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Welcome Back!

Ekdalian has given you a brownie! Brownies promote WikiLove and hopefully this one has made your day better. Spread the WikiLove by giving someone else a brownie, whether it be someone you have had disagreements with in the past or a good friend. Hope you had a great holiday!

Ekdalian (talk) 13:36, 12 July 2023 (UTC)

Delicious! Well worth coming back for. Thank you, Ekdalian. Bishonen | tålk 15:45, 12 July 2023 (UTC).

July music

July songs

my story today

My flowers of resilience. - Great music (in June, I'm behind: three great RMF concerts)! - Last Saturday, a friend played for us at her birthday party, on four instruments including baryton, with family (granddaughters!) and colleagues, from Renaissance to Haydn. - My story today is very personal: the DYK appeared on Misplaced Pages's 15th birthday, and describes a concert I sang. I was requested to translate the bio into German for a memorial concert ... - see background, and we talked about life and death. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 16:11, 12 July 2023 (UTC)

Thank you, Gerda. Bishonen | tålk 20:04, 12 July 2023 (UTC).

more? fireworks on the Rhine pictured on 1 July, but the real stars were sun and moon. I love today's story. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 21:52, 15 July 2023 (UTC)

On today's Main page, you can find a cantata that Bach first performed 300 years ago, and an iconic saxophonist from East Germany. - A bit of QAI history on my talk, Br'er, RexxS and more. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 20:52, 18 July 2023 (UTC)

While today's DYK highlights Santiago on his day, I did my modest share with my story today, describing what I just experienced, pictured. I began the article of the woman in green. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 15:09, 25 July 2023 (UTC)

Today Jahrhundertring, and I'm listening to Götterdämmerung from the Bayreuth Festival, close to the scene pictured, - the image (of a woman who can't believe what she has to see) features also on the article talk. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 18:56, 31 July 2023 (UTC)

Great, Gerda. I do appreciate it. Bishonen | tålk 20:08, 31 July 2023 (UTC).

Email

Thanks & Regards. Ekdalian (talk) 07:47, 17 July 2023 (UTC)

I've replied. Bishonen | tålk 09:27, 17 July 2023 (UTC).

Thanks a lot. Regards. Ekdalian (talk) 11:14, 17 July 2023 (UTC)

The sock has finally been blocked! Thanks. Ekdalian (talk) 11:20, 19 July 2023 (UTC)

User Varoon

Hey Bishonen, check Seewoosagur Ramgoolam. I studied the Indian Express newspaper source and edited that article on the basis of that. But that particular user is continuously reverting my edits saying that Indian classification are not relevant in Mauritius. I think WP: STICKTOSOURCE applies there. I was about to take that user to WP:ANI, but on their talkpage, I saw numerous messages of previous such reportings of that user by different editors. So, i chose to inform you.This will save our time.-Admantine123 (talk) 08:10, 17 July 2023 (UTC)

Talk:Seewoosagur Ramgoolam was last edited on 15 December 2021. Johnuniq (talk) 09:25, 17 July 2023 (UTC)

Good point, Johnuniq. Yes, Admantine123, please use the talkpage. Bishonen | tålk 09:31, 17 July 2023 (UTC).

It's not content dispute, it's clear vandalism. The source explicitly say something, but he is putting something else, as per his own opinion. A third uninvolved editor may verify this.-Admantine123 (talk) 10:35, 17 July 2023 (UTC)

Even if you are correct, the other editor presumably thinks the edits are good (see WP:AGF which is a policy we are required to follow). A calm and clear explanation on article talk will clarify the situation for other editors. Johnuniq (talk) 10:59, 17 July 2023 (UTC)

I have initiated a discussion on talk page of that article. But, I am sure that this is the case of WP:CIR. Let's see, what they say.-Admantine123 (talk) 11:39, 17 July 2023 (UTC)

They've continued edit warring without responding on talk, Admantine123. I've warned. Bishonen | tålk 17:10, 19 July 2023 (UTC).

Thanks Bishonen, this is a WP:CIR issue. They are not providing any source and reverting the sourced content as per their preference. I can't see your warning on their talk page btw. Please, also note the recent messages on their talk page, they all are about this particular user not sticking to source and edit warring on several other articles. -Admantine123 (talk) 17:12, 19 July 2023 (UTC)

Wow, looks like I forgot to save. Good job you told me. Bishonen | tålk 18:54, 19 July 2023 (UTC).

To be fair

I have actually seen some unironic nazis / conspiracists claim that there is a Jewish / non white agenda to cause global warming. It's quite amusing tbh! GeneralHamster (talk) 13:22, 19 July 2023 (UTC)

OK. I don't think it goes in the article essay, though. Definitely not without a reliable source. Bishonen | tålk 17:03, 19 July 2023 (UTC).

