Misplaced Pages

Revision as of 07:14, 26 July 2024

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I hope you enjoy editing here and being a Wikipedian! Please sign your name on talk pages using four tildes (~~~~); this will automatically produce your name and the date. If you need help, please see our help pages, and if you can't find what you are looking for there, please feel free to ask me on my talk page or place {{Help me}} on this page and someone will drop by to help. Again, welcome! Qflib (talk) 18:54, 21 July 2024 (UTC)

You need to research before you edit

Some of the edits you have made on my articles are fair. I agree with many of them. I have been too liberal with the use of some sources. We can agree on that.

But you need to actually research these people before making edits. You have no awareness of who these people are and what they do. If you did any research on Cameron Mason you would find that he was a well-known YouTuber before being a well-known bike racer. If this article was from 4 years ago, the article would be more about his YouTube than his cycling. This is reflected in the new reference I used for this passage (the link to his YouTube is no longer the reference for him being a content creator).

I am happy to debate on edits. In many cases you have made valid points. This one is plainly unresearched, and unlike your other edits which I will honour, this once I will continue to revert. Theobrad (talk) 12:58, 23 July 2024 (UTC)

I don't understand why you're not being WP:NICE? Blanes tree (talk) 17:56, 23 July 2024 (UTC)

See Hounding discussion Theobrad (talk) 12:49, 24 July 2024 (UTC)

Primary source/notability tags

I just saw that you added primary source and notability tags to an article I recently expanded, on the attorney Melvin Wulf. I'm a new Wiki editor and was wondering if you could talk me through your decision to add these tags, so I can better understand what to do or not to do in the future. Thanks! Zelda Zanders (talk) 14:55, 23 July 2024 (UTC)

Certainly, I placed the tag because the page is mostly cited to sources close to or published by the subject. Please do not remove the tag until you have address this issue.Blanes tree (talk) 15:09, 23 July 2024 (UTC)

Can you point me to the sources you're referring to? I'm only aware of two: the Rutgers Oral History Archive interview conducted by Nicholas Molnar (previously cited 4 times, now only 2) and Wulf's article about Philip Agee, cited one time. Are there other sources you have concerns over? Zelda Zanders (talk) 15:22, 23 July 2024 (UTC)

It's probaly best if you ask your mentoor or ask about it at the TreeHouse Blanes tree (talk) 15:56, 23 July 2024 (UTC)

I will do that! However, since you added the tag, I'd also love to understand your thinking about it. Thanks so much! Zelda Zanders (talk) 15:59, 23 July 2024 (UTC)

Sorry, I don't understand the question. Blanes tree (talk) 16:30, 23 July 2024 (UTC)

I'm just wondering which sources prompted you to add the "primary source" tag. Zelda Zanders (talk) 16:43, 23 July 2024 (UTC)

@Zelda Zanders I can't answer for Blanes_tree's view, but the Supreme Court cases are primary sources. They can be used per WP:PRIMARYSOURCES to validate uncontroversial facts, but secondary sources are preferred. The oral history interview is both primary and non-independent and again should be used sparingly to validate uncontroversial facts about the subject. I haven't reviewed closely to see if this is the case. Either way, you have a good range of secondary sources on Wulf and I think this is a terrific article, especially for a newcomer! Dclemens1971 (talk) 03:54, 24 July 2024 (UTC)

Concern about WP:HOUNDING, other issues

Hi there, Blanes_tree. After seeing your (apparent) mistake of interpreting an editor's response in the W. David Marx AfD, I took a closer look at your edit history.

I am concerned that your edit history shows an inordinately heavy focus on @Theobrad's contributions; in addition to targeting their edits on other pages, you have either nominated for deletion or deleted extensive passages from every single article the user has created. Focusing on a single user's work this way can often be interpreted as WP:HOUNDING, which is a form of harassment. I don't think all of your edits are off-base, but I do think several of them are non-constructive, particularly in the way you describe them. For example, you remove the word "eponymous" and describe it as "Horrible disregard for Misplaced Pages's encyclopaedic tone here," which is an overreaction in tone and substance. (Eponymous is a perfectly encyclopedic word that just means something is named after someone or something else.) On Cameron Mason, you removed a reliably sourced statement with the edit summary "Misplaced Pages is not a soapbox for YouTubers to plug their channels," even though the edit you objected to did not include a link to the subject's YouTube channel and there was no evidence that Mason was adding the text himself.

I am concerned about some of your other edits, as well. On Melvin Wulf, you added a notability tag, even though the article clearly asserts notability with adequate sourcing to clear WP:GNG. (And indeed, anyone who receives a New York Times obit is generally going to be found notable.) If you're interested in learning more about how your fellow editors interpret the notability guidelines, spending time as an observer or participant in AfD discussions will give you a good sense for this.

You've only been here a few months, but you seem to have a positive desire to make sure Misplaced Pages content is not promotional. This is great! I just want to be sure you are aware of the policy on WP:HOUNDING in case you were not aware of it, and to invite you to be a little less dogmatic in how you engage with your fellow volunteers. Yes, be WP:BOLD, but also be aware this is a collaborative project, and we are all WP:HERE to build the encyclopedia together. Hope this helps. Dclemens1971 (talk) 03:46, 24 July 2024 (UTC)

After reverting problematic edits by Blanes_tree on the VFS Global article, he likewise engaged in WP:HOUNDING me as well. He wrote a comment on The Great Gatsby directing me to "rewrite" that Featured Article.

