Misplaced Pages

Revision as of 16:40, 9 November 2024

This is the talk page for discussing improvements to the Che Guevara article. This is not a forum for general discussion of the article's subject.

Put new text under old text. Click here to start a new topic. New to Misplaced Pages? Welcome! Learn to edit; get help. Assume good faith Be polite and avoid personal attacks Be welcoming to newcomers Seek dispute resolution if needed Article policies Neutral point of view No original research Verifiability

Find sources: Google (books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL

Archives: Index, 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22Auto-archiving period: 2 months

This  level-4 vital article is rated GA-class on Misplaced Pages's content assessment scale. It is of interest to multiple WikiProjects.

Biography: Military / Politics and Government / Core This article is within the scope of WikiProject Biography, a collaborative effort to create, develop and organize Misplaced Pages's articles about people. All interested editors are invited to join the project and contribute to the discussion. For instructions on how to use this banner, please refer to the documentation.BiographyWikipedia:WikiProject BiographyTemplate:WikiProject Biographybiography This article is supported by the military biography work group (assessed as Top-importance). This article is supported by the politics and government work group (assessed as Top-importance). This article is listed on the project's core biographies page. Socialism Top‑importance This article is within the scope of WikiProject Socialism, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of socialism on Misplaced Pages. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.SocialismWikipedia:WikiProject SocialismTemplate:WikiProject Socialismsocialism Top This article has been rated as Top-importance on the project's importance scale. Military history: Biography / South America / Cold War This article is within the scope of the Military history WikiProject. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the project and see a list of open tasks. To use this banner, please see the full instructions.Military historyWikipedia:WikiProject Military historyTemplate:WikiProject Military historymilitary history Associated task forces: /  Military biography task force South American military history task force Cold War task force (c. 1945 – c. 1989) Argentina Top‑importance This article is part of WikiProject Argentina, an attempt to expand, improve and standardise the content and structure of articles related to Argentine history. If you would like to participate, you can improve Che Guevara, or sign up and contribute to a wider array of articles like those on our to do list.ArgentinaWikipedia:WikiProject ArgentinaTemplate:WikiProject ArgentinaArgentine Top This article has been rated as Top-importance on the project's importance scale. Cuba Top‑importance This article is within the scope of WikiProject Cuba, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of Cuba related articles on Misplaced Pages. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.CubaWikipedia:WikiProject CubaTemplate:WikiProject CubaCuba Top This article has been rated as Top-importance on the project's importance scale. WikiProject Cuba task list: edit history watch purge Task list New article announcements: Requests: Ambrosio Cave, Calero Cave, Centella Cave, Cuba and the United Nations, Cuevas de Punta del Este, Cura Cave, Patana Cave, Pluma Cave Stubs: Dollar store (Cuba) Verify: History of Cuba, Fulgencio Batista Update: Nochebuena NPOV: Armando Valladares, Delfín Fernández, History of Cuba Copyedit: Armando Peraza, Bay of Pigs Invasion, Fabio Grobart, Julio Antonio Mella Cleanup: Abelardo Colomé Ibarra, Antonio Maceo Grajales, Bay of Pigs Invasion, History of Cuba, List of Cubans, Máximo Gómez, War against the Bandits Style: Fidel Castro Expand: Cuba–Soviet Union relations, Baseball in Cuba, Religion in Cuba, Havana's International Book Fair, Cuba–Venezuela relations, Antonio Sánchez de Bustamante y Sirven Caribbean High‑importance This article is within the scope of WikiProject Caribbean, an attempt to build a comprehensive guide to the countries of the Caribbean on Misplaced Pages. If you would like to participate, you can edit this article, or visit the project page, where you can join the project and/or contribute to the discussion. If you are new to editing Misplaced Pages visit the welcome page to become familiar with the guidelines.CaribbeanWikipedia:WikiProject CaribbeanTemplate:WikiProject CaribbeanCaribbean High This article has been rated as High-importance on the project's importance scale. Basque This article is within the scope of WikiProject Basque, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of the Basque Country, Basque people, Basque language, history and culture on Misplaced Pages. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.BasqueWikipedia:WikiProject BasqueTemplate:WikiProject BasqueBasque ??? This article has not yet received a rating on the importance scale. Politics Mid‑importance This article is within the scope of WikiProject Politics, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of politics on Misplaced Pages. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.PoliticsWikipedia:WikiProject PoliticsTemplate:WikiProject Politicspolitics Mid This article has been rated as Mid-importance on the project's importance scale. Atheism Mid‑importance This article is within the scope of WikiProject Atheism, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of atheism on Misplaced Pages. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.AtheismWikipedia:WikiProject AtheismTemplate:WikiProject AtheismAtheism Mid This article has been rated as Mid-importance on the project's importance scale. For more information and how you can help, click the link opposite: If you would like to participate, you can edit this article and visit the project page. Quick help Project's main talk page Article layout Links to atheism-related information · List of free online resources Writing about religion · Article development Citing sources · Verifying sources · About original research Assume good faith · Be civil Recent activity Core articles the "Atheism" article Articles recently added to Category:Atheism To do edit history watch purge Join WikiProject atheism and be bold. Add a userbox to your page ({{User WikiProject Atheism}} or {{User WPA2}}) and attract potential members. Help with articles. See this month's adopt-an-article. Help out with this to-do list. Be consistent Use a "standard" layout for atheism-related articles (see layout style, "The perfect article" and Featured articles). Add Atheism info box to all atheism related talk pages (use {{WikiProject Atheism}} or see info box) Ensure atheism-related articles are members of Atheism by checking whether ] has been added to atheism-related articles – and, where it hasn't, adding it. Maintenance, etc. Find sources for all positions of an article (see Citing sources and atheism references). Try to expand stubs. Ideas and theories about life, however, are prone to generating neologisms, so some stubs may be suitable for deletion (see deletion process). Watch the list of atheism-related articles and add to accordingly. Always write for an encyclopedia. Articles to improve Agnosticism Create Articles on notable atheists Expand an atheism stub Immediate attention State atheism needs a reassessment of its Importance level, as it has little to do with atheism and is instead an article about anti-theist/anti-religious actions of governments. False choice into False dilemma: discuss whether you are for or against this merge here Clarify references in Atheism using footnotes. Secular movement defines it as a being restricted to America in the 21st century. Bolivia Mid‑importance This article is within the scope of WikiProject Bolivia, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of all Bolivia-related articles on Misplaced Pages. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.BoliviaWikipedia:WikiProject BoliviaTemplate:WikiProject BoliviaBolivia Mid This article has been rated as Mid-importance on the project's importance scale. This article is featured on the Bolivia Portal selected article section. History This article is within the scope of WikiProject History, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of the subject of History on Misplaced Pages. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.HistoryWikipedia:WikiProject HistoryTemplate:WikiProject Historyhistory ??? This article has not yet received a rating on the project's importance scale.