Admin action review

I have asked for a review of your recent action at Misplaced Pages:Administrative action review#Unblock of Tony1 by Bishonen. Sandstein 10:48, 20 July 2023 (UTC)

Advice

Hi Bishonen, awhile back I saw that you tried to deal with some issues with Gtoffoletto (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · logs · filter log · block user · block log). Not asking for action on your part since it looks like you dealt with plenty there, just advice from someone familiar with them. It seems like a lot of the badgering, etc. has transferred over to the GMO periphery over at Environmental Working Group, a fringe organization in the subject. There's a bit of that going on at the last few talk sections at Talk:Environmental_Working_Group where they haven't been getting traction with edits (mostly due to MEDRS issues or WP:SYNTH), they don't address those issues, and just reinsert slightly changed text while accusing others of stonewalling. There's a bit of a cycle now where they've denied knowing what other editors are talking about, editors linking back to the very talk or edit summaries explaining those issues, and overall refusal to get the point that's made following anything from an outside perspective difficult. That or messing around with editors comments on talk pages Constant just seems to be the word to best describe all this.

Since you dealt with similar issues from them (and they've accumulated a block log for this kind of stuff since you initially interacted with them), I was wondering if you had any advice on how to proceed with addressing the behavior side of this editor? It's been a headache having to repeat things so much that I honestly don't look forward to trying to sort out all the underlying behavior issues at admin boards. It's just been a mess trying to give them pathways to get consensus on the talk page for something only for them to lash out with stuff like this or barrel ahead with edits anyways. Thanks for any advice. KoA (talk) 20:00, 20 July 2023 (UTC)

EWG is a notable environmental activism group. For example, they publish a popular list of “safe” sunscreens. I think it is an error to characterize this group as “fringe”. Jehochman 13:43, 21 July 2023 (UTC)

Jaguar padding by ... Not to go all tangent-y here, but at least one highly reputable organization considers that list of "safe" sunscreens to be...suspect. JoJo Anthrax (talk) 14:12, 21 July 2023 (UTC)

Yeah, but suspect is not fringe. There is a lot of room for scientific disagreement. The EWG list is based on an objective criteria: does or does not have some chemicals. There may be dispute about whether those chemicals are unsafe or not. No doubt the manufacturers think they are safe, as well as their consulting experts and groups who they sponsor. Jehochman 18:21, 25 July 2023 (UTC)

Request for protecting the article on Mahishya

Hi Bishonen.. almost all such caste articles are protected (in fact, mostly ECP), I am not sure why Mahishya is an exception! Would request you to take care of the user RohitSenapati55 as well, who is edit warring in spite of all warnings! Thanks & Regards. Ekdalian (talk) 07:34, 24 July 2023 (UTC)

Absolutely, Ekdalian. Thank you. Bishonen | tålk 07:44, 24 July 2023 (UTC).

Thanks a lot for your prompt action! Regards. Ekdalian (talk) 07:49, 24 July 2023 (UTC)

Tendentious editing by Nobita's associate

Hi Bishonen.. user CharlesWain has been following my edits for quite some time, reverting my edits wherever possible on some ground or the other! Latest examples are 1, 2 (supporting the master of socks, Nobita here), 3, etc. You might remember user DearDebasish, you had earlier blocked & unblocked this user, finally warned him for edit warring, and the user has changed their original name, DearDebasish!

I have always felt that this user doesn't edit neutrally as far as Bengali Kayastha / related articles are concerned, but couldn't confirm the same! One fine morning, when I checked Bengali Misplaced Pages, I found that all the socks/blocked users here including Nobita456 were pretty much active there doing exactly what we prevented them from doing in English Misplaced Pages! I had posted here at that time, so you may be aware that I fought against those users, Nobita was blocked in Bengali Misplaced Pages after I initiated an SPI, and finally managed to convince their admins that we should replace the poor versions of these sensitive caste articles by the translation of their respective articles from English Misplaced Pages.

Coming to the point, I was stunned to see that CharlesWain was active there in Bengali Misplaced Pages, and helped Nobita create a poor version of the Kayastha article, since Nobita's objective was to promote Baidya caste and undermine Kayastha (sounds silly) as part of medieval Baidya-Kayastha rivalry! You may check this talk page concern where a user is accusing DearDebasish (now CharlesWain) and questioning the neutrality of the article on (Bengali) Kayastha! I understand you won't be able to read Bengali; the user Sreema1990 mentions 3 points under the section named 'Intentional distortion': 1) Unnecessary/undue mention of Baidya as Brahmin-like caste in the article on Kayastha by DearDebasish & others; 2) Intentionally portraying Kayastha as Karan (caste) which is misleading; 3) Undermining Kayastha & considering them as equivalent to agriculturist castes like Mahishya & Sadgop but portraying Baidya as Brahmin (again accusing DearDebasish)! This is one such edit by DearDebasish! I can ping Satnam2408; Satnam, can you please check the above edits in Bengali and validate what I have mentioned related to Bengali Misplaced Pages!

