Misplaced Pages

Revision as of 21:17, 4 April 2005

Anyone, whether directly involved or not, may add evidence to this page. Please make a header for your evidence and sign your comments with your name.

When placing evidence here, please be considerate of the arbitrators and be concise. Long, rambling, or stream-of-conciousness rants are not helpful.

As such, it is extremely important that you use the prescribed format. Submitted evidence should include a link to the actual page diff; links to the page itself are not sufficient. For example, to cite the edit by Mennonot to the article Anomalous phenomenon adding a link to Hundredth Monkey use this form: .

This page is not for general discussion - for that, see talk page.

Please make a section for your evidence and add evidence only in your own section. Please limit your evidence to a maximum 1000 words and 100 diffs, a much shorter, concise presentation is more likely to be effective. Please focus on the issues raised in the complaint and answer and on diffs which illustrate behavior which relates to the issues.

If you disagree with some evidence you see here, please cite the evidence in your own section and provide counter-evidence, or an explanation of why the evidence is misleading. Do not edit within the evidence section of any other user.

Be aware that the Arbitrators may at times rework this page to try to make it more coherent. If you are a participant in the case or a third party, please don't try to refactor the page, let the Arbitrators do it. If you object to evidence which is inserted by other participants or third parties please cite the evidence and voice your objections within your own section of the page. It is especially important to not remove evidence presented by others. If something is put in the wrong place, please leave it for the arbitrators to move.

Evidence presented by User:tkorrovi

• 18:14, 13 Mar 2004
  • Content. Unexplained deletions on controversial article. Removed more than 60% of the article, replaced removed paragraphs with keywords, like "spatialization", "analog I", "analog Me", "excerption", "conciliation" and "narratization". Reverting this change resulted in series of extensive changes. .

• 21:07, 13 Mar 2004
  • Possible use of sock puppet, later named User:Ataturk, now there is no such user .

• 00:42, 25 Apr 2004
  • Personal viewpoint. A paragraph including a reference to children's book about Pony the Merrylegs, .

• 00:00, 3 May 2004
  • Personal attack. "screw loose", a longer text .

• 12:05, 3 May 2004
  • Personal attack. "That Tkorrovi consistently misrepresents the facts is well established" .

• 17:23, 3 May 2004
  • Personal attack. "You are a dishonest troll, tkorrovi. Please go away", .

• 23:53, 3 May 2004
  • Ignorance of Misplaced Pages policy, inserting NPOV label without a proper explanation or reason (the only explanation "Tkorrovi insists on his particularly spin on every issue. This article is not NPOV"), a sequence of edits .

• 00:10, 4 May 2004
  • Personal attack. "You are not an asset to Misplaced Pages", longer text .

• 11:35, 4 May 2004
  • Personal attack. "Tkorrovi's persistent trolling and dishonesty destroys any good will", .

• 14:25, 4 May 2004
  • Personal attack. "he's paranoid", .

• 14:42, 4 May 2004
  • Personal attack. "That is correct. Tkorrovi is worthless troll", .

• 15:05, 4 May 2004
  • Personal attack. "Tkorrovi caught out again in another barefaced lie. If he can twist the facts to support his view he will", .

• 15:34, 6 May 2004
  • Personal attack. "So you say but you are not an authoritative source", .

• 00:27, 7 May 2004
  • Removing a paragraph with reference to the article, the only explanation was that it doesn't belong to his "Genuine AC POV", .

• 15:50, 7 May 2004
  • Personal attack. "When in a hole, stop digging", .

• 19:05, 10 May 2004
  • Personal attack. "You are a pain in the neck to deal with", longer text, .

• 07:35, 11 May 2004
  • Personal attack. "That's the paranoia I mentioned earluier", .

• 13:51, 2 Dec 2004
  • Ignorance of Misplaced Pages policy concerning the NPOV label. Putting NPOV label back without a comment or explanation, the label was removed after all requirements necessary for removing it, provided by the Misplaced Pages rules, were met, , diffs of the last necessary changes to comply with NPOV label removing requirement .

• 07:42, 8 Dec 2004
  • Personal attack. "A correct argument is a valid argument where the premises are correct. Neither test applies, of course, when the argument is submitted by Tkorrovi", longer text, .

• 17:52, 8 Dec 2004
  • Personal attack. "Tkorrovi, let someone else have a go with "your" article", .

• 20:21, 8 Dec 2004
  • Personal attack. Cimon Avaro talk page, discussion about mediation. "Tkorrovi is a pest", "Tkorrovi's understanding of the Misplaced Pages common procedures and standard editing behaviour is as warped as his understanding of his pet subject", longer text, .

• 21:48, 8 Dec 2004
  • Personal attack. "Edit boldly. Ignore Tkorrovi. That is what is necessary", .

• 05:53, 11 Dec 2004
  • Personal attack. "You remind me of that", with a picture of monkeys in a car, yelling to the passing pedestrians "Bastards! Homo Sapiens!", meant me as a monkey. On Cimon Avaro mediation page, during the mediation .

• 07:40, 28 Mar 2005
  • Consensus. Didn't want to allow me to edit the article by reverting my changes (I made different changes every time), without agreeing to explain or discuss, writing an absurd edit summary "remove non-grammatical, non-sequiter addition by Tkorrovi which is UNFIXABLE" concerning the text which was exactly copied from a scientific paper, more explanation in my comment in the arbitration request, .