This page is not a forum for general discussion about Che Guevara. Any such comments may be removed or refactored. Please limit discussion to improvement of this article. You may wish to ask factual questions about Che Guevara at the Reference desk.

	Che Guevara is a former featured article. Please see the links under Article milestones below for its original nomination page (for older articles, check the nomination archive) and why it was removed.
	Che Guevara has been listed as one of the Social sciences and society good articles under the good article criteria. If you can improve it further, please do so. If it no longer meets these criteria, you can reassess it.
	This article appeared on Misplaced Pages's Main Page as Today's featured article on June 18, 2006.
Article milestones Date Process Result August 3, 2004 Featured article candidate Not promoted September 3, 2004 Featured article candidate Not promoted December 16, 2005 Peer review Reviewed December 19, 2005 Good article nominee Listed March 10, 2006 Featured article candidate Promoted April 23, 2008 Featured article review Demoted August 28, 2009 Good article nominee Listed Facts from this article were featured on Misplaced Pages's Main Page in the "On this day..." column on October 8, 2004, October 8, 2005, October 8, 2006, October 7, 2009, October 7, 2010, October 8, 2011, October 8, 2013, October 8, 2017, October 8, 2019, and October 8, 2022. Current status: Former featured article, current good article

Tip: Anchors are case-sensitive in most browsers. This article links to one or more target anchors that no longer exist. ] Anchor Klaus Barbie#Che Guevara links to a specific web page: Che Guevara. The anchor (#Che Guevara) has been deleted. Please help fix the broken anchors. You can remove this template after fixing the problems. | Reporting errors

Views in Argentina

I travelled extensively in Argentina and the views on Guevara were unanimous; he is rarely mentioned there and is certainly not a source of pride. Many I met described him as a "psychopath" who enjoyed killing people. He apparently told his father that he "enjoyed the smell of cordite and blood" after he had shot someone through the head. Not sure if this is worth extra exploration. 86.153.86.158 (talk) 17:03, 7 September 2023 (UTC)

It definitely isn't, I for one know plenty of Argentinians that are in awe of Guevara. Hearsay is not worth being mentioned on Misplaced Pages. 2A02:1811:C1F:8200:3564:4278:E78B:F860 (talk) 12:45, 22 October 2023 (UTC)

