Talk:Insurgency in Balochistan: Difference between revisions

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Revision as of 17:26, 10 May 2016 editTripWire (talk \| contribs)Extended confirmed users, Pending changes reviewers, Rollbackers2,780 edits →Content removal ← Previous edit		Revision as of 18:41, 10 May 2016 edit undoFreedom Mouse (talk \| contribs)48 edits →Content removal Next edit →
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	::::: Indeed, there is no Misplaced Pages policy that says real or supposed `terrorists' should be censored. DNA India is a reliable ]. I don't see a justification for excluding this content. -- ] (]) 09:56, 10 May 2016 (UTC)		::::: Indeed, there is no Misplaced Pages policy that says real or supposed `terrorists' should be censored. DNA India is a reliable ]. I don't see a justification for excluding this content. -- ] (]) 09:56, 10 May 2016 (UTC)
	::::::I am sorry, but ] does not say that views of terrorists must be mentioned. Nor does it says that if mentioned, it should ''propagate'' their views. Also, equating hardcore terrorists whose actions have affected the entire world with every Tommy, Dickie and Hamesh wannabie terrorist and mentioning their views in the lede is not justified. ] is the case in point. Going by this, we should be copy/pasting the entire commentary taking place at twitter or facebook in articles. Also, DNA being an RS does not matter if the individual it is quoting is not reliable. Especially, if we know on one hand that insurgency in Balochistan is being supported by India and at the same time an Indian newspaper (alone) is trying to propagate the views of terrorists it is (supposedly) supporting. If yes, views of Karima Baloch are to mentioned, then the aspect of her getting airtime, support and propagation by India and its news organizations should also be mentioned in the intrest of ]. BTW, searching Karmia Baloch gives some results, but almost all of them are from these terrorist organizations' propaganda websites or their propaganda YouTube channels, not much RS here, so we need to be careful in turning WP into their mouthpiece.—] <sup>] </sup> 16:30, 10 May 2016 (UTC)		::::::I am sorry, but ] does not say that views of terrorists must be mentioned. Nor does it says that if mentioned, it should ''propagate'' their views. Also, equating hardcore terrorists whose actions have affected the entire world with every Tommy, Dickie and Hamesh wannabie terrorist and mentioning their views in the lede is not justified. ] is the case in point. Going by this, we should be copy/pasting the entire commentary taking place at twitter or facebook in articles. Also, DNA being an RS does not matter if the individual it is quoting is not reliable. Especially, if we know on one hand that insurgency in Balochistan is being supported by India and at the same time an Indian newspaper (alone) is trying to propagate the views of terrorists it is (supposedly) supporting. If yes, views of Karima Baloch are to mentioned, then the aspect of her getting airtime, support and propagation by India and its news organizations should also be mentioned in the intrest of ]. BTW, searching Karmia Baloch gives some results, but almost all of them are from these terrorist organizations' propaganda websites or their propaganda YouTube channels, not much RS here, so we need to be careful in turning WP into their mouthpiece.—] <sup>] </sup> 16:30, 10 May 2016 (UTC)

			Please stop removing sourced content

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Nazir Ahmed Marri was nominated for deletion. The discussion was closed on 21 July 2012 with a consensus to merge. Its contents were merged into Insurgency in Balochistan. The original page is now a redirect to this page. For the contribution history and old versions of the redirected article, please see its history; for its talk page, see here.

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Map

Shouldnt the map also show the conflicted area in Iran? It is only showing the balochistan part of pakistan.Sohebbasharat (talk) 23:58, 21 November 2014 (UTC)

Agreed. But who will do it and based on what sources? kashmiri 21:57, 20 December 2014 (UTC)

adding to article

Have made a lot of additions to the article. I use a lot of "according to ..." before telling what was said, and used a lot of quotations. I may make the writing more clunky but I thought it necessary because of the sensitive nature of the topic.

Have also separated info on the conflict in Iran in a separate section. Almost all the article is about the conflict in Pakistan that I thought it would server users better to consolidate the Iran story in one section and add more info to it. -- BoogaLouie (talk) 22:16, 28 June 2015 (UTC)

Indian involvement

You cannot state, as fact, that India has admitted support for Baloch rebels. I would ask that another editor revert this repeated introduction of inappropriate material. Also, the conflict has not subsided and claiming this is rather silly. Curro2 (talk) 02:16, 27 January 2016 (UTC)

Curro2 did you even read the source which I am using? And the sources clearly states that the attack have largely decreased over the period of time 5.36.5.59 (talk) 02:32, 27 January 2016 (UTC)

Please stop or I will ask that you be blocked. Curro2 (talk) 02:38, 27 January 2016 (UTC)

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Content removal

Why is sourced information being removed? The sources support it. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Freedom Mouse (talk • contribs) 05:46, 9 May 2016 (UTC)

@Freedom Mouse because the sources do not support the said statements, or sources are not reliable as per WP:RS and sources are not present. Also some of the content has very bad language and was unintelligible. If you have some reliable sources for the content please link them here I will put in the content and attach the citations myself. FreeatlastChitchat (talk) 05:59, 9 May 2016 (UTC)

The sources do support the content, and how are human rights watch and a mainstream newspaper not reliable? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Freedom Mouse (talk • contribs) 06:16, 9 May 2016 (UTC)

