Revision as of 23:53, 11 February 2018 editBrownHairedGirl (talk | contribs)Autopatrolled, Extended confirmed users, File movers, Pending changes reviewers, Rollbackers2,942,733 edits →Opposed nominations: re Black Falcon← Previous edit | Revision as of 00:25, 12 February 2018 edit undoBrownHairedGirl (talk | contribs)Autopatrolled, Extended confirmed users, File movers, Pending changes reviewers, Rollbackers2,942,733 edits →Opposed nominations: Full discussion of Category:First Ladies of Trinidad and Tobago is at Misplaced Pages:Categories for discussion/Log/2018 February 12#Category:First_Ladies_of_Trinidad_and_TobagoNext edit → | ||
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*:This is part of a larger scheme, ] (and there's also ]), so I think this would require a full discussion. -- ] <sup>(])</sup> 23:22, 11 February 2018 (UTC) | *:This is part of a larger scheme, ] (and there's also ]), so I think this would require a full discussion. -- ] <sup>(])</sup> 23:22, 11 February 2018 (UTC) | ||
⚫ | * ] to ] - C2C to match the parent article. Additionally, ] is expected to take office as President in March 2018 and her husband would be the nation's first First Gentleman.] (]) 13:51, 25 January 2018 (UTC) | ||
⚫ | *:'''Oppose'''. {{yo|Scanlan}} I see no evidence that the verbose title "First Ladies and Gentlemen" is used in Trinidad and Tobago. Rename instead to the simpler descriptive title ], C2C per grandparent ] and many of its subcats. --] <small>] • (])</small> 16:32, 25 January 2018 (UTC) | ||
⚫ | *::'''Comment''' - The Office of the President of Trinidad and Tobago, the official government site, uses "The First Lady", on its page. ] (]) 17:29, 25 January 2018 (UTC) | ||
⚫ | *:::{{yo|Scanlan}} it does ''not'' use the title "First Gentlemen". It does not use "First Ladies and Gentlemen". --] <small>] • (])</small> 17:50, 25 January 2018 (UTC) | ||
⚫ | *:So... is this basically on hold until 19 March 2018, when Weekes takes office, to see how is updated? -- ] <sup>(])</sup> 19:26, 11 February 2018 (UTC) | ||
⚫ | *::{{yo|Black Falcon}} I will continue to oppose regardless of what that site's webmaster does or doesn't do. A simple descriptive category name is clearer for both readers and editors. --] <small>] • (])</small> 23:52, 11 February 2018 (UTC) | ||
* ] to ] – C2C: Replace the dash with a space per the rest of the categories related to the Greek Catholic Church and its church buildings; change "churches" to "church buildings" per the recent rename of ] to ] at ]. ] ] 15:18, 11 January 2018 (UTC) | * ] to ] – C2C: Replace the dash with a space per the rest of the categories related to the Greek Catholic Church and its church buildings; change "churches" to "church buildings" per the recent rename of ] to ] at ]. ] ] 15:18, 11 January 2018 (UTC) | ||
** ] to ] | ** ] to ] | ||
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=====Moved to full discussion===== | =====Moved to full discussion===== | ||
<!-- If this section becomes empty, instead add * ''None currently''. If you add a category to this section, than please link to the full discussion. Add new categories at the beginning of the section. --> | <!-- If this section becomes empty, instead add * ''None currently''. If you add a category to this section, than please link to the full discussion. Add new categories at the beginning of the section. --> | ||
⚫ | * ] to ] - C2C to match the parent article. Additionally, ] is expected to take office as President in March 2018 and her husband would be the nation's first First Gentleman.] (]) 13:51, 25 January 2018 (UTC) | ||
⚫ | *:'''Oppose'''. {{yo|Scanlan}} I see no evidence that the verbose title "First Ladies and Gentlemen" is used in Trinidad and Tobago. Rename instead to the simpler descriptive title ], C2C per grandparent ] and many of its subcats. --] <small>] • (])</small> 16:32, 25 January 2018 (UTC) | ||
⚫ | *::'''Comment''' - The Office of the President of Trinidad and Tobago, the official government site, uses "The First Lady", on its page. ] (]) 17:29, 25 January 2018 (UTC) | ||
⚫ | *:::{{yo|Scanlan}} it does ''not'' use the title "First Gentlemen". It does not use "First Ladies and Gentlemen". --] <small>] • (])</small> 17:50, 25 January 2018 (UTC) | ||
⚫ | *:So... is this basically on hold until 19 March 2018, when Weekes takes office, to see how is updated? -- ] <sup>(])</sup> 19:26, 11 February 2018 (UTC) | ||
