User:Peacekpr: Difference between revisions

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Revision as of 12:20, 22 November 2006 editPeacekpr (talk \| contribs)78 edits correction to user name← Previous edit		Revision as of 22:59, 25 November 2006 edit undoPeacekpr (talk \| contribs)78 edits add note, update sigNext edit →
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	'''3RR (3x to 6x) diffs'''		'''3RR (3x to 6x) diffs'''
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	'''Reasons for suspicions'''		'''Reasons for suspicions'''
			*IPs between the posts below made by Skinny McGee all point to Chardon, Ohio as well.
	*9 November 2006: makes post but forgets to sign in and replies in summary: ‘’“I was trying to add the link to Haunted Attraction in the body of the article as a reference because another editor disputes the use of the phrase 'the standard', but I guess I did it wrong. Sorry!”’’		*9 November 2006: makes post but forgets to sign in and replies in summary: ‘’“I was trying to add the link to Haunted Attraction in the body of the article as a reference because another editor disputes the use of the phrase 'the standard', but I guess I did it wrong. Sorry!”’’
	*The editors arguing over the above mentioned reference were ] and ] on ]		*The editors arguing over the above mentioned reference were ] and ] on ]
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	*] and revert twice in 10 minutes		*] and revert twice in 10 minutes
	*]reverts back to link spam that was reverted by ] but completely alters article as with deceptive edits.		*]reverts back to link spam that was reverted by ] but completely alters article as with deceptive edits.


	'''More past abuse:'''		'''More past abuse:'''
			Further instances of suspected sockpuppetry (also vandalism) for the above include:
	* who removed a post that referenced Nox Arcana (a band that was formed by one of the former members of Midnight Syndicate) , then immediately jumped over to the Midnight Syndicate page to post defamatory comments against Joseph Vargo of Nox Arcana.
	and after it was reverted, he then placed this longer defamatory statement		who removed a post that referenced Nox Arcana (a band that was formed by one of the former members of Midnight Syndicate) , then immediately jumped over to the Midnight Syndicate page to post defamatory comments against Joseph Vargo of Nox Arcana. and after it was reverted, he then placed this longer defamatory statement


	====Further Comments====		====Further Comments====
	It is suspected that ] is actually Edward Douglas (aka ]) editing his own Wiki bio (presumably under one or more of the above names and certainly matching one or more IP). ] keeps referring to a "disgruntled business partner" in his summaries, which lead me to believe that he is personally involved. ] continually removes references, citations and credits to Joseph Vargo, who was a notable producer and member of this band during their formative years (1998-2000). ] also removes notable album credits (changing credits having to do with Vargo's work) and has changed dates in regards to events to make it appear as if Edward Douglas did the work that Vargo was credited with originally (example: removing Vargo's Monolith label info, which actually released 2 of the most successful albums, then claiming that because no label was interested, Edward (alone) distributed the albums). It appears that the remaining member(s) of this band are seeking to now discredit their former producer because he went off and started a new band (Nox Arcana). This theory has been posed by ], ] and ] ] that latter holding a much more senior position at Wiki and states he even interviewed the both bands for his magazine.		It is suspected that ] is actually Edward Douglas (aka ]) editing his own Wiki bio (presumably under one or more of the above names and certainly matching one or more IP). ] keeps referring to a "disgruntled business partner" in his summaries, which lead me to believe that he is personally involved. ] continually removes references, citations and credits to Joseph Vargo, who was a notable producer and member of this band during their formative years (1998-2000). ] also removes notable album credits (changing credits having to do with Vargo's work) and has changed dates in regards to events to make it appear as if Edward Douglas did the work that Vargo was credited with originally (example: removing Vargo's Monolith label info, which actually released 2 of the most successful albums, then claiming that because no label was interested, Edward (alone) distributed the albums). It appears that the remaining member(s) of this band are seeking to now discredit their former producer because he went off and started a new band (Nox Arcana). This theory has been posed by ], ] and ] ] that latter holding a much more senior position at Wiki and states he even interviewed the both bands for his magazine.

