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Revision as of 18:13, 8 September 2023

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Volcan and Conception

Hi Rama, Acad Ronin, I got this picture a while ago and seperately a cropped detail of it. The institution got horribly mixed up on the title, they differ for both images. I believe this is The Pinco Conception in Battle with Xebec Le Volcan, 1804. The Volcan is flying a British flag, RN? Its not inconceivable that the names are mixed up against type here. I can't find the caption, its been chopped off. Any ideas? Broichmore (talk) 09:53, 27 July 2023 (UTC)

Not quite clear what is in the canton of the flag of the xebec, but it certainly could be the Red Ensign.

In 1804 the Republic of Italy was an ally of France, so either Volcan was the literal name of the xebec but she was in the hands of an enemy of Italy, or Volcan is a translation.

Cheers! Rama (talk) 14:55, 27 July 2023 (UTC)

It's this pic, that shows the British flag? Dont know if you saw it? Broichmore (talk) 16:08, 27 July 2023 (UTC)

Ah yes, the image I saw was lower resolution, this one leaves no doubt. Definitly the British Red Ensign. Rama (talk) 17:40, 27 July 2023 (UTC)

So far, I haven't been able to find a Volcano in Lloyd's Register or Lloyd's List. Acad Ronin (talk) 23:35, 10 August 2023 (UTC)

French Naval Ship at sail

Hi Rama, Is there any value to uploading this image? Best regards. Broichmore (talk) 09:03, 9 August 2023 (UTC)

Hello,

there is always value in such images, be it for the image itself. Now, of course, I am not sure that I see any French warship on this image, but that is another question...

Cheers! Rama (talk) 10:06, 9 August 2023 (UTC)

Thanks, I'll leave it for another. If it's a type I woud load it. I don't upload fantasy stuff, knowingly as a rule. Broichmore (talk) 14:15, 10 August 2023 (UTC)

Demerliac request 10 August 2023

Hi Rama, could you please see if Demerliac has anything on the following two privateers: 1}Jeune Adele in the article Pitt (1799 ship); 2) Legere, in the article Sultana (1787 ship)?. Thanks, Acad Ronin (talk) 23:33, 10 August 2023 (UTC)

Hello,

• Jeune Adèle (no 2745, p.321): privateer schooner commissioned in Guadeloupe circa June 1806, with cruises in June, October November of that year under a Captain Le Prieur with 61 men and 14 6-pounders.
• Légère: not quite certain but she might be no 2590 p.286: privateer from an unknown home port, operating in the Mediterranean from April 1799, captured by HMS Flora on 28 April 1799.

Cheers! Rama (talk) 07:53, 13 August 2023 (UTC)

Thanks. Both useful, particularly Jeune Adele. It is unusual that we have useful info from the Caribbean. I have added the info to the two articles. Regards, Acad Ronin (talk) 11:01, 13 August 2023 (UTC)

I was impressed to see how much you managed to gather about Légère, you have much more than Demerliac! Rama (talk) 12:28, 13 August 2023 (UTC)

Thanks. I have to credit Google, and particularity Google books. Regard, Acad Ronin (talk) 22:22, 14 August 2023 (UTC)

Demerliac request 14 August 2023

Hi Rama, in 1798, A French privateer named Zeliee, or Zele, captured Betsey (1790 ship), and I am hoping that Demerliac has something on the privateer. Thanks, Acad Ronin (talk) 22:24, 14 August 2023 (UTC)

In 1806, the privateer Guadaloupienne captured Ariadne. Does Demerliac have anything on Guadaloupienne?. Thanks, Acad Ronin (talk) 17:02, 16 August 2023 (UTC)

Hello,

• Zélé (no 2293, p.263), a privateer from Nantes commissioned in December 1798. Cruise from December 1798 under René-Joseph Salaun until captured by HMS Melpomene on 28 February 1799.
• Gouadeloupéenne: I have no ship of that name or close that matches the date, sorry.