⚫ | *::{{yo|Black Falcon}} I will continue to oppose regardless of what that site's webmaster does or doesn't do. A simple descriptive category name is clearer for both readers and editors. --] <small>] • (])</small> 23:52, 11 February 2018 (UTC) | ||
*:'''Full discussion''' at ]. --] <small>] • (])</small> 00:25, 12 February 2018 (UTC) | |||
* ] to ] – C2C. ] (]) 08:58, 14 January 2018 (UTC) | * ] to ] – C2C. ] (]) 08:58, 14 January 2018 (UTC) | ||
* ] to ] – C2C. ] (]) 08:58, 14 January 2018 (UTC) | * ] to ] – C2C. ] (]) 08:58, 14 January 2018 (UTC) |
Revision as of 00:25, 12 February 2018
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Current nominations
- Category:Distribution (business) to Category:Distribution (marketing) – C2D: Distribution (business) has been renamed to Distribution (marketing), see requested move. Marcocapelle (talk) 19:17, 11 February 2018 (UTC)
- This looks OK but should probably be completed by removing the sub-cat Category:Warehouses, and disambiguating the old name between the new name and Category:Logistics. – Fayenatic London 21:45, 11 February 2018 (UTC)
- Category:Fantasy lists to Category:Fantasy-related lists – C2C: per convention of Category:Lists. BrownHairedGirl (talk) • (contribs) 18:41, 11 February 2018 (UTC)
- Category:2009 Pioneer Football League football season to Category:2009 Pioneer Football League season – C2A, C2C Jweiss11 (talk) 17:54, 11 February 2018 (UTC)
- Category:Flow network rename to Category:Network flow problem — C2D. This was recently renamed from Category:Network flow to Category:Flow network but that is the wrong name for this topic. "Network flow" is the name used in the literature for the general topic; a flow network is a specific type of mathematical object that is used as an input to a network flow problem and "flow network" does not describe other aspects of the subject such as specific types of flow problem to be solved and algorithms to solve them; "network flow" covers the whole topic. The article flow network has been demoted from its main-article status (it should not have been main article) and a new article Network flow problem put in its place. I would actually be happier with the original name Category:Network flow rather than the proposed name, but that name goes to a dab article rather than to an article on this topic. —David Eppstein (talk) 07:13, 11 February 2018 (UTC)
- Oppose as speedy. @David Eppstein: you make a good case, but it doesn't meet any speedy criteria. This needs a full discussion. --BrownHairedGirl (talk) • (contribs) 20:22, 11 February 2018 (UTC)
- @BrownHairedGirl: Perhaps you can explain why the move to the wrong name was a C2D speed but now that the main article has been changed to the right name it can no longer be a C2D speedy again? —David Eppstein (talk) 20:25, 11 February 2018 (UTC)
- @David Eppstein: because the case accepted then was the proposed change met WP:C2D. Whether or not that decision was wrong, you make no such case ... so this needs a full discussion. --BrownHairedGirl (talk) • (contribs) 20:31, 11 February 2018 (UTC)
- The main article is now the proposed new category name, "Network flow problem". In what way does this not meet C2D? —David Eppstein (talk) 20:36, 11 February 2018 (UTC)
- @David Eppstein: because it wasn't the main article until you just WP:BOLDly made it so. So there is no consensus whether you are right, neither consensus-by-stability nor consensus-by-discussion; the point of C2D is that it is based on a consensus rather than on one editor's decision, no matter how wise they are. --BrownHairedGirl (talk) • (contribs) 20:51, 11 February 2018 (UTC)
- The main article is now the proposed new category name, "Network flow problem". In what way does this not meet C2D? —David Eppstein (talk) 20:36, 11 February 2018 (UTC)
- @David Eppstein: because the case accepted then was the proposed change met WP:C2D. Whether or not that decision was wrong, you make no such case ... so this needs a full discussion. --BrownHairedGirl (talk) • (contribs) 20:31, 11 February 2018 (UTC)
- @BrownHairedGirl: Perhaps you can explain why the move to the wrong name was a C2D speed but now that the main article has been changed to the right name it can no longer be a C2D speedy again? —David Eppstein (talk) 20:25, 11 February 2018 (UTC)
- Oppose as speedy. @David Eppstein: you make a good case, but it doesn't meet any speedy criteria. This needs a full discussion. --BrownHairedGirl (talk) • (contribs) 20:22, 11 February 2018 (UTC)
