Talk:Kindai Eiga Kyōkai: Difference between revisions

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Revision as of 12:49, 24 December 2012 editHijiri88 (talk \| contribs)Autopatrolled, Extended confirmed users37,389 edits →Requested move ← Previous edit		Revision as of 12:58, 24 December 2012 edit undoHijiri88 (talk \| contribs)Autopatrolled, Extended confirmed users37,389 edits →Requested move: Small tweak and further question.Next edit →
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	:::You're being disingenuous. It's obvious to a complete fool that the website is a total hack job, and it's also utterly obvious that ], and it's obvious that the preferred spelling is "Kyokai" without a macron. ] (]) 01:17, 23 December 2012 (UTC)		:::You're being disingenuous. It's obvious to a complete fool that the website is a total hack job, and it's also utterly obvious that ], and it's obvious that the preferred spelling is "Kyokai" without a macron. ] (]) 01:17, 23 December 2012 (UTC)
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	*'''Oppose''' and '''speedy close''' of the above as based on extremely dubious evidence and a clear case of ]. See also the edit history of ], ], ] and ], the talk page of ] and ] for very clear evidence that the above editor is ]. and will be taking further appropriate steps if this user continues to hound me. ] (]) 02:47, 23 December 2012 (UTC)		*'''Oppose''' and '''speedy close''' of the above as based on extremely dubious evidence and a clear case of ]. See also the edit history of ], ], ] and ], the talk page of ] and ] for very clear evidence that the above editor is ]. and will be taking further appropriate steps if this user continues to hound me. ] (]) 02:47, 23 December 2012 (UTC)
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	] (]) 12:49, 24 December 2012 (UTC)		] (]) 12:49, 24 December 2012 (UTC)

			Also, since the current title's rationale was given by you in an edit summary as based on DVD covers, could you please link to some scanned image of such a DVD cover? Both my DVDs of ''Onibaba'' and ''Yabu no Naka no Kuroneko'' were in Eureka's ''Masters of Cinema Collection'' (the most widely distributed editions of both in the UK and Ireland), which is entirely separate from the Kyōkai, and when I moved to Japan I put both discs in plastic holders anyway. ] (]) 12:58, 24 December 2012 (UTC)

Revision as of 12:58, 24 December 2012

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Work to be done

A lot more work needs to be done on the list of productions, using perhaps the Japanese wikipedia or JMDB website. Also there should be more about the company's history. Thanks for any contributions. JoshuSasori (talk) 01:23, 4 March 2012 (UTC)

I added the book they published on their thirty-year anniversary. I don't have it myself, but it would be a valuable resource on the company's history. Michitaro (talk) 02:33, 4 March 2012 (UTC)

Thanks very much, for this and your other help.JoshuSasori (talk) 00:43, 6 March 2012 (UTC)

Name with/without macron

I originally put the name with a macron due to the wikipedia convention, and because the company's website does not give a romanized form (except in a "mailto:" link). However, today I was looking at rental DVDs and noticed that all of Kaneto Shindo's DVDs say "Kindai Eiga Kyokai" with no macron (or the wapuro kyoukai found on the "mailto:" link at the company's website). This seems to be the official romanization of the name. If anyone disputes this, please mention it here and I will post some visual evidence. JoshuSasori (talk) 00:43, 6 March 2012 (UTC)

logo with sword and shield

On the old KEK videos, there is a logo of a sword-wielding woman with pointed breasts and a round shield. Does anyone know the story of this? JoshuSasori (talk) 14:11, 31 August 2012 (UTC)

Requested move

The request to rename this article to Kindai Eiga Kyōkai has been carried out.

If the page title has consensus, be sure to close this discussion using {{subst:RM top|'''page moved'''.}} and {{subst:RM bottom}} and remove the {{Requested move/dated|…}} tag, or replace it with the {{subst:Requested move/end|…}} tag.

Kindai Eiga Kyokai → Kindai Eiga Kyōkai – Article was originally created under the macron-spelling, but was moved shortly afterward under the rationale that DVD covers apparently give a non-macronned spelling. However, the company's official website states "Copyright © 2001-2012 KINDAI EIGA KYOUKAI All rights Reserved" spells their name with a u. Both of these spellings are apparently official, and are based on the Hepburn romanization system. Misplaced Pages policy is that when there is a lack of consistency in official sources, we should use the macronned spelling, which is the standard Hepburn spelling. elvenscout742 (talk) 16:29, 22 December 2012 (UTC)

