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Revision as of 02:25, 10 June 2023editundoGaur brahmin (talk | contribs)25 edits /* Rajput is not a real Kshatriya, it is a mixture of many castes, Harsh Vardhan was told by a Chinese traveler himself from a Vaishya Baniya caste, and then some Rajputs were also made from Shudras like Kachchwah Mori solankis chandels tomars and then some Rajputs were made from Brahmins like Guhil pratihars chauhans etc. Rathores are made of Dravid creeds like Rashtrakutas and some Rajputs are made of castes like Huns kushana who are found in Potohar pakistan. Some Rajputs are also mixed wi...Tags: Mobile edit Mobile web edit New topicNext edit →
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:There must be a reason, nothing is arbitrary here! This article is protected in order to prevent vandalism and/or disruptive editing! You may request for the changes (you suggest) here; someone having access will check and do the needful and/or respond here! Thanks. ] (]) 08:04, 4 June 2023 (UTC)
:There must be a reason, nothing is arbitrary here! This article is protected in order to prevent vandalism and/or disruptive editing! You may request for the changes (you suggest) here; someone having access will check and do the needful and/or respond here! Thanks. ] (]) 08:04, 4 June 2023 (UTC)
== Rajput is not a real Kshatriya, it is a mixture of many castes, Harsh Vardhan was told by a Chinese traveler himself from a Vaishya Baniya caste, and then some Rajputs were also made from Shudras like Kachchwah Mori solankis chandels tomars and then some Rajputs were made from Brahmins like Guhil pratihars chauhans etc. Rathores are made of Dravid creeds like Rashtrakutas and some Rajputs are made of castes like Huns kushana who are found in Potohar pakistan. Some Rajputs are also mixed with some Afghans tribes, they have nothing to do with Kshatriya Varna, they emerged as a strong union in the medieval period and then Got their history written with their own so called historians ==
Raja putra sons of kings ] (]) 02:25, 10 June 2023 (UTC)
Revision as of 02:25, 10 June 2023
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Origin of Rajputs and Western Southern India
Many Rajputs originated from South India, such as the Rathor Rashtrakutas, Solanki Chalukyas, and Rajputs such as the Guhil Chauhans originated from southern Rajasthan, the Gurjara Pratiharas and Parmar Rajputs also originated from southern Rajasthan, who later fought the Turks. After reaching Khyber and Potohar, some Rajputs mixed up with Indo Hunnic people (due to marriage relations with Indo Hunnic women) 103.206.177.49 (talk) 06:42, 17 January 2023 (UTC)
Raja putra
Only the son of the king was called Rajputra, it was just a title which became more common in the medieval period, kings came from every caste like Chola, Vaishya, Ahir, Brahmin, Gujar, etc. From and all of these sons will be called Rajputras! This is not a caste, it was just a title, the Kshatriya character was created by Brahmins, they have written the Hindu Kshatriya Gods. राजा वीर (talk) 13:15, 25 April 2023 (UTC)
What is the source???
What is the source that Recent research suggests that the Rajputs came from a variety of ethnic and geographical backgrounds and various varnas. Tanuja Kothiyal states: "In the colonial ethnographic accounts rather than referring to Rajputs as having emerged from other communities, Bhils, Mers, Minas, Gujars, Jats, Raikas, all lay a claim to a Rajput past from where they claim to have 'fallen'. Historical processes, however, suggest just the opposite". Xyzaksingh (talk) 02:50, 13 May 2023 (UTC)
Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 15 May 2023
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Ekdalian and LukeEmily, would you please elaborate your objections for using K.S Singh's work as a source here? Till now, I considered him among the most reliable scholars for caste pages as evident from the fact that his works have been cited in a lot of caste pages without any objections. His works like The Scheduled Tribes , The Scheduled Castes and India's communities have been published by the Oxford University Press. Reading about his works on Rajputs, I can safely say that he has done an in-depth research on primary sources related to the group and his works can prove to be very beneficial for the article. For example, he is the one who informs us that the very first reference to the term rajput comes in Vidyapati's keertilata (source).