- Category:Transport and distribution companies to Category:Freight transport companies – C2C: Category:Freight transport. Marcocapelle (talk) 06:56, 11 February 2018 (UTC)
- Category:Conservative organisations in the United States to Category:Conservative organizations in the United States – C2C (TIES). 209.6.209.51 (talk) 04:45, 7 February 2018 (UTC)
- The category was not tagged until now. -- Black Falcon 05:15, 11 February 2018 (UTC)
- Category:Transdev Group companies to Category:Transdev - C2D. ACendex (talk) 01:18, 11 February 2018 (UTC)
- This is technically not suited for speedy since it would convert a set category into a topic category; however, the proposed change makes sense, so I have no objections. -- Black Falcon 05:22, 11 February 2018 (UTC)
- Category:The College of St. Scholastica to Category:College of St. Scholastica – C2D: article name is College of St. Scholastica Joeykai (talk) 17:49, 10 February 2018 (UTC)
- Category:Songs with lyrics by Kotoko (singer) to Category:Songs with lyrics by Kotoko (musician) – C2D Richhoncho (talk) 09:46, 10 February 2018 (UTC)
- Category:Railway stations served by London Midland to Category:Railway stations served by West Midlands Trains – C2D, London Midland was succeeded by West Midlands Trains in December 2017. Rollingsow (talk) 02:19, 7 February 2018 (UTC)
- Not really comfortable processing this one without a full discussion. C2D does not technically apply to set categories; however, more than that, I wonder if there are any railyway stations that were served by London Midland but are not served by West Midland Trains. -- Black Falcon 05:19, 11 February 2018 (UTC)
Opposed nominations
- Category:French people of Luxembourgian descent to Category:French people of Luxembourgish descent – C2A: Luxembourgish is far more common: Google ngram analysis (also has links to view search results for each term: 15 million vs 125,000 for Luxembourgish vs Luxembourgian); Luxembourgian is a redirect to Luxembourgish. Eric 22:57, 11 February 2018 (UTC)
- This is part of a larger scheme, Category:People of Luxembourgian descent (and there's also Category:Luxembourgian people), so I think this would require a full discussion. -- Black Falcon 23:22, 11 February 2018 (UTC)
- Category:Greek-Catholic churches in Romania to Category:Greek Catholic church buildings in Romania – C2C: Replace the dash with a space per the rest of the categories related to the Greek Catholic Church and its church buildings; change "churches" to "church buildings" per the recent rename of Category:Churches to Category:Church buildings at Misplaced Pages:Categories for discussion/Log/2017 October 25#Category:Churches. עוד מישהו Od Mishehu 15:18, 11 January 2018 (UTC)
- Category:Greek-Catholic cathedrals in Romania to Category:Greek Catholic cathedrals in Romania
- Oppose all these "churches"→"church buildings" categs. I am aware that many have already been speedily renamed, but I have only just checked the basis.
- These changes are being made on the basis of Misplaced Pages:Categories for discussion/Log/2017 October 25#Category:Churches. However, that CfD listed only only the top-level Category:Church buildings, and AFAICS that was the only category tagged. If it was intended that many hundreds (possibly thousands) of subcats should be renamed, then those subcats should have been tagged and listed. That was not done, and (judging by Special:WhatLinksHere/Wikipedia:Categories for discussion/Log/2017 October 25) nor does there appear to have been any attempt to notify the relevant WikiProjects that the single cat listed in their article alerts was a proxy for hundreds of subcats.
- Worse still, this overturned a much better-attended discussion at Misplaced Pages:Categories for discussion/Log/2015 May 1#Churches/Church_buildings, in which the 2400 subcats were tagged, and listed at Misplaced Pages:Categories for discussion/Log/2015 May 1/list. I also see no evidence of any attempt to notify the participants in that earlier discussion; I assume that oversight was an error in good faith, but its presumably-unintended effect was WP:FORUMSHOPping.
- The 2017 October 25 CfD was closed by @Explicit, whose one-word close ("rename") gave no explanation of several key questions: a) why a 5:3 division of votes was sufficient to overturn the much better-attended May 2015 CfD; b) whether it was intended to apply only to the parent cat, c) if it was intended to apply to subcats, why it should do so when they were neither listed nor tagged despite the previous CfD having listed or tagged them.