Extended content
The Kindai Eiga Kyokai website is "interesting" to say the least. For example, the last surviving original founder of the company died this year, after his 100th birthday, but they don't even mention that. As the person who created this article, I was quite disappointed that I couldn't find much other information there about the films or the company. I'm not sure this is a good source of information to use in this "requested move". So the request for moving is based on a rather bogus premise. The DVDs all use "Kindai Eiga Kyokai", and all the film titles use it too: youtube link. But anyway, leaving the renaming topic aside, I am absolutely delighted to find that another editor is interested in the topic of "Kindai Eiga Kyou/Kyo/Kyō-kai". I'm a big fan of Kaneto Shindo and I am looking forward to seeing this editor's contributions on this topic. Together we can make the article great. Even better, the same editor shares my interest in 1970s/80s Japanese actresses, a type of citrus fruit which is so far only grown in Japan, a film starring one of my favourite actresses, Meiko Kaji, and musicians, Ryudo Uzaki, which seems to never have been released outside Japan. I feel like I have found a true friend here on Misplaced Pages, and it touches my heart deeply. I would like to discuss all the great "Kindai Eiga Kyou/Kyo/Kyō-kai" and Meiko Kaji films together and maybe even rent some DVDs and watch them with him/her, maybe we can go to a Ryudo (or should I say Ryuudoh/Ryūdō to be on the safe side?) concert together. Having so many things in common is sure to be the beginning of a beautiful friendship. JoshuSasori (talk) 00:56, 23 December 2012 (UTC) I'm not interested in making friends through Misplaced Pages, but that is beside the point. I like what Shindo films I have seen, particularly Kuroneko (which by the way I think is a ridiculous English title -- why would you just give a shorter version of the Japanese title without any kind of translation??). But I'm also an adherent to auteur theory, so I'm honestly not interested in working on articles related to film companies. However, Misplaced Pages policy on this matter is clear. The default is standard Hepburn, macrons and all; to go against that, outstanding evidence that the subject of the article itself prefers one particular spelling. This is why all articles on pre-modern subjects and most articles on modern non-sentient entities are required to use macrons. The subject of this article is a legal person, so they could technically provide an exception, but the fact that their official website gives the spelling "Kyoukai" and (you claim) their DVDs spell it with no indication of the long vowel, it is clear that they do not have a preferred spelling. Therefore, we should default to the correct Hepburn spelling. elvenscout742 (talk) 01:11, 23 December 2012 (UTC)

Extended content

The Kindai Eiga Kyokai website is "interesting" to say the least. For example, the last surviving original founder of the company died this year, after his 100th birthday, but they don't even mention that. As the person who created this article, I was quite disappointed that I couldn't find much other information there about the films or the company. I'm not sure this is a good source of information to use in this "requested move". So the request for moving is based on a rather bogus premise. The DVDs all use "Kindai Eiga Kyokai", and all the film titles use it too: youtube link. But anyway, leaving the renaming topic aside, I am absolutely delighted to find that another editor is interested in the topic of "Kindai Eiga Kyou/Kyo/Kyō-kai". I'm a big fan of Kaneto Shindo and I am looking forward to seeing this editor's contributions on this topic. Together we can make the article great. Even better, the same editor shares my interest in 1970s/80s Japanese actresses, a type of citrus fruit which is so far only grown in Japan, a film starring one of my favourite actresses, Meiko Kaji, and musicians, Ryudo Uzaki, which seems to never have been released outside Japan. I feel like I have found a true friend here on Misplaced Pages, and it touches my heart deeply. I would like to discuss all the great "Kindai Eiga Kyou/Kyo/Kyō-kai" and Meiko Kaji films together and maybe even rent some DVDs and watch them with him/her, maybe we can go to a Ryudo (or should I say Ryuudoh/Ryūdō to be on the safe side?) concert together. Having so many things in common is sure to be the beginning of a beautiful friendship. JoshuSasori (talk) 00:56, 23 December 2012 (UTC)

I'm not interested in making friends through Misplaced Pages, but that is beside the point. I like what Shindo films I have seen, particularly Kuroneko (which by the way I think is a ridiculous English title -- why would you just give a shorter version of the Japanese title without any kind of translation??). But I'm also an adherent to auteur theory, so I'm honestly not interested in working on articles related to film companies. However, Misplaced Pages policy on this matter is clear. The default is standard Hepburn, macrons and all; to go against that, outstanding evidence that the subject of the article itself prefers one particular spelling. This is why all articles on pre-modern subjects and most articles on modern non-sentient entities are required to use macrons. The subject of this article is a legal person, so they could technically provide an exception, but the fact that their official website gives the spelling "Kyoukai" and (you claim) their DVDs spell it with no indication of the long vowel, it is clear that they do not have a preferred spelling. Therefore, we should default to the correct Hepburn spelling. elvenscout742 (talk) 01:11, 23 December 2012 (UTC)