Fascinatingly, Blanes_tree claims in his recent edit on The Great Gatsby's Talk Page to be a friend of the author and his wife. F. Scott Fitzgerald (whom he misidentifies as "Frank") died in 1940, and Zelda Fitzgerald died in 1948. He would need to be nearly 100 years old for this claim to be true. Assuming WP:GOODFAITH, I shall take him at his word. I look forward to hearing his recollections of drinking with F. Scott Fitzgerald and fishing with Ernest Hemingway. — Flask (talk) 04:57, 24 July 2024 (UTC)

I agree and I accept that my behaviour on this platform has fallen below the threshold. I shouldn't be hounding Theobrad or User:Zelda Zanders. If I do it again, which I won't then you should definitely report me to whoever is in charge here.Blanes tree (talk) 12:40, 24 July 2024 (UTC)

Thank you for your apology. I don't think each individual issue was intended to be Hounding but the result of the accumulative action ended up being so. Additionally I do think your opinion-based edits on The Great Gatsby page were both completely out of ordered and just your opinions instead of a constructive discussion of ideas - especially as you cited no information or literary criticism to support your "claims". Theobrad (talk) 12:48, 24 July 2024 (UTC)

That's fair and I can't apologise enough for my behaviour. I'm still learning the ropes and finding my way around. I think I have found the appropriate message board for you to report your concerns about me to. Would you like me to share the link with you?Blanes tree (talk) 12:56, 24 July 2024 (UTC)

Thanks for this response. Glad to see a conversation was able to resolve a problem before higher levels of dispute resolution are needed. W/r/t Flask's comment, please remember to respond to users' messages on article talk pages before reverting/redoing reverted edits. I'll leave the conversation here and see you around the project. Dclemens1971 (talk) 12:58, 24 July 2024 (UTC)

I appreciate your compassion but I can't help but feel that my behaviour is really, really bad so maybe a you know what at the you know where is required here? Blanes tree (talk) 13:02, 24 July 2024 (UTC)

I don't know the procedure. However, I think this remaining on your Talk page is enough of a reminder to yourself to check yourself before making edits. And it will be helpful for other people to see this if you were to go after someone else's work again. Theobrad (talk) 15:45, 24 July 2024 (UTC)

That's very kind of you, but I do think you should escalate your concerns just in case I am tempted to edit any pages that you've started again. I'm a very impulsive person and I just can't help myself sometimes. You really should file an incident report. Blanes tree (talk) 15:55, 24 July 2024 (UTC)

Disambiguation link notification for July 24

Hi. Thank you for your recent edits. An automated process has detected that when you recently edited Charles R. Conn, you added a link pointing to the disambiguation page Fortune. Such links are usually incorrect, since a disambiguation page is merely a list of unrelated topics with similar titles. (Read the FAQ • Join us at the DPL WikiProject.)

It's OK to remove this message. Also, to stop receiving these messages, follow these opt-out instructions. Thanks, --DPL bot (talk) 20:08, 24 July 2024 (UTC)

Fixed. Thanks for the heads up.Blanes tree (talk) 20:22, 24 July 2024 (UTC)

Notice

For others seeing this user's talk page, please take note of this discussion: Talk:GongU Madang#Tags. Think this user's tone, completely unprovoked, is inappropriate. 104.232.119.107 (talk) 12:52, 25 July 2024 (UTC)

@Blanes tree, you invited an incident report above. I don't want to respond to WP:DRAMA, but your engagement with @104.232.119.107 is an example of what I warned about yesterday. Please don't WP:DRIVEBY tag pages; if you do tag, explain why proactively on the talk page and provide your reasons. This response was WP:UNCIVIL. You did not even address all the tags or respond to the editor's point about Korean sources. Then telling a fellow editor who asked for but has still not gotten an explanation for your edit that "we should both take some time out to cool off and come back to this after a reasonable amount of time has elapsed" suggests you are WP:NOTHERE to build this collaboratively. Moreover, this is the kind of unproductive/uncivil edit summary I warned about above. It's one thing to be WP:BOLD. It's another to disregard the norms of communication around here. Dclemens1971 (talk) 19:00, 25 July 2024 (UTC)

Hi, I'm really sorry about my outburst earlier. I apologized to the IP in question and removed myself from the situation so that it wouldn't escalate and I've stopped editing the page. I also offered to help @Theobrad: drag my you know what to the you know where but for some reason he didn't want to go that far... Blanes tree (talk) 20:09, 25 July 2024 (UTC)

If you want to stop this kind of engagement, you can stop now! Taking a break from a particular page doesn't mean continue the same practices on other pages with other editors. If you keep going like this, I expect there will be sanctions down the road. Good luck. Dclemens1971 (talk) 20:58, 25 July 2024 (UTC)

I support Dclemens1971's concerns about your behaviour. We welcome all new editors to Misplaced Pages, so you are welcome here; and we understand that Misplaced Pages is a steep learning curve, so mistakes will occur. However, when people reach out to you, we do expect a polite and helpful response. Your responses to concerns about your tagging have not been polite or helpful. I strongly suggest that until you more clearly understand the use of tags, that you do not tag any more articles. I would strongly suggest that you do not tag any articles for at least three months. In addition, when someone contacts you about any aspect of your editing that you respond in a polite and neutral manner, explaining your actions clearly, preferably with links to appropriate and relevant Misplaced Pages policies and guidelines. The action of doing this will prevent hard feelings and alienation, will assist the other user to understand what you are doing, and what Misplaced Pages is about, and will also allow you to reflect on your actions to see if they are compliant with consensus. All of us at times do things that we think are right, but when challenged, actually see that what we did was not in keeping with current consensus. SilkTork (talk) 07:13, 26 July 2024 (UTC)