- I have not formed a view on the merits of relative merits of "churches"/"church buildings". But I have a v strong view on the the importance of properly-weighed consensus, and on the disruption caused by mass renamings on the basis of inadequate notification, esp when they reverse a relatively recent, properly-formed consensus. --BrownHairedGirl (talk) • (contribs) 09:53, 13 January 2018 (UTC)
- So, what do you (and others) suggest as the next step? -- Black Falcon 17:43, 15 January 2018 (UTC)
- @Black Falcon: I suggest a new full CfD, with all cats tagged and listed, and an "option A"/"option B" choice between the 2 formats. Notify all participants in previous CfDs, and all wikiprojects. If the outcome is "no consensus", then take "churches" as the default, 'cos that was the last properly notified CfD. It would be great be great to have some sort of long-term moratorium thereafter. --BrownHairedGirl (talk) • (contribs) 01:10, 17 January 2018 (UTC)
- So, what do you (and others) suggest as the next step? -- Black Falcon 17:43, 15 January 2018 (UTC)
- Category:Greek-Catholic cathedrals in Romania to Category:Greek Catholic cathedrals in Romania
- Category:Greek Catholic churches in France to Category:Greek Catholic church buildings in France – C2C: Per the recent rename of Category:Churches to Category:Church buildings at Misplaced Pages:Categories for discussion/Log/2017 October 25#Category:Churches. עוד מישהו Od Mishehu 15:13, 11 January 2018 (UTC)
- Category:Greek Catholic churches in Paris to Category:Greek Catholic church buildings in Paris
- Category:Greek Catholic churches in Israel to Category:Greek Catholic church buildings in Israel
- Category:Belarusian Greek Catholic churches in the United Kingdom to Category:Belarusian Greek Catholic church buildings in the United Kingdom
- Category:Greek Byzantine Catholic churches to Category:Greek Byzantine Catholic church buildings
- Category:Hungarian Greek Catholic churches to Category:Hungarian Greek Catholic church buildings
- Category:Italo-Albanian Greek Catholic churches to Category:Italo-Albanian Greek Catholic church buildings
- Category:Ruthenian Catholic churches to Category:Ruthenian Catholic church buildings
- Category:Ruthenian Catholic churches in the United States to Category:Ruthenian Catholic church buildings in the United States
- Category:Slovak Greek Catholic churches to Category:Slovak Greek Catholic church buildings
- Category:Ukrainian Catholic churches to Category:Ukrainian Catholic church buildings
- Category:Ukrainian Catholic churches by country to Category:Ukrainian Catholic church buildings by country
- Category:Ukrainian Catholic churches in Canada to Category:Ukrainian Catholic church buildings in Canada
- Category:Ukrainian Greek Catholic churches in Italy to Category:Ukrainian Greek Catholic church buildings in Italy
- Category:Ukrainian Catholic churches in Ukraine to Category:Ukrainian Catholic church buildings in Ukraine
- Category:Ukrainian Catholic churches in the United Kingdom to Category:Ukrainian Catholic church buildings in the United Kingdom
- Category:Ukrainian Catholic churches in the United States to Category:Ukrainian Catholic church buildings in the United States
- Category:Polish National Catholic churches to Category:Polish National Catholic church buildings
- Category:Roman Catholic churches completed in the 1120s to Category:Roman Catholic church buildings completed in the 1120s
- Category:Roman Catholic churches completed in 1400 to Category:Roman Catholic church buildings completed in 1400
- Category:Roman Catholic churches completed in the 1400s to Category:Roman Catholic church buildings completed in the 1400s
- Category:Armenian Catholic churches to Category:Armenian Catholic church buildings – C2C: Per the recent rename of Category:Churches to Category:Church buildings at Misplaced Pages:Categories for discussion/Log/2017 October 25#Category:Churches. עוד מישהו Od Mishehu 10:39, 11 January 2018 (UTC)
- Category:Former Armenian Catholic churches to Category:Former Armenian Catholic church buildings
- Category:Armenian Catholic churches by country to Category:Armenian Catholic church buildings by country
- Category:Armenian Catholic churches in Lebanon to Category:Armenian Catholic church buildings in Lebanon
- Category:Armenian Catholic churches in Romania to Category:Armenian Catholic church buildings in Romania
- Category:Armenian Catholic churches in Syria to Category:Armenian Catholic church buildings in Syria
- Category:Chaldean Catholic churches to Category:Chaldean Catholic church buildings
- Category:Chaldean Catholic churches in the United States to Category:Chaldean Catholic church buildings in the United States
- Category:Coptic Catholic churches to Category:Coptic Catholic church buildings
- Category:Ethiopian Catholic churches to Category:Ethiopian Catholic church buildings
- Category:Melkite Greek Catholic churches by country to Category:Melkite Greek Catholic church buildings by country
- Category:Melkite Greek Catholic churches in Israel to Category:Melkite Greek Catholic church buildings in Israel
- Category:Melkite Greek Catholic churches in the United States to Category:Melkite Greek Catholic church buildings in the United States