You're being disingenuous. It's obvious to a complete fool that the website is a total hack job, and it's also utterly obvious that you are cyberstalking me, and it's obvious that the preferred spelling is "Kyokai" without a macron. JoshuSasori (talk) 01:17, 23 December 2012 (UTC)

Oppose and speedy close of the above as based on extremely dubious evidence and a clear case of WP:HOUND. See also the edit history of Reikou, Ryoko Nakano, Akumyo series and Sonezaki Shinju (1978 film), the talk page of Ryo Kase and this AfD discussion for very clear evidence that the above editor is hounding me. I have brought this up on the user's talk page and will be taking further appropriate steps if this user continues to hound me. JoshuSasori (talk) 02:47, 23 December 2012 (UTC)

Extended content
I happened across a discussion in which you had posted, and when I pointed out that you and several other users were violating MOSJ your attempt to violate MOSJ elsewhere, and you responded with a ridiculous accusation speculating on my motives. I later happened to notice elsewhere again that you have a grudge against MOSJ's preference for standard Hepburn romanization, and appear not to understand the Japanese language or the logic behind the macron. Your user page contains a list of links to articles you have created, many of which obviously violate MOSJ. I would hardly call clicking on your signature "cyberstalking". I just found a series of pages that violate MOSJ, and knowing based on your previous posts that you didn't have a legitimate reason for doing so but rather simply don't like macrons, I decided to move the pages. I think I would be more justified in accusing you of cyberstalking, given that you followed me to a completely unrelated AFD and (ignoring all the reasonable arguments presented) voted against my position and made another personal attack against me. HOW ON EARTH CAN YOU ACCUSE ME OF HOUNDING YOU WHEN YOU ARE THE ONE WHO FOLLOWED ME TO THAT AFD?? elvenscout742 (talk) 06:19, 23 December 2012 (UTC) Also, I don't think I emphasized this enough: of the two discussions you are referring to, one was to the best of my knowledge the first time we ever interacted, and the latter was something I came across by myself and you followed me there. elvenscout742 (talk) 06:21, 23 December 2012 (UTC)

Extended content

I happened across a discussion in which you had posted, and when I pointed out that you and several other users were violating MOSJ your attempt to violate MOSJ elsewhere, and you responded with a ridiculous accusation speculating on my motives. I later happened to notice elsewhere again that you have a grudge against MOSJ's preference for standard Hepburn romanization, and appear not to understand the Japanese language or the logic behind the macron. Your user page contains a list of links to articles you have created, many of which obviously violate MOSJ. I would hardly call clicking on your signature "cyberstalking". I just found a series of pages that violate MOSJ, and knowing based on your previous posts that you didn't have a legitimate reason for doing so but rather simply don't like macrons, I decided to move the pages. I think I would be more justified in accusing you of cyberstalking, given that you followed me to a completely unrelated AFD and (ignoring all the reasonable arguments presented) voted against my position and made another personal attack against me. HOW ON EARTH CAN YOU ACCUSE ME OF HOUNDING YOU WHEN YOU ARE THE ONE WHO FOLLOWED ME TO THAT AFD?? elvenscout742 (talk) 06:19, 23 December 2012 (UTC)

Also, I don't think I emphasized this enough: of the two discussions you are referring to, one was to the best of my knowledge the first time we ever interacted, and the latter was something I came across by myself and you followed me there. elvenscout742 (talk) 06:21, 23 December 2012 (UTC)

I have collapsed the above irrelevant arguments on the parts of both myself and JoshuSasori. At the time the argument took place, I was under some stress, and the two of us had a mutual misunderstanding. I had wrongly assumed that JS was deliberately flouting Misplaced Pages policy in his edits to this and other articles, and JS had wrongly assumed I was not genuinely interested in Japanese cinema and was only posting here to troll him. I have posted an offer of peaceful cooperation on JS's talk page, as well as a clarification that I have been editing Japanese film articles on Misplaced Pages for several years, and so I hope we can put the fight behind us. But my opinion on this page's title has not changed, and so I think it would be good if we can move on to having a constructive discussion of the issue.

To start, JS, can you explain why you believe the website I linked to is a hack job? It seems you posted a link to it in the article, and surely it is as valid as anything.

elvenscout742 (talk) 12:49, 24 December 2012 (UTC)

Also, since the current title's rationale was given by you in an edit summary as based on DVD covers, could you please link to some scanned image of such a DVD cover? Both my DVDs of Onibaba and Yabu no Naka no Kuroneko were in Eureka's Masters of Cinema Collection (the most widely distributed editions of both in the UK and Ireland), which is entirely separate from the Kyōkai, and when I moved to Japan I put both discs in plastic holders anyway. elvenscout742 (talk) 12:58, 24 December 2012 (UTC)

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