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Revision as of 16:43, 24 July 2021 editForestFireStarter (talk | contribs)21 editsNo edit summaryTags: Reverted Mobile edit Mobile web edit← Previous edit Revision as of 17:00, 24 July 2021 edit undoJ. M. (talk | contribs)Extended confirmed users, Pending changes reviewers, Rollbackers16,757 edits Reverted 2 edits by ForestFireStarter (talk): Banneed user, block evasionTags: Twinkle UndoNext edit →
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] (]) 07:39, 3 June 2019 (UTC) ] (]) 07:39, 3 June 2019 (UTC)

== User Theonewithreason deconstructive edits ==

The following two paragraphs were left on the user's talk page after they made several reverts under false pretense. Instead of addressing it there they just deleted them with little explanation. So, I will be posting them here instead. Thanks. ForestFireStarter (talk) 02:45, 24 July 2021 (UTC)

Hello, you recently undid my revision of "List of people from Croatia" and you were incorrect in doing so. Nikola Tesla was from Croatia. This is a fact, he was born there and raised there, and his native language was Croatian. You said "not a Croat" when you undid the revision, but this is not a list of Croats, so the ethnicity debate is irrelevant. It is a list of people from Croatia, which is where Nikola Tesla was from. This is an objective fact. I understand your misunderstanding, please do not undo any further similar made revisions. ForestFireStarter (talk) 22:33, 23 July 2021 (UTC)

Hey again, I see you ignored my above message by deleting it and then going ahead to undo my revision again under a false pretense. The reason you provided for this is a Strawman Fallacy. I am completely abiding with WP:OR in the edit I made, as is quite obvious. How about you talk to me about it here instead of deleting everything and undoing edits? I suggest you read my above message again as well as Misplaced Pages:Reverting. Again, explain yourself in a sensible and civilized manner before making anymore deconstructive edits. Thank you. ForestFireStarter (talk) 02:40, 24 July 2021 (UTC)

In the future please leave your remarks here, not on my talk page, because that goes under WP:HARRASMENT, second I did not do any deconstructive edits, if you wish to post Tesla here you need to provide reliable sources and third what you think that is a fact is actually your personal opinion and those opinions have been repeated and repeated for the last 15 years and last the page describes people that are or were Croatian citizens or of Croatian ancestry, Tesla was neither, that is why I removed your edits. Theonewithreason (talk) 24 July 2021 (UTC) ] (]) 16:38, 24 July 2021 (UTC)

Added this back because it was removed for false reasons. I am being accused by user J. M. as being a vandal. This is my first Misplaced Pages account, I'm a new editor. I'm sure you can check my history and see that my intent has always been to talk things out and not get into pointless edit wars, as happened with the MP3 thing, which I realized and admitted I was wrong after it was explained to me. I forgot to thank you for explaining yourself here, Theonewithreason, and I'm quite sorry for bothering you. I think what this J. M. is doing to me goes under WP:HARASSMENT as well. J. M., can we please talk this out? ] (]) 16:43, 24 July 2021 (UTC)

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Criteria

Currently, "List of Croats" is defined in the lead as:

"list of prominent individuals who were Croatian citizens or of Croatian ancestry."

While "prominent" may be presumed to imply the WP:LISTPEOPLE criterion, this definition is not entirely unambiguous, and may be also problematic in some respects. Here are some questions that need to be answered:

  1. Do we want to include "Croatian citizens" or just ethnic Croats? (E.g. Nikola Tesla meets the former criterion, but not the latter.) There are arguments in favor of both options.
  2. Do we construe "Croatian citizens" broadly as not only people who are or were citizens of the Republic of Croatia (1991-present), but also all people who lived and were associated with the same territory? Again, Tesla was strictly speaking never a Croatian citizen, but could be reasonably considered one "retroactively".
  3. "Croatian ancestry" presumably means "] ancestry", but it is fairly clear that "person of Croatian ancestry"<>"Croat". Are all n-th generation Croats still Croats? Where do we draw the line? GregorB (talk) 14:34, 23 August 2012 (UTC)

Split. List of Croats (ethnic Croats) ≠ List of Croatians (nationality).--Zoupan 14:44, 21 April 2015 (UTC)

Male or Female

Hi Folks, I have a suggestion that affects the entire list. Given that that the non-Croat (or non-slavic at least) world may not be familiar with Croat names, what do you think of adding a (M) or (F) after each name? I'm half Croatian and grew up with a fair amount of influence from the Northern California Croat community, but even names like Ignjat and Vanja stumped me.--Scalhotrod - Just your average banjo playing, drag racing, cowboy... (talk) 16:18, 3 January 2013 (UTC)

Inferiority complex

While reading the history of changes of this article I've 'learned' that Leonardo, Michelangello, Napoleon, Brigitte Bardot, Charlie Chaplin ... were Croats. I know there are many editors suffering from the inferiority complex which can be an explanation why all these 'were' Croats. I tried to clean the list removing the names which cannot be put on this list(Schwarz - an Austrian Jew, Boscovic - an Italian, Andric - a Serb). Alas, I see the same name back in the list .