@Freedom Mouse The so called "newspaper" is from India and giving information from a non reliable person , hence it is unreliable. FreeatlastChitchat (talk) 06:19, 9 May 2016 (UTC)

Who are you to claim someone is unreliable? The newspaper quoting him obviously believed he was reliable for what he himself says, you removal sourced content on spurious grounds. ' — Preceding unsigned comment added by Freedom Mouse (talk • contribs) 06:27, 9 May 2016 (UTC)

@FreeatlastChitchat If you think that the source and the person who gave the interview are unreliable, then prove it on WP:RSN. And please stop removing every pro-Indian content just because of your personal bias against Indian sources. Bharatiya 29 07:19, 9 May 2016 (UTC)

Pro-Indian content?? So you agree that you are just here to push your/Indian POV into a Pakistan related article? BTW, the info/POV you are trying to push is from a woman who belongs to BSO-Azad - a terrorist organization. I doubt Misplaced Pages is a propaganda mouthpiece of terrorists organizations. Also, this women, who is she? Why is here propaganda so important that she gets a space here at Wiki? Is she reliable? Only info I can find on her is from Baloch propaganda/terrorist websites which are no good then Al-Qaeda's propaganda websites. Lastly, the IP and FM are using similar modus oprendi to push the same POV by taking turns. I suspect some meat/sock-puppetry.—TripWire ︢ ︢ ︡ ︢ ︡ ︢ ︡ ︢ ︡ ︡ ︢ ︡ 09:40, 9 May 2016 (UTC)

Really? A Baloch nationalist leader doesn't get space on the Balochistan conflict page?

I would like to remind all the editors arguing along nationalist lines that this is explicitly sanctioned by ARBCOM . You are asking for trouble by going down this route. -- Kautilya3 (talk) 11:11, 9 May 2016 (UTC)

@Kautilya3 an unknown nobody with only 3600 google hits, whose only mention in popular media is a blogpost that you pulled from global voices. Who is an unknown entity on the entire internet where even my name has 100 times more hits then hers, is being paraded as a Reliable Source for opinion on Baloch politics? Dare I say more? Last time I checked leaders were the people who had followers, she doesn't even have virtual followers let alone real ones. and do reply on the Kashmir conflict whenever u are reddy. further more she is not even a baloch sepratis now, but simply a refugee in Canada as per this article FreeatlastChitchat (talk) 11:24, 9 May 2016 (UTC)

Let me answer point by point.

Adding Indian POV is not a violation of the policies. The section was completely non-neutral, so I was just making it balanced.
It is natural for Pakistan to declare those organisations who fight for Baloch independence as terrorist groups. Does that mean that their opinion should not be given a place?
Karima Baloch is the chairperson of BSO Azad, whom Pakistan alleges to have connections with Kulbhushan Yadav. That makes her statement even more important to have a balanced view of the allegations put on India.
I fail to understand that how can Karima Baloch's statement be undermined just because she is a refugee. Let me tell you again that she is the chairperson of the same group that is alleged to receive support from India. Therefore her refusal regarding that allegation has to be mentioned for a NPOV.
If anyone suspects me of sock-puppetry then I will appreciate if he/she requests for a CU to get his/her doubts cleared.
The allegation that I am pushing the Indian view on a Pak-related article is baseless. The Balochistan conflict is connected to India because of the allegations by Pak. If I find any official reactions by India to these allegations, then I will add them too in order to present a neutral view to the readers. Bharatiya 29 13:33, 9 May 2016 (UTC)

@TripWire: As to your exclamations about WP being "a mouthpiece", please read WP:TERRORIST. It may help you to read also WP:NOT and WP:NPV. You are certainly mixing up an encyclopaedia with government propaganda. FYI, there is nothing wrong with sourcing encyclopaedic information even to Al-Qaida's websites, especially when writing about AQ. — kashmiri 08:43, 10 May 2016 (UTC)

Indeed, there is no Misplaced Pages policy that says real or supposed `terrorists' should be censored. DNA India is a reliable mainstream news source. I don't see a justification for excluding this content. -- Kautilya3 (talk) 09:56, 10 May 2016 (UTC)

I am sorry, but WP:TERRORIST does not say that views of terrorists must be mentioned. Nor does it says that if mentioned, it should propagate their views. Also, equating hardcore terrorists whose actions have affected the entire world with every Tommy, Dickie and Hamesh wannabie terrorist and mentioning their views in the lede is not justified. WP:FRINGE is the case in point. Going by this, we should be copy/pasting the entire commentary taking place at twitter or facebook in articles. Also, DNA being an RS does not matter if the individual it is quoting is not reliable. Especially, if we know on one hand that insurgency in Balochistan is being supported by India and at the same time an Indian newspaper (alone) is trying to propagate the views of terrorists it is (supposedly) supporting. If yes, views of Karima Baloch are to mentioned, then the aspect of her getting airtime, support and propagation by India and its news organizations should also be mentioned in the intrest of WP:BALANCE. BTW, searching Karmia Baloch gives some results, but almost all of them are from these terrorist organizations' propaganda websites or their propaganda YouTube channels, not much RS here, so we need to be careful in turning WP into their mouthpiece.—TripWire ︢ ︢ ︡ ︢ ︡ ︢ ︡ ︢ ︡ ︡ ︢ ︡ 16:30, 10 May 2016 (UTC)

Please stop removing sourced content

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