- Category:Melkite Greek Catholic churches in Canada to Category:Melkite Greek Catholic church buildings in Canada
- Category:Assyrian Church of the East churches to Category:Assyrian Church of the East church buildings – C2C: Per the recent rename of Category:Churches to Category:Church buildings at Misplaced Pages:Categories for discussion/Log/2017 October 25#Category:Churches. עוד מישהו Od Mishehu 07:16, 11 January 2018 (UTC)
- Category:Armenian Apostolic churches in Georgia to Category:Armenian Apostolic church buildings in Georgia (country) – C2C: Rename "churches" to "church buildings" per the recent rename of Category:Churches to Category:Church buildings at Misplaced Pages:Categories for discussion/Log/2017 October 25#Category:Churches; rename "Georgia" to "Georgia (country)" per the rest of the Category:Georgia (country) category tree. עוד מישהו Od Mishehu 14:50, 10 January 2018 (UTC)
- Category:Episcopal churches to Category:Episcopal church buildings – C2C: Per the recent rename of Category:Churches to Category:Church buildings at Misplaced Pages:Categories for discussion/Log/2017 October 25#Category:Churches. עוד מישהו Od Mishehu 14:39, 10 January 2018 (UTC)
- Category:Episcopal churches by century to Category:Episcopal church buildings by century
- Category:Episcopal churches in the United Kingdom to Category:Episcopal church buildings in the United Kingdom
- Category:Former Anglican churches to Category:Former Anglican church buildings over redirect
- Category:Anglican church stubs to Category:Anglican church buildings stubs
- Category:Armenian churches by denomination to Category:Armenian church buildings by denomination
- Category:Armenian Apostolic churches to Category:Armenian Apostolic church buildings
- Category:Armenian Apostolic churches by city to Category:Armenian Apostolic church buildings by city
- Category:Armenian Apostolic churches in Ashtarak to Category:Armenian Apostolic church buildings in Ashtarak
- Category:Armenian Apostolic churches in Jerusalem to Category:Armenian Apostolic church buildings in Jerusalem
- Category:Armenian Apostolic churches in Tbilisi to Category:Armenian Apostolic church buildings in Tbilisi
- Category:Armenian Apostolic churches in Tehran to Category:Armenian Apostolic church buildings in Tehran
- Category:Armenian Apostolic churches in Vagharshapat to Category:Armenian Apostolic church buildings in Vagharshapat
- Category:Armenian Apostolic churches in Voskepar to Category:Armenian Apostolic church buildings in Voskepar
- Category:Armenian Apostolic churches in Yerevan to Category:Armenian Apostolic church buildings in Yerevan
- Category:Armenian Apostolic churches by country to Category:Armenian Apostolic church buildings by country
- Category:Armenian Apostolic churches in Armenia to Category:Armenian Apostolic church buildings in Armenia
- Category:Armenian Apostolic churches in India to Category:Armenian Apostolic church buildings in India
- Category:Armenian Apostolic churches in Iran to Category:Armenian Apostolic church buildings in Iran
- Category:Armenian Apostolic churches in Israel to Category:Armenian Apostolic church buildings in Israel
- Category:Armenian Apostolic churches in Romania to Category:Armenian Apostolic church buildings in Romania
- Category:Armenian Apostolic churches in Syria to Category:Armenian Apostolic church buildings in Syria
- Category:Armenian Apostolic churches in Turkey to Category:Armenian Apostolic church buildings in Turkey
- Category:Armenian Apostolic churches in Istanbul to Category:Armenian Apostolic church buildings in Istanbul
- Category:Armenian Apostolic churches in Ukraine to Category:Armenian Apostolic church buildings in Ukraine
- Category:Armenian Apostolic churches in the United Kingdom to Category:Armenian Apostolic church buildings in the United Kingdom
- Category:Armenian Apostolic churches in the United States to Category:Armenian Apostolic church buildings in the United States
- Category:Churches in Newcastle to Category:Church buildings in Newcastle upon Tyne – C2C: Rename "Churches" to "Church buildings" per the recent rename of Category:Churches to Category:Church buildings at Misplaced Pages:Categories for discussion/Log/2017 October 25#Category:Churches; rename "Newcastle" to "Newcastle upon Tyne" per the rest of the Category:Newcastle upon Tyne category tree. עוד מישהו Od Mishehu 14:07, 9 January 2018 (UTC)
- Category:Anglican churches in Oceania to Category:Anglican church buildings in Oceania – C2C: Per the recent rename of Category:Churches to Category:Church buildings at Misplaced Pages:Categories for discussion/Log/2017 October 25#Category:Churches. עוד מישהו Od Mishehu 13:32, 9 January 2018 (UTC)
- Category:Anglican churches in Australia to Category:Anglican church buildings in Australia
- Category:Anglican churches in New South Wales to Category:Anglican church buildings in New South Wales
- Category:Anglican churches in South Australia to Category:Anglican church buildings in South Australia
- Category:Anglican churches in Tasmania to Category:Anglican church buildings in Tasmania
- Category:Anglican churches in Victoria (Australia) to Category:Anglican church buildings in Victoria (Australia)
