spoken during this period is not known for certain, but Syriac is a fair guess. Given how relatively marginal Commagene was to Armenia and vice versa, I really think this article has put undue weight on the Armenian connection. The {{History of Armenia}} template, which an anonymous user has been repeatedly reinserting, completely crowds out the right side of the article, creating unnecessary and misleading clutter, while displacing image files that are relevant to the subject matter. I'd love to find a compromise here, and I'm open to suggestions. I note that the article already displays the template {{Historical regions of Armenia}} at the bottom.

For the record (and I shouldn't have to say this), I have no axe to grind either for or against Armenia or Armenians. I'm not Armenian (or Turkish or Kurdish). On the other hand, I spent a great deal of effort during my four years in Istanbul trying to convince Turks that the Armenian genocide was both real and bad. However, this article is not about that, or about possible Armenian territorial claims in reparation for the genocide. It's about the history of a small kingdom in Antiquity that was at the crossroads of Hellenistic, Persian, Armenian, Syrian, and Roman cultures. Q·L·1968 ☿ 16:22, 2 November 2015 (UTC)

I see I've been reverted again. Now, look how nice and compact {{History of Greater Iran}} looks on the article Seleucid Empire and tell me I don't have a point. Q·L·1968 ☿ 16:38, 2 November 2015 (UTC)

Having come up with a more compact way of displaying the template that doesn't get in the way but is expandable, I've been reverted by the anonymous user with the message: "Your reason is weak, you just want to remove the Armenian history of commagene which includes historic site in modern turkey". No. That's not my reason. See above. Q·L·1968 ☿ 17:46, 2 November 2015 (UTC)

I haven't had any luck getting the anonymous contributor to engage with me on this talk page. Still, in an effort to avoid edit warring, I've asked for a third opinion. Q·L·1968 ☿ 18:28, 2 November 2015 (UTC)

Third Opinion

A third opinion has been requested. A third opinion is a reply to discussion by two editors on a talk page. Since only the registered editor and not the unregistered editor has discussed, a third opinion is not applicable. It appears that both editors are over 3RR, but, rather than reporting edit-warring, I have requested semi-protection to force the unregistered editor to discuss. Robert McClenon (talk) 18:57, 2 November 2015 (UTC)

@Robert McClenon: Okay, so it looks like semi-protection is now in force. Should I change the template back to the way I had it the last time (which I actually think would be an admirable compromise) in order to, as you say, "force the unregistered editor to discuss"? I'm checking first to be sure that this wouldn't be seen as aggressive/unhelpful. Q·L·1968 ☿ 16:22, 4 November 2015 (UTC)

There have been no edits in two days, so that putting the template back would not be edit-warring. Putting the template back, since the unregistered editor cannot revert, would force the unregistered editor to discuss. (Well, they could go to WP:ANI, but should look out for the boomerang.) Go ahead. Robert McClenon (talk) 16:27, 4 November 2015 (UTC)

Great; thank you! For the record, I've been arguing against having the template on the grounds of undue weight (and clutter); however, making it small and collapsible seems like a sensible via media. Q·L·1968 ☿ 16:35, 4 November 2015 (UTC)

More reverting

Well, I guess semi-protection must have expired, because my latest edit (with its compromise proposal) has been anonymously reverted again. This time the message is: "this article is the one you are removing the template when the link is in the menu , that is not the reason you said about cluttered". I find this message puzzling for more reasons than its grammar. I'll attempt to reply, however: Yes, it's the same {{History of Armenia}} template, but this time in a conveniently collapsible box so that by default it doesn't dominate so much of the right side of the article. Does that make sense? Readers interested in Armenian history can open it and follow whatever links they want. Other readers can still look at the rest of the material without clutter or inconvenience. I think this sort of compromise should satisfy everybody, but please let me know if you have a constructive alternative. Q·L·1968 ☿ 18:18, 11 November 2015 (UTC)

Another reversion, this time with the message "no, you are specifically targeting this page template removal for your false history agenda". Since the anonymous user evidently knows more about my motivations than I do, I won't comment beyond saying that s/he has not produced any reason why the current arrangement is in any way unsatisfactory. Q·L·1968 ☿ 19:17, 11 November 2015 (UTC)

I'm at least happy to see that the latest round of pro- and anti-Armenian mutual reversion hasn't done any excessive violence to the layout of the page, since there is now enough text (thanks to my expansion of it while the page was semi-protected) to accommodate a number of floats. Q·L·1968 ☿ 04:10, 2 May 2016 (UTC)

Cultural identity?