Cheers! Rama (talk) 17:01, 19 August 2023 (UTC)

Thanks. A 50% hit rate is not bad for what we are doing. By the way, how would you translate the phrase, "La Zele amarina La Charlotte"? I found a small reference to Zele in Nicolierre-Teijero's book on the Nantes corsairs, but am not sure how to translate that. Regards, Acad Ronin (talk) 17:48, 19 August 2023 (UTC)

"Zélé took possession of Charlotte". A rather special sense for "amariner" that few native speakers would know, assuming they would know that verb at all. Cheers! Rama (talk) 18:29, 19 August 2023 (UTC)

Thanks. Thought so. Interestingly, neither Google translate nor Bing had any clue. So clearly, a very unusual use. Nicolierre-Teijero's book was published in 1896, and was specialized, so unsurprising that he used it. Cheers, Acad Ronin (talk) 19:47, 19 August 2023 (UTC)

Proposed deletion of 203mm/55 Modèle 1931 gun

The article 203mm/55 Modèle 1931 gun has been proposed for deletion because of the following concern:

This weapon did not exist, Conway's 1922-1946 and French Cruisers 1922-1956 all state Algerie only had the modele 1924. The only "modele 1931" is the turret mounting used on Algerie which is already mentioned in the modele 1924 article. And from going through a few books on the French cruisers, Naval Weapons of World War Two seems to be the only book that actually mentions its existence (Jane's Fighting Ships also mentions an improved gun, but doesn't provide any details other than "better shells and longer range", which the other 2 books (and even Naval Weapons) state is because of newly introduced shells in the late 1920s/early 1930s) and is probably the origin of this misconception

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Demerliac request 25 August 2023

Hi Rama: in 1807, the French privateer General Ferrand captured Beaver (1796 ship). In 1793, the English privateer Resolution (1793 privateer) captured two French vessels, St Jean de Lone, which may have had a letter of marque, and Vigie, which was a privateer. Also, in 1799, Resolution recaptured a vessel that the French privateer Bellona had captured. Does Demerliac have anything about these four vessels? Thanks, Acad Ronin (talk) 10:54, 25 August 2023 (UTC)

An editor has suggested that Port au Prince (1790 ship) was the former French privateer Général Dumourier. Can Demerliac shed any light on this? Thanks. Acad Ronin (talk) 23:38, 29 August 2023 (UTC)

Hello,

• Général Ferrand: no 2714, p.318: privateer commissioned in Saint-Domingue from December 1806 to April 1807
• St Jean de Lone: Nothing about her I fear
• Vigie: 2157, p. 251: a privateer schooner from an unknown home port, active in the Channel in 1799 with 71 men and 14 guns. Captured by Resolution on 25 May 1799.
• Bellona: probably named Bellone, but I do not have a compatible entry.
• Général Dumourier: I have three entries:
  • Général Dumourier: no 2337, p.266 was a privateer from Bordeaux under a Captain Bernard Dihins (or Dihinx), with 196 men and 22 6-pounders. A British squadron captured her off the Azores on 15 April 1793, and brought her to Portsmouth, where she was broken up in search of Spanish gold captured from a galleon that was tough to be hidden on board. A rather romantic story, but that rules her our as a candidate.
  • Général Dumourier or Grand Dumouriez: no 2897, p.308 a privateer commissioned at Mauritius in July 1793 under Gabriel-Vincent Burguez
  • Dumourier: no 2965, p. 314, a privateer from an unknown homeport, commissioned in 1795 with 180 men and 20 guns. She was catpured by HMS Phaeton in 1795.

Demerliac suspects that 2897 and 2965 could in fact be the same ship. Since neither 2337 nor 2965 have fates compatible with what I see in the article, it might be that 2897 was in fact not 2965 and is the ship Port au Prince; or that we are about another ship entirely that went below Demerliac's radar. I am afraid I cannot be more conclusive from these records.

Cheers! Rama (talk) 07:40, 30 August 2023 (UTC)

I was able to use the info on General Ferrand and Vigie. Unfortunately, none of Demerliac's Général Dumourier, is ours, not even no.2897. Our Général Dumourier was captured in April 1793 in the Caribbean. Still, we did have two hits. Thanks, Acad Ronin (talk) 23:49, 3 September 2023 (UTC)

Demerliac request 8 September 2023

Hi Rama, two requests, please. 1) Cambridge (1797 ship) was captured by French privateer Braave. We have info about an earlier Braave, but apparently not about this one. 2) HMS Diligent. Does Demerliac have anything on the French privateer Diligente, which became the Royal Navy vessel? Thanks, Acad Ronin (talk) 16:44, 8 September 2023 (UTC)

Hello,

I will not be able to access my library for some time, but I will come back to you as soon as I can.

Cheers! Rama (talk) 18:13, 8 September 2023 (UTC)