	'''Questioning neutrality of ]:''' Dionyseus seems to be biased in this matter. He refused to accept or even discuss any of the valid citations that both Oroboros and GuardianZ placed at the suggestion of ] that things should be cited, yet Dionyseus allowed for ] to alter dates, events, and NOT cite the changes. Dionyseus also posted 3RR warnings and reports about the other editors yet did not warn or report SkinnyMcGee, who made about 6 reverts in 2 hours on several days running. Dionyseus has made NO effort to mediate the discussion but instead assists SkinnyMcGee in reverting additional citations and edits to help avoid 3RR warnings for SkinnyMcGee. ~~Dionyseus is also caught up in his own ].~~		'''Questioning neutrality of ]:''' Dionyseus seems to be biased in this matter. He refused to accept or even discuss any of the valid citations that both Oroboros and GuardianZ placed at the suggestion of ] that things should be cited, yet Dionyseus allowed for ] to alter dates, events, and NOT cite the changes. Dionyseus also posted 3RR warnings and reports about the other editors yet did not warn or report SkinnyMcGee, who made about 6 reverts in 2 hours on several days running. Dionyseus has made NO effort to mediate the discussion but instead assists SkinnyMcGee in reverting additional citations and edits to help avoid 3RR warnings for SkinnyMcGee.

	I also believe that ] did not follow standard procedure and has mistakenly accused two individuals that do NOT have the same IP address. Later, ] blanked a post by ] that indicated he was still logged in when IP ] and ] were blocked, thereby hiding that they were indeed different IPs. ] then blocked both IPs. Meanwhile, the actual sockpuppet abuser was not policed...		I also believe that ] did not follow standard procedure and has mistakenly accused two individuals that do NOT have the same IP address. Later, ] blanked a post by ] that indicated he was still logged in when IP ] and ] were blocked, thereby hiding that they were indeed different IPs. ] then blocked both IPs. Meanwhile, the actual sockpuppet abuser was not policed...

			Adding: Dionyseus' history shows other users have also complained of bias issues. Further comments by Dionyseus ] and ] show an unwillingness to ''calmly'' discuss and reconsider Skinny McGee's addition of sensationlism and undue weight, tending to throw in more jabs at subject of arguement instead of discussing issue at hand. Dionyseus also resorts to assumptions of bad faith and false claims (I did not actually acuse Dionyseus of making a false report on purpose, but a ''mistakenly'' false report). Perhaps ] made the mistake. In any case, each side of the edit war should have been investigated.