I'm starting to feel like we ought to have a section in the article about Commagene's cultural identity, where we can talk about its Armenian connections, Hellenistic high culture, Syrian affinities, relationship with Persia and Parthia, neo-Hittite background, etc. (with all of the qualifications, disclaimers, and nuances that the subject requires). I'm getting to think that trying to sum this up in a quick categorical phrase in the lede has helped contribute to some of the disquietude felt in various quarters on this subject. Q·L·1968 ☿ 04:37, 15 November 2015 (UTC)

'History of' templates

Do the {{History of Iran}} and {{History of Armenia}} templates really contribute much to this article? On the one hand, there is at least enough space for these now (thanks to my expanding the article somewhat), so I can't complain too much about clutter. However, in both cases, the templates themselves advertise a series of articles to which the kingdom of Commagene is at best peripheral. I think I'll substitute {{History of Greater Iran}} as being more directly relevant than {{History of Iran}}, but even this hardly seems ideal. Q·L·1968 ☿ 22:35, 27 June 2016 (UTC)

Languages?

Could anyone provide references regarding the languages in the infobox section? Thanks - LouisAragon (talk) 05:32, 11 September 2016 (UTC)

Turkey not quite the same as Asia Minor

I just wanted to justify my remark in an edit summary that "substituting 'Asia Minor' for Turkey complicates things a bit". Turkey's quite a bit bigger than classical Asia Minor: not only does Turkey include eastern Thrace, but by the terms of ancient geography, Asia Minor might not include Mesopotamia, Armenia, or Syria, whereas Commagene is precisely in the zone where ancient Syria meets ancient Armenia. We could always drop the reference to Turkey, but it does provide some basic geographic orientation. Q·L·1968 ☿ 04:45, 14 September 2016 (UTC)

Pronunciation needed

WisDom-UK (talk) 20:43, 25 March 2020 (UTC)

Constant disruption

For those random ips and fresh accounts who keep disrupting this article and still aren't convinced by the countless of sources that agree that the Kingdom of Commagene was of Greco-Iranian descent, here are the words from its most well-known ruler (Antiochus of Commagene) himself: "The Persians and the Greeks: the most fortunate roots of my ancestry" Nomos 2.24-34. I can't find a text of the whole inscription unfortunately, I just found this bit here; The Iranian Expanse: Transforming Royal Identity through Architecture, Landscape, and the Built Environment, 550 BCE–642 CE, page 95. --HistoryofIran (talk) 21:44, 3 July 2020 (UTC)

@HistoryofIran: This site has a full translation of the inscription you mentioned, as well as reproductions and photos. Q·L·1968 ☿ 00:49, 8 July 2020 (UTC)

Numerous sources citing Armenian presence/influence deleted. Why?

Why are numerous quality sources that support an Armenian presence/influence deleted from this article?Preservedmoose (talk) 18:26, 17 February 2021 (UTC)

Because (as I said in the edit summary) it violates WP:RS and WP:UNDUE. --HistoryofIran (talk) 18:27, 17 February 2021 (UTC)

How so? Explain how these are unreliable sources? How are there questions of perspectives? Your name is History of Iran...perhaps I should accuse you of violating these protocols, considering you go through numerous pages on Misplaced Pages and selectively add/control what information fits your prerogative. Yes--a journalist from Daily Sabah is supporting a nationalist Armenian perspective. None of the sources that I provided are from Armenians. One is Turkish,one is from the UK government. One is from the EU. You are not the king of Misplaced Pages.Preservedmoose (talk) 18:39, 17 February 2021 (UTC)