• 22:38, 28 Mar 2005
  • Modification of other users' edits of Arbitration page. Changed the title of the arbitration request of this arbitration submitted by me, from his user name to my user name and second time . Changing the title changes the meaning of other users' edits, at least in this case.

Questionnable or wrong edits by Paul Beardsell:

Paul Beardsell forced into the article the term "Strong AC", or "Genuine AC", never used by any scientist before. This caused problems on the whole structure of the article, to accommodate his view, as a compromise to have "NPOV". as he interpreted it.

Some of the underlying reasons of this "conflict" .

I submitted an arbitration request against Paul Beardsell . I didn't see any provided evidence in what I am accused before starting the case, why the case was made against me, in addition to Paul Beardsell?

Concerning the evidence by ugen64:

4 April 2005

• I did not argue so much about the headers or other miniscule issues, if Paul Beardsell and Matthew Stannard did not change the headers, and move the text within talk page so frequently, and emphasize the miniscule issues.

• The only thing I said, was "anonymous, please register", I don't understand how this can be interpreted as preventing the anons from editing, or "taking to own the articles".

• I inserted a sentence without sources, it is not said anywhere that all sentences in the articles, like logical conclusions, must have sources. But, after this sentence was disputed, I removed it at .

• 13 March 2004 I don't see it as trolling, that prediction is an aspect of consciousness was argued at , which is a peer-reviewed paper, as said earlier. What Paul Beardsell states, is something which I only heared Paul Beardsell to say, and it doesn't even seem to be a logical conclusion based on any source.

• 13 March 2004 This edit war started from Paul Beardsell removing most of the content of the article, I mentioned earlier. I was a new Misplaced Pages user then, with not much edits, and therefore I had not much experience to deal with such conflicts correctly. But in the end, the article was protected in a version favourable for Paul Beardsell, by ugen64.

• Sorry, couldn't find that from the history, the history is only 500 changes deep, and the earlier conversation is not there. Don't remember saying that, but this is also not an attack against any person in particular.

• 30 March 2004 This was one of the series of major changes, which followed removing the content by Paul Beardsell. I would not describe it as a "wholesale revert", rather ugen64 added a lot of content, which I partly replaced with almost the same amount of content, these both were major changes.

• 30 March 2004 The user mentioned, an anonymous user 80.3.32.9 deleted the whole talk page of the article , which I think nobody considers a "good faith". I thought it was a sock puppet of Matthew Stannard, as it was created just then, and appeared together with Matthew Stannard, though later I had some doubts about that. There is no common definition of trolling, but the trolling by Paul Beardsell and Matthew Stannard I mentioned, is how I call this , ie an exercise of winding up a user, including the personal attacks both by Paul Beardsell and Matthew Stannard. I don't remember saying exactly that, but I considered to submit a request for arbitration, talked about it, and said exactly that -- I shall submit a request for arbitration, if there will be no alternatives, so this was not a threat.

• I don't see that I deserve any punishment, or ugen64 is going to double punish me for edit war almost a year ago, when, as I said, I was a beginning user with not much edits, and measures against me (protecting the article ) were already taken. I though consider it necessary to ban Paul Beardsell, because now already almost a year he did not want to settle the dispute, and his hostile behaviour didn't change even recently. This arbitration request by me was the last resort, no measures taken earlier, or in a civil way not responding to his attacks, didn't change Paul Beardsell's hostile behaviour. In Misplaced Pages I have almost only edited the Artificial consciousness article, and because of personal attacks, even this has been severely hindered.

Evidence presented by ugen64

4 April 2005

• Firstly, in general, tkorrovi has been acting childish, disputing miniscule issues (in Talk:Artificial consciousness/Archive 3, for example, he spent a long time arguing about where to place comment headers on the talk page; in the current talk page, he spent a time arguing about the usage of "what and that", "what and which", typos, and so on). For some specific evidence:

• Generally:
  • tkorrovi has taken to owning articles: he's prevented anons from editing such as this edit summary; this has subsided recently (past four or five months)
  • he has refused to cite sources for dubious claims , but then has accused others of NPOV violations (this is evident by looking at the history and talk page).

• 13 March 2004
  • - he's trolling, replacing his own weasel words (it was claimed, etc.) with "User:Psb777|Paul Beardsell claims..." but Paul has done the same.

• 13 March 2004
  • in the midst of a 6 or 7 fold revert war, tkorrovi accuses Paul of removing content; after awhile, he takes to reverting edits just because they're made by Paul.

• 16 March 2004
  • "But now I'm back to deal with possible further trolling." (the aforementioned third archive)

• 30 March 2004
  • - he wholesale reverted a *major* edit I made trying to restore NPOV, with little explanation other than "NPOV compromise"; obviously not a compromise, considering the edit war continued.

• 8 December 2004
  • Personal attacks: "'Then nothing happened until last month when another user tried in good faith to make this article worthwhile.' This was you sock-puppet, stop trolling." "This article was trolled by you and Paul Beardsell, or stop talking about it, otherwise we must go on with arbitration, which was already almost agreed on my request."

• I believe tkorrovi has mentioned every possible piece of evidence I could find against Paul, so I won't bother with that. In short, both users should be punished, but not drastically - their behavior has subsided in recent months.

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