	'''In closing:''' Oroboros and GuardianZ have cited true events and credits. And frankly, I don't see what's wrong with crediting a notable past member of a band. We are not here to rewrite history, but to record it. Are we to edit out something just because it isn't what the band wants to promote? NO.		'''In closing:''' Oroboros and GuardianZ have cited true events and credits. And frankly, I don't see what's wrong with crediting a notable past member of a band. We are not here to rewrite history, but to record it. Are we to edit out something just because it isn't what the band wants to promote? NO.
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	I am sure that Oroboros and GuardianZ have become frustrated with the nepotism they have met with (and remember that their cry for help went unanswered due to the Rfc being removed by the opposing party), but they certainly have not made personal attacks, nor is researching and correcting propaganda bad behavior. SkinnyMcGee's repeated reverts surely caused them to just dig deeper into the dispute between the band members. Both Oroboros and GuardianZ have included SkinnyMcGee's material in their own writings, and they have attempted to cite and write in a neutral tone, even presenting two sides of a dispute that is ongoing. They do not discredit anyone else by crediting the past band member for his work and citing valid references. Oroboros has also made other minor contributions to Wiki, and GuardianZ was editing the article long before SkinnyMcGee (unless, of course, SkinnyMcgee was editing previously under one of the other names mentioned above). I think the actions of SkinnyMcGee and other possible sockpuppets certainly helped to escalate the issue. As has contributed nothing at all except links to interviews and deceptive edits to the ] article. I do not agree with SkinnyMcGee's version of the article. I think this just boils down to a band member (Edward Douglas) wanting to claim ALL the credit for the formation and success of the band instead of sharing that credit or allowing his former band mate to receive credit for his own work. It definitely reeks of the propaganda they have been accused of elsewhere (they have also been complained of on for pulling customer reviews and posting reviews from their own promotions team, and have also been accused of abusing the Press to publicize a different history).		I am sure that Oroboros and GuardianZ have become frustrated with the nepotism they have met with (and remember that their cry for help went unanswered due to the Rfc being removed by the opposing party), but they certainly have not made personal attacks, nor is researching and correcting propaganda bad behavior. SkinnyMcGee's repeated reverts surely caused them to just dig deeper into the dispute between the band members. Both Oroboros and GuardianZ have included SkinnyMcGee's material in their own writings, and they have attempted to cite and write in a neutral tone, even presenting two sides of a dispute that is ongoing. They do not discredit anyone else by crediting the past band member for his work and citing valid references. Oroboros has also made other minor contributions to Wiki, and GuardianZ was editing the article long before SkinnyMcGee (unless, of course, SkinnyMcgee was editing previously under one of the other names mentioned above). I think the actions of SkinnyMcGee and other possible sockpuppets certainly helped to escalate the issue. As has contributed nothing at all except links to interviews and deceptive edits to the ] article. I do not agree with SkinnyMcGee's version of the article. I think this just boils down to a band member (Edward Douglas) wanting to claim ALL the credit for the formation and success of the band instead of sharing that credit or allowing his former band mate to receive credit for his own work. It definitely reeks of the propaganda they have been accused of elsewhere (they have also been complained of on for pulling customer reviews and posting reviews from their own promotions team, and have also been accused of abusing the Press to publicize a different history).

	This not only requires an investigation into sockpuppetry but it needs a very attentive investigator who is willing to look at facts, check citations for accuracy and verifiability, be able to recognize the difference between a verifiable source and the band’s new promotional propaganda. Then discuss possible changes in the article and make sure that the changes are neutral and true... or... just Afd the page and protect it from being recreated. I don't really see this edit war ever ending as long as the facts are in question. ] 06:07, 22 November 2006 (UTC)		This not only requires an investigation into sockpuppetry but it needs a very attentive investigator who is willing to look at facts, check citations for accuracy and verifiability, be able to recognize the difference between a verifiable source and the band’s new promotional propaganda. Then discuss possible changes in the article and make sure that the changes are neutral and true... or... just Afd the page and protect it from being recreated. I don't really see this edit war ever ending as long as the facts are in question. ] 22:59, 25 November 2006 (UTC)

Revision as of 22:59, 25 November 2006

Details for Investigation of SkinnyMcGee

Suspected Sockpuppetry, Deceptive Editing and Vandalism: Shows a strong arguement for sockpuppets and deceptive editing on the Midnight_Syndicate article. This is VERY complex, so I hope someone here will look into it in detail.

Suspected Sockpuppets for SkinnyMcGee

Suspected Sockpuppet IPs: The IPs below used for editing this article, to avoid 3RR during which time it was also being reverted by the above names, point to Chardon, Ohio (home city of Midnight_Syndicate the subject of the disputed article Midnight_Syndicate). The city of Chardon is referenced by the Star Beacon (Ashtabula, OH), October 30, 2006, which is a reference that was posted by SkinnyMcGee and shown to be the band’s address on their official website.

3RR (3x to 6x) diffs Latest edits on November 17-18, aside from being 3RR, also show that SkinnyMcGee to be tag-teaming as Pumpkinhead5 to avoid 3RR and that Dionyseus helps SkinnyMcGee in making reverts but does not try to discuss or mediate either.

