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Mother-Son

New to Misplaced Pages editing but concerned about the following in the 5th paragraph of the between adults and children section: "Research by Leslie Margolin indicates that mother-son incest does not trigger some innate biological response, but that the effects are more directly related to the symbolic meanings attributed to this act by the participants."

For such a sensitive subject, a casual reading of this seems to suggest that mother-son incest isn't psychologically damaging to the victims like other forms of adult-child incest or indeed doesn't have a victim. Especially given where that sentence is placed, just after the sentence about impact. The body of scientific evidence in this area seems to be against this implication. Indeed Margolin article starts by saying "The idea that mother-son incest is the most damaging form of incestuous behaviour has been commonplace in psychiatric and sociological literature for the last thirty years." and indeed the majority of recent studies since Margolin's seem to fall in line with this as well. Margolin's study does not even clinically asses survivors as other do but merely draws on "case material". It seems to be an article that goes against the grain almost for the sake of it and is at odds with the literature. It should not be the only reference.

I suggest either citing an article contradicting the Margolin article to counterbalance eg: or

Or, as I personally think is more appropriate we can remove the citation and sentence completely and just talk less controversially about rarity and under-reporting citing possibly:, letting the "impact" section stand to refer to mother-son incest as well. However, the underreporting bit would better fit at the top of the first paragraph, after the section on Father-son incest, so the 5th paragraph we could just leave as one sentence.

Happy to edit the main page myself but didn't want to just wade in on what must be a heavily monitered article.

OeColonus (talk) 01:20, 12 September 2018 (UTC)

References

1. https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007%2FBF01553341
2. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/12092807
3. https://www.news.com.au/lifestyle/real-life/true-stories/unspoken-abuse-mothers-who-rape-their-sons/news-story/25ad244866c90d0bceac6094e2523a7e
4. https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/0145213493900457

About 1/3 of people in the world live where insect is legal and for mother-son incest to be legal the son must be over 14 or 16. The mothers sometimes discuss their experiences on internet discussions (but not in English). I’ve read many of them and most have a positive view of it. There are a lot of pluses and minuses. In countries where incest is illegal people who have had positive experiences are often afraid to discuss it on the internet. A common case is where a divorced mother has a son who asks for sex and the mother reluctantly agrees. Then the mother starts to really enjoy it: more than she did with her husband.

David S. Lawyer 20:49, 24 September 2022 (UTC)

"Biblical references" section

Couple of things there. First, Cain was exiled, so couldn't have had relations with his mother Eve, which was already forbidden anyway since she was Adam's wife. Second, Genesis clearly states that Adam and Eve had other unnamed sons and daughters, so that's not conjecture as the section makes it seem. Misplaced Pages editors need to get their act together. 67.4.83.66 (talk) 15:41, 17 March 2021 (UTC)

Incest

Incest is only incest if it involves sexual relations. I.e. Kissing doesn’t necessarily count as incest but sexual intercourse does. Savagejulian101 (talk) 14:29, 30 May 2021 (UTC)

"Consanguinamory" listed at Redirects for discussion

An editor has identified a potential problem with the redirect Consanguinamory and has thus listed it for discussion. This discussion will occur at Misplaced Pages:Redirects for discussion/Log/2021 December 29#Consanguinamory until a consensus is reached, and readers of this page are welcome to contribute to the discussion. ★Trekker (talk) 20:12, 29 December 2021 (UTC)

The consanguinity chart is wrong

Person X's siblings, the parents of X, and the direct offspring of X all share on average 50% DNA with X, and thus they all have the same degree of consanguinity with X. The "Table of Consanguinity" displayed to illustrate the article has erred on this point, and thus many of the numbers in the chart are wrong. Compare with the CC-chart here, which is correct: .

This seems like a fundamental error, and I think that the chart should not be used without this issue being fixed. ––St.nerol (talk) 17:22, 21 April 2022 (UTC)

% of world that permits incest (dispute)

Looking over Legality of incest one sees that it’s legal in many large countries such as China, India, and Russia and in few cases it’s legal between teens as young as 12. What % of the world’s population lives in countries where incest (between close relatives such as siblings or parent-offspring) is legal? Someone on the internet calculated 50%. (Next 3 sentences added later) To check on this look at just India and China each with a population of 1.45 billion. That’s 2.9 billion people; not too far from half the world’s population (4 billion of the 8 billion total for the World). To find the figure just add up the populations of countries that allow incest per Misplaced Pages. This is certainly not almost zero which I marked as disputed. David S. Lawyer 19:41, 2 October 2022 (UTC)

I agree that saying "almost universally forbidden" might be a somewhat extreme way to put it, but before marking the claim as disputed I think it'd be better to provide references backing up your stance, and "someone on the internet" most definitely doesn't count as a reliable source. I also don't think academic consensus leans towards more lenient views on incest and, besides, the whole paragraph can be seen as ambiguous, as it mentions several contexts in which incest between close relatives might be seen in completely different ways. In the meantime, I'll revert the edit as another reference saw itself unintentionally modified. --NicoSkater97 (talk) 22:28, 11 October 2022 (UTC)

List of 38 countries that allow adult incest: Argentina, Armenia, Azerbaijan, Belarus, Belgium, Brazil, People's Republic of China, Estonia, France,(1810) Georgia, India, Israel, Italy ( if no scandal is caused) Ivory Coast, Japan, Kazakhstan, Kirghiz Republic, North Korea, South Korea, Latvia, Lithuania, Luxembourg, Malta, Monaco, Montenegro, Netherlands ,New Jersey (US) Pakistan, Portugal, Rhode Island ((US), Russia, Serbia, Slovenia, Spain, Tajikistan, Thailand,Turkey,Turkmenistan Ukraine,Uzbekistan David S. Lawyer 08:03, 15 October 2022 (UTC)

New article proposal: Incest debate

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