Since you seem to have plenty of time on your hands to cast WP:ASPERSIONS towards me, I suggest you click the guidelines and read them yourself. --HistoryofIran (talk) 18:43, 17 February 2021 (UTC)

Not sure what "aspersion" I cast, but okay...you have plenty of time to sit in front of your computer and edit any mention of Armenians. Explain how a) these are unreliable sources and b) these push a perspective. I would appreciate an explanation so I don't offend you again, this is what is far more important and what I asked of you initially, but you ignored.Preservedmoose (talk) 18:47, 17 February 2021 (UTC)

• "Your name is History of Iran...perhaps I should accuse you of violating these protocols, considering you go through numerous pages on Misplaced Pages and selectively add/control what information fits your prerogative."'
• "You are not the king of Misplaced Pages."

What do you call this then? This is certainly not helping your case, I am being completely friendly to you. Sorry, but I'm not forced to teach you about the guidelines, especially with this behaviour. You've been here for +10 years - you should arguably know these by know (WP:COMPETENCE). --HistoryofIran (talk) 18:54, 17 February 2021 (UTC)

You're accusing me of pushing an agenda. Your name is HistoryOfIran, your main interest is ancient Iranian history, and you edit articles to minimize certain other cultures at the expense of a Pro-Iranian narrative (such as this one). Additionally, you have a) accused me of removing reliable sources without explanation, when you yourself have done this with the sources that I provided and b) you are gatekeeping what sources are reliable and what are not, but not explaining WHAT your rational is, despite repeated requests for explanation. I don't know how else to view this besides a perception that the rules do not apply to you. I'll ask you again, how are a) my sources unreliable (one is a British government site!) and b) how do they (from neutral third parties) support an agenda? I'm looking forward to your explanation.Preservedmoose (talk) 19:09, 17 February 2021 (UTC)

I've not accused you of anything - if so where's the proof? My name and interests are of no matter to you, and if you attack me once more, I will report you. --HistoryofIran (talk) 19:17, 17 February 2021 (UTC)

Well, no, they are. You're accusing me of pushing an agenda. I'm using that as an example of you being selective and loose with your criticisms--as I can make an argument that you're doing precisely what you are accusing me of doing. And again, I ask you, how are my sources unreliable or indicative of pushing an agenda (which is the actual topic of this disagreement)? Can you please explain how they are unreliable or bad sources? If not, I'll add them back into the article and we can both go on our merry ways and any reversion you do will be grounds for an investigation/report. Thanks!Preservedmoose (talk) 19:52, 17 February 2021 (UTC)

Ok. So you have no proof (i.e. a diff) of me accusing you of pushing an agenda, and are still going on about me. And now you are threatening to continue edit warring because of the fact that I don't want to help a person who is being rather hostile towards me learn the basics of Misplaced Pages? Go on - do it, it will make my WP:ANI report easier. This discussion is over. --HistoryofIran (talk) 19:57, 17 February 2021 (UTC)

You initially accused me, with no explanation, of pushing an agenda for providing reliable, non-Armenian sources that suggest an Armenian presence/influence in Commagene. You're repeatedly pushing a pro-Iranian narrative here and on other articles (for example, the Orontid dynasty) at the expense of sources mentioning Armenians and other groups and then you repeatedly accuse and threaten people who add these sources. Again, I ask, how are the sources that I provided on this page problematic? If you are unable to provide a criticism or explanation for how these articles are problematic, I'll assume there is no disagreement about their veracity and they can be added again.Preservedmoose (talk) 20:10, 17 February 2021 (UTC)

• All unassessed articles
• Start-Class former country articles
• WikiProject Former countries articles
• Start-Class Classical Greece and Rome articles
• Low-importance Classical Greece and Rome articles
• All WikiProject Classical Greece and Rome pages
• Start-Class Iran articles
• Low-importance Iran articles
• WikiProject Iran articles
• Start-Class Ancient Near East articles
• Low-importance Ancient Near East articles
• Ancient Near East articles by assessment
• Start-Class Turkey articles
• Low-importance Turkey articles
• All WikiProject Turkey pages
• Start-Class Armenian articles
• Unknown-importance Armenian articles
• WikiProject Armenia articles