- Category:Anglican churches in Western Australia to Category:Anglican church buildings in Western Australia
- Category:Anglo-Catholic churches in Australia to Category:Anglo-Catholic church buildings in Australia
- Category:Anglican churches in New Zealand to Category:Anglican church buildings in New Zealand
- Category:Anglo-Catholic churches in New Zealand to Category:Anglo-Catholic church buildings in New Zealand
- Category:Anglican churches in South America to Category:Anglican church buildings in South America
- Category:Anglican churches in Brazil to Category:Anglican church buildings in Brazil
- Category:Anglican churches by country to Category:Anglican church buildings by country
- Category:Anglo-Catholic churches by country to Category:Anglo-Catholic church buildings by country
- Category:Anglo-Catholic churches in the Republic of Ireland to Category:Anglo-Catholic church buildings in the Republic of Ireland
- Category:Anglo-Catholic churches to Category:Anglo-Catholic church buildings
- Category:Anglican churches in Queensland to Category:Anglican church buildings in Queensland
- Question: I presume the movitation here is to distinguish the church as an organisation as distinct to its buildings. However, the Anglican church in Queensland has many buildings that are not churches (in the sense of being a place to gather for worship) as it has offices, schools, etc, and I am sure this is true worldwide. The proposed renaming seems to broaden the scope of the category considerably. Is that the intention? Kerry (talk) 23:41, 9 January 2018 (UTC)
- An Anglican church building is a place of worship; An Anglican Church building would be any building associated with the Anglican Church. עוד מישהו Od Mishehu 07:44, 10 January 2018 (UTC)
- That's a mightly subtle distinction. Are the categories going to be updated with descriptions to make that clear? Indeed, it would seem we now need two categories for both purposes with church buildings a sub-cat of Church buildings (ideally both with explanations). Kerry (talk) 04:14, 11 January 2018 (UTC)
- Anglican Church building cannot be used as Anglican Church is not a proper noun – there is more than Anglican church. See MOS:INSTITUTIONS. 142.161.81.20 (talk) 07:19, 22 January 2018 (UTC)
- An Anglican church building is a place of worship; An Anglican Church building would be any building associated with the Anglican Church. עוד מישהו Od Mishehu 07:44, 10 January 2018 (UTC)
- Question: I presume the movitation here is to distinguish the church as an organisation as distinct to its buildings. However, the Anglican church in Queensland has many buildings that are not churches (in the sense of being a place to gather for worship) as it has offices, schools, etc, and I am sure this is true worldwide. The proposed renaming seems to broaden the scope of the category considerably. Is that the intention? Kerry (talk) 23:41, 9 January 2018 (UTC)
- Category:Episcopal churches in Ohio to Category:Episcopal church buildings in Ohio – C2C: Per the recent rename of Category:Churches to Category:Church buildings at Misplaced Pages:Categories for discussion/Log/2017 October 25#Category:Churches. עוד מישהו Od Mishehu 11:36, 9 January 2018 (UTC)
- Category:Episcopal churches in Cincinnati to Category:Episcopal church buildings in Cincinnati
- Category:Episcopal churches in Oklahoma to Category:Episcopal church buildings in Oklahoma
- Category:Episcopal churches in Oregon to Category:Episcopal church buildings in Oregon
- Category:Episcopal churches in Pennsylvania to Category:Episcopal church buildings in Pennsylvania
- Category:Episcopal churches in Rhode Island to Category:Episcopal church buildings in Rhode Island
- Category:Episcopal churches in South Carolina to Category:Episcopal church buildings in South Carolina
- Category:Anglican churches in South Carolina to Category:Anglican church buildings in South Carolina
- Category:Episcopal churches in South Dakota to Category:Episcopal church buildings in South Dakota
- Category:Episcopal churches in Tennessee to Category:Episcopal church buildings in Tennessee
- Category:Episcopal churches in Chattanooga, Tennessee to Category:Episcopal church buildings in Chattanooga, Tennessee
- Category:Episcopal churches in Texas to Category:Episcopal church buildings in Texas
- Category:Episcopal churches in Utah to Category:Episcopal church buildings in Utah
- Category:Episcopal churches in Vermont to Category:Episcopal church buildings in Vermont
- Category:Episcopal churches in Virginia to Category:Episcopal church buildings in Virginia
- Category:Episcopal churches in Washington (state) to Category:Episcopal church buildings in Washington (state)
- Category:Episcopal churches in West Virginia to Category:Episcopal church buildings in West Virginia
- Category:Episcopal churches in Wisconsin to Category:Episcopal church buildings in Wisconsin
- Category:Episcopal churches in Wyoming to Category:Episcopal church buildings in Wyoming
- Category:Episcopal churches in Puerto Rico to Category:Episcopal church buildings in Puerto Rico
- Category:Episcopal churches in Washington, D.C. to Category:Episcopal church buildings in Washington, D.C.