A sense of personal inferiority arising from conflict between the desire to be noticed and the fear of being humiliated. In psychology, a complex, or cluster of repressed fears, described by Alfred Adler based on physical inferiority. The term is popularly used to describe general feelings of inferiority and the overcompensation that often ensues. Adler described the complex as arising from the perceived inferiority of an organ or part of the body and leading to feelings of general inferiority. He believed that everyone suffered from inferiority feelings and that the desire or determination to relieve them determined people's behavior. Failure to deal with them could lead to neurotic symptoms.

--72.66.12.17 (talk) 19:59, 1 November 2015 (UTC)

Ivo Andric

His mother was a Serbian, he refused to be listed as a Croatian in Yugoslav Encyclopedia. Please, respect his identity.--72.66.12.17 (talk) 23:16, 29 November 2015 (UTC)

External links modified

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Malkovich Croat?

Read the answer here Do danas ne znam jesam li Hrvat, Crnogorac ili Bosanac (Up to today, I do not know whether I am Croat, Montenegrin, or Bosnian)

Kada je prvi put u nekim novinama napisano da sam hrvatskog podrijetla, majka mi je rekla da potječemo iz Crne Gore, za što do tada također nisam čuo--109.92.171.142 (talk) 06:33, 12 October 2017 (UTC)

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External links modified

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Requested move 21 July 2018

The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the move request was: moved as requested per the discussion below. Dekimasuよ! 02:05, 29 July 2018 (UTC)

List of Croatians → List of people from Croatia – Per WP:NOR, WP:NPOV, and WP:COATRACK, we cannot commingle "people from Croatia" and "people with some Croatian ancestry"; the latter isn't an encyclopedic classification anyway. Talk pages of articles with ambiguous titles like this show a lot of dispute about inclusion, and it's caused by an impermissibly confused scope and a misleading title. This should move for WP:CONSISTENCY with almost all of the rest of our "people from X" articles and categories. The remaining "List of Labels" and "List of Label people" pages are being taken one RM at a time, since they vary between labels that are ethnic, national/regional, or both, on a case-by-case basis. The scope will need cleanup; it is presently explicitly mixing people from Croatia and people who are not from there but identify as of Croatian heritage (what about 1/4 Croatian? 1/16? On the basis of what sources?). The latter is just not an encyclopedic criterion at all and is inevitably going to lead to OR and PoV. At this article it already has, and it's been tagged as problematic in this regard since 2009. Time to just fix it.  — SMcCandlish ☏ ¢ 😼  04:11, 21 July 2018 (UTC)

  • Support per above and my reasoning at the move request at Talk:List of people from Sardinia. Vaselineeeeeeee 04:19, 21 July 2018 (UTC)
  • Comment. If I understand correctly, e.g. Nikola Tesla would be in scope of "List of people from Croatia"? I'd still slightly prefer the earlier name, "List of Croats" (the article was apparently stealthily renamed a while ago for whatever reason), although my gripe with it was that it never clearly defined the scope of the list (i.e. who is a "Croat"), and was therefore messy and pointless. GregorB (talk) 13:23, 24 July 2018 (UTC)
    Tesla would still qualify, since he was born there. Also qualifies for American lists as a permanent resident and naturalized citizen. Would also qualify for a list of ethnic Serbs, if we wanted such a thing. "List of Croats" has all the problems of "List of Croatians". It's going to be confused a mixture of people who live in Croatia and people with some degree of Croatian ancestry but who have never set foot there.  — SMcCandlish ☏ ¢ 😼  13:17, 25 July 2018 (UTC)
  • Support per nom. As I said, while I still feel "List of Croats" would be ideal, in the real world it devolved into an unfixable mess. (It might have worked as a list of people who self-identified as Croats, because it would be easier to get rid of all those nonsense entries, but "self-identified" would inevitably lead into another set of problems, chiefly with sourcing.) The new scope may not necessarily provide an easy way out, but I suppose it's still better than the alternatives. IMO, confusion with regard to the new scope is much less likely, but still possible (what precisely does it mean to be "from Croatia"?). However, these things can be stipulated later. GregorB (talk) 13:57, 25 July 2018 (UTC)
The above discussion is preserved as an archive of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page or in a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

unnecessary and redundant marks.

- Some people in the list are marked as "Jewish". I don't see how mentioning peoples religion would improve the list. I suggest removing the mark. - Most people in the category "Architecture" are marked as "architect". This seems preety redundant to me.

62.146.75.212 (talk) 07:39, 3 June 2019 (UTC)

Categories: