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15.ai

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15.ai (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View log | edits since nomination)

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This is an anonymous creator's unfinished project at a dead website, where they collected all of the My Little Pony videos and ran them through open source voice cloning software. Their grandiose view of their own project doesn't mean that it's notable. This article is 49% original research, and 49% content that needs to be moved to the Audio_deepfake article, since it's so generalized. I'm very impressed at boundless energy this particular group of editors has towards curating this article, considering the topic. It ultimately doesn't belong on Misplaced Pages though. Habanero-tan (talk) 00:48, 16 January 2023 (UTC)

• Automated comment: This AfD was not correctly transcluded to the log (step 3). I have transcluded it to Misplaced Pages:Articles for deletion/Log/2023 January 16. —_{Talk to my owner:Online} 01:04, 16 January 2023 (UTC)

• Delete Other than the IGN article and the Arxiv pre-prints, the rest aren't reliable as sources. I don't find any RS discussions we could use. Oaktree b (talk) 01:25, 16 January 2023 (UTC)
• Keep Extremely important as it's one example of the first TTS voice generators and neural networks. I do not see why this is considered for deletion and it's currently under maintenance. There is also plenty of high quality citations. (talk) 05:16, 16 January 2023 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by Bloodclotboy12 (talk • contribs)

  "one example of the first TTS voice generators and neural networks"

  That is an extremely false claim, and I am sorry if this Patreon project mislead you into donating based on that. The 15.ai project was begun in 2020 as a labeled training set of My Little Pony clips. The project uses publically available TTS & neural network software. For the actual history of neural network TTS, which 15.ai has nothing to do with, see:

  - https://en.wikipedia.org/WaveNet#History

  - https://en.wikipedia.org/Speech_synthesis#History

  - https://en.wikipedia.org/Neural_network#History

  Habanero-tan (talk) 21:47, 21 January 2023 (UTC)

  At this point I have to assume you are doing this out of malice. You are, once again, regurgitating the same falsehood that others have called you out for: The project uses publically available TTS & neural network software, when this is clearly not the case, and are now actively trying to (and I don't use this term lightly) lie your way through this. Could an admin please do something about this? This is extremely concerning. Tacotron2 (talk) 23:28, 21 January 2023 (UTC)

• Note: This discussion has been included in the deletion sorting lists for the following topics: Computing and Websites. –LaundryPizza03 (dc̄) 05:28, 16 January 2023 (UTC)
• Delete, how the hell did this become a GA? LilianaUwU 13:27, 17 January 2023 (UTC)
• Delete, although context from this article could probably make more general adjacent articles (such as Deepfake) into a GA article. Iazyges Consermonor Opus meum 14:22, 18 January 2023 (UTC)

• Strong Keep. As one of the primary editors of the article in the past (now mostly inactive due to real-life things), the article from several months ago was most certainly up to GA standards. However, this article has constantly been plagued by anonymous editors and new users making unsubstantiated edits ever since the article was first created. I have since reverted the article back to what it was back in November. As for notability, the subjects absolutely meets the requisite standards, and as pointed above, was extremely crucial in the development of TTS voice generation. I apologize for being inactive as an editor for so long, but I did not expect the level of vandalism to reach this high, causing concern for the legitimacy of this article. —HackerKnownAs (talk) 19:36, 18 January 2023 (UTC)

• • I have since requested a higher level of protection for the article. The last request was accepted and lasted for a month, but it appears that this was not nearly strong enough. —HackerKnownAs (talk) 19:36, 18 January 2023 (UTC)

• Keep The guy who runs the site goes on hiatus like every other month for improvements, this isn't anything new. Page was still up the last time it went under maintenance. — Preceding unsigned comment added by AveTrueToCaesar (talk • contribs) 20:11, 18 January 2023 (UTC)

• Keep, articles like NovelAI and character.ai, which have far fewer reliable sources, are allowed to stay but somehow THIS gets nominated for deletion? Seriously? 63.139.68.87 (talk) 22:59, 18 January 2023 (UTC)

  The OP's claims are so replete with falsehoods and misinformation that it suggests to me that this AfD nomination was not made in good faith. The first two sentences are completely wrong—the project is not "unfinished" but rather constantly improving, the website is not "dead," the creator did not collect "My Little Pony videos," the voice cloning software is not "open source"—that I suspect that this was done fully on purpose. —HackerKnownAs (talk) 23:58, 18 January 2023 (UTC)

• Keep It appears that the article has become somewhat bloated with both marginal content and marginal sources, and could do with a good spring cleaning. However, basic notability is not in question - these four mainstream game magazine articles already form a sufficient backbone for that. --Elmidae (talk · contribs) 14:37, 19 January 2023 (UTC)
• Keep Speedy keep. I'd like to point out: 1. almost everything stated in the OP is incorrect and the website isn't dead, as it's currently under maintenance (only for three months, mind you - hardly considered "dead"); and 2. WP:DEGRADE. This project's possibly the single most widely recognizable modern TTS project on the Internet (yes, even more recognizable than my namesake), and taking into consideration the inordinately numerous IP edit problem this article has always had, it's rash and unreasonable to judge the notability and quality of an article from these overzealous editors. I was most active in contributing to this article back in June of last year, so while I'm disappointed and rather annoyed by the sheer number of gung-ho editors who have no standards for quality control making all of these unsolicited edits, let me assure you that the article definitely did (and still does) exceed the notability and quality standards of Misplaced Pages. There are numerous secondary sources from reliable outlets like Game Informer, Polygon, IGN, and Kotaku, which are all listed under WP:RS.