02:23, 17 November 2006 Skinny McGee
03:21, 17 November 2006 Skinny McGee
04:13, 17 November 2006 Skinny McGee
13:41, 17 November 2006 Pumpkinhead5
21:40, 17 November 2006 Dionyseus
23:20, 18 November 2006 Skinny McGee

Shows SkinnyMcGee to be 67.140.91.34 to avoid 3RR. See "Reasons for suspicions" below.

15:29, 9 November 2006 Skinny McGee
15:49, 9 November 2006 67.140.91.34
23:52, 9 November 2006 Skinny McGee

Shows SkinnyMcGee tag-teaming with various other names and Chardon, Ohio IPs to avoid 3RR. See "Reasons for suspicions" below.

02:00, 1 November 2006 Skinny McGee
02:10, 1 November 2006 67.140.91.34
04:01, 1 November 2006 67.140.91.34
15:00, 1 November 2006 Defender99
19:18, 1 November 2006 Skinny McGee
17:06, 2 November 2006 Skinny McGee

12:27, 20 October 2006 Star525
17:50, 20 October 2006 Indigo1032
23:05, 20 October 2006 67.140.92.106
23:07, 20 October 2006 67.140.92.106
12:38, 21 October 2006 Pumpkinhead5

16:09, 18 October 2006 67.140.80.142
17:42, 18 October 2006 67.140.80.142
19:30, 18 October 2006 67.140.80.142
22:10, 18 October 2006 67.140.80.142
22:11, 18 October 2006 67.140.80.142
22:15, 18 October 2006 67.140.80.142

Reasons for suspicions

IPs between the posts below made by Skinny McGee all point to Chardon, Ohio as well.
9 November 2006: 67.140.91.34 makes post but forgets to sign in and replies in summary: ‘’“I was trying to add the link to Haunted Attraction in the body of the article as a reference because another editor disputes the use of the phrase 'the standard', but I guess I did it wrong. Sorry!”’’
The editors arguing over the above mentioned reference were SkinnyMcGee and GuardianZ on Talk:Midnight_Syndicate
GuardianZ makes edit.
SkinnyMcGee reverts immediately afterwards (with one minute).
67.140.91.34 also removes Rfc requested by GuardianZ to help. No wonder there were never any comments on the page by any other editors!
SkinnyMcGee and 67.140.91.34 revert twice in 10 minutes
SkinnyMcGeereverts back to link spam that was reverted by User:Heligoland but completely alters article as 67.140.91.34 with deceptive edits.

More past abuse: Further instances of suspected sockpuppetry (also vandalism) for the above include: 69.177.28.38 who removed a post that referenced Nox Arcana (a band that was formed by one of the former members of Midnight Syndicate) , then immediately jumped over to the Midnight Syndicate page to post defamatory comments against Joseph Vargo of Nox Arcana. and after it was reverted, he then placed this longer defamatory statement

Further Comments

It is suspected that SkinnyMcGee is actually Edward Douglas (aka User:Midsyndicate) editing his own Wiki bio (presumably under one or more of the above names and certainly matching one or more IP). SkinnyMcGee keeps referring to a "disgruntled business partner" in his summaries, which lead me to believe that he is personally involved. SkinnyMcGee continually removes references, citations and credits to Joseph Vargo, who was a notable producer and member of this band during their formative years (1998-2000). SkinnyMcGee also removes notable album credits (changing credits having to do with Vargo's work) and has changed dates in regards to events to make it appear as if Edward Douglas did the work that Vargo was credited with originally (example: removing Vargo's Monolith label info, which actually released 2 of the most successful albums, then claiming that because no label was interested, Edward (alone) distributed the albums). It appears that the remaining member(s) of this band are seeking to now discredit their former producer because he went off and started a new band (Nox Arcana). This theory has been posed by GuardianZ, Oroboros and Pan (see talk) that latter holding a much more senior position at Wiki and states he even interviewed the both bands for his magazine.