@Luke, it might be convenient for you to ask me to find "better sources" but its not essential that the works published in Oxford and Cambridge covers everything about the group. At some point, we have to refer Indian sources. In your edit summary, you have said that he is not suited for "contradictory issues". May I know what is contradictory here in his statement that both rajput and rajputra have been used in medieval text interchangeably? Please do let us know which modern scholars have contested this simple fact. In your edit summary, you have come up with your usual WP:OR saying Rajputra means prince while Rajput means soldier. Our page itself says that Rajputra is used for nobles numerous times in early medieval era (eg Lichhavi inscriptions and works from Kalidasa, Banabhatta and Asvaghosha.) Also, in Bakhshali manuscript, it has been used for mercenary soldier. Rajatarangini and Varna Ratnakara discuss the Rajputra clan structure without using the term Rajput. Here, Irfan Habib concludes that a Rajputra caste had been formed before 13th century. So no, rajputra doesn't differ from rajput in definition and they have been used interchangeably in medieval text. Please stop creating an artificial rivalry between rajputra and rajput through your OR as both are one and same thing per scholars. Dympies (talk) 18:16, 29 May 2023 (UTC)
They have objected to his The People of India to be precise. The statement in question doesn't seem to be problematic as explained above. There have been no contradictions from other writers over it. If we go on treat him this way, we will end up losing a lot of informative stuff from caste articles.Dympies (talk) 19:04, 29 May 2023 (UTC)
You should respect the consensus, no experienced editor would accept it as a reliable source. And obviously, you can't be selective here; your logic hardly makes sense. Why can't you find reliable sources for your POV? Thanks! Ekdalian (talk) 07:05, 30 May 2023 (UTC)
I am not being selective, its the other way round. I don't see any consensus on writer as such. Sitush raised his concern over a book named The People of India. Over this, we can't term a writer of Singh's stature as "unreliable" and start rejecting all his works. Dympies (talk) 15:40, 30 May 2023 (UTC)
No, sorry; Singh is considered as unreliable! Period. Please look for reliable sources, there's no point wasting time on the source rejected by the community. Thanks! Ekdalian (talk) 17:24, 30 May 2023 (UTC)
@Dympies and Ekdalian: As per Sitush, the Oxford University Press version is reliable but the Popular press publication is not. I have added Sitush's 2019 quote here: User:LukeEmily/reference. As Sitush said, Singh's first series was plagiarized. That does not put Singh in a postive light IMHO. Singh was simply the editor of the reliable(national) series. Dympies, I understand that you have used the reliable series (not "People of India"). As I said in the summary, multiple modern scholars contradict Singh. And for the reasons that Ekdalian rightly stated, he is not considered very high quality. Also, Singh is an anthropological survey and is good for customs etc(so and so caste have a marriage ceremony that lasts X days etc or so and so caste are vegetarians etc). He is also useful when high quality sources are not available. There is a surplus amount of modern academic material on Rajputs. An adminstrative official, who edits a survey on all castes in India is no match for modern academic scholars who have studied Rajputs and literature mentioning them. Singhs' source more like tertiary source in that regard. It would be like keeping Encyclopaedia Britannica at the same level as work by Norman P. Ziegler although both are reliable. The contradiction is that Rajput and Rajputra are not the same. Nor are they used in literature interchangeably as the literature itself shows. There are specific examples given with different meanings by scholars in the article itself. Is horse-soldier/trooper same as a Prince(Rajputra)? How can a wikipedia article contradict itself using a fringe opinion from a tertiary-like source when opposite opinions are given by scholars? LukeEmily (talk) 02:32, 8 June 2023 (UTC)
LukeEmily, I understand your concern but you said in edit summary that its a contradictory thing. I haven't come across modern scholars who contradicted that rajputra and rajput were used interchangeably. But it would have been better had he specifically mentioned the period ie late medieval period. Anyways, I am not going to add it now. Dympies (talk) 02:39, 8 June 2023 (UTC)
Unable to edit this article
I was going to add a wikilink to this article but was unable to do so because it appears to be locked from editing. Please fix this ridiculous situation! 173.88.246.138 (talk) 22:50, 3 June 2023 (UTC)
There must be a reason, nothing is arbitrary here! This article is protected in order to prevent vandalism and/or disruptive editing! You may request for the changes (you suggest) here; someone having access will check and do the needful and/or respond here! Thanks. Ekdalian (talk) 08:04, 4 June 2023 (UTC)
Rajput is not a real Kshatriya, it is a mixture of many castes, Harsh Vardhan was told by a Chinese traveler himself from a Vaishya Baniya caste, and then some Rajputs were also made from Shudras like Kachchwah Mori solankis chandels tomars and then some Rajputs were made from Brahmins like Guhil pratihars chauhans etc. Rathores are made of Dravid creeds like Rashtrakutas and some Rajputs are made of castes like Huns kushana who are found in Potohar pakistan. Some Rajputs are also mixed with some Afghans tribes, they have nothing to do with Kshatriya Varna, they emerged as a strong union in the medieval period and then Got their history written with their own so called historians
Referencing and citation: criterion not met
Coverage and accuracy: criterion met
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Not done: it's not clear what changes you want to be made. Please mention the specific changes in a "change X to Y" format and provide a reliable source if appropriate. DreamRimmer (talk) 12:16, 15 May 2023 (UTC)