>This is an anonymous creator's unfinished project at a dead website, where they collected all of the My Little Pony videos and ran them through open source voice cloning software. Their grandiose view of their own project doesn't mean that it's notable.

That's a very gross misrepresentation of just how significant the project was in the history of TTS research and I would advise editors to not take what is written in the OP at face value. I'm disappointed not only because such a blatant misrepresentation is being used to justify the deletion of this article, but also because some editors seem to have bought into OP's misleading and objectively false statements without checking them. Tacotron2 (talk) 17:50, 19 January 2023 (UTC)

I wasn't aware that WP:SK was an option when I made the above post, so I've upgraded my recommendation to that now (for the reasons listed in #1 and #3 of WP:SK). Sorry, I'm new to this. Tacotron2 (talk) 18:22, 19 January 2023 (UTC)

"how significant the project was in the history of TTS research"

I see the My Little Pony fandom is now glomming onto this AFD, after the initial string of Deletes. First of all, welcome. Regarding your core claim - since 15.ai is ultimately an Audio deepfake implementation (or as you're calling it, TTS, even though that's a much older technology) - why do 0 of the 52 references at Audio deepfake make any mention at all of 15.ai? Seems odd. I hope non-biased editors can judge for themselves which side of this discussion is doing the lying. But, most likely the only new comments here from here out will be from the MLP Fandom, as the string of Deletes came from folks visiting via the daily AFD log. I have nothing against My Little Pony or this deepfake dubbing project, I only take issue with articles full of false claims, original research, and unrelated citations that belong in a different article. Habanero-tan (talk) 22:10, 21 January 2023 (UTC)

What makes you think that I or any of the other commenters are from the My Little Pony fandom? (I'm not.) If you check my previous edits, it should've been obvious that I'm an actual deep learning engineer, as the vast majority of my edits are of deep learning articles (not to mention my username) and the only tangentially MLP-related article in my edit history is this very one (and I only contributed to the technical side of the article, not the fandom side of the article). It's extremely disingenuous of you to try and blame this backlash on brigading when 1. there is no evidence of such brigading happening at all (and the burden of proof is on you), and 2. your initial nomination was full of falsehoods that you still haven't acknowledged and are trying to brush under the carpet.

For example, as pointed out above: Why would you claim that the project is dead? Why would you claim that the project was run through open source cloning software? Why would you claim that the creator collected all of the My Little Pony videos, and why would you insinuate that the MLP aspect of the project is most paramount compared to the actual technology behind the project?

The reason I will continue supporting a speedy keep is due to WP:EARLY: The fifth bullet point states, Nominations which are so erroneous that they indicate that the nominator has not even read the article in question., which to me is obviously the case from the falsehoods mentioned above. The fact that you seem to be ignoring editors calling you out and instead are blaming these grievances on an entire fandom is truly telling. Tacotron2 (talk) 23:03, 21 January 2023 (UTC)

Again, I'm new to the AfD process, but the OP's accusation of brigading does not sit well with me. Could an admin clarify whether this is allowed or not? Tacotron2 (talk) 23:07, 21 January 2023 (UTC)

>or as you're calling it, TTS, even though that's a much older technology

As an ML engineer, I cannot even begin to explain how incorrect you are. Look up any "audio deepfake" implementation paper/repo, and I guarantee that you will see the term TTS being used in the title or description. I mean no offense, but claiming something like this shows just how blatantly ignorant you are of this topic. Here are three examples off the top of my head:

Tacotron2: https://arxiv.org/pdf/1712.05884.pdf

Glow-TTS: https://arxiv.org/pdf/2005.11129.pdf

Transformer-TTS: https://arxiv.org/pdf/1809.08895.pdf Tacotron2 (talk) 23:21, 21 January 2023 (UTC)

No. TTS stands for Text to Speech. It just means speech synthesis. It's not a specific implementation or technique. If you read the comment being directly replied to, it calls 15.ai "the first TTS". TTS is much older than that. Habanero-tan (talk) 02:37, 22 January 2023 (UTC)

What in the world are you talking about? You need to re-read the comment you directly replied to, because I never stated anything of the sort. I'm using the term "TTS" as it's commonly used in the field of ML-based TTS research. You were the one who claimed that 15.ai is not a TTS, when it by definition is. Tacotron2 (talk) 05:11, 22 January 2023 (UTC)

Administrator note Going to draw a line here, y'all. Saying the nominator is wrong is allowed. Arguing with passion that the nominator is wrong is allowed (although maybe not always the best idea). But personal attacks are not allowed, and further ones, by anyone, will be met with blocks from editing. -- Tamzin (she|they|xe) 23:49, 21 January 2023 (UTC)
The following discussion has been closed. Please do not modify it.
Strong Keep and ban Habanero-tan Every single claim this user has made about the project is blatantly false, and it's equally obvious that nominating it for deletion was an act of malice. Kyle horse (talk) 20:18, 20 January 2023 (UTC) This AFD was submitted out of a love for Misplaced Pages. I have zero malice towards the My Little Pony fandom. What I don't like is seeing articles made up entirely of WP:OR, WP:REL, & WP:RS violations. Full disclosure I have been working full time as a Deep Learning researcher since 2018, which includes TTS deepfakes, which is why I took such an astounded interest in this article's many unproven claims of significance. Habanero-tan (talk) 22:24, 21 January 2023 (UTC) Yeah you're very obviously just concern trolling. You have offered no proof for your claims, and you can't because you made them up. Get a life mate 2A02:A442:581E:1:7004:8562:4C6D:34B5 (talk) 23:01, 21 January 2023 (UTC)

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