Questioning neutrality of Dionyseus: Dionyseus seems to be biased in this matter. He refused to accept or even discuss any of the valid citations that both Oroboros and GuardianZ placed at the suggestion of Durova that things should be cited, yet Dionyseus allowed for SkinnyMcGee to alter dates, events, and NOT cite the changes. Dionyseus also posted 3RR warnings and reports about the other editors yet did not warn or report SkinnyMcGee, who made about 6 reverts in 2 hours on several days running. Dionyseus has made NO effort to mediate the discussion but instead assists SkinnyMcGee in reverting additional citations and edits to help avoid 3RR warnings for SkinnyMcGee.

I also believe that Dionyseus did not follow standard procedure and has mistakenly accused two individuals that do NOT have the same IP address. Later, Khoikhoi blanked a post by Oroboros that indicated he was still logged in when IP 68.9.37.233 and GuardianZ were blocked, thereby hiding that they were indeed different IPs. Khoikhoi then blocked both IPs. Meanwhile, the actual sockpuppet abuser was not policed...

Adding: Dionyseus' history shows other users have also complained of bias issues. Further comments by Dionyseus 1 and 2 show an unwillingness to calmly discuss and reconsider Skinny McGee's addition of sensationlism and undue weight, tending to throw in more jabs at subject of arguement instead of discussing issue at hand. Dionyseus also resorts to assumptions of bad faith and false claims (I did not actually acuse Dionyseus of making a false report on purpose, but a mistakenly false report). Perhaps Khoikhoi made the mistake. In any case, each side of the edit war should have been investigated.

In closing: Oroboros and GuardianZ have cited true events and credits. And frankly, I don't see what's wrong with crediting a notable past member of a band. We are not here to rewrite history, but to record it. Are we to edit out something just because it isn't what the band wants to promote? NO.

I am sure that Oroboros and GuardianZ have become frustrated with the nepotism they have met with (and remember that their cry for help went unanswered due to the Rfc being removed by the opposing party), but they certainly have not made personal attacks, nor is researching and correcting propaganda bad behavior. SkinnyMcGee's repeated reverts surely caused them to just dig deeper into the dispute between the band members. Both Oroboros and GuardianZ have included SkinnyMcGee's material in their own writings, and they have attempted to cite and write in a neutral tone, even presenting two sides of a dispute that is ongoing. They do not discredit anyone else by crediting the past band member for his work and citing valid references. Oroboros has also made other minor contributions to Wiki, and GuardianZ was editing the article long before SkinnyMcGee (unless, of course, SkinnyMcgee was editing previously under one of the other names mentioned above). I think the actions of SkinnyMcGee and other possible sockpuppets certainly helped to escalate the issue. As SkinnyMcGee SkinnyMcGee has contributed nothing at all except links to interviews and deceptive edits to the Midnight_Syndicate article. I do not agree with SkinnyMcGee's version of the article. I think this just boils down to a band member (Edward Douglas) wanting to claim ALL the credit for the formation and success of the band instead of sharing that credit or allowing his former band mate to receive credit for his own work. It definitely reeks of the propaganda they have been accused of elsewhere (they have also been complained of on Amazon.com for pulling customer reviews and posting reviews from their own promotions team, and have also been accused of abusing the Press to publicize a different history).

This not only requires an investigation into sockpuppetry but it needs a very attentive investigator who is willing to look at facts, check citations for accuracy and verifiability, be able to recognize the difference between a verifiable source and the band’s new promotional propaganda. Then discuss possible changes in the article and make sure that the changes are neutral and true... or... just Afd the page and protect it from being recreated. I don't really see this edit war ever ending as long as the facts are in question. Peacekpr 22:59, 25 November 2006 (UTC)