Che was a psychopath who enjoyed killing people. He was also a homophobic and racist who hated black people. This is not hearsay. He publicly executed innocent Cubans by gunshot in front of many witnesses as a warning to anyone who tried to oppose their new government. Hectorgavilla (talk) 11:55, 25 December 2023 (UTC)

Striking out material from block evader. Grandpallama (talk) 00:23, 22 March 2024 (UTC)

@Grandpallama: Although I agree that the heresay is irrelevant to our article, I looked at the IP and saw no evidence of block evasion. Is there a link that shows it? If so, it would be helpful if that is mentioned on the IP's talk page in case that editor continues making edits. --David Tornheim (talk) 00:39, 22 March 2024 (UTC)

David Tornheim, the editor is unlikely to show up with this particular IP again, as it's not static. That said, it's been pointed out to me that the age of the edit is such that I'm probably causing confusion more than helping (which makes sense); I only noticed today that he'd become active again for a while last year and was clearly overzealous in wanting to scrub his unproductive contributions. I've reverted my strikethrough. Grandpallama (talk) 06:25, 22 March 2024 (UTC)

Okay. --David Tornheim (talk) 06:28, 22 March 2024 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 10 November 2023

This edit request has been answered. Set the |answered= or |ans= parameter to no to reactivate your request.

Source 100 doesn't make any sense. Quote is from the point of view of someone rescued by Che Guevara during combat, from Joel Iglesias' diary, his "teenage lieutenant". The quote starts by mentioning that Joel is getting shot at, gets rescued by Che. Che does not get shot because the guards overhear him being referred to as "Che". the part that doesn't make sense is the following: ". Later . . . they told me he made a great impression on them when they saw him run out with his pistol stuck in his belt, ignoring the danger, they didn't dare shoot.", how and why would he be communicating, so colloquially at that, to the enemy who was just shooting at him? the formatting of the quote makes me very dubious as well, considering it leads the statement with "later...", which tells us that they took out a part of the quote. Therefore, I am uncertain of the validity of this statement, it is also the only online source of the quote i could find. I would suggest to remove the quote. hope this finds you well XavierNeedsMore (talk) 20:03, 10 November 2023 (UTC)

 Not done That's what the source says. You don't have to believe it. Maproom (talk) 23:41, 10 November 2023 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 17 November 2023

This edit request has been answered. Set the |answered= or |ans= parameter to no to reactivate your request.

Physician should be removed as he was never a doctor, never practiced medicine, never graduated medical school and his diploma has never been shown 2600:1700:6822:7CA0:3931:7913:B26C:6BA0 (talk) 16:33, 17 November 2023 (UTC)

 Not done for now: please establish a consensus for this alteration before using the {{Edit semi-protected}} template. I don't have access to the specific sources that we've cited but per our article it looks like he did complete his degree and practiced briefly in Mexico. Looking through the talk page archives this has been discussed sporadically in the past, and it looks like the consensus have generally been that he was a physician. However, per MOS:FIRSTBIO the first sentence should only contain occupations/activities a BLP subject is notable for and completing a medical degree and briefly practicing medicine IMO is certainly not what Guevara is mainly known for and IMO it should not be in the lead sentence. Cannolis (talk) 17:54, 17 November 2023 (UTC)

Che was a mass murderer

Please add that Che Guevara was a mass murderer in the first sentence of this article. He should be put in the same category as Hitler. the sentence should read as follows:

was an Argentine Marxist Mass Murderer, physician, author, guerrilla leader, diplomat, and military theorist. Hectorgavilla (talk) 04:00, 19 December 2023 (UTC)

When was he convicted of being a mass murderer? HiLo48 (talk) 05:39, 19 December 2023 (UTC)

in Cuba he lined up innocent people against a wall “pared” and executed them without a trial for the public to witness. My Cuban family witnessed these executions and knew people who disappeared. He forced at gunpoint the removal of families from their homes. The only way to enforce socialism is to take away everything the people own by execution and physical violence. No one will willingly give the government their possessions. What I stated are facts. Hectorgavilla (talk) 11:51, 25 December 2023 (UTC)

Then it shouldn't be hard for you to provide some reliable sources here. Facts aren't hard to find in reliable sources. StephenMacky1 (talk) 12:48, 25 December 2023 (UTC)

Lots of sources exist, but they're very easy for you to ignore. 73.100.184.209 (talk) 01:23, 5 June 2024 (UTC)

If you have sources, WP:PROVEIT. Flounder fillet (talk) 00:46, 9 June 2024 (UTC)

Semantic Error

Cite error: There are <ref> tags on this page without content in them (see the help page).

This edit request has been answered. Set the |answered= or |ans= parameter to no to reactivate your request.

Please change "Cause of death Execution by shooting" to "Cause of death Elimination by shooting"

Che Guevara's capture and immediate execution without a legal trial would be more accurately described as an extrajudicial killing which is considered a form of murder. This differs from a lawful execution which typically involves a formal trial. Thirdfemalelead (talk) 05:31, 26 January 2024 (UTC)

 Done I replaced it with extrajudicial killing (per what's covered in the article's body). M.Bitton (talk) 15:17, 26 January 2024 (UTC)

Can you also take care of the "Battles/wars" section, where he was labeled to be executed after a conviction. LackOfInspiration1 (talk) 10:21, 17 April 2024 (UTC)

Interview with Tucker Carlson - Ex-CIA Agent Felix Rodriguez on Che Guevara death

Ex-CIA Agent on Capturing Che Guevara, Who Truly Killed JFK, and Election Predictions

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bwohQJrJeo8&ab_channel=TuckerCarlson

Che Guevara was executed in 1967 in a remote Bolivian village. One of the last people to speak to him alive was CIA officer Felix Rodriguez (former CIA agent). Here’s his story.

Felix Rodriguez worked for the CIA until 1976.

Ironcurtain2 (talk) 16:38, 7 May 2024 (UTC)

That's not a reliable source. Simonm223 (talk) 16:57, 7 May 2024 (UTC)

It is his own testimony!!! Ironcurtain2 (talk) 16:58, 7 May 2024 (UTC)

That's not how WP:ABOUTSELF works. Simonm223 (talk) 16:59, 7 May 2024 (UTC)

Edit conflict, "please provide the acronym that supports your logic". LOL. Ironcurtain2 (talk) 17:01, 7 May 2024 (UTC)

Specifically see points 1 and 2:

1. The material is neither unduly self-serving nor an exceptional claim 2. It does not involve claims about third parties; Simonm223 (talk) 17:01, 7 May 2024 (UTC)

Wow, you know how to make pretty colored text. I am impressed. LOL. Thanks for making my day, User:Simonm223 LOL. Ironcurtain2 (talk) 17:02, 7 May 2024 (UTC)

South Park

Officer Barbrady - There's nothing to see here.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LW6RWSiR88s&ab_channel=MiamiBadBoyBOSS

Ironcurtain2 (talk) 18:37, 7 May 2024 (UTC)

Lies & propaganda surrounding Che.

https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/che-guevara-executing-women/

Example number 1: The link listed above where the accusation of him “Killing 2 woman” came out including him being accused of being a mass murderer (which is false, the people executed weren't innocent and were those working with Batista, war criminals etc.

Example number 2: The accusation that he was responsible for the UMAP camps/Imprisonment of homosexuals. in 1965 Che resigned his position as minister of industries and went to the Congo which means he wasn't in Cuba during the operations of the camps and nor was he involved. Sproogli (talk) 16:40, 9 November 2024 (UTC)

• GA-Class level-4 vital articles
• Misplaced Pages level-4 vital articles in People
• GA-Class vital articles in People
• GA-Class biography articles
• GA-Class biography (military) articles
• Top-importance biography (military) articles
• Military biography work group articles
• GA-Class biography (politics and government) articles
• Top-importance biography (politics and government) articles
• Politics and government work group articles
• GA-Class biography (core) articles
• Core biography articles
• Top-importance biography articles
• WikiProject Biography articles
• GA-Class socialism articles
• Top-importance socialism articles
• WikiProject Socialism articles
• GA-Class military history articles
• GA-Class South American military history articles
• South American military history task force articles
• GA-Class Cold War articles
• Cold War task force articles
• GA-Class Argentine articles
• Top-importance Argentine articles
• WikiProject Argentina articles
• GA-Class Cuba articles
• Top-importance Cuba articles
• WikiProject Cuba articles
• GA-Class Caribbean articles
• High-importance Caribbean articles
• WikiProject Caribbean articles
• GA-Class Basque articles
• Unknown-importance Basque articles
• All WikiProject Basque pages
• GA-Class politics articles
• Mid-importance politics articles
• WikiProject Politics articles
• GA-Class Atheism articles
• Mid-importance Atheism articles
• GA-Class Bolivia articles
• Mid-importance Bolivia articles
• Selected articles on the Bolivia Portal
• GA-Class history articles
• Unknown-importance history articles
• WikiProject History articles
• Misplaced Pages former featured articles
• Misplaced Pages good articles
• Social sciences and society good articles
• Featured articles that have appeared on the main page
• Featured articles that have appeared on the main page once
• Old requests for peer review