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The consanguinity chart is wrong

Person X's siblings, the parents of X, and the direct offspring of X all share on average 50% DNA with X, and thus they all have the same degree of consanguinity with X. The "Table of Consanguinity" displayed to illustrate the article has erred on this point, and thus many of the numbers in the chart are wrong. Compare with the CC-chart here, which is correct: .

This seems like a fundamental error, and I think that the chart should not be used without this issue being fixed. ––St.nerol (talk) 17:22, 21 April 2022 (UTC)

% of world that permits incest (dispute)

Looking over Legality of incest one sees that it’s legal in many large countries such as China, India, and Russia and in few cases it’s legal between teens as young as 12. What % of the world’s population lives in countries where incest (between close relatives such as siblings or parent-offspring) is legal? Someone on the internet calculated 50%. (Next 3 sentences added later) To check on this look at just India and China each with a population of 1.45 billion. That’s 2.9 billion people; not too far from half the world’s population (4 billion of the 8 billion total for the World). To find the figure just add up the populations of countries that allow incest per Misplaced Pages. This is certainly not almost zero which I marked as disputed. David S. Lawyer 19:41, 2 October 2022 (UTC)

I agree that saying "almost universally forbidden" might be a somewhat extreme way to put it, but before marking the claim as disputed I think it'd be better to provide references backing up your stance, and "someone on the internet" most definitely doesn't count as a reliable source. I also don't think academic consensus leans towards more lenient views on incest and, besides, the whole paragraph can be seen as ambiguous, as it mentions several contexts in which incest between close relatives might be seen in completely different ways. In the meantime, I'll revert the edit as another reference saw itself unintentionally modified. --NicoSkater97 (talk) 22:28, 11 October 2022 (UTC)

List of 38 countries that allow adult incest. From a petition to permit incest in New South Wales (Australia). May use this list to find % of world pop. where incest is legal. Australia. Argentina, Armenia, Azerbaijan, Belarus, Belgium, Brazil, People's Republic of China, Estonia, France,(1810) Georgia, India, Israel, Italy ( if no scandal is caused) Ivory Coast, Japan, Kazakhstan, Kirghiz Republic, North Korea, South Korea, Latvia, Lithuania, Luxembourg, Malta, Monaco, Montenegro, Netherlands ,New Jersey (US) Pakistan, Portugal, Rhode Island ((US), Russia, Serbia, Slovenia, Spain, Tajikistan, Thailand,Turkey,Turkmenistan Ukraine,Uzbekistan David S. Lawyer 08:03, 15 October 2022 (UTC)

Just because it's legal doesn't mean it's condoned or occurs openly in more than vanishingly small numbers. There's more to social control than laws. In most/all of these places, if you start dating your sister openly, various bad things will usually happen. Like if your dad kicks you out of the family, or makes you join the army, or shoots you, these are punishments such that "not allowed" applies. Ditto if people spit at you or you get excommunicated or fired etc. We could say "Not allowed under pain of punishment and/or various other bad consequences", but that's just extra verbiage, cos if there're no bad consequences, it's allowed. Tag removed. Herostratus (talk) 04:44, 27 August 2023 (UTC)

New article proposal: Incest debate

Real incest?

The article lists "Father–daughter and stepfather–stepdaughter sex is the most commonly reported form of adult–child incest" but stepfather–stepdaughter sex isn't considered real incest and only pseudo-incest in some cultures or under some religious codes. Biofase | stalk  22:39, 30 May 2023 (UTC)

Maybe stepfather–stepdaughter sex isn't real incest, but it's very bad mojo. I'm in the USA, and here it would be almost universally condemned and considered incest and labeled incest. You can't control how people use words. I can't speak for other countries. Herostratus (talk) 19:18, 6 September 2023 (UTC)

The Marriage of an Uncle and a Niece

I read in the Reader's Digest guide to Canadian Law of a case where a court upheld a Marriage between an Uncle and a niece because one of them (probably the niece) was an adoptee.Tnarrud3 (talk) 12:49, 15 June 2023 (UTC)

Distant cousins

I have a 6th degree relative (second cousin). We share 2.6% of DNA. I could legally marry her in several EU countries. So, I don't understand the fuss about distant cousins: that isn't incest according to the laws of several EU countries. Why should we care if European nobles married their distant cousins centuries ago? The point: DNA similarity dilutes very quickly with each passing generation. Example: Romanian law prohibits incest, but marrying your second cousin isn't incest. Genetic similarity of relatives of the 9th degree (and higher) is negligible to all practical purposes. And that's what "distant cousins" means. tgeorgescu (talk) 04:50, 11 September 2023 (UTC)

Are you referring to the start of the "From the Middle Ages onward" section? I did rewrite that to clarify. I assume that the deal is that if you're occasionally marrying first cousins, but when it's not a first cousin it's probably a second or third cousin or something like that, almost always, for generation after generation, you're going to get problems (e.g. Hapsburg Jaw).. The passage doesn't say that. It does imply it. I don't think anyone knows for sure how much this contributed to Hapsburg Jaw etc. Herostratus (talk) 05:02, 12 September 2023 (UTC)

Wiki Education assignment: Gender and Culture

This article was the subject of a Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment, between 28 August 2023 and 18 December 2023. Further details are available on the course page. Student editor(s): MichelleEstrada55 (article contribs).

— Assignment last updated by Alyssagarcia.422 (talk) 22:05, 6 October 2023 (UTC)

Commonness of incest in ancient Greece

User:Yue and User:CycloneYoris, sibling incest was not common in ancient Greece and this is a typo. See for example this: https://www.cambridge.org/core/journals/journal-of-hellenic-studies/article/abs/familiarity-breeds-incest-and-the-ptolemaic-dynasty/C60A3A24562133A347E54A8F5977D690 It discusses how sibling incest was viewed as morally abhorrent and was outside Greek tradition. That is why the marriages were controversial. I am fixing the typo again, as I don't think this should really be controversial. Happy to go to WP:DRN if it really is. 69.142.179.131 (talk) 15:40, 1 November 2023 (UTC)

Can you please do the edit together with the proper references to the reliable sources, i.e. not only change a word but to make such a change that it be accompanying by the references, so the other editors could see that those claims are properly backed up? I mentioned it in the talk page of User_talk:69.142.179.131

Thank you! Maxim Masiutin (talk) 15:51, 1 November 2023 (UTC)

Okay, sure.

69.142.179.131 (talk) 15:53, 1 November 2023 (UTC)

Thank you for understanding! Sorry that I didn't mention it before, but when such changes are made without proper references, people may wrongly consider it vandalism, however, it may be indeed a good-faith edit. Maxim Masiutin (talk) 15:56, 1 November 2023 (UTC)

I actually noticed that the reference I googled happened to be the one already in the article, cited in that very line. So now it is cited twice.

69.142.179.131 (talk) 15:59, 1 November 2023 (UTC)

You can give names to references in the "ref" tag and then use this tag multiple times only giving the name, without all other attributes. Maxim Masiutin (talk) 16:00, 1 November 2023 (UTC)

I understand. I was just trying to fix a one word typo, based on the source that was already in that line of the article. Would you mind fixing it?

69.142.179.131 (talk) 16:03, 1 November 2023 (UTC)

@69.142.179.131 I am not competent to determine whether it was a typo or intentional word, so I let other editors to decide on substance Maxim Masiutin (talk) 07:57, 2 November 2023 (UTC)

Since this page is semi-protected, and you are not logged in with a user account in wikipedia, it will take time for your edit to be reviewed by editors, they may further decide on whether to accept or revert the change. Maxim Masiutin (talk) 15:59, 1 November 2023 (UTC)

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