- Category:United States Anglican church stubs to Category:United States Anglican church building stubs
On hold pending other discussion
- Category:Buildings and structures in Rio de Janeiro (city) to Category:Buildings and structures in Rio de Janeiro – C2b, Rio de Janeiro LaundryPizza03 (talk) 19:58, 4 January 2018 (UTC)
- Category:Rio de Janeiro (city)-related lists to Category:Rio de Janeiro-related lists
- Category:Culture in Rio de Janeiro (city) to Category:Culture in Rio de Janeiro
- Oppose renaming these under C2B/C2C. While the main category was speedily moved to Category:Rio de Janeiro in late 2016, that move should not have occurred given the potential for confusion with Category:Rio de Janeiro (state). Category names should typically match article names, except when the article name leaves room for ambiguity. -- Black Falcon 20:12, 4 January 2018 (UTC)
- Oppose per Black Falcon. Category:Rio de Janeiro should be renamed to Category:Rio de Janeiro (city). --BrownHairedGirl (talk) • (contribs) 17:04, 6 January 2018 (UTC)
- On hold, pending the outcome of this discussion on the parent category. -- Black Falcon 17:41, 15 January 2018 (UTC)
Moved to full discussion
- Category:First Ladies of Trinidad and Tobago to Category:First Ladies and Gentlemen of Trinidad and Tobago - C2C to match the parent article. Additionally, Paula-Mae Weekes is expected to take office as President in March 2018 and her husband would be the nation's first First Gentleman.Scanlan (talk) 13:51, 25 January 2018 (UTC)
- Oppose. @Scanlan: I see no evidence that the verbose title "First Ladies and Gentlemen" is used in Trinidad and Tobago. Rename instead to the simpler descriptive title Category:Spouses of Presidents of Trinidad and Tobago, C2C per grandparent Category:Spouses of national leaders and many of its subcats. --BrownHairedGirl (talk) • (contribs) 16:32, 25 January 2018 (UTC)
- Comment - The Office of the President of Trinidad and Tobago, the official government site, uses "The First Lady", on its page. Office of the President: The First Lady’s Profile Scanlan (talk) 17:29, 25 January 2018 (UTC)
- @Scanlan: it does not use the title "First Gentlemen". It does not use "First Ladies and Gentlemen". --BrownHairedGirl (talk) • (contribs) 17:50, 25 January 2018 (UTC)
- Comment - The Office of the President of Trinidad and Tobago, the official government site, uses "The First Lady", on its page. Office of the President: The First Lady’s Profile Scanlan (talk) 17:29, 25 January 2018 (UTC)
- So... is this basically on hold until 19 March 2018, when Weekes takes office, to see how this page is updated? -- Black Falcon 19:26, 11 February 2018 (UTC)
- @Black Falcon: I will continue to oppose regardless of what that site's webmaster does or doesn't do. A simple descriptive category name is clearer for both readers and editors. --BrownHairedGirl (talk) • (contribs) 23:52, 11 February 2018 (UTC)
- Full discussion at Misplaced Pages:Categories for discussion/Log/2018 February 12#Category:First_Ladies_of_Trinidad_and_Tobago. --BrownHairedGirl (talk) • (contribs) 00:25, 12 February 2018 (UTC)
- Oppose. @Scanlan: I see no evidence that the verbose title "First Ladies and Gentlemen" is used in Trinidad and Tobago. Rename instead to the simpler descriptive title Category:Spouses of Presidents of Trinidad and Tobago, C2C per grandparent Category:Spouses of national leaders and many of its subcats. --BrownHairedGirl (talk) • (contribs) 16:32, 25 January 2018 (UTC)
- Category:Metro stations in the United Kingdom to Category:Rapid transit stations in the United Kingdom – C2C. feminist (talk) 08:58, 14 January 2018 (UTC)
- Category:Metro stations in Spain to Category:Rapid transit stations in Spain – C2C. feminist (talk) 08:58, 14 January 2018 (UTC)
- Category:Metro stations in South Korea to Category:Rapid transit stations in South Korea – C2C. feminist (talk) 08:57, 14 January 2018 (UTC)
- I am afraid we need a full discussion for metro stations, there is too much mess over there.--Ymblanter (talk) 17:40, 15 January 2018 (UTC)
- @Feminist: do you want to take these to a full discussion, or to withdraw them? --BrownHairedGirl (talk) • (contribs) 15:04, 17 January 2018 (UTC)
- Sure, take them to a discussion if anyone finds them controversial. I do think that a move from "metro" to "rapid transit" makes sense considering the category structure and the fact that Metro is ambiguous. feminist (talk) 15:13, 17 January 2018 (UTC)
- It is just we have for example Category:Moscow Metro stations, whyc should it go to Category:Rapid transit stations in Russia and not Category:Metro stations in Russia? May be it is ok, but I feel we need to discuss this once.--Ymblanter (talk) 15:21, 17 January 2018 (UTC)