I understand that Bengali and English Misplaced Pages are different altogether, but I wanted to share with you that such edits and accusations in Bengali Misplaced Pages clearly indicates the intent of DearDebasish, who has changed his name to CharlesWain, probably in order to avoid such controversies! Would request you to consider these and expect some sort of action against this user, at least a warning! Thanks & Regards. Ekdalian (talk) 07:36, 27 July 2023 (UTC)

The false claim that I am Nobita's associate is itself a clear-cut violation of WP:ASPERSIONS. Use talk page for the content dispute and remember that what happened in Bengali Misplaced Pages can be only resolved there, not here. CharlesWain (talk) 08:50, 27 July 2023 (UTC)

We're also very concerned about Ekdalian's behaviours in Bengali Kayastha page, which include, but are not restricted to, slow edit -warring, WP:OWN, WP:STONEWALLING. Thanks.CharlesWain (talk) 08:56, 27 July 2023 (UTC)

This looks like it's above my paygrade. Abecedare, Sitush, and RegentsPark, are you there? Bishonen | tålk 11:36, 27 July 2023 (UTC).

I am currently (slowly) reading a book to help with the Bengali Kayastha article. There is no doubt that Ekdalian and CharlesWain are at loggerheads, that Ekdalian sort of has ownership issues with Kayastha-related articles, that CharlesWain sometimes seems wayward at them. But I missed the Nobita fun, so am not going to be much help on this particular concern, sorry. - Sitush (talk) 11:58, 27 July 2023 (UTC)

Honestly speaking, I don't have any ownership issue! Together with editors like Sitush,

Joshua Jonathan, and later LukeEmily, I have contributions in the article on Bengali Kayastha! I have been protecting (preventing vandalism & POV pushing) not just this article, but a whole bunch of articles including Baidya, Mahishya, Vishwakarma (caste), & hundreds of such articles! Though the original version of Baidya was written by us (I mean, together with Sitush), I welcomed TB & LukeEmily for changes, and the current version has major contributions by TB; still, I am the first person to revert POV edits, or say, point out the presence of socks! Today, I have reverted a typical POV pusher in the article on Sundhi, though the editors involved in the talk page discussion are other experienced editors!

CharlesWain couldn't explain their edits in Bengali Misplaced Pages (along with Nobita), which clearly show their anti-Kayastha agenda! Had we (neutral editors like Sitush, LukeEmily, Fylindfotberserk & others, and admins like you, Abecedare, RegentsPark & DougWeller) not been here in English Misplaced Pages, caste articles would have become a playground of POV pushers, and that is what we have seen precisely in Bengali Misplaced Pages, where users like Nobita, DrSunBD/socks and CharlesWain had created poor versions of these articles citing poorly sourced content! Thanks & Regards. Ekdalian (talk) 13:41, 27 July 2023 (UTC)

@Ekdalian OK, then I retract that with apologies. It was just an impression: I wasn't suggesting that any sanction was required. - Sitush (talk) 15:11, 27 July 2023 (UTC)

I am a long term editor. I work in broad range of topics and I am here to stay.

I work in Bengali Misplaced Pages too where I have more than 550 edits in more than 30 articles. Sharing a diff here of an WP:SPA with 30 edits ranting on me in Bengali Misplaced Pages wouldn't help. I will not stop trying to do what is right just because an editor who works in much narrow range of topics than me trying to create false narratives; WP:GAME. Thanks.CharlesWain (talk) 17:58, 27 July 2023 (UTC)

Come on CharlesWain, you only edit Bengali caste articles and articles related to Mahishya caste; I edit almost all major Indian caste articles! And you have been trying to play Nobita's game! Thanks. Ekdalian (talk) 18:12, 27 July 2023 (UTC)

Anyone can see ! CharlesWain (talk) 18:16, 27 July 2023 (UTC)

I have seen edits of Sreema1990 on the Bengali Misplaced Pages. Their edits seem problematic. For example, they are adding a weird type of claim that in the Mahabharata, the Baidya caste was mentioned as a shudra born of a shudra father and vaishya mother without any source. I have overlooked Hutton on the Bengali Kayastha page (one of the diffs of Ekdalian reminds me). The source of Hutton was discussed in the WP:RSN here. Ekdalian has pinged LukeEmily and an uninvolved editor but has not pinged me, Fowler&fowler, or RegentsPark or others who expressed their concerns about the source. I think Sitush is correct. Satnam2408 (talk) 15:53, 28 July 2023 (UTC)