- @Feminist: no, I won't take them to a full discussion. You can do so if you like, but not me. I was simply reminding you that now they are opposed, you have 3 options: 1) take em to a full discussion; 2) withdraw; 3) leave them here until they are removed as stale on 22 Jan. --BrownHairedGirl (talk) • (contribs) 17:27, 17 January 2018 (UTC)
- It is just we have for example Category:Moscow Metro stations, whyc should it go to Category:Rapid transit stations in Russia and not Category:Metro stations in Russia? May be it is ok, but I feel we need to discuss this once.--Ymblanter (talk) 15:21, 17 January 2018 (UTC)
- Sure, take them to a discussion if anyone finds them controversial. I do think that a move from "metro" to "rapid transit" makes sense considering the category structure and the fact that Metro is ambiguous. feminist (talk) 15:13, 17 January 2018 (UTC)
- @Feminist: do you want to take these to a full discussion, or to withdraw them? --BrownHairedGirl (talk) • (contribs) 15:04, 17 January 2018 (UTC)
- I am afraid we need a full discussion for metro stations, there is too much mess over there.--Ymblanter (talk) 17:40, 15 January 2018 (UTC)
- Metro stations full discussion at Misplaced Pages:Categories_for_discussion/Log/2018_January_18#Category:Metro_stations_in_South_Korea. --BrownHairedGirl (talk) • (contribs) 13:51, 18 January 2018 (UTC)
- Category:Rio de Janeiro to Category:Rio de Janeiro (city) – C2C: for consistency with all its subcats. This reverses an odd speedy move in Aug 2016, which was proposed by @Od Mishehu and implemented by admin @Number 57.
It was an odd move, because while C2D was the cited reason, C2D does not apply if there is ambiguity (the wording then was "If the page names are controversial or ambiguous in any way, then this criterion does not apply".)
There clearly is ambiguity here, between Category:Rio de Janeiro (city)+subcats and Category:Rio de Janeiro (state) + subcats. Od Mishehu and Number 57 seem to have overlooked the inapplicability of C2D. BrownHairedGirl (talk) • (contribs) 14:46, 7 January 2018 (UTC)- Oppose - the article has remained stable at its current name, Rio de Janeiro, since 2005; this was also the same time frame as Misplaced Pages:Categories for discussion/Log/2016 August 17#Seattle and Misplaced Pages:Categories for discussion/Log/2016 September 6#Major US cities, where the basic consensus is that if a name is unambiguous enough for the article, it's unambiguous enough for the category. עוד מישהו Od Mishehu 15:05, 7 January 2018 (UTC)
- @Od Mishehu: I disagree with that substantive argument, tho I respect that it is a coherent POV.
However, it is an argument which you should have made at a full CfD, because a) C2D did not apply, and b) moving only the one category created an inconsistency between the main category and its subcats, for which I see no justification.
Opposing this reversal of an invalid speedy simply restores the status quo ante, and reverses a procedural error. I assume that the error was made in good faith, so please will you withdraw the objection to reversing it?
You would still of course be free to open a full CfD if you want to (to rename the subcats too) ... but it would not look at all like good faith if you stand by a misapplied speedy. --BrownHairedGirl (talk) • (contribs) 16:03, 7 January 2018 (UTC)- I believed then, and still believe now, that my speedy nomination was correct. Under policy, if you had commented at the time, you could have prevented the rename; and if you had commented shortly after the rename was done, I probably would have accepted your statement and had the rename reverted; however, since you only started to comment now, over a year after the rename, the new name has been established and the burden of establishing consensus is on you. עוד מישהו Od Mishehu 23:39, 7 January 2018 (UTC)
- @Od Mishehu: I disagree with that substantive argument, tho I respect that it is a coherent POV.
- Moved to a full discussion. 17:35, 15 January 2018 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by Black Falcon (talk • contribs)
- Oppose - the article has remained stable at its current name, Rio de Janeiro, since 2005; this was also the same time frame as Misplaced Pages:Categories for discussion/Log/2016 August 17#Seattle and Misplaced Pages:Categories for discussion/Log/2016 September 6#Major US cities, where the basic consensus is that if a name is unambiguous enough for the article, it's unambiguous enough for the category. עוד מישהו Od Mishehu 15:05, 7 January 2018 (UTC)
Ready for deletion
Check Category:Empty categories awaiting deletion for out of process deletions. In some cases, these will need to be nominated for discussion and the editor who emptied the category informed that they should follow the WP:CFD process.
Once the renaming has been completed, copy and paste the listing to the Ready for deletion section of Misplaced Pages:Categories for discussion/Working/Manual.
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