Satnam2408, you are missing the point; we were not discussing whether Sreema1990's edits are good enough or not! We were discussing about the accusation, and it seems from the diffs I have provided that the accusation is based on facts; DD had created a really poor version of the article together with Nobita! Come on Satnam, we don't invite everyone in a discussion; a couple of experienced neutral editors serve the purpose. Don't forget, you have now established yourself as an editor; at that time, TB had portrayed you as a SPA on RegentsPark's talk page! Now, you have contributed in other articles and I can ping you if required. Thanks. Ekdalian (talk) 17:44, 28 July 2023 (UTC)

BTW, can you share the diffs where RegentsPark and F&f have expressed their concern! I am truly interested since I heard this for the first time! Thanks, Satnam2408! Ekdalian (talk) 17:55, 28 July 2023 (UTC)

Satnam2408, got your point after going through the links you 've provided once again! So you are talking about the recent discussion! I just randomly picked two neutral editors & pinged them! I could see F&f's comments but RP was not a part of the other discussion regarding reliability of Hutton! But, I am concerned about the fact that you completely digressed from the discussion! I had requested you to validate my translation (Bengali to English); you spoke about Sreema1990's edits in another article and then about the source by Hutton! Thanks, anyway! Ekdalian (talk) 08:20, 29 July 2023 (UTC)

Hey Ekdalian I believe edits by the editors should reveal their intentions. I cannot comment on Sreema1990's accusations (I have already specified). As for the information provided by CharlesWain, I can say that better sources can be provided there (I am talking about the translations you have provided and that's added in the Bengali Misplaced Pages by the editors). I have not edited the Bangla Misplaced Pages much, except for some in my early days, so I can't speak about the sourcing habits and culture in the Bengali Misplaced Pages. By the way, I think we cannot choose editors randomly to obtain support for a source under WP:CANVASING and I am not digressing, I am strictly following your diffs as You have provided here. Anyway, Thanks to all, Satnam2408 (talk) 15:17, 30 July 2023 (UTC)

Satnam2408, you couldn't get my point, and I 'll leave it there! BTW, you want to say, instead of picking neutral editors like LukeEmily, I should pick someone like CW or one of the socks from Nobita's sockfarm! In fact, neutral & unbiased editors were pinged in order to get fair & unbiased opinion i.e. in order to avoid WP:CANVASING! Thanks! Ekdalian (talk) 17:16, 30 July 2023 (UTC)

Complete misinterpretation! By the word 'chose' I mean to say ping. You have pinged two editors of your choice in the article talk page, and LukeEmily is one of them who has previously given approval for the source. However, you have not pinged F&F and others who have expressed concern (which I have reiterated),Anyway, I will discuss it on the talk page of the respective article once I get some free time from my professional projects. Thanks, Satnam2408 (talk) 17:25, 30 July 2023 (UTC)

We can't do anything about edits on the Bengali wikipedia but if there are any ongoing issues here, those we can handle. My hope though is that with Sitush currently active, consensus can be developed among the involved editors for any updates and improvements to the Kayastha/Baidya articles without Bish, RP and I having to play too much of a role. Call it lazy optimism. :) Abecedare (talk) 15:22, 27 July 2023 (UTC)

Misplaced Pages:Administrative action review#Unblock of Tony1 by Bishonen

Hi, this is in reference to the now-closed XRV discussion linked to above (permalink), in which you did not substantively participate. Please read the feedback by others there and reinstate the block at issue, because I still consider it necessary and your unblock irresponsible. Thanks in advance and best regards, Sandstein 11:03, 7 August 2023 (UTC)

Sorry, no. I'm not sure why you direct me to the feedback by others (which I have read, yes). Zero people in the discussion asked for the block to be reinstated; several said explicitly that it would be a bad idea.

Come on, Sandstein, you don't really expect me to reinstate a two-week block three weeks after I lifted it, surely? Even if I had come round to thinking I was wrong to unblock (which I haven't), I wouldn't jerk a user around like that. Would any admin? Would you? Bishonen | tålk 14:29, 7 August 2023 (UTC).

@Sandstein The closing Admin, User:Cullen, didn’t back you. You have no business coming here, particularly as your review was out of process as you didn’t follow the required process. You've misread the rules completely and are making claims about who can initiate a review that contradict the instructions. Doug Weller talk 14:37, 7 August 2023 (UTC)